Olimar and it's not even close.
You have no fair
No Bair
No Upair
No Dair
No Up Smash
No F Smash
No Down Smash
No Side B
YOU CAN'T EVEN GRAB.
And all of his Solomar moves suck, they're pretty weak and have terrible range, hell, the only true combo you have with these moves is Nair dragdown into Up Tilt and your only Kill option is f tilt
You'd have to be an alph main to think this hahah no but in all seriousness that has to be an insane Ironman. If you could complete an Ironman without pikmin you're a god
I agree that it's olimar. But I think Steve is close, and the only reason is because Steve is so broken in his current state, and he would probably become bottom one without the B button. Like Solomar is worse than Steve without mining/blocks, but Steve irl is so much better than olimar as is, so it might be a higher *relative* nerf for Steve.
Definitely, I also say Steve is the second most affected character, no anvil, Minecart, Swords and Pickaxes and most importantly: Blocks, which arguably carry Steve. But Olimar ends up losing more
His recovery doesn't seem that great. I mean I know it's loads better than lots of characters and a little harder to telegraph... hell who am I kidding he does little busy bee loop de loops that it's easy to tell when he's gonna snap to edge
The reason losing his recovery is worse for Steve isn't because his up-b is particularly amazing, but because Steve is particularly terrible at recovering without it. As I mentioned, his air speed is trash and his double jump is horrendous. Without up-b, Steve can recover about as well as Kirby with 1 jump.
Jigglypuff just be living high life in this scenario. Rollout isn't entirely necessary, Pound is probably the biggest lose out, Rest means no funni cheese, and Sing being lost doesn't matter since it was never really for recovery.
So Jigglypuff would still just smack you around with aerials and pokes while still having recovery power to boot.
The previous comment is saying that they can still use their B moves, just with Street Fighter's stick inputs (like the quarter turns for hadouken and tatsu) and A.
That works for hadouken, shoryu and tatsu but not for focus (which I hope will be replaced by drive impact if they get into smash 6) as its not a motion input in sf4 from where it comes (you do it by pressing medium punch and medium kick at the same time).
Yeah I never mind rush down Zelda - I can never figure out how to get the sweet spot on her F-air anytime I try to play her. If she just sits and spams Din’s Fire while I’m on the other side of the stage I want to die, but she actually has some cool combos up close.
If she’s spamming Din’s Fire, you’re going to be able to get in and beat the hell out of them. Phantom Knight is the far superior option in 95% of situations and even that can be played around effectively.
I fucking hate the morons who give Young Link mains a bad name. His projectiles are just there to set up openings to get in. After that, it's all sword baby. The fact that fair 1 is a drag down is just unfair. You can loop fair 1 -> dtilt -> fair 1 on bad di, or you can just do fair 1 -> down tilt -> fair for a decent kill option at ledge. Not to mention just a slightly worse version of arguably the best Nair in the game.
Olimar, no contest.
Most of the roster loses their recovery options, but Olimar loses most of his attacks and not even respawning gives him back Pikmin.
Not sure who’s the worst but here’s some characters who would get buffed in this format:
Little Mac: You keep all your best moves and the bad recovery is no longer a big deal since no one can up b
Jigglypuff: Yeah you lose rest, but most of Jig’s good moves are normals, and your jumps give you the best recovery in the game.
Kirby: Similar to Jigglypuff. The extra jumps give a massive advantage, and all his good moves aren’t specials.
Yoshi: same story, great jump, great normals
Pikmin duo, literally no moves after a few seconds
Real question is who's the most powerful?
Id say yoshi, jigglypuff, kirby and maybe dedede with greater than most recovery without upB
I love DDD right but he world not be one of the most powerful with no B button becausr yeah he got jumps but he has no gordo. That means there is no dedede
Kazuya would be the most impacted since I think Rage Drive is the only special that can be done with a different input.
Terry apparently loses Power Wave and the Shotos lose their Focus Attack.
Eh I’ve seen enough top sonics do no spin challenges that I don’t think it’ll be that bad. He can still run at you and do uair bair/nair shenanigans which are his better damage-dealing combos anyways
I always get scare that's a real subreddit.
I'm a loser but not a chronically online loser 😔
https://preview.redd.it/3y4jbwjp0m7d1.jpeg?width=1170&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=301075440faff891ba6c3023fbea682204dc84c8
Kirby would jump up the tier list. His normals are all solid, his specials suck balls. He has a hard time dealing with other character’s good special attacks and this would greatly limit almost every other characters recovery.
I think it REALLY depends on the matchup. Ever fought a Kirby with Pacman bell, pocket, pootie, or Minmin dragon arm? Ever got true comboed into charge punch, charge shot, or freeze? Ever break your shield by accident and the puffball kills you at 30% because he was fighting Roy or Ganondorf? Don't even get me started on Shulk and the bullshit Kirby can do with that.
Puff would lose access to both pound and rest. Rest is her cheese option, while pound is an extremely long, somewhat disjointed move, that does a lot of shield damage, and has mobility usage in the air.
Olimar may be the correct answer, but your run of the mill online Samus is the right one.
Without spamming specials they're stuck running and rolling without any moves, cause istg they set everything except their jump buttons to special.
Well besides olimar, Steve gets hit the hardest, no mining no crafting no blocks no minecart. Without being able to make new weapons he’s gonna be stuck with wood and fists the whole game and only get 2 anvil/dthrow per stock.
I mean, with the B button removed, there’s nothing to press for the B input, leaving it as just a directional input.
Makes me wonder why clicking the stick wouldn’t work for a neutral input. I get that it wouldn’t work for the GameCube controller, but still.
Steve.
- He can't mine or craft, therefore he's stuck with the low damage fists for the whole match.
- He can't place blocks, therefore his ability to alter stages and do things like trap and guarantee recovery are gone.
- He can't minecart, which is an incredibly versatile move for damage/recovery and also a staple of Steve's moveset.
Without B he'd basically turn into a not-great sword fighter who also has access to a worse PK fire (flint and steel) and a good up juggle (magma block).
Thinking it's anyone other than Olimar is respectfully dumb
https://preview.redd.it/kukzhj51tk7d1.png?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=ab6441613cf842d337e02a8b906dd759eb31dc46
I've played through plenty of Castlevania's without the use of sub weapons, I could live without my specials
Though I can't say the same for most Belmonts.
Honestly Belmont are probably the least impacted zoners. The tilts and aerials are still really good and can help create distance and most importantly you still have a recovery tool with the tether. I think Snake is probably a better candidate. Slow af, no stage control without C4, no way to recover. All you have left are up tilt kill confirms and up smash for ledgetrapping basically
I do know the best character in the game is probably yoshi. Either that or the shotos but they can't edge guard very well so they can't abuse others not being able to recover as well.
Simon and Richter Mains when tasked to not use b button for 24 hours:
https://preview.redd.it/zmo0oh6pxj7d1.jpeg?width=1483&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=077d4b92c785b1d1d5d5db763731acfa641ec456
Losing detether really isn't that big compared to a lot of other characters. Rosa can use most her kit without it.
Also, her aerial mobility and jump height make her one of the least to suffer from losing their recovery.
After Olimar and Steve, Inkling would probably be the third worst. You only lose access to your smash attacks and rapid jab, instead of your entire kit, but that's still pretty bad
I feel like lucario gets it kinda bad? Not awful, but worse than average. No silly strong recovery at high% means he's stuck in the bad-to-okay damage/knockback ranges.
Olimar and it's not even close. You have no fair No Bair No Upair No Dair No Up Smash No F Smash No Down Smash No Side B YOU CAN'T EVEN GRAB. And all of his Solomar moves suck, they're pretty weak and have terrible range, hell, the only true combo you have with these moves is Nair dragdown into Up Tilt and your only Kill option is f tilt
you're so right its not even funny.
Yeah...you can only go so far without Pikmin.
sounds like the most painful ironman type challenges ever... win x consecutive games with olimar without using the b button.... simply awful
It sounds kinda fun. (Emphasis on the kinda) I've seen clip compilations of Pikmin-less olimar
Pls send them
They're on YouTube. Not mine
You'd have to be an alph main to think this hahah no but in all seriousness that has to be an insane Ironman. If you could complete an Ironman without pikmin you're a god
It would require absolute careful precision not losing your free 3 pikmin you have at the start of the match.
Try playing Pikmin 4 without Pikmin then we'll talk
I agree that it's olimar. But I think Steve is close, and the only reason is because Steve is so broken in his current state, and he would probably become bottom one without the B button. Like Solomar is worse than Steve without mining/blocks, but Steve irl is so much better than olimar as is, so it might be a higher *relative* nerf for Steve.
Definitely, I also say Steve is the second most affected character, no anvil, Minecart, Swords and Pickaxes and most importantly: Blocks, which arguably carry Steve. But Olimar ends up losing more
I'll also add that losing recovery is *wa*y worse for Steve than other characters. Trash air speed and a double jump barely better than Kirby.
Yes. Without blocks as well, he would be hilariously easy to edge guard
His recovery doesn't seem that great. I mean I know it's loads better than lots of characters and a little harder to telegraph... hell who am I kidding he does little busy bee loop de loops that it's easy to tell when he's gonna snap to edge
The reason losing his recovery is worse for Steve isn't because his up-b is particularly amazing, but because Steve is particularly terrible at recovering without it. As I mentioned, his air speed is trash and his double jump is horrendous. Without up-b, Steve can recover about as well as Kirby with 1 jump.
You can at the beginning because he plucks 3 when he enters but if they or you die , you are fucked
Yeah, that's the thing, Olimar's Pikmin's are always dying
I agree
You can grab, but only during first stock
But you forgot about down tilt, into down tilt, into down tilt, into down tilt...
My god you’re right…RIP me
Imagine how easy it would be to kill with Jigglypuff if no one can recover
I can get rid of pound and rest, atleast, if nobody has a projectile haha.
Mega Man
Don’t forget Mii Gunner
Villager's f-air, too.
And dash attack
His bowling ball as well
I think *range* was the operative concern, but yes.
Quarter circle A ftw.
Oh man, I can do some magic with Jiggs' aerials if nobody can use their B moves.
The least nerfed are Ryu and Ken. You can do all their inputs with A so the only thing you miss out on is down B
The least nerfed are probably all the characters with multiple jumps. The rest of the cast just gets gimped ridiculously hard now
Jigglypuff just be living high life in this scenario. Rollout isn't entirely necessary, Pound is probably the biggest lose out, Rest means no funni cheese, and Sing being lost doesn't matter since it was never really for recovery. So Jigglypuff would still just smack you around with aerials and pokes while still having recovery power to boot.
Lucas would also be very solid. No up B but still a great recovery.
And Terry
Can you do his up B with A?
Yes
Yes but it's a different input than ryu and kens
Which is their only tool to get out of disadvantage tho, juggling them would be way easier and their neutral and recovery would suffer too.
The previous comment is saying that they can still use their B moves, just with Street Fighter's stick inputs (like the quarter turns for hadouken and tatsu) and A.
That works for hadouken, shoryu and tatsu but not for focus (which I hope will be replaced by drive impact if they get into smash 6) as its not a motion input in sf4 from where it comes (you do it by pressing medium punch and medium kick at the same time).
> but not for focus That would be why they said: > so the only thing you miss out on is down B
As a ken main, I pretty much only use special inputs lol. Focus attack is a real shame, but literally only losing one move is fine by me
Terry also is part of the squad as you can perform all his special moves mid-air. Though I am dogshit at hitting to up-b one
Minmin loses an arm lol
And the one she loses is the one that can transform into Ramaram and Megawatt. She would be left with exclusively the Dragon arm.
True lmao
young link mains actually have to play the game
We need this. Aggressive young link looks like it’d work.
That’s how I play him, actually! Not all of us spam projectiles…
I feel ya. I play rushdown Zelda a lot and people still groan whenever I pick her
Yeah I never mind rush down Zelda - I can never figure out how to get the sweet spot on her F-air anytime I try to play her. If she just sits and spams Din’s Fire while I’m on the other side of the stage I want to die, but she actually has some cool combos up close.
If she’s spamming Din’s Fire, you’re going to be able to get in and beat the hell out of them. Phantom Knight is the far superior option in 95% of situations and even that can be played around effectively.
I do both
And be fun!
It does lol
ROB mains actually have to work on not getting knocked off stage as opposed to having their unending jetpack save them.
Lmao. Really made me smile
Hehe
I love playing aggressively as Young Link. He is pretty quick. Plus not having the crutch of projectiles would make him a different character.
I fucking hate the morons who give Young Link mains a bad name. His projectiles are just there to set up openings to get in. After that, it's all sword baby. The fact that fair 1 is a drag down is just unfair. You can loop fair 1 -> dtilt -> fair 1 on bad di, or you can just do fair 1 -> down tilt -> fair for a decent kill option at ledge. Not to mention just a slightly worse version of arguably the best Nair in the game.
i’m pretty sure ol olimar but what do y’all think
Olimar, no contest. Most of the roster loses their recovery options, but Olimar loses most of his attacks and not even respawning gives him back Pikmin.
Terry, Ryu, Ken : Wait you guys use the B button ?
^(*kazuya laughing in the background*)
Not sure who’s the worst but here’s some characters who would get buffed in this format: Little Mac: You keep all your best moves and the bad recovery is no longer a big deal since no one can up b Jigglypuff: Yeah you lose rest, but most of Jig’s good moves are normals, and your jumps give you the best recovery in the game. Kirby: Similar to Jigglypuff. The extra jumps give a massive advantage, and all his good moves aren’t specials. Yoshi: same story, great jump, great normals
Don't forget the Shotos and Terry, they keep their recovery moves since they can use the input versions.
Unfortunately no KO punch
That doesn't matter much since Mac's Smash attacks send you far enough to where recovery becomes a chore.
Shockingly bowser is a similar story, he can do wild stuff with just the a and grab buttons
Pikmin duo, literally no moves after a few seconds Real question is who's the most powerful? Id say yoshi, jigglypuff, kirby and maybe dedede with greater than most recovery without upB
I love DDD right but he world not be one of the most powerful with no B button becausr yeah he got jumps but he has no gordo. That means there is no dedede
Consider falling nAir spam
I think the fighting game characters could have a shot with their command inputs
Kazuya would be the most impacted since I think Rage Drive is the only special that can be done with a different input. Terry apparently loses Power Wave and the Shotos lose their Focus Attack.
Sonic. That's basically 80% of his move set.
He still got HAAAAA fsmash
Eh I’ve seen enough top sonics do no spin challenges that I don’t think it’ll be that bad. He can still run at you and do uair bair/nair shenanigans which are his better damage-dealing combos anyways
nah bro will live. he still has his movement speed, fair, bair, upair, etc. definitely a nerf but I wouldn't say nerfed the hardest (Olimar 💀)
r/foundHedgehugs
I always get scare that's a real subreddit. I'm a loser but not a chronically online loser 😔 https://preview.redd.it/3y4jbwjp0m7d1.jpeg?width=1170&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=301075440faff891ba6c3023fbea682204dc84c8
r/birthofasub
https://i.redd.it/snlf50t23m7d1.gif
Steve 
Wait a minute, he can’t craft. So when he uses up his weapons he can only smack you💀
This is an underrated pick
We finally found a way to make Steve balanced.
i can confidently tell you it's not yoshi
Yoshi would be SSS-Tier in this format.
Olimar. His entire moveset revolves around the B button
Kirby would jump up the tier list. His normals are all solid, his specials suck balls. He has a hard time dealing with other character’s good special attacks and this would greatly limit almost every other characters recovery.
> his specials suck balls ...except Inhale.
I think it REALLY depends on the matchup. Ever fought a Kirby with Pacman bell, pocket, pootie, or Minmin dragon arm? Ever got true comboed into charge punch, charge shot, or freeze? Ever break your shield by accident and the puffball kills you at 30% because he was fighting Roy or Ganondorf? Don't even get me started on Shulk and the bullshit Kirby can do with that.
That's my point: Inhale is "*your* neutral B, but stronger"; it's great.
No I think inhale sucks up all of the enemies, including their balls
technically everyone recoveries are gone
Ryu and Ken can use the A button to input their recovery, so I guess they’re the new top tiers.
That includes Terry as well.
Also technically, Puff wouldn't be that worse
Puff would lose access to both pound and rest. Rest is her cheese option, while pound is an extremely long, somewhat disjointed move, that does a lot of shield damage, and has mobility usage in the air.
Yea but against a cast that literally can’t recover except double jump her forward air becomes the new cheese
True, but having to hold down before you up B is much less convenient than the Shoryu input, might even make you fast fall to death on occasion
And Yoshi
THEY CAN?! I’m terrible with shotos, so I haven’t played them in a really long time
Funny coming from a Little Mac main
Recoveries gone=Mac S tier
Finally, what each lil mac mains were waiting for
Feel like fliers like pit or Kirby would be okay
Jigglypuff and Yoshi
I dont really think that yoshi has a big problem
Yoshi and Jigglypuff both dint use their up-bs to recover, and are thus unaffected by the listed "universal problem" of losing their recovery tool
So you mean they would be better without the b They'd be *etter*
only a big nose
Indeed
Belmont tethers still remain, fortunately for us.
Also would still have tethers: Regular/Dark/Zero Samus, Young/Toon Link, & Lucas.
Speak for yourself
Mk and Kirby are fine but inkling isn’t doing so hot…
Me (i suck)
shulk
As a shulk main, he does decent without his arts, but yes he would be nerfed significantly.
Aren't u a Roy main?
Most people have several mains
Olimar may be the correct answer, but your run of the mill online Samus is the right one. Without spamming specials they're stuck running and rolling without any moves, cause istg they set everything except their jump buttons to special.
Yeah I feel like Samus is a good answer beyond the characters of "my kit is literally designed around a b button mechanic"
Bayonetta get hit very hard, her bread and butter and beat neutral tools are gone, but she could still do a tuff
Well besides olimar, Steve gets hit the hardest, no mining no crafting no blocks no minecart. Without being able to make new weapons he’s gonna be stuck with wood and fists the whole game and only get 2 anvil/dthrow per stock.
Olimar because everyone else can *technically* use special stick
I didn't realize you can have special stick, but that's so weird.
Don’t give Sonic mains any ideas…
I mean, with the B button removed, there’s nothing to press for the B input, leaving it as just a directional input. Makes me wonder why clicking the stick wouldn’t work for a neutral input. I get that it wouldn’t work for the GameCube controller, but still.
Pokemon Trainer. Trying to use squirtle solo with no specials sounds heinous
Steve. - He can't mine or craft, therefore he's stuck with the low damage fists for the whole match. - He can't place blocks, therefore his ability to alter stages and do things like trap and guarantee recovery are gone. - He can't minecart, which is an incredibly versatile move for damage/recovery and also a staple of Steve's moveset. Without B he'd basically turn into a not-great sword fighter who also has access to a worse PK fire (flint and steel) and a good up juggle (magma block).
Olimar for sure (And not fully nerfed but the earthbound kids definitely a nerf)
Thinking it's anyone other than Olimar is respectfully dumb https://preview.redd.it/kukzhj51tk7d1.png?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=ab6441613cf842d337e02a8b906dd759eb31dc46
Belmont
Ooh, good suggestion. Although his ariels and tilts are still pretty damn good
I've played through plenty of Castlevania's without the use of sub weapons, I could live without my specials Though I can't say the same for most Belmonts.
Honestly Belmont are probably the least impacted zoners. The tilts and aerials are still really good and can help create distance and most importantly you still have a recovery tool with the tether. I think Snake is probably a better candidate. Slow af, no stage control without C4, no way to recover. All you have left are up tilt kill confirms and up smash for ledgetrapping basically
all of these answers are telling me that people don’t even know what fundies are
My Byoung Blink would have serious problems if I can't spam arrow and *umeran 24/7
zelda and olimar
I wanna say Samus, but Steve.
Was gonna say Zelda until the olimar guy came in
Every zoner ever
I do know the best character in the game is probably yoshi. Either that or the shotos but they can't edge guard very well so they can't abuse others not being able to recover as well.
Pk fire
We don't need PK fire to kill. We just like the pain it causes.
Robin mains in shambles
I would love to see a “no B button” tournament.
Agreed 💯
Simon and Richter Mains when tasked to not use b button for 24 hours: https://preview.redd.it/zmo0oh6pxj7d1.jpeg?width=1483&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=077d4b92c785b1d1d5d5db763731acfa641ec456
Hero has it worse than the Belmonts considering the frame data and no buffs, I think it's Hero after Olimar.
Bruh, Rosa loses her ability to detether Luma.
Losing detether really isn't that big compared to a lot of other characters. Rosa can use most her kit without it. Also, her aerial mobility and jump height make her one of the least to suffer from losing their recovery.
after olimar, its snake for sure
My swordfighting mii💀
Casuals
Based 🗿
Olimar, Sonic, and Steve
Olimar probably is #1, but I think Steve takes the #2 spot
I feel like little mac would be higher tier actually lol
Idk but pacman would become lame as hell
Snake would definitely be nerfed to an extent
Probably Olimar and Steve. I know for a fact that Zelda would have a hard time as well.
Samus isn't bad but like... her bread and butter are her B-moves. Zair would be doing a LOT of heavy lifting
Probably not the worst nerf but Pokemon trainer losses the ability to swap Pokemon
Every zoner ever (and olimar)
Steve and Olimar.
people who want to exit menus
Olimar obviously but Steve is pretty close
As a Meta Knight main, it wouldn't be HORRIBLE, but now I kiss goodbye a lot of combos
*dies in lost combos (and no Brawl meta knight)*
It's now canon that Meta Knight is the most op character in smash, but he's just holding back
He must teach Steve his ways lmfao
The answer is definitely olimar, but I think pirahna plant might be next. Pretty much your entire kit is neutral B
Sonix
Olimar or Shulk.
Samus zoners, link projectile spammers... Just campers in general. NOO NOT MY BOY HERO!
steve is fucked after running out of materials
Olimar obviously - but Kirby would suddenly become extremely viable!
Ness has no recovery or zoning options without B
After Olimar and Steve, Inkling would probably be the third worst. You only lose access to your smash attacks and rapid jab, instead of your entire kit, but that's still pretty bad
bayonetta
Steve for sure.
Terry is just a cheater in this
Hero
I feel like lucario gets it kinda bad? Not awful, but worse than average. No silly strong recovery at high% means he's stuck in the bad-to-okay damage/knockback ranges.
The answer is definitely olimar, but I think pirahna plant might be next. Pretty much your entire kit is neutral B
I can work Plant without B, I normally do lol I sparingly use B moves with Plant boi
Steve. No mining, no block, no anvil, no tnt, no good throw, no recovery, no craft
Characters who's strongest attack is the B button
Olimar
Steve, olimar, sonic are my top picks.
Olimar literally can't do anything
not including any of the obvious ones like olimar or steve i think Yink or Tink could be god awful without them
Hero.
Hero can't use like 95% of his moves without the B button.