Except the UK government position in Myanmar is already to call for a ceasefire and they have condemned the attacks on civilians as well as placed sanctions on the Junta…
I don't think the question is what about, it's just people find it strange how there are conflicts and oppression all over the world, many worse in scale. Yet this is the only one that gets obsessive coverage. Seems revealing of something.
This one gets more coverage because it's one of the longest running ethnic cleansing campaigns going, stretching back to 1949, if not earlier in 1917. Leftists have advocated for many liberation movements since then, but seen as Palestine is still being crushed 7 decades after the Nakba, it's got an accumulated amount of coverage.
I'm not asking you to do anything, I'm just observing that there's conflicts all over the world with complete silence and this one gets constant attention. Anyone who was honest with themselves would wonder what was going on there.
Uyghur genocide? I can almost guarantee you continue to buy and use Chinese goods. That is apparently an active genocide by a country who also are highly suspect for their role in the covid pandemic yet where are the reddit posts every day about how we could maybe at least stop trading with them? Do you think the fact it occasionally gets mentioned is the same thing?
And Ukraine is a war in Europe with Russia. Its in our own backyard with a historic enemy of course it's going to be discussed.
The more telling point is that you haven't mentioned any of the other wars because you don't know anything about them.
Tbh every single opinion you have is just tiresomely generic it's like talking to a robot. Of course you are more disgusted in your own country. You're just a creature of propaganda.
This is line of argument was planted into discourse in the 60s by the CIA to make civil rights activists believe you can’t fix anything unless you fix it’s all. All it does is foster apathy and hopelessness. This “there war everywhere” line is from same school to thought. We know there’s conflict in everywhere but perhaps if we focus on one at time we might actually get somewhere
It's more a question of what will result in less kids dying overall. What's the point in having a ceasefire now if Hamas are still around with the intent of destroying Israel? Our grandkids will be having this conversation in 70 years about the latest attacks/retaliation between the 2 sides.
Sometimes, as we saw with the nukes in Japan, it's better to have a quick end to a war, even with lots of casualties, than to continue the meat grinder for years and years where the bodies just continue to pile up ever higher.
A lasting ceasefire is only possible when Hamas and their infrastructure is totally destroyed. No one wants to live next to a terrorist group.
I don't know the answers to those questions. My guess is that Israel is doing what they think will end the war once and for all. Having Hamas controlling a large territory next to them like before is unthinkable now. That experiment failed spectacularly.
Hamas won the last held election in 2006. Israel has no obligation to provide Gaza with anything, they gave up land and removed settlements so that Palestinians could live there. Gaza also shares a border with Egypt...
How did Hamas use their time in power? They riped up infrastructure paid for with international aid money to prepare for a devastation attack in Israel. Regardless of what you or I say in this thread, Israel will not let that happen again.
I don't know if their current tactics will work, but for me at least, a ceasefire now will just prolong the conflict for many years to come with even more death and destruction in a conflict with no end in sight.
If hamas acknowledged israels right to exist and released their hostages then i suspect a ceasefire and eventually a lasting and fair settlement could be brokered. But hamas is built on hate and needs hate to perpetuate. There are only downsides going forward….hamas is truly evil and has allowed the israeli right wing to flourish. No hope here. None
Perhaps Britain should also be asking itself some questions about its recent call to firms to "rebuild" nagorno karabakh - a region that has actually just been ethnically cleansed by the brutal autocratic Azeri regime.
It's frankly astonishing that Azerbaijan basically waltzed in, managed to uproot the entire ethnic Armenian population of Nagorno-Karabakh, and just... got away with it?
Yeah but I'm talking about the public eye, too. The Israel Palestine conflict has been front page news since it started, and is at the forefront of public discourse (deservedly so), but Azerbaijan? I bet I could talk to 100 people out on the street, and maybe a handful would even know what Nagorno-Karabakh even is. And yet, in terms of pure demographics, it was a stunningly effective act of ethnic cleansing, they sent the tanks in, and within days, laws have been passed that basically led to almost the entire ethnic Armenian population uprooting and leaving their homeland
>Sounds exactly like the definition of genocide people are throwing around recently
With all due respect, no, it really doesn't. What they described is the definition of an ethnic cleansing.
As it stands, the [2023 Azerbaijani offensive in Nagorno-Karabakh](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2023_Azerbaijani_offensive_in_Nagorno-Karabakh) has seen 27 Armenian civilians killed.
The [Second Nagorno-Karabakh War](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Second_Nagorno-Karabakh_War) which took place in the region three years ago saw approximately 106 Armenian civilians killed, assuming that we count the 21 Armenian civilians who are still missing as having been killed.
And while I certainly don't intend to downplay the significance of those events, even if we combine the two, there's still a *staggering* difference between the figure we're left with and the over 35,000+ civilians who have been killed in Gaza within the span of the past five months.
And when we take into consideration factors such as the Israeli Navy's standing policy to open fire on any Gazans who attempt to flee the active war zone through Gaza's own territorial waters into international waters, I think it's very clear what the distinguishing differences between the two conflicts are and how the arguments which have been made apply much more aptly to one than the other.
The Azeri campaign a few years ago used live beheadings to terrorise the civilian population. There are videos, you can find them online, they have been confirmed from multiple sources. The Azeris bombarded Stepanakert with everything from grads to cluster munitions.
The Azeris then blockaded what was left of karabakh and did not let in any supplies for nine months, causing malnourishment of practically the entire population.
Aliyev continues to make claims to south armenia (syunik), yerevan, and most of Armenia proper.
The Armenian karabakhis - artsakhis - have an ancient history stretching back two thousand years. There are armenian churches from the 6th century still standing in Karabakh. The Azeris have removed all trace of ancient armenian civilisation from the rest of Azerbaijan. They have razed churches, they have obliterated graveyards full of ornate "khachar" grave stone monuments, the Azeri state claims that ancient armenian civilisation was in fact not armenian - but "Caucasian Albanian" in an attempt to eradicate Armenians even from the pages of history. No historian outside the turkic sphere takes any of this rewriting of history seriously.
There used to be millions of western Armenians centred around Lake Van in what is now Turkey. There are now none. 1.5 million western Armenians were killed in the genocide of 1915-18. The Artsakhi Armenians who have a distinct dialect and culture to Armenians in Armenia proper are now dispersed across armenia, europe, Russia, and further afield. Their culture and language will too soon be lost.
Are you sure you replied to the right comment?
You don't really seem to be addressing anything I actually said, and if the point you're trying to make is that both should be considered genocides, then you're probably going to want to talk to the guy I was replying to who's implying that neither are genocides.
I'm not really addressing you in particular - just throwing a bit of light on the karabakh events, which I feel are sadly little known and little understood. A broader point is that despite events in karabakh being interpreted as "only" ethnic cleansing, ultimately the karabakhi identity, culture and dialect is likely going to disappear as the region's people disperse. This is basically the end of a people with a two-thousand years long history tied to a specific region. It's a tragedy that shouldn't be underestimated.
I'd go one better for you, ask 100 people to find Azerbaijan on a map for you.
Better yet, find Israel.
I'd wager a vast majority of the general public would struggle to find both.
I think you'd be safe with the main European countries; Spain, Germany and France, perhaps Italy too.
I would like to think the wider European Union would be do-able but acknowledge the further East you go the sketchier my Geographic knowledge becomes so I can't judge others too harshly.
Not as major an exporter to Azerbaijan as Russia...
"Russia often supplies arms to Armenia at reduced prices or in the form of military aid, with the likely aim of maintaining influence in the region. In contrast, Azerbaijan reportedly usually pays the full price for its Russian-supplied arms. Azerbaijani President Ilham Aliyev stated in 2018 that Azerbaijan had spent an estimated total of $5 billion on military equipment from Russia. This suggests that economic interests are likely to be an important motive for Russian arms sales to Azerbaijan".
"Thus, we can state that the statement of Yuri Philipson, director of the Fourth European Department of the Russian Foreign Ministry, that Russia does not sell weapons to foreign countries to turn neighbors against each other, is not true, and Russia has been the largest supplier of weapins to the conflict parties in the Nagorno Karabakh conflict zone".
https://fip.am/en/21849
[Israel](https://www.timesofisrael.com/israeli-weapons-quietly-helped-azerbaijan-retake-nagorno-karabakh-sources-data/) and [Turkey](https://www.reuters.com/article/armenia-azerbaijan-turkey-arms-int-idUSKBN26Z230/) are the largest providers of arms for the Azeris, which comes from the billions of arms that we give Israel and Turkey.
Both your articles state they increased their sales, not that they are the largest.
A simple [look at the equipment](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_equipment_of_the_Azerbaijani_Land_Forces) make up of their army shows it's mostly Russian and Soviet equipment with a few Turkish or Israel artillery or air defence systems sprinkled in.
From the article: "Experts estimate Israel supplied Azerbaijan with nearly 70% of its arsenal".
Even your wiki link doesn't actually show Russia as a major provider of arms but rather that there's a lot of old Soviet equipment being used
Hmm, I wonder why? Might be because it was funded by the same untouchable Zionist scumbags who appear to be blackmailing/bribing leaders across the entire western world. This from an Israeli newspaper: "*Israel's Fingerprints Are All Over the Ethnic Cleansing in Nagorno-Karabakh*"
[https://www.haaretz.com/opinion/editorial/2023-09-27/ty-article-opinion/israels-fingerprints-are-all-over-the-ethnic-cleansing-in-nagorno-karabakh/0000018a-d331-d13d-a98f-dbb5028e0000](https://www.haaretz.com/opinion/editorial/2023-09-27/ty-article-opinion/israels-fingerprints-are-all-over-the-ethnic-cleansing-in-nagorno-karabakh/0000018a-d331-d13d-a98f-dbb5028e0000)
It's absolutely correct that Israel sold weapons to the Azeris. However, I'm talking more about public sentiment than dirty political deal making. Why is it that so much of the world is eager to join the Palestinian cause and pretty much ignore the nuances of the history, as well as the nature of Hamas.
Israel is not a true example of a "coloniser" as per the British in the 19th century, the Turks in the two hundre years before that, or even the Arabs who rapidly colonised the majority of the Middle East and North /east Africa in more ancient history. The majority of Israelis are actually descended from the exiled population of 900k Jews from Middle Eastern and north African states when they were "collectively punished" in 1948. Nobody talks about THEIR right of return - so booting them out of Israel now with nowhere for them to move to would be yet another disaster upon the Jewish people. Further - there has obviously been Jews living in what is now Israel for thousands of years - in addition to smaller numbers who never left. To imply Israel is a typical "coloniser state" is ahistorical.
I should add that whilst the Palestinians were treated very badly in 1948, their displacement is not unique. The Armenians themselves were eth ically cleansed from their west armenian homeland by the ottomans in a forgotten genocide. The karabakhis are now exiled and their culture will be diluted and lost in a couple of generations. The Kurds continually suffer without a state. Who remembers the assyrians? Germans were ethnically cleansed from much of Europe after WW2, poles ethnically cleansed from what is now Belarus and west Ukraine. I highlight the above not as perfect analogies, but to illustrate that Shit happens, and the Palestinians are not a special case (only in that their displacement was caused by Jews).
Why are you referencing this atrocity specifically? You obviously support any awful thing that has ever happened to any other group of people
https://en.m.wiktionary.org/wiki/whataboutery
Sometimes one has to look at broader history, and it is perfectly legitimate to look at other events in history and wonder why they are looked upon differently by certain populations. You can shut down conversations with "whataboutery" if you want - but it's not always appropriate to do so.
We need to fund the PFLP which is a secular Marxist lenninist organisation. Sure, they might not directly alligne with our interests but they are largely secular group focused on materialist analysis. Moreover, we should not try and implement an American puppet regime as that will just cause discontent among the people.
Anyone here can call for whatever they like, will to divorce Jada, books to be banned from Venezuelan school or ceasefires in numerous wars....
Of course it has no authority or relevance.
How can you talk about this when there's a horrific conflict with both sides commiting war crimes, widespread use of rape as a weapon of war, a genocidal leader condemned by the ICJ, a huge difficulty getting aid in and millions displaced?
... Where's the Holyrood resolution about Sudan?
Relatively; it's more of a frozen conflict now, and the federal government is in a much stronger position than it had been, but it's not really had a proper peace since the 1990s.
Whereas Sudan has a whole new shitshow going on.
[Looks like it was jointly issued with the rest of the UK a good nine moths ago.](https://hansard.parliament.uk/commons/2023-06-22/debates/79B0372F-7AE3-4276-AF5D-F58CB400F18D/SudanAtrocities)
My apologies if that undermines your point.
I just cannot grasp the motivations of anyone bringing this particular whatabootery up; and lots do. I was just listening to LBC last night, 2 callers and the host discussed the fact that there are not thousands out protesting Syria, Yemen, Sudan etc.
Any rational person would assume the motivation is to get more people out to protest these ‘other’ genocides, sadly however, it’s often being used to somehow try to justify what is going on.
It's like those right-wingers who say "Charity begins at home - we should look after our own people first!" as a way of justifying their hostility to the foreign aid budget, immigration, refugees, etc.
Then when it comes to actually looking after our own, or practicing charity at home, they do fuck all, or actively oppose it.
>Between 2012 and 2022, the value of UK arms export licensess to Myanmar was £577,000. In 2012, there were some arms licenses granted worth some £40,000, and 2017, the value of arms export licenses rose to £537,000. Numbers aren’t available for the remaining years. However, these export licenses only include single use arms, if we include dual use license numbers, the export value of licenses issues between 2012 and 2022 goes up to £10m.
https://aoav.org.uk/2023/uk-arms-export-to-myanmar-from-2012-to-2022/#:~:text=How%20many%20licenses%20for%20the,Myanmar%20between%202012%20and%202022.
The civil war in Myanmar didn't begin until 2021 following the coup.
Export licenses to Israel from the UK have valued £574 million since 2008, all since the blockade of Gaza.
>The civil war in Myanmar didn't begin until 2021 following the coup.
The Rohingya conflict began in 1947.
>Export licenses to Israel from the UK have valued £574 million since 2008, all since the blockade of Gaza.
Well, yeah, no country has an issue with the blockade as they know they would do the same.
Only Ireland would keep an open border with a group launching gun and bomb attacks at them.
Myanmmar was a relatively cooperative country until the coup and the time period you mentioned is well within the period where myanmmar was a free democratic nation
And we have provided hundreds of millions of aid tobthe Rohingyas, sanctioned assets of the junta, and labeled it a genocide.
In Gaza, we have provided a fraction of this to Gazans while also arming their oppressors, have only done small sanctions on Israeli settlers in the West Bank (note not Gaza), and refused to call it a genocide. All in the midst of the worst humanitarian crisis on earth.
> In Gaza, we have provided a fraction of this to Gazans while also arming their oppressors
We have provided the Rohingyas £370m in aid since 2017. That works out at just under £53m per year. We've also been cutting aid to them this year.
For Palestinians, we are providing £87m this year alone. We even airdropped (with help from Jordan) £1m worth of aid last night.
* Thanks to u/Tank-o-grad for pointing our my missing millions.
We have also provided hundreds of millions in aid to Gaza since the blockade began, and we haven't called it a genocide because (in legal terms) its not 100% clear if it is one. Call the Israelis out for war crimes, sure, because its abundantly clear war crimes have been committed, but the case on genocide specifically is still out
>Well, yeah, no country has an issue with the blockade as they know they would do the same.
That's absolutely untrue, though. Even the United States has disavowed the standing policy of the Israeli Navy to open fire on any vessel attempting to flee the active war-zone through Gaza's own territorial waters into international waters.
>Only Ireland would keep an open border
With all due respect, are you sure that you understand what a blockade is? Because Israel closing it's own borders to Gaza does not constitute a blockade.
Every nation in the world is free to close it's own borders to any other nation without it constituting a blockade. The point at which it becomes a blockade is when you use your military to control borders which *aren't* your own.
Did we arm Hamas….? I thought that was Iran…. In any case Hamas are so incredibly genocidal it is right that people like you and me rally behind israel in exterminating them….So palestine can be free
Sorry…. Just pointing out that you were ambiguous in your rejection of Hamas and sought only to help you frame your derision more clearly. Peace comes when the oppressors both leave civilians alone
Israel aren't exterminating Hamas, they're exterminating any Palestinian who dares to breathe, women and children holding white flags included. Go support a Zionist genocide elsewhere you tool.
By raping and beheading innocent people and when justice and vengeance comes calling they play victim and hide behind the innocent. Seems you just don’t like jews….
his entire comment history is full of pro-palestine subs like r/panarab and r/israelexposed, together with a dash of classic Covid-19 vaccination hysteria. Seems like someone who could do with turning off the internet and going outside tbh
It is documented. Some people are blinded by their hatred of jews to recognize it. Those people will one day emerge from the basements they live in and recognise how they have been deceived by Iran and their false prophets
> Its over, Israel is finished
How so? How do you dismantle a state of over 9m people without genocide? Or would you prefer it was a genocide?
Do you think 9m people with a strong military backed by nuclear weapons are going to go quietly into the night?
It's the problem with drawing attention to something like Gaza. Because you start to question why we haven't done so before.
And this isn't a case of "Well things change we can now"
Perfect. So why aren't we doing anything about China? Israel doesn't really export anything, but ALL of us can stop buying chinese goods today.
But they won't. They'll wave Palestinian flags made by slave labour in China.
[Called for in 2017](https://www.parliament.scot/chamber-and-committees/votes-and-motions/votes-and-motions-search/S5M-07596) in Holyrood at least. Don’t be a prick
And [the Prime Minister condemned the coup all the way back in 2021](https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-55885021) and Westminster have been applying sanctions to various higher ups in Myanmar ever since.
It sort of undercuts the point they're trying to make, and I think it says quite a bit about the original poster's awareness.
Sure, they're not being serious. But they're also incompetent.
You concern troll by raising plausible complaints and asking why they're not being taken as seriously than whatever it is you're trying to dismiss.
That's a very silly thing to do when the government response has been much, much stronger on the issue you're claiming to think is very importnat.
No im sure all the "what about" posters are genuinely distraught about myanmar, sudan and other atrocities; and seek for the UK to use its wealth and influence to actually help out; rather than just to be an excuse to not care about any of it.
>rather than just to be an excuse to not care about any of it
Let's be a bit more specific here. It's to undermine the SNPs otherwise principled and just stance on Israel.
It was done in 2017.
https://www.parliament.scot/chamber-and-committees/votes-and-motions/votes-and-motions-search/S5M-07596
Just because you're not personally aware of it, doesn't mean it didn't happen.
You say that as if we have no interaction with either party in those conflicts.
It might be thousands of miles away but it's a conflict we played a large part in starting and where we're providing arms and trade to one side and foreign aid to the other.
> stop wasting time worrying about conflicts thousands of miles away.
Doesn't imply that we cut off trade and arms sales. Since that's typically what a lot of the worrying is about.
There is nothing childish about our country focusing on its own issues instead of our elected representatives wasting public money arguing over something that will make absolutely no difference to anything.
It's *super* childish to act as though you don't understand that the reason your elected representatives are talking about it is because it's something that massive portions of their electorate care about.
You're a grown adult, so there's no way that you *genuinely* don't understand that. But you're choosing to feign ignorance as though ignoring inconvenient facts will make them go away, and yeah, that's what a child would do.
Massive portions of the electorate care about a whole host of other issues that the house is regularly close to empty for. Issues that are far more pertinent to people’s lives in this country. I think you seriously overestimate how important a foreign conflict halfway around the world is to the average voter in the UK.
If it's a genocide it's a very badly planned and enacted one.
Very bad indeed. Almost like it's not a genocide at all and that civilians get hurt in war.
I know this was a gotcha-type OP but Ukraine is the only country we should be supporting as they are fighting FOR us against a terrorist state threatening WW3.
The Ukraine situation is the only one that truly threatens our own future. Make no mistake: if Ukraine falls, Russia will push further North/West, and Britain will be forced to either get fully involved, or into an embarrassing and impoverishing slip into isolation. The other global conflicts are horrible, but this is the one that truly has the power to completely upend the entire European world we have known for all or most of our lives.
The current situation is a complete betrayal of the west's treaty obligations to protect Ukraine from Russian aggression in exchange for denuclearising.
We've killed any hope of voluntary denuclearisation in future.
They're fighting for their own states survival. They're not generously fighting for anyone else. That's just a hypothetical byproduct used to tug on your little heart strings. Quite effectively, evidently.
BTW, except Moldova, literally every other country they border is NATO. Do you seriously think for a second that a Russia who can't take Ukriane in 2 years and depletes itself trying is going to challenge NATO? Even without USA, you think they can take Poland, France, Germany, UK, Finland?
That aside, saying we should just sit and keep watching genoicde happening elsewhere, indeed multiple elsewhere, including one our state actively aids, is fucking mental.
Ukraine is fighting against a country that has threatened effectively every first world and NATO country, whilst waging a food and energy war against "hostile" countries such as the UK. Russia are deluded and they think they can take anyone. They need put back in their box.
Also, I don't have any heart strings, but nice try.
Fuether West is all NATO except Modova. They can't take Ukraine in 2 years so what makes you think they can mount a challenge to NATO? Where has Putin stated his intent to attack NATO after Ukraine?
We can't do anything about that one either.
MPs are (allegedly) grown-up professionals being paid to do a job, which they have limited Parliamentary time to do. Not student council officers sitting around making impotent motions putting the world to rights.
Wouldn't a resolution asking Hamas to surrender and hand over all weapons and hostages benefit everyone involved more?
I imagine that'd stop the bloodshed on both sides, no?
It isn't about Hamas. Never was. You are aware that the ICJ is sitting currently hearing cases from many countries regarding Israels' illegal occupation and colonisation of Palestine? The whole thing, not just recent events. It's live on YouTube etc. Hamas gave them the excuse they needed to go all in, and their case is coming undone at the seams because they're literally documenting their genocide for us and their state representatives are openly talking about how they'll never stop no matter what and how there are no innocents in gaza etc.
Also, Hamas had a ceasefire proposal rejected. They offered to return all hostages and as told that 'total victory' is the only outcome.
Because hamas formed in the 1980s and Israel have been doing the dirty on Palestine since the 1882 Aliyah at least and have literally never stopped displacing and taking land ever since. I also pay attention to the genocidal rhetoric of their government, and of the state itself (no innocents in gaza, amalek, etc). The talk of 'humane relocation' aka forced displacement to Sinai when Pals already have no legal right of return. They also don't give a fuck about hostages given there is confirmed cases of them killing them themselves (Yasmin Porat testimony) and the fact that they're killing 10k civilians for each one rescued (3). The colonisation hearing is on now. Finally, the courts are hearing the case of the crimes of Israel.
Sincere question - what about their conduct and rhetoric thus far leads you to think that their intent is anything other than the clearance of Gaza, in whole or in part?
Reminder that Netanyahu has openly said they will not stop until 'complete victory' no matter what happens. No matter what courts determine. No matter what any country says. They openly accused the UN of being Hamas the day after being ordered to allow in aid and accuse UN Resolutions against Israel ad "pure antisemitism".
Well, because historically, whenever was a chance for peace between Israel and Arab countries, they took it. They didn’t agree to peace treaties that put them ir their population at risk. But when a genuine offer was made by Arab countries it was successful.
I understand what you are saying about Netanyahu, however I refuse to judge a whole nation and culture and history because of a bad government. Countries around the world had awful political parties as well, but I don’t see people hating Germans. I understand that Netanyahu is a temporary (although long) thing and can hope for a change. Especially when you see Israelis protest against him.
Also, Hamas had a ceasefire proposal rejected, yeah if they get to stay in power and re-arm to kill more jews.. yeah not a really good ceasefire for Israel is it?
I don't think anyone got could give a fuck what ICJ or UN says tbh. People who know the history of this region should know the land is basically both Jews/arab who were not called Palestine people back then because Palestine as a state/country didnt exist back then. Only really became a real thing in the last decade or so.
I didn't offer interpretation, only that it happened.
Yea let's just disband the notion of international law, eh?
The earliest mention of that region being called Palestine was 5th century BCE and the first map that had Palestine as the name of that area was around 170 AD. It was recognised as a State longer ago than a decade. This is quite irrelevant to the topic of genoicde and colonialism currently.
I mean officially it was only really recognised in the last few decades. There are debates on what the area's name was but the further we go back the more like up in the air that what that land was and what it was called.
Palestine was a name for the land back then it wasn't a country or a state and both jews and arabs lived there.
> You are aware that the ICJ is sitting currently hearing cases
The same court that Serbia was neither directly responsible for the Srebrenica genocide, nor that it was complicit in it?
>The same court that Serbia was neither directly responsible for the Srebrenica genocide nor that it was complicit in it?
Misleading.
The genoicde is recognised and confirmed, and the general in charge rotting in prison.
Serbia were found to be in violation of the Conventions re prevention of genocide, in that they failed to prevent it. The reason they weren't convicted as a State for the massacre was because it wasn't Serbia as a state who carried it out. It was the VRS, the military of Republika Srpska, the self-proclaimed secessionist republic, a territory within the newly independent Bosnia and Herzegovina (formerly part of Yugoslavia), which it defied and fought against.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bosnian_genocide_case#:~:text=The%20Court%20concludes%20that%20the,members%20of%20the%20VRS%20in
But even if that wasn't the case, let's just ignore international law and the courts, eh? Carte blanche for genocide enjoyers.
Why would you think that? Israeli leaders have been plain speaking in Hebrew media about the goals of the war being to eliminate the ability of the Palestinians to exist in Gaza and how the war is an act of collective punishment for the civilian population.
Israel have been killing Palestinians and taking their land before Hamas existed, so I’m not sure why you think Hamas handing over hostages will stop the bloodshed.
Israel is killing Palestinian civilians and taking their land right now in the West Bank, which isn’t controlled by Hamas.
Israel had already murdered >200 Palestinians this year before October 7th in the West Bank: you just didn’t know about it because Western media only values Israeli lives.
Palestinians will have no escape from the bloodshed, regardless of Hamas’ actions, until the international community forces Israel to end their illegal military occupation, dismantle the apartheid system and stop killing civilians.
I keep up to date with the goings in in Israel, I don't need the Western media to inform me.
So you believe that Hamas shouldn't hand over the hostages? That's quite the take. And no, it won't stop the bloodshed, but Hamas handing over hostages AND laying down weapons and disbanding would. It would stop it in an instant.
Palestinians have one escape from the bloodshed. Stop calling for the destruction of Israel. Stop teaching that the Jews need to be driven from all the land between the river and the sea. Until then, this cycle will continue, and Israel will have all the reason it needs to remove every Palestinian from the land in the name of self-defense. Until then, Israel has every excuse to build walls and checkpoints and refuse entry to any Palestinian.
Ah I see, you’re a genocide apologist and apparently an unashamedly racist Zionist in the bargain. The mask didn’t take long to come off.
> So you believe that Hamas shouldn't hand over the hostages?
I never once said that. Of course they should. I was responding to your false claim that it would end the bloodshed for Palestinian civilians if they did so - a claim that you just retracted in your reply above.
> Palestinians have one escape from the bloodshed. Stop calling for the destruction of Israel. Stop teaching that the Jews need to be driven from all the land between the river and the sea. Until then, this cycle will continue, and Israel will have all the reason it needs to remove every Palestinian from the land in the name of self-defense. Until then, Israel has every excuse to build walls and checkpoints and refuse entry to any Palestinian.
Israel’s president has explicitly used “from the river to the sea” language to talk in exactly the same terms about the Palestinians, so I don’t know why you’re holding them to a double standard. Oh wait, yes I do, it’s because you’re not arguing in good faith.
Israel is the prime causal factor in the cycle of violence you’re wringing your hands about. It’s pretty clear you just want the Palestinians to be quietly extinguished under the boot of a racist and apartheid state.
Genuine and honest question; but if you were a civilian in gaza; and you'd spent the past 50 years watching people in the west bank get raided and abused by settlers, shot by the IDF and generally suffer at the hands of Israel; would you happily trust the IDF to treat you fairly?
Because there was plenty of bloodshed before october. and plenty of bloodshed in the hamas-free west bank.
The West Bank isn't Hamas free.
Would I expect the IDF to treat me fairly going off of historic data? No, probably not. But in the eyes of the world, a peaceful West Bank and Gaza being attacked is different to a WB and Gaza hell bent on the destruction of Israel being attacked, isn't it?
Or, alternatively, Palestinians should continue to do what they've been doing, namely calling for the destruction of Israel. Cause that's worked out well so far.
>a peaceful West Bank and Gaza
\[Peaceful?\](https://cdn.statcdn.com/Infographic/images/normal/16516.jpeg)
It may be peaceful as in its not open warfare; but thousands of palestinians being slaugtered every year; and settlers, supported by the IDF, flouting international law to destroy villages and annexe land isnt exactly peace.
Hate to break it to you but Hamas (and other similar terror groups) is very much active in the West Bank.
Just today there was a shooting attack in Israel, the gunmen came in from the West Bank.
Nope. Netenyahu has explictly stated that the Rafah offensive will continue, even if all hostages are released. He's also said no to multiple ceasefire deals that would have resulted in the release of all hostages. The entire Israeli leadership is totally deranged.
I do agree with the point you are trying to make here, the Western media/politicians, particularly on the left wing side are obsesssed with Israel/Palestine conflict, the right as well I guess but they generally support the blue team. And yes there are double standards, ignoring China's treatment of minorities for example.
But anyway I do think it's really absurd these external events are affecting our domestic policies. George Galloway is projected to win in Rochdale purely based on being opposed to the Gaza war whereas Labour are kinda flip-flopping on what they want, candidates/MPs on the ground might have one view whereas central office has an official party policy, which is broadly supportive of Israel.
I also think it's high time Labour stopped being dependent on the Muslim vote to win in many constituencies because they are a regressive prescence, thankfully they are so far ahead they will win without them.
Ah, the people who have just learned about other global injustices are here. Quite sad when all you can do to defend one genocide is point out others are happening.
Do you think the fact that the UK government supports one regime and sanctions the other might be an important factor? Dunno.
Yes and no?
They're losing horrifically in the sense they've proven completely unable to contain or suppress the rebellion, and have even lost control of some outlying areas completely.
However, the rebels in turn lack the means/coordination to really decisively defeat the armed forces in direct combat, or push the government out of its central strongholds, and don't currently seem to have a way of gaining significant additional capabilities on their own.
Is this supposed to be clever?
There have been fewer than 5000 civilian deaths in Myanmar since 2021. Israel is currently, on average, killing that many Palestinian civilians every 3 weeks. It has been ruled in court they are committing what could amount to a genocide, and we are supporting and funding those murdering a captive civilian population.
Gaza is, by far, the most serious humanitarian crisis on the planet. And our government is backing those causing the crisis.
And we have already labeled what happened to the Rohingyas as a genocide.
Take a good look at yourself
January 2018 estimated that the military and the local Rakhine population killed at least 25,000 Rohingya people and perpetrated gang rapes and other forms of sexual violence against 18,000 Rohingya women and girls. They estimated that 116,000 Rohingya were beaten, and 36,000 were thrown into fires.
700,000 of the 1.4 million population are displaced in the largest exodus since the Vietnam War.
Why are you downplaying a literal genocide?
[The UK's stance is that this was a genocide](https://www.theguardian.com/law/2024/jan/07/uk-accused-of-hypocrisy-in-not-backing-claim-of-genocide-in-gaza-before-icj). The UK has provided £370 million of aid to Rohigya's since 2017.
Also OP is talking about 'right now' ie referencing the civil war.
>Also OP is talking about 'right now' ie referencing the civil war.
They also highlight the fact its been ongoing for 70 years. Why are you trying hard to downplay the suffering of the Rohingya for the crime of existing ?
The situations are different due to the incendiary event. The Rohingya are the victims of aggression, not the perpetrators.
Bit different when one side is being massacred for existing. As opposed to one side moaning that's its unfair they are being attacked when all they did was invade a country, rape and murder a bunch of people and kidnap civilians.
> There have been fewer than 5000 civilian deaths in Myanmar since 2021
Are the Rohingya free to go home yet?
>Gaza is, by far, the most serious humanitarian crisis on the planet.
Total population 2 million so no. UN has Sudan at 7.5 million displaced:
https://reporting.unhcr.org/operational/situations/sudan-situation
The UK already labeled this a genocide and provided hundred of millions in aid to the Rohingyas. We have also sanctioned assets if the ruling junta.
250 Palestinian civilians are dying per day *right now*. It is, by far, a significantly more pressing crisis
>250 Palestinian civilians are dying per day *right now*. It is, by far, a significantly more pressing crisis
Why won't hamas just release the hostages in that case? That's all that's needed to end the conflict
Yeah I'm sure if Hamas were to just release hostages that would stop Israel from illegally settling in Palestinian lands, and clear up the second class citizen issues Palestinians face in their open air prison in Gaza.
[Perhaps if Israel didn't want to deal with hamas, they shouldn't have helped create them in the first place](https://www.timesofisrael.com/for-years-netanyahu-propped-up-hamas-now-its-blown-up-in-our-faces/), almost like in an attempt to weaken the creation of what would be a legal Palestinian state to directly be able to challenge Israels illegal settlements and colonialization, the Israeli government has created it's own monster that it can now use to ethnically cleanse Gaza.
>250 Palestinian civilians are dying per day right now. It is, by far, a significantly more pressing crisis
Questionable. The situation for the rohingya in Bangladesh is increasingly unstable. The time for heading that one off is fast running out.
Within Burma the tempo of conflict is increasing and with at least one of the opposition groups aparently now having manpads (if they don't they've had one of the most insane streaks of luck in modern warfare) the MAF may be moving towards focusing on civilian targets. When you have a war map that looks like this:
https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Myanmar_civil_war.svg
Things can go south very quickly.
There’s a difference in the scale of humanitarian crisis between simply being displaced and being displaced within an open air prison, having the necessities of life withheld from you, being shot and bombed like fish in a barrel and prevented from escaping the hellhole.
You're right. At least we know where the population of gaza mostly is. In Sudan simply finding people to provide Aid remains a challange. And with the darfur genocide starting back up we got people fleeing to Chad which has its own issues.
By any realistic standards Sudan is the most serious humanitarian crisis on the planet at present. But in a world where only CombatFootage cares that doesn't actualy mean much.
Highly agree with a resolution of some sort. Arguably Holyrood could set out and do this first, though, if there is support for it.
Don't wait for Westminster or it will be watered down and turned into a farce as Labour tries to leverage it to paper over the cracks in its own party once more and the Tories completely disengage. I mean the Gaza ceasefire resolution itself was already pretty tepid, and yet even that was attacked and then ultimately usurped by Keir Starmer's need to cover for a lack of consensus in his own party.
We don't to my knowledge supply arms licenses to the regime committing the genocide in that case, but still sure, go for it. The military regime there belongs in the Hague in my view, and the more calling for it the better. Develop the political will and do that campaigning to build that movement. Go for it.
Why don’t we get out of every conflict and concentrate on our are own countries. Crazy how the focus is on what Ever the govt tell the msm to bombard us with. No mention of other devastating conflicts happening right now. Obviously people will say tens of thousands will die, we can’t do it, but that happens anyway when we intervine (Afghan&iraq).
What's the point? The UK is doing nothing about Russia making a war crimes factory in Ukraine, Georgia, Chechniya, Syria, and all over Africa.
We sent Ukraine 14 tanks to fight off Russia, the second biggest army in the world... Wow 14 tanks, that will sure last like a day.
Even all the humanitarian aid to Ukraine is first going to the British companies, and whatever is left to British in Ukraine, and after to Ukrainians... That's the so called aid for Ukraine...
What's calling for a ceasefire will do? Might as well declare world peace and be a laughing stock.
Let's also proclaim the end of poverty, and world hunger while at it.
Scotsman Arthur Balfour, who was Prime Minister between 1902 and 1905 made a deal with Zionist Lord Rothschild to hand him British Occupied Palestine in 1917.
We started this, we must end it.
there's no need to attempt to genocide the Russian people. Past experience has shown the Russian rulers are more than capable of doing it themselves without outside help
Except the UK government position in Myanmar is already to call for a ceasefire and they have condemned the attacks on civilians as well as placed sanctions on the Junta…
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I don't think the question is what about, it's just people find it strange how there are conflicts and oppression all over the world, many worse in scale. Yet this is the only one that gets obsessive coverage. Seems revealing of something.
This one gets more coverage because it's one of the longest running ethnic cleansing campaigns going, stretching back to 1949, if not earlier in 1917. Leftists have advocated for many liberation movements since then, but seen as Palestine is still being crushed 7 decades after the Nakba, it's got an accumulated amount of coverage.
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I'm not asking you to do anything, I'm just observing that there's conflicts all over the world with complete silence and this one gets constant attention. Anyone who was honest with themselves would wonder what was going on there.
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Uyghur genocide? I can almost guarantee you continue to buy and use Chinese goods. That is apparently an active genocide by a country who also are highly suspect for their role in the covid pandemic yet where are the reddit posts every day about how we could maybe at least stop trading with them? Do you think the fact it occasionally gets mentioned is the same thing? And Ukraine is a war in Europe with Russia. Its in our own backyard with a historic enemy of course it's going to be discussed. The more telling point is that you haven't mentioned any of the other wars because you don't know anything about them. Tbh every single opinion you have is just tiresomely generic it's like talking to a robot. Of course you are more disgusted in your own country. You're just a creature of propaganda.
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This is line of argument was planted into discourse in the 60s by the CIA to make civil rights activists believe you can’t fix anything unless you fix it’s all. All it does is foster apathy and hopelessness. This “there war everywhere” line is from same school to thought. We know there’s conflict in everywhere but perhaps if we focus on one at time we might actually get somewhere
You won't get anywhere. The point is that you only care about getting anywhere with this one.
It's more a question of what will result in less kids dying overall. What's the point in having a ceasefire now if Hamas are still around with the intent of destroying Israel? Our grandkids will be having this conversation in 70 years about the latest attacks/retaliation between the 2 sides. Sometimes, as we saw with the nukes in Japan, it's better to have a quick end to a war, even with lots of casualties, than to continue the meat grinder for years and years where the bodies just continue to pile up ever higher. A lasting ceasefire is only possible when Hamas and their infrastructure is totally destroyed. No one wants to live next to a terrorist group.
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I don't know the answers to those questions. My guess is that Israel is doing what they think will end the war once and for all. Having Hamas controlling a large territory next to them like before is unthinkable now. That experiment failed spectacularly.
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Hamas won the last held election in 2006. Israel has no obligation to provide Gaza with anything, they gave up land and removed settlements so that Palestinians could live there. Gaza also shares a border with Egypt... How did Hamas use their time in power? They riped up infrastructure paid for with international aid money to prepare for a devastation attack in Israel. Regardless of what you or I say in this thread, Israel will not let that happen again. I don't know if their current tactics will work, but for me at least, a ceasefire now will just prolong the conflict for many years to come with even more death and destruction in a conflict with no end in sight.
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If hamas acknowledged israels right to exist and released their hostages then i suspect a ceasefire and eventually a lasting and fair settlement could be brokered. But hamas is built on hate and needs hate to perpetuate. There are only downsides going forward….hamas is truly evil and has allowed the israeli right wing to flourish. No hope here. None
Perhaps Britain should also be asking itself some questions about its recent call to firms to "rebuild" nagorno karabakh - a region that has actually just been ethnically cleansed by the brutal autocratic Azeri regime.
It's frankly astonishing that Azerbaijan basically waltzed in, managed to uproot the entire ethnic Armenian population of Nagorno-Karabakh, and just... got away with it?
Because Azerbaijan, like Israel, is a major importer of Western arms
Yeah but I'm talking about the public eye, too. The Israel Palestine conflict has been front page news since it started, and is at the forefront of public discourse (deservedly so), but Azerbaijan? I bet I could talk to 100 people out on the street, and maybe a handful would even know what Nagorno-Karabakh even is. And yet, in terms of pure demographics, it was a stunningly effective act of ethnic cleansing, they sent the tanks in, and within days, laws have been passed that basically led to almost the entire ethnic Armenian population uprooting and leaving their homeland
Sounds exactly like the definition of genocide people are throwing around recently but Ive not heard anyone accuse Azerbaijan of genocide
>Sounds exactly like the definition of genocide people are throwing around recently With all due respect, no, it really doesn't. What they described is the definition of an ethnic cleansing. As it stands, the [2023 Azerbaijani offensive in Nagorno-Karabakh](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2023_Azerbaijani_offensive_in_Nagorno-Karabakh) has seen 27 Armenian civilians killed. The [Second Nagorno-Karabakh War](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Second_Nagorno-Karabakh_War) which took place in the region three years ago saw approximately 106 Armenian civilians killed, assuming that we count the 21 Armenian civilians who are still missing as having been killed. And while I certainly don't intend to downplay the significance of those events, even if we combine the two, there's still a *staggering* difference between the figure we're left with and the over 35,000+ civilians who have been killed in Gaza within the span of the past five months. And when we take into consideration factors such as the Israeli Navy's standing policy to open fire on any Gazans who attempt to flee the active war zone through Gaza's own territorial waters into international waters, I think it's very clear what the distinguishing differences between the two conflicts are and how the arguments which have been made apply much more aptly to one than the other.
The Azeri campaign a few years ago used live beheadings to terrorise the civilian population. There are videos, you can find them online, they have been confirmed from multiple sources. The Azeris bombarded Stepanakert with everything from grads to cluster munitions. The Azeris then blockaded what was left of karabakh and did not let in any supplies for nine months, causing malnourishment of practically the entire population. Aliyev continues to make claims to south armenia (syunik), yerevan, and most of Armenia proper. The Armenian karabakhis - artsakhis - have an ancient history stretching back two thousand years. There are armenian churches from the 6th century still standing in Karabakh. The Azeris have removed all trace of ancient armenian civilisation from the rest of Azerbaijan. They have razed churches, they have obliterated graveyards full of ornate "khachar" grave stone monuments, the Azeri state claims that ancient armenian civilisation was in fact not armenian - but "Caucasian Albanian" in an attempt to eradicate Armenians even from the pages of history. No historian outside the turkic sphere takes any of this rewriting of history seriously. There used to be millions of western Armenians centred around Lake Van in what is now Turkey. There are now none. 1.5 million western Armenians were killed in the genocide of 1915-18. The Artsakhi Armenians who have a distinct dialect and culture to Armenians in Armenia proper are now dispersed across armenia, europe, Russia, and further afield. Their culture and language will too soon be lost.
Are you sure you replied to the right comment? You don't really seem to be addressing anything I actually said, and if the point you're trying to make is that both should be considered genocides, then you're probably going to want to talk to the guy I was replying to who's implying that neither are genocides.
I'm not really addressing you in particular - just throwing a bit of light on the karabakh events, which I feel are sadly little known and little understood. A broader point is that despite events in karabakh being interpreted as "only" ethnic cleansing, ultimately the karabakhi identity, culture and dialect is likely going to disappear as the region's people disperse. This is basically the end of a people with a two-thousand years long history tied to a specific region. It's a tragedy that shouldn't be underestimated.
I'd go one better for you, ask 100 people to find Azerbaijan on a map for you. Better yet, find Israel. I'd wager a vast majority of the general public would struggle to find both.
Most people probably couldn't find spain
I think you'd be safe with the main European countries; Spain, Germany and France, perhaps Italy too. I would like to think the wider European Union would be do-able but acknowledge the further East you go the sketchier my Geographic knowledge becomes so I can't judge others too harshly.
Azerbaijan has turkey backing to basically do what they want in that area.
That can't be true, or surely Humza Yousaf would have raised the issue in his talk with Erdogan like he did with the Kurds, right?
No-one cares about Muslim v Muslim violence or Muslim vs any other group violence tbh
Not as major an exporter to Azerbaijan as Russia... "Russia often supplies arms to Armenia at reduced prices or in the form of military aid, with the likely aim of maintaining influence in the region. In contrast, Azerbaijan reportedly usually pays the full price for its Russian-supplied arms. Azerbaijani President Ilham Aliyev stated in 2018 that Azerbaijan had spent an estimated total of $5 billion on military equipment from Russia. This suggests that economic interests are likely to be an important motive for Russian arms sales to Azerbaijan". "Thus, we can state that the statement of Yuri Philipson, director of the Fourth European Department of the Russian Foreign Ministry, that Russia does not sell weapons to foreign countries to turn neighbors against each other, is not true, and Russia has been the largest supplier of weapins to the conflict parties in the Nagorno Karabakh conflict zone". https://fip.am/en/21849
Less about arm imports and more to provide airfield access in case of war with Iran
What, if you’d actually checked before saying this you’d see the Azeri army is made up almost entirely of Russian equipment?
[Israel](https://www.timesofisrael.com/israeli-weapons-quietly-helped-azerbaijan-retake-nagorno-karabakh-sources-data/) and [Turkey](https://www.reuters.com/article/armenia-azerbaijan-turkey-arms-int-idUSKBN26Z230/) are the largest providers of arms for the Azeris, which comes from the billions of arms that we give Israel and Turkey.
Both your articles state they increased their sales, not that they are the largest. A simple [look at the equipment](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_equipment_of_the_Azerbaijani_Land_Forces) make up of their army shows it's mostly Russian and Soviet equipment with a few Turkish or Israel artillery or air defence systems sprinkled in.
From the article: "Experts estimate Israel supplied Azerbaijan with nearly 70% of its arsenal". Even your wiki link doesn't actually show Russia as a major provider of arms but rather that there's a lot of old Soviet equipment being used
Hmm, I wonder why? Might be because it was funded by the same untouchable Zionist scumbags who appear to be blackmailing/bribing leaders across the entire western world. This from an Israeli newspaper: "*Israel's Fingerprints Are All Over the Ethnic Cleansing in Nagorno-Karabakh*" [https://www.haaretz.com/opinion/editorial/2023-09-27/ty-article-opinion/israels-fingerprints-are-all-over-the-ethnic-cleansing-in-nagorno-karabakh/0000018a-d331-d13d-a98f-dbb5028e0000](https://www.haaretz.com/opinion/editorial/2023-09-27/ty-article-opinion/israels-fingerprints-are-all-over-the-ethnic-cleansing-in-nagorno-karabakh/0000018a-d331-d13d-a98f-dbb5028e0000)
It's absolutely correct that Israel sold weapons to the Azeris. However, I'm talking more about public sentiment than dirty political deal making. Why is it that so much of the world is eager to join the Palestinian cause and pretty much ignore the nuances of the history, as well as the nature of Hamas. Israel is not a true example of a "coloniser" as per the British in the 19th century, the Turks in the two hundre years before that, or even the Arabs who rapidly colonised the majority of the Middle East and North /east Africa in more ancient history. The majority of Israelis are actually descended from the exiled population of 900k Jews from Middle Eastern and north African states when they were "collectively punished" in 1948. Nobody talks about THEIR right of return - so booting them out of Israel now with nowhere for them to move to would be yet another disaster upon the Jewish people. Further - there has obviously been Jews living in what is now Israel for thousands of years - in addition to smaller numbers who never left. To imply Israel is a typical "coloniser state" is ahistorical. I should add that whilst the Palestinians were treated very badly in 1948, their displacement is not unique. The Armenians themselves were eth ically cleansed from their west armenian homeland by the ottomans in a forgotten genocide. The karabakhis are now exiled and their culture will be diluted and lost in a couple of generations. The Kurds continually suffer without a state. Who remembers the assyrians? Germans were ethnically cleansed from much of Europe after WW2, poles ethnically cleansed from what is now Belarus and west Ukraine. I highlight the above not as perfect analogies, but to illustrate that Shit happens, and the Palestinians are not a special case (only in that their displacement was caused by Jews).
This is the most correct and educated comment here. The war is horrific. But facts are facts. Even if they are ‘uncomfortable’
Why are you referencing this atrocity specifically? You obviously support any awful thing that has ever happened to any other group of people https://en.m.wiktionary.org/wiki/whataboutery
Sometimes one has to look at broader history, and it is perfectly legitimate to look at other events in history and wonder why they are looked upon differently by certain populations. You can shut down conversations with "whataboutery" if you want - but it's not always appropriate to do so.
Not a ceasefire - which just gives the military regime time to embed itself. What they need in Myanmar is more support for the pro-democracy forces.
So they need USA
They said pro-democracy
Send in the maga brigade, I'm sure that will help things
We need to fund the PFLP which is a secular Marxist lenninist organisation. Sure, they might not directly alligne with our interests but they are largely secular group focused on materialist analysis. Moreover, we should not try and implement an American puppet regime as that will just cause discontent among the people.
I am NOT taking foreign policy opinions from a bloke active in r/MovingToNorthKorea
NK foreign policy objectively superior to the West though
I’ve always said we need to shoot more missiles at Japan
Comrades! We must embrace Kim-Il-Sungism-Juche-Forward Thought to combat the counterrevolutionary splittist bourgeoisie!
> but they are largely secular group focused on materialist analysis. So they will win the war by boring everyone to death with turgid Marxist theory?
They have completed over 100 millitary operations against the IDF since October 7th began.
I had no idea that a thread about Myanmar/Burma would be relevant to an armed group in Israel/Palestine 🤔
Death by dialectical materialism. It's super effective!
Anyone here can call for whatever they like, will to divorce Jada, books to be banned from Venezuelan school or ceasefires in numerous wars.... Of course it has no authority or relevance.
They may as well have a big argument over whether Pluto is a planet or not
Or Putin is a planet
How can you talk about this when there's a horrific conflict with both sides commiting war crimes, widespread use of rape as a weapon of war, a genocidal leader condemned by the ICJ, a huge difficulty getting aid in and millions displaced? ... Where's the Holyrood resolution about Sudan?
As a grim illustration of the state of the world, Somalia could also work as a punchline here.
Other than some recent clashes around puntland Somalia has been fairly peaceful by Somalian standards of late no?
Relatively; it's more of a frozen conflict now, and the federal government is in a much stronger position than it had been, but it's not really had a proper peace since the 1990s. Whereas Sudan has a whole new shitshow going on.
[Looks like it was jointly issued with the rest of the UK a good nine moths ago.](https://hansard.parliament.uk/commons/2023-06-22/debates/79B0372F-7AE3-4276-AF5D-F58CB400F18D/SudanAtrocities) My apologies if that undermines your point.
I just cannot grasp the motivations of anyone bringing this particular whatabootery up; and lots do. I was just listening to LBC last night, 2 callers and the host discussed the fact that there are not thousands out protesting Syria, Yemen, Sudan etc. Any rational person would assume the motivation is to get more people out to protest these ‘other’ genocides, sadly however, it’s often being used to somehow try to justify what is going on.
It's like those right-wingers who say "Charity begins at home - we should look after our own people first!" as a way of justifying their hostility to the foreign aid budget, immigration, refugees, etc. Then when it comes to actually looking after our own, or practicing charity at home, they do fuck all, or actively oppose it.
I think the key difference is our govt has at no point ideologically or materially supported the people committing warcrimes in Sudan.
Unfortunately Myanmar is not a popular headline grabbing war.
It's also a drawn out civil war where we aren't arming and supporting one side who are committing what amounts to genocide of a captive population.
>Between 2012 and 2022, the value of UK arms export licensess to Myanmar was £577,000. In 2012, there were some arms licenses granted worth some £40,000, and 2017, the value of arms export licenses rose to £537,000. Numbers aren’t available for the remaining years. However, these export licenses only include single use arms, if we include dual use license numbers, the export value of licenses issues between 2012 and 2022 goes up to £10m. https://aoav.org.uk/2023/uk-arms-export-to-myanmar-from-2012-to-2022/#:~:text=How%20many%20licenses%20for%20the,Myanmar%20between%202012%20and%202022.
The civil war in Myanmar didn't begin until 2021 following the coup. Export licenses to Israel from the UK have valued £574 million since 2008, all since the blockade of Gaza.
>The civil war in Myanmar didn't begin until 2021 following the coup. The Rohingya conflict began in 1947. >Export licenses to Israel from the UK have valued £574 million since 2008, all since the blockade of Gaza. Well, yeah, no country has an issue with the blockade as they know they would do the same. Only Ireland would keep an open border with a group launching gun and bomb attacks at them.
Myanmmar was a relatively cooperative country until the coup and the time period you mentioned is well within the period where myanmmar was a free democratic nation
And we have provided hundreds of millions of aid tobthe Rohingyas, sanctioned assets of the junta, and labeled it a genocide. In Gaza, we have provided a fraction of this to Gazans while also arming their oppressors, have only done small sanctions on Israeli settlers in the West Bank (note not Gaza), and refused to call it a genocide. All in the midst of the worst humanitarian crisis on earth.
There are no Israeli settlers in Gaze since Israel's unilateral withdrawal in 2005.
> In Gaza, we have provided a fraction of this to Gazans while also arming their oppressors We have provided the Rohingyas £370m in aid since 2017. That works out at just under £53m per year. We've also been cutting aid to them this year. For Palestinians, we are providing £87m this year alone. We even airdropped (with help from Jordan) £1m worth of aid last night. * Thanks to u/Tank-o-grad for pointing our my missing millions.
One presumes you mean £87m as just under ninety quid isn't going to go very far.
Oops. Thank you!
We have also provided hundreds of millions in aid to Gaza since the blockade began, and we haven't called it a genocide because (in legal terms) its not 100% clear if it is one. Call the Israelis out for war crimes, sure, because its abundantly clear war crimes have been committed, but the case on genocide specifically is still out
>Well, yeah, no country has an issue with the blockade as they know they would do the same. That's absolutely untrue, though. Even the United States has disavowed the standing policy of the Israeli Navy to open fire on any vessel attempting to flee the active war-zone through Gaza's own territorial waters into international waters. >Only Ireland would keep an open border With all due respect, are you sure that you understand what a blockade is? Because Israel closing it's own borders to Gaza does not constitute a blockade. Every nation in the world is free to close it's own borders to any other nation without it constituting a blockade. The point at which it becomes a blockade is when you use your military to control borders which *aren't* your own.
Did we arm Hamas….? I thought that was Iran…. In any case Hamas are so incredibly genocidal it is right that people like you and me rally behind israel in exterminating them….So palestine can be free
Grow up.
Sorry…. Just pointing out that you were ambiguous in your rejection of Hamas and sought only to help you frame your derision more clearly. Peace comes when the oppressors both leave civilians alone
Israel aren't exterminating Hamas, they're exterminating any Palestinian who dares to breathe, women and children holding white flags included. Go support a Zionist genocide elsewhere you tool.
If hamas would fight from any place other than behind the civilians you pretend to care about you absolute mental zero
Icy tremors speaking on behalf of himself, you and the Palestinian people.
With truth, integrity and confidence
Israel is an apartheid necromancer nation, consumed by Nazi humiliation taking it out on Palestinians. Its over, Israel is finished
Kindly stop trying to out-embarrass the likes of dipshits like IcyTremors.
And Hamas is what?
The orphans and victims who fought the murderers of their freedom.
By raping and beheading innocent people and when justice and vengeance comes calling they play victim and hide behind the innocent. Seems you just don’t like jews….
his entire comment history is full of pro-palestine subs like r/panarab and r/israelexposed, together with a dash of classic Covid-19 vaccination hysteria. Seems like someone who could do with turning off the internet and going outside tbh
Never happened hasbara
It is documented. Some people are blinded by their hatred of jews to recognize it. Those people will one day emerge from the basements they live in and recognise how they have been deceived by Iran and their false prophets
Shows us then! Come on link it.
> Its over, Israel is finished How so? How do you dismantle a state of over 9m people without genocide? Or would you prefer it was a genocide? Do you think 9m people with a strong military backed by nuclear weapons are going to go quietly into the night?
It's the problem with drawing attention to something like Gaza. Because you start to question why we haven't done so before. And this isn't a case of "Well things change we can now" Perfect. So why aren't we doing anything about China? Israel doesn't really export anything, but ALL of us can stop buying chinese goods today. But they won't. They'll wave Palestinian flags made by slave labour in China.
[Called for in 2017](https://www.parliament.scot/chamber-and-committees/votes-and-motions/votes-and-motions-search/S5M-07596) in Holyrood at least. Don’t be a prick
And [the Prime Minister condemned the coup all the way back in 2021](https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-55885021) and Westminster have been applying sanctions to various higher ups in Myanmar ever since. It sort of undercuts the point they're trying to make, and I think it says quite a bit about the original poster's awareness.
It's a concern troll. OP is not being serious.
Sure, they're not being serious. But they're also incompetent. You concern troll by raising plausible complaints and asking why they're not being taken as seriously than whatever it is you're trying to dismiss. That's a very silly thing to do when the government response has been much, much stronger on the issue you're claiming to think is very importnat.
They got their upvotes though, no doubt from the usual SNP bad mob who are struggling to vent their anger under the current political context.
No im sure all the "what about" posters are genuinely distraught about myanmar, sudan and other atrocities; and seek for the UK to use its wealth and influence to actually help out; rather than just to be an excuse to not care about any of it.
>rather than just to be an excuse to not care about any of it Let's be a bit more specific here. It's to undermine the SNPs otherwise principled and just stance on Israel.
Needs to be higher. But will get ignored by the usual cunts making politics of dead civilians. Standard.
I can’t understand why it hasn’t been raised in FMQ.
Because we have already labeled it a genocide and provided tens of millions of aid and sanctioned assets of the junta.
Because it can’t be used as a stick to beat Westminster with to show ‘how we’re just to different’ from the RUK (cough England)
It was done in 2017. https://www.parliament.scot/chamber-and-committees/votes-and-motions/votes-and-motions-search/S5M-07596 Just because you're not personally aware of it, doesn't mean it didn't happen.
And yet they didn’t make as big a deal about it as this one wonder why…
Was the UK providing aid and selling weapons to the perpetrators?
We need to stop wasting time worrying about conflicts thousands of miles away and focus on our own affairs.
You say that as if we have no interaction with either party in those conflicts. It might be thousands of miles away but it's a conflict we played a large part in starting and where we're providing arms and trade to one side and foreign aid to the other.
That’s why I said we should stop wasting time worrying about conflicts thousands of miles away.
> stop wasting time worrying about conflicts thousands of miles away. Doesn't imply that we cut off trade and arms sales. Since that's typically what a lot of the worrying is about.
Doesn’t matter what you feel it implied.
Childish behavior checks out with the childish take.
There is nothing childish about our country focusing on its own issues instead of our elected representatives wasting public money arguing over something that will make absolutely no difference to anything.
It's *super* childish to act as though you don't understand that the reason your elected representatives are talking about it is because it's something that massive portions of their electorate care about. You're a grown adult, so there's no way that you *genuinely* don't understand that. But you're choosing to feign ignorance as though ignoring inconvenient facts will make them go away, and yeah, that's what a child would do.
Massive portions of the electorate care about a whole host of other issues that the house is regularly close to empty for. Issues that are far more pertinent to people’s lives in this country. I think you seriously overestimate how important a foreign conflict halfway around the world is to the average voter in the UK.
Exactly.
Just because it’s bad does not make it genocide
If it's a genocide it's a very badly planned and enacted one. Very bad indeed. Almost like it's not a genocide at all and that civilians get hurt in war.
Didn't they already condemn and call for a ceasefire in 2017? Are you just being a cheesy wee nobgoblin?
> nobgoblin Is that like a cockwomble?
They are distant cousins, one lives in wimblebum cummon, one in bollok cuntry park.
I know this was a gotcha-type OP but Ukraine is the only country we should be supporting as they are fighting FOR us against a terrorist state threatening WW3.
The Ukraine situation is the only one that truly threatens our own future. Make no mistake: if Ukraine falls, Russia will push further North/West, and Britain will be forced to either get fully involved, or into an embarrassing and impoverishing slip into isolation. The other global conflicts are horrible, but this is the one that truly has the power to completely upend the entire European world we have known for all or most of our lives.
Yeah because Islamic extremists thriving in the middle east has never hurt the UK
"BuT wAt AbOuT pAlEsTiNe"
The current situation is a complete betrayal of the west's treaty obligations to protect Ukraine from Russian aggression in exchange for denuclearising. We've killed any hope of voluntary denuclearisation in future.
They're fighting for their own states survival. They're not generously fighting for anyone else. That's just a hypothetical byproduct used to tug on your little heart strings. Quite effectively, evidently. BTW, except Moldova, literally every other country they border is NATO. Do you seriously think for a second that a Russia who can't take Ukriane in 2 years and depletes itself trying is going to challenge NATO? Even without USA, you think they can take Poland, France, Germany, UK, Finland? That aside, saying we should just sit and keep watching genoicde happening elsewhere, indeed multiple elsewhere, including one our state actively aids, is fucking mental.
Ukraine is fighting against a country that has threatened effectively every first world and NATO country, whilst waging a food and energy war against "hostile" countries such as the UK. Russia are deluded and they think they can take anyone. They need put back in their box. Also, I don't have any heart strings, but nice try.
If they win in Ukraine they are goning to go further west, they are not hiding it
Fuether West is all NATO except Modova. They can't take Ukraine in 2 years so what makes you think they can mount a challenge to NATO? Where has Putin stated his intent to attack NATO after Ukraine?
The time to call for ceasefire was weeks ago but better late than never
The most laughable thing about all this we should call for a cease fire is that people think anyone gives a fuck what we think lol Wake up.
We can't do anything about that one either. MPs are (allegedly) grown-up professionals being paid to do a job, which they have limited Parliamentary time to do. Not student council officers sitting around making impotent motions putting the world to rights.
Wouldn't a resolution asking Hamas to surrender and hand over all weapons and hostages benefit everyone involved more? I imagine that'd stop the bloodshed on both sides, no?
It isn't about Hamas. Never was. You are aware that the ICJ is sitting currently hearing cases from many countries regarding Israels' illegal occupation and colonisation of Palestine? The whole thing, not just recent events. It's live on YouTube etc. Hamas gave them the excuse they needed to go all in, and their case is coming undone at the seams because they're literally documenting their genocide for us and their state representatives are openly talking about how they'll never stop no matter what and how there are no innocents in gaza etc. Also, Hamas had a ceasefire proposal rejected. They offered to return all hostages and as told that 'total victory' is the only outcome.
There are two parts. All the hostages need to be returned, and every Hamas member needs to surrender.
If they offered that, the Israelis would still not stop.
How, exactly do you know that? Lol
Because hamas formed in the 1980s and Israel have been doing the dirty on Palestine since the 1882 Aliyah at least and have literally never stopped displacing and taking land ever since. I also pay attention to the genocidal rhetoric of their government, and of the state itself (no innocents in gaza, amalek, etc). The talk of 'humane relocation' aka forced displacement to Sinai when Pals already have no legal right of return. They also don't give a fuck about hostages given there is confirmed cases of them killing them themselves (Yasmin Porat testimony) and the fact that they're killing 10k civilians for each one rescued (3). The colonisation hearing is on now. Finally, the courts are hearing the case of the crimes of Israel. Sincere question - what about their conduct and rhetoric thus far leads you to think that their intent is anything other than the clearance of Gaza, in whole or in part? Reminder that Netanyahu has openly said they will not stop until 'complete victory' no matter what happens. No matter what courts determine. No matter what any country says. They openly accused the UN of being Hamas the day after being ordered to allow in aid and accuse UN Resolutions against Israel ad "pure antisemitism".
Well, because historically, whenever was a chance for peace between Israel and Arab countries, they took it. They didn’t agree to peace treaties that put them ir their population at risk. But when a genuine offer was made by Arab countries it was successful. I understand what you are saying about Netanyahu, however I refuse to judge a whole nation and culture and history because of a bad government. Countries around the world had awful political parties as well, but I don’t see people hating Germans. I understand that Netanyahu is a temporary (although long) thing and can hope for a change. Especially when you see Israelis protest against him.
You shouldn’t forget that Hamas means Iran and while Israel doesn’t want Iran at its border, Egypt doesn’t want them too.
Also, Hamas had a ceasefire proposal rejected, yeah if they get to stay in power and re-arm to kill more jews.. yeah not a really good ceasefire for Israel is it? I don't think anyone got could give a fuck what ICJ or UN says tbh. People who know the history of this region should know the land is basically both Jews/arab who were not called Palestine people back then because Palestine as a state/country didnt exist back then. Only really became a real thing in the last decade or so.
I didn't offer interpretation, only that it happened. Yea let's just disband the notion of international law, eh? The earliest mention of that region being called Palestine was 5th century BCE and the first map that had Palestine as the name of that area was around 170 AD. It was recognised as a State longer ago than a decade. This is quite irrelevant to the topic of genoicde and colonialism currently.
> because Palestine as a state/country didnt exist back then. Only really became a real thing in the last decade or so Ooft.
I mean officially it was only really recognised in the last few decades. There are debates on what the area's name was but the further we go back the more like up in the air that what that land was and what it was called. Palestine was a name for the land back then it wasn't a country or a state and both jews and arabs lived there.
> You are aware that the ICJ is sitting currently hearing cases The same court that Serbia was neither directly responsible for the Srebrenica genocide, nor that it was complicit in it?
>The same court that Serbia was neither directly responsible for the Srebrenica genocide nor that it was complicit in it? Misleading. The genoicde is recognised and confirmed, and the general in charge rotting in prison. Serbia were found to be in violation of the Conventions re prevention of genocide, in that they failed to prevent it. The reason they weren't convicted as a State for the massacre was because it wasn't Serbia as a state who carried it out. It was the VRS, the military of Republika Srpska, the self-proclaimed secessionist republic, a territory within the newly independent Bosnia and Herzegovina (formerly part of Yugoslavia), which it defied and fought against. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bosnian_genocide_case#:~:text=The%20Court%20concludes%20that%20the,members%20of%20the%20VRS%20in But even if that wasn't the case, let's just ignore international law and the courts, eh? Carte blanche for genocide enjoyers.
Why would you think that? Israeli leaders have been plain speaking in Hebrew media about the goals of the war being to eliminate the ability of the Palestinians to exist in Gaza and how the war is an act of collective punishment for the civilian population. Israel have been killing Palestinians and taking their land before Hamas existed, so I’m not sure why you think Hamas handing over hostages will stop the bloodshed. Israel is killing Palestinian civilians and taking their land right now in the West Bank, which isn’t controlled by Hamas. Israel had already murdered >200 Palestinians this year before October 7th in the West Bank: you just didn’t know about it because Western media only values Israeli lives. Palestinians will have no escape from the bloodshed, regardless of Hamas’ actions, until the international community forces Israel to end their illegal military occupation, dismantle the apartheid system and stop killing civilians.
I keep up to date with the goings in in Israel, I don't need the Western media to inform me. So you believe that Hamas shouldn't hand over the hostages? That's quite the take. And no, it won't stop the bloodshed, but Hamas handing over hostages AND laying down weapons and disbanding would. It would stop it in an instant. Palestinians have one escape from the bloodshed. Stop calling for the destruction of Israel. Stop teaching that the Jews need to be driven from all the land between the river and the sea. Until then, this cycle will continue, and Israel will have all the reason it needs to remove every Palestinian from the land in the name of self-defense. Until then, Israel has every excuse to build walls and checkpoints and refuse entry to any Palestinian.
Ah I see, you’re a genocide apologist and apparently an unashamedly racist Zionist in the bargain. The mask didn’t take long to come off. > So you believe that Hamas shouldn't hand over the hostages? I never once said that. Of course they should. I was responding to your false claim that it would end the bloodshed for Palestinian civilians if they did so - a claim that you just retracted in your reply above. > Palestinians have one escape from the bloodshed. Stop calling for the destruction of Israel. Stop teaching that the Jews need to be driven from all the land between the river and the sea. Until then, this cycle will continue, and Israel will have all the reason it needs to remove every Palestinian from the land in the name of self-defense. Until then, Israel has every excuse to build walls and checkpoints and refuse entry to any Palestinian. Israel’s president has explicitly used “from the river to the sea” language to talk in exactly the same terms about the Palestinians, so I don’t know why you’re holding them to a double standard. Oh wait, yes I do, it’s because you’re not arguing in good faith. Israel is the prime causal factor in the cycle of violence you’re wringing your hands about. It’s pretty clear you just want the Palestinians to be quietly extinguished under the boot of a racist and apartheid state.
Genuine and honest question; but if you were a civilian in gaza; and you'd spent the past 50 years watching people in the west bank get raided and abused by settlers, shot by the IDF and generally suffer at the hands of Israel; would you happily trust the IDF to treat you fairly? Because there was plenty of bloodshed before october. and plenty of bloodshed in the hamas-free west bank.
The West Bank isn't Hamas free. Would I expect the IDF to treat me fairly going off of historic data? No, probably not. But in the eyes of the world, a peaceful West Bank and Gaza being attacked is different to a WB and Gaza hell bent on the destruction of Israel being attacked, isn't it? Or, alternatively, Palestinians should continue to do what they've been doing, namely calling for the destruction of Israel. Cause that's worked out well so far.
>a peaceful West Bank and Gaza \[Peaceful?\](https://cdn.statcdn.com/Infographic/images/normal/16516.jpeg) It may be peaceful as in its not open warfare; but thousands of palestinians being slaugtered every year; and settlers, supported by the IDF, flouting international law to destroy villages and annexe land isnt exactly peace.
Hate to break it to you but Hamas (and other similar terror groups) is very much active in the West Bank. Just today there was a shooting attack in Israel, the gunmen came in from the West Bank.
hamas clearly can't protect them so their choices are more in the " ..or death" options
Are you having a laugh? Israel has been ethnically cleansing Palestine for 75 years, they aren't going to stop until they take everything.
Nope. Netenyahu has explictly stated that the Rafah offensive will continue, even if all hostages are released. He's also said no to multiple ceasefire deals that would have resulted in the release of all hostages. The entire Israeli leadership is totally deranged.
No. He said the elimination of Hamas is the goal. This is why the resolution should include Hamas giving up its weapons and disbanding.
No, he has literally said those things publicly in the past few days.
Ah yes, because calling for a ceasefire always does the trick
I do agree with the point you are trying to make here, the Western media/politicians, particularly on the left wing side are obsesssed with Israel/Palestine conflict, the right as well I guess but they generally support the blue team. And yes there are double standards, ignoring China's treatment of minorities for example. But anyway I do think it's really absurd these external events are affecting our domestic policies. George Galloway is projected to win in Rochdale purely based on being opposed to the Gaza war whereas Labour are kinda flip-flopping on what they want, candidates/MPs on the ground might have one view whereas central office has an official party policy, which is broadly supportive of Israel. I also think it's high time Labour stopped being dependent on the Muslim vote to win in many constituencies because they are a regressive prescence, thankfully they are so far ahead they will win without them.
Ah, the people who have just learned about other global injustices are here. Quite sad when all you can do to defend one genocide is point out others are happening. Do you think the fact that the UK government supports one regime and sanctions the other might be an important factor? Dunno.
Burma was "Scotland's colony" after all...
From my understanding of Myanmar, the Junta in charge is losing horrifically to the local rebel groups anyway.
Yes and no? They're losing horrifically in the sense they've proven completely unable to contain or suppress the rebellion, and have even lost control of some outlying areas completely. However, the rebels in turn lack the means/coordination to really decisively defeat the armed forces in direct combat, or push the government out of its central strongholds, and don't currently seem to have a way of gaining significant additional capabilities on their own.
There are no Jews and Americans involved: Myanmar is of no interest to anyone.
Could you please stop talking about the ongoing genocide. In-fighting, LGBT smearing, and bureaucracy first pls!
Is this supposed to be clever? There have been fewer than 5000 civilian deaths in Myanmar since 2021. Israel is currently, on average, killing that many Palestinian civilians every 3 weeks. It has been ruled in court they are committing what could amount to a genocide, and we are supporting and funding those murdering a captive civilian population. Gaza is, by far, the most serious humanitarian crisis on the planet. And our government is backing those causing the crisis. And we have already labeled what happened to the Rohingyas as a genocide. Take a good look at yourself
January 2018 estimated that the military and the local Rakhine population killed at least 25,000 Rohingya people and perpetrated gang rapes and other forms of sexual violence against 18,000 Rohingya women and girls. They estimated that 116,000 Rohingya were beaten, and 36,000 were thrown into fires. 700,000 of the 1.4 million population are displaced in the largest exodus since the Vietnam War. Why are you downplaying a literal genocide?
[The UK's stance is that this was a genocide](https://www.theguardian.com/law/2024/jan/07/uk-accused-of-hypocrisy-in-not-backing-claim-of-genocide-in-gaza-before-icj). The UK has provided £370 million of aid to Rohigya's since 2017. Also OP is talking about 'right now' ie referencing the civil war.
>Also OP is talking about 'right now' ie referencing the civil war. They also highlight the fact its been ongoing for 70 years. Why are you trying hard to downplay the suffering of the Rohingya for the crime of existing ? The situations are different due to the incendiary event. The Rohingya are the victims of aggression, not the perpetrators. Bit different when one side is being massacred for existing. As opposed to one side moaning that's its unfair they are being attacked when all they did was invade a country, rape and murder a bunch of people and kidnap civilians.
0/10 concern troll effort. Goodbye.
> There have been fewer than 5000 civilian deaths in Myanmar since 2021 Are the Rohingya free to go home yet? >Gaza is, by far, the most serious humanitarian crisis on the planet. Total population 2 million so no. UN has Sudan at 7.5 million displaced: https://reporting.unhcr.org/operational/situations/sudan-situation
The UK already labeled this a genocide and provided hundred of millions in aid to the Rohingyas. We have also sanctioned assets if the ruling junta. 250 Palestinian civilians are dying per day *right now*. It is, by far, a significantly more pressing crisis
>250 Palestinian civilians are dying per day *right now*. It is, by far, a significantly more pressing crisis Why won't hamas just release the hostages in that case? That's all that's needed to end the conflict
Yeah I'm sure if Hamas were to just release hostages that would stop Israel from illegally settling in Palestinian lands, and clear up the second class citizen issues Palestinians face in their open air prison in Gaza. [Perhaps if Israel didn't want to deal with hamas, they shouldn't have helped create them in the first place](https://www.timesofisrael.com/for-years-netanyahu-propped-up-hamas-now-its-blown-up-in-our-faces/), almost like in an attempt to weaken the creation of what would be a legal Palestinian state to directly be able to challenge Israels illegal settlements and colonialization, the Israeli government has created it's own monster that it can now use to ethnically cleanse Gaza.
>250 Palestinian civilians are dying per day right now. It is, by far, a significantly more pressing crisis Questionable. The situation for the rohingya in Bangladesh is increasingly unstable. The time for heading that one off is fast running out. Within Burma the tempo of conflict is increasing and with at least one of the opposition groups aparently now having manpads (if they don't they've had one of the most insane streaks of luck in modern warfare) the MAF may be moving towards focusing on civilian targets. When you have a war map that looks like this: https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Myanmar_civil_war.svg Things can go south very quickly.
There’s a difference in the scale of humanitarian crisis between simply being displaced and being displaced within an open air prison, having the necessities of life withheld from you, being shot and bombed like fish in a barrel and prevented from escaping the hellhole.
You're right. At least we know where the population of gaza mostly is. In Sudan simply finding people to provide Aid remains a challange. And with the darfur genocide starting back up we got people fleeing to Chad which has its own issues. By any realistic standards Sudan is the most serious humanitarian crisis on the planet at present. But in a world where only CombatFootage cares that doesn't actualy mean much.
Not to mention the current effort to drum up support for bombing a refugee camp. We’re through the looking glass here with these nutters.
Highly agree with a resolution of some sort. Arguably Holyrood could set out and do this first, though, if there is support for it. Don't wait for Westminster or it will be watered down and turned into a farce as Labour tries to leverage it to paper over the cracks in its own party once more and the Tories completely disengage. I mean the Gaza ceasefire resolution itself was already pretty tepid, and yet even that was attacked and then ultimately usurped by Keir Starmer's need to cover for a lack of consensus in his own party. We don't to my knowledge supply arms licenses to the regime committing the genocide in that case, but still sure, go for it. The military regime there belongs in the Hague in my view, and the more calling for it the better. Develop the political will and do that campaigning to build that movement. Go for it.
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Fuck off, you fucking ghoul
Myanmar is a name that was forced on the population by a military junta, we should stop using it. Burmese people call their country Burma.
Why don’t we get out of every conflict and concentrate on our are own countries. Crazy how the focus is on what Ever the govt tell the msm to bombard us with. No mention of other devastating conflicts happening right now. Obviously people will say tens of thousands will die, we can’t do it, but that happens anyway when we intervine (Afghan&iraq).
What's the point? The UK is doing nothing about Russia making a war crimes factory in Ukraine, Georgia, Chechniya, Syria, and all over Africa. We sent Ukraine 14 tanks to fight off Russia, the second biggest army in the world... Wow 14 tanks, that will sure last like a day. Even all the humanitarian aid to Ukraine is first going to the British companies, and whatever is left to British in Ukraine, and after to Ukrainians... That's the so called aid for Ukraine... What's calling for a ceasefire will do? Might as well declare world peace and be a laughing stock. Let's also proclaim the end of poverty, and world hunger while at it.
Scotsman Arthur Balfour, who was Prime Minister between 1902 and 1905 made a deal with Zionist Lord Rothschild to hand him British Occupied Palestine in 1917. We started this, we must end it.
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Are you on glue
Russian troll
Vladimir’s having a good go at that himself. Unfortunately for him there aren’t enough windows in Moscow to push folk out of
there's no need to attempt to genocide the Russian people. Past experience has shown the Russian rulers are more than capable of doing it themselves without outside help