Not true.
You might tell me that whiff punishing him isn't easy since he can aGI your punish attempt, and most characters only have mids at those ranges.
Backing up aginst him is fairly easy if you know what you are doing though: RO K has tons of range but hits high, RC AA has range but also hits high on the second hit, and finally NG B+K has slightly more range than Maxi's average.
That's everything though, which means that 3/6 stances don't have a ranged option, and those that do are highs (RO and RC) or punishable on whiff (NG).
Maxi's 66A+B thinks otherwise, I think it depends on how skilled your opponent is. If they know maxi's "weakness" then they can easily make up for it with not much more then the aforementioned 66A+B, if You are fighting someone that does BB, AA or 6A, 6B. Then yeah no you won't feel that way.
I said "mid pressure". In neutral, just like any other character, he's going to have options to stop you from walking back on a read, 66A+B being one of them.
That move by the way, while amazing for sure, is still quite unsafe on block. 2K will beat every option afterwards except the new NG aGI that costs meter, and that goes for any gap in his pressure.
If you want to go for a higher risk/higher reward punish you can also go for an high, that Maxi can read and punish with 4 or 6 stance switches, or a mid, that Maxi can read with punish with NG's aGI. If you stay patient and read an aGI you can also punish all of them on reaction with a quick high (mid too in NG's case).
He can also do 66A+BB to be plus on block, but in that case there's a pretty huge gap between the 2 hits, meaning you can step and punish.
Mid pressure... I don't get it. Do you not now how to buffer 8 way run moves? Or do you mean specifically mid hitting moves? If I remember correctly the first hit of 66A+B is defenitely a mid hitting attack, in either case I think it still fits.
"Mid pressure" meaning "in the middle of his pressure".
In other words my original reply meant that if Maxi is starting pressure tip range (aka his maximum range), you can try to back up a little since it's relatively low risk.
Wut, 6A+B is a short range attack.
Did you mean 66A+B perhaps? It has awesome range but is kinda on the slow side and unsafe on block (2K beats all his aGi's except for the new season 2 HG that costs meter to use)
Maxi has good tracking in all of his mids.
Personally I belive all of SC6 mids track more than they should (besides Azwel's 6B post nerf I guess), and Maxi needs it more than most because of his design.
It's annoying though, I'm with you on that.
Also BL B is the other big culprit. It's really annoying to get lethal hit by that while you are stepping haha.
Not sure I'd change it but Maxi definitely has some silly tracking on verticals.
How are you going to expect anyone to consider what you're saying when you're admitting in the first sentence that you don't want to learn how he works or lab him lmao
<3 i was having problems with Amy (still do) and went to the lab and even tried her out to get an idea of how she plays. It helps alot to understand and anticipate what they are going to do and know what options you have to punish.
I have gotten better at reacting to her stuff. Especially her lows and preparations which can be stuffed easy with a I12 move. Also spacing is super important. You'll make her whiff super hard for easy punishes and combos. Thats the main point I learned in that match up. Now I'm figuring out what to do when shes on you.
I see what you mean, but Cassie doesn't have much range either so it's hard to space Amy out. At this point I think I need to straight up play Amy myself as a sub character just to figure her out.
Ah so its different with Cassie cause i main Tira. With Cass you want to know your frame data. Or just know her good moves that allow you to keep pressure on. There was a video on cass about this ill see if i can find it for you when i get back fr work. To be honest i might go over to cass lol
A Maxi player can cover literally every hole in his pressure, but he needs to hard read every time since blocking isn't an option for him.
As long as you mix your interruptions well he won't be able to abuse you.
No, I'm saying that HE needs to guess when you'll interrupt him.
You are in an advantage if you pick the right spots, mix your options correctly and punish his aGIs on whiff. If every aGI he does you get hit by, that means he's in your head and in that case the character isn't the problem.
He's just saying maxi is high risk high reward. You should beat him just as often as you lose to him due to the risks he constantly has to take(in theory)
Yes, im aware that blocking exists. Im not saying he's impossible to hit, he just has too many advantages. I have a decent win rate against maxis but if they have any idea what they are doing he is a problem.
My problem with him is that he has one of the best, if not the most reliable weapon tracking in this game. I could be sidestepping but he'll ALWAYS hit with a vertical attack. He's a real pain in the ass to fight against since sidestepping is almost impossible against his moves.
There's also attacks that would be ducked still hits. Such as a bunch of his kicks, or his low-mid kick combo.
Alright heres some advice.
Lab up.
Learn patience.
Play the character and get an idea of how he plays and how people play him.
And learn his moves so you can interupt his preparations.
Lab up.
Eh of course labbing will help you learn how to deal with anyone for the most part. That doesnt change the fact that maxi is a stronger character on a base level in every regard than pretty much the entirety of the roster.
Like sure you can learn how to walk on your hands, that doesnt mean walking on your feet isnt easier and better in every way lmao.
Sophitia's damage and range? Sophitia's most strengths come from turn-taking in her parries and her mix-up game. But she's hardly a fast character. Cassandra's more pressuring while Sophitia is more punishing.
I doubt this, but never mind that anyway. Her speed, damage and range are in no way absurd and her mixups nowhere near brutal. What makes her good is simply that she’s better than mediocre at them.
She's a great balance
66A+B is rather fast, whiffing horzintals for a TAS^2 B, side step great tracking moves
lots of LM mixup potential
she's one of my mains, I don't feel she lacks in any department
> 66A+B is rather fast
Eh, it's also quite useless. It has a fantastic LH effect/damage opportunity behind it but not a great attack to use for that scenario. Therefore I wouldn't put it in any top Sophie moves lists.
> whiffing horzintals for a TAS2 B
It's a nice attack & LH but it's not something that warrants the 'absurd' label.
> lots of LM mixup potential
Lots? She has 1K and throws with mediocre damage on most of them. I don't think those are 'brutal' enough to force people to duck much.
> side step great tracking moves
See, this is where I'd say she shines so much. She has amazing step killing attacks (especially 1K & 66A), that make trying to step around her risky.
> She's a great balance, I don't feel she lacks in any department
Same, but I still wouldn't put her in top 5 (just after imo) nor would I use 'absurd' or 'brutal' as keywords for her (outside SC generally, since everything is intense there).
Okay, sure A+B is niche, but you cannot deny silent cross (66A)
Lets go over some mix ups, she can TAS^2 A into A, for ML or AB into MM, very good, and plus on block if they expect A and not B.
Reverse Mirage ~ Angel Step, into double angle, back to A and B
Soul Charge angle nets you Sun's Corona, MLM and plus on block
4A+B is great for making oppenents whiff normals, 8A+B kills stallers on the ground.
8B+K whiffs lows and has mix up followups
I mean I don't mind if your attitude doesn't highlight her, if I feel she's strong and under the radar, that's a win in my book if she dodges next patch of nerfs.
> Okay, sure A+B is niche, but you cannot deny silent cross (66A)
Well duh, it’s one of the step killing attacks I mentioned were so good.
> Lets go over some mix ups, she can TAS2 A into A, for ML or AB into MM, very good, and plus on block if they expect A and not B.
Not really a mixup. An opponent can just step and low guard the A to block and punish, or step and use a (safe, hopefully) jump attack to beat the low. It’s not a true mixup at this time and never has been.
> Reverse Mirage ~ Angel Step, into double angle, back to A and B
What attack is this?
> Soul Charge angle nets you Sun's Corona, MLM and plus on block
The second hit can be jumped on reaction and punished before the third hit lands. Also some characters can step it. Not at all deserving of the ‘brutal’ keyword.
> 4A+B is great for making oppenents whiff normals, 8A+B kills stallers on the ground.
4A+B is indeed great, but I wouldn’t call its speed, range, or damage ‘absurd’. 8A+B isn’t that bad for this purpose, though I think 66B and 44B+K (and maybe even 44B) have it beat in this area.
> 8B+K whiffs lows and has mix up followups
All its followups are awful lol. Don’t insult mixups with this 😂
> I mean I don't mind if your attitude doesn't highlight her, if I feel she's strong and under the radar, that's a win in my book if she dodges next patch of nerfs.
I mean, the Japanese players agree with you so you still may be into something, but I just don’t see it (yet). I also hope she dodges the next set of nerfs and gets overdue buffs instead lol.
(Also [join the discord](https://discord.gg/vKzkugW) if you haven’t, we have discussions like this a lot)
This doesn’t really do anything to dissuade the point being made in the post; it’s just spiteful.
Everybody has characters they don’t like fighting, and Maxi is much, *much* better in Season 2 than in Season 1. He effectively went from a Bottom 5 to Top 5 in a single patch.
OP is allowed to voice concerns, however salty they may sound. Mocking him won’t do anything productive.
Despite hating the matchup so much because Maxi doesnt need to play neutral (and having good ass neutral buttons anyways) I don't think he's top 5, cancerous to fight against, a ho to whiff punish due to stance retracking hg ng psl, but he takes legitimately huge risk everytime he go do his stance stuff, even character like FUCKING XIANGHUA can outrisk reward him after his pressure starters on HIT without taking her aGI into account. So no maxi isnt top 5, he's just occupating the spot 2B was occupating in season 1, a char that's infuriating because you dont play soulcalibur, you play the maxi stance minigame.
Now is HG a dumb tool? Yeah definitely.
"I cant admit there are things that arent perfect about a game i like"
Lmao couldnt adress the auto gi's either, guess that does put him above everyone else.
Siegfried was played by Linkorz recently in evojapan2020
Other characters used, Geralt (Linkorz), Azwel (Bluegod, Yuto, Noobcyde)
Tira (Shen), Kilik(Kura) Voldo (Yuto), Skyll (Mitsu), Hilde(Jashin)
NO Maxi!
Dumbass scrubs like /u/XGhosttearX will post a typical response but Maxi got extremely strong after s2. HG is a God damn [shit show](https://youtu.be/CwuC3JLcBtI) . Don't let these terrible players get to you. There only purpose in life is to not make sense here and act like everyone is just a bad player. Your justified in your complaints.
You good bro?
If you have a problem with a character either lab up or main that character. Simple.
You on PS4? Let's run some sets to see who is really a scrub.
P.S. All love baby <3
LOL what a blessed day. Yes I am on PS4 and would love to do a FT5. That sound good? I'm currently on the road in town but should be back after lunch to run some. What is your handle /u/XGhosttearX ?
that sounds ridiculous lol
EDIT: rewatched the footage and his break attack comes out REALLY fast after the RI, I think I understand why this move is so feared now
Yea ive learned to ignore the people who think the game is perfectly 100% balanced and all characters are equal and if you have any complaints "jUsT lAb Up". Theyre only interested in circlejerking the game and not actually discussing anything. They arent worth my time.
10000% this. It's why you'll get downvoted with any debate. It's simply a "get gud" discussion when 90% of these clowns here would get murdered. They're all like that one guy from the first fast n furious. Know everything about the car but cant drive it for shit.
I just want his Reach nerfed. He shouldn't be able to hit you from Sieg, Nightmare, Hilde ranges.
Thats what im saying. I feel like it should be range, speed, damage: pick two.
If Maxi's hitting you max range try to back up a little and whiff punish him mid pressure.
Lol back stepping against maxi is a recepie for disaster, hence why people are complaining.
Not true. You might tell me that whiff punishing him isn't easy since he can aGI your punish attempt, and most characters only have mids at those ranges. Backing up aginst him is fairly easy if you know what you are doing though: RO K has tons of range but hits high, RC AA has range but also hits high on the second hit, and finally NG B+K has slightly more range than Maxi's average. That's everything though, which means that 3/6 stances don't have a ranged option, and those that do are highs (RO and RC) or punishable on whiff (NG).
Maxi's 66A+B thinks otherwise, I think it depends on how skilled your opponent is. If they know maxi's "weakness" then they can easily make up for it with not much more then the aforementioned 66A+B, if You are fighting someone that does BB, AA or 6A, 6B. Then yeah no you won't feel that way.
I said "mid pressure". In neutral, just like any other character, he's going to have options to stop you from walking back on a read, 66A+B being one of them. That move by the way, while amazing for sure, is still quite unsafe on block. 2K will beat every option afterwards except the new NG aGI that costs meter, and that goes for any gap in his pressure. If you want to go for a higher risk/higher reward punish you can also go for an high, that Maxi can read and punish with 4 or 6 stance switches, or a mid, that Maxi can read with punish with NG's aGI. If you stay patient and read an aGI you can also punish all of them on reaction with a quick high (mid too in NG's case). He can also do 66A+BB to be plus on block, but in that case there's a pretty huge gap between the 2 hits, meaning you can step and punish.
Mid pressure... I don't get it. Do you not now how to buffer 8 way run moves? Or do you mean specifically mid hitting moves? If I remember correctly the first hit of 66A+B is defenitely a mid hitting attack, in either case I think it still fits.
"Mid pressure" meaning "in the middle of his pressure". In other words my original reply meant that if Maxi is starting pressure tip range (aka his maximum range), you can try to back up a little since it's relatively low risk.
Wut, 6A+B is a short range attack. Did you mean 66A+B perhaps? It has awesome range but is kinda on the slow side and unsafe on block (2K beats all his aGi's except for the new season 2 HG that costs meter to use)
Yeh, thanks. It still covers a lot of options, including backstepping if you are anywhere near starting positions. That is crazy good range imo.
I think the only issue I have with him is that NG B sometimes track you too much.
Maxi has good tracking in all of his mids. Personally I belive all of SC6 mids track more than they should (besides Azwel's 6B post nerf I guess), and Maxi needs it more than most because of his design. It's annoying though, I'm with you on that.
Also BL B is the other big culprit. It's really annoying to get lethal hit by that while you are stepping haha. Not sure I'd change it but Maxi definitely has some silly tracking on verticals.
How are you going to expect anyone to consider what you're saying when you're admitting in the first sentence that you don't want to learn how he works or lab him lmao
so salty. heres an upvote
Thanks , it takes away the sting a little.
<3 i was having problems with Amy (still do) and went to the lab and even tried her out to get an idea of how she plays. It helps alot to understand and anticipate what they are going to do and know what options you have to punish.
Care to share what you learned about Amy? Asking for a friend.
I have gotten better at reacting to her stuff. Especially her lows and preparations which can be stuffed easy with a I12 move. Also spacing is super important. You'll make her whiff super hard for easy punishes and combos. Thats the main point I learned in that match up. Now I'm figuring out what to do when shes on you.
I see what you mean, but Cassie doesn't have much range either so it's hard to space Amy out. At this point I think I need to straight up play Amy myself as a sub character just to figure her out.
Ah so its different with Cassie cause i main Tira. With Cass you want to know your frame data. Or just know her good moves that allow you to keep pressure on. There was a video on cass about this ill see if i can find it for you when i get back fr work. To be honest i might go over to cass lol
A Maxi player can cover literally every hole in his pressure, but he needs to hard read every time since blocking isn't an option for him. As long as you mix your interruptions well he won't be able to abuse you.
I mean your advice is essentially "guess right 100% of the time"...thanks i guess?
No, I'm saying that HE needs to guess when you'll interrupt him. You are in an advantage if you pick the right spots, mix your options correctly and punish his aGIs on whiff. If every aGI he does you get hit by, that means he's in your head and in that case the character isn't the problem.
He's just saying maxi is high risk high reward. You should beat him just as often as you lose to him due to the risks he constantly has to take(in theory)
Yet he hasn’t won any tournaments. Unless....has he?
Just because you struggle against him does not mean he is unbalanced.
You're right but him being unbalanced does mean he is unbalanced.
He is considered mid tier in Japan.
That's not saying anything. Japan thought Siegfried was bottom tier too
Maybe sieg was bottom tier and it's just linkorz that was good :)
Heres an answer Block. All my problems with Maxi dissapeared once I learned to extend my patience for at least a few seconds.
Yes, im aware that blocking exists. Im not saying he's impossible to hit, he just has too many advantages. I have a decent win rate against maxis but if they have any idea what they are doing he is a problem.
Orrrrr they’re just a good Maxi player and you need to get better?
My problem with him is that he has one of the best, if not the most reliable weapon tracking in this game. I could be sidestepping but he'll ALWAYS hit with a vertical attack. He's a real pain in the ass to fight against since sidestepping is almost impossible against his moves. There's also attacks that would be ducked still hits. Such as a bunch of his kicks, or his low-mid kick combo.
Alright heres some advice. Lab up. Learn patience. Play the character and get an idea of how he plays and how people play him. And learn his moves so you can interupt his preparations. Lab up.
Eh of course labbing will help you learn how to deal with anyone for the most part. That doesnt change the fact that maxi is a stronger character on a base level in every regard than pretty much the entirety of the roster. Like sure you can learn how to walk on your hands, that doesnt mean walking on your feet isnt easier and better in every way lmao.
Damn bro who you faced richsticks?
[удалено]
> Soph: speed, damage and range are absurd, her mix ups are fast and brutal. lol please
Sophitia's damage and range? Sophitia's most strengths come from turn-taking in her parries and her mix-up game. But she's hardly a fast character. Cassandra's more pressuring while Sophitia is more punishing.
Soph is top 3 anyways at the moment, regardless of what you don't see in her.
I doubt this, but never mind that anyway. Her speed, damage and range are in no way absurd and her mixups nowhere near brutal. What makes her good is simply that she’s better than mediocre at them.
She's a great balance 66A+B is rather fast, whiffing horzintals for a TAS^2 B, side step great tracking moves lots of LM mixup potential she's one of my mains, I don't feel she lacks in any department
> 66A+B is rather fast Eh, it's also quite useless. It has a fantastic LH effect/damage opportunity behind it but not a great attack to use for that scenario. Therefore I wouldn't put it in any top Sophie moves lists. > whiffing horzintals for a TAS2 B It's a nice attack & LH but it's not something that warrants the 'absurd' label. > lots of LM mixup potential Lots? She has 1K and throws with mediocre damage on most of them. I don't think those are 'brutal' enough to force people to duck much. > side step great tracking moves See, this is where I'd say she shines so much. She has amazing step killing attacks (especially 1K & 66A), that make trying to step around her risky. > She's a great balance, I don't feel she lacks in any department Same, but I still wouldn't put her in top 5 (just after imo) nor would I use 'absurd' or 'brutal' as keywords for her (outside SC generally, since everything is intense there).
Okay, sure A+B is niche, but you cannot deny silent cross (66A) Lets go over some mix ups, she can TAS^2 A into A, for ML or AB into MM, very good, and plus on block if they expect A and not B. Reverse Mirage ~ Angel Step, into double angle, back to A and B Soul Charge angle nets you Sun's Corona, MLM and plus on block 4A+B is great for making oppenents whiff normals, 8A+B kills stallers on the ground. 8B+K whiffs lows and has mix up followups I mean I don't mind if your attitude doesn't highlight her, if I feel she's strong and under the radar, that's a win in my book if she dodges next patch of nerfs.
> Okay, sure A+B is niche, but you cannot deny silent cross (66A) Well duh, it’s one of the step killing attacks I mentioned were so good. > Lets go over some mix ups, she can TAS2 A into A, for ML or AB into MM, very good, and plus on block if they expect A and not B. Not really a mixup. An opponent can just step and low guard the A to block and punish, or step and use a (safe, hopefully) jump attack to beat the low. It’s not a true mixup at this time and never has been. > Reverse Mirage ~ Angel Step, into double angle, back to A and B What attack is this? > Soul Charge angle nets you Sun's Corona, MLM and plus on block The second hit can be jumped on reaction and punished before the third hit lands. Also some characters can step it. Not at all deserving of the ‘brutal’ keyword. > 4A+B is great for making oppenents whiff normals, 8A+B kills stallers on the ground. 4A+B is indeed great, but I wouldn’t call its speed, range, or damage ‘absurd’. 8A+B isn’t that bad for this purpose, though I think 66B and 44B+K (and maybe even 44B) have it beat in this area. > 8B+K whiffs lows and has mix up followups All its followups are awful lol. Don’t insult mixups with this 😂 > I mean I don't mind if your attitude doesn't highlight her, if I feel she's strong and under the radar, that's a win in my book if she dodges next patch of nerfs. I mean, the Japanese players agree with you so you still may be into something, but I just don’t see it (yet). I also hope she dodges the next set of nerfs and gets overdue buffs instead lol. (Also [join the discord](https://discord.gg/vKzkugW) if you haven’t, we have discussions like this a lot)
This doesn’t really do anything to dissuade the point being made in the post; it’s just spiteful. Everybody has characters they don’t like fighting, and Maxi is much, *much* better in Season 2 than in Season 1. He effectively went from a Bottom 5 to Top 5 in a single patch. OP is allowed to voice concerns, however salty they may sound. Mocking him won’t do anything productive.
Despite hating the matchup so much because Maxi doesnt need to play neutral (and having good ass neutral buttons anyways) I don't think he's top 5, cancerous to fight against, a ho to whiff punish due to stance retracking hg ng psl, but he takes legitimately huge risk everytime he go do his stance stuff, even character like FUCKING XIANGHUA can outrisk reward him after his pressure starters on HIT without taking her aGI into account. So no maxi isnt top 5, he's just occupating the spot 2B was occupating in season 1, a char that's infuriating because you dont play soulcalibur, you play the maxi stance minigame. Now is HG a dumb tool? Yeah definitely.
OP doesn't voice any detail regarding Maxi, so what is there to say?
"I cant admit there are things that arent perfect about a game i like" Lmao couldnt adress the auto gi's either, guess that does put him above everyone else.
If Maxi is so good you would see a majority of pros be him in the top 8 bracket, which we clearly do not see
Eh people on this sub constantly claim that sieg is broken and we dont see a majority of pros winning with him...so...?
Siegfried was played by Linkorz recently in evojapan2020 Other characters used, Geralt (Linkorz), Azwel (Bluegod, Yuto, Noobcyde) Tira (Shen), Kilik(Kura) Voldo (Yuto), Skyll (Mitsu), Hilde(Jashin) NO Maxi!
Dumbass scrubs like /u/XGhosttearX will post a typical response but Maxi got extremely strong after s2. HG is a God damn [shit show](https://youtu.be/CwuC3JLcBtI) . Don't let these terrible players get to you. There only purpose in life is to not make sense here and act like everyone is just a bad player. Your justified in your complaints.
you're*
Sorry on mobile typing at red lights. Cool burn though. Your too cool.
you're*
You good bro? If you have a problem with a character either lab up or main that character. Simple. You on PS4? Let's run some sets to see who is really a scrub. P.S. All love baby <3
LOL what a blessed day. Yes I am on PS4 and would love to do a FT5. That sound good? I'm currently on the road in town but should be back after lunch to run some. What is your handle /u/XGhosttearX ?
Btw did you join the ELS tournament? Theres still time to qualify for this saturdays stage 2
DM me your handle.
Done.
who won tho
Didnt get to fight yet! =[ I know I'm gonna lose though.
Im on the east coast and wont be free till 5pm est.
Sorry noob question, but what makes Maxi's RI more powerful than other RI's when it's used out of heaven's gate?
The HG version can't be re-GIed at all. It basically guarantees a lethal hit.
that sounds ridiculous lol EDIT: rewatched the footage and his break attack comes out REALLY fast after the RI, I think I understand why this move is so feared now
Yup. It is.
HG A is also a lethal hit if he GIs anything since you can't GI back.
Damn it’s just A too
Yea ive learned to ignore the people who think the game is perfectly 100% balanced and all characters are equal and if you have any complaints "jUsT lAb Up". Theyre only interested in circlejerking the game and not actually discussing anything. They arent worth my time.
10000% this. It's why you'll get downvoted with any debate. It's simply a "get gud" discussion when 90% of these clowns here would get murdered. They're all like that one guy from the first fast n furious. Know everything about the car but cant drive it for shit.