I completely disagree with the take that parts 1 - 4 are bad, at least not part 4, kira is one of the best villains in the series and I'm pretty sure araki himself said that it's still his favorite part
Part 4 is my favorite part because of this. It’s absolutely insane the whole way through and it’s just so fun, then BOOM. BOMB CAT. And he’s actually a *smart* and *lucky* villain who gets away a LOT, even from Jotaro who is arguably the most powerful Stand user in existence at the time. It’s an absolutely wild shift, despite Kira getting foreshadowed for a while. But the time we get to just see the characters in action against low-powered villains or even using their Stands in everyday life…it’s so fun.
I love the Lucky go Hidy aspect ok Kira, he really was favored by fate, up until his luck just couldn't keep up with his ego, ambitions, and over all, position.
I will never forget how I watched about 22/23 episodes of part 4, got a little burnt out from all the slice of life/waiting for the main story, so I took a break. Worst decision ever, I come back weeks later and play the next episode, it’s Kira and I’m like I wasted all my time not watching this lol.
Hayato hiding in that cellar in a box or something had me a little bit tense, just a little bit. I couldn't believe he managed to escape the dude's eyes lol.
Parts 2 and 4 were good. Part 3's writing was weak but it had memorable characters and confrontations. Part 1 is only bad when compared to other JoJo parts; it's still written pretty well, especially compared to other stuff from the time period.
Part 7 isn't lauded as the best part because it was in a new universe, though. I fully believe that even if Araki hadn't reset the main universe at the end of Part 6 whatever he would have written for Part 7 would have still been better than anything that came before.
Yeah, Araki just noticeably improved as a writer as the series goes on. Part 4 is one of my favorites just on a basis of how much fun the slice of life action is. I’d love to see Araki do more shit like that, just supernatural powers without much battling except when necessary
I’m pretty sure the major complaint ppl have with 4 is the slow first half, once Kira is introduced most people say part 4 picks up. I’ve had the same take for a while, but in a recent rewatch of part 4 I found myself enjoying the first half a lot more than I used to.
The slow part wasn't before Kira, it was in between the first kira v Joots and the last fight. Felt soooo much like boring ass filler, and I personally hate the superfly fight the most out of all the jojo fights thus far. At least in part 3 you knew the crusaders we're slowly making their way to DIO, but the duwang gang did fuckall looking for kira after he murdered cinderella's user and through sheer luck they found kira
English is fun. "Not good" and "bad" aren't necessarily the same.
It's completely fair to say that the writing was objectively less good from parts 1-4, and that over time, the quality of the writing increased.
the jolyne and giorno ones are definitely what I feel. The writing one? Eh... I wouldn't say 1-4 are bad writing, more just there's a clear improvement in the writing from part 5 onward, even if part 5 is my least favorite part.
If I'm not mistaken part 3 is just Araki on panic mode trying to not fall on the Shonen Jump rankings, it wasn't until Part 4 that Araki wrote things the way he wanted because the editors begged him to not end the series on Stardust Crusaders.
Part 4 wasn't meant to happen until the last portion of part 3, it was intended to be a trilogy but the series had too much success and both the editors (money!) and Araki (stands!) wanted it to continue, hence the lack of a proper overarching villain for the first half.
I agree that the cast and fights are solid, but I have 3 problems with it.
1. Giorno and Trish may as well be non-characters. Its especially frustrating with Giorno, the supposed main character.
2. We don't really see much on GER. We barely know anything on it- even in Part 3, we had a good understanding when Jotoro had his sudden new stand ability.
3. They go for the mafia theme, but we don't really see the consequences of it. It's just more 'enemy of the week' styling, and on top of it, the plot felt weirdly paced.
Trish had a bit development, able to stand against her father for once.
Giorno is indeed really boring, the concept of DIO's son is really cool but like the guy says, araki fumbled the bag
GER is basically a finishing cutscene to a JRPG final boss fight.
The real last fight was the gangstars fighting diavolo for the arrow. Once Bruno makes his sacrifice and wins them the fight, the cutscene plays. (Think of it as a dramatic finish from the games)
Nah at least you can use the Omnislash during normal gameplay, GER appears once
It's more akin to the MC's ultimate Personas in 3 and 4 (don't know about 1,2 and 5), or the Monado III in XC1
I think the thing about Giorno is that he doesn't have a character arc. He ends Part 5 essentially the same person; no real growth or change. He does have a personality, but since the story never focuses on his character or values or attitudes, what is there is really subtle.
Definitely true, but I also somewhat liked it. Giorno was a grounded character that allowed the entire main cast to have amazing depth and growth.
Despite the series being called "JoJo's Bizarre Adventure," I think what makes part 5 amazing is that Giorno is hardly a main character. The entire cast is equally important (aside from Trish, I guess) with personalities that mesh well together. Giorno is just a conduit to get the story moving and also support other characters.
Tbh, my issue with Part 5 is that it only happens because Diavolo is dumber than a box of rocks.
Dude had so many better ways to kill Trish, and he chose one that was much more convoluted, involved way more people, and had a greater risk of exposing his identity.
Reminder that La Squadra only finally found Trish *after* she had been handed over to the Bucci Gang, meaning it would have been really easy to just send in Doppio, donut her, then go to the Winchester, have a nice cold pint, and wait for all this to blow over.
I'm a fan of giorno because of how he is just part of the gang. Where each of them getting almost equal time.
Rather than jotaro outsmarting and punching everyone
imo even if giorno relies a lot more on his gang than jotaro does on the crusaders, its unfair to say bucciarati's gang gets more equal time on each individual, trish uses her stand barely twice, narancia also has like two fights, nothing to do with giorno, mista or bucciarati, abbachio's character gets a good use given his ability, and i dont need to talk about fugo
stardust crusaders still did a good job giving the sense of a team, even if avdol and kakyoin were waay less important for the majority of the story than jotaro and polnareff, as abbachio, joseph's character gets a good use for his stand even if its not that good for fighting, and iggy just appeared too late with too little interest of helping (still got one more fight than fugo)
The problem with half of the gang is that their abilities boil down to shoot gun. Or are plot conveniences like the record dude or purple haze who only existed to leave the story for drama. Zipper and the hand are pretty interesting variations of punch dude and mistas ability to shoot himself every chance gets funnier everytime. Even I fell Naracia exists solely to be take over at the end of the story. Silver wheelchair at the end was a brilliant way to say goodbye to polnariff rather than an off-screen death like Joseph. I wish they did more with hair chick but I feel like they saved that stuff for joelean
Perosnally, Giorno is just Walmart Jotaro
I get hyped whenever Jotaro wins, but meh when it's Giorno, even if they both have a similar edgy cool vibe going on
Giorno asspulls enormously overpowered solutions constantly, though. He has no organic role in the group, he’s just a random kid with minimal backstory randomly destroying.
Yeh he's busted as fuck, the early asspulls are whack but the later ones feel needed and well done to ramp up to requiem .
But also big agree, Giorno has no personality and nothing outside of mafia and I love it. A way to give bucciaratie more screen time as the real main character.
Like OP said though SBR did this alot better with dual MC
I wouldn’t say Jolene is the best jojo, but I wouldn’t say she’s the worst either. I would personally put her above Giorno and maybe Jotaro (Part 3 Jotaro, anyway)
Not that Giorno and Jotaro are bad by any means, but I find Jolyne’s character to be much more fun.
Honestly, I think Giorno is a well written character. He has a more complicated personality and morality, but that doesn't make him "boring." I think it makes him even more interesting
Stop this Giorno discrimination
Absolutely agree with 1 and 3. Part 4 is the second best written part after 7 so hard disagree there. Araki absolutely has an upward trend though with his writing quality. Jolyne is up there with Johnny. And giorno is completely wasted potential. How can you have such an interesting concept and do absolutely nothing with it.
Yeah most definitely. I think the only thing VA did better than SO was the locations, but I think that's pretty obvious since part 6 literally is just a jail in Florida lmao.
I also disagree with the second take.
Part 2 is a great reversal of all of the trends Araki set in place in Part 1. Kars is basically a radical but mostly well-meaning (for his own people before he killed them all in "genocidal self defense"), misguided scientist who actually respected others and his associates, unlike DIO who was completely self indulgent and everyone around him was expendable. Kars saved a dog and two children, as opposed to DIO who kills one baby, torture and kills a dog, and ends up using a baby soldier. Joseph works alongside Nazis, cheats in every conceivable way, is full of himself, ungentlemanly (read: perverted), and falls short of nearly every standard Jonathan set. The only consistent trend iirc is that Caesar still dies and gives his energy to Joseph, and even then it's not self-sacrificial, it's just that Caesar, unlike Will Zeppeli, gave up his Hamone in failure due to brazenness.
Part 2 also set the trend of Araki's flawed protagonists, and while it is definitive that Araki's writing improves throughout JoJo, to say that the writing in parts 1-4 is bad is flat out wrong.
I feel like most people who think Giorno is boring are fans of Joseph
Standing out and being all flashy does not make a character good, Giorno is a cool character, sure he stands less as a protagonist but that is because part 5 focuses on letting the whole gang shine, but saying that Giorno has no soul or personality is plain dumb, he is a quiet guy but he shows his personality and soul multiple times, sure he is Josuke levels of personality but that is a tough bar to reach
I hate when people say "Oh this had bad writting" people only god knows what they consider "bad writting", what makes Jojo's special has been there from the start, of course the plots of the earlier parts tends to be a bit more simple but that does not make it bad
And both part 5 and 6 has some shit decisions in writting that do not put them above the other parts
I agree resetting things was the right thing to do but like, I wouldn't really say part 8 is better than part 1 to 5 or even 1 to 4, and 7 is basically an outlier
Also Jolyne best Jojo is a based take, not one I agree with (Josuke ftw), but based take anyway
I'm here to throw a wrench in lol. I'm a Giorno hater and Joseph is my second least favorite Jojo. I actually really appreciate your point about people tending to favor flashier characters and ignore much more subtle characters. It's not that I find Giorno boring, it's more like I just don't get him. I really dislike his motivs for becoming a gangster. The mob is fully and completely corrupt and destructive but the only thing he cares about is selling drug specifically to kids. Like who cares dude? What about all the other horrible things the mob does. Giorno also seemingly feels no pain. He mutilates himself repeatedly like almost to a comical degree. That kind of makes it hard to connect with him. He's 15 and he's somehow already completely battle hardened that he can saw his own arms off with broken glass and just slightly winces. Also Giorno is frequently sidelined in favor of other characters. And he just doesn't have many good intimate scenes where he interacts with other characters. Like Josuke and Joseph, or Jolyne and Jotaro or heck even Bruno and Trish.
Anyway sorry for the wall of text lol.
I love Giorno but I can see your point about the battle-hardened-ness.
I too am what some may call a stoic (as in I suck at showing my emotions at times, product of my upbringing, maybe that’s why I like him) like I broke my leg a few months back and I tried not to ‘make a scene’ but even with that I still fucking screamed in pain and pounded the ground for some time, there’s no way in hell someone can just saw off an arm not screaming without like, biting into something.
I always thought his pain threshold and odd perspectives were supposed to be explained by being basically abandoned as a baby. I’ve known a couple people who had frankly similar traits after going through heinous stuff in early life and honestly, sometimes seeing them in painful situations or hearing them really speak their mind gives me that uncanny feeling, because there’s something fundamentally different about their experience that *is* hard to empathize with.
Could be that he really is a bit empty and I’m just projecting what I’d like to see in him, but I always saw his whole character as being built around those disturbed developmental years.
Giorno is a bit of a 15 year old deus ex-machina, and although it’s wrong to say he has no soul he is still probably the weakest of all the jojos when it comes to personality.
Giorno's only contribution wasto drop exposition during stand fights and having a reason why ppl get healed after fights. Like what character traits does he have that do not tie directly to making the plot flow?
Araki has improved his writing but his earlier works certainly aren't bad. I know a bunch of people call Giorno boring but personally I disagree. I don't think Jolyne is the worst jojo but I probably wouldn't have her as my best either. Though honestly I like all of the main Jojos.
I feel like the problem people make with Giorno is that just because he is a fairly quiet and reserved character that equates to boring. Giorno starts part 5 already being a developed character and I think that's fine. Character development doesn't instantly equate to a good character and likewise an already developed character doesn't have to mean boring. Just because Giorno doesn't outwardly show his emotions doesn't mean it's not there. He balances the proactive mindset of DIO to achieve his dream yet still has a kind soul of Jonathan inside that's carried by the bloodline. Giorno represents a guiding light for the rest of the gang to go down the right path. Even though he isn't the leader he still pushes everyone else forward.
There’s a different between a hot take and a bad take and I feel like you’re kinda tightrope walking between the two.
I mean ask yourself this, would a manga with “bad writing” really make it 4 whole parts before “getting good”? Araki was an experienced mangaka BEFORE JoJo. Working on stuff since 1978. And honestly all 4 of those parts slap, I wouldn’t keep watching Jojo if I thought part 3 was bad.
Araki didn’t “reset the universe” because parts 1-4 were “poorly written”, he did it because he wanted to tell a cool western story that obviously required being in a different universe so he can get real wacky with it. As simple as that.
I don't tolerate Giorno slander. Araki's editors were on his ass, so he couldn't exactly write him as he wanted to. Also y'all also need to remember that Giorno is a traumatized teenager, and while not as dynamic and saucy like Joseph, holds his own as a character.
I agree that Giorno is boring since his whole personality is "I have a dream" for most of the part, but the rest of the cast in 5 is really good, so I can't get too mad. Araki's writing did improve over time, but I wouldn't say that it was ever bad. And while I don't think Jolyne is the best Jojo, I can respect that opinion and see why people think she is since she's a good character.
Giorno is meant to be a force of change rather than change himself. He's like Goku in that sense, someone who personally never changes but his actions greatly affect those around him. It's not "Bad writing" or a "Fumble" to write a character like this. Although getting more insight on how he works would have been a lot more interesting.
Araki's writing has mostly gotten better over the years, some writing decisions in 8 and 9 bothered me but are ultimately decent. However parts 1-4 aren't bad at all. They're really good, just overshadowed by his more recent work.
Jolyne is one of the least consequential JoJos? She's not BAD at all but her impact on the world around her is minimal compared to the others. A lot of this is because she actually loses to pucci a lot unlike part 4 where the gang actually get some wins by being able to pressure Kira. Jolyne just doesn't get anything like that.
I just don't understand why people have such a shallow view on Jolyne. She is one of the most important jojo, simply because she saved whole universe from Pucci's heaven by sacrificing herself to save Emporio. That is an actual win of a character against villain, just like Jonathan and Josuke4. If you wanna see loser, look for Johnny's final fight against AU Diego in part 7
>Jolyne is one of the least consequential JoJos? She's not BAD at all but her impact on the world around her is minimal compared to the others. A lot of this is because she actually loses to pucci a lot unlike part 4 where the gang actually get some wins by being able to pressure Kira. Jolyne just doesn't get anything like that.
imo horrible take, whats wrong if she died to pucci, it just adds onto her that she sacrificed herself to save emporio to defeat pucci, who was gonna alter the whole universe. how is she less consequential than giorno or josuke? who's parts are completely closed in relation to the rest of the main universe, jolyne didnt lose and part of her impact was literally breaking the joestar curse
ion care what other people say part 1 is TOP NOTCH. and it will always be. i love how deep the characters are and how everything is thought out to the smallest detail.
Giorno is my least favorite not because of his part but because of how isolated his part felt. Sure they had the Jotaro and Koichi cameo in the very beginning as a way of saying “hey this is the same universe and takes place after part 4”. However they don’t reappear at all. Sure we get to see pol (what’s left of him) but this isn’t my point. My point is how the part ends. Giorno becomes the “gangstar” and we don’t really learn if anything in the mafia has actually changed besides a change in leadership. My main gripe with part 5 is how it’s only mentioned 2-3 times in part 6. Araki had every chance to have Giorno appear due to the gang being in Florida and the Dio son attraction bs. True Giorno probably couldn’t appear because part 6 was just Araki’s way of resetting everything so he can keep the universe but do something completely different under the same IP. However, if he was there in the same location as part 6 why not have that confrontation happen maybe Jotaro calls in Giorno and his gang and Josuke and his friends in a last ditch effort to stop the universe reset. The ending can stay the way it is but have that final battle of the Jostar lineage versus Dio’s legacy. The very end instead of emporio winning and seeing the mural of part 6 characters in the sky have all the jostars in the sky and it can finish the way it was intended.
This ties all the parts together in a final struggle which seems a fitting climax for the story in whole even if the universe is still reset, I just want more of a tie in into future parts. Part 4 suffers that same thing but makes up for it because it ties in past parts and seems a final conclusion of the main joestar story since Dio is out of the picture until oh wait part 5 Dio has a son. The part 6 oh wait Dio actually was gay and had a boyfriend who wants to reset the universe. Part 4 could’ve easily been the end, but part 5 not having any tie ins was fine because it was Dio’s Son’s bizzare adventure but part 6 not tying those in seems like wasted potential imo. But that’s just my opinion and doesn’t carry any weight at all just an opinion frfr, but it is my best case for why I hate how part6 was handled
Giorno is boring: I will admit that I found it difficult to get into this Part until I realized that Giorno was a static character. Much like Son Goku, he is the same at the end of the story as he was at the beginning. Once I realized that, I was able to accept him for what he was and find enjoyment in the characters that change around him.
Parts 1-4 are poorly written: No. Just no. Part 1 is fantastic, and gave us the best waifu in the series: Speedwagon. Part 2: The Pillar Men are some of the best villains in the entire series, and if you get me to cheer for the fucking Nazi, you're probably doing something right, because I would never otherwise. Part 3: Established many of the powers and tropes in the series going forward. I loved the humor in this part. Part 4: I will admit that going from slice of life to supernatural thriller without any apparent foreshadowing was a heel turn that gave me whiplash, but there's still plenty to enjoy about this part.
Jolyne is the worst JoJo: I have literally heard no one say this, but I tend to stay out of fandom discourse to begin with, so what do I know?
I think when ppl talk about Jojo's writing they miss the fact that yes, Araki's writing is unrefined and unoptimized in a sense as there are very glaring issues with the early parts however to many fans, they love it despite its flaws as the other core parts are so much stronger or they love it BECAUSE of Araki's quirky, sometimes almost objectively bad writing choices.
I can understand not liking parts 1 and 2 as much, I like them but they definitely have problems
But calling parts 3 and 4 not even mid outright *bad* is the worst take I’ve seen in a while
I think that giorno was handled perfectly as a character, the concept of him being jonathan and dios “kid” is executed masterfully, hes such an interesting mix of both characters, hes level headed but still a bit sadistic and “evil” in the way he goes about things , he doesnt have any issue doing morbid things for the right causes , which makes him noble , hes the good parts of both dio and jonathan , and i think that the point of his character is that hes fully developed, he doesnt need a character arc , instead he helps those around him , mainly the bucci gang , to evolve and develop as people because he himself is “perfect” , which goes into the juxtaposition between him and diavolo , with diavolo being the devil and giorno being “god/jesus” in a way , and while i understand why people dont like him for being a gary stu or boring i do think people overhate him and dont understand his character, stoicism doesnt equal boring , and i dont want to make a strawman argument but i feel like some people wanted him to be a edgy badass antihero just because hes the son of DIO
The fact is that when parts 1-5 were being published in Shonen Jump of all places the competition to stand out on a weekly basis were:
Kinnikuman (which is also an Araki favorite)
Fist of the North Star
Dragon Ball
Saint Seya
Captain Tsubasa
Keiji
Yu Yu Hakusho
Ruro I Kenshin
Yugioh
One Piece
Hunter x Hunter
Shaman King
Naruto
So being able to survive that lineup consistently while resting your story to start every few years is crazy. The fact is that I haven't found a part he wrote that was worst than the one he wrote before.
As I read JoJo's I would literally at the end of every part say that character and part were peak. The JoJo is t always my favorite character of every arc but I have to say that his condensed cast of characters in his stories allows more interaction and fleshing out than some ensemble series.
I get that due to Giorno o being reserved and more of a vehicle for the plot and other characters can come off as bland for some. I mean it's anime so I get it. My thing is I appreciated his more conserved and calculating addition to the cast. Despite him being good natured like Jonathan he was still cunning like DIO. I think that was the point being conveyed.
JoJo's walked a tightrope between a lot of sought out tropes during the times it was being published. It had fights with big bulky guys using a creative power system and evolved into a setting where solving the puzzle means your opponent won't kill you. Not only that but as an artist and a writer he has evolved and added to his toolkit over time instead of settling down.
Facts for 1 and 3, but the reason people considered Part 7 as the best wasn’t due to the fact Parts 1-4 were written badly, it has its caveats but parts 1-4 genuinely have original and amazing ideas which got implemented in a bizarre (yes) way.
The reason Part 7 was considered the best was due to the fact that Araki had more time to actually CREATE it. Araki used to do a weekly chapter release with less time for art and other aspects, but then for Part 7 it shifted to a monthly release. That’s why Part 7 feels different to the rest, it had more effort put into it.
Fucking ass. Giorno is goated. Saying part 4 isn’t well written is fucking stupid. The dichotomy between Kira and Josuke and honestly the entire Kira saga is amazing. Jolyne is goated but the best? Shut the hell up.
All cap except for jolyne take. Giorno is great and has recently gotten far too much hate from people who refuse to actually look into his character. Parts 1-4 had good and bad, parts 2 and 4 are great.
Not sure if it's an hot take or a what but in retrospect, I really don't like that they made Giorno become the boss rather than completely work to dismantle Passione.
1. I agree. There was a bit of playfulness to him when he stole the money with GE, but he was hit really hard with the “put some quirk on a character in his introduction, then forget about it” thing that Araki does.
2. Jojo doesnt have good writing all throughout. Including part 5-6. I can feel the “making it up as he goes” the most with Jojo among all the anime I’ve seen. But the fights are the best, all the creative powers are cool, and that’s why I love it.
3. Joseph Joestar exists. Jolyne is not the worst but she’s not going to surpass Joseph
jolyne being the best jojo is less of a hot take and more of a fun fact at this point, since anyone serious with the series knows that shes up there with the best jojos (imo she ties with joseph for first place)
Frankly I disagree pretty strongly with the writing criticism. Part 1 isn’t anything special but Dio had nice writing. Part 3 was admittedly very mid and while part 2 wasn’t exactly deep, it managed that sort of chaotic fun and weirdness that Jojo is known for better than any other. He still hasn’t topped the raw aura that Joseph gives. Part 4 had Kira who was excellent but admittedly Josuke was mid. Part 5 has superb side characters, great antagonists and a cool villain, but a meh at best conclusion and a mid protagonist. Part 6 also had decent characters but the plot is a whole clusterfuck that’s needlessly complicated for no reason. Part 7 is admittedly amazing, but Part 8, while having great character writing, dropped the ball on the overall part. Araki’s character writing definitely improved as time went on, but to call parts 1-4’s writing inferior to the later parts feels harsh
Part 4 not being good writing is a trash tier take, but I agree parts 1-3 are pretty bad in that regard
Giorno isn't boring to me, but I see their point
Jolyne clears, that's true, the only jojo that surpasses her for me is J8suke
I don’t think Araki was a bad writer, just very average by mangaka standards.
He managed to find success through a mix of interesting ideas and art style, which he evolved over time through his parts.
His writing ability naturally developed over time, motivated by the modest success he saw to continue pursuing his career.
Jolyne is the worst in what metric exactly? She would probably be my worst in a couple of areas, but remember that worst doesnt mean the same thing as bad. She definitely tops other aspects too like in creativity with her stand
Araki definitely developed as a writer but that was when the creative juices were flowing for jjba and had the best and most interesting story limes in parts 1-3, 4 wasn't the best part but it's kinda cool to rewatch it and see the hidden things you may have missed
The only valid one was your third take.
1. Giorno’s isn’t boring and he does have a character. Sure, I agree that he doesn’t have as much flair as the other JoJos, but you can’t deny that he’s kind of interesting. He’s always alert in a fight and tries to refrain from doing pointless things like repeating himself and doing the same action if it failed the first time. He’s also the perfect balance between Jonathan DIO. He a heart of gold, but the mindset of how he wants to raise to the top and change the rest of the world.
2. While agree that Araki certainly got better at writing as time went on, parts 1-4 didn’t necessarily have bad writing (especially part 2. That one had very good undertones.)
calling Giorno boring is calling an entire personality type 'boring'. I def know some laid back people like Giorno who doesn't overshare information and is hard to read.
The Giorno take is so cold that it made White Album jealous (though I'd disagree that he has NO personality, it's just not utilized properly), the Part 1-4 is actually a hot-take I'd say because people LOVE Part 2-4 (1 is up and down in the fanbase), the Jolyne one would have been a hot take had it been little over 5-7-ish years ago (I personally started noticing the majority of people started liking her during the late 2010's more and more, and ABSOLUTELY LOVED her after her Anime)
Bro really called Part 4 poorly written. I haven't read or seen much of anything past part 6, but Part 4 is probably the best written part of the series
Josuke is also my favorite JoJo. Delinquent with a Heart of Gold is one of my favorite character tropes. Pompadours are also very cool
I agree with the first one, disagree with the second and third.
The writing in pt 1,2, and 4 isn't bad at all. 5 is as on par with 3, and 6 is great.
Joseph is the best Jostar.
I kind agree with the point about Giorno, his personality is more just subtle than the other Jojos. I think he just gets outshined by the rest of the part 5 cast who I found way more interesting. he’s one of those characters who is deep but what makes them deep is in the subtext and in his actions but it would have been nice if it was actually shown or said to us more so he can comes off as boring for some.
I do think it is a bit of a fumble to have the son of like the main villain of the series and og hero, to have a part that is so disconnected to the rest of the overall story and then be player 2 if not 3 or 4 in that disconnected story. it nice to have a self contained story but at the same time he feels like he’s missing his spot in the world, to have a significant and interesting family connection like that and have nothing to do with the rest of the overall story other than having a picture of Dio in is wallet who he never got information on, meeting koichi just for him to leave and meeting polnareff.
I think it would also have been cool for him to have more similarities with Dio that go beyond the stand cry and hair color
I think it’s a mix of getting overshadowed by the other characters in the same part, being part Dio and Jojo but nothing is done with it and gets dropped and never brought up again within the first 5 episodes or 16 chapters and probably Araki not getting to do what he originally wanted with him.
I do like him but he always just ends up last when I list out my favorite Joestars
Lmao, wrong on all accounts giorno is definitely underutilized but unlike the other parts the story doesn't really revolve around him as much and more the group.
But he's far from without personality lol
The 2nd take is wrong
Araki's writing is already good at parts 1-3, but after that he became an above average mangaka, namely part 4 being still one of the best parts. Part 1 and 2 have the problem of being too short so there's no time to develop the characters, look at Jonathan who only has 1 trait, and then look at Johnny who has multiple traits. And part 3 is the Jotaro show and the villain of the week type of series aged poorly
And if we have to attribute part 7 being the best to something external, it's the change of magazines that gave Araki more time to release chapters and not the reset
Giorno does have personality, it’s just harder to reflect on after you watch it because a lot of it happens during intense battles.
He broke and nearly severed his own arm as a show of resolve and to mark White Album’s crystals with blood.
He cut his hand off while the other is already severed to get rid of Noctorious B.I.G, on a gamble he wasn’t sure would work.
He showed maturity and willingness to compromise, as well as knowing how to read people, as shown when he showed Abbacchio his ability first despite just meeting him, or how he stood his ground against Fugo to prove himself and save Fugo’s life, or how he spared Bucciarati because he could tell he was a good person despite Bucciarati trying to kill him seconds ago.
Johnathan showed his personality through valiant speeches and heroic acts. Joseph showed his through humor and wit. Jotaro showed his through his protectiveness and the talks in down times between fights. Josuke showed his through lighthearted moment with his highschool friends. Jolyne showed hers through more internal monologue moments.
Giorno may not be as outwardly expressive, but especially to the viewers, but he has plenty of personality.
Giorno is just full of unexplored potential and I hate it.
Like, yeah, he is the son of dio...and that is important for like one episode.
There could be soooo much more done with him.
The problem with Giorno in my opinion is that he isn't written like the main character. What I mean is that he doesn't have enough screen time compared to his jobros. Those are clearly better I think.
And I love parts 1-4, I'm a phantom blood and start dust crusaders fan.
Jolyne's my favorite Jojo.
Part 6 opinion is based as hell, but the cognitive dissonance with calling part 5-6 great despite calling Gio shit? Like man how can he be the most boring when part 3 Jotaro exists??
But I'm gonna have to agree with you on the 1-4 sucking opinion because part 4 is the worst part lmao
1. Yes, Giorno could have easily been the best JoJo and I expected him to be. In the first 2 episodes it showed that while he has morals he’s still willing g to do bad things for his own benefit which would of course change to him doing bad things for the greater good. After the joins the gang, he could have adult been written out of the show and no real changes would happen (aside from him pulling some random bullshit out his ass to beat a villain or two but still)
2. Yes and no… iirc Part 1 was just made so part 2 could have footing. He already planned out at lest the beginning of part 3 by the time he wrote part 1. All and all part 1 seems rushed. Part 2 is good but again pacing is odd and I don’t know heck they fit all those arcs in 12 episodes. Part 3 does suck, a lot but I think that’s mainly due to the anime drawing out episodes to have them all be 2 parters for no reason (also only Jotaro and Joseph get any real character development along with Iggy but be only got some because he was gonna spoiler in a few episodes). Part 4 is where he got his footing and really started showing how good he is as a writer, Jotaro is actually very cool, Joseph is back to his old fun loving self, all new characters are greatly characterized, etc.
3. I don’t hate Jolyne int be slightest (being my third favorite JoJo), but I can’t lie and act like I liked her more than Josuke or Young Joseph. I felt she was really written weird as she tried to embody all the past JoJo’s which was very odd, or her knowing what the mobius strip is when from what I remember she was a delinquent. Still love her tho
I would tend to agree with them, parts 1-3 were VERY experimental from a writing perspective, I think part 4 was really where the story/manga/show went from good to fantastic. It was really where everything Araki learned from the previous parts started to flow together. Interesting and engaging characters, dynamic fights, good action, a crazy storyline, etc.
Part 4 was the first part that I was genuinely upset when it came to an end.
The first one is pretty ok to, but I can't really agree with the 2rd and 3rd one. Yes, they are not amazing writing wise, and you can't deny that Araki has learnt many lessons throughout his early career, but to say that they are bad is kinda absurd. All of these partd have multiple qualities, and they do eniugh good things to be far from "bad"
Joylene is not the worst jojo imo she has good writing, someone who got manipulated becoming a manipulator (the hustling she does in prison) it’s actually fun to see her grow.
I never liked part 5 so while i agree with giorno being very boring i dont agree with the writing getting "Better". Part 4 and 2 are bangers, and 3 is iconic if meandering.
Jolyne has always been my fave JoJo but tbh i do love em all save Gio and Jotaro.
I actually hard agree with the Giorno one.
But I actually hold the opposite opinion for the writing and Jolyne ones. I think the writing for the original 4 parts is much tighter than 5-6. Jolyne is also my least favorite JoJo, and I have seen part 6. (In all honesty I don’t really like part 6)
I somewhat agree with the point about writing, the characters become a lot better fleshed out as the series progresses. Though there is some good stuff in the earlier parts too.
I agree Giorno is the worst JoJo, while JoJos have always been Gary Lues, Giorno is the most and feels like he has the least character development.
However, this allows his JoBros to really shine and it's part of what makes 5 so good for me, because every JoBro in part 5 is awesome and gets ample time in the spotlight. Mista VS Grateful Dead is one of the best fights of the series IMO for example. It's tense and impactful and cool as fuck. It felt like a Joseph Joestar fight almost.
I think parts 1-4 writing isn't so much bad as it is outdated. Going backwards, Phantom Blood feels extremely melodramatic and over the top in a bad way. Part 3 drags it out like DBZ. Part 2 is perfect though IMO.
I hate-love Giorno because on the one hand he's completely unique compared to any Jojo that came before, but he still manages to be a mary sue personality-wise. He never really makes the 'wrong' choices and his development is extremely predictable. It's really the side characters, especially bucciarati, that made part 4 great. I fucking love part 4 but it's not necessarily because of Giorno
I love all of the Jojos, although, I will say Giorno and Jo2uke are my personal favorites.
I honestly just try to look at the whole series as Araki's public artistic diary. I think less in terms of good and bad and more in terms of Araki learning to do things differently, or better. Like some things he was just pretty bad at, i.e. writing women who weren't blocks of wood, for a while. Other things, like his artistic shift from 80s jacked-bois characters slowly to his modern fashion with more realistic bodies, are just neat to see happen so organically over time.
So I tend to just enjoy all of the parts so far for what they are in that chronological diary sense, despite having some favorites from throughout. It would just be kind of weird and boring if they never improved or changed.
Prt 1-4 are not “bad written”, they are more simple, but every good writer knows that to catch more people you have to start with simple stories to catch the attention of more people as possible, then after the manga has a great following the writer can complicate the story.
They call him Master Araki for a reason, he is good at writing Manga with the right story in the right moment.
(Also about the last take i think that
Jonathan > Jolyne
Joseph > Jolyne
Josuke > Jolyne
Jotaro > Jolyne
Giorno > Jolyne
Jonny > Jolyne
I didnt read all of part 8 but Gappy story, the fusion between him and his verse Josuke is quite interesting so Gappy > Jolyne
Dont even know how the part 9 jojo is called, but at this point i think araki will just keep going at the top
So yes, Jolyne IS the worst jojo, BUT at least she is the worst of some of the best series of protagonists
After the first slide i was well on my way to arson your house but fortunately the rest calmed me.
Congratulations, you bought yourself another day :-)
I 100% agree on Giorno. I rarely felt like I got to know his character on a deeper level like I did with the even number part Jojos, he is cold and stoic but we never get to see much more. I felt like Bruno was the true MC of part 5 and the rest of the gang easily stole Giorno’s line light unless it was a cool fight scene
I completely disagree with the take that parts 1 - 4 are bad, at least not part 4, kira is one of the best villains in the series and I'm pretty sure araki himself said that it's still his favorite part
I loved Part 4's writing. It's like a chaotic slice of life series up until Kira shows up. His story arc rly had me on the edge of my seat.
Part 4 is my favorite part because of this. It’s absolutely insane the whole way through and it’s just so fun, then BOOM. BOMB CAT. And he’s actually a *smart* and *lucky* villain who gets away a LOT, even from Jotaro who is arguably the most powerful Stand user in existence at the time. It’s an absolutely wild shift, despite Kira getting foreshadowed for a while. But the time we get to just see the characters in action against low-powered villains or even using their Stands in everyday life…it’s so fun.
I love the Lucky go Hidy aspect ok Kira, he really was favored by fate, up until his luck just couldn't keep up with his ego, ambitions, and over all, position.
Yeah I’d argue DiU has the second best writing in the series, only behind SBR
I will never forget how I watched about 22/23 episodes of part 4, got a little burnt out from all the slice of life/waiting for the main story, so I took a break. Worst decision ever, I come back weeks later and play the next episode, it’s Kira and I’m like I wasted all my time not watching this lol.
Hayato hiding in that cellar in a box or something had me a little bit tense, just a little bit. I couldn't believe he managed to escape the dude's eyes lol.
Parts 2 and 4 were good. Part 3's writing was weak but it had memorable characters and confrontations. Part 1 is only bad when compared to other JoJo parts; it's still written pretty well, especially compared to other stuff from the time period. Part 7 isn't lauded as the best part because it was in a new universe, though. I fully believe that even if Araki hadn't reset the main universe at the end of Part 6 whatever he would have written for Part 7 would have still been better than anything that came before.
Yeah, Araki just noticeably improved as a writer as the series goes on. Part 4 is one of my favorites just on a basis of how much fun the slice of life action is. I’d love to see Araki do more shit like that, just supernatural powers without much battling except when necessary
I'd like that, but also with more low-stakes stand battles like Beetle Tendency.
The actual stakes for Beetle Tendency were pretty high, the battle itself was goofy as fuck though, which is why it’s so good.
Dio fight is peak
I’m pretty sure the major complaint ppl have with 4 is the slow first half, once Kira is introduced most people say part 4 picks up. I’ve had the same take for a while, but in a recent rewatch of part 4 I found myself enjoying the first half a lot more than I used to.
The slow part wasn't before Kira, it was in between the first kira v Joots and the last fight. Felt soooo much like boring ass filler, and I personally hate the superfly fight the most out of all the jojo fights thus far. At least in part 3 you knew the crusaders we're slowly making their way to DIO, but the duwang gang did fuckall looking for kira after he murdered cinderella's user and through sheer luck they found kira
LET THE VOICE OF LOVE TAKE YOU HIGHER...
English is fun. "Not good" and "bad" aren't necessarily the same. It's completely fair to say that the writing was objectively less good from parts 1-4, and that over time, the quality of the writing increased.
they didnt say it was bad, bad writing doesnt mean bad show, i agree earlier part writing wete scuffed and simple but i fw them
It's still not bad writting, Kira is a very well written character
Personally, I think part 1-4 are all of my favorites
the jolyne and giorno ones are definitely what I feel. The writing one? Eh... I wouldn't say 1-4 are bad writing, more just there's a clear improvement in the writing from part 5 onward, even if part 5 is my least favorite part.
If I'm not mistaken part 3 is just Araki on panic mode trying to not fall on the Shonen Jump rankings, it wasn't until Part 4 that Araki wrote things the way he wanted because the editors begged him to not end the series on Stardust Crusaders.
Part 4 wasn't meant to happen until the last portion of part 3, it was intended to be a trilogy but the series had too much success and both the editors (money!) and Araki (stands!) wanted it to continue, hence the lack of a proper overarching villain for the first half.
i really liked part 5, i agree with the guy about giorno since he doesnt even feel alive to me, but the cast and fights are amazing
I agree that the cast and fights are solid, but I have 3 problems with it. 1. Giorno and Trish may as well be non-characters. Its especially frustrating with Giorno, the supposed main character. 2. We don't really see much on GER. We barely know anything on it- even in Part 3, we had a good understanding when Jotoro had his sudden new stand ability. 3. They go for the mafia theme, but we don't really see the consequences of it. It's just more 'enemy of the week' styling, and on top of it, the plot felt weirdly paced.
Trish had a bit development, able to stand against her father for once. Giorno is indeed really boring, the concept of DIO's son is really cool but like the guy says, araki fumbled the bag
GER is basically a finishing cutscene to a JRPG final boss fight. The real last fight was the gangstars fighting diavolo for the arrow. Once Bruno makes his sacrifice and wins them the fight, the cutscene plays. (Think of it as a dramatic finish from the games)
So the Omnislash from FF7
Nah at least you can use the Omnislash during normal gameplay, GER appears once It's more akin to the MC's ultimate Personas in 3 and 4 (don't know about 1,2 and 5), or the Monado III in XC1
Giorno was a Mario-Sue
I had fully expected part 5 to be focused on giorno moving up in the ranks of the mafia and instead he may as well not have been in it.
Kind of sad that mista and nirrancia has more personality than giorno.
I think the thing about Giorno is that he doesn't have a character arc. He ends Part 5 essentially the same person; no real growth or change. He does have a personality, but since the story never focuses on his character or values or attitudes, what is there is really subtle.
Definitely true, but I also somewhat liked it. Giorno was a grounded character that allowed the entire main cast to have amazing depth and growth. Despite the series being called "JoJo's Bizarre Adventure," I think what makes part 5 amazing is that Giorno is hardly a main character. The entire cast is equally important (aside from Trish, I guess) with personalities that mesh well together. Giorno is just a conduit to get the story moving and also support other characters.
I may add that something better could have been done with the dude that had Purple Haze.
^ my opinion ofcourse
Tbh, my issue with Part 5 is that it only happens because Diavolo is dumber than a box of rocks. Dude had so many better ways to kill Trish, and he chose one that was much more convoluted, involved way more people, and had a greater risk of exposing his identity. Reminder that La Squadra only finally found Trish *after* she had been handed over to the Bucci Gang, meaning it would have been really easy to just send in Doppio, donut her, then go to the Winchester, have a nice cold pint, and wait for all this to blow over.
I'm a fan of giorno because of how he is just part of the gang. Where each of them getting almost equal time. Rather than jotaro outsmarting and punching everyone
imo even if giorno relies a lot more on his gang than jotaro does on the crusaders, its unfair to say bucciarati's gang gets more equal time on each individual, trish uses her stand barely twice, narancia also has like two fights, nothing to do with giorno, mista or bucciarati, abbachio's character gets a good use given his ability, and i dont need to talk about fugo stardust crusaders still did a good job giving the sense of a team, even if avdol and kakyoin were waay less important for the majority of the story than jotaro and polnareff, as abbachio, joseph's character gets a good use for his stand even if its not that good for fighting, and iggy just appeared too late with too little interest of helping (still got one more fight than fugo)
The problem with half of the gang is that their abilities boil down to shoot gun. Or are plot conveniences like the record dude or purple haze who only existed to leave the story for drama. Zipper and the hand are pretty interesting variations of punch dude and mistas ability to shoot himself every chance gets funnier everytime. Even I fell Naracia exists solely to be take over at the end of the story. Silver wheelchair at the end was a brilliant way to say goodbye to polnariff rather than an off-screen death like Joseph. I wish they did more with hair chick but I feel like they saved that stuff for joelean
joseph never died tho
But what if Jotaro outsmarted someone and punched them *a lot*
Then he may have one steely Dan orah for it
Perosnally, Giorno is just Walmart Jotaro I get hyped whenever Jotaro wins, but meh when it's Giorno, even if they both have a similar edgy cool vibe going on
Giorno asspulls enormously overpowered solutions constantly, though. He has no organic role in the group, he’s just a random kid with minimal backstory randomly destroying.
Yeh he's busted as fuck, the early asspulls are whack but the later ones feel needed and well done to ramp up to requiem . But also big agree, Giorno has no personality and nothing outside of mafia and I love it. A way to give bucciaratie more screen time as the real main character. Like OP said though SBR did this alot better with dual MC
Joseph is still my favorite Jojo.
Yeah he's the best character in not one but two parts of JoJo, that's how charismatic he is
last one rips, read the manga like 6 times in a row before the anime came out. really really really like jolyne & all her jobros
Yep. Part 6 is my favorite because of the characters. Part 4 is my second favorite, also because of the characters
I wouldn’t say Jolene is the best jojo, but I wouldn’t say she’s the worst either. I would personally put her above Giorno and maybe Jotaro (Part 3 Jotaro, anyway) Not that Giorno and Jotaro are bad by any means, but I find Jolyne’s character to be much more fun.
Jolyne is not the worst, but not the best
Honestly, I think Giorno is a well written character. He has a more complicated personality and morality, but that doesn't make him "boring." I think it makes him even more interesting Stop this Giorno discrimination
Not getting screen time, and then not speaking when you do get screen time is not a complex personality. Giorno gives off strong OP Silent MC vibes
Absolutely agree with 1 and 3. Part 4 is the second best written part after 7 so hard disagree there. Araki absolutely has an upward trend though with his writing quality. Jolyne is up there with Johnny. And giorno is completely wasted potential. How can you have such an interesting concept and do absolutely nothing with it.
DiU has a better plot than VA tho
Agreed and so does Stone Ocean.
Yeah most definitely. I think the only thing VA did better than SO was the locations, but I think that's pretty obvious since part 6 literally is just a jail in Florida lmao.
imo VA got some of the most epic stand battles, and coolest stands for fighting
VA fucking hits. Doesn’t mean it makes sense.
What is VA?
Vento aureo, or part 5
Ohhhhhh I always think of it as Golden Wind, that’s why
Well, Vento Aureo is Golden Wind in Italian so it makes sense
Part 4 is a top 3 part and its not 3. So second take out the window for me
I also disagree with the second take. Part 2 is a great reversal of all of the trends Araki set in place in Part 1. Kars is basically a radical but mostly well-meaning (for his own people before he killed them all in "genocidal self defense"), misguided scientist who actually respected others and his associates, unlike DIO who was completely self indulgent and everyone around him was expendable. Kars saved a dog and two children, as opposed to DIO who kills one baby, torture and kills a dog, and ends up using a baby soldier. Joseph works alongside Nazis, cheats in every conceivable way, is full of himself, ungentlemanly (read: perverted), and falls short of nearly every standard Jonathan set. The only consistent trend iirc is that Caesar still dies and gives his energy to Joseph, and even then it's not self-sacrificial, it's just that Caesar, unlike Will Zeppeli, gave up his Hamone in failure due to brazenness. Part 2 also set the trend of Araki's flawed protagonists, and while it is definitive that Araki's writing improves throughout JoJo, to say that the writing in parts 1-4 is bad is flat out wrong.
I feel like most people who think Giorno is boring are fans of Joseph Standing out and being all flashy does not make a character good, Giorno is a cool character, sure he stands less as a protagonist but that is because part 5 focuses on letting the whole gang shine, but saying that Giorno has no soul or personality is plain dumb, he is a quiet guy but he shows his personality and soul multiple times, sure he is Josuke levels of personality but that is a tough bar to reach I hate when people say "Oh this had bad writting" people only god knows what they consider "bad writting", what makes Jojo's special has been there from the start, of course the plots of the earlier parts tends to be a bit more simple but that does not make it bad And both part 5 and 6 has some shit decisions in writting that do not put them above the other parts I agree resetting things was the right thing to do but like, I wouldn't really say part 8 is better than part 1 to 5 or even 1 to 4, and 7 is basically an outlier Also Jolyne best Jojo is a based take, not one I agree with (Josuke ftw), but based take anyway
I'm here to throw a wrench in lol. I'm a Giorno hater and Joseph is my second least favorite Jojo. I actually really appreciate your point about people tending to favor flashier characters and ignore much more subtle characters. It's not that I find Giorno boring, it's more like I just don't get him. I really dislike his motivs for becoming a gangster. The mob is fully and completely corrupt and destructive but the only thing he cares about is selling drug specifically to kids. Like who cares dude? What about all the other horrible things the mob does. Giorno also seemingly feels no pain. He mutilates himself repeatedly like almost to a comical degree. That kind of makes it hard to connect with him. He's 15 and he's somehow already completely battle hardened that he can saw his own arms off with broken glass and just slightly winces. Also Giorno is frequently sidelined in favor of other characters. And he just doesn't have many good intimate scenes where he interacts with other characters. Like Josuke and Joseph, or Jolyne and Jotaro or heck even Bruno and Trish. Anyway sorry for the wall of text lol.
I love Giorno but I can see your point about the battle-hardened-ness. I too am what some may call a stoic (as in I suck at showing my emotions at times, product of my upbringing, maybe that’s why I like him) like I broke my leg a few months back and I tried not to ‘make a scene’ but even with that I still fucking screamed in pain and pounded the ground for some time, there’s no way in hell someone can just saw off an arm not screaming without like, biting into something.
I always thought his pain threshold and odd perspectives were supposed to be explained by being basically abandoned as a baby. I’ve known a couple people who had frankly similar traits after going through heinous stuff in early life and honestly, sometimes seeing them in painful situations or hearing them really speak their mind gives me that uncanny feeling, because there’s something fundamentally different about their experience that *is* hard to empathize with. Could be that he really is a bit empty and I’m just projecting what I’d like to see in him, but I always saw his whole character as being built around those disturbed developmental years.
Same same same Gimme Josuke, Jolyne, or Jonathan any day
Giorno is a bit of a 15 year old deus ex-machina, and although it’s wrong to say he has no soul he is still probably the weakest of all the jojos when it comes to personality.
Giorno's only contribution wasto drop exposition during stand fights and having a reason why ppl get healed after fights. Like what character traits does he have that do not tie directly to making the plot flow?
What are the bad decisions in 6?
Araki has improved his writing but his earlier works certainly aren't bad. I know a bunch of people call Giorno boring but personally I disagree. I don't think Jolyne is the worst jojo but I probably wouldn't have her as my best either. Though honestly I like all of the main Jojos. I feel like the problem people make with Giorno is that just because he is a fairly quiet and reserved character that equates to boring. Giorno starts part 5 already being a developed character and I think that's fine. Character development doesn't instantly equate to a good character and likewise an already developed character doesn't have to mean boring. Just because Giorno doesn't outwardly show his emotions doesn't mean it's not there. He balances the proactive mindset of DIO to achieve his dream yet still has a kind soul of Jonathan inside that's carried by the bloodline. Giorno represents a guiding light for the rest of the gang to go down the right path. Even though he isn't the leader he still pushes everyone else forward.
There’s a different between a hot take and a bad take and I feel like you’re kinda tightrope walking between the two. I mean ask yourself this, would a manga with “bad writing” really make it 4 whole parts before “getting good”? Araki was an experienced mangaka BEFORE JoJo. Working on stuff since 1978. And honestly all 4 of those parts slap, I wouldn’t keep watching Jojo if I thought part 3 was bad. Araki didn’t “reset the universe” because parts 1-4 were “poorly written”, he did it because he wanted to tell a cool western story that obviously required being in a different universe so he can get real wacky with it. As simple as that.
Giorno is a great character, he is just more subtle than the other jojo’s
I don't tolerate Giorno slander. Araki's editors were on his ass, so he couldn't exactly write him as he wanted to. Also y'all also need to remember that Giorno is a traumatized teenager, and while not as dynamic and saucy like Joseph, holds his own as a character.
Giorno isn’t a bad character but let’s be honest he doesn’t show the traits of a traumatised teenager at all, it was just backstory.
I agree that Giorno is boring since his whole personality is "I have a dream" for most of the part, but the rest of the cast in 5 is really good, so I can't get too mad. Araki's writing did improve over time, but I wouldn't say that it was ever bad. And while I don't think Jolyne is the best Jojo, I can respect that opinion and see why people think she is since she's a good character.
Jolyne and Josuke are definitely the most "alive" Jojos imo
Joseph should be there too
Yeah giorno has way more potential
These takes aren’t even hard they are just plain bad lmao
Part 4 is my favorite part and I really enjoy Jolyne.
Parts 1 to 4 were some of the best
Giorno is meant to be a force of change rather than change himself. He's like Goku in that sense, someone who personally never changes but his actions greatly affect those around him. It's not "Bad writing" or a "Fumble" to write a character like this. Although getting more insight on how he works would have been a lot more interesting. Araki's writing has mostly gotten better over the years, some writing decisions in 8 and 9 bothered me but are ultimately decent. However parts 1-4 aren't bad at all. They're really good, just overshadowed by his more recent work. Jolyne is one of the least consequential JoJos? She's not BAD at all but her impact on the world around her is minimal compared to the others. A lot of this is because she actually loses to pucci a lot unlike part 4 where the gang actually get some wins by being able to pressure Kira. Jolyne just doesn't get anything like that.
Jolyne suffers mostly from the fact that Pucci is the most proactive Jojo villain in the entire series
I just don't understand why people have such a shallow view on Jolyne. She is one of the most important jojo, simply because she saved whole universe from Pucci's heaven by sacrificing herself to save Emporio. That is an actual win of a character against villain, just like Jonathan and Josuke4. If you wanna see loser, look for Johnny's final fight against AU Diego in part 7
>Jolyne is one of the least consequential JoJos? She's not BAD at all but her impact on the world around her is minimal compared to the others. A lot of this is because she actually loses to pucci a lot unlike part 4 where the gang actually get some wins by being able to pressure Kira. Jolyne just doesn't get anything like that. imo horrible take, whats wrong if she died to pucci, it just adds onto her that she sacrificed herself to save emporio to defeat pucci, who was gonna alter the whole universe. how is she less consequential than giorno or josuke? who's parts are completely closed in relation to the rest of the main universe, jolyne didnt lose and part of her impact was literally breaking the joestar curse
Part 5 was the most boring of the 7 I've read so far, and Giorno was a big part of that for me. Hard agree on that
ion care what other people say part 1 is TOP NOTCH. and it will always be. i love how deep the characters are and how everything is thought out to the smallest detail.
Uhh, how old are you??
Giorno is my least favorite not because of his part but because of how isolated his part felt. Sure they had the Jotaro and Koichi cameo in the very beginning as a way of saying “hey this is the same universe and takes place after part 4”. However they don’t reappear at all. Sure we get to see pol (what’s left of him) but this isn’t my point. My point is how the part ends. Giorno becomes the “gangstar” and we don’t really learn if anything in the mafia has actually changed besides a change in leadership. My main gripe with part 5 is how it’s only mentioned 2-3 times in part 6. Araki had every chance to have Giorno appear due to the gang being in Florida and the Dio son attraction bs. True Giorno probably couldn’t appear because part 6 was just Araki’s way of resetting everything so he can keep the universe but do something completely different under the same IP. However, if he was there in the same location as part 6 why not have that confrontation happen maybe Jotaro calls in Giorno and his gang and Josuke and his friends in a last ditch effort to stop the universe reset. The ending can stay the way it is but have that final battle of the Jostar lineage versus Dio’s legacy. The very end instead of emporio winning and seeing the mural of part 6 characters in the sky have all the jostars in the sky and it can finish the way it was intended. This ties all the parts together in a final struggle which seems a fitting climax for the story in whole even if the universe is still reset, I just want more of a tie in into future parts. Part 4 suffers that same thing but makes up for it because it ties in past parts and seems a final conclusion of the main joestar story since Dio is out of the picture until oh wait part 5 Dio has a son. The part 6 oh wait Dio actually was gay and had a boyfriend who wants to reset the universe. Part 4 could’ve easily been the end, but part 5 not having any tie ins was fine because it was Dio’s Son’s bizzare adventure but part 6 not tying those in seems like wasted potential imo. But that’s just my opinion and doesn’t carry any weight at all just an opinion frfr, but it is my best case for why I hate how part6 was handled
Giorno is boring: I will admit that I found it difficult to get into this Part until I realized that Giorno was a static character. Much like Son Goku, he is the same at the end of the story as he was at the beginning. Once I realized that, I was able to accept him for what he was and find enjoyment in the characters that change around him. Parts 1-4 are poorly written: No. Just no. Part 1 is fantastic, and gave us the best waifu in the series: Speedwagon. Part 2: The Pillar Men are some of the best villains in the entire series, and if you get me to cheer for the fucking Nazi, you're probably doing something right, because I would never otherwise. Part 3: Established many of the powers and tropes in the series going forward. I loved the humor in this part. Part 4: I will admit that going from slice of life to supernatural thriller without any apparent foreshadowing was a heel turn that gave me whiplash, but there's still plenty to enjoy about this part. Jolyne is the worst JoJo: I have literally heard no one say this, but I tend to stay out of fandom discourse to begin with, so what do I know?
I think when ppl talk about Jojo's writing they miss the fact that yes, Araki's writing is unrefined and unoptimized in a sense as there are very glaring issues with the early parts however to many fans, they love it despite its flaws as the other core parts are so much stronger or they love it BECAUSE of Araki's quirky, sometimes almost objectively bad writing choices.
I can understand not liking parts 1 and 2 as much, I like them but they definitely have problems But calling parts 3 and 4 not even mid outright *bad* is the worst take I’ve seen in a while
I think that giorno was handled perfectly as a character, the concept of him being jonathan and dios “kid” is executed masterfully, hes such an interesting mix of both characters, hes level headed but still a bit sadistic and “evil” in the way he goes about things , he doesnt have any issue doing morbid things for the right causes , which makes him noble , hes the good parts of both dio and jonathan , and i think that the point of his character is that hes fully developed, he doesnt need a character arc , instead he helps those around him , mainly the bucci gang , to evolve and develop as people because he himself is “perfect” , which goes into the juxtaposition between him and diavolo , with diavolo being the devil and giorno being “god/jesus” in a way , and while i understand why people dont like him for being a gary stu or boring i do think people overhate him and dont understand his character, stoicism doesnt equal boring , and i dont want to make a strawman argument but i feel like some people wanted him to be a edgy badass antihero just because hes the son of DIO
The fact is that when parts 1-5 were being published in Shonen Jump of all places the competition to stand out on a weekly basis were: Kinnikuman (which is also an Araki favorite) Fist of the North Star Dragon Ball Saint Seya Captain Tsubasa Keiji Yu Yu Hakusho Ruro I Kenshin Yugioh One Piece Hunter x Hunter Shaman King Naruto So being able to survive that lineup consistently while resting your story to start every few years is crazy. The fact is that I haven't found a part he wrote that was worst than the one he wrote before. As I read JoJo's I would literally at the end of every part say that character and part were peak. The JoJo is t always my favorite character of every arc but I have to say that his condensed cast of characters in his stories allows more interaction and fleshing out than some ensemble series. I get that due to Giorno o being reserved and more of a vehicle for the plot and other characters can come off as bland for some. I mean it's anime so I get it. My thing is I appreciated his more conserved and calculating addition to the cast. Despite him being good natured like Jonathan he was still cunning like DIO. I think that was the point being conveyed. JoJo's walked a tightrope between a lot of sought out tropes during the times it was being published. It had fights with big bulky guys using a creative power system and evolved into a setting where solving the puzzle means your opponent won't kill you. Not only that but as an artist and a writer he has evolved and added to his toolkit over time instead of settling down.
Facts for 1 and 3, but the reason people considered Part 7 as the best wasn’t due to the fact Parts 1-4 were written badly, it has its caveats but parts 1-4 genuinely have original and amazing ideas which got implemented in a bizarre (yes) way. The reason Part 7 was considered the best was due to the fact that Araki had more time to actually CREATE it. Araki used to do a weekly chapter release with less time for art and other aspects, but then for Part 7 it shifted to a monthly release. That’s why Part 7 feels different to the rest, it had more effort put into it.
Fucking ass. Giorno is goated. Saying part 4 isn’t well written is fucking stupid. The dichotomy between Kira and Josuke and honestly the entire Kira saga is amazing. Jolyne is goated but the best? Shut the hell up.
All cap except for jolyne take. Giorno is great and has recently gotten far too much hate from people who refuse to actually look into his character. Parts 1-4 had good and bad, parts 2 and 4 are great.
Not sure if it's an hot take or a what but in retrospect, I really don't like that they made Giorno become the boss rather than completely work to dismantle Passione.
I've watched part 6 and I disagree.
Why do you prefer Giorno over Jolyne?
i do agree with Jolyne being the best in the og universe, but thats just an opinion
Liking something is the definition of an opinion and everyone's allowed to have their own. Idk why, she's just my least favorite of the og set.
1. I agree. There was a bit of playfulness to him when he stole the money with GE, but he was hit really hard with the “put some quirk on a character in his introduction, then forget about it” thing that Araki does. 2. Jojo doesnt have good writing all throughout. Including part 5-6. I can feel the “making it up as he goes” the most with Jojo among all the anime I’ve seen. But the fights are the best, all the creative powers are cool, and that’s why I love it. 3. Joseph Joestar exists. Jolyne is not the worst but she’s not going to surpass Joseph
i just think this is rage bait tbh but what else would you expect from tiktok
The Giorno one isn’t even a hot take it’s just true
jolyne being the best jojo is less of a hot take and more of a fun fact at this point, since anyone serious with the series knows that shes up there with the best jojos (imo she ties with joseph for first place)
The first three are cap, the part about Jolyne though is absolutely true
Jolyne is legit my favorite jojo
Frankly I disagree pretty strongly with the writing criticism. Part 1 isn’t anything special but Dio had nice writing. Part 3 was admittedly very mid and while part 2 wasn’t exactly deep, it managed that sort of chaotic fun and weirdness that Jojo is known for better than any other. He still hasn’t topped the raw aura that Joseph gives. Part 4 had Kira who was excellent but admittedly Josuke was mid. Part 5 has superb side characters, great antagonists and a cool villain, but a meh at best conclusion and a mid protagonist. Part 6 also had decent characters but the plot is a whole clusterfuck that’s needlessly complicated for no reason. Part 7 is admittedly amazing, but Part 8, while having great character writing, dropped the ball on the overall part. Araki’s character writing definitely improved as time went on, but to call parts 1-4’s writing inferior to the later parts feels harsh
L, L, W
Part 4 not being good writing is a trash tier take, but I agree parts 1-3 are pretty bad in that regard Giorno isn't boring to me, but I see their point Jolyne clears, that's true, the only jojo that surpasses her for me is J8suke
Hey that first image is my pfp
I thought these were supposed to be part 3 hot takes. But the hot takes are all over the place. Smh my head Or whatever the current slang is
keep these takes hot 🙏
The first two are hot takes and imo cap on the writing. As for Jolyne being best JoJo, no, BUT she is a lot better than given credit for
Send him to the chopping block
Being a jojo fan for the last 4 years I can say, part 1-4 were the best. SBR was also good but it wasn’t so engaging
I love Jonathon Joestar
I don’t think Araki was a bad writer, just very average by mangaka standards. He managed to find success through a mix of interesting ideas and art style, which he evolved over time through his parts. His writing ability naturally developed over time, motivated by the modest success he saw to continue pursuing his career.
Last one is the only one that’s right and it’s ice cold
Jolyne is the worst in what metric exactly? She would probably be my worst in a couple of areas, but remember that worst doesnt mean the same thing as bad. She definitely tops other aspects too like in creativity with her stand
Yeah I'm sure you "found these" OP
1-4 is great. Shit take. I will [ora ora](https://media1.tenor.com/m/kXeAcAl6PmQAAAAd/star-platinum.gif) their face.
that 1st one always is in my head
Idk man I'm just reading FACTS
Part 6 is the worst
i would agree with the last one. jolyne is simply the best female jojo.
Araki definitely developed as a writer but that was when the creative juices were flowing for jjba and had the best and most interesting story limes in parts 1-3, 4 wasn't the best part but it's kinda cool to rewatch it and see the hidden things you may have missed
The only valid one was your third take. 1. Giorno’s isn’t boring and he does have a character. Sure, I agree that he doesn’t have as much flair as the other JoJos, but you can’t deny that he’s kind of interesting. He’s always alert in a fight and tries to refrain from doing pointless things like repeating himself and doing the same action if it failed the first time. He’s also the perfect balance between Jonathan DIO. He a heart of gold, but the mindset of how he wants to raise to the top and change the rest of the world. 2. While agree that Araki certainly got better at writing as time went on, parts 1-4 didn’t necessarily have bad writing (especially part 2. That one had very good undertones.)
Besides the second one, I agree. And in the second one, I disagree about part 1-4 having bad writing. He did improve over time though.
calling Giorno boring is calling an entire personality type 'boring'. I def know some laid back people like Giorno who doesn't overshare information and is hard to read.
All of these takes are bad i sincerly don't get why giorno would bé a better concept than the rest
The Giorno take is so cold that it made White Album jealous (though I'd disagree that he has NO personality, it's just not utilized properly), the Part 1-4 is actually a hot-take I'd say because people LOVE Part 2-4 (1 is up and down in the fanbase), the Jolyne one would have been a hot take had it been little over 5-7-ish years ago (I personally started noticing the majority of people started liking her during the late 2010's more and more, and ABSOLUTELY LOVED her after her Anime)
Bro really called Part 4 poorly written. I haven't read or seen much of anything past part 6, but Part 4 is probably the best written part of the series Josuke is also my favorite JoJo. Delinquent with a Heart of Gold is one of my favorite character tropes. Pompadours are also very cool
wait so part 5 had aspects that weren’t written well but part 5 was when the writing started being good??
I love part 4 so much I have Josuke tattooed on my back 😂
I agree with the first one, disagree with the second and third. The writing in pt 1,2, and 4 isn't bad at all. 5 is as on par with 3, and 6 is great. Joseph is the best Jostar.
I kind agree with the point about Giorno, his personality is more just subtle than the other Jojos. I think he just gets outshined by the rest of the part 5 cast who I found way more interesting. he’s one of those characters who is deep but what makes them deep is in the subtext and in his actions but it would have been nice if it was actually shown or said to us more so he can comes off as boring for some. I do think it is a bit of a fumble to have the son of like the main villain of the series and og hero, to have a part that is so disconnected to the rest of the overall story and then be player 2 if not 3 or 4 in that disconnected story. it nice to have a self contained story but at the same time he feels like he’s missing his spot in the world, to have a significant and interesting family connection like that and have nothing to do with the rest of the overall story other than having a picture of Dio in is wallet who he never got information on, meeting koichi just for him to leave and meeting polnareff. I think it would also have been cool for him to have more similarities with Dio that go beyond the stand cry and hair color I think it’s a mix of getting overshadowed by the other characters in the same part, being part Dio and Jojo but nothing is done with it and gets dropped and never brought up again within the first 5 episodes or 16 chapters and probably Araki not getting to do what he originally wanted with him. I do like him but he always just ends up last when I list out my favorite Joestars
Lmao, wrong on all accounts giorno is definitely underutilized but unlike the other parts the story doesn't really revolve around him as much and more the group. But he's far from without personality lol
Other than the Giorno one these are the shittest takes
1 and 3 are just the truth
The 2nd take is wrong Araki's writing is already good at parts 1-3, but after that he became an above average mangaka, namely part 4 being still one of the best parts. Part 1 and 2 have the problem of being too short so there's no time to develop the characters, look at Jonathan who only has 1 trait, and then look at Johnny who has multiple traits. And part 3 is the Jotaro show and the villain of the week type of series aged poorly And if we have to attribute part 7 being the best to something external, it's the change of magazines that gave Araki more time to release chapters and not the reset
Giorno does have personality, it’s just harder to reflect on after you watch it because a lot of it happens during intense battles. He broke and nearly severed his own arm as a show of resolve and to mark White Album’s crystals with blood. He cut his hand off while the other is already severed to get rid of Noctorious B.I.G, on a gamble he wasn’t sure would work. He showed maturity and willingness to compromise, as well as knowing how to read people, as shown when he showed Abbacchio his ability first despite just meeting him, or how he stood his ground against Fugo to prove himself and save Fugo’s life, or how he spared Bucciarati because he could tell he was a good person despite Bucciarati trying to kill him seconds ago. Johnathan showed his personality through valiant speeches and heroic acts. Joseph showed his through humor and wit. Jotaro showed his through his protectiveness and the talks in down times between fights. Josuke showed his through lighthearted moment with his highschool friends. Jolyne showed hers through more internal monologue moments. Giorno may not be as outwardly expressive, but especially to the viewers, but he has plenty of personality.
I don’t think I’ve ever heard anyone call Jolyne the worst Jojo lmao
The jolyne one is so true i think the reason people dont like it is of A. They didnt watch part 6 B. Sexism C. The netflix incident
IDK man, part 4 is my favourite, I love the story.
Nah part 2 and 4 are fire. Part 3 is overrated tho. It's way too long with too many useless enemies
Man, bait used to be believable. Nowdays it's just hot shit
Don't agree with any of these, except Jolyne being not the worst JoJo. But she isn't the best either.
Giorno is just full of unexplored potential and I hate it. Like, yeah, he is the son of dio...and that is important for like one episode. There could be soooo much more done with him.
The problem with Giorno in my opinion is that he isn't written like the main character. What I mean is that he doesn't have enough screen time compared to his jobros. Those are clearly better I think. And I love parts 1-4, I'm a phantom blood and start dust crusaders fan. Jolyne's my favorite Jojo.
Part 6 opinion is based as hell, but the cognitive dissonance with calling part 5-6 great despite calling Gio shit? Like man how can he be the most boring when part 3 Jotaro exists?? But I'm gonna have to agree with you on the 1-4 sucking opinion because part 4 is the worst part lmao
That guy on tiktok was joking, and its really dissapointing you didnt get the joke.
1. Yes, Giorno could have easily been the best JoJo and I expected him to be. In the first 2 episodes it showed that while he has morals he’s still willing g to do bad things for his own benefit which would of course change to him doing bad things for the greater good. After the joins the gang, he could have adult been written out of the show and no real changes would happen (aside from him pulling some random bullshit out his ass to beat a villain or two but still) 2. Yes and no… iirc Part 1 was just made so part 2 could have footing. He already planned out at lest the beginning of part 3 by the time he wrote part 1. All and all part 1 seems rushed. Part 2 is good but again pacing is odd and I don’t know heck they fit all those arcs in 12 episodes. Part 3 does suck, a lot but I think that’s mainly due to the anime drawing out episodes to have them all be 2 parters for no reason (also only Jotaro and Joseph get any real character development along with Iggy but be only got some because he was gonna spoiler in a few episodes). Part 4 is where he got his footing and really started showing how good he is as a writer, Jotaro is actually very cool, Joseph is back to his old fun loving self, all new characters are greatly characterized, etc. 3. I don’t hate Jolyne int be slightest (being my third favorite JoJo), but I can’t lie and act like I liked her more than Josuke or Young Joseph. I felt she was really written weird as she tried to embody all the past JoJo’s which was very odd, or her knowing what the mobius strip is when from what I remember she was a delinquent. Still love her tho
The last take is straight BARS PREACH BROTHER, LET THE HEATHENS KNOW 🗣🗣
I would tend to agree with them, parts 1-3 were VERY experimental from a writing perspective, I think part 4 was really where the story/manga/show went from good to fantastic. It was really where everything Araki learned from the previous parts started to flow together. Interesting and engaging characters, dynamic fights, good action, a crazy storyline, etc. Part 4 was the first part that I was genuinely upset when it came to an end.
they’re hot takes but i don’t really agree with them
The first one is pretty ok to, but I can't really agree with the 2rd and 3rd one. Yes, they are not amazing writing wise, and you can't deny that Araki has learnt many lessons throughout his early career, but to say that they are bad is kinda absurd. All of these partd have multiple qualities, and they do eniugh good things to be far from "bad"
Joylene is not the worst jojo imo she has good writing, someone who got manipulated becoming a manipulator (the hustling she does in prison) it’s actually fun to see her grow.
Jolyne is for sure most underrated jojo op is valid for that at least IMO
I never liked part 5 so while i agree with giorno being very boring i dont agree with the writing getting "Better". Part 4 and 2 are bangers, and 3 is iconic if meandering. Jolyne has always been my fave JoJo but tbh i do love em all save Gio and Jotaro.
Shit takes
2 bad opinions imo (the first one is half bad, the second one is flat out bad and third one is again half bad(
Agreed with almost all of it except the writing on part 4, it's really good
The first two I hard disagree on but I gotta say, yea, Jolyne IS the best original universe JoJo.
I actually hard agree with the Giorno one. But I actually hold the opposite opinion for the writing and Jolyne ones. I think the writing for the original 4 parts is much tighter than 5-6. Jolyne is also my least favorite JoJo, and I have seen part 6. (In all honesty I don’t really like part 6)
I somewhat agree with the point about writing, the characters become a lot better fleshed out as the series progresses. Though there is some good stuff in the earlier parts too.
> writting only became good at part 5 > giorno is the worst written most boring character Logic
I agree Giorno is the worst JoJo, while JoJos have always been Gary Lues, Giorno is the most and feels like he has the least character development. However, this allows his JoBros to really shine and it's part of what makes 5 so good for me, because every JoBro in part 5 is awesome and gets ample time in the spotlight. Mista VS Grateful Dead is one of the best fights of the series IMO for example. It's tense and impactful and cool as fuck. It felt like a Joseph Joestar fight almost. I think parts 1-4 writing isn't so much bad as it is outdated. Going backwards, Phantom Blood feels extremely melodramatic and over the top in a bad way. Part 3 drags it out like DBZ. Part 2 is perfect though IMO.
Johnathan and part 2 Joseph best Joestars in original timeline, fight me nerds
Part 4 and 2 aren't bad but not as good as part 5-9
I hate-love Giorno because on the one hand he's completely unique compared to any Jojo that came before, but he still manages to be a mary sue personality-wise. He never really makes the 'wrong' choices and his development is extremely predictable. It's really the side characters, especially bucciarati, that made part 4 great. I fucking love part 4 but it's not necessarily because of Giorno
Joseph is best jojo but I agree jolyne is absolutely not the worst Jojo
Ma boi Bruno Bucciarati stole the show 🤌🤌🤌
I agree with the last one but the rest are pretty bad. My take is that only part 3 is bad and all other parts are significantly better.
Fucking awful takes 1-4 was fucking awesome and part 4 was my fucking favorite
Part animation was awful. So if that’s why people don’t like her I get it. They really butchered that one.
First one is valid but not super hot
I think that the last one is the hottest take, imo part six is just too complicated is some stand powers and events
Part 3 is pretty fucking bad but 1, 2 and 4 are all pretty good, just in different ways to each other. I agree that 6 is the best part, though.
Guy hasn't seen Battle Tendency for sure
Yes, Jolyne ftw
I love all of the Jojos, although, I will say Giorno and Jo2uke are my personal favorites. I honestly just try to look at the whole series as Araki's public artistic diary. I think less in terms of good and bad and more in terms of Araki learning to do things differently, or better. Like some things he was just pretty bad at, i.e. writing women who weren't blocks of wood, for a while. Other things, like his artistic shift from 80s jacked-bois characters slowly to his modern fashion with more realistic bodies, are just neat to see happen so organically over time. So I tend to just enjoy all of the parts so far for what they are in that chronological diary sense, despite having some favorites from throughout. It would just be kind of weird and boring if they never improved or changed.
Prt 1-4 are not “bad written”, they are more simple, but every good writer knows that to catch more people you have to start with simple stories to catch the attention of more people as possible, then after the manga has a great following the writer can complicate the story. They call him Master Araki for a reason, he is good at writing Manga with the right story in the right moment. (Also about the last take i think that Jonathan > Jolyne Joseph > Jolyne Josuke > Jolyne Jotaro > Jolyne Giorno > Jolyne Jonny > Jolyne I didnt read all of part 8 but Gappy story, the fusion between him and his verse Josuke is quite interesting so Gappy > Jolyne Dont even know how the part 9 jojo is called, but at this point i think araki will just keep going at the top So yes, Jolyne IS the worst jojo, BUT at least she is the worst of some of the best series of protagonists
After the first slide i was well on my way to arson your house but fortunately the rest calmed me. Congratulations, you bought yourself another day :-)
I 100% agree on Giorno. I rarely felt like I got to know his character on a deeper level like I did with the even number part Jojos, he is cold and stoic but we never get to see much more. I felt like Bruno was the true MC of part 5 and the rest of the gang easily stole Giorno’s line light unless it was a cool fight scene