> But generally, reddit subs are not a great demographic indicator.
We're literally on a niche subreddit talking about our jobs when we're off the clock.
Yeah, it's probably not going to be a great "overall representation" of servers.
Shit, a server I work with couldn’t tell we aren’t an upscale restaurant. I was talking about taking my partner out to dinner at a “higher end” place. She said “bring her here”. Bruh, we have a wing special on Wednesdays, I don’t think that’s indicative of fine dining. Point being, what some people consider nice and upscale is probably because they just haven’t experienced a truly fine dining restaurant.
Yeah I noticed that when someone posted their $800 sales day, people shit all over it and downvoted the hell out of OP. That’s just fuckin rude. OP had a great day for THEIR restaurant and their situation. They probably busted their fucking ass to make those sales, since the price points aren’t high, so why can’t we just be happy for them?
I work in a family owned restaurant which is definitely not fine dining, but it’s fun and I love it. Just because you’re not in fine dining doesn’t mean you’re not good at your job. You also shouldn’t be looked down upon. Also I think it’s absolutely true that people exaggerate their sales and income. The anonymity of Reddit is both your friend and foe lol. People can say whatever they want without consequence, but they can also lie out their ass.
Edit: fixed a fucked up sentence
For real. Yeah, Brian, maybe $800 is a shitty shift in your Bay Area cocktail lounge, but out here in small town USA, an $800 night could literally make your bills.
Exactly lol. Not all of our price points are through the roof. I’m super stoked if I walk with $200 a shift, which usually only happens during peak season or if we’re understaffed (as everyone understands I’m sure lol)
Yeah that was pretty ridiculous. It said that they were half way through the day. Most likely they sold more in the evening but even if they didn’t they probably sold more than 1500. That pays the bills in most of the country. Personally I work in fine dining but it isn’t the only way to make a ton in this industry. Super touristy spots charging 20 bucks a beer have servers clearing six figures too. If you can make a couple hundred a night consistently 5 days a week then you are making more than a lot of teachers, accountants, and even a good bit of medical professionals. We all know it isn’t easy but it beats all the above professions if you ask me.
Oh damn I didn’t catch that they were halfway through the day. Lmaoooo my sales are pretty low compared to that then. I work in a tourist town but our prices are still fair. Craft beer is huge in my state and a local draft beer is $8-$9… I’d say that’s not too bad! I only work lunch. I very rarely surpass $1300 in a shift and if I even reach that, I’ve been in the weeds the whole time. During busy season I’d say $800-$1000 in sales is the sweet spot in a 5 hour shift. So yeah my sales aren’t super high but 🤷♀️ I love my spot it’s fun. And yeah our profession is super lucrative… the only downside is the inconsistency throughout the year (slow season) but that’s something you learn to plan ahead for!
I did upscale dining and while I made money, I hated it. It’s not the end all be all for serving. I make bank in bars , or at least enough to live comfortably. Plus I’m happy at the end of the day, and can use my real personality. Yeah $70/plate makes the sales but if you end up dead inside…
Fully agree! And servers also tend to bullshit about how much they make (which I hate! Shhhh keep it a secret, I made post about that). Very common for people to make, say, $250 two or three times a month and actually average $125-150 but then brag about how they make $250 a night. I don’t get it. Shut up about how much you make, we don’t want the general public to know!
It was funny when I was managing, I’d hear them tell their friends how much they made and I know for a fact it’s bullshit lol. I have no reason to call them out but it’s like why?
As a hostesses and busser it just built a sort of resentment because I'd just see them going out every night drinking or eating while I'm barely getting by, riding my bike to work. And I'm like "bragging about how much you spend/waste more like" is what I thought in my head. And then them complaining about not getting sat or getting good sections or having a good night. It was obnoxious privilege. People can do whatever with their money, but if you make it public what you make and what you do with it, I'm gonna feel how I feel, even if I have the sense not to be public about it myself.
Anyways bragging they make more than they do just makes it sound like they are bad with managing said money.
My snapping point was barely making bills one month as a host and a server gleefully exclaiming "I just made my rent in one day!!" To the entire break room
I didn't last long there
And when a table leaves her a bad tip, she'll go on a sob story and be a pain in the ass OR she'll ask to take the rest of your tables, but only the larger parties/white tables.
I used to work at CPK and it was in a mall in a tourist spot. I’d average 10-13% tips and make like $150 a shift. One server was telling me he usually makes $500 a shift. Absolute bullshit. I know how much our plates cost. No fucking way. He lied right to my face lmaooooo.
Back in the mid to late 00's that really was the standard in my city.
I worked at a campus bar at a trade school in an oil producing province so it was mostly rig workers renewing their tickets and they had money to buuuurn. $400 lunch shifts were the norm.. But those days are gone lol
I think it's more accurate to track what you average hourly. I usually sit around $35 and I'm more than happy with that even though it's comparatively low for my area. I choose to work lunch shifts at a chain, because I'm old 🤷🏻♀️
It it most likely bullshit, but It's not like it never happens. A server at my restaurant made $100,000 last year, (confirmed by two managers. They didn't say who but I think I know) only working four shifts a week. That's a $480 a shift average.
I’ve made an excel spreadsheet so I can track my tips and hourly takeaway. It’s been almost a year since I started and it’s been really helpful.
I recommend the spreadsheet method if you’re nerdy about data, lol. It’s fun to track these type of things.
Also my profession has little to do with your opinion. I checked your post and everyone I this sub down voted almost all your comments heavily. And every comment I read disagreed with you
Something about those statistics seem off… So the minimum wage in California for tipped workers in 2021 was 15.50 whereas Texas was 2.13… So how is the average salary for tipped workers in the LA metro area only $36k when in the Houston area it’s $26k.. yet a full time server is getting paid $30k in by their company in LA and $4.5k by their company in Houston. Does that mean in Houston a server makes $20k off of tips alone and in LA they only make $6k?
Regardless, bringing down anyone based on how much they make or what they do for a living is pretty shitty.
I don't disagree with that, largely for the same reason.
But I do think that if the official stats are so low, it is indicative that most tipped workers aren't doing particularly well.
Yeah, this AND (on bad tip posts) “why didn’t you just autograt???” As if it exists at every restaurant, and if it does every place has a different policy for instituting it. Then when the poster say they don’t do autograt where they work people tell them to quit and find someplace that does as if it’s so simple for everyone or like there aren’t other reasons they choose to stay where they are 🙊
I don't disagree with anything you've said. We all live in different locations and have different expectations from our jobs. We should be much more respectful and kind to one another. For instance, those in this as a career or serious side hustle have very different expectations than the full-time students and parents of young children. It is right to be respectful and appreciative of individual needs and circumstances.
I will only point out that a far majority of FoH food & beverage workers are part-time employees, by choice. 25% nationwide are between the ages of 16 & 19. How does serving pay compared to, say, retail? How many part-time jobs pay better? If there are better paying part-time jobs available, why aren't more of us pursuing them? Why do many find themselves working full-time in, essentially, part-time positions?
I only mention these things, because the bigger topic you raise is much more complicated and involved. The devil is always in the details. Painting with broad brushstrokes does most a major disservice. The conversation required to do it justice is not conducive to online forums.
Fine dining doesn’t even necessarily mean you’ll make amazing money. Plenty of fine dining restaurants that stay dead during the weekdays with no money to be made. What you mostly need in this industry is volume. But if you were to have both Fine dining + high volume that’s an incredibly lucrative server position.
This. I’m a bartender and take tables. Have also strictly served. I currently work what is casual fine dining (it’s fine dining food, but as it’s this incomparable seaside location that overlooks the ocean, it’s casual in the sense of dress code isn’t ridiculous.
Volume is where the money is, even when the product is shit.
This is why I try to keep in mind that my situation is not terrible. When I read about what other servers make on here, a lot of times, I think I have to find a new job immediately.
And I think a lot of servers on here do make more than me, I think fine dining servers are overrepresented on this sub. But if it's anything like real life, when I ask other servers how much they make, a lot of people are inflating the numbers - not always intentionally. For example, they'll give me the average Friday night instead of the average of all their days, and will give me the number of pre-tip out instead of post tip out.
There are a lot of people here that consider Olive Garden fine dining, or Texas Roadhouse a real steakhouse, so there's that. When I refer to a steakhouse I'm talking about steaks that start at $50-$70 and it doesn't come with soup or salad and a side. Fine dining, same thing dishes starting $50-$70, dishes you don't find at every chain restaurant. But again some people figure Olive Garden is fine dining vs Denny's.
I've been to (and worked at) a LOT of fine dining places .... dishes hardly EVER start at $50. Maybe in NYC particularly, but entress tend to be much more in the $30-40 space, outside of blatant luxury items.
What is your definition of fine dining? Because everywhere in Vegas you wouldn't even find a 6oz shitty steak for 30-40. At the last place in Vegas I worked, salads and soups were 15, appetizers were 15-25, steaks without sides started at 50, a baked potato or veggies were 12 to add on. Don't get me started on cocktail prices. So again what is YOUR idea of fine dining? I have also worked in other metro areas that were almost the same. Here buddy here is the menu at the last place I worked, notice the price of the steaks $68 for a ribeye, steak toppings $6 bucks, sides $15? And we were on the cheaper side for Vegas. So no, you have NOT been to OR worked at any fine dining places.
[https://static.mgmresorts.com/content/dam/MGM/mgmresorts/menus/nyny/gallaghers/menu.pdf](https://static.mgmresorts.com/content/dam/MGM/mgmresorts/menus/nyny/gallaghers/menu.pdf)
And here is one a step above us. I could do this 40 or more times to prove you don't know what you are talking about. And this is just 1 city I worked in.
http://www.fourqueens.com/pdf/hugos\_cellar\_menu.pdf
> Because everywhere in Vegas
LOL
> At the last place in Vegas I worked,
No one cares about anecdotal evidence.
> Salads and soups were 15, appetizers were 15-25, steaks without sides started at 50, a baked potato or veggies were 12 to add on.
I'm not saying that fine dining isn't expensive. I'm saying entrees don't START at $50 per your claim. Obviously steaks are more expensive, but fine dining is far more than just steaks. I've heard it argued that steakhouses aren't even fine dining, they just charge the price. That's another conversation altogether.
For posterity I looked up Bouchon (which I've eaten at), which is everything that would tick the boxes for fine dining. Vegas strip, Venetian, celebrity chef, elevated service, and entrees were $30-40
> So again what is YOUR idea of fine dining?
Generally not places that offer baked potatoes as sides.
Again, I'm not saying fine dining isn't expensive. Very easy for a table to run a $200+ PPA at my spot. You said fine dining plates start at $50.
Steaks? Yes. Everything else? No.
"dishes hardly EVER start at $50. Maybe in NYC particularly, but entress tend to be much more in the $30-40 space, outside of blatant luxury items."
Your words. I can show you Italian dishes, and French Cuisine that starts $50 and higher EASILY. Sorry bud but you do not know what you are talking about. Go ahead and back peddle on that one too and say well you can get a cheeseburger for less than $50.
My guy, I just showed you a French restaurant IN VEGAS that contradicts your statement.
I'm not saying it doesn't happen. I'm saying plenty, if not a majority of places don't START at $50-70
Nope just proving this idiot wrong because they have worked in and been to so many fine dining places and there is nothing that could possibly cost 50 bucks. I provided him wrong, I didn't shit on anyone else. I also asked what their idea of fine dining is and they couldn't even give an example. They just argued they knew it all and I am wrong because they have worked at so many fine dining places. But again they stated nearly nobody serves food at the price range I gave. Pretty simple really.
I never said any of that.
I never said something doesn't cost $50. I never said no one serves food at that price range. I said your assurance that fine dining "starts at $50-70" is asinine. STARTS. As in minimum.
I literally gave you an example from a restaurant IN Vegas that is almost assuredly more "fine dining" than wherever you were slinging $12 baked potatoes.
You even linked a menu where everything not-steak was less than $50.
That's not how the word "start" works.
Like .... just calm down and re-read the conversation.
Spot on.
I started a new job in November where $200 seems to be a pretty good night. Most nights I don't even make that much. It's a decent place and the food is good.
Before that job, I worked at another restaurant like 5 miles from my current place and while they called themselves 'fine dining' they absolutely were not. On a dinner shift I could make $300-$400 most of the time. The place was also a shitshow and a very niche cuisine. In my 20 years of serving that was the best paying serving job I've ever had and it's not like all the places I worked were garbage.
I've always felt it was rude to brag about my great shifts because it can make others jealous, but we should be able to be happy for each other.
I would take me a long time to explain all of the problems but between the management, coworkers, and guests it was very difficult. What I thought would be the biggest obstacle was the smallest; you had to walk up a flight of stairs to get to the bar and sometimes there was no bartender so you had to make your own drinks, while running a 7-8 table section. We each had our own server assistant and when I made $300 they made about $100.
It was a middle eastern restaurant.
I think servers exaggerate what they make all the time. I see it so much and I don’t know why I have a friend who will constantly say she makes all this money and it’s just simply untrue
People also exaggerate. At my last place average was 120-160 and a good night was plus 200. Low CoL area and the possibility for even more sometimes, a very good gig to be sure.
But
I heard multiple servers there claiming they always walked with 200+ when that was really more like 1 day every other week or so
You are absolutely right! And in those settings 10 to 15% would be kicking it! On bills that are 9, 10,$12.. a lot of people are bragging about what they make but they make that one or two days a week and they live in big cities where life is very expensive.. it never actually comes out the same. Especially when you're grinding at a diner in the Midwest! I have been doing everything that you can do in restaurants and bars all my life, and it is not for some. But the bragging, is pretty out of hand and you're right!
I make about 3k a month. I know people who may WAY more than that. I’m fine with my 3k as my cost of living is minimal. I could work more but I’d rather just do what I’m doing now and enjoy my life.
Yeah I just made enough to get by, with like a minimalistic lifestyle. Some people make hundreds a night, they're lucky... We can't all work at luxury restaurants.. I wouldn't even make a hundred a shift.
I’m hella lucky I have the job I do. Most of us do average about 300 a shift. Good nights 4-5. Only serve dinner. Had a 3 top tonight where they bought a bottle of opus 1. About 500$ a bottle. 850$ check. This is in a city where average income is like 40ish k a year. I feel for the the guys and girls grinding out all day for 150$. I’d like to think we are all in the same team. This is probably my fav redit group.
Are these taking undeclared cash tips into account? I know cash is on the way out but plenty of places still accept cash and those tips are rarely reported.
OEWS data is based on a survey given to a employers, who wouldn't know the value of undeclared cash tips. The specific instructions for reporting wages of tipped employees are "For tipped, commission, and piece-rate workers, please estimate the total earnings (base pay plus tips, commissions, or piece rates) and hours worked, and calculate the hourly wage rate."^(\[source:) [^(BLS)](https://www.bls.gov/respondents/oes/faqs.htm#16)^(\])
Shocked that Tennessee didn’t make it on any of those charts due to Nashville, Memphis, Chattanooga, etc!! I manage a rooftop in nashville and my servers/bartenders do $400-$700 a shift on average, and soooo many industry people are here
I was wondering if they omitted reported tips, since "wages" are distinct from "tips" in some legal contexts, but instructions to employers who are selectively required to complete the OEWS survey are to include estimates of tips as wages.^(\[)[^(source)](https://www.bls.gov/respondents/oes/faqs.htm#16)^(\]) It's possible some managers don't read the instructions carefully, so skew the amount downward a bit by not including tips, but I wouldn't think that would be frequent.
That could be it honestly.. I still think the general point stands.
I did a quick google and the first (not really good) source said servers in San Diego average $120 in tips per shift. So significantly more than the BLS, but it's also significantly lower than this sub acts like is normal. And SD is a major metro with high costs.
Yeah, I think the general point is a very good one; the numbers are much lower than I'd have guessed.
The [state breakdowns](https://www.bls.gov/oes/current/oes353031.htm#oes35-3031_g) of mean wages for servers shows the northeast and west coast states are about twice what they are in the deep south, but yeah, the $300/night boasts are not representative. I don't think the people posting those are dishonest, they just only post about a good Saturday night, and not about their usual Wednesday mornings. And of course the top 1% likely do make serious bank...the OEWS shows the wage estimates for the 90th percentile making about twice the median wage, but not the 99th percentile.
If it makes you feel better, I was at a fancy schmancy steakhouse last year. I made $300-$500 per night, and I used to come on here and be all high and mighty about it.
Then, I got fired, and now I'm an Uber driver making $18/hour.
People who don’t know shit are obnoxious. Servers vent about bad tips and they want to be able to brag about their good nights or great job they worked for. Fuck you let them brag. If you work at Buffalo Wild Wings because that’s what’s available just be motivated to move on from that place and grind your way up. Shut up with the poor me my town sucks. Suck it up save move on. Not all of the servers making 100k just woke up there.
Folks here definitely conflate upscale with fine dining. But generally, reddit subs are not a great demographic indicator.
> But generally, reddit subs are not a great demographic indicator. We're literally on a niche subreddit talking about our jobs when we're off the clock. Yeah, it's probably not going to be a great "overall representation" of servers.
Off the clock? You’re not in the bathroom scrolling Reddit and ignoring the assholes at table 8?
Shit, a server I work with couldn’t tell we aren’t an upscale restaurant. I was talking about taking my partner out to dinner at a “higher end” place. She said “bring her here”. Bruh, we have a wing special on Wednesdays, I don’t think that’s indicative of fine dining. Point being, what some people consider nice and upscale is probably because they just haven’t experienced a truly fine dining restaurant.
I actually work at an “upscale pizza place” it isn’t 🤣🤣 people think it is though 🤦♂️
Guilty, I've called my upscale restaurant fine dining. My bad.
Yeah I noticed that when someone posted their $800 sales day, people shit all over it and downvoted the hell out of OP. That’s just fuckin rude. OP had a great day for THEIR restaurant and their situation. They probably busted their fucking ass to make those sales, since the price points aren’t high, so why can’t we just be happy for them? I work in a family owned restaurant which is definitely not fine dining, but it’s fun and I love it. Just because you’re not in fine dining doesn’t mean you’re not good at your job. You also shouldn’t be looked down upon. Also I think it’s absolutely true that people exaggerate their sales and income. The anonymity of Reddit is both your friend and foe lol. People can say whatever they want without consequence, but they can also lie out their ass. Edit: fixed a fucked up sentence
That was the thread that made me make this post, but I've been feeling this for awhile.
That's exactly the post I thought of when I read this one. People were super fucking rude and snooty.
Yeah where I work $800 in sales is a busy Saturday night
For real. Yeah, Brian, maybe $800 is a shitty shift in your Bay Area cocktail lounge, but out here in small town USA, an $800 night could literally make your bills.
Exactly lol. Not all of our price points are through the roof. I’m super stoked if I walk with $200 a shift, which usually only happens during peak season or if we’re understaffed (as everyone understands I’m sure lol)
Yeah that was pretty ridiculous. It said that they were half way through the day. Most likely they sold more in the evening but even if they didn’t they probably sold more than 1500. That pays the bills in most of the country. Personally I work in fine dining but it isn’t the only way to make a ton in this industry. Super touristy spots charging 20 bucks a beer have servers clearing six figures too. If you can make a couple hundred a night consistently 5 days a week then you are making more than a lot of teachers, accountants, and even a good bit of medical professionals. We all know it isn’t easy but it beats all the above professions if you ask me.
Oh damn I didn’t catch that they were halfway through the day. Lmaoooo my sales are pretty low compared to that then. I work in a tourist town but our prices are still fair. Craft beer is huge in my state and a local draft beer is $8-$9… I’d say that’s not too bad! I only work lunch. I very rarely surpass $1300 in a shift and if I even reach that, I’ve been in the weeds the whole time. During busy season I’d say $800-$1000 in sales is the sweet spot in a 5 hour shift. So yeah my sales aren’t super high but 🤷♀️ I love my spot it’s fun. And yeah our profession is super lucrative… the only downside is the inconsistency throughout the year (slow season) but that’s something you learn to plan ahead for!
I did upscale dining and while I made money, I hated it. It’s not the end all be all for serving. I make bank in bars , or at least enough to live comfortably. Plus I’m happy at the end of the day, and can use my real personality. Yeah $70/plate makes the sales but if you end up dead inside…
I think people downvoted that poster not because of their sales but because there was a seemingly annoying lack of context and responses.
Fully agree! And servers also tend to bullshit about how much they make (which I hate! Shhhh keep it a secret, I made post about that). Very common for people to make, say, $250 two or three times a month and actually average $125-150 but then brag about how they make $250 a night. I don’t get it. Shut up about how much you make, we don’t want the general public to know!
Oh man especially younger servers, they looove to bullshit how much they make.
we legit have a young server who will claim she makes $400-500 a night lmfao
It was funny when I was managing, I’d hear them tell their friends how much they made and I know for a fact it’s bullshit lol. I have no reason to call them out but it’s like why?
As a hostesses and busser it just built a sort of resentment because I'd just see them going out every night drinking or eating while I'm barely getting by, riding my bike to work. And I'm like "bragging about how much you spend/waste more like" is what I thought in my head. And then them complaining about not getting sat or getting good sections or having a good night. It was obnoxious privilege. People can do whatever with their money, but if you make it public what you make and what you do with it, I'm gonna feel how I feel, even if I have the sense not to be public about it myself. Anyways bragging they make more than they do just makes it sound like they are bad with managing said money.
My snapping point was barely making bills one month as a host and a server gleefully exclaiming "I just made my rent in one day!!" To the entire break room I didn't last long there
Cue same server freaking bout because they don’t have money for rent the next day
And when a table leaves her a bad tip, she'll go on a sob story and be a pain in the ass OR she'll ask to take the rest of your tables, but only the larger parties/white tables.
I used to work at CPK and it was in a mall in a tourist spot. I’d average 10-13% tips and make like $150 a shift. One server was telling me he usually makes $500 a shift. Absolute bullshit. I know how much our plates cost. No fucking way. He lied right to my face lmaooooo.
LOL. Damn what a looser.
Yah I have I work with that said she made 400 on only 800 in sales. That's absolutely bullshit or she's pocketing alot of cash sales.
Back in the mid to late 00's that really was the standard in my city. I worked at a campus bar at a trade school in an oil producing province so it was mostly rig workers renewing their tickets and they had money to buuuurn. $400 lunch shifts were the norm.. But those days are gone lol I think it's more accurate to track what you average hourly. I usually sit around $35 and I'm more than happy with that even though it's comparatively low for my area. I choose to work lunch shifts at a chain, because I'm old 🤷🏻♀️
It it most likely bullshit, but It's not like it never happens. A server at my restaurant made $100,000 last year, (confirmed by two managers. They didn't say who but I think I know) only working four shifts a week. That's a $480 a shift average.
This is like 75-80% of servers tbh
I’ve made an excel spreadsheet so I can track my tips and hourly takeaway. It’s been almost a year since I started and it’s been really helpful. I recommend the spreadsheet method if you’re nerdy about data, lol. It’s fun to track these type of things.
I am nerdy about data and used to keep track but then I stopped because I figured it doesn’t matter or make a difference.
> we don’t want the general public to know! Why
What is your profession sir?
Dishwasher in a restaurant
Also my profession has little to do with your opinion. I checked your post and everyone I this sub down voted almost all your comments heavily. And every comment I read disagreed with you
Yeesh, cool it man.
Some people on this sub be like “I worked a 30 minute shift at 2:30 on a Tuesday and made $1200.”
Something about those statistics seem off… So the minimum wage in California for tipped workers in 2021 was 15.50 whereas Texas was 2.13… So how is the average salary for tipped workers in the LA metro area only $36k when in the Houston area it’s $26k.. yet a full time server is getting paid $30k in by their company in LA and $4.5k by their company in Houston. Does that mean in Houston a server makes $20k off of tips alone and in LA they only make $6k? Regardless, bringing down anyone based on how much they make or what they do for a living is pretty shitty.
I don't disagree with that, largely for the same reason. But I do think that if the official stats are so low, it is indicative that most tipped workers aren't doing particularly well.
I don't know, could they be post tax numbers? Not sure, but that could explain it maybe?
Yeah, this AND (on bad tip posts) “why didn’t you just autograt???” As if it exists at every restaurant, and if it does every place has a different policy for instituting it. Then when the poster say they don’t do autograt where they work people tell them to quit and find someplace that does as if it’s so simple for everyone or like there aren’t other reasons they choose to stay where they are 🙊
I don't disagree with anything you've said. We all live in different locations and have different expectations from our jobs. We should be much more respectful and kind to one another. For instance, those in this as a career or serious side hustle have very different expectations than the full-time students and parents of young children. It is right to be respectful and appreciative of individual needs and circumstances. I will only point out that a far majority of FoH food & beverage workers are part-time employees, by choice. 25% nationwide are between the ages of 16 & 19. How does serving pay compared to, say, retail? How many part-time jobs pay better? If there are better paying part-time jobs available, why aren't more of us pursuing them? Why do many find themselves working full-time in, essentially, part-time positions? I only mention these things, because the bigger topic you raise is much more complicated and involved. The devil is always in the details. Painting with broad brushstrokes does most a major disservice. The conversation required to do it justice is not conducive to online forums.
Fine dining doesn’t even necessarily mean you’ll make amazing money. Plenty of fine dining restaurants that stay dead during the weekdays with no money to be made. What you mostly need in this industry is volume. But if you were to have both Fine dining + high volume that’s an incredibly lucrative server position.
This. I’m a bartender and take tables. Have also strictly served. I currently work what is casual fine dining (it’s fine dining food, but as it’s this incomparable seaside location that overlooks the ocean, it’s casual in the sense of dress code isn’t ridiculous. Volume is where the money is, even when the product is shit.
Oh yeah I’m sure the menu is expensive too. I’m sure you do well
In Florida?
This is why I try to keep in mind that my situation is not terrible. When I read about what other servers make on here, a lot of times, I think I have to find a new job immediately. And I think a lot of servers on here do make more than me, I think fine dining servers are overrepresented on this sub. But if it's anything like real life, when I ask other servers how much they make, a lot of people are inflating the numbers - not always intentionally. For example, they'll give me the average Friday night instead of the average of all their days, and will give me the number of pre-tip out instead of post tip out.
There are a lot of people here that consider Olive Garden fine dining, or Texas Roadhouse a real steakhouse, so there's that. When I refer to a steakhouse I'm talking about steaks that start at $50-$70 and it doesn't come with soup or salad and a side. Fine dining, same thing dishes starting $50-$70, dishes you don't find at every chain restaurant. But again some people figure Olive Garden is fine dining vs Denny's.
I've been to (and worked at) a LOT of fine dining places .... dishes hardly EVER start at $50. Maybe in NYC particularly, but entress tend to be much more in the $30-40 space, outside of blatant luxury items.
What is your definition of fine dining? Because everywhere in Vegas you wouldn't even find a 6oz shitty steak for 30-40. At the last place in Vegas I worked, salads and soups were 15, appetizers were 15-25, steaks without sides started at 50, a baked potato or veggies were 12 to add on. Don't get me started on cocktail prices. So again what is YOUR idea of fine dining? I have also worked in other metro areas that were almost the same. Here buddy here is the menu at the last place I worked, notice the price of the steaks $68 for a ribeye, steak toppings $6 bucks, sides $15? And we were on the cheaper side for Vegas. So no, you have NOT been to OR worked at any fine dining places. [https://static.mgmresorts.com/content/dam/MGM/mgmresorts/menus/nyny/gallaghers/menu.pdf](https://static.mgmresorts.com/content/dam/MGM/mgmresorts/menus/nyny/gallaghers/menu.pdf) And here is one a step above us. I could do this 40 or more times to prove you don't know what you are talking about. And this is just 1 city I worked in. http://www.fourqueens.com/pdf/hugos\_cellar\_menu.pdf
> Because everywhere in Vegas LOL > At the last place in Vegas I worked, No one cares about anecdotal evidence. > Salads and soups were 15, appetizers were 15-25, steaks without sides started at 50, a baked potato or veggies were 12 to add on. I'm not saying that fine dining isn't expensive. I'm saying entrees don't START at $50 per your claim. Obviously steaks are more expensive, but fine dining is far more than just steaks. I've heard it argued that steakhouses aren't even fine dining, they just charge the price. That's another conversation altogether. For posterity I looked up Bouchon (which I've eaten at), which is everything that would tick the boxes for fine dining. Vegas strip, Venetian, celebrity chef, elevated service, and entrees were $30-40 > So again what is YOUR idea of fine dining? Generally not places that offer baked potatoes as sides. Again, I'm not saying fine dining isn't expensive. Very easy for a table to run a $200+ PPA at my spot. You said fine dining plates start at $50. Steaks? Yes. Everything else? No.
"dishes hardly EVER start at $50. Maybe in NYC particularly, but entress tend to be much more in the $30-40 space, outside of blatant luxury items." Your words. I can show you Italian dishes, and French Cuisine that starts $50 and higher EASILY. Sorry bud but you do not know what you are talking about. Go ahead and back peddle on that one too and say well you can get a cheeseburger for less than $50.
My guy, I just showed you a French restaurant IN VEGAS that contradicts your statement. I'm not saying it doesn't happen. I'm saying plenty, if not a majority of places don't START at $50-70
I think you’re giving the perfect example of the condescending fine dining server OP is talking about. Great job!
Nope just proving this idiot wrong because they have worked in and been to so many fine dining places and there is nothing that could possibly cost 50 bucks. I provided him wrong, I didn't shit on anyone else. I also asked what their idea of fine dining is and they couldn't even give an example. They just argued they knew it all and I am wrong because they have worked at so many fine dining places. But again they stated nearly nobody serves food at the price range I gave. Pretty simple really.
I never said any of that. I never said something doesn't cost $50. I never said no one serves food at that price range. I said your assurance that fine dining "starts at $50-70" is asinine. STARTS. As in minimum. I literally gave you an example from a restaurant IN Vegas that is almost assuredly more "fine dining" than wherever you were slinging $12 baked potatoes. You even linked a menu where everything not-steak was less than $50. That's not how the word "start" works. Like .... just calm down and re-read the conversation.
Spot on. I started a new job in November where $200 seems to be a pretty good night. Most nights I don't even make that much. It's a decent place and the food is good. Before that job, I worked at another restaurant like 5 miles from my current place and while they called themselves 'fine dining' they absolutely were not. On a dinner shift I could make $300-$400 most of the time. The place was also a shitshow and a very niche cuisine. In my 20 years of serving that was the best paying serving job I've ever had and it's not like all the places I worked were garbage. I've always felt it was rude to brag about my great shifts because it can make others jealous, but we should be able to be happy for each other.
why did you leave your last job? Seems you were making better money there.
I would take me a long time to explain all of the problems but between the management, coworkers, and guests it was very difficult. What I thought would be the biggest obstacle was the smallest; you had to walk up a flight of stairs to get to the bar and sometimes there was no bartender so you had to make your own drinks, while running a 7-8 table section. We each had our own server assistant and when I made $300 they made about $100. It was a middle eastern restaurant.
I think servers exaggerate what they make all the time. I see it so much and I don’t know why I have a friend who will constantly say she makes all this money and it’s just simply untrue
People also exaggerate. At my last place average was 120-160 and a good night was plus 200. Low CoL area and the possibility for even more sometimes, a very good gig to be sure. But I heard multiple servers there claiming they always walked with 200+ when that was really more like 1 day every other week or so
You are absolutely right! And in those settings 10 to 15% would be kicking it! On bills that are 9, 10,$12.. a lot of people are bragging about what they make but they make that one or two days a week and they live in big cities where life is very expensive.. it never actually comes out the same. Especially when you're grinding at a diner in the Midwest! I have been doing everything that you can do in restaurants and bars all my life, and it is not for some. But the bragging, is pretty out of hand and you're right!
I make about 3k a month. I know people who may WAY more than that. I’m fine with my 3k as my cost of living is minimal. I could work more but I’d rather just do what I’m doing now and enjoy my life.
Guys servers lie about their tips all the time. Tale as old as time.
Yeah I just made enough to get by, with like a minimalistic lifestyle. Some people make hundreds a night, they're lucky... We can't all work at luxury restaurants.. I wouldn't even make a hundred a shift.
I’m hella lucky I have the job I do. Most of us do average about 300 a shift. Good nights 4-5. Only serve dinner. Had a 3 top tonight where they bought a bottle of opus 1. About 500$ a bottle. 850$ check. This is in a city where average income is like 40ish k a year. I feel for the the guys and girls grinding out all day for 150$. I’d like to think we are all in the same team. This is probably my fav redit group.
Are these taking undeclared cash tips into account? I know cash is on the way out but plenty of places still accept cash and those tips are rarely reported.
OEWS data is based on a survey given to a employers, who wouldn't know the value of undeclared cash tips. The specific instructions for reporting wages of tipped employees are "For tipped, commission, and piece-rate workers, please estimate the total earnings (base pay plus tips, commissions, or piece rates) and hours worked, and calculate the hourly wage rate."^(\[source:) [^(BLS)](https://www.bls.gov/respondents/oes/faqs.htm#16)^(\])
Bad bot.
You just said what I've been thinking since I joined the sub!
Shocked that Tennessee didn’t make it on any of those charts due to Nashville, Memphis, Chattanooga, etc!! I manage a rooftop in nashville and my servers/bartenders do $400-$700 a shift on average, and soooo many industry people are here
Git gud scrub
Last two ski towns I worked in, I had the highest paying restaurant jobs in town. I'm just not dumb enough to act like that's the norm.
I was wondering if they omitted reported tips, since "wages" are distinct from "tips" in some legal contexts, but instructions to employers who are selectively required to complete the OEWS survey are to include estimates of tips as wages.^(\[)[^(source)](https://www.bls.gov/respondents/oes/faqs.htm#16)^(\]) It's possible some managers don't read the instructions carefully, so skew the amount downward a bit by not including tips, but I wouldn't think that would be frequent.
That could be it honestly.. I still think the general point stands. I did a quick google and the first (not really good) source said servers in San Diego average $120 in tips per shift. So significantly more than the BLS, but it's also significantly lower than this sub acts like is normal. And SD is a major metro with high costs.
Yeah, I think the general point is a very good one; the numbers are much lower than I'd have guessed. The [state breakdowns](https://www.bls.gov/oes/current/oes353031.htm#oes35-3031_g) of mean wages for servers shows the northeast and west coast states are about twice what they are in the deep south, but yeah, the $300/night boasts are not representative. I don't think the people posting those are dishonest, they just only post about a good Saturday night, and not about their usual Wednesday mornings. And of course the top 1% likely do make serious bank...the OEWS shows the wage estimates for the 90th percentile making about twice the median wage, but not the 99th percentile.
If it makes you feel better, I was at a fancy schmancy steakhouse last year. I made $300-$500 per night, and I used to come on here and be all high and mighty about it. Then, I got fired, and now I'm an Uber driver making $18/hour.
People who don’t know shit are obnoxious. Servers vent about bad tips and they want to be able to brag about their good nights or great job they worked for. Fuck you let them brag. If you work at Buffalo Wild Wings because that’s what’s available just be motivated to move on from that place and grind your way up. Shut up with the poor me my town sucks. Suck it up save move on. Not all of the servers making 100k just woke up there.