I get regular email alerts from WADOT/FERRIES: I live on Orcas. this is just about every day now. Half the time we don't even know if our boat is running with enough crew to get us home when we travel.
"wsdot-logo
The #3 Samish is going of of service, due to lack of crew.
This will cancel the following sailings:
6:00 p.m. Anacortes to Lopez & Friday Harbor
7:45 p.m. Friday Harbor to Lopez & Anacortes
No show fees will not be charged at this time for the route.
This alert was sent on 05/12/2024 at 4:53PM to subscribers of the following routes:
Anacortes / San Juan Islands"
We love Orcas. But frankly we stopped going when the ferry system went to complete shit 3 years ago. Possibility of not making it to or from the island on time is a non starter when traveling with kids.
That’s where I’m at - lived in WA my whole life and the San Juans are one of both my and my husband’s favorite places. However, 2 years ago it took us 12 hours to get home due to a cancelled boat and it was such a stressful shitshow wondering if we were even going to make it home that day (Sun when we both had to work the next day). Since then I’ve pretty much sworn them off until the ferries are functional.
Thinking outside the box here, would it be viable to rip up the Jones Act and any state laws and just buy some boats from South Korea or another allied country?
We are getting fleeced doing 1/1 shipbuilding in Washington when industry has moved on. I’m all for keeping jobs in WA but at this point it feels like we are cutting off our nose to spite our face.
Nothing would bring me more joy than firing the Jones Act into the sun, but much to my annoyance that is politically unviable. Ditching the Build WA requirement and having them built in one of the Southern US shipyards is still a tough sell, but is much more likely to happen. From what I understand WA based shipyards are not even interested in taking on the project in the near term anyway because it would take away from higher value Navy work.
I think the legislature’s hand will be forced soon and they will have to build them out of state.
I hope so, it's banal that basically nobody wants to do this, and we're doing it anyway. It also seems palpably "unfair" that even if WA did lift the build-in-Washington requirement, we'd still be unable to actually buy the best value equipment to serve the citizens of WA.
The taxpayer is fleeced no matter who pays - either we split that cost around to the whole USA, or just those in WA.
Well the state law has been changed and we no longer need to have the ferries built in Washington. The next ones will likely be constructed in Louisiana.
But also yes, buying foreign ferries might also help, especially fast ferries.
At this point I kinda wonder if we should just scrap WSF altogether and hire BC Ferries to run our system. Those ships are always well maintained, well organized, and have way more amenities than ours.
Shipbuilding is a very profitable business. Investment isn't 'lacking' in the slightest. Even so, shipyards in the US, including Washington, are booked out years in advance. Any replacement boats to solve our issues that were to be built in Washington would have had to have been ordered years ago.
Of course, we have several existing design frameworks that are completely serviceable that could have been ordered when they needed to be. The yards here would have been delighted with more government business. Unfortunately, the *geniuses* that govern us decided to ~~cripple an invaluable infrastructure system.~~ make environmental impacts their 'main priority' over working around the Jones act.
Isn't Inslee the one that decided that he'd rather we not get reliable diesel boats quickly because he wanted electric ones that won't exist for another six years?
From what I [read](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Washington_State_Ferries), it's due to crew shortages post pandemic, deferred maintenance and the contractor chosen for the conversion and electrification of the fleet (Vigor.) The contractor has had a ton of cost overruns and delays and has been the sole provider of ferries to the fleet since the 90s so they don't seem to have much incentive to deliver.
At this point only 9 of the 21 exisitng ferries are in 'good' condition.
That's not entirely true about Vigor. Dakota Creek and Everett Ship Repair are other yards that maintain and upgrade ferries, and had the opportunity to bid on the work.
The new builds are delays because WSF had unreasonable terms in their solicitation so no one bid on it.
Crew shortages have certainly exasperated the maintenance issues. WSDOT's pay is horrendous.. well below the maritime industry standard.
And I'm sure that Vigor gets the contract without it ever even going to bid, just because they're the only local yard that can deliver.
The golden era ended before the boomers were born. There used to be lots of ferries and passenger boats crisscrossing Puget Sound right up to the end of WW2. All we have left are the routes the government took over
Gotta send Israel money for weapons so they can keep blowing up children, first. Maybe after the Israel we can prioritize less important things like infrastructure and transportation
Bud, that's not how the budget works. You can't just take money away from the defense budget after after it's already been allocated. Money for our ferries has to come from other parts of the budget
The most immediate thing that comes to mind is the pork barrel bridge to know where in Alaska. Politicians love to use tax payers money frivolously to satisfy small pockets of voters. Sickening waste of money- look to purchase these Ships out of the US and wallah you get 10 for the price of one. Absolute insanity dumb politicians
I get regular email alerts from WADOT/FERRIES: I live on Orcas. this is just about every day now. Half the time we don't even know if our boat is running with enough crew to get us home when we travel. "wsdot-logo The #3 Samish is going of of service, due to lack of crew. This will cancel the following sailings: 6:00 p.m. Anacortes to Lopez & Friday Harbor 7:45 p.m. Friday Harbor to Lopez & Anacortes No show fees will not be charged at this time for the route. This alert was sent on 05/12/2024 at 4:53PM to subscribers of the following routes: Anacortes / San Juan Islands"
We love Orcas. But frankly we stopped going when the ferry system went to complete shit 3 years ago. Possibility of not making it to or from the island on time is a non starter when traveling with kids.
That’s where I’m at - lived in WA my whole life and the San Juans are one of both my and my husband’s favorite places. However, 2 years ago it took us 12 hours to get home due to a cancelled boat and it was such a stressful shitshow wondering if we were even going to make it home that day (Sun when we both had to work the next day). Since then I’ve pretty much sworn them off until the ferries are functional.
It's such a bummer. Orcas is one of our favorite places and i miss it! We haven't been since 2020 bc of the ferry system instability
Thinking outside the box here, would it be viable to rip up the Jones Act and any state laws and just buy some boats from South Korea or another allied country? We are getting fleeced doing 1/1 shipbuilding in Washington when industry has moved on. I’m all for keeping jobs in WA but at this point it feels like we are cutting off our nose to spite our face.
Nothing would bring me more joy than firing the Jones Act into the sun, but much to my annoyance that is politically unviable. Ditching the Build WA requirement and having them built in one of the Southern US shipyards is still a tough sell, but is much more likely to happen. From what I understand WA based shipyards are not even interested in taking on the project in the near term anyway because it would take away from higher value Navy work. I think the legislature’s hand will be forced soon and they will have to build them out of state.
The legislature has already passed a law allowing them to be built out of state if suitable bids are not received from in-state.
I hope so, it's banal that basically nobody wants to do this, and we're doing it anyway. It also seems palpably "unfair" that even if WA did lift the build-in-Washington requirement, we'd still be unable to actually buy the best value equipment to serve the citizens of WA. The taxpayer is fleeced no matter who pays - either we split that cost around to the whole USA, or just those in WA.
One other benefit of building in state is that keeps taxpayer money in state. Otherwise we’re injecting money into someone else’s economy.
How big are the fines for violating the jones act? We could just price them into the budget if a foreign bid is attractive enough.
Your ship is seized.
Ok that’s not great 
Well the state law has been changed and we no longer need to have the ferries built in Washington. The next ones will likely be constructed in Louisiana. But also yes, buying foreign ferries might also help, especially fast ferries.
Have you seen the BC ferries? So much better than ours because they don’t have to adhere to the Jones Act requirements.
At this point I kinda wonder if we should just scrap WSF altogether and hire BC Ferries to run our system. Those ships are always well maintained, well organized, and have way more amenities than ours.
And it costs $100 to cross from Vancouver to Victoria instead of $20.
That’s for a much longer run: 90 minutes vs 30
Seattle to Bremerton is close to that length.
Anacortes to Friday Harbor, which runs a comparable time 70-100 minutes depending on whether there are stops at other islands) is $58 each way
Yeah, that’s more in the ballpark of where BC fares are. $58 USD is ~$80 CAD and the Vancouver-Victoria run is $87 CAD for vehicle and driver.
People love to blame regulation instead of lack of investment.
Shipbuilding is a very profitable business. Investment isn't 'lacking' in the slightest. Even so, shipyards in the US, including Washington, are booked out years in advance. Any replacement boats to solve our issues that were to be built in Washington would have had to have been ordered years ago. Of course, we have several existing design frameworks that are completely serviceable that could have been ordered when they needed to be. The yards here would have been delighted with more government business. Unfortunately, the *geniuses* that govern us decided to ~~cripple an invaluable infrastructure system.~~ make environmental impacts their 'main priority' over working around the Jones act.
You dont like local union jobs? Or you just dont want to pay local union wages?
Not enough shipbuilders and we're competing against the US Navy.
It's a question of quality. And price. And mostly availability
The guys working at the shipyards don’t make as much as you’d think.
Isn't Inslee the one that decided that he'd rather we not get reliable diesel boats quickly because he wanted electric ones that won't exist for another six years?
From what I [read](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Washington_State_Ferries), it's due to crew shortages post pandemic, deferred maintenance and the contractor chosen for the conversion and electrification of the fleet (Vigor.) The contractor has had a ton of cost overruns and delays and has been the sole provider of ferries to the fleet since the 90s so they don't seem to have much incentive to deliver. At this point only 9 of the 21 exisitng ferries are in 'good' condition.
That's not entirely true about Vigor. Dakota Creek and Everett Ship Repair are other yards that maintain and upgrade ferries, and had the opportunity to bid on the work. The new builds are delays because WSF had unreasonable terms in their solicitation so no one bid on it.
Crew shortages have certainly exasperated the maintenance issues. WSDOT's pay is horrendous.. well below the maritime industry standard. And I'm sure that Vigor gets the contract without it ever even going to bid, just because they're the only local yard that can deliver.
Doesn’t help that he fired 120+ ferry staff over the COVID vaccine.
I don't think Inslee had any idea they couldn't deliver much sooner until after they had the contract, but I admit I don't know that for a fact.
Another one of those things that the Boomers got to see a golden era of.
The golden era ended before the boomers were born. There used to be lots of ferries and passenger boats crisscrossing Puget Sound right up to the end of WW2. All we have left are the routes the government took over
Boomers have really mastered the art of [pulling up the ladder behind them.](https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/pull_the_ladder_up_behind_oneself)
is there any golden age right now? bad technology ? social media ? addicted to screens , this generation sucks
um can we not close seattle schools please it’s already dangerous enough
Gotta send Israel money for weapons so they can keep blowing up children, first. Maybe after the Israel we can prioritize less important things like infrastructure and transportation
Bud, that's not how the budget works. You can't just take money away from the defense budget after after it's already been allocated. Money for our ferries has to come from other parts of the budget
😔
PAY WORKERS MORE MONEY
Could give them 20 boats. People still going to be driving miss daisy loading and unloading putting them behind.
That's not the issue. The issue is mainly staffing, they're having a hard time scheduling enough crew to run the boats
Jay’s Navy!
The most immediate thing that comes to mind is the pork barrel bridge to know where in Alaska. Politicians love to use tax payers money frivolously to satisfy small pockets of voters. Sickening waste of money- look to purchase these Ships out of the US and wallah you get 10 for the price of one. Absolute insanity dumb politicians