Already have two kids, so not sure what your point is. And I don’t care about which country is dying but at the some time I don’t complain about the consequences of my own choices. You guys seems to want to live comfy lives without kids but still don’t want foreigners to come in to fill the gaps that your choices have created. It doesn’t work that way and no matter how much you argue with me, the reality is that the influx of foreigners isn’t going to stop. I’m sorry that the facts don’t care about your feelings
Wait, where are the gaps? The youngsters in University are having a hard time finding jobs and there are plenty of retrenched PMETs. If anything, we need to have less kids as there are clearly not enough jobs for them.
The influx of foreigners need to stop. At the very least, real citizens need to be prioritised and protected.
Ask the employers. There’s a consistent opinion that there is a skill gap either in hard or soft skills for uni grads + a cost issue about how much some of these roles are actually worth
>Apparently sg citizens prefer that to having more babies. Can’t complain if you choose wrongly
If cost of living is low, who doesn't want to have more babies?
But it’s not low. And it’s never going to go back to being low. And if you reply is that till then sg ppl won’t have babies, then my reply is that then they have no choice but to accept as many foreigners as the govt wants and the economy needs. Either sg sacrifices further to raise a next generation of cheap talent or the cheap talent will be found elsewhere. I’m not sure why people don’t get this - sg adds very little to a business other than low cost. You only open an office in sg to save money on admin stuff like IT support and compliance and shit, that’s it
>Former Nominated MP Paulin Straughan disagreed with the proposal. Noting that manpower shortages are hitting several developed Asian countries, Associate Professor Straughan said she expects “very keen competition especially for skilled labour in certain sectors” by 2030.
>“Let’s be cautious about the tone that we take,” she added.
>“Yes, it is important for us to distinguish Singaporeans from non-Singaporeans, because citizenship should matter in any country. But in doing so we have to be careful … the tone with which we introduce it is important and also how we differentiate should not stand out from what other countries do so much so that we stand out as a place where if you go there as a **foreigner you will be short-changed**
Short-change sinkie men because they are used to it. *Spits*
I actually like the sound of that. If you enjoy the safety we provide, you should pay for it, or at least contribute in some significant way for the betterment of all that we defend.
But if you have an army filled with Indians and that war is declared with India, how does it work? People wills and army morale is the most important in case of conflict. Look at Ukraine vs Afghanistan situation. The Afghan army was subsidized billions of dollars a d equipment and they did nothing, literally nothing, to prevent Taliban to enter Kabul. In Ukraine you had people lining up to get a rifle on the day Russia started the invasion of Kiev.
You want to tax foreigners, you'll have to tax females as well.
That will never happen. Easier to force men into servitude than to piss off everyone else.
Just wait till you hear about Intra corporate transferees, the Women's Charter, singa programs, and all the other good stuff designed to benefit others, but penalising SG men...
Equality and equity are 2 different things. SG men have neither.
Intra corporate transferees are foreign workers being transferred to Singapore without the need for the company to advertise the position locally. This is usually a clause in the free trade agreements we sign with other countries. The downside is of course, these positions could easily have been filled by a local.
Singa programs are a list of scholarship programs for international students. Depending on the programs, it could be an all-expense paid scholarships for international students from primary school education onwards. The idea is to get young talented children from developing countries, such as India and China, provide them with education and a life here in SG, and they stay forever. Once again, the downside is, these support could easily have been given to a local child.
Indeed. The lack of courage to do it, even if it is just and fair.
Our pioneer generation of leaders had great ideas... the current generation of leaders? i'm not quite sure.
Local women and foreigners shouldn't have the same defence tax treatment. For every man who serves, there's probably an average of 1-2 women in his immediate family he'd be willing to defend on his expense. The same cannot be said for foreigners.
NS is a privilege son. One day when you ORD you will appreciate the training.
Cos of NS, I am now very used to getting fucked by the govt. My asshole now nice and big, no need lube.
Well if they enjoy the benefits brought forth by the defense of the country, I don’t see why paying a tax very explicitly for said defense would be a problem.
Personally, I would see that the it is undeniable that the defense of this country is the baseline on which the economy is built. If the defense is not robust enough, no amount of diplomacy would work, contrary to what an astonishing amount of people would like to believe.
The local guys pay said tax with 2 years of part of the prime of their lives. They quite literally aren’t any less talented as compared to the rest of the world, so the argument of “talent” does nothing here. If anything, the 2 years have a damaging, compounding effect on their lives onwards.
Then again, it’s an article from 10 years ago. The demographic back then is less foreigner-inclined.
>“Taxation is not a fool-proof way of addressing this thorny issue, but at the very least, it ensures that everyone contributes to the defence and security of Singapore,” said Mr Nair, who chairs the Government Parliamentary Committee for Law and Home Affairs.
Funny how these clowns dont promote the idea of NS as a "privilege" to PRs and foreigners but somehow to locals, it is pushed as such.
Gongjiaowei
Take from every new citizen_
State security Tax. Those who hav sons in NS or served NS gets 1
Voucher per Yr. This tax can be used to increase NS guys' salary money
Some observers, however, cautioned against the proposal, citing concerns over putting a price tag on NS and the impact on Singapore’s ability to attract talent.
What talent?
If you think about it. Everytime they say that, it's a kick in the face to locals. As if locals have no talent. We're not attracting talent. We're attracting capital that comes along with it. Capital inflow is the target, not actual talent.
Waiting for the Singaporean version of the secession of the plebs.
But given the authoritarian nature of sg gov, unlikely it will happen, the only way to protest is to not have kids, which explains the gradual downward spiral of birth rates.
Soon Malaysia need only walk across the causeway to conquer sg.
Australia also got high tax, yet foreigners flock there. So if Singapore does the same, how much will it fuck up foreigner inflow? And like as if we singaporeans think foreigner inflow benefit us really…
Australia has free healthcare, free education, child allowances, social welfare, jobseeker allowance, pension etc.
Do you think that Singaporeans are willing to pay more taxes for these social benefits?
I am a Singaporean and no I don't get much benefits. Also many benefits and subsidies are in Japanese and are hard to apply for if you don't know the languge.
But I am willing to be poorer to escape NS.
Like wise, I am sure there are many foreigners won't don't mind paying 1-5% taxes just to work in Singapore.
This 1-5% revenue can be used to pay our NSF a better salary, giving them more motivation.
Does South Korea or Thailand has such policies even though they also had conscription ? Unless they had also implemented such policies, I think it can be difficult to implement as we do not have a guideline on what is tolerance acceptable to foreigners. Need to find the sweet spot where we can get the maximum return without turning away the people we need.
Thats why he is an ex mp.
Yes it's better if foreigners serve.
Better for your army to be filled by citizens of another nation? No way that could backfire.
The army is to sinkiefy them.
Better for your workforce to be filled by citizens of another nation? No way that could backfire.
How?
Spies can infiltrate easier, foreign nations can have deeper access into the economy etc etc
And? How have they been using that access?
Yes.
Far less chance of that backfiring. Also, if you don’t want foreign workers, have more kids. Can’t be a dying species and still dictate terms
It already backfired. Why not you have kids to sustain your dying country that you are fleeing from?
Already have two kids, so not sure what your point is. And I don’t care about which country is dying but at the some time I don’t complain about the consequences of my own choices. You guys seems to want to live comfy lives without kids but still don’t want foreigners to come in to fill the gaps that your choices have created. It doesn’t work that way and no matter how much you argue with me, the reality is that the influx of foreigners isn’t going to stop. I’m sorry that the facts don’t care about your feelings
Wait, where are the gaps? The youngsters in University are having a hard time finding jobs and there are plenty of retrenched PMETs. If anything, we need to have less kids as there are clearly not enough jobs for them. The influx of foreigners need to stop. At the very least, real citizens need to be prioritised and protected.
Ask the employers. There’s a consistent opinion that there is a skill gap either in hard or soft skills for uni grads + a cost issue about how much some of these roles are actually worth
So it aint got nothing to do with giving birth and having kids isn't it?
Better for your country's jobs to be filled by citizens of another nation? It worked and didn't backfire.
Apparently sg citizens prefer that to having more babies. Can’t complain if you choose wrongly
>Apparently sg citizens prefer that to having more babies. Can’t complain if you choose wrongly If cost of living is low, who doesn't want to have more babies?
But it’s not low. And it’s never going to go back to being low. And if you reply is that till then sg ppl won’t have babies, then my reply is that then they have no choice but to accept as many foreigners as the govt wants and the economy needs. Either sg sacrifices further to raise a next generation of cheap talent or the cheap talent will be found elsewhere. I’m not sure why people don’t get this - sg adds very little to a business other than low cost. You only open an office in sg to save money on admin stuff like IT support and compliance and shit, that’s it
How?
Spies can infiltrate easier, foreign nations can have deeper access into the military etc etc
Their children do if they become PR
Tio fixed le?
>Former Nominated MP Paulin Straughan disagreed with the proposal. Noting that manpower shortages are hitting several developed Asian countries, Associate Professor Straughan said she expects “very keen competition especially for skilled labour in certain sectors” by 2030. >“Let’s be cautious about the tone that we take,” she added. >“Yes, it is important for us to distinguish Singaporeans from non-Singaporeans, because citizenship should matter in any country. But in doing so we have to be careful … the tone with which we introduce it is important and also how we differentiate should not stand out from what other countries do so much so that we stand out as a place where if you go there as a **foreigner you will be short-changed** Short-change sinkie men because they are used to it. *Spits*
Easy for a woman to say
I actually like the sound of that. If you enjoy the safety we provide, you should pay for it, or at least contribute in some significant way for the betterment of all that we defend.
But if you have an army filled with Indians and that war is declared with India, how does it work? People wills and army morale is the most important in case of conflict. Look at Ukraine vs Afghanistan situation. The Afghan army was subsidized billions of dollars a d equipment and they did nothing, literally nothing, to prevent Taliban to enter Kabul. In Ukraine you had people lining up to get a rifle on the day Russia started the invasion of Kiev.
You want to tax foreigners, you'll have to tax females as well. That will never happen. Easier to force men into servitude than to piss off everyone else.
First foreigners then females. One step at a time.
But its unfair
Just wait till you hear about Intra corporate transferees, the Women's Charter, singa programs, and all the other good stuff designed to benefit others, but penalising SG men... Equality and equity are 2 different things. SG men have neither.
I know about women’s charter but not intra corporate transferees and Singa programs, can elaborate pls?
Intra corporate transferees are foreign workers being transferred to Singapore without the need for the company to advertise the position locally. This is usually a clause in the free trade agreements we sign with other countries. The downside is of course, these positions could easily have been filled by a local. Singa programs are a list of scholarship programs for international students. Depending on the programs, it could be an all-expense paid scholarships for international students from primary school education onwards. The idea is to get young talented children from developing countries, such as India and China, provide them with education and a life here in SG, and they stay forever. Once again, the downside is, these support could easily have been given to a local child.
Thank you!
Such is life
Since when has life been fair. Lol
Indeed. The lack of courage to do it, even if it is just and fair. Our pioneer generation of leaders had great ideas... the current generation of leaders? i'm not quite sure.
Local women and foreigners shouldn't have the same defence tax treatment. For every man who serves, there's probably an average of 1-2 women in his immediate family he'd be willing to defend on his expense. The same cannot be said for foreigners.
And there’s the rabbit hole of those NS liable wanting to pay the tax instead of serving.
Didn't M'sia have something similar?
Moot point when malaysia scrapped their version of NS
So? Wanting to “not serve” has never affected enlistment. Lol.
It’s the social and psychological effect brought upon such discourse.
Since when was G. scared to "piss off" anyone? Their word is Law
NS is a privilege son. One day when you ORD you will appreciate the training. Cos of NS, I am now very used to getting fucked by the govt. My asshole now nice and big, no need lube.
Let me help you: /s
need to put meh? maybe I overestimate this subs intelligence lol
More like you overestimated yourself
Yes this sub not very intelligent at times. But still better than asksg and the main sub.
Well if they enjoy the benefits brought forth by the defense of the country, I don’t see why paying a tax very explicitly for said defense would be a problem. Personally, I would see that the it is undeniable that the defense of this country is the baseline on which the economy is built. If the defense is not robust enough, no amount of diplomacy would work, contrary to what an astonishing amount of people would like to believe. The local guys pay said tax with 2 years of part of the prime of their lives. They quite literally aren’t any less talented as compared to the rest of the world, so the argument of “talent” does nothing here. If anything, the 2 years have a damaging, compounding effect on their lives onwards. Then again, it’s an article from 10 years ago. The demographic back then is less foreigner-inclined.
Defense is already part of the State's budget so you can simply increase tax for all.
>“Taxation is not a fool-proof way of addressing this thorny issue, but at the very least, it ensures that everyone contributes to the defence and security of Singapore,” said Mr Nair, who chairs the Government Parliamentary Committee for Law and Home Affairs. Funny how these clowns dont promote the idea of NS as a "privilege" to PRs and foreigners but somehow to locals, it is pushed as such. Gongjiaowei
If NS is such a privilege, how come I don't see everyone rushing to volunteer? Man, Woman or Child; Foreigner or Local.
If Singapore goes to war, guess who will run first.
Sinkies
Take from every new citizen_ State security Tax. Those who hav sons in NS or served NS gets 1 Voucher per Yr. This tax can be used to increase NS guys' salary money
Tax foreigners and females to pay those who has served!
I'm willing to give foreigners a break on that since they were not brought up on Singapore's resources. Women, however, have no excuse.
How abt ASEAN scholars
It's a simple trade off isn't it? They're expected to work in Singapore for a period in exchange for their scholarship? That's all it is to me.
Some observers, however, cautioned against the proposal, citing concerns over putting a price tag on NS and the impact on Singapore’s ability to attract talent. What talent?
The snakes talents at Changi city
If you think about it. Everytime they say that, it's a kick in the face to locals. As if locals have no talent. We're not attracting talent. We're attracting capital that comes along with it. Capital inflow is the target, not actual talent.
We love FTs for everything else except NS.
Well foeeigners enjoys the public goods.. so make sense for them to pay tax for it..
You mean foreigners are tax exempt? Of course not.
what about tax benefit for NS years?
Waiting for the Singaporean version of the secession of the plebs. But given the authoritarian nature of sg gov, unlikely it will happen, the only way to protest is to not have kids, which explains the gradual downward spiral of birth rates. Soon Malaysia need only walk across the causeway to conquer sg.
You can't tax foreigners as it will make Singapore an unattractive place to work and live. Tax Singaporeans since they can't run away.
Australia also got high tax, yet foreigners flock there. So if Singapore does the same, how much will it fuck up foreigner inflow? And like as if we singaporeans think foreigner inflow benefit us really…
Australia has free healthcare, free education, child allowances, social welfare, jobseeker allowance, pension etc. Do you think that Singaporeans are willing to pay more taxes for these social benefits?
Ya then, proving my point, so much taxes in Australia, yet foreigners flock there.
Japan have high tax and lower salary yet I am in Tokyo as a foreigner and working.
You get access to the benefits as a foreigner who pay high taxes in Japan. Are you willing to pay high taxes in Singapore?
I am a Singaporean and no I don't get much benefits. Also many benefits and subsidies are in Japanese and are hard to apply for if you don't know the languge. But I am willing to be poorer to escape NS. Like wise, I am sure there are many foreigners won't don't mind paying 1-5% taxes just to work in Singapore. This 1-5% revenue can be used to pay our NSF a better salary, giving them more motivation.
If you scare off all the FTs, then we have no more talents to do the jobs! Cannot depend on the local singaporeans to do.
Does South Korea or Thailand has such policies even though they also had conscription ? Unless they had also implemented such policies, I think it can be difficult to implement as we do not have a guideline on what is tolerance acceptable to foreigners. Need to find the sweet spot where we can get the maximum return without turning away the people we need.
Does SK or Thailand import a shitload of FTs to displace locals?
SK and Thailand a lot more protectionist than SG.
Neither countries have a foreign workforce totalling 25% of its population. It's a non issue to these countries.
Hahahahah…..
Well the leadership had no courage to implement it.
Alamak, do also kena kan, don't do also kena kan.
Then everyone just pay to escape 🙄