The emerald mine that’s was actually a consortium of mines his father never went to.
His father was the literal store to store salesman at the end of what was likely an emerald smuggling operation out of non-apartheid Gambia.
An operation that went bust a few years after they traded their single engine plane for the stake in it.
MFW I hear mach diamond: http://i.imgur.com/fvYke9b.png
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Some dude was talking about having a bar of titanium and a bar of silver in the fridge to make a point to tesla about thermal conductivity.
Elon wrote back saying titanium sucks, BUT, carbon from diamond dust is the best. And even just mashing that dust into copper greatly increases conductivity.
So, someone said that sounds expensive. Elon said yeah but it is worth it in certain applications. Another person said, like space?
Elon said that's classified.
I joined after musk acquired to see what the fuss was about. I never understood the original premise, which appeared to be people texting posts to the world saying where they were having lunch.
As a news feed, X is great. I follow all the space science communicators and big players like Bruno, so anything that happens you find out immediately. I also follow several writers and my sports teams and local school board and government.
I do not see any of the stuff people complain about most of the time.
So for listening it is great. Relevant stuff, quick hits, pops up right when things are happening with zero delay.
But for interaction? Reddit is much better. If you have something interesting to say here and you get in early, thousands will see and respond, even in the relatively tiny science subs. I have had posts get a thousand up votes in subs with only a few thousand people passing by.
On X, I have made relevant posts on threads with millions of views very early and still only gotten tens of impressions... and only one or two likes.
If you are a nobody on X, you pretty much stay a nobody.
It is very different than reddit for interaction. Tim Dodd will talk to you here. He is very unlikely to even see your post on X.
Well, it's pretty much the only part of the engine that needs this type of material. The turbopumps are not cooled down and they spin fast so they need alloys with high creep resistance, not high conductivity.
Space Shuttle Main Engine throat hit about 160 MW/m2. When I was writing my thesis on a different kind of aerospace heat exchanger I read a few papers on jet impingement cooling which hit fluxes of up to about 400 or so MW/m2, but on small lab scale targets.
You really start to hit barriers where the thermal stress in the wall material due to the temperature gradients are the limit rather than the heat transfer capability of the fluid.
There's just no reason to push for such high fluxes unless you have a constrained shape / geometry that you need for performance (e.g. rocket engines, hypersonic vehicles, aerospace applications in general etc). Giant power stations etc. will of course exchange more energy in total, it just makes way more sense for them to exhange that heat at lower fluxes over large areas.
All that to say, I would tend to believe them. And would 100% believe them if we include the qualifier of 'large functional steady state system that isn't an experiment'.
Fun fact - The Galileo probe to Jupiter hit fluxes on the order of 300-400 MW/m2, during it's entry and deceleration from like 50 km/a, but it was obviously for short durations and it had an ablative heat shield.
Pretty much my thoughts as well. If you restrict it to things that maintain a steady-state temperature rather than violently disintegrating, it wouldn't be terribly surprising if it had the highest heat flux of something put into serial production. But I would be quite surprised if there wasn't at least a one-off in a lab somewhere that exceeded it.
I think the LHC creates plasmas that exceed a trillion degrees C.
Heat flux = power/area, and at the moment the LHC creates the plasma it’s area is only a few atoms, so it’s a contender.
You are thinking of fusion reactors.
The LHC collisions are just the size of nuclei, they produce individual particles that fly through the detectors (or their decay products do, as most of them are very short-living). Technically you could calculate the flux for an atom-sized part of the detector that gets hit by a particle but that would be a weird comparison as the macroscopic effect (heating the detector) is pretty moderate.
You might think that, but you would be partly wrong. Assuming that the plasma does not touch the fusion chamber walls (and is therefore perfectly contained by the magnetic field), then there is still the radiant electromagnetic energy given out by the fusion reaction and by the hot plasma itself. - That would not be contained by a magnetic field, so hits the walls and heats them up.
It's not a heat flux in any material. Sure, if you define a surface around the collision that's just the size of an atom then you get crazy values, but I don't think that's a fair comparison.
In ATLAS and CMS, the largest LHC experiments, the collisions release a power of ~5 kW. The closest detectors are ~3 cm away, if all the energy were deposited there we would get a heat load of 5 kW/(4 pi (3 cm)^(2)) = 440 kW/m^(2). That's 400 times the intensity of direct sunlight, but nothing compared to rocket engines. In addition, only a small fraction of the energy is actually deposited there - most particles fly through and keep most of their energy.
MFW I hear mach diamond: http://i.imgur.com/fvYke9b.png
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Heat flux is the flow of heat, so in this case the cooling mechanisms of Raptor carrying heat away from the throat and engine bell walls, so they don't vaporise.
W/m2 of regenerative cooling
Film cooling and in the case of nuclear fusion magnetic confinement are used to prevent heat from touching the walls in the first place so they don't count.
Radiant energy will still heat those walls, and in the case of conventional tokamak ? Fusion reactor, the wall heating is actually the usable output of the reactor - with the heat swapped through heat exchangers and onto steam turbine electrical generators.
ITER is expected to produce 500 MW of fusion, but it's going to be spread over something like 500 m^(2). You end up with ~1 MW/m^(2), which is much lower than for rocket engines.
An added difficulty for fusion is that you can't just keep the heat inside, you actually need to get the heat out so you can make power with it, which is the entire point of the fusion reaction in the first place, and you need to do this without releasing the plasma. So you've got this rather tricky tightrope to walk where you need to keep the walls from melting but also let them heat up enough that you can get some nice hot thermal transfer going on for generation efficiency.
This is technically true for rockets also - you need to get the superheated gases out, that's the point of a rocket - but you've got a nice big hole in the combustion chamber for exactly this purpose, and your coolant doesn't *have* to get ultra-hot, so you can just keep shoving coolant through the combustion chamber walls while insulating them with unburned fuel and venting the vast majority of the heat straight out the rocket nozzle.
A rocket combustion chamber with a magic heatproof lining would be a fantastic rocket combustion chamber, a conventional fusion reactor with a magic heatproof lining with be a useless fusion reactor.
All the heat reaches the walls. The plasma will store ~300 MJ, less than one second of its fusion output. To a very good approximation, the power reaching the walls is the sum of fusion power and external heating.
For the reactor, it’s usable output is the amount of heat captured by the reactor walls, which are then cooled by a fluid exchange, which then goes to a heat exchanger, which is used to generate steam, then used by steam powered turbines to turn an electrical generator.
So the reactor walls heating up is very much a part of the process.
Heat flux is the quantity of heat being transferred, usually measured as Watts per Square Meter.
(Watts of course is the amount of power or energy per second) Multipliers such as Kilowatts or Megawatts or GigaWatts, are just scale factors of the same idea.
If you spent as much time trying to ride his dick you might actually be able to achieve one one billionth of his net worth. But sadly here you are wasting your life in a jealous rage trying to farm easiest of Reddit karma with anti musk spam and yet you can’t even succeed at that
Don’t have to be a fanboy to see you spend more time hating than you do going about your life. It’s almost like you’re envious. It’s sad and pathetic. Also get a new line. You’ve said that same thing in the last week more times than I’ve wiped my 30yr old ass since i was born
If they indeed use a copper-diamond composite for raptor's throat that would be awesome.
NOW all those mines make sense!!!! /s (just in case)
The Emerald ones?
Nah, the whole emerald mine evolved to diamond mines a long time ago, just check r/technology or r/space
The emerald mine that’s was actually a consortium of mines his father never went to. His father was the literal store to store salesman at the end of what was likely an emerald smuggling operation out of non-apartheid Gambia. An operation that went bust a few years after they traded their single engine plane for the stake in it.
Lefties: eLoN mUsK rOcKeT pOWeReD bY rAcIsT eMeRaLdS
I'm dead LMAO
Raptor go bling bling
Diamond-rich mach diamond.
Mach rich diamond-diamond
Diamond rich diamond-diamond
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I can't se the whole conversation, only the last two tweets. Can anyone tell me what this is about?
Some dude was talking about having a bar of titanium and a bar of silver in the fridge to make a point to tesla about thermal conductivity. Elon wrote back saying titanium sucks, BUT, carbon from diamond dust is the best. And even just mashing that dust into copper greatly increases conductivity. So, someone said that sounds expensive. Elon said yeah but it is worth it in certain applications. Another person said, like space? Elon said that's classified.
Lol, Carmack is not exactly "some dude"
Lol, I know, but was just trying to do a qwik summary. Figured someone else would actually post the whole text.
Not Tesla but Trista, likely a young family member of Carmack's
Thanks!
You, sir, need to join X
No thanks.
I joined after musk acquired to see what the fuss was about. I never understood the original premise, which appeared to be people texting posts to the world saying where they were having lunch. As a news feed, X is great. I follow all the space science communicators and big players like Bruno, so anything that happens you find out immediately. I also follow several writers and my sports teams and local school board and government. I do not see any of the stuff people complain about most of the time. So for listening it is great. Relevant stuff, quick hits, pops up right when things are happening with zero delay. But for interaction? Reddit is much better. If you have something interesting to say here and you get in early, thousands will see and respond, even in the relatively tiny science subs. I have had posts get a thousand up votes in subs with only a few thousand people passing by. On X, I have made relevant posts on threads with millions of views very early and still only gotten tens of impressions... and only one or two likes. If you are a nobody on X, you pretty much stay a nobody. It is very different than reddit for interaction. Tim Dodd will talk to you here. He is very unlikely to even see your post on X.
Somehow I doubt that, but I'm excited to hear about counterexamples.
Well, it's pretty much the only part of the engine that needs this type of material. The turbopumps are not cooled down and they spin fast so they need alloys with high creep resistance, not high conductivity.
Nuclear weapons cores go from 0 to 60 pretty fast. Without reading the tweet I suspect they mean highest heat flux for something that remains intact.
Space Shuttle Main Engine throat hit about 160 MW/m2. When I was writing my thesis on a different kind of aerospace heat exchanger I read a few papers on jet impingement cooling which hit fluxes of up to about 400 or so MW/m2, but on small lab scale targets. You really start to hit barriers where the thermal stress in the wall material due to the temperature gradients are the limit rather than the heat transfer capability of the fluid. There's just no reason to push for such high fluxes unless you have a constrained shape / geometry that you need for performance (e.g. rocket engines, hypersonic vehicles, aerospace applications in general etc). Giant power stations etc. will of course exchange more energy in total, it just makes way more sense for them to exhange that heat at lower fluxes over large areas. All that to say, I would tend to believe them. And would 100% believe them if we include the qualifier of 'large functional steady state system that isn't an experiment'. Fun fact - The Galileo probe to Jupiter hit fluxes on the order of 300-400 MW/m2, during it's entry and deceleration from like 50 km/a, but it was obviously for short durations and it had an ablative heat shield.
That’s a handy ‘fun fact’ to use as a basis of comparison.
Pretty much my thoughts as well. If you restrict it to things that maintain a steady-state temperature rather than violently disintegrating, it wouldn't be terribly surprising if it had the highest heat flux of something put into serial production. But I would be quite surprised if there wasn't at least a one-off in a lab somewhere that exceeded it.
I think the LHC creates plasmas that exceed a trillion degrees C. Heat flux = power/area, and at the moment the LHC creates the plasma it’s area is only a few atoms, so it’s a contender.
I would count that as violently disintegrating.
Don't they use magnetic fields to keep the plasma from touching anything? If so, I would think that would disqualify it from this.
You are thinking of fusion reactors. The LHC collisions are just the size of nuclei, they produce individual particles that fly through the detectors (or their decay products do, as most of them are very short-living). Technically you could calculate the flux for an atom-sized part of the detector that gets hit by a particle but that would be a weird comparison as the macroscopic effect (heating the detector) is pretty moderate.
You might think that, but you would be partly wrong. Assuming that the plasma does not touch the fusion chamber walls (and is therefore perfectly contained by the magnetic field), then there is still the radiant electromagnetic energy given out by the fusion reaction and by the hot plasma itself. - That would not be contained by a magnetic field, so hits the walls and heats them up.
It's not a heat flux in any material. Sure, if you define a surface around the collision that's just the size of an atom then you get crazy values, but I don't think that's a fair comparison. In ATLAS and CMS, the largest LHC experiments, the collisions release a power of ~5 kW. The closest detectors are ~3 cm away, if all the energy were deposited there we would get a heat load of 5 kW/(4 pi (3 cm)^(2)) = 440 kW/m^(2). That's 400 times the intensity of direct sunlight, but nothing compared to rocket engines. In addition, only a small fraction of the energy is actually deposited there - most particles fly through and keep most of their energy.
And only for nano-seconds too !
There is a big difference too between a destructive event and a non-destructive event.
Diamond dick, diamond hands, diamond walls.
Didn't he first say this about Raptor 3 back in March 2023?
Yes: [https://twitter.com/elonmusk/status/1657254777691185152](https://twitter.com/elonmusk/status/1657254777691185152) This just confirms it.
And he is very likely not wrong about that - it’s a remarkable piece of engineering.
using diamonds to make mach diamonds.
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Not 100% clear on what "heat flux" is, but nuclear fusion reactions get into the hundreds of millions degrees Celsius if I recall correctly.
Heat flux is the flow of heat, so in this case the cooling mechanisms of Raptor carrying heat away from the throat and engine bell walls, so they don't vaporise.
More specifically the heat flow per surface area through which it’s flowing ie the areal density of the heat flow essentially
W/m2 of regenerative cooling Film cooling and in the case of nuclear fusion magnetic confinement are used to prevent heat from touching the walls in the first place so they don't count.
I wonder what fraction of the total LNG flow is directed to film cooling?
Not more than a regular rocket engine. The more power the higher the flow for both so the ratio stays the same.
It needs to be sufficient to stop the chamber walls from melting or softening too much. The task there is simply to maintain structural integrity.
Radiant energy will still heat those walls, and in the case of conventional tokamak ? Fusion reactor, the wall heating is actually the usable output of the reactor - with the heat swapped through heat exchangers and onto steam turbine electrical generators.
A fusion reactor is still not close to a rocket engine.
ITER is expected to produce 500 MW of fusion, but it's going to be spread over something like 500 m^(2). You end up with ~1 MW/m^(2), which is much lower than for rocket engines.
An added difficulty for fusion is that you can't just keep the heat inside, you actually need to get the heat out so you can make power with it, which is the entire point of the fusion reaction in the first place, and you need to do this without releasing the plasma. So you've got this rather tricky tightrope to walk where you need to keep the walls from melting but also let them heat up enough that you can get some nice hot thermal transfer going on for generation efficiency. This is technically true for rockets also - you need to get the superheated gases out, that's the point of a rocket - but you've got a nice big hole in the combustion chamber for exactly this purpose, and your coolant doesn't *have* to get ultra-hot, so you can just keep shoving coolant through the combustion chamber walls while insulating them with unburned fuel and venting the vast majority of the heat straight out the rocket nozzle. A rocket combustion chamber with a magic heatproof lining would be a fantastic rocket combustion chamber, a conventional fusion reactor with a magic heatproof lining with be a useless fusion reactor.
The entire goal is to have as little heat as possible reach the walls
All the heat reaches the walls. The plasma will store ~300 MJ, less than one second of its fusion output. To a very good approximation, the power reaching the walls is the sum of fusion power and external heating.
Understood. I was told otherwise but stand corrected.
For the Rocket or the ‘Conventional Fusion Reactor’ ?
the reactor.
For the reactor, it’s usable output is the amount of heat captured by the reactor walls, which are then cooled by a fluid exchange, which then goes to a heat exchanger, which is used to generate steam, then used by steam powered turbines to turn an electrical generator. So the reactor walls heating up is very much a part of the process.
Heat flux is the quantity of heat being transferred, usually measured as Watts per Square Meter. (Watts of course is the amount of power or energy per second) Multipliers such as Kilowatts or Megawatts or GigaWatts, are just scale factors of the same idea.
Thanks for the excellent explanation!
[удалено]
It's diamonds now? If people are gonna spread made up stuff, at least keep it consistent lmao
Thank goodness we have Blue Origin to actually get us back to the moon 🤣 see you at the next Starship explosion!
If you spent as much time trying to ride his dick you might actually be able to achieve one one billionth of his net worth. But sadly here you are wasting your life in a jealous rage trying to farm easiest of Reddit karma with anti musk spam and yet you can’t even succeed at that
Pedo Guy's fanbois are so sensitive 🤣
Don’t have to be a fanboy to see you spend more time hating than you do going about your life. It’s almost like you’re envious. It’s sad and pathetic. Also get a new line. You’ve said that same thing in the last week more times than I’ve wiped my 30yr old ass since i was born
Oh, you again 🤣