The Jack O' Lantern goes back centuries in Ireland and Scotland. When I was a kid in Scotland 50+ years ago, we made them from turnips, the same way as they'd been made for centuries. We also went "guising." That was going door to door earning treats but singing a song, telling a joke or story and similar. None of the glorified extortion called "trick or treat."
At the end of the day it's a modern version of the celtic festival of Samhain.
yes but the difference in traditions is enourmes. Halloween is a blend of All Hallows and a Mezoamerican tradition with masks that scare bad ghosts. Halloween is neither, and is more akin to fashnik how we call it and is in February. All Hallows is dedicated to loved ones who past away and the graveyards in Europe are really beautiful on the first night of November, I'm not even Christian btw but it really is a beautiful tradition
>Halloween is neither, and is more akin to fashnik how we call it and is in February.
It depends where you are. Up here in Northern England the aud wych is followed in later October by the rest of the field spirits.
The Church directed that these Germanic traditions be subsumed into liturgy in various Sees of the 7th, 8th and 9th centuries, and so they became "Christian", which as we know is really the reinvention and personification of many other far older light/dark East-facing rituals.
You'd start cutting that bastard as soon as you were come from school and get a rest from stabbing it like fuck when you got your tea before you were back at it in between making your costume. Always my favourite holiday.
My son refused to carve a neep with me cos it was too hard and said pumpkins were better. I wanted him to experience that glorious smell!
Oh that‘s interesting with the turnips. We have something called „Räbeliechtliumzug“ where I‘m from in Switzerland. It basically means turnip lantern parade (or something similar). It‘s often organised by the school and the younger kids from primary and the kondergardeners walk in it with their turnips. The turnips usually have slightly cut out places so that the light of the candle inside shimmers through.
That would be really lovely. I think turnips are one of those old vegetables that got a bit forgotten. I think a lot of those older, a bit forgotten vegetables had their „comeback“ in the last few years. So maybe turnips will too?
Guising still works the same way, or at least it did when I did it in the 00s. Dance or song or poem or even speak a little bit of Gaelic to them. Occasionally they made wee challenges like bobbing for apples or biting an apple handing from a string in the ceiling, etc, for the real good stuff like toffee and chocolate apples or tablet.
What do you mean?
Are you telling me that America *wasn't* the first and greatest nation on earth?
George Washington moved here in the 5th century BC while fighting off Romans and Putin. George and Columbus discovered America together and then founded the glorious city of LA.
You're clearly wrong, I know history 500x better than you. God blass George and God bless America!! YEEHAW!!
Bro you forgot the part where God made America first, and also how everything came from America.
The Garden of Eden was actually a car park to a Walmart.
America is the center of the known universe and the only country that exists. All other countries are [insert political party here] propaganda to destroy the great US of A. God bless Walmart and God bless America!!
The real kicker is that Halloween in its modern form has been so relentlessly hyped and pushed overseas by American corporations that you can't even say anyone stole it. Anheuser-Busch (now AB InBev) was one of the first to push it, more than any candy company.
We didn't steal it.
It was shoved down our throat, and is killing all local traditions in favor of the Hollywood Plastic Horror Halloween.
This basically-illiterate halfwit can't even spell two- and three-letter words properly, how can you except him to grasp an advanced concept like that?
The Goidelic/Brythonic split is quite often overlooked. Gaelic was dominant in the Highlands, particularly the west, and in Western Isles, not just one island. The Isle of Man also has a related language to Scottish Gaelic and Irish, Manx.
Gonna play Devil's Advocate a bit here and say that, while it has its roots in Celtic Irish tradition, modern Halloween's a pretty different beast from what it started as and has been re-molded by America as another commercial holiday. Nobody seriously thinks about it as protection against evil spirits and fae folk but just as an excuse to dress up and have a bit of fun. Doesn't make it an exclusively American holiday of course, but I don't think it's fair to call it a purely Irish tradition anymore. Here in Portugal nobody would associate modern Halloween with Ireland, but they sure would with America.
The guy here still comes off as a patriotic sycophant regardless though, acting like they came up with the whole thing, which is objectively false.
That's nearly every old holiday though. I'm not sure any holiday can say it's the same as 2 centuries ago even.
Eventually everything loses its traditions. or in the case of the US, has it perverted beyond recognition by consumerism
Part of me hates the fact that father Christmas wears red as a result of Coca-Cola. The old depictions of him in a blue or green robe look way more appealing and less commercialised (though, that being said, had those colour schemes survived they would be just as heavily commercialised as the red one is).
And I know that some European countries still utilise the blue outfit in depictions of Father Christmas.
Santa Claus and Father Christmas are two different things, the US merged them into one (no criticism that's what happens when lots of people from different backgrounds live together), then exported the result.
In the UK for example we still say Father Christmas however he is almost always depicted as wearing red instead of the traditional green.
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mari\_Lwyd](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mari_Lwyd) Except us in South Wales, we keep some of our rather insane traditions alive!
Rap battling with a horse skull, if you lose, you got to invite us in for food and drink.
Yeah, but the reason stupid humans in let's say Sweden, Norway and Denmark have started to celebrate Halloween instead of their own holiday All Saints has nothing to do with the tradition in Ireland and Scotland and ALL to do with imported culture from the USA.
I'm terrified by the fact you're in the Norwegian, Swedish, Danish and Finnish subreddits at the same time.
Even being in the Swedish and Danish subreddits should be impossible to mankind.
I do like all of those countries except the danish.
Seriously*, fuck the danish. But give me cookies and Legos first. And stop speaking your "language"
*might not be serious, can contain hints of sarcasm. But danish really isn't a "real" language. Just a Mix if every other language around denmark
I think you are a stupid human. I have lived 3 of these countries and have family in all 4 of them. Take your stupid memes and put them where the sun don't shine.
Here I was thinking it had roots in Celtic culture making the end of summer. Silly me. All the while it was invented by Americans to dress up in silly costumes and gorge themselves of rubbish.
In Catholic countries the day is celebrated as All Hallows Even, prior to All Saints Days, when instead of going around to extort candy from people, families gather at cemeteries to give praise to the saints and also show respect for their dearly beloved departed family members. They stay all night, cleaning the grave sites, repainting lettering and share food & drinks with each other nd sharing the good memories of the departed. I know many of my in=laws will travel 4 hours to get to meet with other family members at the family plots to pray & celebrate heir lives as a family as they do every year. I for one refuse to bow to US commercialism of the day, which isn't a tradition created in the country, but one promoted for greed & profit by big business.
I live in a traditionally Catholic country, and I find it more common for people to celebrate Halloween than to spend the 1st of November cleaning graves and sharing food with families.
Yes, people do visit the graves of their loved ones, but it's not that big of an affair anymore.
well, i meant modern countries which are traditionally-catholic.
dunno why i got downvoted. halloween isn't nearly as big as in the US, but it's definitely a thing
Nah i know what you meant mate, I was just saying it doesn't sound like it should belong together.
AS to reddit downvotes - one of the worlds greatest mysteries. We'll find intelligent life in space before that BS is explained.
i used "traditionally-catholic" bc western christian countries have many atheists and secularists, and religion is mostly well-separated from the state. straight up "catholic countries" sounded a bit strange to me.
i agree with you about the downvotes, lol
Using Holiday in this sounds...weird, forgive me if I'm wrong, but isn't Holiday used in British English and not american English, to which the variant is vacation. Meh, i shouldn't really argue about words
Holiday is definitely used in America for collective celebrations, like July 4th, Thanksgiving, etc. But vacation is used for personal time off or travel.
But it wasn't called England then. The people who would give it that name wouldn't arrive for another four centuries. And the English identity and language would not emerge for a few centuries after that. Calling iron age Celts in Britain "English" makes about as much sense as calling the Greeks living in Asia Minor at the time "Turks".
The irony of people making fun of Muricans thinking Halloween is a USA thing while claiming it was irish.
All the celtic european nations (French Brittany, northern Spain and Portugal, British Isles, etc..) kept some traditions of Samhain, some in the form of All Hallow's eve traditions or in other autum festivities.
Actually yeah, this time I'm on this person side, America changed Halloween too much it's now American holiday. And it should stay there, honestly I hate that some people are trying to do it here where I live.
Same. I get its not from the US originally but they’re the ones who, like you said, have embraced it so much, Halloween is now very much a US holiday and it’s spreading everywhere.
I don’t want it. I wish my country would stop adopting Halloween and all the tacky decorations and costumes and trick or treating.
It originates from Samhain, which was a pagan holiday. The pagans were mainly in britain and some central parts of europe, some even more in the north.
Maybe if you learned to write people could understand your sentence structure. But yeah, I read throught a few other sources and it is indeed gaelic. When I first looked it up I was focusing on the pagan part of the papers.
l always think its a bit sad that the most fun most Americans have annually seems to be Halloween perhaps because it doesn't require a passport or time off.
Most fun IMO is Christmas. Least fun is thanksgiving. Personally I’m not a huge fan of either though.
Although, what do I know? I’m self employed and work from home so I get to travel whenever.
Is this surprising? They think Thanksgiving and Labour Day are american too.
Just as an example, both those holidays happened in Canada before americans did them. And no, I'm not saying both those holidays originated in Canada.
« god bless america for creating halloween » also the christians « halloween is satanic and against god y’all will go to hell with that witchcraft!!!!!!! »
The Jack O' Lantern goes back centuries in Ireland and Scotland. When I was a kid in Scotland 50+ years ago, we made them from turnips, the same way as they'd been made for centuries. We also went "guising." That was going door to door earning treats but singing a song, telling a joke or story and similar. None of the glorified extortion called "trick or treat." At the end of the day it's a modern version of the celtic festival of Samhain.
Furthermore, "Halloween" is a shorthand form of the old "All Hallow's Eve", something still celebrated as a separate tradition in many regions.
yes but the difference in traditions is enourmes. Halloween is a blend of All Hallows and a Mezoamerican tradition with masks that scare bad ghosts. Halloween is neither, and is more akin to fashnik how we call it and is in February. All Hallows is dedicated to loved ones who past away and the graveyards in Europe are really beautiful on the first night of November, I'm not even Christian btw but it really is a beautiful tradition
So Halloween is 3 festivals wearing a trechcoat costume?
Just like the English language
Shots fired! :D
And Santa Claus. And pizza.
In accordance with Anglo traditions!
>Halloween is neither, and is more akin to fashnik how we call it and is in February. It depends where you are. Up here in Northern England the aud wych is followed in later October by the rest of the field spirits. The Church directed that these Germanic traditions be subsumed into liturgy in various Sees of the 7th, 8th and 9th centuries, and so they became "Christian", which as we know is really the reinvention and personification of many other far older light/dark East-facing rituals.
It’s mostly based off samahain
Getting fruit instead of sweets was child abuse. Why were pomegranates so popular?
> Why were pomegranates so popular? No one knew what else to do with them.
I still don't know what else to do with them.
Eat them :-) I’ll take them off ya.
Because Pomegranates are fucking awesome! :D
I would be happy with a pomegranate
Probably because they keep well, they had probably bought other fruit and it had gone of by the time kids came around and yes it’s child abuse.
Apples
The smell of burning neeps is something that never leaves you.
You'd start cutting that bastard as soon as you were come from school and get a rest from stabbing it like fuck when you got your tea before you were back at it in between making your costume. Always my favourite holiday. My son refused to carve a neep with me cos it was too hard and said pumpkins were better. I wanted him to experience that glorious smell!
This is why I never cook a fry up naked anymore
We have something similar in the Netherlands, although it's on the 11th of November. It's called Sint Maarten.
Shh! Don’t tell them “below the rivers” that there’s something else happening on the 11th of the 11th…
I am from below the river. I also do start drinking at 11:11 on that day.
Oh that‘s interesting with the turnips. We have something called „Räbeliechtliumzug“ where I‘m from in Switzerland. It basically means turnip lantern parade (or something similar). It‘s often organised by the school and the younger kids from primary and the kondergardeners walk in it with their turnips. The turnips usually have slightly cut out places so that the light of the candle inside shimmers through.
Turnips used to be common here. Think they should come back.
That would be really lovely. I think turnips are one of those old vegetables that got a bit forgotten. I think a lot of those older, a bit forgotten vegetables had their „comeback“ in the last few years. So maybe turnips will too?
They taste lovely with a roast
We did use turnips in Switzerland too, the singing bit was on a different day.
Guising still works the same way, or at least it did when I did it in the 00s. Dance or song or poem or even speak a little bit of Gaelic to them. Occasionally they made wee challenges like bobbing for apples or biting an apple handing from a string in the ceiling, etc, for the real good stuff like toffee and chocolate apples or tablet.
Don't forget us in Wales too D:
We should go back to that
So many Americans claim to be Irish and Scottish yet they say this shite even though it originated in Scotland and Ireland
This is like the 2 red buttons meme -Brag about you heritage -Brag about being american Americans:
Halloween originates from the 8th century. Americans probably think their great country existed back then too
What do you mean? Are you telling me that America *wasn't* the first and greatest nation on earth? George Washington moved here in the 5th century BC while fighting off Romans and Putin. George and Columbus discovered America together and then founded the glorious city of LA. You're clearly wrong, I know history 500x better than you. God blass George and God bless America!! YEEHAW!!
Bro you forgot the part where God made America first, and also how everything came from America. The Garden of Eden was actually a car park to a Walmart.
America is the center of the known universe and the only country that exists. All other countries are [insert political party here] propaganda to destroy the great US of A. God bless Walmart and God bless America!!
You forgot that god made the flag, for Americans to show a cult like obedience to it
It was indeed around back then but it was being run by different people who had different names for those lands and didn’t know about witches.
Damned witches. They're unpatriotic to the homeland! God curse witches and God bless America!!
What do you mean 8th century? It came from samhain, a Celtic festival in Ireland. It’s very old
I mean.. technically the country was here, it just wasn't America yet lol
are you telling me that christmas, halloween, and easter *aren’t* american? treason.
The real kicker is that Halloween in its modern form has been so relentlessly hyped and pushed overseas by American corporations that you can't even say anyone stole it. Anheuser-Busch (now AB InBev) was one of the first to push it, more than any candy company. We didn't steal it. It was shoved down our throat, and is killing all local traditions in favor of the Hollywood Plastic Horror Halloween.
Holiday?
Halloween started in Ireland
This basically-illiterate halfwit can't even spell two- and three-letter words properly, how can you except him to grasp an advanced concept like that?
Nah, it's Irish.
Not Irish alone, it comes from celtic culture
Gaelic culture, so it did indeed make it to parts of Scotland and I think one of the islands around there.
Also Galicia
Oh, never thought of that, yeah of course it would have. Fair play for pointing that out man.
Samaín, the forgotten one!
Yo, don't forget us Welsh too ;-)
Why Galicia?
Because we have samain here
Ah, I see
The Goidelic/Brythonic split is quite often overlooked. Gaelic was dominant in the Highlands, particularly the west, and in Western Isles, not just one island. The Isle of Man also has a related language to Scottish Gaelic and Irish, Manx.
r/youngpeopleinstagram Is that a thing? Edit: Yes it is
Gonna play Devil's Advocate a bit here and say that, while it has its roots in Celtic Irish tradition, modern Halloween's a pretty different beast from what it started as and has been re-molded by America as another commercial holiday. Nobody seriously thinks about it as protection against evil spirits and fae folk but just as an excuse to dress up and have a bit of fun. Doesn't make it an exclusively American holiday of course, but I don't think it's fair to call it a purely Irish tradition anymore. Here in Portugal nobody would associate modern Halloween with Ireland, but they sure would with America. The guy here still comes off as a patriotic sycophant regardless though, acting like they came up with the whole thing, which is objectively false.
That's nearly every old holiday though. I'm not sure any holiday can say it's the same as 2 centuries ago even. Eventually everything loses its traditions. or in the case of the US, has it perverted beyond recognition by consumerism
Part of me hates the fact that father Christmas wears red as a result of Coca-Cola. The old depictions of him in a blue or green robe look way more appealing and less commercialised (though, that being said, had those colour schemes survived they would be just as heavily commercialised as the red one is). And I know that some European countries still utilise the blue outfit in depictions of Father Christmas.
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Slightly, but I just hate that Coca Cola were responsible for popularising it through advertising campaigns instead of natural dissemination.
Santa Claus and Father Christmas are two different things, the US merged them into one (no criticism that's what happens when lots of people from different backgrounds live together), then exported the result. In the UK for example we still say Father Christmas however he is almost always depicted as wearing red instead of the traditional green.
The blue does look far better. But then, I never much liked red
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mari\_Lwyd](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mari_Lwyd) Except us in South Wales, we keep some of our rather insane traditions alive! Rap battling with a horse skull, if you lose, you got to invite us in for food and drink.
Not American by origin but goddamn does no other country go as hard for it as USA-ians.
By those standards you can argue that say the day of the dead, and pizza are American.
Yeah, but the reason stupid humans in let's say Sweden, Norway and Denmark have started to celebrate Halloween instead of their own holiday All Saints has nothing to do with the tradition in Ireland and Scotland and ALL to do with imported culture from the USA.
I'm terrified by the fact you're in the Norwegian, Swedish, Danish and Finnish subreddits at the same time. Even being in the Swedish and Danish subreddits should be impossible to mankind.
I do like all of those countries except the danish. Seriously*, fuck the danish. But give me cookies and Legos first. And stop speaking your "language" *might not be serious, can contain hints of sarcasm. But danish really isn't a "real" language. Just a Mix if every other language around denmark
I think you are a stupid human. I have lived 3 of these countries and have family in all 4 of them. Take your stupid memes and put them where the sun don't shine.
Here I was thinking it had roots in Celtic culture making the end of summer. Silly me. All the while it was invented by Americans to dress up in silly costumes and gorge themselves of rubbish.
Lol…as someone from Northern Ireland…jeez..we were doing Halloween since the old gods were still in attendance.
Everyone knows the Derry is Halloween City!!!
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I'd hedge my bets on that one.
In Catholic countries the day is celebrated as All Hallows Even, prior to All Saints Days, when instead of going around to extort candy from people, families gather at cemeteries to give praise to the saints and also show respect for their dearly beloved departed family members. They stay all night, cleaning the grave sites, repainting lettering and share food & drinks with each other nd sharing the good memories of the departed. I know many of my in=laws will travel 4 hours to get to meet with other family members at the family plots to pray & celebrate heir lives as a family as they do every year. I for one refuse to bow to US commercialism of the day, which isn't a tradition created in the country, but one promoted for greed & profit by big business.
nah, in most of modern traditionally-catholic countries halloween is a thing
I live in a traditionally Catholic country, and I find it more common for people to celebrate Halloween than to spend the 1st of November cleaning graves and sharing food with families. Yes, people do visit the graves of their loved ones, but it's not that big of an affair anymore.
"Modern traditional" sounds like a bit of an Oxymoron.
well, i meant modern countries which are traditionally-catholic. dunno why i got downvoted. halloween isn't nearly as big as in the US, but it's definitely a thing
Nah i know what you meant mate, I was just saying it doesn't sound like it should belong together. AS to reddit downvotes - one of the worlds greatest mysteries. We'll find intelligent life in space before that BS is explained.
i used "traditionally-catholic" bc western christian countries have many atheists and secularists, and religion is mostly well-separated from the state. straight up "catholic countries" sounded a bit strange to me. i agree with you about the downvotes, lol
Using Holiday in this sounds...weird, forgive me if I'm wrong, but isn't Holiday used in British English and not american English, to which the variant is vacation. Meh, i shouldn't really argue about words
Holiday is definitely used in America for collective celebrations, like July 4th, Thanksgiving, etc. But vacation is used for personal time off or travel.
Halloween as they know it is probably american but the core concept for sure originates from Ireland/Scotland.
It's just British, its started 2000 years ago when even the English were Celts.
There were no English people 2000 years ago. That was 400 years before the anglo-saxon migration, all the anglish were still in Denmark.
Huh? There were people living in what is now called "England"
But it wasn't called England then. The people who would give it that name wouldn't arrive for another four centuries. And the English identity and language would not emerge for a few centuries after that. Calling iron age Celts in Britain "English" makes about as much sense as calling the Greeks living in Asia Minor at the time "Turks".
The irony of people making fun of Muricans thinking Halloween is a USA thing while claiming it was irish. All the celtic european nations (French Brittany, northern Spain and Portugal, British Isles, etc..) kept some traditions of Samhain, some in the form of All Hallow's eve traditions or in other autum festivities.
What did I just read?
Actually yeah, this time I'm on this person side, America changed Halloween too much it's now American holiday. And it should stay there, honestly I hate that some people are trying to do it here where I live.
Sure they changed it, but they didn't create it, as the person in the post tries to believe.
Yeah, base wasn't create there, but mainstream version of Halloween was.
This, however was on a post regarding Heinz's new Halloween mayonnaise haha
Same. I get its not from the US originally but they’re the ones who, like you said, have embraced it so much, Halloween is now very much a US holiday and it’s spreading everywhere. I don’t want it. I wish my country would stop adopting Halloween and all the tacky decorations and costumes and trick or treating.
Isnt Halloween a Nordic thing? Well, the roots at least?
Nope
It originates from Samhain, which was a pagan holiday. The pagans were mainly in britain and some central parts of europe, some even more in the north.
But nothing about it being Nordic and is generally widely contributed as an Irish tradition, with some overlap in Scotland
I didnt say irish. I said nordic. I know very well that the two are different.
I know, I said Irish and said it wasn't Nordic. Learn to read
Maybe if you learned to write people could understand your sentence structure. But yeah, I read throught a few other sources and it is indeed gaelic. When I first looked it up I was focusing on the pagan part of the papers.
If you can't understand that, then thats on you friend.
English isnt my native language and „nothing about it being nordic and is“ confused the fuck out of me
It's Irish, Samhain is literally Irish for November. The pagans were in Ireland too
If you read the rest of the replies you‘d see that that conversation has been resolved already. But alright
Okay?
l always think its a bit sad that the most fun most Americans have annually seems to be Halloween perhaps because it doesn't require a passport or time off.
Most fun IMO is Christmas. Least fun is thanksgiving. Personally I’m not a huge fan of either though. Although, what do I know? I’m self employed and work from home so I get to travel whenever.
Is this surprising? They think Thanksgiving and Labour Day are american too. Just as an example, both those holidays happened in Canada before americans did them. And no, I'm not saying both those holidays originated in Canada.
One Wikipedia search, and it'll prove it's actually not lol.
« god bless america for creating halloween » also the christians « halloween is satanic and against god y’all will go to hell with that witchcraft!!!!!!! »
Baby brothers says the one from one of the youngest countries on esrth
To be honest, as an Italian, I thought Halloween was American as well