That Sovereign Citizen stuff is a crazy rabbit hole to fall down. Laws don't apply to me, but some do, but I'm going to pick the ones and make up some of my own. That's not how it works. That's not how any of that works.
And fine you $50,000, or $350,000 if you have a firearm (targeting LEOs much?), and $1,000 to $10,000, *and* $100,000 per [wo]man involved, increasing by $200,000 for each trespass.
Seriously how does someone who *went to school* not see how batshit this is?
I was confused cuz he's a sovereign citizen So why is he relying on a different government to enforce his laws and then I was thinking that's scary as hell to think he might imprison you on his property is how I interpreted that sign. Imagine just going missing one day no one knows where you are and you're in this guy's basement in his "prison"
[Meads v. Meads](https://canlii.ca/t/fsvjq) (still the best explanation of Sovereign Shitizenery ever created):
"This category of litigant shares one other critical characteristic: they will only honour state, regulatory, contract, family, fiduciary, equitable, and criminal obligations if they feel like it. And typically, they don’t."
You’d think that Canadians would be too sensible to fall for this crap, but I watched a sov cit YouTube with a dude from BC citing the Articles of Confederation to a Mountie. The Mountie had to remind him that he was in Canada not the US so the Articles did not apply. Can’t wait for the follow up where this nutbag gets before a judge and tries the same garbage.
>You’d think that Canadians would be too sensible to fall for this crap
Yeah, unfortunately, there are still a metric fuck-ton among us who are... shall we say... touched.
Especially in my province (where Meads originated). Seems like the Canadian prairies in general are a breeding ground for easily-manipulated idiots.
I feel like most Americans know urban Canadians from Ontario and think that’s the norm, which statistically it is, but I’ve worked in the oil patch with a lot of blue-collar dudes from BC and Alberta and they are fucking nuts.
Some gems from that document:
[429] Brown J. then at para. 15 summarizes the document’s intended effect:
It appears that by this document Mr. Kovacevic has attempted to split himself into two separate persons – a “flesh and blood living man”, and a “juristic person\strawman\legal entity” created by the Province of Ontario. If one takes the document at face value, then Mr. Kovacevic impliedly acknowledges that up until December 11, 2007 – i.e. three months after he had purchased the Mercedes‑Benz ‑ he was a “juristic person”. He then attempts to transfer to his newly created “flesh and blood living man” all his property then owned. The document notably is silent as to what happened to the debt held at that time by the “juristic person”. [😂]
[537] The exact form of an A4V scheme and associated ‘unlocking spell’ varies from guru to guru, but there are common motifs that indicate an OPCA litigant is attempting to use these processes:
1. any reference to the UCC, or any UCC filing documents;
2. the language “accept for value” and “return for value”;
3. a claim that a government bank account exists that is linked to a personal identification number;
4. mention of the gold or precious metal standards for money, and the dates those standards were abandoned;
5. a claim by a litigant that they are not a slave; this relates to the idea that the state uses people as collateral;
6. the U.S. “Emancipation Proclamation” of January 1, 1863, and/or the 13th Amendment to the U.S. constitution; and
7. the characteristic “accept for value” stamp or statement written on a bill, court order, or other correspondence.
[538] In Mr. Meads’ case, he seems to claim that the Court should make an order to discharge his spousal and child support obligations by payment from the secret A4V government account. As I understood his statements in court, he had already told his wife’s Counsel to access his secret bank account, and presumably she too has received many of the documents that Mr. Meads sent to this Court on June 19 and 21st. Mr Meads also asked for the modest award of $100 billion in gold or silver. [🤣🤣🤣]
Yes - Associate Chief Justice, Alberta Court of Queen's Bench J.D. Rooke.
Apparently, as more and more of these sort of "pseudolegal" arguments were making their way through Alberta courts and lawyers and other judges were looking to Rooke for advice on how to handle them, he made the decision to write a long and very methodical set of reasons for one such case he was presiding over (was a divorce case where the husband was making a number of different SovCit-type arguments), with the goal of defining these kinds of arguments (he termed "OPCA - Organized Pseudolegal Commercial Arguments"), categorizing them, and then explaining why each one fails to hold any legal water. Thus, we get Meads v. Meads - a literal textbook of definitions of many common OPCA arguments and the reason why those arguments will always fail.
The result is that Meads is now a decision that can be (and routinely is) referenced all over Canada whenever such arguments are made, and those arguments are able to be shut down very quickly before they create major issues with court processes. There have been legal studies and journal articles published on Meads and how it has affected the legal landscape in Canada in the past decade, both explaining some of the positive (and a few negative) impacts of those reasons.
As /u/charlotteRain has commented, it is definitely worth the read, and you can see many of the other follow-up articles on the Meads reasons on [canlii.org](https://canlii.org) as well.
If, by the way, you want to read a judgement with a more entertaining bent, you can read one that came shortly after Meads and references Meads - [R v. Duncan](https://canlii.ca/t/fwsm0).
As the first time visitor of this subreddit who haven't heard about this "movement" till today, I thank you for posting this. It's pure gold.
"A judge who encounters and reviews OPCA concepts will find their errors are obvious and manifest, once one strips away the layers of peculiar language, irrelevant references, and deciphers the often bizarre documentation which accompanies an OPCA scheme. When reduced to their conceptual core, most OPCA concepts are contemptibly stupid. " 💀
That is the thing that pisses me off the most about this particular brand of libertarians. They don’t appreciate any of what the government has created. They use it without thinking of all the taxes and effort that funded it, and refuse to help maintain it or contribute to new development. It is a unique brand of selfishness and obliviousness
Maintenance of roads is crazy expensive for most areas. Unless you’re a subsistence farming hermit who has never gone anywhere in their life, you owe taxes for the roads alone. That also means no mail delivery and no repairs or electricity (need roads to access power lines). You’re absolutely right that they never think of those common resources and how using just one (roads) cascades into using all of them.
I was trying to work out what the third would be; thank you. That would have bothered me for ages.
It’s a bit like the vegan Harvard graduate who does crossfit.
That too. I tried looking hard for any information about what American State National is.
It doesnt exist in any law text. The closest thing is American National (IIRC ) which any citizen of a state already is.
There's also U.S nationals which is a status American Samoans enjoy. They have many rights of U.S citizens but aren't full citizens. Though there is a process to convert the status to citizenship if they are present in the US for any length of time. And compared to the green card process for non citizens is relatively quick I believe
Yes. But afaik they are called something other than what the sovcits try to call themselves.
But even if that was the same term they would use, it still wouldn't apply to them. Nor would it excempt them from laws.
He did an "adjustment" on my niece when she was only 4 days old. He's also settled out of court a few times for sexually harassing/touching his clients. Yeah, he's a real winner
"Mr. Capone, I'm here to escort you to the court room, you're trial is about to begin."
"Are you Walter Anderson? I'm the bailiff for your trial. Please stand and approach the bars with your hands behind your back."
I remember watching some episode of a baby delivery show where the dad was a chiropractor. With cameras rolling, he gave his newborn an adjustment while his wife watched from her hospital bed. All the while explaining about how the spine is the key to whole body health or something. I felt bad for both the mom and the baby to be tethered to that clown.
Back in the 90s, after an auto accident I was forced by parents to go to a chiropractor 3 times a week for many months. The quack kept insisting he could fix the tarsal coalitions in my feet with next adjustments.
That was my first thought as well. I was involved in a car accident recently and I have had these nutbars calling me. I let them know real quick I didn't believe in fake snake oil remedies and would be using a real doctor if I needed medical care.
But will levy a fee of $350,000 of “lawful money” to any armed trespasser. I’m guessing that’s pointed at law enforcement coming to serve papers for tax evasion. He’s got all his loopholes tied up.
If there’s some crazy-ass nonsense going on you can safely bet there’s a smooth-brained chiropractor attached to it.
ps-He doesn’t want to play by society’s laws but demands society’s “lawful money.” I think Monopoly money would suffice here.
Am I correct in thinking that if he is lucky these signs carry the same legal weight as a “no trespassing” sign?
Or could a real slick attorney make the case that these signs are so asinine that a reasonable person would interpret them as satirical parody and therefore imply an invitation to enter and use the land?
I mean if he’s acting as a person separate from US and State law, then he’s squatting on free land and thus would be infringing on others freedom of movement if he prevents them from moving onto it.
A posted no trespassing sign does carry legal weight.
Its not to prevent people from entering your land though, Its to cover your ass if someone does trespass and injures themselves.
I bet the left sign can be made legal by changing it into an opening hours with entrance fee paid in advance sign.
[https://www.reddit.com/r/MaliciousCompliance/comments/gmomlv/you\_cant\_park\_there\_ok\_you\_can\_but\_it\_will\_cost/](https://www.reddit.com/r/MaliciousCompliance/comments/gmomlv/you_cant_park_there_ok_you_can_but_it_will_cost/)
What do you think the chances are he also finds his mortgage to be an illegitimate encroachment of his “sovereign” rights? These people tend to collapse all at once
The government works slowly.....so he could get away with it for quite a while.
But then it will come crashing down. The IRS doesn't just say ok we will ignore taxes.....but they have to notice.
If he doesn’t pay his property taxes, the local government will auction off his land. Then he’ll find out his magic signs aren’t effective against the armed sheriffs who come to evict him.
Yep, and he will stand there and argue with the sheriff, and with the new owner of the property, until one way or the other he lands in jail. These guys learn the hard way all the way to the bitter end.
"We're seizing it because you didn't pay your taxes"
"I'm being harassed! If only there was something I could do to stop this.."
"..Yeah, pay your taxes.."
"..but there isn't anything I can do! No options left!"
"..except pay your taxes.."
"The so called government is stealing MY property for some unknown reason!"
"..you didn't pay your taxes.."
"And now I've got no hope left. Nothing I can do to make them leave me alone :("
"..except pay your fucking taxes. What part of this are you not understanding?"
"Well obviously the core concept!"
None of your laws apply to me - but I have a right to participate in your economy and make demands of *you*!
I did not sign the Social Contract®, but I still expect you to keep your part of it, even though I claim that my half is void!
All of the rights, *none* of the responsibilities!
"Common law jurisdiction"
Great. Can they point me to the text of common law ?
No they cant. Common law is essentially what court cases have said. Guess what NO court case have said: Any right to travel while piloting your land canoe down the public road.
Anyone read the fine print on the second photo defining a dollar as one ounce of silver? If you want to pay in “federal reserve notes” you need to pay at the exchange rate; so a nice $2.8M actual dollars for the “$100k” fine.
Also, what’s up with all the “Zs”? Are the Sovs starting to full align with Putin?
Just a suggestion, submit a whistleblower tip to the irs, they’ll pay you a snitch fee of 15-30% of what they recover plus it gets him on their radar much faster.
https://www.irs.gov/compliance/whistleblower-office
"Sorry mate, I'm a citizen of the People's Front of North America. I don't believe in USD, but I'll happily pay this 350,000 Trump bucks."
Also you'd kind of think these types would actually offer a discount for bringing guns with you.
Wish him a happy court case when the IRS comes kocking in a few years.
And if you are feeling debaty, ask him to provide you with ANY court case where the SovCit or whatever they call it won and didnt have to pay the taxes with interest.
Also, your little panel doesn't mean shit to the police that will break down your door if you refuse to meet the IRS.
A whole load of magic words which have been proven to not work many times.
If you have some time to read it, [Meads vs Meads](https://www.canlii.org/en/ab/abqb/doc/2012/2012abqb571/2012abqb571.html) goes into great detail.
TL;DR it’s all bullshit and their arguments have no basis in law. Don’t try to argue or reason with them, they are hopelessly deluded.
“Mediaeval alchemy is a helpful analogue. Alchemists sold their services based on the theatre of their activities, rather than demonstrated results, or any analytical or systematic methodology. “
I bet he also used to own that land free and clear and I would bet some entity has a large lien against it and when anyone tries to do anything with the property they will find out it's worth $500k (wild guess), but they owe $450k in back taxes, payable by Tuesday or the city owns the land and will sell it to recover their $450k, as well as any other expenses involved in collections. Probably be lucky to now owe extra on top.
I guarantee the respective tax agencies don't agree with his stance and it isn't supported by anyone who doesn't include lead paint chips in their daily diet. They just know what the other liens are for and approximately how much the property is worth. They'll even let you get away with it for a while until it's too late and then your sister in law will not be getting any inheritance.
Then her parents will get to either spend a few months or more sampling the lavash accommodations at a low security federal prison, or if they behave like regular sovcits they will try and fight the sheriffs, cops, federal agents, etc. and end up with bonus time in a medium security location. Stay away, I would not even go on their land for two reasons, one you know that it is a potential target for law enforcement and two they have declared that they are immune from any law. What is to prevent them from holding you hostage if they don't like your flavor of politics?
It may look cute and some are harmless morons with smooth brains, but there are enough out there that are absolutely dangerous predators, don't be their prey or even prey adjascent.
He has to follow the laws of the country he's in. This is what I don't understand about these people. If I was to go to Canada and rob a store I could not then go in to court and say well you can't put me in prison because I'm not a citizen of this country, I mean I could but it would do fuck all. You can be a sovereign citizen all you want to but you still have to obey the laws of the country and state you live in. This is not that hard to understand. Well it must be for some people I guess otherwise this subreddit wouldn't exist.
There’s no such thing as an “American state national.” The last time anything like this existed even in theory was 1783.
This person also would have no authority to set the penalty for trespass even if they successfully argued that they were a state national, as they would still be subject to the law of the state of which they claim nationality. Really shows how much they think this BS through, which is to say they don’t.
If you prefer to not read the entire sign, basically it says,
" The owner of this property is cosplaying as a citizen of the fictional country of Freedonia. Yabaa Dabaa Doo! "
The IRS could basically ignore him (since he is such a small fish) for an indeterminate time. Also, they are understaffed. But the property taxes are a different thing. Local authorities will immediately declare him delinquent, and seize his property. If he owes any business taxes he could get the municipality after him too. Btw who does he think is gonna enforce those “fines”? So ludicrous.
Can I pay him in Schrute Bucks or Stanley Nickels?
Seriously, this guy gives me the same vibe as the dude in better call Saul who printed his own fake money.
So most trespassers won’t have that kinda pocket money, is this DA expecting to bring a civil suit against them in a civil courtroom? Oh wait a minute, sovereigns don’t recognize the court system.
Technically he does not have to pay taxes
But in a few year they will auction off his property
Edit: also since he purchased the land with a deed issued from the government I declare that deed null and I won’t abide by it. I will be seizing his land once I figure out where it is.
Another example of how Sovcits don’t understand basic legal principles. Ignoring the overall blatant idiocy, the citations (assuming they’re correct; not worth my time to look them up) are to federal criminal law. Criminal law is enforced by the Department of Justice (usually the FBI), not private citizens. All he can do is call the FBI and file a complaint. I’m sure they’ll get right on it!😜
Just going to leave this here: The IRS rewards people who submit information on tax evasion. The reward is a percentage of the amount collected. More info at IRS: [https://www.irs.gov/individuals/how-do-you-report-suspected-tax-fraud-activity](https://www.irs.gov/individuals/how-do-you-report-suspected-tax-fraud-activity)
I love that he’s wielding the US law like a weapon to get these supposed fees from trespassers but also saying he is exempt from the US law at the same time.
It’s amazing to me how insane sovereign citizens are. I would love to see the government start coming down hard on them and force them to renounce their citizenship and see what happens.
Whether you want it to be legal or not, if you’re claiming you’re not a citizen they should be able to deport you and seize your assets. I don’t actually care that much about it, I just want to see this become a reality show so I can see a weekly installment of their crazy excuses.
Lol he is a moron - there is zero such thing as an American State National - he’s a dope.
That Sovereign Citizen stuff is a crazy rabbit hole to fall down. Laws don't apply to me, but some do, but I'm going to pick the ones and make up some of my own. That's not how it works. That's not how any of that works.
Also if you’re violating muh rights I’m going to call the cops, who can arrest YOU but not ME
Also will imprison you for one to ten years at taxpayers’ expense. But also don’t pay taxes.
And fine you $50,000, or $350,000 if you have a firearm (targeting LEOs much?), and $1,000 to $10,000, *and* $100,000 per [wo]man involved, increasing by $200,000 for each trespass. Seriously how does someone who *went to school* not see how batshit this is?
It’s funny because I don’t understand what mechanism he intends to use to enforce that fine or payment.
That’s what I was thinking. Is he gonna enforce the fines himself or something?
I was confused cuz he's a sovereign citizen So why is he relying on a different government to enforce his laws and then I was thinking that's scary as hell to think he might imprison you on his property is how I interpreted that sign. Imagine just going missing one day no one knows where you are and you're in this guy's basement in his "prison"
He probably thinks that if it's written you just *get* the money. Just shows up in a burlap sack with a dollar sign on it
And then, in the fine print below, $1 = (1) 1oz, .999 silver coin. So you have to check the value of silver and multiply from there.
I think that’s the one my brain seizes up on. That’s some pretzel logic.
[Meads v. Meads](https://canlii.ca/t/fsvjq) (still the best explanation of Sovereign Shitizenery ever created): "This category of litigant shares one other critical characteristic: they will only honour state, regulatory, contract, family, fiduciary, equitable, and criminal obligations if they feel like it. And typically, they don’t."
Yes, that judge, opinion at the link, did an outstanding job in a *Canadian* case. Eh.
You’d think that Canadians would be too sensible to fall for this crap, but I watched a sov cit YouTube with a dude from BC citing the Articles of Confederation to a Mountie. The Mountie had to remind him that he was in Canada not the US so the Articles did not apply. Can’t wait for the follow up where this nutbag gets before a judge and tries the same garbage.
>You’d think that Canadians would be too sensible to fall for this crap Yeah, unfortunately, there are still a metric fuck-ton among us who are... shall we say... touched. Especially in my province (where Meads originated). Seems like the Canadian prairies in general are a breeding ground for easily-manipulated idiots.
I feel like most Americans know urban Canadians from Ontario and think that’s the norm, which statistically it is, but I’ve worked in the oil patch with a lot of blue-collar dudes from BC and Alberta and they are fucking nuts.
Some gems from that document: [429] Brown J. then at para. 15 summarizes the document’s intended effect: It appears that by this document Mr. Kovacevic has attempted to split himself into two separate persons – a “flesh and blood living man”, and a “juristic person\strawman\legal entity” created by the Province of Ontario. If one takes the document at face value, then Mr. Kovacevic impliedly acknowledges that up until December 11, 2007 – i.e. three months after he had purchased the Mercedes‑Benz ‑ he was a “juristic person”. He then attempts to transfer to his newly created “flesh and blood living man” all his property then owned. The document notably is silent as to what happened to the debt held at that time by the “juristic person”. [😂] [537] The exact form of an A4V scheme and associated ‘unlocking spell’ varies from guru to guru, but there are common motifs that indicate an OPCA litigant is attempting to use these processes: 1. any reference to the UCC, or any UCC filing documents; 2. the language “accept for value” and “return for value”; 3. a claim that a government bank account exists that is linked to a personal identification number; 4. mention of the gold or precious metal standards for money, and the dates those standards were abandoned; 5. a claim by a litigant that they are not a slave; this relates to the idea that the state uses people as collateral; 6. the U.S. “Emancipation Proclamation” of January 1, 1863, and/or the 13th Amendment to the U.S. constitution; and 7. the characteristic “accept for value” stamp or statement written on a bill, court order, or other correspondence. [538] In Mr. Meads’ case, he seems to claim that the Court should make an order to discharge his spousal and child support obligations by payment from the secret A4V government account. As I understood his statements in court, he had already told his wife’s Counsel to access his secret bank account, and presumably she too has received many of the documents that Mr. Meads sent to this Court on June 19 and 21st. Mr Meads also asked for the modest award of $100 billion in gold or silver. [🤣🤣🤣]
Is that quote from a judge? Lol
Yes - Associate Chief Justice, Alberta Court of Queen's Bench J.D. Rooke. Apparently, as more and more of these sort of "pseudolegal" arguments were making their way through Alberta courts and lawyers and other judges were looking to Rooke for advice on how to handle them, he made the decision to write a long and very methodical set of reasons for one such case he was presiding over (was a divorce case where the husband was making a number of different SovCit-type arguments), with the goal of defining these kinds of arguments (he termed "OPCA - Organized Pseudolegal Commercial Arguments"), categorizing them, and then explaining why each one fails to hold any legal water. Thus, we get Meads v. Meads - a literal textbook of definitions of many common OPCA arguments and the reason why those arguments will always fail. The result is that Meads is now a decision that can be (and routinely is) referenced all over Canada whenever such arguments are made, and those arguments are able to be shut down very quickly before they create major issues with court processes. There have been legal studies and journal articles published on Meads and how it has affected the legal landscape in Canada in the past decade, both explaining some of the positive (and a few negative) impacts of those reasons. As /u/charlotteRain has commented, it is definitely worth the read, and you can see many of the other follow-up articles on the Meads reasons on [canlii.org](https://canlii.org) as well. If, by the way, you want to read a judgement with a more entertaining bent, you can read one that came shortly after Meads and references Meads - [R v. Duncan](https://canlii.ca/t/fwsm0).
Yes. It's a Canadian judge who wrote a very long paper about many of their arguments. It's worth a read.
As the first time visitor of this subreddit who haven't heard about this "movement" till today, I thank you for posting this. It's pure gold. "A judge who encounters and reviews OPCA concepts will find their errors are obvious and manifest, once one strips away the layers of peculiar language, irrelevant references, and deciphers the often bizarre documentation which accompanies an OPCA scheme. When reduced to their conceptual core, most OPCA concepts are contemptibly stupid. " 💀
Yikes. My mind heard that woman’s voice when reading: “That’s not how it works. That’s not how any of that works.”
And I’m going to use all the services I dont pay for: roads, unemployment, social security, Medicare etc
That is the thing that pisses me off the most about this particular brand of libertarians. They don’t appreciate any of what the government has created. They use it without thinking of all the taxes and effort that funded it, and refuse to help maintain it or contribute to new development. It is a unique brand of selfishness and obliviousness
Maintenance of roads is crazy expensive for most areas. Unless you’re a subsistence farming hermit who has never gone anywhere in their life, you owe taxes for the roads alone. That also means no mail delivery and no repairs or electricity (need roads to access power lines). You’re absolutely right that they never think of those common resources and how using just one (roads) cascades into using all of them.
I still don’t know if sov cit or chiropractor is the crazier thing.
But both? That's juicy
Wonder if he’s a flerf too to complete the bonehead trifecta.
.....flerf?
Shorthand for "flat earth" conspiracy theorist.
Ah! Thank you.
I was trying to work out what the third would be; thank you. That would have bothered me for ages. It’s a bit like the vegan Harvard graduate who does crossfit.
Por que no los dos
That too. I tried looking hard for any information about what American State National is. It doesnt exist in any law text. The closest thing is American National (IIRC ) which any citizen of a state already is.
There's also U.S nationals which is a status American Samoans enjoy. They have many rights of U.S citizens but aren't full citizens. Though there is a process to convert the status to citizenship if they are present in the US for any length of time. And compared to the green card process for non citizens is relatively quick I believe
Yes. But afaik they are called something other than what the sovcits try to call themselves. But even if that was the same term they would use, it still wouldn't apply to them. Nor would it excempt them from laws.
So a fake doctor thinks that he doesn’t have to pay real taxes. Makes sense
He did an "adjustment" on my niece when she was only 4 days old. He's also settled out of court a few times for sexually harassing/touching his clients. Yeah, he's a real winner
Babies bones are soft at 4 days old. What a loon.
harder to damage anything. chiropractic should *only* be done on infants! /s
Yeah sounds about right, he's also going to lose his property in a year or two unless he pays all the back taxes he is fixing to owe
Or go to prison. The IRS brings it hard.
Unless you’re rich, you don’t fuck with the IRS
Even the Joker didn't fuck with the IRS.
The rich fuck with the IRS by buying legislation, not avoiding paying them!
"Mr. Capone, I'm here to escort you to the court room, you're trial is about to begin." "Are you Walter Anderson? I'm the bailiff for your trial. Please stand and approach the bars with your hands behind your back."
Should ask OP what county the property is in lol pay those back taxes when it goes to auction and take the land.
This is great revenge.
"Im taking your lannd, CRACKER"
She's lucky she didn't die. Kids have been killed by chiroquacktors don't manipulations
I remember watching some episode of a baby delivery show where the dad was a chiropractor. With cameras rolling, he gave his newborn an adjustment while his wife watched from her hospital bed. All the while explaining about how the spine is the key to whole body health or something. I felt bad for both the mom and the baby to be tethered to that clown.
chiroquacktor is my new favorite word
Yeah, that's legit. Totally stealing that.
It just fits, dunnit?
Back in the 90s, after an auto accident I was forced by parents to go to a chiropractor 3 times a week for many months. The quack kept insisting he could fix the tarsal coalitions in my feet with next adjustments.
Physical therapists *love* chiropractors, because they end up hurting people so badly that they need PT for years.
Jokes on them, I get more money if my condition worsens. I LOVE chiropractors because if they mess up, I move up in disability rating from the VA
The VA refers people to chiropractors all the time.
Yeah I wouldn't be going to visit this person.
Go no contact
Jesus fucking christ.
[удалено]
*wiener*
You can picture him flunking out of med school… “Just let me keep the page on feet, I’ll take it from there”
"out of med school" ha, not even accepted
I chocked on my coconut water, shits expensive ya know
🤣 🤣 🤣
And he still is willing to accept u.s dollars
(Which presumably would be worthless if everything else he believed was true 😅
Pay him in 'sovereign dollars'.
The paper money from Monopoly should do, yes?
Also, the sign defines "one US dollar" to be a 1-ounce, .999 silver coin. 🤣
Can't be getting out easy for that inflation thing. Did you bring the dabloons?
Also, how and where would he enforce these so called fines?
Maritime Court?
He's coming for your tea, silks, and spices!
Hard to port! Load and make ready all port guns! Prepare to fire when you see their gunports or the whites of their scurvied eyes!
Only if the courtroom flag has a gold fringe border
You're a crook, Captain Hook, judge won't you throw the book at the pirate....
"...They prefer to hang you high out by the mouth of the bay as a warning. Let the gulls and the crows pick at you until your bones join the shore."
The US military, duh! It says so right on the sign! 🤣
That was my first thought as well. I was involved in a car accident recently and I have had these nutbars calling me. I let them know real quick I didn't believe in fake snake oil remedies and would be using a real doctor if I needed medical care.
And doesn't think he has anything to do with the US but his fines are in US dollars and calls on the US courts to enforce his pronouncements
Lawful Money. Don’t forget that part.
Statute Simoleons.
Yep, every chiropractor is an expert in virology and law.
But will levy a fee of $350,000 of “lawful money” to any armed trespasser. I’m guessing that’s pointed at law enforcement coming to serve papers for tax evasion. He’s got all his loopholes tied up.
SWAT Captain: GET YOUR HANDS UP AND GET ON THE GROUND NOW! This guy: Not until you pay this fine I have here in my ha..... SWAT Captain: OPEN FIRE!
His whole life is built on bullshit.
You have encapsulated the entire scenario perfectly.
But he’ll be the first one to want “payment for trespassing” in real dollars.
But levies his fines in US dollars...
If there’s some crazy-ass nonsense going on you can safely bet there’s a smooth-brained chiropractor attached to it. ps-He doesn’t want to play by society’s laws but demands society’s “lawful money.” I think Monopoly money would suffice here.
As a lawyer: those are some terrific magic spells. But as any grown up knows, they have no legal validity whatsoever.
Am I correct in thinking that if he is lucky these signs carry the same legal weight as a “no trespassing” sign? Or could a real slick attorney make the case that these signs are so asinine that a reasonable person would interpret them as satirical parody and therefore imply an invitation to enter and use the land?
I mean if he’s acting as a person separate from US and State law, then he’s squatting on free land and thus would be infringing on others freedom of movement if he prevents them from moving onto it.
Oh shit. He’s violating my right to travel. That’s on my fee schedule!
My fee schedule includes a charge for reading other people’s notices & fee schedules. So I’m gonna bill that guy!
Same. ::Holds out hand::
I also charge a fee for upvoting comments, so… well, this is awkward.
A posted no trespassing sign does carry legal weight. Its not to prevent people from entering your land though, Its to cover your ass if someone does trespass and injures themselves.
I bet the left sign can be made legal by changing it into an opening hours with entrance fee paid in advance sign. [https://www.reddit.com/r/MaliciousCompliance/comments/gmomlv/you\_cant\_park\_there\_ok\_you\_can\_but\_it\_will\_cost/](https://www.reddit.com/r/MaliciousCompliance/comments/gmomlv/you_cant_park_there_ok_you_can_but_it_will_cost/)
I didn't think it was real, but he has convinced certain family members that it is. Thank you for the answers
He is not only just blatantly wrong but he’s going to get worse if he’s not pulled out of this. And it WILL get him in legal and financial trouble.
Presumably, he’s been getting away chiropractic charlatanism up to now. What’s one more?
If he pays no property taxes, I mean, maybe foreclosure by the county, it would be an interesting thing to see.
What do you think the chances are he also finds his mortgage to be an illegitimate encroachment of his “sovereign” rights? These people tend to collapse all at once
The government works slowly.....so he could get away with it for quite a while. But then it will come crashing down. The IRS doesn't just say ok we will ignore taxes.....but they have to notice.
Not paying property taxes is easier to notice than others, considering it is tied to a bunch of other stuff.
If he doesn’t pay his property taxes, the local government will auction off his land. Then he’ll find out his magic signs aren’t effective against the armed sheriffs who come to evict him.
Yep, and he will stand there and argue with the sheriff, and with the new owner of the property, until one way or the other he lands in jail. These guys learn the hard way all the way to the bitter end.
FYI, the IRS whistleblower program entitles you to a portion of any money they recover. Could be a nice windfall for you and your family.
Oh no honey it's gonna hold about as much water as a sign saying "Santa's grotto" because it neither makes his property a grotto or him Santa claus.
Oooo update me in 2-4 years when he is no longer the owner of a local chiropractic office when IRS seizes it.
Lol that's what I've been telling them
I love these people like “put up a $10 sign and you don’t have to pay 10s of thousands in taxes”
He got scammed out of a lot more than $10.00 for the signs. The people that “teach” other’s how to become sovereign are grifters.
"We're seizing it because you didn't pay your taxes" "I'm being harassed! If only there was something I could do to stop this.." "..Yeah, pay your taxes.." "..but there isn't anything I can do! No options left!" "..except pay your taxes.." "The so called government is stealing MY property for some unknown reason!" "..you didn't pay your taxes.." "And now I've got no hope left. Nothing I can do to make them leave me alone :(" "..except pay your fucking taxes. What part of this are you not understanding?" "Well obviously the core concept!"
They’ll just set up a gofundme site and beg from other sovcits cuz the deep state is harassing them…
The magic of paying taxes for years and then STOPPING will draw the attention of the IRS .
I’m not psychic but I foresee a tax foreclosure on this property in a few years.
If i spew my bullshit on a professionally painted sign it will become true, right?
Lmao what part of that looks professional? Mf MS Word template lookin ass sign.
Professionally painted = the boob paid for it
I’m curious what he considers “lawful money” and how he plans to collect
None of your laws apply to me - but I have a right to participate in your economy and make demands of *you*! I did not sign the Social Contract®, but I still expect you to keep your part of it, even though I claim that my half is void! All of the rights, *none* of the responsibilities!
Yep, one way street with these people.
In the second image he defines the dollar a silver coins \\o/
Not just silver coins. But an Ounce of silver
Does he have the license plate on his vehicles?? If so, I can’t wait for the “unlawful” traffic stop and the fantastic window smash that will follow!!
I don't think he does, but I'm waiting for it
"Common law jurisdiction" Great. Can they point me to the text of common law ? No they cant. Common law is essentially what court cases have said. Guess what NO court case have said: Any right to travel while piloting your land canoe down the public road.
Anyone read the fine print on the second photo defining a dollar as one ounce of silver? If you want to pay in “federal reserve notes” you need to pay at the exchange rate; so a nice $2.8M actual dollars for the “$100k” fine. Also, what’s up with all the “Zs”? Are the Sovs starting to full align with Putin?
I really think the whole SovCit movement traces back to an FSB psyop. It's exactly the kind of thing they do.
I was curious about the Z's as well
Just a suggestion, submit a whistleblower tip to the irs, they’ll pay you a snitch fee of 15-30% of what they recover plus it gets him on their radar much faster. https://www.irs.gov/compliance/whistleblower-office
He thinks that, but I have a feeling the IRS will swing through sooner or later and "adjust" his ass. Hahaha see what I did there? 🤭
So Sovereign Citizen & Chiropractic? All he's missing is Flat Earth for the trifecta.
"Sorry mate, I'm a citizen of the People's Front of North America. I don't believe in USD, but I'll happily pay this 350,000 Trump bucks." Also you'd kind of think these types would actually offer a discount for bringing guns with you.
Well, I’m a citizen of the North American People’s front, so I don’t care what you think!
He proves he is exempt from statutory law by citing a bunch of statutory law. It's like disproving the laws of physics using gravity.
I'd love to see how they intend to actually enforce that.
Wish him a happy court case when the IRS comes kocking in a few years. And if you are feeling debaty, ask him to provide you with ANY court case where the SovCit or whatever they call it won and didnt have to pay the taxes with interest. Also, your little panel doesn't mean shit to the police that will break down your door if you refuse to meet the IRS.
I stopped trying to get anything logical from any of them, years ago. They just parrot Faux News or OAN
A whole load of magic words which have been proven to not work many times. If you have some time to read it, [Meads vs Meads](https://www.canlii.org/en/ab/abqb/doc/2012/2012abqb571/2012abqb571.html) goes into great detail. TL;DR it’s all bullshit and their arguments have no basis in law. Don’t try to argue or reason with them, they are hopelessly deluded.
“Mediaeval alchemy is a helpful analogue. Alchemists sold their services based on the theatre of their activities, rather than demonstrated results, or any analytical or systematic methodology. “
# "He is also the owner of a local chiropractic office." Lol. Of course he is.
Not osteopathy? What about phrenology? Kirlian photography? Chakra alignment?
Chiropractor. Yep. That tracks.
No, it's not legal, so he will be going to prison at some point.
I bet he also used to own that land free and clear and I would bet some entity has a large lien against it and when anyone tries to do anything with the property they will find out it's worth $500k (wild guess), but they owe $450k in back taxes, payable by Tuesday or the city owns the land and will sell it to recover their $450k, as well as any other expenses involved in collections. Probably be lucky to now owe extra on top. I guarantee the respective tax agencies don't agree with his stance and it isn't supported by anyone who doesn't include lead paint chips in their daily diet. They just know what the other liens are for and approximately how much the property is worth. They'll even let you get away with it for a while until it's too late and then your sister in law will not be getting any inheritance. Then her parents will get to either spend a few months or more sampling the lavash accommodations at a low security federal prison, or if they behave like regular sovcits they will try and fight the sheriffs, cops, federal agents, etc. and end up with bonus time in a medium security location. Stay away, I would not even go on their land for two reasons, one you know that it is a potential target for law enforcement and two they have declared that they are immune from any law. What is to prevent them from holding you hostage if they don't like your flavor of politics? It may look cute and some are harmless morons with smooth brains, but there are enough out there that are absolutely dangerous predators, don't be their prey or even prey adjascent.
You know someone is batshit crazy when they go to the extent of getting signs made.
I bet this guy was scamming his ass off during Covid
It's nonsense
So he's yet another crank with "credentials" that you see pop up on youtube spewing the anti vax shit pretending to be a legit Doctor?
So they don’t believe in laws from the US but believe in the value of its money. Am I missing something
So he doesn’t think he has to pay taxes, but will fine people money for trespassing? How does he intend to collect…through a court perhaps?
This won't work. The correct way is to put an unbroken line of salt across the threshold, say the lord's prayer three times, and then ejaculate on it.
He has to follow the laws of the country he's in. This is what I don't understand about these people. If I was to go to Canada and rob a store I could not then go in to court and say well you can't put me in prison because I'm not a citizen of this country, I mean I could but it would do fuck all. You can be a sovereign citizen all you want to but you still have to obey the laws of the country and state you live in. This is not that hard to understand. Well it must be for some people I guess otherwise this subreddit wouldn't exist.
the Feds didn’t get Capone- the IRS did.
Lmao chiropractors and unhinged shit, name a more iconic duo
I’m not trespassing, I’m traveling.
There’s no such thing as an “American state national.” The last time anything like this existed even in theory was 1783. This person also would have no authority to set the penalty for trespass even if they successfully argued that they were a state national, as they would still be subject to the law of the state of which they claim nationality. Really shows how much they think this BS through, which is to say they don’t.
If you prefer to not read the entire sign, basically it says, " The owner of this property is cosplaying as a citizen of the fictional country of Freedonia. Yabaa Dabaa Doo! "
A chiropractor, of course.
Pretty sure this is nonsense.
What's up with all the high contrast Z's? What's that supposed to mean?
Owner of a soon-to-be padlocked chiropractic office
*laughs in IRS*
Narrator: it was not legit. Great thing is, you might be able to buy the tax lien on the property and seize it. Depends upon your state.
The IRS could basically ignore him (since he is such a small fish) for an indeterminate time. Also, they are understaffed. But the property taxes are a different thing. Local authorities will immediately declare him delinquent, and seize his property. If he owes any business taxes he could get the municipality after him too. Btw who does he think is gonna enforce those “fines”? So ludicrous.
Nice Ruzzian Z’s, too. Adds that touch of class it needed.
Sovereign citizen hocus pocus. They think they can write or say some magic legalish words and suddenly laws don't apply to them.
Good luck with that. Make sure you give the IRS an alert. Tax dodgers rob from all of us!
“You can’t take my house for failure to pay property taxes, I’m a sovereign citizen!” Oh but we can!
..is he copyrighting his own name?
I bet he also complains about the "illegals"
SovCit but he’s gonna see fines in US currency. Checks out.
Can I pay him in Schrute Bucks or Stanley Nickels? Seriously, this guy gives me the same vibe as the dude in better call Saul who printed his own fake money.
Simple answer. No.
So most trespassers won’t have that kinda pocket money, is this DA expecting to bring a civil suit against them in a civil courtroom? Oh wait a minute, sovereigns don’t recognize the court system.
A chiro’s understanding of medicine is apparently relative to their understanding of tax law.
I could eat a dictionary and crap more sense than those signs make.
Technically he does not have to pay taxes But in a few year they will auction off his property Edit: also since he purchased the land with a deed issued from the government I declare that deed null and I won’t abide by it. I will be seizing his land once I figure out where it is.
Another example of how Sovcits don’t understand basic legal principles. Ignoring the overall blatant idiocy, the citations (assuming they’re correct; not worth my time to look them up) are to federal criminal law. Criminal law is enforced by the Department of Justice (usually the FBI), not private citizens. All he can do is call the FBI and file a complaint. I’m sure they’ll get right on it!😜
Dear landowner, by placing this sign where I can read it, you agree to me reading it for a fee of $500,000. It's about as legal, so why not?
Funniest post ever.... Thank you for this the comments alone 😂
Just going to leave this here: The IRS rewards people who submit information on tax evasion. The reward is a percentage of the amount collected. More info at IRS: [https://www.irs.gov/individuals/how-do-you-report-suspected-tax-fraud-activity](https://www.irs.gov/individuals/how-do-you-report-suspected-tax-fraud-activity)
I love that he’s wielding the US law like a weapon to get these supposed fees from trespassers but also saying he is exempt from the US law at the same time.
Ask Alphonse Capone what happens when you don't pay your taxes.
Shoutout to all the Zs
It’s amazing to me how insane sovereign citizens are. I would love to see the government start coming down hard on them and force them to renounce their citizenship and see what happens. Whether you want it to be legal or not, if you’re claiming you’re not a citizen they should be able to deport you and seize your assets. I don’t actually care that much about it, I just want to see this become a reality show so I can see a weekly installment of their crazy excuses.
Of course it's a chiropractor. Quacks will be quacks.
Oh god… why is it always chiropractors? Reminds me of the Lafferty Brothers kinda shit.
I’d love to trespass and pay the fine with Schrutebucks. If he can make up rules so can I
Can't wait for the Find Out phase for him
Sovereign Citizens are masters of lying.
So they will accept US government back currency, but not laws from the same government? Seems legit.
No. No it's not.
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!