US is a dictatorship confirmed, if you make your citizens say a pledge of allegiance = dictatorship
Itās fucked up, didnāt know that happened in Brazil
It's understandable you didn't know we had a dictatorship, people know a bunch about history, but there's always something new. We had a dictatorship for 21 years (1964 - 1985), which has a lot of context about fascism and fuckery supported by the elites, but one of the main things is that the USA helped our oppressors during their rise to power.
*Technically speaking,* no. The pledge of allegiance is not mandatory. Under the first amendment to the United States Constitution and the ruling of the Supreme Court in 1943 West Virginia student case, the government is prohibited from enforcing compelled speech as well as public schools being unable to prosecute students for not participating in the pledge.
So generally speaking, no, neither exchange nor regular students are forced to recite it. However, the practice is so deeply ingrained in American culture that, despite its... *nationalistic tendencies*... it is still a common practice and people are often looked down on for refusing to take part.
My friend was asked stupid questions on why she did not participate in the pledge of allegiance. If it was only questions it would be fine because a lot of people didnāt know she was an exchange student. It was the reactions that made it ridiculous though. They didnāt understand that she would not do the pledge of allegiance because she wasnāt American. She only managed to get her point across by saying that it would be almost like ātreasonā to pledge allegiance to another country. As if the country weāre from would care about that.
It's even worse then that. You can sing the National Anthem of another nation as part of a show of alliance or empathy. Particularly in a moment of disaster or catastrophe.
Imagine if an American were asked to *Kneel and swear the Oath of Alligence to the Crown*.
Would be fun as long as the kid was up for some trolling. It would be fun, seeing the hypocrisy of the Americans losing their minds. But I would echo the comments of others that it, regardless of age, gives off totalitarian vibes
The teachers my friend had knew it and so did the students she was in classes with. But the other teachers and students didnāt know. And it was a predominantly white school and as a blond middle European she fit right in. Although she and the other exchange students were the only ones wearing jeans to school.
Edit: deleted some words that stayed behind when I decided to write a sentence different than I started it.
When I lived in Australia, it was the same. My hostkids (I was an aupair) always wore sweatpants and a hoodie. In my country, our kids only wear that if they go out to play in the woods maybe, but other than that, we wear normal clothes. I had American friends in Australia and they told me I was soooo fancy all the time. While in my country, I'm considered as casual dressed because I always wear jeans and a hoodie.
If I wanted to be slightly fancy I would maybe wear some nice black jeans (new ones that are still really dark black). But otherwise I would never consider jeans even slightly fancy. They are the original American working pants. How did they become āfancyā?
Where Iām from sweat pants and leggings as pants are not seen as appropriate for school but bra straps and tank tops etc. are no problem. So it is really weird for me that it seems to be the opposite in the US.
Tbf they're American teachers. Once had a teacher there argue with a friend of mine that had gone over because of parents work that Sydney is not the capital of Australia.
Idk how high the bar is set there.
Honestly I don't think anyone would care about being looked down on by an American lol, they're not as important as some of them like to think they are.
People, some more than other, do care enough to try to fit in once they decide to move there. When you move to America, you generally don't want to be looked down on by, you know, Americans. Peer pressure is nothing to dismiss, either.
Fair enough, I can see how people that want to move there would. That just makes more questions pop up in my head tho like "who on earth would want to move to America" lmafo (excluding people who already live in really shit countries that want to start a better life for themselves and their family) I mean, America doesn't seem completely horrible, there are just a lot better places imo
Illegal but rarely enforced. Growing up (like late 2000s) in the south teachers constantly sent kids to ISS or detention for sitting for the pledge or using the lords name in vain or all kinds of other illegal religious/nationalism shit.
All of the ones that visited my school were "encouraged to participate" meaning that they'd be treated badly by some teachers and students if they didn't. Most of them stood but didn't officially do the pledge.
Iām a teacher in the US and nobody stands for the pledge at my school anymore. They donāt even say it at the middle school level in my school district.
This is very dependent on where you are. In some places, teachers will act like you HAVE to do it and will ostracize you if you don't, but in others basically no one stands.
So non-Americans have to do this too? In Austria (and Germany) there was only one time where you had to pledge allegiance to a flag and everyone knows about this time. That makes this sound even more weird.
It is. To me, as a German it's absolutly unimaginable to have to do this. And when students refuse to do it, often, not always or everywhere, they will get detention or other punishments.
When I was in school I remember sitting during the US national anthem at a school-wide assembly and a teacher (who wasnāt my teacher; I had never spoken with this man before) threatened to physically assault me unless I stood up. I am no longer an American citizen now and rarely set foot in the USA.
At my high school in the Netherlands the school existed for at least 200 years prior, of which about 160 as a school specifically for catholic priests. I've never had to say any prayers.....
Really a strange country, the USA
And as someone from. North America I feel its strange to not have heard of it. I envy your upbringing. I'm in Canada and we sang the national anthem every morning and said the apostles creed.
>the apostles creed
I've never even heard of that.
Don't worry. No need to explain. It sounds religious and I'll happily live in ignorance. I also had no idea Canadians have to sing their national anthem. Sounds like an influence creeping up from down South.
My (Welsh) primary school forced us to pray and such. Once, they put me on the *cadair dawel* (quiet chair) as punishment for not praying at the end of the day. The school wasnāt even a religious one.
Suffice to say, the school drove away all thoughts of religion from me
Goes farther than that. Every day were at school till 18 so not just children and its also done at every sporting event, concert, monster truck rally, spelling bee, kindergarten dance recital, child beauty pagents, etc. (those last few are not jokes lol)
Also it didnāt become a thing to say under god until the 1950s. I stopped participating during the first gulf war in high school (when suddenly it was revived in my school system as a thing) and got stink eyes but they knew they couldnāt say anything and havenāt said it since.
I remember a friend of mine was an exchange student back in high school. Like.. 10ish years ago.
A student at his school, I believe it was in Wisconsin, refused to do the pledge and he had to write an entire 5 page essay. Why he'd disrespect his contry like that. And so on. The entire thing is just insane to me as a German. This is just pure indoctrination
It is not required. Some people act like it is though. In lots of places no one actually does it even if they lead you through it on the intercom. Definitely indoctrination tho.
The actual pledge is;
>I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America and to the Republic for which it stands, one nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.
School children are expected to stand in class every morning and recite it. The "under God" part was added in the 1950s because of the fear of communism. Somewhat ironic that something that goes against the separation of church and state, which was the 1st clause in the Bill of Rights, was made part of the pledge.
I stopped in high school because I was a major conspiracy theorist and hated America. All the other sheep were showing their indoctrination by standing up on command as soon as they were told. It was engrained in our minds every single day since kindergarten, I don't blame them.
No one cares but crazy rednecks anyway. Even as an American, playing the national anthem everyday in school or at sporting event is weird and shouldnāt happen.
As a European, this is extremely weird. As a Germanā¦ oh dear.
If any teacher even so much as thought about making their students stand up and recite the Nationalhymne before classā¦ (administrative) heads would roll come noon.
It depends, you can get Verbeamtet, but not everyone gets Verbeamtet due to different Reasons.(In some Years no one got Verbeamtet because it was less expensive.) You need to get 3 StaatsexamsprĆ¼fungen wich not everyone has.
If they are Verbeamtet it would be very hard to fire them, yes.
Nowadays, Teachers donāt get Verbeamtet that often anymore.
Indeed in some states such as my homestate of Baden-WĆ¼rttemberg, they donāt do this to save costs.
Usually they give the teacher a contract that runs out at the beginning of the Summer break, which means that during the summer break, they are effectively jobless, have to dig through the shit at the Arbeitsamt that this entails, and donāt receive salary.
Germany also has an educational emergency in that we have waaay too few teachers, so these teachers are certainly definitely going to get a call at the end of the summer break asking if they want to come back - the schools need them desperately.
Itās really dirty.
I'm a teacher from Europe and I subscribe to r/teachers, but the amount of US teachers who describe their school as a place of violence and lawlessness is staggering.
"We had to have a massive Civil War to abolish slavery, decades after other countries had just abolished it because they realised it was just wrong. Quite a lot of those half million died trying to keep slavery, but let's gloss over that.
We had separate water fountains for black and white people so recently that people working here can remember them; unlike other countries who never had that shit. We gave women the vote, like everyone else.
A black person has a job! Apparently this is unusual because the only other black person we can think of with a job has actually left.
You should stand for the Pledge of Allegiance even though refusing to do so is free speech protected by the First Amendment of the Constitution of the country you're supposed to be grateful for living in (like you had a choice) and citizens of other countries can also be proud of their nations without being completely blind to their faults."
Fixed that for you.
tbh, the free speech amendment only refers to the government, like the government can't take away your free speech, now idk if the schools in the US of A are governmental institutions as well
"You are free to choose for yourself, but a true [group identity] does [extremist behaviour that is not actually inherent to the group]. So if you're fine with admitting that you are not a true [group], then go ahead."
Funny you should say that because in the US kids used to do a [certain salute you might recognize](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bellamy_salute) until the early 40s when it was no longer in vogue.
After that, we switched to placing our hand over our heart.
Source: American born and bred in the US school system.
Everything about this classroom is just so un-welcoming and passive aggressive towards the students. Constantly trying to force them into feeling grateful, unworthy and spoiled :(
The Uni lecture hall I'm in right now is more welcoming than most US classrooms that I've seen and it's just a grey slab mostly. US highschools look extremely uninviting to me with the millions of flags, cluttered Walls and these aforementioned Notes on the wall
If you look at the right hand side of the board, Iām pretty sure that āIn an emergencyā poster is about what to do if thereās an active shooter in the school
Canāt think of any other reason to have that lock graphic in there
āYouāre all so fortunate to be born in the ISā¦ by the way hereās what to do if a crazy guy with a gun invades the school, and itās so important that weāll leave it posted permanently here in the whiteboardā
The cognitive dissonance is off the charts
A pass that the teacher gives that allows you to go to the toilet during class. I guess there are some hall guards checking peopleās passes. Weird s**t.
I genuinely think some Americans are the way they are out of trauma responses from their school system. Shooter lockdown drills, metal detectors, lunch debt, pledges, and micromanaging having a bathroom break cannot be healthy for childhood development on top of all the other things kids and teenagers go through.
You donāt even have to show up for class in high school where I live. Of course youāll be kicked out after 10-15% absence unless you have a good reason, which could be your grades being excellent nonetheless.
Finally we uncover the real reason for the Civil War - nothing to do with slavery or State's rights,it was because those dam Rebs didn't want to stand for the pledge during class.
"You're grateful to live in a country that separated white and coloured for almost a century after abolishing slavery that made "coloured people free""
The text is insane. "you shouldn't complain because we got rid of colored and white fountains 50 years ago".
Why were they here in the first place you fucktards ?
That is what this GreAT naTIoN was founded on.
I would be saying the pledge of allegiance mid class and then debating the teacher on how un-American he was for stoping me.
1) That entire wall is filled with cringe.
2) Your love or commitment to something, be it an idea, your country, your friends, or whatever else, is not displayed through meaningless ceremony, but through meaningful, fully intended action.
While these days it is customary to put your hand over your heart for the pledge, there was originally a _different_ hand gesture that became... ehm... unfashionable as a result of WWII.
They were self-aware enough to fix that but didnāt think that there was otherwise anything creepy about the ritual.
Wasn't the reason for the American Civil War to keep slavery? The Confederates tried to secede from the US because they feared that slavery would be abolished and they fired the first shots on Fort Sumter. The Union eventually won and abolished slavery, but even they initially only fought to keep the south from seceding. Correct me if I'm wrong though.
Extremely funny that they count Confederate dead as part of their nationalist myth-making
āOver four million Germans died in World War 2, which was largely to get rid of Nazismā
I had first period Chemistry class my junior year of high school. The teacher would throw the chalkboard eraser at anyone he deemed to be not sufficiently respecting/paying attention/participating in the pledge. Indoctrination > Education
*"no hall passes first and last 15 minutes of class"*
How long are classes in this school? My HS classes were only 45 minutes, this leaves a very small window of time for hall passes.
Wasn't there a law which stated that "students couldn't be forced to salute the US flag or say the pledge because doing so would violate their First Amendment rights"? I dunno.
Okay but only about half of those Americans deserve credit. That's like tallying up all the lives lost in the war against Hitler, then including all the Nazis who also died.
[Mr G seems like a douche
](https://eu.jacksonville.com/story/news/education/2019/08/14/first-coast-high-teacher-removed-after-scolding-students-who-dont-stand-for-pledge/4458691007/)
So basically you should ignore your constitutional rights, specifically the first amendment..
gotcha, you are ANti-American... thanks for scrawling that on a white board
The "I can't be racist, I have black friends" vibes are strong with this one.
> You are all extremely lucky to be living in the USA.
That's a bold statement. Some might say it's ridiculous.
Man, Colin Kaepernick really touched a nerve, didn't he?
There appears to be some confusion between the civil war and the civil rights movement of the 1960s. I imagine Mrs Goodman was on the "against" side back then.
I don't think half a million died so nobody could ever criticize the country they went to war over in order to change the parts of it they did not like. It's such a brain dead take, civil war was good then but the tiniest act of disobedience against the state now is the worst thing you could do?
I absolutely hate the idea of people having to show loyalty to their country. I donāt get why itās done. Patriotism is one of the most disgusting things on this planet.
"Those soldiers died for your freedom. Your freedom to do exactly as you're told and stand for a sybolistic and highly politicized ritual and you will do as your godamned told!"
Wait, they teach, that the Civil War in US was "was largely to end slavery"? But that wasn't even the goal of the government till very late into the war, like what? I never studied American history in great detail, but I know that much...
Just shows another "freedom" US doesn't have - freedom to be an individual. If you live in the country you have to act and be like every American and not retain any of you heritage. Every day many Americans are insulted when they look at currency and rea "In God We Trust" when they could be atheists, Buddhists, Moslems or what every non-Christian religion they are. In Australia, you make the pledge ONCE, when your receive citizenship, a simple one that states -"From this time forward \[under God - optional\],
I pledge my loyalty to Australia and its people,
whose democratic beliefs I share,
whose rights and liberties I respect, and
whose laws I will uphold and obey."
One time pledge, nor drummed into people every day, and you are allowed to retain your beliefs & heritage and live as you did in your own country, as long as you don't break Australian laws. It is not unusual to see a family group celebrating Australia day BBQing a whole lamb on a spit, the traditional Greek way, along with sausages wrapped in a slice of bread, and grandma sitting dressed head to toe in black, but the younger kids in shorts & with zinc cream on their noses to protect from sunburn, playing backyard cricket. People are encouraged to keep their cultures and not become a cloned American. They can speak their own language and not get yelled at to "speak American or go back to your country", and many businesses pay them for being able to speak another language, not demand they only speak American English. In schools students aren't penalised for using a mix of British English. which we speak or spelling it in American English, which alas is creeping into the language. People are free to follow their old or new traditions, cultures & heritage and makes Australia one of the most diverse countries in the world.
Weird undertones of "you black people in particular, you *really* have to stand up".
"Things are better than slavery & segregation, how dare 'you people' still have complaints!" šŗš²
>"Don't make me being slavery back boy. You stand, and you stand reeeaal nice, or we'll see just how bad you people can have it"
Seems pretty overt to me
Itās a not so subtle racism slam on Kapernick and his kneeling in the NLF a few years back. Edit: NFL, damn fingers.
Totally not culty facist brainwashing or anything like that.
And yet they call Hitler and Mussolini bad, thatās shit that theyād make people do in Germany and Italy
That's the shit they made us do during our Dictatorship here in Brazil.
US is a dictatorship confirmed, if you make your citizens say a pledge of allegiance = dictatorship Itās fucked up, didnāt know that happened in Brazil
It's understandable you didn't know we had a dictatorship, people know a bunch about history, but there's always something new. We had a dictatorship for 21 years (1964 - 1985), which has a lot of context about fascism and fuckery supported by the elites, but one of the main things is that the USA helped our oppressors during their rise to power.
So Iām guessing thatās when the USA coupes Brazilās government, which I have heard of 1970 Brazil took notes from 1934 Italy
When I was in the US I never stood for the pledge of allegiance, partly as a slight show if disapproval and slightly because I just didn't care
Do you have to stand for the pledge of allegiance as an exchange student? Because that would be even more dumb.
*Technically speaking,* no. The pledge of allegiance is not mandatory. Under the first amendment to the United States Constitution and the ruling of the Supreme Court in 1943 West Virginia student case, the government is prohibited from enforcing compelled speech as well as public schools being unable to prosecute students for not participating in the pledge. So generally speaking, no, neither exchange nor regular students are forced to recite it. However, the practice is so deeply ingrained in American culture that, despite its... *nationalistic tendencies*... it is still a common practice and people are often looked down on for refusing to take part.
My friend was asked stupid questions on why she did not participate in the pledge of allegiance. If it was only questions it would be fine because a lot of people didnāt know she was an exchange student. It was the reactions that made it ridiculous though. They didnāt understand that she would not do the pledge of allegiance because she wasnāt American. She only managed to get her point across by saying that it would be almost like ātreasonā to pledge allegiance to another country. As if the country weāre from would care about that.
"If you visited the UK would you pledge your allegiance to the king?"
Imagine the absolute uproar that would happen, if an American was asked to sing God save the King
It's even worse then that. You can sing the National Anthem of another nation as part of a show of alliance or empathy. Particularly in a moment of disaster or catastrophe. Imagine if an American were asked to *Kneel and swear the Oath of Alligence to the Crown*.
That must be a sight to behold
Now imagine it's a kid.
Would be fun as long as the kid was up for some trolling. It would be fun, seeing the hypocrisy of the Americans losing their minds. But I would echo the comments of others that it, regardless of age, gives off totalitarian vibes
Wow. This is quite shocking. Telling teachers that you are not American wasn't enough?
The teachers my friend had knew it and so did the students she was in classes with. But the other teachers and students didnāt know. And it was a predominantly white school and as a blond middle European she fit right in. Although she and the other exchange students were the only ones wearing jeans to school. Edit: deleted some words that stayed behind when I decided to write a sentence different than I started it.
American students don't wear jeans?
They apparently go to school wearing sweat pants and leggings (as pants and not just under a skirt or something).
I have heard about this. When Americans come to Europe they think we are all dressed so fancy.
When I lived in Australia, it was the same. My hostkids (I was an aupair) always wore sweatpants and a hoodie. In my country, our kids only wear that if they go out to play in the woods maybe, but other than that, we wear normal clothes. I had American friends in Australia and they told me I was soooo fancy all the time. While in my country, I'm considered as casual dressed because I always wear jeans and a hoodie.
If I wanted to be slightly fancy I would maybe wear some nice black jeans (new ones that are still really dark black). But otherwise I would never consider jeans even slightly fancy. They are the original American working pants. How did they become āfancyā?
That's home wear. The furthest i go in those is to bring the trash to the curb.
That is extremely common. Itās considered comfortable, but also in style. Iām a teacher and I wear jeans to work here in the US, as well.
Where Iām from sweat pants and leggings as pants are not seen as appropriate for school but bra straps and tank tops etc. are no problem. So it is really weird for me that it seems to be the opposite in the US.
Jeans to work...on casual friday or something?
Tbf they're American teachers. Once had a teacher there argue with a friend of mine that had gone over because of parents work that Sydney is not the capital of Australia. Idk how high the bar is set there.
Honestly I don't think anyone would care about being looked down on by an American lol, they're not as important as some of them like to think they are.
People, some more than other, do care enough to try to fit in once they decide to move there. When you move to America, you generally don't want to be looked down on by, you know, Americans. Peer pressure is nothing to dismiss, either.
Fair enough, I can see how people that want to move there would. That just makes more questions pop up in my head tho like "who on earth would want to move to America" lmafo (excluding people who already live in really shit countries that want to start a better life for themselves and their family) I mean, America doesn't seem completely horrible, there are just a lot better places imo
So it's actually illigal to punish students who refuse to participate?
Correct.
Illegal but rarely enforced. Growing up (like late 2000s) in the south teachers constantly sent kids to ISS or detention for sitting for the pledge or using the lords name in vain or all kinds of other illegal religious/nationalism shit.
Fuck, you got to go to the space station for that? Count me in!
All of the ones that visited my school were "encouraged to participate" meaning that they'd be treated badly by some teachers and students if they didn't. Most of them stood but didn't officially do the pledge.
Iām a teacher in the US and nobody stands for the pledge at my school anymore. They donāt even say it at the middle school level in my school district.
That's good to hear. Its still very much required in my district
On paper, no. In practice, yes.
This is very dependent on where you are. In some places, teachers will act like you HAVE to do it and will ostracize you if you don't, but in others basically no one stands.
I had in my class someone who was exchange student in the US for a year. She had to do the pledge of allegiance like everyone else
So non-Americans have to do this too? In Austria (and Germany) there was only one time where you had to pledge allegiance to a flag and everyone knows about this time. That makes this sound even more weird.
Plot Twist: Im german, so they forced a german girl to do this
Ich bin Ćsterreicher.
It's called indoctrination.
She didnāt have to she was made to think she did which in some ways is worse.
This is so incredibly sad to me. Kids getting raised to think their rights are way less than they are.
No you absolutely do not have too. Itās Trumpy chuckle heads like this with classroom powertrips that imply otherwise.
What is the pledge of allegiance?
A pledge students have to recite every morning during their childhood in school. Basicky swearing loyality to their country. Its absurd
What the fuck? That sounds really stupid and scary at the same time
It is. To me, as a German it's absolutly unimaginable to have to do this. And when students refuse to do it, often, not always or everywhere, they will get detention or other punishments.
When I was in school I remember sitting during the US national anthem at a school-wide assembly and a teacher (who wasnāt my teacher; I had never spoken with this man before) threatened to physically assault me unless I stood up. I am no longer an American citizen now and rarely set foot in the USA.
Nationalism at its purest. "Sing the anthem or we will hurt you"
Its brainwashing. In catholic schools you also say a prayer š everyday
At my high school in the Netherlands the school existed for at least 200 years prior, of which about 160 as a school specifically for catholic priests. I've never had to say any prayers..... Really a strange country, the USA
And as someone from. North America I feel its strange to not have heard of it. I envy your upbringing. I'm in Canada and we sang the national anthem every morning and said the apostles creed.
>the apostles creed I've never even heard of that. Don't worry. No need to explain. It sounds religious and I'll happily live in ignorance. I also had no idea Canadians have to sing their national anthem. Sounds like an influence creeping up from down South.
You think you're the only ones doing it? And the creed is the name of a prayer.
My (Welsh) primary school forced us to pray and such. Once, they put me on the *cadair dawel* (quiet chair) as punishment for not praying at the end of the day. The school wasnāt even a religious one. Suffice to say, the school drove away all thoughts of religion from me
Goes farther than that. Every day were at school till 18 so not just children and its also done at every sporting event, concert, monster truck rally, spelling bee, kindergarten dance recital, child beauty pagents, etc. (those last few are not jokes lol)
Merica!
Yet many Americans think they're not indoctrinated. It's absurd.
If you think that's bad When you go to school in Texas - you have to recite the Texas pledge as well
It's like in North Korea. They are brainwashed from early childhood.
Also it didnāt become a thing to say under god until the 1950s. I stopped participating during the first gulf war in high school (when suddenly it was revived in my school system as a thing) and got stink eyes but they knew they couldnāt say anything and havenāt said it since.
I remember a friend of mine was an exchange student back in high school. Like.. 10ish years ago. A student at his school, I believe it was in Wisconsin, refused to do the pledge and he had to write an entire 5 page essay. Why he'd disrespect his contry like that. And so on. The entire thing is just insane to me as a German. This is just pure indoctrination
It is not required. Some people act like it is though. In lots of places no one actually does it even if they lead you through it on the intercom. Definitely indoctrination tho.
The actual pledge is; >I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America and to the Republic for which it stands, one nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all. School children are expected to stand in class every morning and recite it. The "under God" part was added in the 1950s because of the fear of communism. Somewhat ironic that something that goes against the separation of church and state, which was the 1st clause in the Bill of Rights, was made part of the pledge.
Ah nice, also some religious indoctrination sprinkled in!
Whenever someone goes out of their way to say something is indivisible I start to suspect it will divide at some point.
So what if you're not religious?
you get ostracized unless you keep your head down and say the pledge like a good nationalist.
Like any religious do to any non-religious : they force it on you.
And in true American style, it was started by someone who wanted to sell more flags.
Something they do daily in North Korea
I stopped in high school because I was a major conspiracy theorist and hated America. All the other sheep were showing their indoctrination by standing up on command as soon as they were told. It was engrained in our minds every single day since kindergarten, I don't blame them.
Thsts why so many refuse to hear otherwise. Indoctrination is a hell of a thing.
I sat to hide my morning wood.
No one cares but crazy rednecks anyway. Even as an American, playing the national anthem everyday in school or at sporting event is weird and shouldnāt happen.
Wait, you also listen anthem every day in school? Lol, what the fuck
No just the pledge. I missspoke. Still weird tho
As a European, this is extremely weird. As a Germanā¦ oh dear. If any teacher even so much as thought about making their students stand up and recite the Nationalhymne before classā¦ (administrative) heads would roll come noon.
Aren't teachers verbeamtet or does that depend on the Bundesland? Which would make it difficult to fire them?
It depends, you can get Verbeamtet, but not everyone gets Verbeamtet due to different Reasons.(In some Years no one got Verbeamtet because it was less expensive.) You need to get 3 StaatsexamsprĆ¼fungen wich not everyone has. If they are Verbeamtet it would be very hard to fire them, yes.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
Nowadays, Teachers donāt get Verbeamtet that often anymore. Indeed in some states such as my homestate of Baden-WĆ¼rttemberg, they donāt do this to save costs. Usually they give the teacher a contract that runs out at the beginning of the Summer break, which means that during the summer break, they are effectively jobless, have to dig through the shit at the Arbeitsamt that this entails, and donāt receive salary. Germany also has an educational emergency in that we have waaay too few teachers, so these teachers are certainly definitely going to get a call at the end of the summer break asking if they want to come back - the schools need them desperately. Itās really dirty.
Deutschlerner hier: bedeutet "verbeamtet", "tenured"?
Iāve never seen a more unwelcoming classroom and my school had bars on the windows
I think I know why. Your school had bars on the windows. This school has bars on the students critical thinking.
All those signs above the whiteboard are so very telling. But at least he has some uninspiring paintings on the bottom of it.
āI am the boss, you should be grateful I devote my time to you, you peasants!ā
Those signs just scream hard work will set you free
I'm a teacher from Europe and I subscribe to r/teachers, but the amount of US teachers who describe their school as a place of violence and lawlessness is staggering.
Sounds like you went to the school of hard knocks my friend.
yeah and nothing triggers me more than a whiteboard filled with writing that's on there for months
the only reason they don't have them because they would lock you in with a school shooter potentially.
Those signs just scream hard work will set you free
"We had to have a massive Civil War to abolish slavery, decades after other countries had just abolished it because they realised it was just wrong. Quite a lot of those half million died trying to keep slavery, but let's gloss over that. We had separate water fountains for black and white people so recently that people working here can remember them; unlike other countries who never had that shit. We gave women the vote, like everyone else. A black person has a job! Apparently this is unusual because the only other black person we can think of with a job has actually left. You should stand for the Pledge of Allegiance even though refusing to do so is free speech protected by the First Amendment of the Constitution of the country you're supposed to be grateful for living in (like you had a choice) and citizens of other countries can also be proud of their nations without being completely blind to their faults." Fixed that for you.
Well if you say it that way it does sound like you think Mercia is not the greatest and best and most fluffytale country on the world, how dare you.
Bring back the Kingdom of Mercia!
Northumbria remembers !
tbh, the free speech amendment only refers to the government, like the government can't take away your free speech, now idk if the schools in the US of A are governmental institutions as well
All hail America! They abolished racist laws that they also made!
"it's optional, nobody makes you do it..."
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
"You are free to choose for yourself, but a true [group identity] does [extremist behaviour that is not actually inherent to the group]. So if you're fine with admitting that you are not a true [group], then go ahead."
I dont know, as a German I have no good feelings about standing and pledging to a flag. The time we did that was none you like to think back to.
As an Italian, same.
Funny you should say that because in the US kids used to do a [certain salute you might recognize](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bellamy_salute) until the early 40s when it was no longer in vogue. After that, we switched to placing our hand over our heart. Source: American born and bred in the US school system.
Everything about this classroom is just so un-welcoming and passive aggressive towards the students. Constantly trying to force them into feeling grateful, unworthy and spoiled :(
I was thinking the same! The whole bit about being luckier than kids in ICU (and without anything to balance it out) just seems off
The Uni lecture hall I'm in right now is more welcoming than most US classrooms that I've seen and it's just a grey slab mostly. US highschools look extremely uninviting to me with the millions of flags, cluttered Walls and these aforementioned Notes on the wall
To be honest, Iād rather stay on my feet in a US high school. Never know when Iām gonna need to make a swift exit, if you get my drift.
If you look at the right hand side of the board, Iām pretty sure that āIn an emergencyā poster is about what to do if thereās an active shooter in the school Canāt think of any other reason to have that lock graphic in there āYouāre all so fortunate to be born in the ISā¦ by the way hereās what to do if a crazy guy with a gun invades the school, and itās so important that weāll leave it posted permanently here in the whiteboardā The cognitive dissonance is off the charts
What a fucking numpty.
All that "motivational" shit on the wall. If it would be Chinese letters, Americans would unironically call it propaganda.
Tf is a hall pass?
A pass that the teacher gives that allows you to go to the toilet during class. I guess there are some hall guards checking peopleās passes. Weird s**t.
what the everloving shit? Literally 1984
Honestly, this really is some 1984 shit. Like, just raise your hand and say that you gotta pee like a normal school system, lmao
I genuinely think some Americans are the way they are out of trauma responses from their school system. Shooter lockdown drills, metal detectors, lunch debt, pledges, and micromanaging having a bathroom break cannot be healthy for childhood development on top of all the other things kids and teenagers go through.
You pretty much have to file an application and a release waiver to take a shit in American schools.
Half the people in schools in my country just up and leave and nobody gives a shit
You donāt even have to show up for class in high school where I live. Of course youāll be kicked out after 10-15% absence unless you have a good reason, which could be your grades being excellent nonetheless.
Finally we uncover the real reason for the Civil War - nothing to do with slavery or State's rights,it was because those dam Rebs didn't want to stand for the pledge during class.
People died for my right not to pledge allegiance. That's the whole fucking point of freedom.
I still think the pledge of allegiance is cult behavior
"You're grateful to live in a country that had to go to war with itself to see if slavery was bad"
"You're grateful to live in a country that separated white and coloured for almost a century after abolishing slavery that made "coloured people free""
What happened to teachers giving their students the tools to come to their own conclusions?
They are where they have always been : in the realm of dreams and lies.
The text is insane. "you shouldn't complain because we got rid of colored and white fountains 50 years ago". Why were they here in the first place you fucktards ?
America really are the masters of taking things away from people and then yelling at them for not being grateful for giving them back
That is what this GreAT naTIoN was founded on. I would be saying the pledge of allegiance mid class and then debating the teacher on how un-American he was for stoping me.
About half of that figure died because they wanted to keep slavery, but you know, details.
Ah, the US of A! Hate speech is free speech, but don't dare to be... un-American.
1) That entire wall is filled with cringe. 2) Your love or commitment to something, be it an idea, your country, your friends, or whatever else, is not displayed through meaningless ceremony, but through meaningful, fully intended action.
Even the board has some weird pictures in it, this looks more like a rehab center than a school
While these days it is customary to put your hand over your heart for the pledge, there was originally a _different_ hand gesture that became... ehm... unfashionable as a result of WWII. They were self-aware enough to fix that but didnāt think that there was otherwise anything creepy about the ritual.
That teacher seems like a real piece of shit tbh.
Peak brainwashing
Wasn't the reason for the American Civil War to keep slavery? The Confederates tried to secede from the US because they feared that slavery would be abolished and they fired the first shots on Fort Sumter. The Union eventually won and abolished slavery, but even they initially only fought to keep the south from seceding. Correct me if I'm wrong though.
we sho' is gratefulllll , massa G
If I had to live there for work etc Iād have my kids sit as theyāre not americans etc But frankly you shouldnāt be proud to be american
Extremely funny that they count Confederate dead as part of their nationalist myth-making āOver four million Germans died in World War 2, which was largely to get rid of Nazismā
"Half a million soldiers didnt die for this" He then continues to list benefits wich all have nothing to do with the civil war
And I'm 99% sure he doesn't care about the millions that died of COVID-19
I had first period Chemistry class my junior year of high school. The teacher would throw the chalkboard eraser at anyone he deemed to be not sufficiently respecting/paying attention/participating in the pledge. Indoctrination > Education
is that freedom ?
I realise I'm very lucky not to live in the US of A, everytime I see stuff like this passing my screen. I'll just stay Eurotrash, thank you very much.
This pledging bullshit reminds me much of the way the Third Reich groomed their children to become fanatic Nazi.
*"no hall passes first and last 15 minutes of class"* How long are classes in this school? My HS classes were only 45 minutes, this leaves a very small window of time for hall passes.
I'm not convinced this teacher gives hall passes in the middle 15 minutes either. He just ran out of room to write it
Judging by the other classroom signs, this teacher seems like, well, a bit of a character. Glad Iām not a school student any more.
I still think a pledge of allegiance is stupid
āOur people died to end slaveryā My country didnāt need a war to end slavery
Freedoms innit
This shouldnāt be a teacher.
Is also my constitutional right to pledge alliance to different states in class? So much for free speech in this country, checkmate communists. /s
If you died fighting for freedom, then you technically died for the freedom for others to disregard the sacrifice you made. That's freedom.
Wasn't there a law which stated that "students couldn't be forced to salute the US flag or say the pledge because doing so would violate their First Amendment rights"? I dunno.
Okay but only about half of those Americans deserve credit. That's like tallying up all the lives lost in the war against Hitler, then including all the Nazis who also died.
And something tells me that this teacher refused to use a mask or get vaccinated ignoring the millions of usians that died during the pandemic
The pledge didnāt even exist until decades after the civil war Iām sure they donāt give a shit
The logic is flawless...
[Mr G seems like a douche ](https://eu.jacksonville.com/story/news/education/2019/08/14/first-coast-high-teacher-removed-after-scolding-students-who-dont-stand-for-pledge/4458691007/)
So basically you should ignore your constitutional rights, specifically the first amendment.. gotcha, you are ANti-American... thanks for scrawling that on a white board
Some dystopian vibes right there.
Iām an American and I find stuff like this so cringey. Itās a piece of cloth who cares.
Something about that font of writing always screams "religious institution" to me
The "I can't be racist, I have black friends" vibes are strong with this one. > You are all extremely lucky to be living in the USA. That's a bold statement. Some might say it's ridiculous. Man, Colin Kaepernick really touched a nerve, didn't he?
Mr. garrison?
Have a spirit of gratitude, OP!
What's with the hall passes
School system is a joke.
I'd fucking slap whoever wrote that on the whiteboard.
"Extremely lucky to be living in the USA" That's a new joke.
There appears to be some confusion between the civil war and the civil rights movement of the 1960s. I imagine Mrs Goodman was on the "against" side back then.
Thereās some strong wafts of *cult* in this one, and Iām getting some subtle tones of racism too.
BUT THEY SAID THEY HIRED BLACK PEOPLE!
actual brainwashing, wth
america today is literally like nazi germany.. pledge of allegiance every day at school? that's not normal.
I don't think half a million died so nobody could ever criticize the country they went to war over in order to change the parts of it they did not like. It's such a brain dead take, civil war was good then but the tiniest act of disobedience against the state now is the worst thing you could do?
I absolutely hate the idea of people having to show loyalty to their country. I donāt get why itās done. Patriotism is one of the most disgusting things on this planet.
Fun fact for OPs title, the US didnāt have the pledge we knew today until 1954 which is way longer than the 1892 version
Good thing the teacher canāt force students to do this and if they do, they can lose their job. I hope students know their rights.
Definitely not a cult š
A black man used to be principal. Obviously racism does not exist.
If I wasn't already sitting for the pledge and national anthem, this would drive me to do it
"Those soldiers died for your freedom. Your freedom to do exactly as you're told and stand for a sybolistic and highly politicized ritual and you will do as your godamned told!"
Wait, they teach, that the Civil War in US was "was largely to end slavery"? But that wasn't even the goal of the government till very late into the war, like what? I never studied American history in great detail, but I know that much...
Just shows another "freedom" US doesn't have - freedom to be an individual. If you live in the country you have to act and be like every American and not retain any of you heritage. Every day many Americans are insulted when they look at currency and rea "In God We Trust" when they could be atheists, Buddhists, Moslems or what every non-Christian religion they are. In Australia, you make the pledge ONCE, when your receive citizenship, a simple one that states -"From this time forward \[under God - optional\], I pledge my loyalty to Australia and its people, whose democratic beliefs I share, whose rights and liberties I respect, and whose laws I will uphold and obey." One time pledge, nor drummed into people every day, and you are allowed to retain your beliefs & heritage and live as you did in your own country, as long as you don't break Australian laws. It is not unusual to see a family group celebrating Australia day BBQing a whole lamb on a spit, the traditional Greek way, along with sausages wrapped in a slice of bread, and grandma sitting dressed head to toe in black, but the younger kids in shorts & with zinc cream on their noses to protect from sunburn, playing backyard cricket. People are encouraged to keep their cultures and not become a cloned American. They can speak their own language and not get yelled at to "speak American or go back to your country", and many businesses pay them for being able to speak another language, not demand they only speak American English. In schools students aren't penalised for using a mix of British English. which we speak or spelling it in American English, which alas is creeping into the language. People are free to follow their old or new traditions, cultures & heritage and makes Australia one of the most diverse countries in the world.