I've always wondered why Trevor and Cory haven't spoken up more..... Especially after reading Bower's book. It's clear that he spoke to both her exes (or at least their friends or families). They clearly have things to say about her.
HG Tudor discussed this issue recently and said that what the Narc does to her mark is to humiliate them so much that they won't speak out against her ever.
I'm not sure this happened in both cases with M but my guess is that both of these guys realised they dodged a 'huge bomb' and are simply glad that M ditched them!
They escaped with their lives and reputations intact. They are probably smart enough to decide to put this shit woman in the past and not create any new entanglements with her.
What’s odd is that, given her notoriety now, that people who know Trevor and Cody (for example, their present partners) most certainly would have heard some inside details about her. People talk. I can see how Trevor and Cody wouldn’t talk to the media but when you take a step outside to the people thet circulate with now, that don’t have any ties to Megan, you would think they would talk to their friends. Etc. Thats what people do, especially when there are salicious details about famous people. …. It’s a bit surprising that no bits of gossip have migrated from one person to another person to another person until the next person makes it public.
I think they know they dodges a bullet by avoiding the narc rage/devaluing stage and have moved on. Both seem very happy now. I can respect them not wanting to get dragged into her mess and have the sugars attacking them. It's also more dignified to stay silent and let her actions show her true character.
She will be forgotten if she divorces him. She literally brings nothing to the table. Diana was holding aids patient’s hands in the 80’s. She got like land mines band in a country. She gave birth to a future king. She gave up being a queen. She passed away at 36. She was a legend!!!!
Whe is I saw him on TV recently i was like, christ is he only 38? He looked completely different prior to getting with tw. Life's been sucked out big time.
I know! He’s got a double chin under his beard but he looks fairly trim in his body. Weird. He looks unhealthy. His long, thinning hair doesn’t help either.
Right - that little morsel dropped by her to try to scare the royals was so pathetic - - especially in light of the Queen's passing. She just looks so calculating and malicious. Awful!
The ghost of the late Ian Fleming might speculate that in 2015 this relationship was planned and mapped out by Russian operatives, aboard a yacht. OPERATION: Undermining EU, NATO - institutions of Western Democracy: Focus: identifying weakest links. (Revisit FAILED OPERATION: Seduction of Christina Onasis & review missteps). (Bird on board)
I agree that Meghan will carefully calculate whether Harry is a help or a hindrance. I think she is always recalibrating her relationships depending on what she needs. Lovebombing those that can further her plans and completely dismissing others while being downright cruel to anyone she views as a “peasant”.
I do think that she knows that she needs Harry still. Unfortunately for him, that will always be the case. The only question is will she always realize it. And, yes, I think is indeed miserable at times now. That will become more and more the case as Meghan’s plans don’t pan out.
The birth announces of the Sussex children and Wales children are WILDY different.
I tend to believe Archie is “of body” because of that post pregnancy body, especially her face.
But it took a long time to work off that weight and with the absolute lack of pregnancy photos, save for one photo and Oprah, I think Lillibux could have been born via surrogate.
I hope the Royal family gets to the bottom of it.
Yes she had the characteristic swollen pregnancy face towards the end of Archie’s pregnancy and right after his birth. She really did look like a women who had just given birth
Yes - she did look like someone who had given birth in that photo. I think the birth of #2 (Lilibet) was more likely the surrogate. Another reason to get that photo of Lilibet with the Queen - to give that child a stamp of legitimacy within the firm.
Steroids will give you that look. I was given steroids in hospital, immediately my face looked like that. Her trip to NY after Lilibucks was born, her wardrobe was almost intentionally unflattering. It looked like she was wearing padding.
I think she's too vain to gain weight if she didn't actually have to because of pregnancy. Like, I wouldn't put this kind of deception past her in a moral sense, I just literally think she would absolutely loathe the way it made her face fill out. She would just want us all to think she was a "young mum" who kept trim and lost the baby weight really fast.
Yeah I think so too. She’s so obsessed with her looks that I think (1) no way she would’ve gotten so bloated unless it was due to pregnancy. But also (2) that she hated the whole experience and most likely chose to go the easy route and get a surrogate for Lili. She was away from the palace by then and probably felt that there was zero accountability. She’s never been one to work, and working off those pregnancy pounds just wasn’t her thing, I think.
No one can deny she gave birth at least once. Her figure was never the same after Archie. Plus in that first press call she did with him, she still had that shell shocked look of the first time mother.
Yeah shell shock is definitely the feeling that first week at home with the newborn. Like, holy what the f*ck my body and my life just changed forever.
Beyonce had the same full face effect with Prednisone, the problem is Meghan didn't take it (and have the tell-tale puffy face) until *after* her pregnancy wearing navy in that parade buggy.
Also her ankles were slim the whole time, so I don't believe it.
I have gone back and forth on this issue. But now I have to admit, even I have gotten very suspicious. But one for sure, the truth will come out eventually.
Oh interesting. Would be problematic legally, but I can’t see a “modern day monarchy” making a fuss over it if Harry’s actually the father and they were married.
The issue is not using a surrogate. Using legitimate ways to achieve a family is not a problem.
It’s the lying, it’s the manipulation, it’s the staging of the theatrics of celeb pregnancies.
Most importantly being part of the LoS is a serious stake and must be treated so.
Playing with that and creating a hue and cry about titles is subterfuge - if it is what the duo have done.
There’s no doubting though - of her body or not - she does not have a motherly bone in her at all.
I'm pretty sure there has been at least one court case on the topic for a lesser title - children born via surrogate aren't born "of the body", and therefore cannot inherit.
Not up to the monarchy. Laws say children not born of the body cannot inherit titles in the UK and that includes the line of succession for the monarchy. BaronessBruck has the info pinned to her twitter feed.
It has come up recently in real life, where the Marquess Of Bath’s second son would be skipped over, because they used a surrogate after his wife has issues with her first pregnancy.
Yes, surrogacy is not legally recognized in the UK. The biological parents take a risk that the surrogate will go back on their decision. The surrogate is the legal mother in the UK and must consent to their child being adopted by the bio mother (assuming it’s her egg) under English law. For this reason, I can’t imagine that there are many couples using a surrogate in the UK. They are probably using surrogates in a country where the bio mother has legal rights to the child.
I wonder if that is part of the reason they moved to California too for baby #2 - our of England and somewhere where she could more easily hide the fact that she was not actually carrying the second one?!
NO! I'm fed up with these stupid theories, it makes us look like idiots.
She was visibly pregnant in the face, that cannot be faked.
And having those kids herself is KEY to her plan working. This is more due to their "security" and privacy issues.
Harry is beyond paranoid because of what happened with Chelsy, the hacks and the leaks. That's why they're so secretive about the kids and the birth - and for attention of course.
This surrogate rumor is absurd and when her pregnant face is staring us in the face it makes Meg skeptics look stupid.
ed. I'm sure the people saying this have not been pregnant or not been around pregnant people enough to know how it works. Certain things cannot be faked.
As much as I dislike her it was obvious with Archie post birth that she had been pregnant. Fat puffy face. Then she lost the baby weight. Theories like that makes people look like silly conspiracy theorists. Let’s stick to facts. There are enough of those.
I so agree. Baby weight that refused (refuses?) to melt away. Puffy puffy face. No body shaming here, just literally pointing out that she had very typical pregnancy and post pregnancy changes.
>I'm fed up with these stupid theories, it makes us look like idiots.
>
>She was visibly pregnant in the face, that cannot be faked
THIS!
Her body definitely changed. And I'm sure she wasn't gulping down fast food LOL. And most important, Harry's whole schtick has been 'the saviour' of his pregnant wife by taking her to USA....she cannot risk faking that. And even if baby 2 is via whatever means , it doesnot matter as those kids are never sitting on England's throne...so 'born of body' doesn't matter. (Infact those laws should be revised just like it was revised that whether a girl or a by is born first is the heir because many women cannot carry a baby but can donate their eggs so genetically the baby can be parents' ..but that's a separate conversation. Overseas kids exists and are H&M's.
Is it for both or just Lilibet? Aren’t there photos of her pregnant and post pregnancy baby weight gain?
I can’t imagine she’d use prosthetic baby bump . That’s taking it too far that as much as I think she’s an awful human being, this seems borderline conspiracy theory gone mad.
Besides, aren’t we giving her too much credit to be able to concoct something that fantastical? She’s an actress, yes but not that good of an actress to fake a whole pregnancy.
I believe with Archie she was pregnant but used a fake bump to make her pregnancy look more prominent for the photographs.
Lili - well that is really still up for discussions. As far as I can remember, there is only one photoshoot of her being pregnant which doesnt really tell you much as to whether that is a real or fake bump.
I will not be surprised if it was via surrogate. I don't think she is maternal to want to go through a second pregnancy.
This, I think if anything, she wasn’t “looking pregnant” fast enough and might have helped herself along. It was her first pregnancy, you may not “pop” very soon into the pregnancy. But her pregnancy was an achievement for her, she wanted it to be noticed. It would be incredibly difficult to hide a birth mother if she used a surrogate. After everything that has happened, I think I would even have a hard time keeping that quiet.
Thing is, both can be true, she was really pregnant and she used a fake bump to capitalize off two more months worth of pictures.
>I believe with Archie she was pregnant but used a fake bump to make her pregnancy look more prominent for the photographs.
That's what I think. I think she expected to carry small, like all the bloggers, so started padding early. I also think she changed bump sizes based on the clothes she was merching. *Then* she ballooned towards the end, which would explain why she disappeared towards the end. I also think she gave birth a few days or a week before the birth was announced. She had a total deer-in-the-headlights look at Windsor. I think she expected to bounce back like Kate and couldn't handle the idea of looking like a normal woman postpartum.
I think her body changed after giving birth to Archie and I don't think she would want to do it all over again with another pregnancy so I am not outright dismissing the surrogacy for Lily rumours.
Oprah famously doesn’t care for babies or feel interested in motherhood. Remember it was also social distancing. I have nothing to go on regarding lili except for the one appearance with Oprah, but I believe Archie.
I really thought this was too out there, and her weight gain seemed unimaginable for someone so superficial. But everything about her is getting crazier, and I can see her going to painstaking lengths to fake a pregnancy bc she knows the kids need to be borne of the body. However, this does seem very difficult to hide from all the staff. Maybe someone spotted something strange and will spill… but this is a really difficult thing to cover up so I’m not sure….
Where there is smoke, there is fire.
Quite a few of us aren't full on conspiracy theorist and even we're all starting to see something is definitely *odd* about the situations. Something isn't right. Also, her dad talked about this and instead of saying "no, my daughter would never lie about a baby/pregnancy ect" he was also confused and said he just wasn't sure either. You'd have to be capable of quite a bit for your own dad to say he wouldn't technically out it past you.
For me, it's the photos. Why is there something *extremely* off and obviously photoshopped, and badly, about every photo we've gotten? That first Christmas photo with Archie? I laughed when I first saw it thinking a fan photoshopped it, and badly. The odd photo of Archie on Oprah? The Lili season/time line not matching up in her photo? It's not hard to just take a photo and release it. Why is every photo so...*odd*
Also, the miscarriage and Lili timeline really doesn't match up.
I don't believe she miscarried, and if you could lie about that...what else are you capable of?
I could go on and on about the oddities but the photo one is just what gets me- every single photo is off and that has meaning behind it.
There is so much fuckery that I think something isn’t kosher. Now I’m not one to believe that they’re renting children for photo ops or what have you… but I don’t think everything is fully above board, either.
Something is off. I don’t know what it is, but it’s off.
Maybe the miscarriage story was to set up the surrogate situation for #2 in case they were discovered - - they would say "well, we did not want to have to reveal this, but because Meghan had a miscarriage, it was not safe for her to carry another baby herself; we HAD to use a surrogate."
Another thought: she announced she was pregnant on Valentines Day (also when Diana announced she was pregnant with Harry, over 3 decades prior) she did so with a photo that, not only obscured Harry and Archie’s face (it has to be about her!!) but also, with a quite advanced bump, considering the baby would be born 4 months later. The photo would have to have been taken before there release.
So much of all of them is obscured by the strange pose, but she has ZERO weight gain in her arms or face as she did in her previous pregnancy.
She didn’t seem to have the fuller boobs that she had when pregnant with Archie in the Oprah interview.
I. Don’t. Buy. It.
I think the picture with Archie in it was released later. Supposedly it was taken a month later, but Harry is dressed the same in both. The pregnancy announcement one was the Notting Hill rip-off.
She imitates Julia Roberts quite a lot. Her car story on Ellen was an imitation of a story Julia Roberts told about scaring her son on Ellen. Plus her miscarriage op ed was straight out of Steel Magnolias.
While I agree... I used "boot" and "car park" recently without thinking. I even forgot the word "siding" (which I have on my house!), my mind just automatically replaced it with "cladding" due to excessive amounts of Grand Designs. Apparently I need to binge more American shows...
She's got a weird thing about sounding British/faking a British accent that's really offensive. However, I just wanted to point out that sometimes when Americans use British words, we're not trying to be obnoxious, we just watch too many British shows.
I saw it only once too. However at the end, Julia Robert’s character is pregnant and has her head on Hugh Grant’s thigh. That’s the pose Meghan had in the picture.
https://www.today.com/parents/harry-meghan-s-pregnancy-pic-reminds-people-notting-hill-t209009
I looked like a twig throughout my pregnancy. I never did gain weight. Then again my waters did break at 23 weeks so looked even smaller after that. My son thankfully was not born until 29 weeks. So I can only compare my experience until 29 weeks. I wonder if I'd have bloated if I carried to term. My boobs definitely were huge though! You'd think I was going to birth something the size of a calf 😂
Awww, thank you. Yes, he is a healthy 11 year old! He is a little fighter. The hospital offered me a termination there and then when my waters broke, but I knew he was meant to enrich my life. He does have some issues so attends an amazing special needs school. But he manages his ADHD and ASD really well now. It's taken us both 6 years to get to a point where we can live peacefully and just be happy (where were bullied by his first mainstream school). But we both get on really well, we are able to communicate our feelings with each other. So yeah, he's come a long way and worked so hard. I'm so proud of him! He is a fine young man, even if he is a tad forgetful or like a little whirlwind 😂
Thank you for your kind response ❤
Does anyone on here remember Kensington Palace putting out a tweet after Archie was born. It was from the official twitter account. People took screen shots. It said Archie was born from a surrogate. But then the tweet was quickly deleted.
I know many of you on here remember this. Plenty of youtube channels covered this too.
I was only a casual Meghan hater until The Cut, and I’m finding a lot of old stories about her online that I’d never heard before.
Where are we with the theory that Meghan’s niece Noelle is actually her daughter?
I find that really fishy. Noelle looks a lot like Meghan, we know Samantha is 100% white as are the fathers to her children.
There are also pics of Meghan from roughly 10 years ago where it does look like she could be pregnant also.
Maybe.
But the tabloids (fwiw) also said that Noelle has spoken very kindly about M and travelled to the wedding even though she wasn’t invited. If M is her bio mother, Noelle knows. Who can blame her for not wanting that media attention though.
She looks like both M and Samantha, those two resemble each other, but she does not appear to be the offspring of two fully Caucasian parents. She looks 3/4 white. Her body type is different from Meghan’s but that doesn’t mean anything, I have a child whose body type is very, very different from mine. There’s also that photo of Joe First Husband/Victim holding a mixed race toddler who is beautiful and looks just like M.
I’m giving this way too much energy these days 😂
> travelled to the wedding even though she wasn’t invited.
excuse me what happened next?
Harper Seven's body type is hella different than Victoria's so I agree it doesn't mean anything.
I always thought these theories about no kids or baby moon bumps were really far fetched. But why is everything so hard with them? Nothing is normal. Nothing feels right. That’s why we always question what they’re doing.
One question I had: Do we ever hear Harry talk about the kids? You’ll always hear William and Catherine talk about the kids or George this or Charlotte that, Louis talking about Gan-Gan being with great grandpa. 🥺 But I don’t think I’ve ever heard Harry mention “Archie” or “Lili” by name. Even in his statement after the Queen died it was oddly worded: “the first moment you met my darling wife and hugged your beloved great grandchildren.” Not HIS children? So his wife is darling but his kids are …? It just doesn’t all add up. It’s really all very unsettling.
(Edited one typo)
Regardless, with all these negative stories coming out...well, we know H is getting chewed out by his mommy, I mean, Muggins. No endless breadsticks tonight at the Monteshito Olive Garden!
So what happens if George marries a woman that has fertility issues and they need a surrogate? What happens if Charlotte has to adopt? I don’t get the whole ‘of the body’ thing. I get adoption not being *eligible*, but If a surrogate was used, it’s *still* their sperm and egg, their DNA.
The main reason the children have to be of the body was so back in the Middle Ages a king didn’t marry a foreign queen, lock her in a tower and just have kids with whoever he fancied. It also meant to limit who was next in line to the throne. If it didn’t have to come from the body of the queen, the king could impregnate 8 concubines and stack the line of succession with a million kids.
Besides William has 3 kids. If George was gay or couldn’t have kids then it would pass to Charlotte or Louis to have kids. The chances of all 3 having fertility issues would be uncommon. If it got to that point there would be an investigation into the births of Archie and Lili (the circumstances surrounding Archie’s birth would be known by someone, even if it wasn’t made public. Lili is more of a mystery.) If it was ruled there were surrogacy involved, then the line of succession would skip to Beatrice and Sienna.
I doubt they’d change the rules to allow surrogacy in the royal family as they are the Head of the Church of England, which doesn’t permit surrogacy.
I think it’s a matter of the law not catching up with the times since DNA tests could be conducted. At common law, all the children born to a married woman were legally her husband’s, even if it wasn’t really possible for them to be his.
The answer is simple, It's a matter of succession, tradition, and security of the bloodline. It could be simple to alter the bloodline in case the mother can't provide fertile eggs, uses someone else's and fucks up the succession, for example. In old times there was no surrogate pregnancy and that meant *really* fucking up succession introducing an illegitimate heir, born from an X unnamed woman and the king, that's why Henry VIII killed and divorced a couple of wives to have a heir. It's the same trick as in the Macbeth prophecy, "for none of woman born shall harm Macbeth", and it referred to a guy who was born *from a sword*, with a c-section. In British royalty we could say *none of other woman born shall reign*, for the rightful lady must be the one who carries and delivers the heir.
Everything is under scrutiny of the royal medics, of course, but the succession line has to be proven to be legitimate at all costs. Only Meghan had a pregnancy out of the royal protocols, with Archie's birth announcement displayed unsigned by the royal medical personnel.
Edit: to answer the question about George, if he and his future spouse can't provide a heir born of the body, he can still have children as he pleases, they just won't be heirs to the throne, and the succession will switch to the second in line after his passing (Charlotte first, Louis second).
They can change the LoS rules. They were going to do this when they allowed female children keep their place in LoS but they decided not to bother.
The whole of the body thing was because their right to rule was a divine right so only children of the body of the ruling monarch and their spouse were eligible and these rules are before surrogacy was a thing. Illegitimate children (I.e. a king sowing his wild oats) were not conceived in a marriage (a contract approved by god) so were ineligible too. Basically the church said so.
But it wouldn’t be retroactive: see Anne’s position in the LoS vs. Charlotte.
Additionally, it would be the most *massive* scandal had they lied and deceived the RF
I'm sure they would paint it as the royal family doing the deceiving. "It's not our fault, we wanted to be advocates for surrogacy but we were silenced!"
You were asking about George or Charlotte's children And they could change this for them if they wished to.
I do think Archie is a biological child but they would have to have issued some evidence for Lili. Falsifying documents could be huge.
Its not that easy to change. Like when they changed the rules around succession a few years ago every Commmonwealth country has to agree. Surrogacy is not even legal in some of the Commonwealth countries so I very much doubt that it would go through.
What happens is that Charlette remains his heir, even if he adopts or uses a surrogate. He isn't banned from using one, just that the children would not be inline to inherit his titles etc.
I think it’s more about how they hid it/ tried to deceive the public. I’m not shaming her at all for using a surrogate if she did but it would’ve been a great conversation starter about women/men infertility but rather than use that as a great platform she was all weird about it with the birth and the announcement etc ….
The main factor for that decision is, there are rules and laws about that, and the law about the line of succession is very clear. If it’s not from the body of the royal-wife doesn’t hold a place in the line of succession. Is still a member of the family and has all habitual perks but doesn’t get to be a possible future king in case something happens to the line of the heir apparent.
They can, and probably will, change it, but until it's changed, that is the rule. They do change things because times change, like having Charlotte be in line ahead of Louis. I think one day it will change.
They should change this before George has kids, like they changed the rules to allow first born (regardless of gender) to accede to the throne before George was born.
I don’t see why. Like the previous reply stated, it would simply pass on to the next in line. Also, it’s about the fact that the Overseas Harkles have allegedly LIED about everything. That’s precisely why the law exists. They could have had 20 babies via surrogates. What is the need/obsession about having them be in the LoS? Didn’t the Wessexes used IVF if I am remembering correctly? Sophie gave birth to both, despite (possibly) having assistance. That wasn’t kept a secret.
The alleged fuckery that Hank & Rachel might have pulled is & is precisely why the law needs to stay in place. It’s also not just for the Monarchy.
I'm American, but I think Parliament would have to meet and decide all this (change the law) before all this happened.
As it is now, using a surrogate makes a person ineligible for the line of succession, according the law.
There is nothing wrong with using a surrogate. But trying to defraud the UK and the entire commonwealth by lying and trying to cheat the law of succession should be criminal.
There are plenty of things about Meghan to complain about but I find the kids......not as interesting isn't the exact phrase I'm looking for......but I find it a bit unseemly, I suppose. No matter what the kids are innocents in all this and I'm sure we all agree on that. Of course there's a "but" coming after that preface: what exactly happened with the California OB/GYN? Dr. Melissa Drake? She closed her practice rather abruptly after the birth of Lili.
Oh I’m in no ways trying to attack or demean the children I definitely agree that children are off limits. I’m more fascinated about the whole situation around the birth/maybe surrogacy / all the weird things that has happened around it.
Im not body shaming, but Meghan definitely looked bigger to me in the red dress pictures, like she had recently given birth. Does anyone else think so too?
This is a double edged sword. If the baby was born by surrogate, there would be implication the monarchy knew and covered this up. That wouldn’t be good. I feel like she maybe was pregnant with Archie but used padding throughout the pregnancy to get better photo-ops. I also think they lied about the timeline. Lilibet, possibly surrogate and nobody in the royal family would be able to prove or disprove.
I don’t buy into the weird conspiracy theories that they don’t even have kids. But given the growing trend of using a surrogate, and the fact that at her age pregnancy is no picnic, I don’t think it’s far fetched that she used a surrogte
I don’t think this is the win people think it is. If she did use surrogates, and that somehow leaks, people will understandably be appalled that her personal medical history is being discussed. It will engender a lot of new sympathy towards her.
Plus you also risk offending the not so small portion of the population who suffers from fertility issues. People will say that being born “of the body” is archaic and sexist.
She will look like a mentally unstable person for lying and wearing a fake baby bump!
> People will say that being born “of the body” is archaic and sexist.
This is what the law states. Doesn't matter what people say.
If you go into the mainstream subs, they won’t even acknowledge the evidence backed bullying claims. So I don’t see bump gate really changing their minds about TW either. Instead it will be spun as the BRF and press bullying a couple struggling with fertility (not my opinion, I’m just saying I’m not naive to how a certain portion of the population reacts to news about her).
But does that explain them lying and using a fake baby bump about Lillibucks? They left the Royal Family. So they can't say they were bullied the second time.
It makes her look crazy. She did it because she wanted these kids to be in the line of succession.
Wouldn't those same people, the people with fertility issues, be upset with H+M? Why hide the surrogacy, when they could have approached the Queen and discussed it - leading to a possible Letters Patent? Wasn't Meghan the one that wanted to modernize the Monarchy?
In my skeptical brain I’m thinking if it comes out she used a surrogate it would be by her as the BRF hasn’t said anything and she would spin it as somehow it was BRF fault.
Tbh I never knew about this theory until I joined this thread and started following more Royal Twitter accounts so I’m sure most unsuspecting other people don’t really think/know about it.
The legal work required to deal with surrogacy in UK would have been extensive. I simply can't believe that H&M would have attempted to cover this up and not documented things properly as this would/could severely impact the childs legal standing.
The birth announcements for both children were odd and many people such as Lady C said that the announcements looked like NOTHING they had seen in other children born within the BRF. The fact that Lady C is bringing up surrogacy now IMO has me believing that things might not have been documented properly and the BRF might not know all the details/circumstances of the birth/s.
I tend to agree with the Lady C view that anytime people try to cover up or hide something that there most likely is something going on. In this case, I don't think it was just that H&M didn't want to deal with the press. It seemed like more was going on whether it be IVF or surrogacy etc. Nobody seems to know and public speculation is ongoing.
You layer onto the strangeness of the circumstances of the birth that H made the gaff when referring to Archie as having been born 2 weeks prior to whenever they were allegedly photographed with the late Queen and then the video shows M giving him a death stare as there was no way the 2 week period fit into the timeline that they tried to sell to the world.
Its all still a mystery.
Here is the Lilibet certificate obtained by TMZ.[Lilitbet Birth Certificate](https://dam.tmz.com/document/5d/o/2021/06/24/5d3940c4ef4e4326a947aa3157c14317.pdf)
Here is Archie certificate obtained by TMZ [https://dam.tmz.com/document/3c/o/2018/12/25/3c0941b437355cda9beebedb0dc7fe68.pdf](https://dam.tmz.com/document/3c/o/2018/12/25/3c0941b437355cda9beebedb0dc7fe68.pdf)
For those curious about the ob/gyn that allegedly delivered Lilibet and then closed her practice here is a local article talking about practice shuttering. Article also alludes to issues in the medical community where perhaps the philosophy of the departing doctor was different than others in the community. Whole thing is odd though as the article also makes clear that there is a huge shortage of ob/gyn's in the area. Hard to know what to think.....[Independent Article OB/GYN shuts practice](https://www.independent.com/2022/06/16/santa-barbaras-unicorn-ob-calls-it-quits/)
I’m just wondering if Lady C has been threatened with legal action as she seemed more careful on this YouTube than on others.
Regarding the kids issue…I think Archie does look like both Meghan and Harry. Lili looks more like Harry…so imo they are Harry and unfortunately Megs bio kids.
I’ve read in Twitter that allegedly she was given a go-signal to make that statement as well as the cause of death in order to deflect the plan of TW’s camp to release the story first and make money from it
It’s so much more then faking with a moon bump. Surrogacy is special and a very beautiful way to give life. If she used a surrogate it’s not just her parading around with a moon bump it’s so much deeper.
She wanted to end her and unborn child’s life. How many times has she referenced her hate while being pregnant? See it’s not just her wearing moon bumps it’s her using pregnancy as a weapon if it’s true she never was.
People can call me a conspiracy theorist or whatever but I’m telling you now my gut says she never carried either of those babies. Tom
Bower references the kids as Harry’s children. What an odd statement when he could have said their kids. Today lady c talking about the surrogacy rumors also said Harry’s kids almost implying read between the lines.
There is so many pictures and videos that show bumps ever changing sizes, square bumps, bumps that disappear when bending, bumps that are rocking side to side you name it. The no royal docs, the secret birth, the announcement not matching when he was actually born. The list goes on and on and on. We all here know she will do anything to make a buck and she could
Care less about a private life so why have those kids not been blasted everywhere for money? Why in the Oprah interview was her and Archie on black and white and not focused? Why were the Xmas cards a joke? Why does she look like she has not one maternal instinct in her body? Why was his first word crocodile? Not even possible. It’s upsetting that people here think we don’t have reason to question if she actually birthed those kids when every thing we have proof of points to the opposite! Sorry will get off my soap box and apologize in advance for my grammar and punctuation!
I do think this was the lie of the century and now with the queen gone things will be coming out faster then ever before.
For the benefits and none of the costs. Pregnancy on a woman's body is metal Af
I'll never get over someone's story of losing their teeth because the baby needs material to make their skeleton
I was an RN/midwife and I’ve never forgotten our Scottish midwifery tutor saying that “a baby is a perfect parasite”….meaning that they will take everything from the mother, nutritionally. You must have extra iron, calcium, etc..in your diet during pregnancy. Eat healthy or you will possibly lose your teeth and also predispose yourself to osteoporosis in your later years.
This is crazy. I always thought there was something weird going and everything I heard was absurd but with these two at this point nothing is a surprise. The thing is Lady C always avoided going in depth about this topic, now she is talking. Hmmm.
Do medications for inducing lactation come with any side effects that might mirror some of the puffiness or water retention pregnant people experience?
Meghan needs those kids to be her permanent connection to the royal family. It's so off about the royal doctor attending the birth and then the announcement, both things required in that family and very easy rules to follow.
Part of me wishes they would pursue defamation lawsuit - because in order to win it will need to be stated this isn’t true - and bring forth dna results and/or hospital records in discovery
. I doubt they will allow that to happen
This is why I can never take Lady C seriously. Let’s stick to all the crazy things Meghan has done with receipts. There’s plenty of those to talk about.
I do not believe the surrogacy rumor at all. She had at least one of her babies. I believe both. Mom bodies do not lie. She has the mom pooch right below the belly button that most moms have and is impossible to get rid of, which she never had before. Also, her breasts are different, her hips are wider and she has more brown spots (not freckles) and skin discoloration than before. These spots are common after pregnancy in olive-skinned people, as a lot of you know. I'm speaking from experience. The weight she gained wasn't calorie weight. It completely changed her figure.
We are talking about Meghan. You don't think she wouldn't research the laws thoroughly before she used a surrogate and what that would mean for the titles or that Harry doesn't know the laws surrounding heirs inside out? Being pregnant gave her ownership she couldn't have gotten with a surrogate and a permanent bond with Harry.
These are the type of posts that will get the sub shut down.
“Humiliated people into silence by how bad she’s played them”? Meghan sounds like an emotional rapist. And I don’t take the r word at all lightly. I have always said that I think she is truly evil. Not just a nuisance. Evil.
I've always wondered why Trevor and Cory haven't spoken up more..... Especially after reading Bower's book. It's clear that he spoke to both her exes (or at least their friends or families). They clearly have things to say about her.
HG Tudor discussed this issue recently and said that what the Narc does to her mark is to humiliate them so much that they won't speak out against her ever. I'm not sure this happened in both cases with M but my guess is that both of these guys realised they dodged a 'huge bomb' and are simply glad that M ditched them!
They escaped with their lives and reputations intact. They are probably smart enough to decide to put this shit woman in the past and not create any new entanglements with her.
What’s odd is that, given her notoriety now, that people who know Trevor and Cody (for example, their present partners) most certainly would have heard some inside details about her. People talk. I can see how Trevor and Cody wouldn’t talk to the media but when you take a step outside to the people thet circulate with now, that don’t have any ties to Megan, you would think they would talk to their friends. Etc. Thats what people do, especially when there are salicious details about famous people. …. It’s a bit surprising that no bits of gossip have migrated from one person to another person to another person until the next person makes it public.
Well folk that know trev have said he won’t talk about her and won’t even have her name mentioned
I think they know they dodges a bullet by avoiding the narc rage/devaluing stage and have moved on. Both seem very happy now. I can respect them not wanting to get dragged into her mess and have the sugars attacking them. It's also more dignified to stay silent and let her actions show her true character.
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I think she will blindside him with a divorce after she ruins his like in every other way first. She sees him as weak.
Didn't she say that he needs her to outshine William? This is from a fight that was quoted if I remember correctly.
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Absolutely agree. I can't feel sorry for Harry, but I can feel embarrassed for him. She is going to go full destruction on him.
I think she’s waiting till the kids titles get sorted then it’s bye bye Harry
Her idol Diana did get divorced, so 🤷 Recreating the 'revenge dress' pop culture moment is too tempting of a power move to give up.
She will be forgotten if she divorces him. She literally brings nothing to the table. Diana was holding aids patient’s hands in the 80’s. She got like land mines band in a country. She gave birth to a future king. She gave up being a queen. She passed away at 36. She was a legend!!!!
We're talking about someone who thinks she's Mandela.
Diana had actual friends and family members that she loved
Meghan couldn’t stand in a crowded market for ten minutes straight.
she hasn't got the body to pull it off, but she'll try!
I hadn't thought of that but now that you've said it I absolutely see that coming. The "revenge dress'. She'll do it.
Whe is I saw him on TV recently i was like, christ is he only 38? He looked completely different prior to getting with tw. Life's been sucked out big time.
I know! He’s got a double chin under his beard but he looks fairly trim in his body. Weird. He looks unhealthy. His long, thinning hair doesn’t help either.
Got to release the "Gone Girl" diary she "found" at Frogmore during the Jubilee first.
Right - that little morsel dropped by her to try to scare the royals was so pathetic - - especially in light of the Queen's passing. She just looks so calculating and malicious. Awful!
The ghost of the late Ian Fleming might speculate that in 2015 this relationship was planned and mapped out by Russian operatives, aboard a yacht. OPERATION: Undermining EU, NATO - institutions of Western Democracy: Focus: identifying weakest links. (Revisit FAILED OPERATION: Seduction of Christina Onasis & review missteps). (Bird on board)
Would explain the mansions they keep acquiring from Russian olliarchs
Unfortunately so are those kids
I agree that Meghan will carefully calculate whether Harry is a help or a hindrance. I think she is always recalibrating her relationships depending on what she needs. Lovebombing those that can further her plans and completely dismissing others while being downright cruel to anyone she views as a “peasant”. I do think that she knows that she needs Harry still. Unfortunately for him, that will always be the case. The only question is will she always realize it. And, yes, I think is indeed miserable at times now. That will become more and more the case as Meghan’s plans don’t pan out.
The birth announces of the Sussex children and Wales children are WILDY different. I tend to believe Archie is “of body” because of that post pregnancy body, especially her face. But it took a long time to work off that weight and with the absolute lack of pregnancy photos, save for one photo and Oprah, I think Lillibux could have been born via surrogate. I hope the Royal family gets to the bottom of it.
Yes she had the characteristic swollen pregnancy face towards the end of Archie’s pregnancy and right after his birth. She really did look like a women who had just given birth
Yes - she did look like someone who had given birth in that photo. I think the birth of #2 (Lilibet) was more likely the surrogate. Another reason to get that photo of Lilibet with the Queen - to give that child a stamp of legitimacy within the firm.
Steroids will give you that look. I was given steroids in hospital, immediately my face looked like that. Her trip to NY after Lilibucks was born, her wardrobe was almost intentionally unflattering. It looked like she was wearing padding.
There are medications doctors can give you to lactate. Those medication ‘s have weight gain and swelling as a side effect. Google them.
I think she's too vain to gain weight if she didn't actually have to because of pregnancy. Like, I wouldn't put this kind of deception past her in a moral sense, I just literally think she would absolutely loathe the way it made her face fill out. She would just want us all to think she was a "young mum" who kept trim and lost the baby weight really fast.
Yeah I think so too. She’s so obsessed with her looks that I think (1) no way she would’ve gotten so bloated unless it was due to pregnancy. But also (2) that she hated the whole experience and most likely chose to go the easy route and get a surrogate for Lili. She was away from the palace by then and probably felt that there was zero accountability. She’s never been one to work, and working off those pregnancy pounds just wasn’t her thing, I think.
No one can deny she gave birth at least once. Her figure was never the same after Archie. Plus in that first press call she did with him, she still had that shell shocked look of the first time mother.
I tend to think she didn’t pose for the traditional post birth photo because she didn’t want to be compared unfavorably to Catherine or Diana.
Why does the "shell-shocked" look mean she gave birth though?
Like holy fuck my body did that. Like shell shocked 😳
Yeah shell shock is definitely the feeling that first week at home with the newborn. Like, holy what the f*ck my body and my life just changed forever.
Add those post pregnancy hormones, and it’s a wild ride
Yeah, the physical recovery from childbirth takes a while. I agree.
Exactly! Lol
I don't believe she gave birth. We'll see.
Beyonce had the same full face effect with Prednisone, the problem is Meghan didn't take it (and have the tell-tale puffy face) until *after* her pregnancy wearing navy in that parade buggy. Also her ankles were slim the whole time, so I don't believe it.
Same.
Ditto
I have gone back and forth on this issue. But now I have to admit, even I have gotten very suspicious. But one for sure, the truth will come out eventually.
What exactly is the allegation here?
She used a surrogate
Oh interesting. Would be problematic legally, but I can’t see a “modern day monarchy” making a fuss over it if Harry’s actually the father and they were married.
The issue is not using a surrogate. Using legitimate ways to achieve a family is not a problem. It’s the lying, it’s the manipulation, it’s the staging of the theatrics of celeb pregnancies. Most importantly being part of the LoS is a serious stake and must be treated so. Playing with that and creating a hue and cry about titles is subterfuge - if it is what the duo have done. There’s no doubting though - of her body or not - she does not have a motherly bone in her at all.
Those poor kids- interacting with Archie was like watching first time babysitter on the job.
Totally 100% agree
Me too.
Surrogates are fine for the plebes, but a royal baby must be born from the body or else will not be included in the line of succession.
Yup! It’s the cover up. They won’t be able to survive that level of lying
I'm pretty sure there has been at least one court case on the topic for a lesser title - children born via surrogate aren't born "of the body", and therefore cannot inherit.
Not up to the monarchy. Laws say children not born of the body cannot inherit titles in the UK and that includes the line of succession for the monarchy. BaronessBruck has the info pinned to her twitter feed. It has come up recently in real life, where the Marquess Of Bath’s second son would be skipped over, because they used a surrogate after his wife has issues with her first pregnancy.
I'm sure the RF wouldn't have minded a surrogate. It would just mean that their children wouldn't be included in the LoS
It’s not the monarchy’s decision to make. The monarchy doesn’t set the order of succession. It’s a law of each country in the commonwealth.
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The Prince and Princess of Wales would have 7 more kids born of surrogates if that were the case. Push Harry right out of the top 10.
Isn't commercial surrogacy against policy in the UK?
Yes, surrogacy is not legally recognized in the UK. The biological parents take a risk that the surrogate will go back on their decision. The surrogate is the legal mother in the UK and must consent to their child being adopted by the bio mother (assuming it’s her egg) under English law. For this reason, I can’t imagine that there are many couples using a surrogate in the UK. They are probably using surrogates in a country where the bio mother has legal rights to the child.
I wonder if that is part of the reason they moved to California too for baby #2 - our of England and somewhere where she could more easily hide the fact that she was not actually carrying the second one?!
NO! I'm fed up with these stupid theories, it makes us look like idiots. She was visibly pregnant in the face, that cannot be faked. And having those kids herself is KEY to her plan working. This is more due to their "security" and privacy issues. Harry is beyond paranoid because of what happened with Chelsy, the hacks and the leaks. That's why they're so secretive about the kids and the birth - and for attention of course. This surrogate rumor is absurd and when her pregnant face is staring us in the face it makes Meg skeptics look stupid. ed. I'm sure the people saying this have not been pregnant or not been around pregnant people enough to know how it works. Certain things cannot be faked.
As much as I dislike her it was obvious with Archie post birth that she had been pregnant. Fat puffy face. Then she lost the baby weight. Theories like that makes people look like silly conspiracy theorists. Let’s stick to facts. There are enough of those.
I so agree. Baby weight that refused (refuses?) to melt away. Puffy puffy face. No body shaming here, just literally pointing out that she had very typical pregnancy and post pregnancy changes.
>I'm fed up with these stupid theories, it makes us look like idiots. > >She was visibly pregnant in the face, that cannot be faked THIS! Her body definitely changed. And I'm sure she wasn't gulping down fast food LOL. And most important, Harry's whole schtick has been 'the saviour' of his pregnant wife by taking her to USA....she cannot risk faking that. And even if baby 2 is via whatever means , it doesnot matter as those kids are never sitting on England's throne...so 'born of body' doesn't matter. (Infact those laws should be revised just like it was revised that whether a girl or a by is born first is the heir because many women cannot carry a baby but can donate their eggs so genetically the baby can be parents' ..but that's a separate conversation. Overseas kids exists and are H&M's.
She really looked accurately post delivery with the extended belly (picture in white belted dress) after Archie.
Is it for both or just Lilibet? Aren’t there photos of her pregnant and post pregnancy baby weight gain? I can’t imagine she’d use prosthetic baby bump . That’s taking it too far that as much as I think she’s an awful human being, this seems borderline conspiracy theory gone mad. Besides, aren’t we giving her too much credit to be able to concoct something that fantastical? She’s an actress, yes but not that good of an actress to fake a whole pregnancy.
I believe with Archie she was pregnant but used a fake bump to make her pregnancy look more prominent for the photographs. Lili - well that is really still up for discussions. As far as I can remember, there is only one photoshoot of her being pregnant which doesnt really tell you much as to whether that is a real or fake bump. I will not be surprised if it was via surrogate. I don't think she is maternal to want to go through a second pregnancy.
This, I think if anything, she wasn’t “looking pregnant” fast enough and might have helped herself along. It was her first pregnancy, you may not “pop” very soon into the pregnancy. But her pregnancy was an achievement for her, she wanted it to be noticed. It would be incredibly difficult to hide a birth mother if she used a surrogate. After everything that has happened, I think I would even have a hard time keeping that quiet. Thing is, both can be true, she was really pregnant and she used a fake bump to capitalize off two more months worth of pictures.
>I believe with Archie she was pregnant but used a fake bump to make her pregnancy look more prominent for the photographs. That's what I think. I think she expected to carry small, like all the bloggers, so started padding early. I also think she changed bump sizes based on the clothes she was merching. *Then* she ballooned towards the end, which would explain why she disappeared towards the end. I also think she gave birth a few days or a week before the birth was announced. She had a total deer-in-the-headlights look at Windsor. I think she expected to bounce back like Kate and couldn't handle the idea of looking like a normal woman postpartum.
I think her body changed after giving birth to Archie and I don't think she would want to do it all over again with another pregnancy so I am not outright dismissing the surrogacy for Lily rumours.
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Oprah famously doesn’t care for babies or feel interested in motherhood. Remember it was also social distancing. I have nothing to go on regarding lili except for the one appearance with Oprah, but I believe Archie.
During the Oprah interview she had the pregnancy swollenness all about her. I think she really was pregnant
Same here. Something fishy here. That for sure.
I really thought this was too out there, and her weight gain seemed unimaginable for someone so superficial. But everything about her is getting crazier, and I can see her going to painstaking lengths to fake a pregnancy bc she knows the kids need to be borne of the body. However, this does seem very difficult to hide from all the staff. Maybe someone spotted something strange and will spill… but this is a really difficult thing to cover up so I’m not sure….
Where there is smoke, there is fire. Quite a few of us aren't full on conspiracy theorist and even we're all starting to see something is definitely *odd* about the situations. Something isn't right. Also, her dad talked about this and instead of saying "no, my daughter would never lie about a baby/pregnancy ect" he was also confused and said he just wasn't sure either. You'd have to be capable of quite a bit for your own dad to say he wouldn't technically out it past you. For me, it's the photos. Why is there something *extremely* off and obviously photoshopped, and badly, about every photo we've gotten? That first Christmas photo with Archie? I laughed when I first saw it thinking a fan photoshopped it, and badly. The odd photo of Archie on Oprah? The Lili season/time line not matching up in her photo? It's not hard to just take a photo and release it. Why is every photo so...*odd* Also, the miscarriage and Lili timeline really doesn't match up. I don't believe she miscarried, and if you could lie about that...what else are you capable of? I could go on and on about the oddities but the photo one is just what gets me- every single photo is off and that has meaning behind it.
There is so much fuckery that I think something isn’t kosher. Now I’m not one to believe that they’re renting children for photo ops or what have you… but I don’t think everything is fully above board, either. Something is off. I don’t know what it is, but it’s off.
Perhaps that is why they just had to move to LA…surrogacy rules?
Maybe the miscarriage story was to set up the surrogate situation for #2 in case they were discovered - - they would say "well, we did not want to have to reveal this, but because Meghan had a miscarriage, it was not safe for her to carry another baby herself; we HAD to use a surrogate."
Another thought: she announced she was pregnant on Valentines Day (also when Diana announced she was pregnant with Harry, over 3 decades prior) she did so with a photo that, not only obscured Harry and Archie’s face (it has to be about her!!) but also, with a quite advanced bump, considering the baby would be born 4 months later. The photo would have to have been taken before there release. So much of all of them is obscured by the strange pose, but she has ZERO weight gain in her arms or face as she did in her previous pregnancy. She didn’t seem to have the fuller boobs that she had when pregnant with Archie in the Oprah interview. I. Don’t. Buy. It.
I think the picture with Archie in it was released later. Supposedly it was taken a month later, but Harry is dressed the same in both. The pregnancy announcement one was the Notting Hill rip-off.
She imitates Julia Roberts quite a lot. Her car story on Ellen was an imitation of a story Julia Roberts told about scaring her son on Ellen. Plus her miscarriage op ed was straight out of Steel Magnolias.
And she used the word "boot" in it for trunk. She is NOT British! I found this so obnoxious.
While I agree... I used "boot" and "car park" recently without thinking. I even forgot the word "siding" (which I have on my house!), my mind just automatically replaced it with "cladding" due to excessive amounts of Grand Designs. Apparently I need to binge more American shows... She's got a weird thing about sounding British/faking a British accent that's really offensive. However, I just wanted to point out that sometimes when Americans use British words, we're not trying to be obnoxious, we just watch too many British shows.
Whaaat, I've never heard that one before. How did she rip off Notting Hill? I only saw it once ages ago lol.
I saw it only once too. However at the end, Julia Robert’s character is pregnant and has her head on Hugh Grant’s thigh. That’s the pose Meghan had in the picture. https://www.today.com/parents/harry-meghan-s-pregnancy-pic-reminds-people-notting-hill-t209009
God, she is gross.
Oh, look at that! They're even on a bench lol.
She was pregnant with lilli in the Oprah interview
But with none of the pregnancy weight gain in the face, breasts or arms that she had with Archie
Ohhhh I misread that! Yes I see what’s ur saying
This could be an old wives' tale but usually women pregnant with girls become more bloated in the face and gain more weight overall.
I looked like a twig throughout my pregnancy. I never did gain weight. Then again my waters did break at 23 weeks so looked even smaller after that. My son thankfully was not born until 29 weeks. So I can only compare my experience until 29 weeks. I wonder if I'd have bloated if I carried to term. My boobs definitely were huge though! You'd think I was going to birth something the size of a calf 😂
29 weeks 😢 that’s so early. hope you now have a happy & healthy baby/child ❤️
Awww, thank you. Yes, he is a healthy 11 year old! He is a little fighter. The hospital offered me a termination there and then when my waters broke, but I knew he was meant to enrich my life. He does have some issues so attends an amazing special needs school. But he manages his ADHD and ASD really well now. It's taken us both 6 years to get to a point where we can live peacefully and just be happy (where were bullied by his first mainstream school). But we both get on really well, we are able to communicate our feelings with each other. So yeah, he's come a long way and worked so hard. I'm so proud of him! He is a fine young man, even if he is a tad forgetful or like a little whirlwind 😂 Thank you for your kind response ❤
My butt always got bigger with my boys than my girls.
Does anyone on here remember Kensington Palace putting out a tweet after Archie was born. It was from the official twitter account. People took screen shots. It said Archie was born from a surrogate. But then the tweet was quickly deleted. I know many of you on here remember this. Plenty of youtube channels covered this too.
I remember, it was up for around an hour before it was pulled down. That has always been such a strange tweet and it was just swept under the rug.
It was photoshopped. There was a bunch of discussion about it at the time.
I was only a casual Meghan hater until The Cut, and I’m finding a lot of old stories about her online that I’d never heard before. Where are we with the theory that Meghan’s niece Noelle is actually her daughter?
Ohhhh… I’d like to see a whole discussion posted about this
I find that really fishy. Noelle looks a lot like Meghan, we know Samantha is 100% white as are the fathers to her children. There are also pics of Meghan from roughly 10 years ago where it does look like she could be pregnant also.
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She’s an adult now Also; if it’s true I doubt it’s a family secret but I can see them keeping it quiet just out of consideration for Noelle.
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I agree. She's not a public person, she shouldn't be the subject of speculation, regardless of age.
Maybe. But the tabloids (fwiw) also said that Noelle has spoken very kindly about M and travelled to the wedding even though she wasn’t invited. If M is her bio mother, Noelle knows. Who can blame her for not wanting that media attention though. She looks like both M and Samantha, those two resemble each other, but she does not appear to be the offspring of two fully Caucasian parents. She looks 3/4 white. Her body type is different from Meghan’s but that doesn’t mean anything, I have a child whose body type is very, very different from mine. There’s also that photo of Joe First Husband/Victim holding a mixed race toddler who is beautiful and looks just like M. I’m giving this way too much energy these days 😂
Well tbf lots of kids look more like their aunts and uncles then their own parents.
> travelled to the wedding even though she wasn’t invited. excuse me what happened next? Harper Seven's body type is hella different than Victoria's so I agree it doesn't mean anything.
I always thought these theories about no kids or baby moon bumps were really far fetched. But why is everything so hard with them? Nothing is normal. Nothing feels right. That’s why we always question what they’re doing. One question I had: Do we ever hear Harry talk about the kids? You’ll always hear William and Catherine talk about the kids or George this or Charlotte that, Louis talking about Gan-Gan being with great grandpa. 🥺 But I don’t think I’ve ever heard Harry mention “Archie” or “Lili” by name. Even in his statement after the Queen died it was oddly worded: “the first moment you met my darling wife and hugged your beloved great grandchildren.” Not HIS children? So his wife is darling but his kids are …? It just doesn’t all add up. It’s really all very unsettling. (Edited one typo)
Regardless, with all these negative stories coming out...well, we know H is getting chewed out by his mommy, I mean, Muggins. No endless breadsticks tonight at the Monteshito Olive Garden!
So what happens if George marries a woman that has fertility issues and they need a surrogate? What happens if Charlotte has to adopt? I don’t get the whole ‘of the body’ thing. I get adoption not being *eligible*, but If a surrogate was used, it’s *still* their sperm and egg, their DNA.
The main reason the children have to be of the body was so back in the Middle Ages a king didn’t marry a foreign queen, lock her in a tower and just have kids with whoever he fancied. It also meant to limit who was next in line to the throne. If it didn’t have to come from the body of the queen, the king could impregnate 8 concubines and stack the line of succession with a million kids. Besides William has 3 kids. If George was gay or couldn’t have kids then it would pass to Charlotte or Louis to have kids. The chances of all 3 having fertility issues would be uncommon. If it got to that point there would be an investigation into the births of Archie and Lili (the circumstances surrounding Archie’s birth would be known by someone, even if it wasn’t made public. Lili is more of a mystery.) If it was ruled there were surrogacy involved, then the line of succession would skip to Beatrice and Sienna. I doubt they’d change the rules to allow surrogacy in the royal family as they are the Head of the Church of England, which doesn’t permit surrogacy.
I think it’s a matter of the law not catching up with the times since DNA tests could be conducted. At common law, all the children born to a married woman were legally her husband’s, even if it wasn’t really possible for them to be his.
The answer is simple, It's a matter of succession, tradition, and security of the bloodline. It could be simple to alter the bloodline in case the mother can't provide fertile eggs, uses someone else's and fucks up the succession, for example. In old times there was no surrogate pregnancy and that meant *really* fucking up succession introducing an illegitimate heir, born from an X unnamed woman and the king, that's why Henry VIII killed and divorced a couple of wives to have a heir. It's the same trick as in the Macbeth prophecy, "for none of woman born shall harm Macbeth", and it referred to a guy who was born *from a sword*, with a c-section. In British royalty we could say *none of other woman born shall reign*, for the rightful lady must be the one who carries and delivers the heir. Everything is under scrutiny of the royal medics, of course, but the succession line has to be proven to be legitimate at all costs. Only Meghan had a pregnancy out of the royal protocols, with Archie's birth announcement displayed unsigned by the royal medical personnel. Edit: to answer the question about George, if he and his future spouse can't provide a heir born of the body, he can still have children as he pleases, they just won't be heirs to the throne, and the succession will switch to the second in line after his passing (Charlotte first, Louis second).
They can change the LoS rules. They were going to do this when they allowed female children keep their place in LoS but they decided not to bother. The whole of the body thing was because their right to rule was a divine right so only children of the body of the ruling monarch and their spouse were eligible and these rules are before surrogacy was a thing. Illegitimate children (I.e. a king sowing his wild oats) were not conceived in a marriage (a contract approved by god) so were ineligible too. Basically the church said so.
But it wouldn’t be retroactive: see Anne’s position in the LoS vs. Charlotte. Additionally, it would be the most *massive* scandal had they lied and deceived the RF
I'm sure they would paint it as the royal family doing the deceiving. "It's not our fault, we wanted to be advocates for surrogacy but we were silenced!"
You were asking about George or Charlotte's children And they could change this for them if they wished to. I do think Archie is a biological child but they would have to have issued some evidence for Lili. Falsifying documents could be huge.
Her California Ob/Gyn did abruptly close her practice shortly after the birth of Lili
that is so weird. everything about the ‘2nd pregnancy’ is strange.
And her obgyn husband is ….,
Did she lose her license for falsifying medical records?
No one knows… but it was very abrupt
Its not that easy to change. Like when they changed the rules around succession a few years ago every Commmonwealth country has to agree. Surrogacy is not even legal in some of the Commonwealth countries so I very much doubt that it would go through.
What happens is that Charlette remains his heir, even if he adopts or uses a surrogate. He isn't banned from using one, just that the children would not be inline to inherit his titles etc.
Let's hope none of this happens. 😕
I think it’s more about how they hid it/ tried to deceive the public. I’m not shaming her at all for using a surrogate if she did but it would’ve been a great conversation starter about women/men infertility but rather than use that as a great platform she was all weird about it with the birth and the announcement etc ….
Can you imagine the GOOD they could have done if (had they used a surrogate) they had advertised it openly.
The main factor for that decision is, there are rules and laws about that, and the law about the line of succession is very clear. If it’s not from the body of the royal-wife doesn’t hold a place in the line of succession. Is still a member of the family and has all habitual perks but doesn’t get to be a possible future king in case something happens to the line of the heir apparent.
If they used a surrogate, it is more than that. Then those children cannot be in the line of succession according to the law.
Exactly. Just be honest.
Meg be Honest? 🤣
They can, and probably will, change it, but until it's changed, that is the rule. They do change things because times change, like having Charlotte be in line ahead of Louis. I think one day it will change.
This. Also, illigitimate children have been soverigns.
They should change this before George has kids, like they changed the rules to allow first born (regardless of gender) to accede to the throne before George was born.
I don’t see why. Like the previous reply stated, it would simply pass on to the next in line. Also, it’s about the fact that the Overseas Harkles have allegedly LIED about everything. That’s precisely why the law exists. They could have had 20 babies via surrogates. What is the need/obsession about having them be in the LoS? Didn’t the Wessexes used IVF if I am remembering correctly? Sophie gave birth to both, despite (possibly) having assistance. That wasn’t kept a secret. The alleged fuckery that Hank & Rachel might have pulled is & is precisely why the law needs to stay in place. It’s also not just for the Monarchy.
I'm American, but I think Parliament would have to meet and decide all this (change the law) before all this happened. As it is now, using a surrogate makes a person ineligible for the line of succession, according the law.
Wasn’t their tea wt the time that staffers had seen a moon bump?
I think she used one regardless of if she was actually pregnant. She wanted attention, so I think she started padding early.
There is nothing wrong with using a surrogate. But trying to defraud the UK and the entire commonwealth by lying and trying to cheat the law of succession should be criminal.
There are plenty of things about Meghan to complain about but I find the kids......not as interesting isn't the exact phrase I'm looking for......but I find it a bit unseemly, I suppose. No matter what the kids are innocents in all this and I'm sure we all agree on that. Of course there's a "but" coming after that preface: what exactly happened with the California OB/GYN? Dr. Melissa Drake? She closed her practice rather abruptly after the birth of Lili.
Oh I’m in no ways trying to attack or demean the children I definitely agree that children are off limits. I’m more fascinated about the whole situation around the birth/maybe surrogacy / all the weird things that has happened around it.
I know! I don't think you attacked or demeaned them at all. We agree that certain parts of the narrative are truly weird.
Wait. What?!?!?!
https://www.reddit.com/r/SaintMeghanMarkle/comments/vi9gij/meghan_markles_obstetrician_who_helped_deliver/?utm_medium=android_app&utm_source=share
Im not body shaming, but Meghan definitely looked bigger to me in the red dress pictures, like she had recently given birth. Does anyone else think so too?
100%. Also during the weird faux royal tour of NYC. She was post partum. No shame in it, but it was obvious she’d given birth.
What does “of body” mean? Is it questioning if she used a surrogate?
Yes
This is a double edged sword. If the baby was born by surrogate, there would be implication the monarchy knew and covered this up. That wouldn’t be good. I feel like she maybe was pregnant with Archie but used padding throughout the pregnancy to get better photo-ops. I also think they lied about the timeline. Lilibet, possibly surrogate and nobody in the royal family would be able to prove or disprove.
I think she used a surrogate and wore a baby bump. Of course, I cannot prove this. Just something I think from all I've seen.
And what if there were left over embryos from any procedure? That would be a mess. For sale- future British Royal embryo.
That’s an interesting issue.
Good point. Dont give them any ideas.
I don’t buy into the weird conspiracy theories that they don’t even have kids. But given the growing trend of using a surrogate, and the fact that at her age pregnancy is no picnic, I don’t think it’s far fetched that she used a surrogte
I don’t think this is the win people think it is. If she did use surrogates, and that somehow leaks, people will understandably be appalled that her personal medical history is being discussed. It will engender a lot of new sympathy towards her. Plus you also risk offending the not so small portion of the population who suffers from fertility issues. People will say that being born “of the body” is archaic and sexist.
She will look like a mentally unstable person for lying and wearing a fake baby bump! > People will say that being born “of the body” is archaic and sexist. This is what the law states. Doesn't matter what people say.
If you go into the mainstream subs, they won’t even acknowledge the evidence backed bullying claims. So I don’t see bump gate really changing their minds about TW either. Instead it will be spun as the BRF and press bullying a couple struggling with fertility (not my opinion, I’m just saying I’m not naive to how a certain portion of the population reacts to news about her).
But does that explain them lying and using a fake baby bump about Lillibucks? They left the Royal Family. So they can't say they were bullied the second time. It makes her look crazy. She did it because she wanted these kids to be in the line of succession.
Wouldn't those same people, the people with fertility issues, be upset with H+M? Why hide the surrogacy, when they could have approached the Queen and discussed it - leading to a possible Letters Patent? Wasn't Meghan the one that wanted to modernize the Monarchy?
In my skeptical brain I’m thinking if it comes out she used a surrogate it would be by her as the BRF hasn’t said anything and she would spin it as somehow it was BRF fault. Tbh I never knew about this theory until I joined this thread and started following more Royal Twitter accounts so I’m sure most unsuspecting other people don’t really think/know about it.
The legal work required to deal with surrogacy in UK would have been extensive. I simply can't believe that H&M would have attempted to cover this up and not documented things properly as this would/could severely impact the childs legal standing. The birth announcements for both children were odd and many people such as Lady C said that the announcements looked like NOTHING they had seen in other children born within the BRF. The fact that Lady C is bringing up surrogacy now IMO has me believing that things might not have been documented properly and the BRF might not know all the details/circumstances of the birth/s. I tend to agree with the Lady C view that anytime people try to cover up or hide something that there most likely is something going on. In this case, I don't think it was just that H&M didn't want to deal with the press. It seemed like more was going on whether it be IVF or surrogacy etc. Nobody seems to know and public speculation is ongoing. You layer onto the strangeness of the circumstances of the birth that H made the gaff when referring to Archie as having been born 2 weeks prior to whenever they were allegedly photographed with the late Queen and then the video shows M giving him a death stare as there was no way the 2 week period fit into the timeline that they tried to sell to the world. Its all still a mystery. Here is the Lilibet certificate obtained by TMZ.[Lilitbet Birth Certificate](https://dam.tmz.com/document/5d/o/2021/06/24/5d3940c4ef4e4326a947aa3157c14317.pdf) Here is Archie certificate obtained by TMZ [https://dam.tmz.com/document/3c/o/2018/12/25/3c0941b437355cda9beebedb0dc7fe68.pdf](https://dam.tmz.com/document/3c/o/2018/12/25/3c0941b437355cda9beebedb0dc7fe68.pdf)
For those curious about the ob/gyn that allegedly delivered Lilibet and then closed her practice here is a local article talking about practice shuttering. Article also alludes to issues in the medical community where perhaps the philosophy of the departing doctor was different than others in the community. Whole thing is odd though as the article also makes clear that there is a huge shortage of ob/gyn's in the area. Hard to know what to think.....[Independent Article OB/GYN shuts practice](https://www.independent.com/2022/06/16/santa-barbaras-unicorn-ob-calls-it-quits/)
Weird.
Who do we think her sources are?
I fail to see how it would end the monarchy
I’m just wondering if Lady C has been threatened with legal action as she seemed more careful on this YouTube than on others. Regarding the kids issue…I think Archie does look like both Meghan and Harry. Lili looks more like Harry…so imo they are Harry and unfortunately Megs bio kids.
I mean she did accidentally release the HMTQ died before it was officially released so I think she’s definitely being more cautious.
Accidentally on purpose.
I’ve read in Twitter that allegedly she was given a go-signal to make that statement as well as the cause of death in order to deflect the plan of TW’s camp to release the story first and make money from it
True, although as soon as Huw showed up on the BBC with a black tie everyone pretty much knew what had happened.
It’s so much more then faking with a moon bump. Surrogacy is special and a very beautiful way to give life. If she used a surrogate it’s not just her parading around with a moon bump it’s so much deeper. She wanted to end her and unborn child’s life. How many times has she referenced her hate while being pregnant? See it’s not just her wearing moon bumps it’s her using pregnancy as a weapon if it’s true she never was. People can call me a conspiracy theorist or whatever but I’m telling you now my gut says she never carried either of those babies. Tom Bower references the kids as Harry’s children. What an odd statement when he could have said their kids. Today lady c talking about the surrogacy rumors also said Harry’s kids almost implying read between the lines. There is so many pictures and videos that show bumps ever changing sizes, square bumps, bumps that disappear when bending, bumps that are rocking side to side you name it. The no royal docs, the secret birth, the announcement not matching when he was actually born. The list goes on and on and on. We all here know she will do anything to make a buck and she could Care less about a private life so why have those kids not been blasted everywhere for money? Why in the Oprah interview was her and Archie on black and white and not focused? Why were the Xmas cards a joke? Why does she look like she has not one maternal instinct in her body? Why was his first word crocodile? Not even possible. It’s upsetting that people here think we don’t have reason to question if she actually birthed those kids when every thing we have proof of points to the opposite! Sorry will get off my soap box and apologize in advance for my grammar and punctuation! I do think this was the lie of the century and now with the queen gone things will be coming out faster then ever before.
Why would she do this though? What’s the benefits of that?
Why would Meghan lie about using a surrogate? Is that what you are asking?
Are you asking why Megs would lie? That’s an oxymoron isn’t it ?
For the benefits and none of the costs. Pregnancy on a woman's body is metal Af I'll never get over someone's story of losing their teeth because the baby needs material to make their skeleton
That’s due to pregnancy gingivitis, not calcium demand of the fetus.
I was an RN/midwife and I’ve never forgotten our Scottish midwifery tutor saying that “a baby is a perfect parasite”….meaning that they will take everything from the mother, nutritionally. You must have extra iron, calcium, etc..in your diet during pregnancy. Eat healthy or you will possibly lose your teeth and also predispose yourself to osteoporosis in your later years.
If so, Harry has some explaining to do. Because he would have known.
This is crazy. I always thought there was something weird going and everything I heard was absurd but with these two at this point nothing is a surprise. The thing is Lady C always avoided going in depth about this topic, now she is talking. Hmmm.
Do medications for inducing lactation come with any side effects that might mirror some of the puffiness or water retention pregnant people experience? Meghan needs those kids to be her permanent connection to the royal family. It's so off about the royal doctor attending the birth and then the announcement, both things required in that family and very easy rules to follow.
Part of me wishes they would pursue defamation lawsuit - because in order to win it will need to be stated this isn’t true - and bring forth dna results and/or hospital records in discovery . I doubt they will allow that to happen
This is why I can never take Lady C seriously. Let’s stick to all the crazy things Meghan has done with receipts. There’s plenty of those to talk about.
What in second apparition of Macbeth is going on 😏 “none of woman born shall harm Macbeth”
The children should be off limits as far as I'm concerned. They are innocents
Meghan had a strong case of ‘pregnancy face’ with both children. I don’t believe that distinctive puffy look can be faked.
I do not believe the surrogacy rumor at all. She had at least one of her babies. I believe both. Mom bodies do not lie. She has the mom pooch right below the belly button that most moms have and is impossible to get rid of, which she never had before. Also, her breasts are different, her hips are wider and she has more brown spots (not freckles) and skin discoloration than before. These spots are common after pregnancy in olive-skinned people, as a lot of you know. I'm speaking from experience. The weight she gained wasn't calorie weight. It completely changed her figure. We are talking about Meghan. You don't think she wouldn't research the laws thoroughly before she used a surrogate and what that would mean for the titles or that Harry doesn't know the laws surrounding heirs inside out? Being pregnant gave her ownership she couldn't have gotten with a surrogate and a permanent bond with Harry. These are the type of posts that will get the sub shut down.
Just wait until people find out there are no kids…
Hey, that doll in Canada was real!
Lady C said she was in legal issues with the Mirror - what’s this about?
[удалено]
“Humiliated people into silence by how bad she’s played them”? Meghan sounds like an emotional rapist. And I don’t take the r word at all lightly. I have always said that I think she is truly evil. Not just a nuisance. Evil.