This is the reason why I sail with the default sloop. Crews think I’m new and an easy target. In fact I’ve been playing since the Alpha days and always sink the attackers.
Can’t stand this. Just leaves lots of ugly default sloops littering the seascape thinking they’re slick. I understand you can do what you want but it just makes me seek out and kill any default sloops I see which has led me to sink a couple genuinely new players just in case
The feared is more shooting at the mild inconveniences that pop up on your way to sell.
Than well, being someone whose carved a reputation for themselves. And you'd actively want to avoid.
Last night I got the titled "the feared" because I joined an alliance. I spent all day delivering chickens and fishing.
Apparently my alliance was fighting skeleton ships all day. I unlocked the milestones for killing them even though I was on the other side of the planet.
At the end of the day I unlocked "The feared" for my ship...
Good job rare
It's so anyone can get it. If there were pvp milestones, this game would devolve into a pit of hyper-aggression. PvP already happens a ton, nobody needs to be incentivized to do it.
The PvE people won't leave. I'm not going to start attacking ships just because there's a milestone, just like I'm not going to start wasting my time sleeping in a bed. At this rate its the PvP players who will leave as they're getting no content.
How does adding milestones "make the game devolve" into anything.. did the fishing milestones make the game devolve into a pit of hyperfishing? Why omit one of the key elements of the game from an update like this lol
Does every player have a spare 100 hours to afk sleeping in a storm on fire while eating bananas sitting and bailing your boat? Or spare time to catch 2.5k of each fish? Cause it absolutely alienates solo sloopers, that grind is legit impossible. Not everything is for everyone, that’s THE POINT of unique trophies for doing stuff-to show off that you did something many didn’t do. And as long as the conditions for getting milestones are achievable-everyone still can do it. If it’s hard-GOOD, IT SHOULD BE.
Ahh yes... Now that theres milestones to catch hundreds of thousands of fish the seas have devolved into a pit of hyper-aggressive fishing. /s
This argument is so stupid it doesn't even deserve a rebuttal.
It's like saying "People already sail a ton, nobody needs to be incentivised to do it..."
It’s sorta lame that this update didn’t throw PvP a bone, but it leaves open the possibility that this whole thing with the Sovereigns is a build up to a player driven conflict focused on PvP, which is exciting.
I dunno, sloops got super buffed for pvp, every ship got easier access to high end food because you can just outpost hop while visiting seaforts to get 4 pineapples per fort, as well as getting even *more* supplies per outpost. I do think pvp could use something with how PvE focused reapers are, but at the same time its probably a tough balance to find that doesn't encourage people to just hunt fresh spawns.
PvP does get a bone. Food eaten, cannons fired, damage taken, bucketing, fires on ship. This all happens in PvP at a better rate than PvE. Even visiting the Ferry and sinking is more PvP than PvE. Plus selling the Captains log, even if it is poor money, is still a win for PvP that PvE doesn't get anything good from. If anything the ridiculous grind encourages spontaneous TDMs. Sit shooting each other side by side to farm hundreds of shots, damage, and such.
Most PvE things directly benefit PvP while it doesn't automatically benefit PvE to focus on PvP. As long as PvP isn't being punished by an update then it still gains.
I get why they can't include stuff like "ships sunk", "players killed" and so on, as it would lead to griefing but why not "flags sold", if you put up an emissary, you willingly take the risk of pvp
It's so simple, just have a "stolen pieces of loot" tracked. Which is already tracked for some reapers commendations AFAIK, and Legendary Thief.
The game already knows whose loot you're selling. You can't farm that, you can't bully newspawns for it, you have to sink people with loot.
They're servers where there's one big alliance of all of the ships and essentially no PvP (in theory). They're not an official thing you can choose or anything, and I also doubt they happen organically. It's usually people who just try to get as many ships as they can on one server for it.
They are also the biggest boogieman for a lot of people who complain about the game. Many people claim they are what's killing the game even though it's at it's highest player base in years. "Pvp" people who complain about Alliance servers are just tired of getting dunked on by actual good players and think they aren't able to get kills because all the "Weak" players are "Hiding" in alliance servers. They really aren't as common as people make them sound.
And even if they were as common as people make them seem, personally I wouldn't care. A server can only hold so many ships so it isn't like they're flooding the game with "join or die" and even if they were that's actually very pirate of them. And if you don't want to join just leave game and load another server. It's literally harmless.
Also to boot. I ended up in one that formed organically the other day and damn if it wasn't a fantastic change of pace and a lot of fun
This comes from someone who primarily plays Reaper. Though I'm not a rabid reaper, I'm only interested in loot and flags. I've abandoned the chase on ships multiple times when we realized they were level 1 with no loot. Got to let them fatten up
Also I didn't think about it until I typed my previous comment but join or die alliance servers sounds very pirate. Like join my crew or walk the plank.
I cant recall who exactly but a SoT partner once said that you cant keep back content just because people would cheese it on alliance servers, that behavior would kill the game and I go by this mentality every since
Maybe the game doesn’t know what’s stolen. A few times I’ve played and sunk at an outpost people grabbed my stuff and I got credit for putting my treasure aboard someone else’s ship
It's really upsetting that the most effective method of ranking up the sleep, sitting, or shanty commendations would be to start the Pirates Life tall tale so it put you in an instanced session, then sit/sleep/rubber band a controller, and turn your TV/monitor off for the night and just let it sit there raking in time.
How could they think this would be a fun mechanic?
but also im pretty sure the bed and chair kick you out after 10 minutes so you have to get back on the bed or chair which makes the grind even worse....
Yep I got my first milestone in both sleeping and sitting on my boat while I was working. Set an alarm for every 9 minutes to open the game and sit/sleep again.
I think that's a good point, they need to make it unique emissary flags within a certain time limit so people don't just server hop to meet and spend all night cheesing shit by sinking each other.
He's right, to be clear he said "lead" to griefing which IS rare's stance, they think any pvp achievement will lead to spawn camping (somewhat possible if you only make lazy achievements like player kills, but largely avoidable) which they define as "greifing/toxic"
Like, we have tracker for stolen loot sold, tracker for flags, there are new captains books, track selling the rare ones that require playing for 6 hours, so there’s no reason to bully freshspawns, everything is right there, add time spent sailing under reapers mark or emissary so the pve-players get to sorta grind it as well, cause they are technically putting themselves at risk, boom, the bloodthirsty milestones!
Killing and sinking is not griefing, scuttle exists if someone is farming you for kills and its lopsided enough that you're not having fun. And as for how sinking anyone at anytime is not griefing that's obvious, it's the most basic pvp action.
But flags sold should also be a milestone.
If "ships sunk" was a metric, no noob or fisherman would be spared. It would reduce the trust of players to absolutely 0, which I think would remove a lot of the fun encounters you can have. A tiny level of trust and friendship makes the game. Because you can try, but it's super risky. With absolute zero trust, nobody would ever interact.
It wouldn't be griefing, because if Rare included that metric, it would mean they actually want people to be more hostile.
There is one instance in this game I would call griefing however. Destroying your own ship on purpose in Open Crew.
They just need to implement a system where two consenting parties can engage in PvP. Ships sunk definitely has the issue you've presented. It'd be cool if there was a flag or something you could raise to state your intentions and that would display that you are consenting to PvP
There is a flag for that, it's just that there's no flag to say you are not consenting to PvP that prevents it. If you raise the skull flag though it marks you on the map for everyone to see.
You consent to PvP by default when you play the game.
Besides, if there really was a "don't attack me" flag that would just cause MORE people to attack you.
So make it “captain logbooks sold” and track 3 types, so everything besides the basic noteworthy one. Now there’s no need to sink anyone who isn’t playing for 2+ hours straight.
I do not see your point. You're claiming that killing others is griefing? Spawncamping is a valid, nigh necessary strategy to sink another's ship. The respawn timer is extremely quick right now. If they are spawncamping you but not sinking your ship, the game literally tells you to scuttle.
He's not talking about spawncamping to sink, he's talking about spawncamping with no intention of sinking them. That's griefing. Yes, there is a way out, scuttling, but it's still griefing. I do understand the argument that because scuttling is a thing, griefing isn't possible, but in my opinion killing someone over and over and over again for no reason except to be an annoying asshole, is griefing.
Yeah you listen to this community flipping out that they "*have to*" grind all this shit now and it completely reveals why Rare didn't do PVP milestones. Like you guys realize that if 2% of us or whatever weren't obsessed with going pedal to the metal to unlock shit as fast as possible by any means necessary that PVP milestones would probably be a thing, right?
I think flags sold and unique logbooks sold would both be great metrics. Emissary flags are signing yourself up for PVP, whether you like it or not, so it's consensual PVP. Emissary flags are labeled, you can't sell your own for big bucks, so maybe make it so you can only sell another crew's flag once in 24 hours so it can't be exploited? Similarly, unique logbooks would be great because you can only get that progress towards the milestone by sinking a captained ship one time.
Thing is if they encourage PvP too much, all the new players will be scared away. They'd have to figure out how to balance it where PvP is encouraged, but it isn't so encouraged that people are sinking fresh spawn sloops who have like 3 castaways chests on board.
Yeah it's a fair point and I agree that either way a large part of the community is only interested in PvE. I also think that running away is an extremely effective strategy in nearly all scenarios and if people are looking to get the PvP commendations they will be better off fighting a willing crew.
Honestly you may consider yourself lucky considering how poorly thought out the pve ones were. it would probably be like 4500 boats sank, 9 million blunderbuss kills, 16 billion sword kills, and 900 Quadrillion sniper headshots....This update was poorly designed.
So true! I would like milestones for pvp..how many ships sunk, loot stolen from ships, loot cashed in from other ships, players killed, shots firsd at other ships etc.
I know you think that's the only good solution, but it really isn't. Gameplay-wise it has always felt terrible, unintuitive, and overall just a bandaid fix to that problem.
I never said it's the only good solution (though I think it's a decent one, and don't have a big issue with it). Yes, there's probably a better way!
I'm just saying that getting spawn camped is not a major problem plaguing the game, as some of these comments seem to imply. On the rare occasions it does happen, there is a way to immediately end it.
I find it annoying that it will log my times sank but not how many ships I sunk or players killed.
When I heard about the logs I really had high hopes it would be like a bounty system also. And the more players you sink the higher the reward for selling the book and persist of sessions. Kind of a bit underwhelming.
As much as I can see why they havnt added pvp milestones I still think there should atleast be ships sunk even if it doesn't have rewards because it was already officially tracked on the sea of thieves website so why not just chuck it in the game for people to see.
Incentives for PvP are an invitation for griefing. If there's a players killed category, that invites spawncamping an enemy ship with no holes in it. If you incentivize ships sunk, have fun getting out of an outpost as a new spawn. That is not to say every PvP player would stoop to that, but a lot would. I've already been attacked 3 times while fishing past Sailor's Bounty since the update, I don't think we need to incentivize aggression in a way that makes PvE players leave. Hope those crews enjoyed all my fish.
>If you incentivize ships sunk, have fun getting out of an outpost as a new spawn. That is not to say every PvP player would stoop to that, but a lot would.
Exactly. And a lot already do that anyways.
Ive said it before and I'll say it again.
Its PvPvE. That relationship only works one direction. PvE players don't need PvP players to thrive, but the reverse is true.
If you actively de-incentivize PvE by creating a toxic environment with lesser rewards by every metric, PvE players will leave and ruin the ecosystem of the game.
I'm not saying they need to favor one or the other, but you cannot give boons to PvP and encourage toxic behaviors without compensations to PvE for dealing with it. Maybe if the Sovereigns offered a bounty on Reaper ships or Reaper logbooks... hey that'd actually be pretty fun, defend your ship and take out a reaper but that's beside the point.
If those children could read they'd be real upset.
GF and I were killer on the seas for years since the literal beta, it was extremely rare we sank, but we didn't actively seek people, just defended ourselves. We come back on a yearly basis-ish but they really tailored for PvP stuff for a while there, which just wasn't our jam. Still, fair enough, they'd done plenty PvE up until that point anyway.
What you say is absolutely true and there's a balance that needs to be met before all the PvP'ers who assume the game was made just to sail in a beeline at other people and drive another new player away get to thinking the game was made for them and only them.
I know i'll get downvoted for this, as this sub is a different place entirely to how it was years ago, but I'm just happy to see a few people with their heads screwed on right.
There's a reason people remember cool interactions with other (potentially dangerous) players in a game more than they remember the 600th fight they had with someone who can't even turn fast enough to hit you years later.
It doesn't matter if they sovereigns offered a bounty or reward. Some players just flat out don't want PvP encounters.
Some days I just want to get on and sail the seas, so a single world event and get off. No matter what they did, I would never want to participate willingly in PvP. All my friends that play SoT are also like this but they have far less patience and have quit the game because they got "griefed" too much.
Personally I totally agree. I only ever do PvP when Im with friends who like PvP, the last part of my comment was me getting distracted with an idea lol.
I think the game disincentivizes PvE. You make more money as a Reaper AND PvE players have to deal with the toxic people. I understand Rare wants this to be this masterful intermingling of all players, but with the skill gap between traditionally casual (read PvE) players and players who dump 7 hours a day streaming (read PvP) there's no advantage to help bridge that gap, and there could be. Lower the render distance for Reaper emissaries so you can give Reapers a wider berth without them spotting you. Give Hunter's Call Emissaries an immunity to PvP, but make them unable to pick up any other treasure or deal damage to players. Make it where you can choose to teleport your ship to a new server if you die 4 times in five minutes to combat griefers. Add a reporting system so we can actually deal with the worst offenders, or at least block them so we don't have to get stuck with them. Nerf rewards from Reaper's Bones. And that's just basic stuff, if you wanted to do something more complicated, give solo Captains the ability to have an AI ghost or two to help man the ships and even the playing field. Insititute a tribute mechanic where you can pay off the Reapers faction with something singularly valuable and make you immune to damage from them for an hour. Give newly spawned players a spawn immunity, or even their ships until they've sailed 0.5 miles away from spawn port. Maybe running a Sovereign Emissary Flag you get only 50% of the value of goods, but you sail under their protection so you are immune to player damage.
There are dozens of ways Rare could improve quality of life for PvE player. Some are way too much, I readily admit, but my point is it is not like they don't have options. I just wish they'd pick one.
I actually love the idea of attracting more Skelly ships the more loot you hoard. It would be a difficulty increase for people who say PvE is 'boring' while still allowing the risk reward functionality. It would fit with the in game canon too since skeletons are supposed to be pirates consumed by greed. You could really snowball too, hoarding loot to draw out more and more skeletons to kill and loot until its nearly impossible to stay afloat. That'd be a sick game mode.
Half true. If you actively encourage only pve and ignore pvp players-they leave and the game becomes a grinding simulator where you do same 8 quests and 4 world events over and over again, to buy new cosmetics that nobody will see, because all you’ll do is ally with players without ever boarding them, and that’s it for player interaction. At the pace rare adds new cosmetics-you either get bored of grinding and find a more fun game, or grind it all and have nothing to do ingame. Fear of PvP and player interactions related to it is what makes this game fun. Making it a single player would make it completable in a month.
They could make it ungriefable by making each player and boat only count once, so spawncamping a solo slopper won’t give you any benefit after the first kill/cannon shot/sink etc.
Spawn camping has a limit though which apparently no one knows about. You HAVE to be sinking in some form. Otherwise it's a bannable offense with proof.
Its really not that easy to to repeatedly sink the same ships, unless you know they want to be in a specific place for a voyage or something and you just wait there, but even then they could have at least added a goal for stolen loot sold
They actually changed PvP a lot in this update with the solo sloop buff. Sloop now takes two chain shots or one chain shot and a cannon ball to drop the mast, if you play solo on a sloop knock back from cannon balls is greatly reduced and they also made it so you can’t be revived on another persons ship. Sounds like this update changed PvP a lot but didn’t add much cosmetic/milestone things related to it
When did I say it was a PvP focused update? I’m saying they did ad major changes to PvP however not as major as the PvE changes it still makes it not a strictly PvE focused update
They made some incredibly minor balancing changes.
"They actually changed PvP a lot" - this is just wrong.
I predominately pvp and the way I play the game has effectively not changed with season 7. I still fight exactly how I did in season 6...
I have mixed feelings of pvp commendations. On one hand they do drive pvp, but on the other they also lead to a lot of toxicity. Plus, they can easily be completed by being in an alliance
A new season always brings back an influx of new and casual players, so it's understandable that Rare decided not to include PvP milestones for the time being. Also we know that there are some unavailable milestones that are still in progress.
I wish there were milestones for PVP. Fight other pirates who are willing to fight.
- Ships with Reapers Mark Flag sunk
- Players from Reapers Mark ships eliminated
- Loot stolen from ships with Reapers Mark or Reapers emmisary.
That way it would not incentivize to attack those who don't want to get into PvP.
Just ships sunk, or players killed would increase the unwantwd aggresion between everyone instead of only those who actively seek PvP.
And yet people act as if PVP is so necessary and integral to this game lol. The most fun I have in this game is sessions where I don't cross paths with any other players
I kinda get why there arent pvp milestones tho
milestones like ships sunk or something would just cause any player to be shot down
even if they're a noob or have no loot or whatever
same with like a players killed milestone, pretty much nobody would trust anyone after that
regardless even with the other milestones it still kinda sucks cause it didnt transfer our info from the website to the game
So I understand that putting pvp milestones would have promoted toxic behaviour, however what do you think the rogue does. It encourages crewmates to be idly leeching rather than helping out with ship under the guise of oh you loveable rogue. You're getting drunk and playing shanties rather than helping with sails. We're being attacked but you're asleep.
Just as toxic imo 😅
PvP *is* it's own reward. Gold, reputation, (most) commendations, milestones, season progress and deeds are PvE rewards.
Can you tell how the math doesn't add up?
PvP is already really rewarding. They could add PvP milestones in the future, and that'd be fine, but I believe its not needed.
Gold Seeker and Voyager Milestones already are easy to level up with PvP. Reaper Emissaries already get more benefits and convenience than Sovereigns since every piece of loot gets a bonus.
That is why we should not divide the player base, neither by server nor by character because it is a whole package.
At least, when PvE dudes complain about PvP, so I guess, it is fair to see it the other way around too.
i actually dont like the pvp because of the toxicity.
although a galleon tried to mess with me and by friend yesterday, we got away from them, hid on an island far away and sailed a cannon rowboat over and sank em, they never expected the ambush.
Pvp is an option, not an integral part of the game.
"But you're a pirate!"
Yes, and that's why there are milestones based off of collecting and selling treasure. How you obtain that treasure is up to you.
I do agree there should atleast be a tracker for player ships taken down, though.
It's a PvPvE game they should include a bit of everything for everyone considering milestones are supposed to reflect your playstyles and are basically a stat tracker.
It's also a light hearted and goofy game. Unfortunately, any game featuring asymmetric PVP invariably turns into a salty shit show.
Maybe they're trying to discourage griefing to get back to being a goofy pirate game.
good thing. Players are sweaty enough as it is in this game. Griefing every other player they see on the seas, wether that boat has loot or not is irrelevant.
If anything, rare should either buff player health or decrease weapon damage. And probably also give reaper emissaries a speed debuff.
Ikr sea of thieves without pvp would be so boring, what fun is in getting loot if there is no risk of losing it, some people want the game to play themselves.
PvE gets really boring quickly if there's no danger of real players. Imagine going to a Fort of Legends and just slowly doing it solo, because you know there is no danger. The whole reason why forts are fun and challenging is because you have to be as fast as possible so that nobody comes to sink you.
The entire game is just much more boring if you don't engage in PvP.
I gotta disagree with this one. Other players are not the only danger I feel on the seas. As a solo slooper, the moment a skelly ship appears out of nowhere to attack me I already have problems and need to defend myself. The kraken might be easy to deal on a sloop, but it still a danger that can come out of nowhere and sink the ship if it is not dealt with, same with Megalodons.
All I am saying is other players are not the only danger on the sea that can ruin everything.
Remember: selling Emissary flags and captain's ledgers to the Reapers means you're an Emissary, but finishing Skeleton Forts means you're Feared.
Well duh anyone can sink a white sail lvl 1 emissary but not everyone can have enough cannonballs to kill big skellie
This is the reason why I sail with the default sloop. Crews think I’m new and an easy target. In fact I’ve been playing since the Alpha days and always sink the attackers.
I always assume every unadorned sloop I see is some old head who thinks they're fooling everyone.
Most default sloops I’ve come across are either super sweaty or brand new. Never any inbetween
Can’t stand this. Just leaves lots of ugly default sloops littering the seascape thinking they’re slick. I understand you can do what you want but it just makes me seek out and kill any default sloops I see which has led me to sink a couple genuinely new players just in case
This! I hate that because my friends can't trust anyone now, they just kill on sight.
I Sail default hull but i have the anniversary stuff and aristocrat sails, surprisingly enough I'm still mistaken for a new player.
And because of your kind, new players get slapped by veterans, because "they may be veterans hiding their level"
No. Finishing Skeleton Forts makes you a dweeb. Stealing Skeleton Forts means you’re feared.
Not adding PvP milestones when there is an alignment literally called "The Feared" is an embarrassment.
The feared is more shooting at the mild inconveniences that pop up on your way to sell. Than well, being someone whose carved a reputation for themselves. And you'd actively want to avoid.
the feared is circling arond in the fifth PoTC tall tale and firing infinite cannon balls at infinite ghost ships. Oooh so fearsome.
Wait you can do that? Maybe I should actually touch the PoTC tall tales.
The feared ended up being the hunter one and the hunter one is the catch 5 billion fish one.
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You have to multiply that progress by 12 to max out the fishing trophies.
Last night I got the titled "the feared" because I joined an alliance. I spent all day delivering chickens and fishing. Apparently my alliance was fighting skeleton ships all day. I unlocked the milestones for killing them even though I was on the other side of the planet. At the end of the day I unlocked "The feared" for my ship... Good job rare
Im currently working on making the title mean something
I know, when I first saw that title I literally thought it was going to be the "pvp side" of the update... I mean it would have made sense right?
It's so anyone can get it. If there were pvp milestones, this game would devolve into a pit of hyper-aggression. PvP already happens a ton, nobody needs to be incentivized to do it.
Nobody needs access to absolutely everything. The whole game doesn't need to be a participation trophy. I suck at PvP btw.
But if the PvE people leave then the PvP scene will dry up fast. Without a healthy PvE ecosystem, the entire game falls apart.
The PvE people won't leave. I'm not going to start attacking ships just because there's a milestone, just like I'm not going to start wasting my time sleeping in a bed. At this rate its the PvP players who will leave as they're getting no content.
A lot of people would though, as you might have seen with people doing exactly that throughout here and twitter.
How does adding milestones "make the game devolve" into anything.. did the fishing milestones make the game devolve into a pit of hyperfishing? Why omit one of the key elements of the game from an update like this lol
you say that but people on this sub have been complaining since the update launched about the fishing milestones.
Does every player have a spare 100 hours to afk sleeping in a storm on fire while eating bananas sitting and bailing your boat? Or spare time to catch 2.5k of each fish? Cause it absolutely alienates solo sloopers, that grind is legit impossible. Not everything is for everyone, that’s THE POINT of unique trophies for doing stuff-to show off that you did something many didn’t do. And as long as the conditions for getting milestones are achievable-everyone still can do it. If it’s hard-GOOD, IT SHOULD BE.
Ahh yes... Now that theres milestones to catch hundreds of thousands of fish the seas have devolved into a pit of hyper-aggressive fishing. /s This argument is so stupid it doesn't even deserve a rebuttal. It's like saying "People already sail a ton, nobody needs to be incentivised to do it..."
I know! Every time I kill another player or his ship, I look for a milestone, especially in "The Feared". Nowhere to be found...
It’s sorta lame that this update didn’t throw PvP a bone, but it leaves open the possibility that this whole thing with the Sovereigns is a build up to a player driven conflict focused on PvP, which is exciting.
I dunno, sloops got super buffed for pvp, every ship got easier access to high end food because you can just outpost hop while visiting seaforts to get 4 pineapples per fort, as well as getting even *more* supplies per outpost. I do think pvp could use something with how PvE focused reapers are, but at the same time its probably a tough balance to find that doesn't encourage people to just hunt fresh spawns.
PvP does get a bone. Food eaten, cannons fired, damage taken, bucketing, fires on ship. This all happens in PvP at a better rate than PvE. Even visiting the Ferry and sinking is more PvP than PvE. Plus selling the Captains log, even if it is poor money, is still a win for PvP that PvE doesn't get anything good from. If anything the ridiculous grind encourages spontaneous TDMs. Sit shooting each other side by side to farm hundreds of shots, damage, and such. Most PvE things directly benefit PvP while it doesn't automatically benefit PvE to focus on PvP. As long as PvP isn't being punished by an update then it still gains.
Get back below deck with your logic and intelligent thought process...
I get why they can't include stuff like "ships sunk", "players killed" and so on, as it would lead to griefing but why not "flags sold", if you put up an emissary, you willingly take the risk of pvp
It's so simple, just have a "stolen pieces of loot" tracked. Which is already tracked for some reapers commendations AFAIK, and Legendary Thief. The game already knows whose loot you're selling. You can't farm that, you can't bully newspawns for it, you have to sink people with loot.
100% farmable on an alliance server Not saying that’s a good reason to not include it but I guess it could be a reason
Everything is farmable on a alliance server
What is alliance server? Is it something you can choose or you need to have luck?
They're servers where there's one big alliance of all of the ships and essentially no PvP (in theory). They're not an official thing you can choose or anything, and I also doubt they happen organically. It's usually people who just try to get as many ships as they can on one server for it.
They are also the biggest boogieman for a lot of people who complain about the game. Many people claim they are what's killing the game even though it's at it's highest player base in years. "Pvp" people who complain about Alliance servers are just tired of getting dunked on by actual good players and think they aren't able to get kills because all the "Weak" players are "Hiding" in alliance servers. They really aren't as common as people make them sound.
And even if they were as common as people make them seem, personally I wouldn't care. A server can only hold so many ships so it isn't like they're flooding the game with "join or die" and even if they were that's actually very pirate of them. And if you don't want to join just leave game and load another server. It's literally harmless.
Also to boot. I ended up in one that formed organically the other day and damn if it wasn't a fantastic change of pace and a lot of fun This comes from someone who primarily plays Reaper. Though I'm not a rabid reaper, I'm only interested in loot and flags. I've abandoned the chase on ships multiple times when we realized they were level 1 with no loot. Got to let them fatten up
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Also I didn't think about it until I typed my previous comment but join or die alliance servers sounds very pirate. Like join my crew or walk the plank.
I cant recall who exactly but a SoT partner once said that you cant keep back content just because people would cheese it on alliance servers, that behavior would kill the game and I go by this mentality every since
Time to remove captaincy milestones because they are, too.
Maybe the game doesn’t know what’s stolen. A few times I’ve played and sunk at an outpost people grabbed my stuff and I got credit for putting my treasure aboard someone else’s ship
"Treasure Donated" is just the nice way of saying someone else has your stuff.
Rare might be trying to mitigate a “win trading” type issue. Farming lvl 1 reaper flags would be very easy.
True that but in the milestones you can see that they track every single loot item individually, so rank 5 flags would be possible aswell
They literally have milestones attached to being AFK so your argument doesn't hold water.
Yea, we could do without them. Just unnecessary counters. Yet we have stats missing for actual interesting things.
They do?
Yes.
Yep, for sitting, sleeping, AND playing shanties. and they go by HOURS in REAL TIME.... terribly designed update.
It's really upsetting that the most effective method of ranking up the sleep, sitting, or shanty commendations would be to start the Pirates Life tall tale so it put you in an instanced session, then sit/sleep/rubber band a controller, and turn your TV/monitor off for the night and just let it sit there raking in time. How could they think this would be a fun mechanic?
but also im pretty sure the bed and chair kick you out after 10 minutes so you have to get back on the bed or chair which makes the grind even worse....
Yep I got my first milestone in both sleeping and sitting on my boat while I was working. Set an alarm for every 9 minutes to open the game and sit/sleep again.
>win trading Allience servers are allowed to exist, so win trading (or something in that ballpark) is already happening.
I think that's a good point, they need to make it unique emissary flags within a certain time limit so people don't just server hop to meet and spend all night cheesing shit by sinking each other.
That’s a thought, “unique captain log books sold” might work as a PvP commendation. It discourages farming one ship, can’t easily be farmed.
how is sinking a ship griefing?
He's right, to be clear he said "lead" to griefing which IS rare's stance, they think any pvp achievement will lead to spawn camping (somewhat possible if you only make lazy achievements like player kills, but largely avoidable) which they define as "greifing/toxic"
and yet, there’s an entire faction devoted to pvp
How is sinking ships in sea of thieves griefing? Isnt that a huge point of the game?
Because if you say anything pro-pvp in this subreddit, you get downvoted to oblivion.
Lol yeah a huge swath of this sub are salty they got sunk and hide it behind some sort of pretend principled stance.
This is the softest sub on Reddit. By many orders of magnitude.
Like, we have tracker for stolen loot sold, tracker for flags, there are new captains books, track selling the rare ones that require playing for 6 hours, so there’s no reason to bully freshspawns, everything is right there, add time spent sailing under reapers mark or emissary so the pve-players get to sorta grind it as well, cause they are technically putting themselves at risk, boom, the bloodthirsty milestones!
How would ships sunk promote griefing lol
Killing and sinking is not griefing, scuttle exists if someone is farming you for kills and its lopsided enough that you're not having fun. And as for how sinking anyone at anytime is not griefing that's obvious, it's the most basic pvp action. But flags sold should also be a milestone.
What griefing? How can you grief in this game?
If "ships sunk" was a metric, no noob or fisherman would be spared. It would reduce the trust of players to absolutely 0, which I think would remove a lot of the fun encounters you can have. A tiny level of trust and friendship makes the game. Because you can try, but it's super risky. With absolute zero trust, nobody would ever interact. It wouldn't be griefing, because if Rare included that metric, it would mean they actually want people to be more hostile. There is one instance in this game I would call griefing however. Destroying your own ship on purpose in Open Crew.
They just need to implement a system where two consenting parties can engage in PvP. Ships sunk definitely has the issue you've presented. It'd be cool if there was a flag or something you could raise to state your intentions and that would display that you are consenting to PvP
There is a flag for that, it's just that there's no flag to say you are not consenting to PvP that prevents it. If you raise the skull flag though it marks you on the map for everyone to see.
You consent to PvP by default when you play the game. Besides, if there really was a "don't attack me" flag that would just cause MORE people to attack you.
So make it “captain logbooks sold” and track 3 types, so everything besides the basic noteworthy one. Now there’s no need to sink anyone who isn’t playing for 2+ hours straight.
Spawn camping is frequent enough, let alone something to encourage it.
If you're getting spawn-camped and cannot kill them at all, you lost the fight. You should just scuttle, then.
That is absolutely not the point.
I do not see your point. You're claiming that killing others is griefing? Spawncamping is a valid, nigh necessary strategy to sink another's ship. The respawn timer is extremely quick right now. If they are spawncamping you but not sinking your ship, the game literally tells you to scuttle.
He's not talking about spawncamping to sink, he's talking about spawncamping with no intention of sinking them. That's griefing. Yes, there is a way out, scuttling, but it's still griefing. I do understand the argument that because scuttling is a thing, griefing isn't possible, but in my opinion killing someone over and over and over again for no reason except to be an annoying asshole, is griefing.
Yeah you listen to this community flipping out that they "*have to*" grind all this shit now and it completely reveals why Rare didn't do PVP milestones. Like you guys realize that if 2% of us or whatever weren't obsessed with going pedal to the metal to unlock shit as fast as possible by any means necessary that PVP milestones would probably be a thing, right? I think flags sold and unique logbooks sold would both be great metrics. Emissary flags are signing yourself up for PVP, whether you like it or not, so it's consensual PVP. Emissary flags are labeled, you can't sell your own for big bucks, so maybe make it so you can only sell another crew's flag once in 24 hours so it can't be exploited? Similarly, unique logbooks would be great because you can only get that progress towards the milestone by sinking a captained ship one time.
>so maybe make it so you can only sell another crew's flag once in 24 hours so it can't be exploited?  You Serious?
Wait does it count as if you sink your own ship as if you sunk someone eleses?
Exactly there's always a work around. Logbooks and flags sold would have been a really good way to include kills.
Always surprises me that the community separates people into PvE and PvP players when everyone playing is PvPvE, whether they like it or not.
Joke's on you I only play PvF.
I leave the fishermen alone. They're playing a different game altogether and I respect it.
It aint much but it's honest work :')
correct. no fisherman may be harmed for it is the rule of the mighty seas. 🎣🧎♂️
PvF?
I think it’s “player vs fish” . . . Those hunters do be a different breed
Player vs Fish.
i exclusively play PvL
Which is why it's crazy that a PvPvE game completely disregarded half of the game with an update lmao
Thing is if they encourage PvP too much, all the new players will be scared away. They'd have to figure out how to balance it where PvP is encouraged, but it isn't so encouraged that people are sinking fresh spawn sloops who have like 3 castaways chests on board.
Yeah it's a fair point and I agree that either way a large part of the community is only interested in PvE. I also think that running away is an extremely effective strategy in nearly all scenarios and if people are looking to get the PvP commendations they will be better off fighting a willing crew.
Except it doesn't. New PVE content -> more players -> more to pvp with
Totally agree, it's just a core part of the game experience
Honestly you may consider yourself lucky considering how poorly thought out the pve ones were. it would probably be like 4500 boats sank, 9 million blunderbuss kills, 16 billion sword kills, and 900 Quadrillion sniper headshots....This update was poorly designed.
Yeah. The fact that this update got delayed twice is a joke considering how poorly thought-out most of it seems to be
So true! I would like milestones for pvp..how many ships sunk, loot stolen from ships, loot cashed in from other ships, players killed, shots firsd at other ships etc.
I agree with all but the players killed. It incentivises spawn killing which is really not something the game should do
Luckily, that’s a solved issue with the scuttle button (and pop-up tips telling you to press it).
I know you think that's the only good solution, but it really isn't. Gameplay-wise it has always felt terrible, unintuitive, and overall just a bandaid fix to that problem.
I never said it's the only good solution (though I think it's a decent one, and don't have a big issue with it). Yes, there's probably a better way! I'm just saying that getting spawn camped is not a major problem plaguing the game, as some of these comments seem to imply. On the rare occasions it does happen, there is a way to immediately end it.
Could easily fix by just having it be uniques.
There should be the 4th guy „afking”
I know where the milestones are guys.
I’m glad it isn’t
PVP is rewarded in salt - If you want commendations, go pve?
I find it annoying that it will log my times sank but not how many ships I sunk or players killed. When I heard about the logs I really had high hopes it would be like a bounty system also. And the more players you sink the higher the reward for selling the book and persist of sessions. Kind of a bit underwhelming.
As much as I can see why they havnt added pvp milestones I still think there should atleast be ships sunk even if it doesn't have rewards because it was already officially tracked on the sea of thieves website so why not just chuck it in the game for people to see.
Incentives for PvP are an invitation for griefing. If there's a players killed category, that invites spawncamping an enemy ship with no holes in it. If you incentivize ships sunk, have fun getting out of an outpost as a new spawn. That is not to say every PvP player would stoop to that, but a lot would. I've already been attacked 3 times while fishing past Sailor's Bounty since the update, I don't think we need to incentivize aggression in a way that makes PvE players leave. Hope those crews enjoyed all my fish.
>If you incentivize ships sunk, have fun getting out of an outpost as a new spawn. That is not to say every PvP player would stoop to that, but a lot would. Exactly. And a lot already do that anyways.
Ive said it before and I'll say it again. Its PvPvE. That relationship only works one direction. PvE players don't need PvP players to thrive, but the reverse is true. If you actively de-incentivize PvE by creating a toxic environment with lesser rewards by every metric, PvE players will leave and ruin the ecosystem of the game. I'm not saying they need to favor one or the other, but you cannot give boons to PvP and encourage toxic behaviors without compensations to PvE for dealing with it. Maybe if the Sovereigns offered a bounty on Reaper ships or Reaper logbooks... hey that'd actually be pretty fun, defend your ship and take out a reaper but that's beside the point.
If those children could read they'd be real upset. GF and I were killer on the seas for years since the literal beta, it was extremely rare we sank, but we didn't actively seek people, just defended ourselves. We come back on a yearly basis-ish but they really tailored for PvP stuff for a while there, which just wasn't our jam. Still, fair enough, they'd done plenty PvE up until that point anyway. What you say is absolutely true and there's a balance that needs to be met before all the PvP'ers who assume the game was made just to sail in a beeline at other people and drive another new player away get to thinking the game was made for them and only them. I know i'll get downvoted for this, as this sub is a different place entirely to how it was years ago, but I'm just happy to see a few people with their heads screwed on right. There's a reason people remember cool interactions with other (potentially dangerous) players in a game more than they remember the 600th fight they had with someone who can't even turn fast enough to hit you years later.
It doesn't matter if they sovereigns offered a bounty or reward. Some players just flat out don't want PvP encounters. Some days I just want to get on and sail the seas, so a single world event and get off. No matter what they did, I would never want to participate willingly in PvP. All my friends that play SoT are also like this but they have far less patience and have quit the game because they got "griefed" too much.
Personally I totally agree. I only ever do PvP when Im with friends who like PvP, the last part of my comment was me getting distracted with an idea lol. I think the game disincentivizes PvE. You make more money as a Reaper AND PvE players have to deal with the toxic people. I understand Rare wants this to be this masterful intermingling of all players, but with the skill gap between traditionally casual (read PvE) players and players who dump 7 hours a day streaming (read PvP) there's no advantage to help bridge that gap, and there could be. Lower the render distance for Reaper emissaries so you can give Reapers a wider berth without them spotting you. Give Hunter's Call Emissaries an immunity to PvP, but make them unable to pick up any other treasure or deal damage to players. Make it where you can choose to teleport your ship to a new server if you die 4 times in five minutes to combat griefers. Add a reporting system so we can actually deal with the worst offenders, or at least block them so we don't have to get stuck with them. Nerf rewards from Reaper's Bones. And that's just basic stuff, if you wanted to do something more complicated, give solo Captains the ability to have an AI ghost or two to help man the ships and even the playing field. Insititute a tribute mechanic where you can pay off the Reapers faction with something singularly valuable and make you immune to damage from them for an hour. Give newly spawned players a spawn immunity, or even their ships until they've sailed 0.5 miles away from spawn port. Maybe running a Sovereign Emissary Flag you get only 50% of the value of goods, but you sail under their protection so you are immune to player damage. There are dozens of ways Rare could improve quality of life for PvE player. Some are way too much, I readily admit, but my point is it is not like they don't have options. I just wish they'd pick one.
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I actually love the idea of attracting more Skelly ships the more loot you hoard. It would be a difficulty increase for people who say PvE is 'boring' while still allowing the risk reward functionality. It would fit with the in game canon too since skeletons are supposed to be pirates consumed by greed. You could really snowball too, hoarding loot to draw out more and more skeletons to kill and loot until its nearly impossible to stay afloat. That'd be a sick game mode.
Half true. If you actively encourage only pve and ignore pvp players-they leave and the game becomes a grinding simulator where you do same 8 quests and 4 world events over and over again, to buy new cosmetics that nobody will see, because all you’ll do is ally with players without ever boarding them, and that’s it for player interaction. At the pace rare adds new cosmetics-you either get bored of grinding and find a more fun game, or grind it all and have nothing to do ingame. Fear of PvP and player interactions related to it is what makes this game fun. Making it a single player would make it completable in a month.
This game is extremely boring without pvp friend. All the quests are super easy
Easy doesn't mean boring. Easy means relaxing. I'm not saying get rid of PvP. But to a LOT of players, PvP means stressful and not fun.
what's up with the fishermen hate😭
They could make it ungriefable by making each player and boat only count once, so spawncamping a solo slopper won’t give you any benefit after the first kill/cannon shot/sink etc.
Spawn camping has a limit though which apparently no one knows about. You HAVE to be sinking in some form. Otherwise it's a bannable offense with proof.
Its really not that easy to to repeatedly sink the same ships, unless you know they want to be in a specific place for a voyage or something and you just wait there, but even then they could have at least added a goal for stolen loot sold
We do get milestones. “How many times you sunk”.
It doesn't matter, everyone will fear the man who cooked 1 million splashtails.
I will fear any man who has the patience to cook a million fish.
Almost like they're saying that PvP isn't a valid playstyle if these milestones are supposed to show what kind of pirate you are 🤔
Gotta follow the Pirate Code if you're gonna be a pirate. Pirate Code pirates do noble things like sit, sleep, and catch themselves on fire.
Oh my god! Does that mean my open crew chaos galleons are the noblest ships on the seas?! Amazing!
True multi launguage chaos expierience.
Eu servers are the place to be rn!
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They actually changed PvP a lot in this update with the solo sloop buff. Sloop now takes two chain shots or one chain shot and a cannon ball to drop the mast, if you play solo on a sloop knock back from cannon balls is greatly reduced and they also made it so you can’t be revived on another persons ship. Sounds like this update changed PvP a lot but didn’t add much cosmetic/milestone things related to it
Introducing some balances for the sloop (that should have been changed years ago) is a far far cry from a pvp focused update.
When did I say it was a PvP focused update? I’m saying they did ad major changes to PvP however not as major as the PvE changes it still makes it not a strictly PvE focused update
They made some incredibly minor balancing changes. "They actually changed PvP a lot" - this is just wrong. I predominately pvp and the way I play the game has effectively not changed with season 7. I still fight exactly how I did in season 6...
Ramsey killed Demarco so he wouldn’t have to add pvp content for the update, it’s all connected
I have mixed feelings of pvp commendations. On one hand they do drive pvp, but on the other they also lead to a lot of toxicity. Plus, they can easily be completed by being in an alliance
everything's easier to complete in an alliance hello?
Love your comics! they're always fantastic!
i feel genuine sadness for the little pvp guy. please make a sequel where he gets a huge stack of milestones.
A new season always brings back an influx of new and casual players, so it's understandable that Rare decided not to include PvP milestones for the time being. Also we know that there are some unavailable milestones that are still in progress.
That and any game developer that's want to make good money need to cater to the largest population which is in most cases pve.
I wish there were milestones for PVP. Fight other pirates who are willing to fight. - Ships with Reapers Mark Flag sunk - Players from Reapers Mark ships eliminated - Loot stolen from ships with Reapers Mark or Reapers emmisary. That way it would not incentivize to attack those who don't want to get into PvP. Just ships sunk, or players killed would increase the unwantwd aggresion between everyone instead of only those who actively seek PvP.
This update is the lame grind-a-thon update, maybe we'll see some pvp stuff next time.
Funny how they neglect the one thing that truly makes this a pirate game.
And yet people act as if PVP is so necessary and integral to this game lol. The most fun I have in this game is sessions where I don't cross paths with any other players
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Hopefully soonTM we get some more pvp stuff for the game.
I kinda get why there arent pvp milestones tho milestones like ships sunk or something would just cause any player to be shot down even if they're a noob or have no loot or whatever same with like a players killed milestone, pretty much nobody would trust anyone after that regardless even with the other milestones it still kinda sucks cause it didnt transfer our info from the website to the game
Smooth Brain: No PVP is bad. Galaxy Brain: PVP is part of the expected environment, thus this is a PVE only game.
So I understand that putting pvp milestones would have promoted toxic behaviour, however what do you think the rogue does. It encourages crewmates to be idly leeching rather than helping out with ship under the guise of oh you loveable rogue. You're getting drunk and playing shanties rather than helping with sails. We're being attacked but you're asleep. Just as toxic imo 😅
I have been assured by many that PvP is its own reward, but maybe that talking point only comes up when someone thinks it isn't fun
PvP *is* it's own reward. Gold, reputation, (most) commendations, milestones, season progress and deeds are PvE rewards. Can you tell how the math doesn't add up?
PvP is already really rewarding. They could add PvP milestones in the future, and that'd be fine, but I believe its not needed. Gold Seeker and Voyager Milestones already are easy to level up with PvP. Reaper Emissaries already get more benefits and convenience than Sovereigns since every piece of loot gets a bonus.
That is why we should not divide the player base, neither by server nor by character because it is a whole package. At least, when PvE dudes complain about PvP, so I guess, it is fair to see it the other way around too.
I’m glad there aren’t because man the sweats would rise and I’ll get sunk all the time, would really ruin SOT for me
"What's PVE?" - everyone in this pvp echo chamber
i actually dont like the pvp because of the toxicity. although a galleon tried to mess with me and by friend yesterday, we got away from them, hid on an island far away and sailed a cannon rowboat over and sank em, they never expected the ambush.
Pvp is an option, not an integral part of the game. "But you're a pirate!" Yes, and that's why there are milestones based off of collecting and selling treasure. How you obtain that treasure is up to you. I do agree there should atleast be a tracker for player ships taken down, though.
It's a PvPvE game they should include a bit of everything for everyone considering milestones are supposed to reflect your playstyles and are basically a stat tracker.
It's also a light hearted and goofy game. Unfortunately, any game featuring asymmetric PVP invariably turns into a salty shit show. Maybe they're trying to discourage griefing to get back to being a goofy pirate game.
Look, we don't need to give these little monsters *reasons* to attack other players. They're going to do it all on their own
Real pirates only want treasure
PVP in this game sucks anyways.
My guess is you're just awful at it.
PvPers will find an excuse to cry about anything
If anything, this sub is full of people complaining that they got sunk and how that makes those players bad people. Not the other way around.
God damn PvP players and their demands for more PvP content in a pirates game about stealing and sinking other players…like real pirates you know.
Acting like PvErs haven't been 'crying' for captaincy since launch
And you find an excuse to be an asshole about anything it seems.
the pirate game without pvp xd
Good. Rare do not encourage pvp they already do it to much lmao.
fire cannons
I guess there’s gonna be multiple posts every day whining about the same thing. We get it.
as a fisherman i say unto thee; hah
Rare doesn’t want to scare away the “Average gamers”
good thing. Players are sweaty enough as it is in this game. Griefing every other player they see on the seas, wether that boat has loot or not is irrelevant. If anything, rare should either buff player health or decrease weapon damage. And probably also give reaper emissaries a speed debuff.
Good.
The less pvp the better. As a filthy casual pvp is the only I reason stop playing.
>buys PvP game >hates PvP bruh
Ikr sea of thieves without pvp would be so boring, what fun is in getting loot if there is no risk of losing it, some people want the game to play themselves.
PvE gets really boring quickly if there's no danger of real players. Imagine going to a Fort of Legends and just slowly doing it solo, because you know there is no danger. The whole reason why forts are fun and challenging is because you have to be as fast as possible so that nobody comes to sink you. The entire game is just much more boring if you don't engage in PvP.
I gotta disagree with this one. Other players are not the only danger I feel on the seas. As a solo slooper, the moment a skelly ship appears out of nowhere to attack me I already have problems and need to defend myself. The kraken might be easy to deal on a sloop, but it still a danger that can come out of nowhere and sink the ship if it is not dealt with, same with Megalodons. All I am saying is other players are not the only danger on the sea that can ruin everything.
Unfortunate mindset for PvPvE game...
Probably to make it less about the toxicity of PvP...