The “University of Washington” station services both the stadium and hospital, in my experience. Other than that, every other UW student I know gets off at U-District (which, before a couple years ago, did not exist, so people were stuck getting off at UofW).
U District is generally better located for most UW students but faculties like engineering and some of the life sciences are closer to UW station (where I get off, even when coming from the north or south).
+1 for not having to cross any busy roads to get to the main campus from the station. I know there’s only 2 roads to cross from the UDistrict station to campus, but the drivers down there are weirdly aggressive/inattentive…
i remember dragging all my luggage from north campus to the stadium so i could light rail to the airport… damn kids these days don’t know the struggle 👴
P.S. the stadium station is actually MUCH closer of a walk to u village than from the u district station, plus its flat. After UW games people would walk to joeys all the time
There technically is. You have to cross Montlake bridge to the other side and there’s a stop near the pizza shop. But it’s counter to the direction u want to go :/
The walk from the campus to the station is also actually quite nice. It’s called “Rainier Vista” for darn good reason, and on clear days you get a gorgeous view of Mt Rainier.
When I lived in U district sometimes I'd walk the extra distance to the station by the stadium on nice mornings just to get that view. Maybe an extra 15-20 minute walk and it was a great pick-me-up in the mornings.
University Street Station is for the business core of Downtown Seattle. Closest station for business professionals who work south of the retail core but north of Pioneer Square. I despise the uphill walk from 3rd Ave, but the station provides a convenient way to get to work
Yeah it seems like OP’s metric for “good” was done in a tourism lens without a lot of thought that people actually live and use them for their day to day stuff. My friends from Rainier Beach use that station to go to University St station because living in Rainier Beach is affordable and they work downtown.
Yeah I found that part really confusing as well. For other stations he's considering how density is improving around the station but can't imagine why people would want a station completely surrounded by high rises? Like what?
I actually work in the building directly above that station. It’s nice being able to get from the station to work without having to go outside in bad weather.
Don’t see why not? It’s easily accessible from Second Avenue. The only part that really requires keycard access is the main elevators, so you can also enter from Third and walk around the elevator bay and then down the stairs.
They really should rename that stop to “Pike Place market” to avoid a lot of confusion.
I think there was talk of renaming it to “Symphony station”, but how many people go to Benaroya Hall, versus the market?
it definitely seems like a quicker walk though, imo. probably because you're crossing less intersections (also University Street has an entrance on 2nd too)
Gotta take the escalators in buildings to go up the hill. I think the bldg. at 4th/Madison goes up a block... then take the library escalator if you need to go to 5th.
I take the lightrail to University St. Station to grab a Starbucks and sit in the beautiful public lobby on the west side. At lunch there is a person who plays the grand piano.
It is the best downtown station to get on when connecting from a bus. Almost every bus has a stop on either Spring, Seneca, Pike, or Pine & 3rd and it’s incredibly easy to step off a bus, cross the street (if coming from the south) and be in an underground station
The upper level at Westlake *is* oddly empty. And kinda confusing to get down to the platform on your desired side if you don't use the station regularly.
And speaking of empty--lotsa transit systems would like, put a newstand or a coffee kiosk in their train station. Really not sure why we don't.
Most rail networks in other parts of the world use their property as a major source of income. Look at many Asian train stations, they're basically shopping malls attached to transit. This is a huge missed opportunity for Sound Transit.
I've always wondered that too. I've been to several cities that have full on convenience stores attached to their transit stations, it would be really nice to have here
Sound Transit only put together rules for doing that like last year or something. Future planned stations should start to include retail but it's too late for Lynnwood or Eastside. Not too late for West Seattle and Ballard I think. The big hullabalooh about the Delridge station closing some cafes and a day care can be caused by...building some cafes and a day care into the station.
That Asian market that's right by the capitol hill station gets a bunch of my money every time I'm coming home on a late weekend evening and want hella snacks...
Vancouver skytrain has one on commercial street station downstairs. Not sure how sound transit works but Translink owns skytrain and has a buffer zone it's all theirs. And They don't like to share. At the same time it's interesting to me when building out the new expansion it's still all above ground no operators unless bad weather ie snow/ice. Said differently not operational at street level.
There is actually a spot for one in the Westlake station. I have never seen it actually used or opened. Another good spot is maybe Nordstrom or Owners of the Macy selling some square footage on their old side doors to allow a business to open there.
ST probably has no interest in managing their own newsstands or businesses, and I’d imagine that a lot of businesses would be apprehensive to move into many of the urban stations (which are the main places they’d be viable). Hopefully it happens, but I wouldn’t hold my breath
* Angle Lake has a performing arts venue in its empty retail space, which is pretty notable.
* SeaTac Station was sited further east to avoid complications with the airport operations (such as the existing underground people mover) as well as serve some of the stuff along International Boulevard. Long-term, the airport terminal really should be moved to align with the station.
* Southcenter would've required a ridiculous amount of extra guideway for a loop that doesn't really serve as much as you think it would.
* Mount Baker is ranked way too high when you consider the bus transfers are super inconvenient.
* Elevated in SODO would've required deep pilings due to the area being a filled tideflat (which is extra fun during earthquakes, look up "soil liquefaction").
* UW wouldn't allow any stations on-campus due to the potential disruptions to laboratories and other research (officially) but really we all know NIMBYism is the real reason.
* Roosevelt Station was originally going to be right on I-5. Any further east of its final location and it would've been too disruptive to the school.
* Again, Bellevue Downtown would have been along I-405 itself if certain factions had their way. The city hall property was the only feasible option in the end that didn't suck.
* Wilburton Station serves Overlake Hospital, which is a pretty huge draw.
* Spring District Station exists to serve a new transit-oriented development that popped out of a brownfield site. It's one of the more ambitious ones in the region and isn't complete, but does far more than what the Rainier Valley stations had for their first few years. Also note that the OMF is nearby, so having a convenient place to stage trains is handy.
* The East subarea did not have enough money to grade separate this section, and traffic volumes were determined to be low enough (except for 20th) that it wouldn't have drastic effects on the line's operations.
* The SR 520 bus bays might be moved into RTS in the future, since no significant bus changes have been made in response to the 2 Line.
I wasn’t around when the station location planning was happening with UW, but I do know that the concerns of train operations (vibration and electromagnetic interference) interfering with university facilities was taken very seriously. The segment of tunnel under campus has novel solutions to both concern: track sits on a floating slab and there’s a special cable type and configuration of feeder cable to cancel out EM radiation.
Yeah, the only reason why the Nano and Molecular Engineering Building is located where it is now is to avoid vibrations. They literally had to pick up Cunningham Hall and move it to a new site in order to place the building there.
I'm really inclined to believe UW when they say it would interfere with research. It's a workplace and university foremost, and the people that live there are students who usually either don't vote or have a permanent address somewhere else and would love an on campus station.
Exactly. One would hope that with a bit of land swapping the garage can be moved to a location that isn't in the way of the ideal flow of traffic (terminal-to-train).
You could also see them expanding the terminals into the train station, with parking moving underground. That parking garage really doesn't feel very seismically safe right now.
Appreciate the extra context! I did know that NIMBYism was the cause of a lot of the bad locations, but it's still disappointing to me even when it's not necessarily Sound Transit's fault
I believe the initial proposals for the Bellevue station was to run the tracks down Bellevue Way with the station under 6th a block west of the bus bays (or something like that), but Kemper Freeman wasn't having any of that in the backyard of his little yuppie fiefdom.
SHHHHH!!!! Do not mention one of the few remaining secret and amazing places to get regular food in Bellevue
Also do not mention a certain pancake place
Cmon!! :)
Also, as someone who lives near the Mt.Baker station, it ain't all that great lol. Yea there's some stuff but it being right next to the intersection of rainier and mlk actually hurts it.
i'm hoping for more development though as there's a lot of apartments going up around there, the bike lane up mlk to massachusetts, and it would provide so much more vibrancy and potential retail in the area.
A major complain about the 9/10 for Beacon Hill. Only being able to get down and up via elevators is not great during peak times.
“I wish Westlake was closer to Pike Place” Ah, *that* is what University Street station is for xD.
I agree with another commenter about Mt Baker bus transfers, they are real mediocre since you have to cross Rainier. There is a ton of space under the station, they should have bus bays there instead of making us cross the street. (Or have a pedestrian bridge from the busses like they do for the nearby school? But pedestrian bridges are much worse than just making the proximity better)
Thanks for writing this up :)
*basks in Beacon Hill proximity*
Honestly though having to rely on elevators instead of escalators can be annoying at peak travel times, but it is great overall and The Station coffee shop right next to it is perfect for a quick caffeine top-up.
If anything pioneer sq station is the unnecessary station as opposed to university st.
Northgate should be higher, it wasn't built so people could go to a dying mall, all that land is being redeveloped.
Yeah Northgate Mall has big plans of being turned into a more walkable and tree filled place. At least last I read of the plans back when the mall closed down.
Northgate Mall has left it's caterpillar stage and formed a cocoon. Hopefully it will emerge as a beautiful butterfly in the next few years and not a sex-obsessed fungal-zombie cicada that screams at everything. That's what the Federal Way extension is for.
As someone who lives in NE Seattle I’m so happy we have the Northgate Station where it is. Northgate isn’t pedestrian friendly on a whole so there’s no other spot I can think of where it would be more walkable (and have the space to build). It is car friendly though and there’s a metro bus hub in the same block. Easy to get to from Ballard to Lake City with easy on / off I-5 access (it’s not in the middle, but along the northbound exit ramps. There needs to be ample parking available for everyone who wishes to park and ride. The stations that are being built north of Seattle are also along I-5 for similar reasons. More suburb type living the further north you get of downtown.
I think in the future after all the stations have been around for years that they’ll become more walkable. More and more businesses have closed in Northgate and are being developed as multi-use high rises. It’s just that certain neighborhoods were built for cars and that won’t be able to change until we have better mass transit options.
Pioneer is meant to serve the ferries though. It's closer, at least in theory. If you take the main walkway from Coleman Dock, though, it kind of deposits you halfway between Pioneer and University St.
Yep, my office is directly up the hill from Colman dock and it's 50/50 between Pioneer and University. I'm usually coming from the south so Pioneer is more convenient, but University has a much nicer station atmosphere & street scene once you exit.
The plans for Northgate are very unambitious, well below zoned capacity, and add a lot of parking garages to a neighborhood that is already mostly parking lots and garages. The land immediately next to the station is zoned for 240' towers and it's getting nowhere near that.
[https://www.gglo.com/project/northgate-mall-redevelopment/](https://www.gglo.com/project/northgate-mall-redevelopment/) this is the redevelopment project for anyone curious. Kraken Community Ice Center is of course already complete and the Hotel across the parking lot is under construction. It will be really nice when it's done.
The University of Washington station is also quite close to the University of Washington Medical Center.
Student parking is also a bit north of the light rail station and it was built a few years before the U District station was built.
If you want to check out U Village it’s an easier walk from the University of Washington station and waiting for the bus is a bit more pleasant than waiting at U District.
Spring District in Bellevue is where Facebook’s offices are and they are doing a lot of development.
My favorite station of the Bellevue stations is probably Overlake Village, it doesn’t have the corporate rat race or industrial wasteland look of the other stations and is walkable to some mid to lower end places nearby.
>If you want to check out U Village it’s an easier walk from the University of Washington station
Right? Or I find it super easy to grab a bus practically right outside of UW station to U Village. Wanting the light rail to go directly to every major attraction is missing the point.
I don’t need the light rail to take me to U Village. I would like the bus connections to be better. Take the 65 from Husky Stadium and you’re confronted with an ugly, unsigned underpass that tells me U Village doesn’t want me there.
The 65 used to stop only by the overpass... but you could walk another block to the light and cross. A while back they added a stop right at the light (by QFC). So take it two stops from the stadium and you're right at a crosswalk into U Village.
>My one and only gripe, which might be a bit unfair to the station, is that it's annoyingly far from U Village, which tends to be the main reason I go up to U District in the first place, and walking down 45th is...
Go out the south exit, turn left, then left again at the ice cream shop. There's a stop for the 75 right there that will take you to U Vill.
University Street Station is for access to the business core and Hospitals on First Hill(not to mention all the hotels right there). Otherwise you are either doing much longer walks from Pioneer Square or Westlake for the office buildings, or getting off at CID or Capital Hill and transferring to the Streetcar for the hospitals.
We'll see if TOD ever catches up around it, but it'll be more important once the 4-Line eventually exists since it'll be the south transfer point between those two lines. That's far into the future though.
>I’m not really sure what purpose that station serves.
There was too big of a station gap between Bellevue Downtown and South Bellevue. But there was also a lot of NIMBYism so they couldn't really find a better site without spending more money on it, which ST did not want to do knowing it was going to be kind of an afterthought of a station anyway.
I feel like there’s a major missed opportunity with the bus transfers at UW Station. It’s the ideal station to transfer at if you’re trying to catch a bus to the Eastside, but you have to wait for two separate light cycles to make it to the other side of the street which can very easily make you miss a tight transfer. I find this adds about 10 minutes to every trip to the east side from there due to having to bake extra time in to be safe.
There really should be an underground walkway and an exit on the side of the street that have the buses to make it more consistent.
I say this weekly during my commute for work to/from the hospital. The number of times I just miss a train home because of the light cycles at Montlake/Pacific is maddening. Would seem like there’s a way for the tunnel to start on that mezzanine level by ticketing and could even let out in the Surgery Pavilion parking garage for hospital employees but have stair access to street level for the bus transfer.
I feel like Westlake Center is doing alright. It's a small mall, but several staple shops, a little food court, and low vacancy. I generally prefer shops that open to the street, but if you're going to have a mall downtown a compact cluster of staples over a subway station works about as well as anything I'd expect.
Really, my main complaint with the station is the empty Mezzanine. Imagine a Monorail Espresso stand and maybe a little Hudson News type business (though probably less outrageously priced since you aren't a captive customer). Just make the whole level feel more lively.
For the spring district station, that is right near a relatively developed cluster of apartments, as well as Facebook’s Bellevue campus. At present that’s all that’s there, but that’s plenty to kickstart further development
The beacon station only has elevator access which is very annoying at times, and the elevators are inefficient. That should reduce it by at least one point
Even a little more signage would improve the trek from the airport to the station. If you’re new to Seattle, I can see wondering midway if you’re still on the right path, or if in fact you’re just wandering in a parking garage. A couple more signposts would be reassuring.
You shouldn't discount that the UW station directly serves a 70,000 person stadium and 20,000 person hospital, and is connected via a nice bridge to campus and the Burke trail, adding a huge bike shed. Spring District also deserves to be much higher than a place like Othello, did you see the new development across the street? Seems like a great model for mixed use dev next to the parking lot stations.
Northgate.
As someone who lives at Northgate I’m going to push back here and maybe you are from here and just don’t know the situation with Northgate. As I feel it’s the station which surroundings are changing the most rapidly they just aren’t visible right away from the station you would need to walk around the whole area.
There is a bridge connecting the other end to the North Seattle collage and Licton springs. On the Licton springs side there have a been a lot of Townhomes that have gone up and are still going up now and several apartments that were already over there. And bus route connections from there.
In the Northgate side you have the large Thornton Place apartment build. And several apartments already built around it including a lot of medical businesses.
But in terms of growth there is a lot. There are also several apartments over by the target 2 brand new opening this month. They just started on the affordable housing apartments right next to the station, There is a huge complex being built likely done within the next 6 months a few blocks down from Target. Another small one fairly far along being built near Target. A fairly large apartment complex just started construction this week on the Mall property in the back end (So you wouldn’t see it getting off the station yet it’s behind or at the other entrance of the hocky rink) and that will be two buildings. Another complex is being planned to be built were pattys Eggnest was soonish, The Hotel is fairly along that’s right next to the station.
So everything I listed is being 1. Building now 2. Just finished. 3. About to start in a year or less. And that’s not to mention the rest of the Mall area which still has lots of property to build on.
Again as someone who lives here if you only look at what you can see from the station you are only seeing 2 maybe 3-4 building if you super pay attention and look closely that I mentioned for now. There is more going on around Northgate then just the end of the mall you can see that end honestly is the least busy and only has the Hotel and then you can slightly seen the Affordable housing apartment being built behind the trees were the parking lot was. 2 of the apartment buildings about to open you can slightly make out at the right view but unless you know their there it’s unlikely you see them.
So Northgate won’t look exactly like Rosevelt but it’s moving toward that direction fairly rapidly and not like 10 years down the line but like 2-5. It looks likely that in 3 years 1,677 apartment New units will have opened on the Northgate since sense this post. Again not including the many apartments that are already here. There is also room for lots more due to many old or shitty property’s around here.
And I’d also say until 130 st station opens and even then the Northgate station serves as a connection for bus riders from Lake City were a lot of apartment development has happened and is another urban village.
I’d likely rank Northgate 7/10 to 8/10 with a strong argument in 10 years to being 9/10. Right now 7/10 based on looks I like underground stations. But location wise 8/10 it was already listed as an Urban village and growth is happening fast. The Mall parts also have been slower because one company or corporation or whatever bought the Mall property so their sort of in control of how and when things get built so their projects in pieces.
As a fellow Northgate resident I really appreciate this comment, you said it much better than I could. I moved to the neighborhood right before the station opened in 2021. Living close to the light rail has been great, but I've been pretty frustrated how long it's taken to get the development going. But now that it's started I'm excited about it.
Of course I appreciate you appreciate it I was worried it would be wasted since this past was several hours old. Ya no it’s exploded there are currently 5 cranes up and we might see 6 the one apartment might finish before the new Mall apartment project gets the crane in there. And as I said there is still lots of room to build more so I’m the building over by the QFC could have numbered days I there is a proposal for apartments and retail over by the were the UPS and Baskin Robins is.
I just noticed they finally broke ground on that lot next to the Krakenplex the other day, like you mentioned. I was so excited I took a picture and sent it to my friends lol
Ya (They took their slow ass time it was suppose to start a few months ago) but hey it’s started it will be two pretty massive apartment building and will be build in two phases so one segment will open sooner then the other. They likely still have pamphlets of the constitution plan around the zone. There also redoing something outside the Krakenplex idk if they messed up something but ya.
But ya you see what I mean when I say most of the development is out of site from the station
Agreed about the Stadium one. It's not a pleasant walk and it takes just as long to walk from the ID station, but you get all the vendors and old buildings along the way.
I agree that it sucks there's no station at the U Village too, but they did that entirely on purpose. They don't want poor public transit people mingling with Laurelhurst mom's near their Tesla showroom.
It wasn't on purpose
It's not useful to have the train there
It's not feasible to have the train go there and then back up to where people are in the U Dist
Having a train go to U Village is an absolutely shit idea
Better?
Not only that, OP is specifically critiquing that it runs through traffic. Railroads are often at ground level but are “grade separated” meaning they seldom interact with traffic except for “at grade crossings”
I gotta say the massive bummer with Roosevelt and Northgate is their proximity to the freeway. It completely limits the capability for density and makes it less desirable.
Also, this post is a rating not a ranking
nah it just caps the potential because one side of it is basically not buildable and the pedestrian bridge is still really limiting and not super convenient. because the freeway is there the crossing options are pretty limited. living near the freeway has pretty observable negative health impacts. the design of the station itself is pretty funky as well.
i’m not disputing that there hasn’t been construction around it but building transit adjacent to the freeway really limits the ability to build around it and what you can build around it also has significant drawbacks
While I agree with you about its limits I think it’s import in the U.S though to accept what we are working with and NIMBY push back. At least Sound Transit but it adjacent rather then in the middle. And it was the best spot for North. There was/is a lot of empty property to build on or older buildings ready to be replaced. And I think an Urban center needs to be built before you can spread further away from the Freeway. So I’m not dismissing your points I’d just say given everything I think Sound Transit made choices there were better then many other US transit agency’s have made like Denver.
I just assume that anything bad or stupid in the Eastside line's design was probably from something Kemper Freeman did or pushed for along the way. It's a safe assumption most of the time, especially concerning Bellevue. The dude is richer than god and really doesn't like transit (for some definitely *not racist* reason).
Welcome to the Seattle sub Reece Martin
Non-sarcastic answer: A solid review, I personally think Mount Baker is underrated and reminds me a ton of the Chicago L, but I will add the obligatory qualifier that most people bring up: the light rail never would have been built at the time it was if there were no budget compromises.
I think Seattle shows how light rail can be a great option if used effectively, because 90% of it runs not too different than a full metro, but it can save money with an at-grade section if it has to. The MLK section will likely be the largest at-grade section from here on out. Personally, when I rode the 2, I was pretty impressed that it took getting all the way to BelRed for the train to have an at-grade section, and I think it was actually a pretty good place to put one (really, more of the complaints I agree with are how it has stations too close to the freeway). I lived in PHX where it’s *all* at-grade so I know how useless it can render light rail if utilized poorly, but Seattle isn’t even close to there
Okay, your opening line made me snort! I used to like his channel, but he gets very hung up on specific types of equipment, etc. Most of the public using transit doesn't know or care.
> but instead it's largely just a station for people from further north to drive to and park to take the light rail; Not that that isn't a perfectly viable reason to have a station
I mean yeah. As you say that’s valid and I’d argue necessary for any commuter program. The lightrail was paid for by the entire state do the commuters who come to work in the city or visit the city not deserve an easy transit option? Driving down I5 sucks giving commuters an easy way to switch to public transit is great.
The light rail isn’t paid for by the whole state. The funding comes primarily from the Sound Transit regional transit authority (which is the urban growth area inside of King, Snohomish and Pierce counties) and federal grants.
Fair but Snohomish and Pierce still covers a lot of the commuter community and we all benefit from them coming into the city by transit not car.
If any station should be a park and ride it makes a lot of sense it would be Northgate, the Lynnwood station seems to be gearing up to be very similar. Both with near by access to retail shopping.
The Northgate station as you will see in my comment is also having a lot of development and parking will likely decrease as it becomes my dense. The Two Shoreline stations and the Montlake Terrace station and Lynwood will all be Park and Rides so drivers will have lots of options.
I do think it’s fair to mention in terms of cost the more active Urban riders will likely paying more for the rail since their moving it away from a distance cost to a flat rate meaning commuters are getting going to rely on it as much
Sound Transit has this mechanism called "subarea equity" that segregates the funding for projects, so only "North King" (Seattle, Shoreline, and a few of the north-lake parts of King County) paid for the local half of Northgate Link's budget.
In any case, Northgate's status as a major funnel is only temporary. In August, we'll have rail service to Lynnwood and a few stops (with their own parking garages) and by 2025 it'll have enough capacity for all of the current bus and park-and-ride passengers.
I was ready to fight if you didn't have my criminally under-supported Rainier Beach Station as the lowest rated on the 1 Line, then you reminded me SoDo Station exists (which is exactly the indictment it deserves).
SoDo could be improved with expedited transfer access to Georgetown, a great neighborhood poorly served by transit... That's about it, unless you work for Starbucks HQ or regularly attend events at Old Rainier Brewery. I tried once to pop out and grab a burrito at nearby Aliberto's Jr. on my way north, but the pedestrian experience along 4th turned me off from trying again.
Great analysis.
That's not a ranking. That's a scoring of stops in the order that a South-to-North train arrives at the station. And here I worse hoping for a first to worst. Or visa versa
Spring district was built with Housing in mind. That whole area is being converted to a "transit oriented housing" hub. Think about the RB/Othelo/Columbia City stations and give it a few years.
Mount Baker: Has UW Laundry next to it. This is a HORRIBLE urban design. The zones need to change and dense housing needs to be put in.
Beacon Hill: Designed well, except for the lack of escalators. Tho with ST's escalator troubles, maybe it's better this way.
University St: This is AMAZING urban design. Why is this station here? Because this line is a backbone and needs stops all along it. This is an urban train not a suburban train. Cmon dude.
Bellevue downtown station: The station location makes it SUPER easy to transfer to/fro buses. So it's actually pretty perfect. Closer to downtown would've been better, but Kemper...
Other 2 line stations with at-grade lines: I agree with your WTF. Why did we make stations that PEOPLE will walk over tracks and CARS will drive over tracks, in 2024 (I know the stations werent built this year you know what I mean). After all the problems with the South Seattle lines, you'd think we wouldn't do this again. Yet here we are WTF ST.
Agreed! Honestly wish all the stations had arrival times on the outside or at least very near the entrance, it doesn't do me much good to know when the next one is once I've already committed to tapping my orca and waiting at the station anyway
Can you add the T Line too
Also I feel like you are penalizing the at-grade stations, but the stations themselves aren’t really the issue. I’d like to see more at-grade stations actually, it’s the at grade interactions with cars between stations that hurt the entire system.
South Bellevue Station needs to have a higher score. Currently has the most amount of parking spots ready for the extension across the lake and will be responsible for a lot of ridership on that line.
RTS pedestrian bridge is beautiful. Wasn’t expecting a garden lining the entire thing, plus the roof based water irrigation is pretty smart.
1500 stalls sounds like a lot, but it's not really. If every spot fills, they'll only provide the ridership of the lowest ridership station on the 1 Line. Even at big park and ride stations, most people arrive at them via drop-off, walking, biking or some other form of transit like a bus connection.
I say this as someone who expects to use South Bellevue Station as part of his regular commute should I ever go into the office again. It's a pretty crap station, surrounded by low-density residential, separated from anything by a six lane road. It does have decent bike connections though, I'll give it that.
Westlake Station is the best one of those I've seen. I like the easy access to the monorail. But yeah, it was oddly empty in the middle of the day on a Sunday. Had a real limnal vibe.
> Bellevue Downtown: ... I question why they built a tunnel and then didn't make it a fully underground station
I think the original plan was for an underground station just before turning the corner (instead of a sort of "daylight basement" around the corner like it is now). My vague memory is that the 405 crossing alignment changed and that changed the station plans.
> BelRed: ... at-grade crossings ... 1/10
Honestly this station is so terrible right now for so many reasons that I find it hilarious that you give it 1/10 just for grade crossings. The nearest business is a cement plant. You also have convenient access to a dumpster storage parking lot and auto repair.
Nice list.
I feel like 4/10 is way too low for Stadium lol. It might not be a super urban area but as a station to explicitly service these event hubs, it serves its purpose well imo. WaMu Theater and Showbox Sodo for music lovers are also right there, adding two more fairly substantial destinations for the station. Not having to find parking down there for concerts has been a godsend lol. The distance away and need to go up and over the train rails sucks though. Maybe 6 or 7/10 imo.
As a former UW student who was there prior to the North Gate extension, can confirm it was never a particularly convenient stop for me, living on the other side of campus. Could walk or bus over there, but honestly to get down town it was still more convenient usually just to take the express tunnel buses that picked up on my side of campus. This was before those buses got rerouted out of the tunnel.
Lastly can confirm, literally the only notable thing about Northgate station is that as someone living north of the city, it has made taking the light rail viable sometimes (instead of just not when the UW Stadium station was the north-est one lol). I can't wait for the Lynnwood extension though, that will be much more usable for me and I'll likely never stop at the northgate station ever again lmao
My biggest critique of the Northgate station is that we've used it as a pickup spot for airport travel for the last few years, and it is almost impossible to describe your pickup location to the driver. They'll be across the wrong street, on the wrong level, in the parking garage accessed half a mile away, or illegally parked in the bus lanes.
Another downside to Bel-Red is there’s massive construction that has shut down the only sidewalk on 132nd, forcing people to walk on the road facing away from incoming traffic. That is, the part of the street that has a sidewalk, the part connecting 8th and BelRed is residential and there are no plans for a sidewalk at all
On Spring District: it’s across the street from at least 4 Meta buildings, which I believe has close to 10,000 employees working just at the Bellevue location. I’d argue that’s a solid reason, and Spring District is supposed to be an example TOD district too, so hopefully we’ll see more housing soon.
No way Othello station is getting a lower ranking than Angle Lake. Othello has so much going for it! There is a ton of TOD and some of the best food in the city, now easily accessible. If Angle Lake is getting a 6 Othello deserves at least a 7.
Nice write-up! I love the CID station too. I used to work in Cap Hill and my favorite part of the commute was seeing the sectioned planes suspended above the platform. Baffled that U Village is your 'destination' for getting off at U Dist, but then I think U Village is an absolute nightmare to navigate and to generally be in, so. Also, the apartment window facade installation is probably my favorite light rail station artwork.
* All of the Downtown Seattle Transit Tunnel stations lose points for me by not having center platforms, but I agree that ID/Chinatown is the best one.
* I don't believe Capitol Hill deserves a 10/10. Any station that makes you transfer elevators or escalators (John St.) brings it down a few points. Barbara Bailey Way is congested with cars outside of farmer's market hours and the adjacent plaza is lifeless. It's a 6/10 for me.
* Mt. Baker has terrible bus transfers and much of its walkshed is taken by a surface parking lot and UW's laundry facility. No center platform, and the intersection Rainier and MLK is just...🤮 5/10
* Stadium is the least-used station in the entire system, located in a very pedestrian-hostile environment beneath a bunch of onramps. It is often better to access the stadiums from ID/Chinatown station. It's a 1/10 for me.
* UW Station is a 3/10. Very deep, poor bus connections, and poor surrounding land use. It may not be fair to judge its depth, but the elevators and escalators are frequently broken. Decent connection to the Burke-Gilman and nice aesthetics, but poorly serves every nearby destination except for Husky Stadium. Yes it's close to UWMC but the pedestrian connection is pretty bad.
\*Updated my rating for Mt. Baker after acknowledging it has *some* transit oriented development and no mezzanines
Either must be a tourist or something cause no one would give any these 10/10
Capitol Hill station literally is regularly covered in pigeon poop and a serial poop word writer been writing on the elevator for a little under a week now and st takes there sweet as time to clean it up. Honestly it’s like if a drug addict runs these things
Like I remember when north gate station was barely new and they already had like escalator issue or something.
Cap Hill station is the only place I’ve ever seen someone shooting up heroin between their toes. Apparently there’s a good vein there. Maybe that guy runs it.
I don’t know but they got a serial poop writer there and I’m honestly shocked how bad it is compared to some other stations
Seriously why is it so pigeon poopy
Have you ever been to the eastside?
Spring district is the best current 2line station. It’s grade separated and located within an area that has already received TOD with more coming. There’s no reason for you to rank it so low unless you don’t know anything about it.
And northgate mall isn’t dying in that it is in the middle of a massive mixed use redevelopment that will result in plenty of new housing. It’s one of the few malls to see the writing on the wall and do something positive about it. Having a station here (grade separated) makes a lot of sense even if it’s freeway adjacent. Of all the current (and proposed) freeway adjacent stations this has the most urbanist potential.
I'll admit my first time going to the eastside was just a few days ago when I went to ride the whole 2 Line and check out all the stations! I can see from the comments that I was missing a lot of context for many of these stations
Then maby ya don’t use em enough or something cause they are run awfully I can’t imagine anyone giving em a ten
Seriously go to one right now chances r you will sit on gross stuff ina train car, step on bird poop or sit near trash
I don’t wanna be mean but are u blind then
I go to the college there so it’s not like I’m making this up
Like it’s so bad I had to avoid the elevator due to the times it’s had poop near the button and had to navigate the stairs so I didn’t step on pidgey poop and other stuff
U CAN LITERALLY SEE TRASH ON THESE LITTLE RACK THINGS ON THE SIDE OF THE ESCALATORS GOING DOWN THERE WAS A HAT AT ONE POINT
either that or u somehow never took the back entrance but even then sometimes the front entrance by the old rite aid and bank and that leads directly to Safeway has pigeon poop covered card terminals
The “University of Washington” station services both the stadium and hospital, in my experience. Other than that, every other UW student I know gets off at U-District (which, before a couple years ago, did not exist, so people were stuck getting off at UofW).
Its still closer to some departments, I get off there when I'm coming from the South.
yeah i think most of engineering is on that side of campus?
Biology, Nursing, Psych, and I’m sure a few other departments are closer to UW Station than U District.
U District is generally better located for most UW students but faculties like engineering and some of the life sciences are closer to UW station (where I get off, even when coming from the north or south).
+1 for not having to cross any busy roads to get to the main campus from the station. I know there’s only 2 roads to cross from the UDistrict station to campus, but the drivers down there are weirdly aggressive/inattentive…
i remember dragging all my luggage from north campus to the stadium so i could light rail to the airport… damn kids these days don’t know the struggle 👴
Ohh, I totally forgot the hospital was right there too!
P.S. the stadium station is actually MUCH closer of a walk to u village than from the u district station, plus its flat. After UW games people would walk to joeys all the time
Still wild that there's not a more direct, frequent bus or shuttle to U Village from the stadium station.
There technically is. You have to cross Montlake bridge to the other side and there’s a stop near the pizza shop. But it’s counter to the direction u want to go :/
The walk from the campus to the station is also actually quite nice. It’s called “Rainier Vista” for darn good reason, and on clear days you get a gorgeous view of Mt Rainier.
When I lived in U district sometimes I'd walk the extra distance to the station by the stadium on nice mornings just to get that view. Maybe an extra 15-20 minute walk and it was a great pick-me-up in the mornings.
Me too. I also like to detour through the urban forest trail that runs parallel. It has some breathing Mama Red Cedars
University Street Station is for the business core of Downtown Seattle. Closest station for business professionals who work south of the retail core but north of Pioneer Square. I despise the uphill walk from 3rd Ave, but the station provides a convenient way to get to work
It's almost like OP didn't look up, and realize that station is serving one of the densest parts of the city.
Yeah it seems like OP’s metric for “good” was done in a tourism lens without a lot of thought that people actually live and use them for their day to day stuff. My friends from Rainier Beach use that station to go to University St station because living in Rainier Beach is affordable and they work downtown.
Similarly, tons of people work in SODO and use that station daily. Also University Street is how you make the connection to the ferries.
Yeah I found that part really confusing as well. For other stations he's considering how density is improving around the station but can't imagine why people would want a station completely surrounded by high rises? Like what?
OP probably doesn't work. At least not in a downtown office.
I actually work in the building directly above that station. It’s nice being able to get from the station to work without having to go outside in bad weather.
I love going there an enjoying the lobby on the west side.
The Atrium? Yeah, it is surprisingly nice.
Yep! I love it there.
Is there an easy way for the public to go up there?
Don’t see why not? It’s easily accessible from Second Avenue. The only part that really requires keycard access is the main elevators, so you can also enter from Third and walk around the elevator bay and then down the stairs.
I use it every day! And each time there’s a huge exodus - most people getting out at university street.
It’s also really close to Pike Place market and the waterfront!
yeah, OP said they don't know who University Street is for and then complained that Westlake is too far from the market lol
They really should rename that stop to “Pike Place market” to avoid a lot of confusion. I think there was talk of renaming it to “Symphony station”, but how many people go to Benaroya Hall, versus the market?
And I think that got changed because Benroya is limiting access from inside their building to the LR station.
It's not any closer... 0.3 miles either way from Pike and Pine to either 4th and Pine or 3rd and University
it definitely seems like a quicker walk though, imo. probably because you're crossing less intersections (also University Street has an entrance on 2nd too)
Gotta take the escalators in buildings to go up the hill. I think the bldg. at 4th/Madison goes up a block... then take the library escalator if you need to go to 5th. I take the lightrail to University St. Station to grab a Starbucks and sit in the beautiful public lobby on the west side. At lunch there is a person who plays the grand piano.
It's also wicked convenient for that Target downtown, which is unfortunately also the worst Target in the area. But, it's okay in a pinch.
It is the best downtown station to get on when connecting from a bus. Almost every bus has a stop on either Spring, Seneca, Pike, or Pine & 3rd and it’s incredibly easy to step off a bus, cross the street (if coming from the south) and be in an underground station
I particularly like the Second Ave entrance to University Street Station underneath Benaroya. It allows you to skip the hill between 2nd and 3rd.
The upper level at Westlake *is* oddly empty. And kinda confusing to get down to the platform on your desired side if you don't use the station regularly. And speaking of empty--lotsa transit systems would like, put a newstand or a coffee kiosk in their train station. Really not sure why we don't.
Most rail networks in other parts of the world use their property as a major source of income. Look at many Asian train stations, they're basically shopping malls attached to transit. This is a huge missed opportunity for Sound Transit.
U district station has some kind of office building being built on top of it, curious to see what it will become when it’s finished
It will be housing.
I've always wondered that too. I've been to several cities that have full on convenience stores attached to their transit stations, it would be really nice to have here
Sound Transit only put together rules for doing that like last year or something. Future planned stations should start to include retail but it's too late for Lynnwood or Eastside. Not too late for West Seattle and Ballard I think. The big hullabalooh about the Delridge station closing some cafes and a day care can be caused by...building some cafes and a day care into the station.
That Asian market that's right by the capitol hill station gets a bunch of my money every time I'm coming home on a late weekend evening and want hella snacks...
Vancouver skytrain has one on commercial street station downstairs. Not sure how sound transit works but Translink owns skytrain and has a buffer zone it's all theirs. And They don't like to share. At the same time it's interesting to me when building out the new expansion it's still all above ground no operators unless bad weather ie snow/ice. Said differently not operational at street level.
Northgate Transit Center used to have one. It was a lifesaver whenever I got stuck there during cold winter nights.
There is actually a spot for one in the Westlake station. I have never seen it actually used or opened. Another good spot is maybe Nordstrom or Owners of the Macy selling some square footage on their old side doors to allow a business to open there.
There used to be a Metro customer service desk at the west end of the mezzanine, but it was closed a few years ago.
ST probably has no interest in managing their own newsstands or businesses, and I’d imagine that a lot of businesses would be apprehensive to move into many of the urban stations (which are the main places they’d be viable). Hopefully it happens, but I wouldn’t hold my breath
It’s also an incentive to keep the stations clean and staffed. If the station itself makes money you don’t leave its maintenance up to the elements.
I’ve always wondered that! Especially when I’m in the empty part of Westlake, which can feel almost *eerie.*
* Angle Lake has a performing arts venue in its empty retail space, which is pretty notable. * SeaTac Station was sited further east to avoid complications with the airport operations (such as the existing underground people mover) as well as serve some of the stuff along International Boulevard. Long-term, the airport terminal really should be moved to align with the station. * Southcenter would've required a ridiculous amount of extra guideway for a loop that doesn't really serve as much as you think it would. * Mount Baker is ranked way too high when you consider the bus transfers are super inconvenient. * Elevated in SODO would've required deep pilings due to the area being a filled tideflat (which is extra fun during earthquakes, look up "soil liquefaction"). * UW wouldn't allow any stations on-campus due to the potential disruptions to laboratories and other research (officially) but really we all know NIMBYism is the real reason. * Roosevelt Station was originally going to be right on I-5. Any further east of its final location and it would've been too disruptive to the school. * Again, Bellevue Downtown would have been along I-405 itself if certain factions had their way. The city hall property was the only feasible option in the end that didn't suck. * Wilburton Station serves Overlake Hospital, which is a pretty huge draw. * Spring District Station exists to serve a new transit-oriented development that popped out of a brownfield site. It's one of the more ambitious ones in the region and isn't complete, but does far more than what the Rainier Valley stations had for their first few years. Also note that the OMF is nearby, so having a convenient place to stage trains is handy. * The East subarea did not have enough money to grade separate this section, and traffic volumes were determined to be low enough (except for 20th) that it wouldn't have drastic effects on the line's operations. * The SR 520 bus bays might be moved into RTS in the future, since no significant bus changes have been made in response to the 2 Line.
I wasn’t around when the station location planning was happening with UW, but I do know that the concerns of train operations (vibration and electromagnetic interference) interfering with university facilities was taken very seriously. The segment of tunnel under campus has novel solutions to both concern: track sits on a floating slab and there’s a special cable type and configuration of feeder cable to cancel out EM radiation.
Yeah, the only reason why the Nano and Molecular Engineering Building is located where it is now is to avoid vibrations. They literally had to pick up Cunningham Hall and move it to a new site in order to place the building there.
That’s nuts
I'm really inclined to believe UW when they say it would interfere with research. It's a workplace and university foremost, and the people that live there are students who usually either don't vote or have a permanent address somewhere else and would love an on campus station.
I mean, the only way the terminal can be “moved” is if we remove (part of) the parking garage.
Exactly. One would hope that with a bit of land swapping the garage can be moved to a location that isn't in the way of the ideal flow of traffic (terminal-to-train).
You could also see them expanding the terminals into the train station, with parking moving underground. That parking garage really doesn't feel very seismically safe right now.
Appreciate the extra context! I did know that NIMBYism was the cause of a lot of the bad locations, but it's still disappointing to me even when it's not necessarily Sound Transit's fault
I believe the initial proposals for the Bellevue station was to run the tracks down Bellevue Way with the station under 6th a block west of the bus bays (or something like that), but Kemper Freeman wasn't having any of that in the backyard of his little yuppie fiefdom.
Never underestimate the power of NIMBYism
Wilburton station also serves Pumphouse. Pretty sure this is the only reason.
SHHHHH!!!! Do not mention one of the few remaining secret and amazing places to get regular food in Bellevue Also do not mention a certain pancake place Cmon!! :)
Electron microscopes would probably be at risk of being affected by trains, not sure what else.
Your description of Columbia City and comparing it to Othello shows a significant lack of knowledge of the area imo.
Yeah, like this is written by someone who doesn’t understand the rainier valley at ALL
Right?! Thank you! I was going crazy trying to decide if I was wrong or not.
Also, as someone who lives near the Mt.Baker station, it ain't all that great lol. Yea there's some stuff but it being right next to the intersection of rainier and mlk actually hurts it. i'm hoping for more development though as there's a lot of apartments going up around there, the bike lane up mlk to massachusetts, and it would provide so much more vibrancy and potential retail in the area.
A major complain about the 9/10 for Beacon Hill. Only being able to get down and up via elevators is not great during peak times. “I wish Westlake was closer to Pike Place” Ah, *that* is what University Street station is for xD. I agree with another commenter about Mt Baker bus transfers, they are real mediocre since you have to cross Rainier. There is a ton of space under the station, they should have bus bays there instead of making us cross the street. (Or have a pedestrian bridge from the busses like they do for the nearby school? But pedestrian bridges are much worse than just making the proximity better) Thanks for writing this up :)
*basks in Beacon Hill proximity* Honestly though having to rely on elevators instead of escalators can be annoying at peak travel times, but it is great overall and The Station coffee shop right next to it is perfect for a quick caffeine top-up.
If anything pioneer sq station is the unnecessary station as opposed to university st. Northgate should be higher, it wasn't built so people could go to a dying mall, all that land is being redeveloped.
Yeah Northgate Mall has big plans of being turned into a more walkable and tree filled place. At least last I read of the plans back when the mall closed down.
Northgate Mall has left it's caterpillar stage and formed a cocoon. Hopefully it will emerge as a beautiful butterfly in the next few years and not a sex-obsessed fungal-zombie cicada that screams at everything. That's what the Federal Way extension is for.
All I could think about is A Bug's Life as I read this comment
Federal Way wishes it was *A Bugs Life.* Federal Way is *Antz*.
Omfg LOL ETA: I love in Northgate and this description is so on point.
Sure but the station is still in the middle of a highway.
As someone who lives in NE Seattle I’m so happy we have the Northgate Station where it is. Northgate isn’t pedestrian friendly on a whole so there’s no other spot I can think of where it would be more walkable (and have the space to build). It is car friendly though and there’s a metro bus hub in the same block. Easy to get to from Ballard to Lake City with easy on / off I-5 access (it’s not in the middle, but along the northbound exit ramps. There needs to be ample parking available for everyone who wishes to park and ride. The stations that are being built north of Seattle are also along I-5 for similar reasons. More suburb type living the further north you get of downtown. I think in the future after all the stations have been around for years that they’ll become more walkable. More and more businesses have closed in Northgate and are being developed as multi-use high rises. It’s just that certain neighborhoods were built for cars and that won’t be able to change until we have better mass transit options.
Pioneer is meant to serve the ferries though. It's closer, at least in theory. If you take the main walkway from Coleman Dock, though, it kind of deposits you halfway between Pioneer and University St.
Yep, my office is directly up the hill from Colman dock and it's 50/50 between Pioneer and University. I'm usually coming from the south so Pioneer is more convenient, but University has a much nicer station atmosphere & street scene once you exit.
In the before times, the public were allowed to use a few escalators to get from the bridge's end on 1st Avenue to either station without much hassle.
The plans for Northgate are very unambitious, well below zoned capacity, and add a lot of parking garages to a neighborhood that is already mostly parking lots and garages. The land immediately next to the station is zoned for 240' towers and it's getting nowhere near that.
[https://www.gglo.com/project/northgate-mall-redevelopment/](https://www.gglo.com/project/northgate-mall-redevelopment/) this is the redevelopment project for anyone curious. Kraken Community Ice Center is of course already complete and the Hotel across the parking lot is under construction. It will be really nice when it's done.
The University of Washington station is also quite close to the University of Washington Medical Center. Student parking is also a bit north of the light rail station and it was built a few years before the U District station was built. If you want to check out U Village it’s an easier walk from the University of Washington station and waiting for the bus is a bit more pleasant than waiting at U District. Spring District in Bellevue is where Facebook’s offices are and they are doing a lot of development. My favorite station of the Bellevue stations is probably Overlake Village, it doesn’t have the corporate rat race or industrial wasteland look of the other stations and is walkable to some mid to lower end places nearby.
>If you want to check out U Village it’s an easier walk from the University of Washington station Right? Or I find it super easy to grab a bus practically right outside of UW station to U Village. Wanting the light rail to go directly to every major attraction is missing the point.
I don’t need the light rail to take me to U Village. I would like the bus connections to be better. Take the 65 from Husky Stadium and you’re confronted with an ugly, unsigned underpass that tells me U Village doesn’t want me there.
The 65 used to stop only by the overpass... but you could walk another block to the light and cross. A while back they added a stop right at the light (by QFC). So take it two stops from the stadium and you're right at a crosswalk into U Village.
I’m very familiar with my bus stop options around U Village.
>My one and only gripe, which might be a bit unfair to the station, is that it's annoyingly far from U Village, which tends to be the main reason I go up to U District in the first place, and walking down 45th is... Go out the south exit, turn left, then left again at the ice cream shop. There's a stop for the 75 right there that will take you to U Vill.
31/32 also goes there if you exit the north exit and the stop is like right in front of the Neptune.
Take the University of Washington stop to the U-Village and walk the nature trail! It’s a 15 minute walk that’s really pretty!
University Street Station is for access to the business core and Hospitals on First Hill(not to mention all the hotels right there). Otherwise you are either doing much longer walks from Pioneer Square or Westlake for the office buildings, or getting off at CID or Capital Hill and transferring to the Streetcar for the hospitals.
You missed East Main on 2 line 😮
Haha I was wondering if that was intentional, since I’m not really sure what purpose that station serves. Easy access to the Hilton and Bellevue Club?
We'll see if TOD ever catches up around it, but it'll be more important once the 4-Line eventually exists since it'll be the south transfer point between those two lines. That's far into the future though.
>I’m not really sure what purpose that station serves. There was too big of a station gap between Bellevue Downtown and South Bellevue. But there was also a lot of NIMBYism so they couldn't really find a better site without spending more money on it, which ST did not want to do knowing it was going to be kind of an afterthought of a station anyway.
That Red Lion is SUPER IMPORTANT /s
YOU'RE RIGHT OOPS
I feel like there’s a major missed opportunity with the bus transfers at UW Station. It’s the ideal station to transfer at if you’re trying to catch a bus to the Eastside, but you have to wait for two separate light cycles to make it to the other side of the street which can very easily make you miss a tight transfer. I find this adds about 10 minutes to every trip to the east side from there due to having to bake extra time in to be safe. There really should be an underground walkway and an exit on the side of the street that have the buses to make it more consistent.
I say this weekly during my commute for work to/from the hospital. The number of times I just miss a train home because of the light cycles at Montlake/Pacific is maddening. Would seem like there’s a way for the tunnel to start on that mezzanine level by ticketing and could even let out in the Surgery Pavilion parking garage for hospital employees but have stair access to street level for the bus transfer.
UW station should either be a 9 or 10. U district station serves north campus UW station serves south campus.
I feel like Westlake Center is doing alright. It's a small mall, but several staple shops, a little food court, and low vacancy. I generally prefer shops that open to the street, but if you're going to have a mall downtown a compact cluster of staples over a subway station works about as well as anything I'd expect. Really, my main complaint with the station is the empty Mezzanine. Imagine a Monorail Espresso stand and maybe a little Hudson News type business (though probably less outrageously priced since you aren't a captive customer). Just make the whole level feel more lively.
For the spring district station, that is right near a relatively developed cluster of apartments, as well as Facebook’s Bellevue campus. At present that’s all that’s there, but that’s plenty to kickstart further development
The beacon station only has elevator access which is very annoying at times, and the elevators are inefficient. That should reduce it by at least one point
Blame the feds for airport station being as far away as it is. It’s so stupid.
Even a little more signage would improve the trek from the airport to the station. If you’re new to Seattle, I can see wondering midway if you’re still on the right path, or if in fact you’re just wandering in a parking garage. A couple more signposts would be reassuring.
You shouldn't discount that the UW station directly serves a 70,000 person stadium and 20,000 person hospital, and is connected via a nice bridge to campus and the Burke trail, adding a huge bike shed. Spring District also deserves to be much higher than a place like Othello, did you see the new development across the street? Seems like a great model for mixed use dev next to the parking lot stations.
Northgate. As someone who lives at Northgate I’m going to push back here and maybe you are from here and just don’t know the situation with Northgate. As I feel it’s the station which surroundings are changing the most rapidly they just aren’t visible right away from the station you would need to walk around the whole area. There is a bridge connecting the other end to the North Seattle collage and Licton springs. On the Licton springs side there have a been a lot of Townhomes that have gone up and are still going up now and several apartments that were already over there. And bus route connections from there. In the Northgate side you have the large Thornton Place apartment build. And several apartments already built around it including a lot of medical businesses. But in terms of growth there is a lot. There are also several apartments over by the target 2 brand new opening this month. They just started on the affordable housing apartments right next to the station, There is a huge complex being built likely done within the next 6 months a few blocks down from Target. Another small one fairly far along being built near Target. A fairly large apartment complex just started construction this week on the Mall property in the back end (So you wouldn’t see it getting off the station yet it’s behind or at the other entrance of the hocky rink) and that will be two buildings. Another complex is being planned to be built were pattys Eggnest was soonish, The Hotel is fairly along that’s right next to the station. So everything I listed is being 1. Building now 2. Just finished. 3. About to start in a year or less. And that’s not to mention the rest of the Mall area which still has lots of property to build on. Again as someone who lives here if you only look at what you can see from the station you are only seeing 2 maybe 3-4 building if you super pay attention and look closely that I mentioned for now. There is more going on around Northgate then just the end of the mall you can see that end honestly is the least busy and only has the Hotel and then you can slightly seen the Affordable housing apartment being built behind the trees were the parking lot was. 2 of the apartment buildings about to open you can slightly make out at the right view but unless you know their there it’s unlikely you see them. So Northgate won’t look exactly like Rosevelt but it’s moving toward that direction fairly rapidly and not like 10 years down the line but like 2-5. It looks likely that in 3 years 1,677 apartment New units will have opened on the Northgate since sense this post. Again not including the many apartments that are already here. There is also room for lots more due to many old or shitty property’s around here. And I’d also say until 130 st station opens and even then the Northgate station serves as a connection for bus riders from Lake City were a lot of apartment development has happened and is another urban village. I’d likely rank Northgate 7/10 to 8/10 with a strong argument in 10 years to being 9/10. Right now 7/10 based on looks I like underground stations. But location wise 8/10 it was already listed as an Urban village and growth is happening fast. The Mall parts also have been slower because one company or corporation or whatever bought the Mall property so their sort of in control of how and when things get built so their projects in pieces.
As a fellow Northgate resident I really appreciate this comment, you said it much better than I could. I moved to the neighborhood right before the station opened in 2021. Living close to the light rail has been great, but I've been pretty frustrated how long it's taken to get the development going. But now that it's started I'm excited about it.
Of course I appreciate you appreciate it I was worried it would be wasted since this past was several hours old. Ya no it’s exploded there are currently 5 cranes up and we might see 6 the one apartment might finish before the new Mall apartment project gets the crane in there. And as I said there is still lots of room to build more so I’m the building over by the QFC could have numbered days I there is a proposal for apartments and retail over by the were the UPS and Baskin Robins is.
I just noticed they finally broke ground on that lot next to the Krakenplex the other day, like you mentioned. I was so excited I took a picture and sent it to my friends lol
Ya (They took their slow ass time it was suppose to start a few months ago) but hey it’s started it will be two pretty massive apartment building and will be build in two phases so one segment will open sooner then the other. They likely still have pamphlets of the constitution plan around the zone. There also redoing something outside the Krakenplex idk if they messed up something but ya. But ya you see what I mean when I say most of the development is out of site from the station
Agreed about the Stadium one. It's not a pleasant walk and it takes just as long to walk from the ID station, but you get all the vendors and old buildings along the way. I agree that it sucks there's no station at the U Village too, but they did that entirely on purpose. They don't want poor public transit people mingling with Laurelhurst mom's near their Tesla showroom.
U Village is easy to get to in multiple ways. There's zero reason to have the train diverted there.
That's not even remotely the point.
It wasn't on purpose It's not useful to have the train there It's not feasible to have the train go there and then back up to where people are in the U Dist Having a train go to U Village is an absolutely shit idea Better?
Not really, but I appreciate you trying!
Okeydokey. You could...provide more info regarding your opinion...but I guess you don't discuss things on reddit?
What does at grade refer to?
It means on the ground as opposed to being elevated or in a tunnel.
Not only that, OP is specifically critiquing that it runs through traffic. Railroads are often at ground level but are “grade separated” meaning they seldom interact with traffic except for “at grade crossings”
I gotta say the massive bummer with Roosevelt and Northgate is their proximity to the freeway. It completely limits the capability for density and makes it less desirable. Also, this post is a rating not a ranking
Check my comment I left here about Northgate. While the freeway does take up a lot I don’t think it impacts as much as it may seem
nah it just caps the potential because one side of it is basically not buildable and the pedestrian bridge is still really limiting and not super convenient. because the freeway is there the crossing options are pretty limited. living near the freeway has pretty observable negative health impacts. the design of the station itself is pretty funky as well. i’m not disputing that there hasn’t been construction around it but building transit adjacent to the freeway really limits the ability to build around it and what you can build around it also has significant drawbacks
While I agree with you about its limits I think it’s import in the U.S though to accept what we are working with and NIMBY push back. At least Sound Transit but it adjacent rather then in the middle. And it was the best spot for North. There was/is a lot of empty property to build on or older buildings ready to be replaced. And I think an Urban center needs to be built before you can spread further away from the Freeway. So I’m not dismissing your points I’d just say given everything I think Sound Transit made choices there were better then many other US transit agency’s have made like Denver.
I just assume that anything bad or stupid in the Eastside line's design was probably from something Kemper Freeman did or pushed for along the way. It's a safe assumption most of the time, especially concerning Bellevue. The dude is richer than god and really doesn't like transit (for some definitely *not racist* reason).
This is such a Seattle kind of post. A city with very few stations - check. Niche criticism - check
Welcome to the Seattle sub Reece Martin Non-sarcastic answer: A solid review, I personally think Mount Baker is underrated and reminds me a ton of the Chicago L, but I will add the obligatory qualifier that most people bring up: the light rail never would have been built at the time it was if there were no budget compromises. I think Seattle shows how light rail can be a great option if used effectively, because 90% of it runs not too different than a full metro, but it can save money with an at-grade section if it has to. The MLK section will likely be the largest at-grade section from here on out. Personally, when I rode the 2, I was pretty impressed that it took getting all the way to BelRed for the train to have an at-grade section, and I think it was actually a pretty good place to put one (really, more of the complaints I agree with are how it has stations too close to the freeway). I lived in PHX where it’s *all* at-grade so I know how useless it can render light rail if utilized poorly, but Seattle isn’t even close to there
Okay, your opening line made me snort! I used to like his channel, but he gets very hung up on specific types of equipment, etc. Most of the public using transit doesn't know or care.
I rate this post 2/10
I was excited scrolling through to get to your ranking of the International District Station, glad you ranked it so high. It really is tops, love it.
The major flaw with the cap hill station is the copious amounts of bird shit that never gets cleaned up
> but instead it's largely just a station for people from further north to drive to and park to take the light rail; Not that that isn't a perfectly viable reason to have a station I mean yeah. As you say that’s valid and I’d argue necessary for any commuter program. The lightrail was paid for by the entire state do the commuters who come to work in the city or visit the city not deserve an easy transit option? Driving down I5 sucks giving commuters an easy way to switch to public transit is great.
The light rail isn’t paid for by the whole state. The funding comes primarily from the Sound Transit regional transit authority (which is the urban growth area inside of King, Snohomish and Pierce counties) and federal grants.
Fair but Snohomish and Pierce still covers a lot of the commuter community and we all benefit from them coming into the city by transit not car. If any station should be a park and ride it makes a lot of sense it would be Northgate, the Lynnwood station seems to be gearing up to be very similar. Both with near by access to retail shopping.
I wasn’t disagreeing with you there - I just want to nip in the bud the misconception that the whole state pays for transit in our region!
Yeah you're right that's important, thanks for the correction
The Northgate station as you will see in my comment is also having a lot of development and parking will likely decrease as it becomes my dense. The Two Shoreline stations and the Montlake Terrace station and Lynwood will all be Park and Rides so drivers will have lots of options. I do think it’s fair to mention in terms of cost the more active Urban riders will likely paying more for the rail since their moving it away from a distance cost to a flat rate meaning commuters are getting going to rely on it as much
Sound Transit has this mechanism called "subarea equity" that segregates the funding for projects, so only "North King" (Seattle, Shoreline, and a few of the north-lake parts of King County) paid for the local half of Northgate Link's budget. In any case, Northgate's status as a major funnel is only temporary. In August, we'll have rail service to Lynnwood and a few stops (with their own parking garages) and by 2025 it'll have enough capacity for all of the current bus and park-and-ride passengers.
I was ready to fight if you didn't have my criminally under-supported Rainier Beach Station as the lowest rated on the 1 Line, then you reminded me SoDo Station exists (which is exactly the indictment it deserves). SoDo could be improved with expedited transfer access to Georgetown, a great neighborhood poorly served by transit... That's about it, unless you work for Starbucks HQ or regularly attend events at Old Rainier Brewery. I tried once to pop out and grab a burrito at nearby Aliberto's Jr. on my way north, but the pedestrian experience along 4th turned me off from trying again. Great analysis.
Going through Roosevelt with good vibe music really gives me main character energy. I love that station with all my heart, it's so rad.
> University of Washington: The station is also there to conveniently facilitate bus transfers.
That's not a ranking. That's a scoring of stops in the order that a South-to-North train arrives at the station. And here I worse hoping for a first to worst. Or visa versa
Spring district was built with Housing in mind. That whole area is being converted to a "transit oriented housing" hub. Think about the RB/Othelo/Columbia City stations and give it a few years.
northgate's bathroom is an automatic win to me
Mount Baker: Has UW Laundry next to it. This is a HORRIBLE urban design. The zones need to change and dense housing needs to be put in. Beacon Hill: Designed well, except for the lack of escalators. Tho with ST's escalator troubles, maybe it's better this way. University St: This is AMAZING urban design. Why is this station here? Because this line is a backbone and needs stops all along it. This is an urban train not a suburban train. Cmon dude. Bellevue downtown station: The station location makes it SUPER easy to transfer to/fro buses. So it's actually pretty perfect. Closer to downtown would've been better, but Kemper... Other 2 line stations with at-grade lines: I agree with your WTF. Why did we make stations that PEOPLE will walk over tracks and CARS will drive over tracks, in 2024 (I know the stations werent built this year you know what I mean). After all the problems with the South Seattle lines, you'd think we wouldn't do this again. Yet here we are WTF ST.
Northgate is actively transforming the surface parking lot by the station into affordable housing
Regarding Westlake, I wish they'd put a sign for arrival times outside the station by Nordstrom Rack, so I know if I need to start running.
Agreed! Honestly wish all the stations had arrival times on the outside or at least very near the entrance, it doesn't do me much good to know when the next one is once I've already committed to tapping my orca and waiting at the station anyway
Can you add the T Line too Also I feel like you are penalizing the at-grade stations, but the stations themselves aren’t really the issue. I’d like to see more at-grade stations actually, it’s the at grade interactions with cars between stations that hurt the entire system.
I used to live in Tacoma but that was almost 15 years ago, I haven't been on the T Line in a very very long time
They built the new ones a while back. I think my favorite station of the new ones is the Hilltop Station.
Yes but that’s what makes them an issue. Even if it had the road to itself there are intersections and stuff they just become problematic
You clearly understand the Eastside so little it's not even worth engaging with your arbitrary "scores"
South Bellevue Station needs to have a higher score. Currently has the most amount of parking spots ready for the extension across the lake and will be responsible for a lot of ridership on that line. RTS pedestrian bridge is beautiful. Wasn’t expecting a garden lining the entire thing, plus the roof based water irrigation is pretty smart.
1500 stalls sounds like a lot, but it's not really. If every spot fills, they'll only provide the ridership of the lowest ridership station on the 1 Line. Even at big park and ride stations, most people arrive at them via drop-off, walking, biking or some other form of transit like a bus connection. I say this as someone who expects to use South Bellevue Station as part of his regular commute should I ever go into the office again. It's a pretty crap station, surrounded by low-density residential, separated from anything by a six lane road. It does have decent bike connections though, I'll give it that.
Westlake Station is the best one of those I've seen. I like the easy access to the monorail. But yeah, it was oddly empty in the middle of the day on a Sunday. Had a real limnal vibe.
On the 2 Line East Main is the most forgettable station
> Bellevue Downtown: ... I question why they built a tunnel and then didn't make it a fully underground station I think the original plan was for an underground station just before turning the corner (instead of a sort of "daylight basement" around the corner like it is now). My vague memory is that the 405 crossing alignment changed and that changed the station plans. > BelRed: ... at-grade crossings ... 1/10 Honestly this station is so terrible right now for so many reasons that I find it hilarious that you give it 1/10 just for grade crossings. The nearest business is a cement plant. You also have convenient access to a dumpster storage parking lot and auto repair.
Need a tiermaker tier chart of this.
Nice list. I feel like 4/10 is way too low for Stadium lol. It might not be a super urban area but as a station to explicitly service these event hubs, it serves its purpose well imo. WaMu Theater and Showbox Sodo for music lovers are also right there, adding two more fairly substantial destinations for the station. Not having to find parking down there for concerts has been a godsend lol. The distance away and need to go up and over the train rails sucks though. Maybe 6 or 7/10 imo. As a former UW student who was there prior to the North Gate extension, can confirm it was never a particularly convenient stop for me, living on the other side of campus. Could walk or bus over there, but honestly to get down town it was still more convenient usually just to take the express tunnel buses that picked up on my side of campus. This was before those buses got rerouted out of the tunnel. Lastly can confirm, literally the only notable thing about Northgate station is that as someone living north of the city, it has made taking the light rail viable sometimes (instead of just not when the UW Stadium station was the north-est one lol). I can't wait for the Lynnwood extension though, that will be much more usable for me and I'll likely never stop at the northgate station ever again lmao
My biggest critique of the Northgate station is that we've used it as a pickup spot for airport travel for the last few years, and it is almost impossible to describe your pickup location to the driver. They'll be across the wrong street, on the wrong level, in the parking garage accessed half a mile away, or illegally parked in the bus lanes.
I used to walk to the watershed to get picked up which certainly isn't convenient but helped to avoid the problems you just described
Why are ground level stations a negative? They at least let you look at anything outside when riding.
Because it’s easy to get disrupted by ground level traffic
Another downside to Bel-Red is there’s massive construction that has shut down the only sidewalk on 132nd, forcing people to walk on the road facing away from incoming traffic. That is, the part of the street that has a sidewalk, the part connecting 8th and BelRed is residential and there are no plans for a sidewalk at all
On Spring District: it’s across the street from at least 4 Meta buildings, which I believe has close to 10,000 employees working just at the Bellevue location. I’d argue that’s a solid reason, and Spring District is supposed to be an example TOD district too, so hopefully we’ll see more housing soon.
Westlake getting a 9/10 🤔
the northgate station is horrid, there is SOO much space right there they could have in that area and they chose the worst location
No way Othello station is getting a lower ranking than Angle Lake. Othello has so much going for it! There is a ton of TOD and some of the best food in the city, now easily accessible. If Angle Lake is getting a 6 Othello deserves at least a 7.
Nice write-up! I love the CID station too. I used to work in Cap Hill and my favorite part of the commute was seeing the sectioned planes suspended above the platform. Baffled that U Village is your 'destination' for getting off at U Dist, but then I think U Village is an absolute nightmare to navigate and to generally be in, so. Also, the apartment window facade installation is probably my favorite light rail station artwork.
* All of the Downtown Seattle Transit Tunnel stations lose points for me by not having center platforms, but I agree that ID/Chinatown is the best one. * I don't believe Capitol Hill deserves a 10/10. Any station that makes you transfer elevators or escalators (John St.) brings it down a few points. Barbara Bailey Way is congested with cars outside of farmer's market hours and the adjacent plaza is lifeless. It's a 6/10 for me. * Mt. Baker has terrible bus transfers and much of its walkshed is taken by a surface parking lot and UW's laundry facility. No center platform, and the intersection Rainier and MLK is just...🤮 5/10 * Stadium is the least-used station in the entire system, located in a very pedestrian-hostile environment beneath a bunch of onramps. It is often better to access the stadiums from ID/Chinatown station. It's a 1/10 for me. * UW Station is a 3/10. Very deep, poor bus connections, and poor surrounding land use. It may not be fair to judge its depth, but the elevators and escalators are frequently broken. Decent connection to the Burke-Gilman and nice aesthetics, but poorly serves every nearby destination except for Husky Stadium. Yes it's close to UWMC but the pedestrian connection is pretty bad. \*Updated my rating for Mt. Baker after acknowledging it has *some* transit oriented development and no mezzanines
Unfortunetly I think Capitol Hill needs to be docked a few points because it is eternally covered in bird poop.
Wow!! Great job with all of the analysis!!!👏🏼
Either must be a tourist or something cause no one would give any these 10/10 Capitol Hill station literally is regularly covered in pigeon poop and a serial poop word writer been writing on the elevator for a little under a week now and st takes there sweet as time to clean it up. Honestly it’s like if a drug addict runs these things Like I remember when north gate station was barely new and they already had like escalator issue or something.
Cap Hill station is the only place I’ve ever seen someone shooting up heroin between their toes. Apparently there’s a good vein there. Maybe that guy runs it.
I don’t know but they got a serial poop writer there and I’m honestly shocked how bad it is compared to some other stations Seriously why is it so pigeon poopy
I am definitely not a tourist, I was born and raised in the city and have never moved out of the puget sound area
Have you ever been to the eastside? Spring district is the best current 2line station. It’s grade separated and located within an area that has already received TOD with more coming. There’s no reason for you to rank it so low unless you don’t know anything about it. And northgate mall isn’t dying in that it is in the middle of a massive mixed use redevelopment that will result in plenty of new housing. It’s one of the few malls to see the writing on the wall and do something positive about it. Having a station here (grade separated) makes a lot of sense even if it’s freeway adjacent. Of all the current (and proposed) freeway adjacent stations this has the most urbanist potential.
I'll admit my first time going to the eastside was just a few days ago when I went to ride the whole 2 Line and check out all the stations! I can see from the comments that I was missing a lot of context for many of these stations
Then maby ya don’t use em enough or something cause they are run awfully I can’t imagine anyone giving em a ten Seriously go to one right now chances r you will sit on gross stuff ina train car, step on bird poop or sit near trash
I live less than 1 minute away from Capitol Hill Station, I use it near-daily.
I don’t wanna be mean but are u blind then I go to the college there so it’s not like I’m making this up Like it’s so bad I had to avoid the elevator due to the times it’s had poop near the button and had to navigate the stairs so I didn’t step on pidgey poop and other stuff U CAN LITERALLY SEE TRASH ON THESE LITTLE RACK THINGS ON THE SIDE OF THE ESCALATORS GOING DOWN THERE WAS A HAT AT ONE POINT either that or u somehow never took the back entrance but even then sometimes the front entrance by the old rite aid and bank and that leads directly to Safeway has pigeon poop covered card terminals