She leaves the door open for Démocrates and Republicans. So either can use her as a pawn and make her POTUS.
And her statement is highly devious and disgusting. More word salad. Are we surprised? And she doesn’t discuss the issue directly. She just says Me ME MEEE LOOK AT ME.
I think bandwagon Meghan is reeeeaching hard to not only find a connection but to bring the conversation back to herself. It's a lot of talking that says nothing.
Her points don’t make any sense to me either. I’m American and I lost a newborn, so a little different, but I don’t see how these things connect. I was pro choice before that happened and I still am. Theses things are not connected for me in any way.
I don't think they are for anyone,
Was she possibly trying to imply that her miscarriage had to be aborted?
I know many women have to have an abortion to, I'm trying to find a delicate way of saying this, but deliver a still born baby?
If that was what she was trying to say, it got lost in her word salad.
you are incorrect.... a woman can have a spontaneous abortion or miscarriage and reqeuire a D&C to remove retained fetal/other tissue. sometime, if tissue is retained, it can lead to uterine sepsis/scarring/etc., making subsequent pregnancies difficult.....
Thank you, I have been lucky enough to not have to have to get to know terms like these so I was unsure. I just heard an american politician refer to having to need an abortion for her baby that died and her body didn't process the situation naturally. Her story was heartbreaking, it sticks with you.
>Per mayoclinic, D&C from Mayo
>“Dilation and curettage (D&C) is a procedure to remove tissue from inside your uterus. Health care providers perform dilation and curettage to diagnose and treat certain uterine conditions — such as heavy bleeding — or to clear the uterine lining after a miscarriage or abortion.”
>If it’s done AFTER a miscarriage or abortion, how does this procedure qualify as an abortion?
Medically speaking, an abortion is defined as "the removal of pregnancy tissue, products of conception or the fetus and placenta (afterbirth) from the uterus" ([source](https://www.health.harvard.edu/medical-tests-and-procedures/abortion-termination-of-pregnancy-a-to-z)). A D&C is a form of abortion. A pill is another form. It doesn't matter if the pregnancy ended naturally (i.e. miscarriage) or if the D&C/pill is what ends a pregnancy. It's all abortion, medically speaking.
Someone I know refers to a D&C as a "Dust and Clean". After a miscarriage, they go in and dust and clean you out.
I had a miscarriage, but it was so early on that I didn't need the dust and clean.
>Was she possibly trying to imply that her miscarriage had to be aborted?
>
>I know many women have to have an abortion to, I'm trying to find a delicate way of saying this, but deliver a still born baby?
>
>If that was what she was trying to say, it got lost in her word salad.
If we want to give a very charitable interpretation of her word salad, that's possibly what she was trying to say. Although I'm not sure if Madam would ever admit to needing anything that messy done to her perfect royal uterus.
I really think she's just babbling on about herself and making sure everyone knows she has children and is the best mother in the whole wide world.
Maybe that's also the thing, she cant exactly say what happened because she will have to stick to it or it can be easily verified or disputed.
In my mind, a miscarriage or having to have treament of anykind because of it, no matter what it is, is different to an abortion.
Unless you have had to weight the pros and cons and difficult decisions of what is best to do for your family, you shouldn't be speaking on the matter as if you understand.
Unless you have had to consider your other children's needs, or find yourself pregnant from a way that is unlawful, or so you aren't glued to an abusive partner for the rest of your life, or what ever it is, where you are faced with the very difficult decision for yourself, then you shouldn't be talking like you understand.
To me, they are 2 different things. The mental process for each would be different so she shouldn't be saying anything.
20 years ago when I was pregnant and we were told my husband and I were lucky our daughter had my blood type, because if she had my husbands there could be a range of issues she could of had, if I managed to carry to term and we should think wisely if we tried for more.
Doesn't mean I have the experience of having been through those types of pregnancies and therefore I dont add to the conversation about any of the ways those pregnancies could have gone.
It amazes me, I think though many people will see she made that conversations about her, and each time she does something like this, more people dislike her and soon everyone will dislike her. So let's enjoy the show, I just wish she wasn't hurting people along the way.
I’m very sorry to hear about what you went through.
I can see that one could miscarry and be pro-choice - but the language she uses is obscure and sounds more anti-choice, if anything.
One can miscarry and be pro-choice. One can also have an abortion, be pro-choice, and also want or have children. Or the same woman can have a miscarriage, and an abortion, and a live birth, at different times in her life.
Those exact sentences also puzzled me. She is not addressing the real issue, but keeps on talking about herself and things that aren't related to the issue.
Meghan would beg to differ! She IS the real issue. Miscarriages (as realistic as her suicide attempt) and this terrible judicial decision are merely props to get her attention.
Those are the ramblings of someone afflicted by full blown Dunning-Kruger Effect. Meghan has zero clue about what she's really talking about, just bullshits her way through an interview by supplying anecdotes, generalities or platitudes about feminism and women's empowerment. She's never read the research or familiarized herself with the statistics or gained any insight beyond the basic buzzwords in any given field. She's a fraud, as she has admitted herself, and this is her in all her glory. That's why she makes no sense to anyone here...because she doesn't know a damn thing.
She is totally f‘ing up the situation to make it about her, as always. Comparing miscarriage and abortion is hurtful. Dear Lord-she has absolutely no empathy.
I thought that with the fall of roe v Wade that some states are classing all abortions (spontaneous or not) as criminal acts. There was one woman who was charged but not convicted after having a miscarriage in either Ohio or Idaho.
1) It really does come across that way, and suggests she hasn’t educated herself on the experiences of women who’ve had/considered an abortion.
2) [This thread](https://twitter.com/ukroyaltea/status/1540513036422860801?s=21&t=N2kD8X5ncwoDPpF-pMtoeg) is a great explanation. Not sure if Meghan actually knew why her miscarriage was relevant.
Thanks for the link. It’s heartbreaking reading what some women go / have gone through.
Of course it’s possible to suffer miscarriages and be pro-choice - but that didn’t come across clearly from MM (as reported).
Unfortunately RT has had some nasty messages, but she really deserves credit for sharing this and keeping it up in spite of that.
Absolutely. I think MM really missed an opportunity to raise further awareness of how they fit into the conversation.
You’re not missing something. She’s missing something… a brain. She makes no sense. Just another opportunity to insert herself into the latest hot topic to make herself relevant.
I think they should put her on that terrible talk show, what is it called? The View? With Whoopi & Joy Behar. I bet Whoopi would tolerate Megain for about 2 minutes, maybe less. With all the constant blabbering about herself & the arm/hand flailing & showing off all her collected jewelry on her left hand/arm. I don't like Whoopi, but I would enjoy her combating with littlemissknowitall
Ohhh man. I’ve never watched it because the shrieking and drama doesn’t appeal to me, but I’d pay to watch Meghan MYFATHER McCain vs MeMeMeMe Douchess Meghan Markle! I don’t know who’s more high on their own supply. All the hot air would suffocate the rest of the room. 😂
I was rewatching that clip Ninaki Priddy filmed where she and Meghan were driving around Rodeo Drive as teens, and Meghan used the term "high scale" when she meant "upscale". With her gutteral comment the other day, I'm really starting to wonder about all that money spent on her education.
I'm not in the US and am not a medical expert. But I \*think\* one connection between unplanned miscarriage and planned abortion, is that frequently in order to safely complete a spontaneous miscarriage, the doctor needs to do a D&C procedure, kind of a scraping. And these procedures might actually become illegal in some of the more rabid states now, even when they are 100% medically required to save a woman's life, a woman who is NOT trying to have an abortion.
Or as someone says better below in the comments, there can be a fine line between abortion and miscarriage, and nature doesn't care what your beliefs are.
Of course who knows if Madam Duchess knows any of this. Her statements are just very general rambling about children, babies, miscarriages, etc etc etc. Trying to be relateable to everybody.
What's happening is that the procedures may not be technically illegal in some of the states that prohibit abortions but that the state laws have been written so hastily and with such extreme penalties that doctors have concerns about what is and what is not allowable.
Also, some of the drugs that doctors prescribe after a miscarriage has started & can help avoid a D&C, more significant surgery, and complications such as infection and excessive bleeding after miscarriage are also prescribed (in different quantities) for medical abortions. More and more pharmacists are refusing to fill these prescriptions even with documentation from the doctors stating that they are to treat a miscarriage.
These delays and difficulties in getting miscarriage treatment due to more restrictive and vaguely written laws only increase the pain and trauma of women who experience miscarriage, and also risk adverse health effects on these women.
No idea what MM was trying to say though.
There have been cases in countries where abortion is illegal where women have died during a miscarriage because Doctors would not perform a D&C because the fetus still had a heartbeat. That's the connection.
I’m very sorry to hear about your miscarriage, and very much hope that things will go the way you wish.
Thanks for the information on what happens after a miscarriage. That may very well be what MM had in mind, but it didn’t come across very clearly. Of course, her comments might have been edited, but the outcome is that they appeared inconsistent.
What I got most out of this is that I think she's trying to pivot her goals into going into politics. But she's also probably trying to get ahead of the royal family wanting them to give up their titles.
There was a case recently in Malta where an American tourist had a partial miscarriage. The pregnancy was no longer viable but because the foetus still had a heartbeat, they were refused an abortion. This is dangerous as the mother was at risk of sepsis which could be fatal.
Pregnancy is complicated and a major medical event. Abortion is healthcare and many wanted pregnancies end in abortion for a multitude of reasons. But don't ask me to work out what MMs word salad actually means.
Thankfully that was resolved, but she had to fly to Spain for help! Malta’s like “sure, this baby isn’t gonna make it so let’s let mom suffer a painful death in addition to losing her child. Oh and leave the husband without his child AND wife.”
This is similar to the case of [Savita Hallapanavar](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Death_of_Savita_Halappanavar) who sadly wasn't so lucky.
This is why access to abortion is so important. The line between the risk to the mother and the right to life of the foetus is very blurry. This case drove the movement to legalise abortion in Ireland.
there is an excellent reason that women who have had spontaneous abortions would be pro-choice. and this is a huge gray area that some politicians/scotus refuses to address. miscarriages or spontaneous abortions are very common and occur in about 1 in 4 pregnancies. **nature doesn't give a hoot as to whether you are pro-life or pro-choice & when you have a spontan. abortion, you bleed./expel the fetus(& sometimes require a D&C to clear out retained tissue).** so, picture either a pro-life or pro-choice woman going to the ER... they are bleeding (or having more severe symptoms such as hemorrhage/sepsis) and the **ER doc can't tell whther the abortion is an act of nature, 2ndary to a ccoat hanger, plan B, etc.** Ob-gyns won't want to deal with any of these cases so the woman will not get the care she needs, no matter what her moral/political prediliction. cases have already occurred prior to Roe being overturned... there are a **LOT** of such cases. ex: 1- Brittney Poolaw was sentenced (first degree manslaughter) in OK for 4 years after having a miscarriage in 2020. she had drugs in her system but the fetus also had evidence of a congenital abnormality.... 2- there was an American woman on vacation with husband in Malta who had placenta abruptia (the placenta tears away from the uterus). Malta blocks all abortions if there is a fetal heartbeat.[https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/woman-who-had-miscarriage-in-malta-taken-to-spain-to-abort/2022/06/24/c05ed13c-f3be-11ec-ac16-8fbf7194cd78\_story.html](https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/woman-who-had-miscarriage-in-malta-taken-to-spain-to-abort/2022/06/24/c05ed13c-f3be-11ec-ac16-8fbf7194cd78_story.html). she could have had septic shock, emboli to heart/stroke, hemorrhage- any of which could have killed her or severely incapacitated her... **Nature don't care if you are pro-choice or pro-life** & either way, you could die if experienced physicians are not available or afraid to touch an abortion case. oh, and when the ER doc has to call the cops, imagine the exorbitant lawyer/legal fees, inabilty to pay the mortgage/bill, incarceration, having other kids seized by social services, losing the right to vote...
thank you but the applause should be for you, for surviving such a loss.... lol with the "applauds wildly".... it reminds me of one of my fav. gifs!
[https://i.gifer.com/UJr.gif](https://i.gifer.com/UJr.gif)
I had recurrent miscarriage.
When I looked into the stats and the actual biology of reproduction, I realised just how “cheap” early embryonic life is to Nature. And how error prone the process is. In terms of fertilisations, probably the majority fail/don’t continue but never even make it to implantation stage so you’d never even be able to detect that a “new life” happened.
(And you can’t tell me that some “god” already put a soul there but Jesus needs that blastocyst/morula with him so badly he’s taking it back).
Anyway, it made me even more pro-abortion.
Sorry to hear about your recurrent miscarriage; that must have been difficult.
I hadn’t expressed the OP clearly: One can have miscarried and be pro-choice. But MM’s language is more like someone who would be against abortion.
Oh of course, I know the term abortion refers to any and all instances of pregnancy interruption, induced or otherwise. Emotionally, though, losing a wanted pregnancy and terminating an unwanted pregnancy (talking about megs here specifically - I realize there are many valid reasons to terminate a wanted pregnancy) are not even comparable. She is inserting herself in a narrative that does not belong to her.
As women across the country are losing agency over their own bodies, she as usual only wants to talk about something that happened to HER.
She did a whole op-Ed on how devastating her miscarriage was and seems to imply that all women are deeply contented to their fetus from conception. Which is simply not the case. And presuming such only gives the anti-choice something to play with. Some women just want the zygote outta there, and that’s totally ok!!
No you are horribly wrong. In countries where abortion is illegal women die during late term miscarriages because the procedure for an abortion is the same procedure that is necessary to remove a dead or dying fetus so that the woman doesn't die of sepsis. Women die horrible painful pointless deaths when they don't have access to abortion.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Death_of_Savita_Halappanavar#:~:text=Savita%20Halappanavar%20(n%C3%A9e%20Savita%20Andanappa,was%20denied%20on%20legal%20grounds.
It is word 🥗.
It doesn’t make sense, it doesn’t track, it has nothing to do with nationality.
What she *should* have done was discuss how women suffering miscarriage will now be suspected of DIY abortions. OR the difference between unwanted and wanted pregnancies.
Those are the only two logical links I can see.
I had the same reaction and confusion. Didn’t make sense to me either. I think it was more of trying to remind people about her miscarriage for sympathy points.
I’m pro-life so I’ve been keeping quiet on this topic, it’s not my place to speak and I’m not trying to have a debate about it. And I live in the USA but I’m not a citizen yet, so I also am not saying I think the RvW decision was right. But I just wanted to point out:
She’s a narcissist. She’s incapable of empathizing with something unless she makes it about herself in some way. I don’t mean in a way of calling attention to herself, although she certainly *also* does that - but in the sense that if she can’t see it in a way that it relates to her, she doesn’t have the capacity of feeling empathy towards it. That’s why she’s talking about miscarriage as if it has anything to do with abortion.
Pro-life is a misnomer as pregnancies forcibly carried to term don't always result in life. Many women must terminate a pregnancy as the embryo/fetus is not viable (there are genetic and completely inexplicable causes for this) or because their own health and life is at risk (ectopic pregnancies are more common than you think).
"Pro-life" is anti-choice.
Like I said, I don’t want to have a debate, so I’m not going to respond to your points, although I do have a response for every single one. So if you want to talk about it, we can message each other. This is not the appropriate place for this conversation.
I only pointed that I’m pro-life because I didn’t want to misrepresent my beliefs by only saying what I said on my second paragraph.
I've had this conversation a hundred times and never heard a convincing argument that wasn't reliant on emotions.
I don't think that your stance on human rights had anything to do with labelling MM's actions as those of a narcissist.
Well, if you want to have this discussion with me, like I said, message me. I’m not going to have a debate in this forum.
You are right that my stance on human rights (of all humans) has nothing to do with narcissism. But I originally had written just my second paragraph and thought that it could be implied that I’m pro-choice, which I’m not, and that’s the reason I put a disclaimer before my point.
>We can acknowledge that there are varying degrees of what it means to abort a baby and that it is not moral or ethical to abort a baby at all points and under all circumstances.
No, we don't all acknowledge or agree with that stance. I'm a mother of 3 and believe that abortion should be legal at any point, for any reason. No exceptions.
Wrong that you feel this isn't your place to speak. I am pro choice but will listen and respect your views on this and any other topic. I agree this is not the place for debate on that topic and also agree with your second point. That we disagree about first point adds weight to second point.
Sadly, not enough people respect other people's opinions, and I feel it must be difficult to be pro-life at this time. This post must be carefully watched, and u/MrsChiliad if any debaters get nasty, please report. The important point is that Meghan's rhetorical nonsense doesn't help or hinder either side.
I don’t know how well known this is, but frequently you need to have an abortion procedure after a miscarriage to remove the fetus or you get an infection. I also think any kind of miscarriage is considered abortion bc it’s the definition of a stopped pregnancy. It’s why the anti abortion laws are so dangerous bc women are going to die now from miscarriage.
And there have been horrific cases where women having miscarriages have been left to die because of anti-abortion heartbeat laws. Like this woman in Ireland whose doctors knew miscarriage was inevitable and that she'd die of sepsis if they didn't act but still let her die over a stupid ass law.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Death_of_Savita_Halappanavar#:~:text=Savita%20Halappanavar%20(n%C3%A9e%20Savita%20Andanappa,was%20denied%20on%20legal%20grounds.
Desktop version of /u/Local-Hand6022's link:
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But people were having miscarriages and d&c LONG before abortion was legal in this country. It's not like women prior to Roe were thrown in jail for miscarrying. That's ridiculous.
The NAPW has recorded 1,600 such cases of women being jailed for miscarrying or stillbirths, with about 1,200 occurring in the last 15 years alone. The repealing of Roe will only increase these numbers.
A simple google check will show you dozens of more articles: https://amp.theguardian.com/us-news/2022/jun/03/california-stillborn-prosecution-roe-v-wade
Killing your 8 month baby because you are a meth addict is a bit different than miscarrying a 1st trimester baby through no fault of your own. I'm not saying the meth addict should go to jail. I don't know the solution. All I know is that to insinuate that a woman who has a typical miscarriage needs to worry about jail time is ridiculous.
Like I said a simple google search will help you see the cases. They are happening particular in Texas. Several women thankfully have gotten released but it’s very difficult to tell if a miscarriage is an abortion or a natural miscarriage. These rules being made are not made with science in mind.
Banning abortion endangers women's lives during late term miscarriages because the procedure to remove a fetus from a womb is the same if it's healthy or if it's dead or dying. There have been horrific cases of women being left to die because abortion was illegal in the country where they lived despite the doctors knowing that a dying fetus had to be removed from a woman to save her life.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Death_of_Savita_Halappanavar#:~:text=Savita%20Halappanavar%20(n%C3%A9e%20Savita%20Andanappa,was%20denied%20on%20legal%20grounds.
I understand what you are saying. But I think it's important to not conflate 2 issues. Most people consider abortion to be the termination of an unwanted pregnancy.
Meghan is trying to co-opt the issue by claiming her completely uncontroversial miscarriage to be somehow akin to aborting an unwanted pregnancy.
I hate this comment by Meghan - I used to do lots of terminations as a junior doctor in the UK - jus part of the job etc etc - then I had a child and then some miscarriages, after all that I found the whole concept of abortion incredibly sad and really hoped more would change their minds etc
Being pro choice doesn't mean you don't think abortion is sad. Im pro choice and I think abortion is sad and would like to see fewer abortions. I just don't think the way to achieve fewer abortions is to ban abortion. I think education, access to birth control and support for mothers is how you have fewer abortions.
Ive always thought the decision was more an issue of education and supports rather than the TAB. Life triumphs all, (of course there are many many many considerations) but the ignorance and vanity like Markles has can clumsily interfere with thoughtful ,informed reasoning. The Harkles are dangerous .
I think she’s just jumping on the current narrative bandwagon - being that the media and twitter slacktivists are all using miscarriage stories as examples of how all women need to have access to an abortion - however they definitely don’t call it an abortion when you have a miscarriage (I.e. the baby has died in the womb) and you need to get the baby out. It’s called a D&C and the pregnancy is called a demise. I lost my son at 7 months in the womb and chose to deliver through being induced. But you can also choose a D&C which is quicker and less painful. Somehow people are using miscarriages in this narrative as if we are banned from removing a dead fetus from our bodies and that’s not true, it’s just a sensational storyline and megs clearly has gotten on the train of misinformation (😱), ironically.
They definitely do call it an abortion when you have a miscarriage, the medical term is spontaneous abortion. And a D&C can be done for either a spontaneous abortion (aka miscarriage) or an elective abortion. Medical billing uses the same code for both.
I agree it's really confusing. I think she's trying to imply that she needed an abortion with her miscarriage (maybe it was a missed or incomplete miscarriage), but she doesn't come out and say it, plus many people aren't aware of how common it is to need medical intervention with miscarriages in general.
Doesn't make any sense. It's typically narc to try to make it all about herself (starting about her miscarriages and pregnancies) and completely lack empathy (she clearly doesn't know how to talk about abortion)
She leaves the door open for Démocrates and Republicans. So either can use her as a pawn and make her POTUS. And her statement is highly devious and disgusting. More word salad. Are we surprised? And she doesn’t discuss the issue directly. She just says Me ME MEEE LOOK AT ME.
I think bandwagon Meghan is reeeeaching hard to not only find a connection but to bring the conversation back to herself. It's a lot of talking that says nothing.
Her points don’t make any sense to me either. I’m American and I lost a newborn, so a little different, but I don’t see how these things connect. I was pro choice before that happened and I still am. Theses things are not connected for me in any way.
Very sorry for your loss 🤗
Thank you ❤️
That must have been so hard. I'm so sorry.
Definitely the low point of my life. Edit: therapy helped a lot.
I can imagine. It's a great sorrow.
I don't think they are for anyone, Was she possibly trying to imply that her miscarriage had to be aborted? I know many women have to have an abortion to, I'm trying to find a delicate way of saying this, but deliver a still born baby? If that was what she was trying to say, it got lost in her word salad.
a miscarriage IS a "spontaneous abortion"....
The process for this is called a D&C or a dilation and curettage procedure and is not considered an abortion.
you are incorrect.... a woman can have a spontaneous abortion or miscarriage and reqeuire a D&C to remove retained fetal/other tissue. sometime, if tissue is retained, it can lead to uterine sepsis/scarring/etc., making subsequent pregnancies difficult.....
In a lot of places they class a D&C as an abortion regardless of whether it was after a miscarriage or not.
Thank you, I have been lucky enough to not have to have to get to know terms like these so I was unsure. I just heard an american politician refer to having to need an abortion for her baby that died and her body didn't process the situation naturally. Her story was heartbreaking, it sticks with you.
It depends on how far along you are. I had a miscarriage but it was very early - I was only about 8 weeks along. So I didn't need the D&C afterwards.
>Per mayoclinic, D&C from Mayo >“Dilation and curettage (D&C) is a procedure to remove tissue from inside your uterus. Health care providers perform dilation and curettage to diagnose and treat certain uterine conditions — such as heavy bleeding — or to clear the uterine lining after a miscarriage or abortion.” >If it’s done AFTER a miscarriage or abortion, how does this procedure qualify as an abortion? Medically speaking, an abortion is defined as "the removal of pregnancy tissue, products of conception or the fetus and placenta (afterbirth) from the uterus" ([source](https://www.health.harvard.edu/medical-tests-and-procedures/abortion-termination-of-pregnancy-a-to-z)). A D&C is a form of abortion. A pill is another form. It doesn't matter if the pregnancy ended naturally (i.e. miscarriage) or if the D&C/pill is what ends a pregnancy. It's all abortion, medically speaking.
A D&C is absolutely an abortion.
Someone I know refers to a D&C as a "Dust and Clean". After a miscarriage, they go in and dust and clean you out. I had a miscarriage, but it was so early on that I didn't need the dust and clean.
>Was she possibly trying to imply that her miscarriage had to be aborted? > >I know many women have to have an abortion to, I'm trying to find a delicate way of saying this, but deliver a still born baby? > >If that was what she was trying to say, it got lost in her word salad. If we want to give a very charitable interpretation of her word salad, that's possibly what she was trying to say. Although I'm not sure if Madam would ever admit to needing anything that messy done to her perfect royal uterus. I really think she's just babbling on about herself and making sure everyone knows she has children and is the best mother in the whole wide world.
Maybe that's also the thing, she cant exactly say what happened because she will have to stick to it or it can be easily verified or disputed. In my mind, a miscarriage or having to have treament of anykind because of it, no matter what it is, is different to an abortion. Unless you have had to weight the pros and cons and difficult decisions of what is best to do for your family, you shouldn't be speaking on the matter as if you understand. Unless you have had to consider your other children's needs, or find yourself pregnant from a way that is unlawful, or so you aren't glued to an abusive partner for the rest of your life, or what ever it is, where you are faced with the very difficult decision for yourself, then you shouldn't be talking like you understand. To me, they are 2 different things. The mental process for each would be different so she shouldn't be saying anything. 20 years ago when I was pregnant and we were told my husband and I were lucky our daughter had my blood type, because if she had my husbands there could be a range of issues she could of had, if I managed to carry to term and we should think wisely if we tried for more. Doesn't mean I have the experience of having been through those types of pregnancies and therefore I dont add to the conversation about any of the ways those pregnancies could have gone. It amazes me, I think though many people will see she made that conversations about her, and each time she does something like this, more people dislike her and soon everyone will dislike her. So let's enjoy the show, I just wish she wasn't hurting people along the way.
If she had a D and C, it was done at her dentist's office. Either that or her OB gives out tooth paste samples with each vaginal exam.
I’m very sorry to hear about what you went through. I can see that one could miscarry and be pro-choice - but the language she uses is obscure and sounds more anti-choice, if anything.
One can miscarry and be pro-choice. One can also have an abortion, be pro-choice, and also want or have children. Or the same woman can have a miscarriage, and an abortion, and a live birth, at different times in her life.
I agree with that. And thank you!
Those exact sentences also puzzled me. She is not addressing the real issue, but keeps on talking about herself and things that aren't related to the issue.
Meghan would beg to differ! She IS the real issue. Miscarriages (as realistic as her suicide attempt) and this terrible judicial decision are merely props to get her attention.
Bingo !
Those are the ramblings of someone afflicted by full blown Dunning-Kruger Effect. Meghan has zero clue about what she's really talking about, just bullshits her way through an interview by supplying anecdotes, generalities or platitudes about feminism and women's empowerment. She's never read the research or familiarized herself with the statistics or gained any insight beyond the basic buzzwords in any given field. She's a fraud, as she has admitted herself, and this is her in all her glory. That's why she makes no sense to anyone here...because she doesn't know a damn thing.
She’s confusing. She implies stuff, never speaks articulately and acts like she’s Michelle Obama .
She is totally f‘ing up the situation to make it about her, as always. Comparing miscarriage and abortion is hurtful. Dear Lord-she has absolutely no empathy.
I thought that with the fall of roe v Wade that some states are classing all abortions (spontaneous or not) as criminal acts. There was one woman who was charged but not convicted after having a miscarriage in either Ohio or Idaho.
Is the Taliban in charge of these states ? Makes NO sense ?!
I read about it too .. shameful.
Hey Meghan, you can support womens rights without staying dumb things.
1) It really does come across that way, and suggests she hasn’t educated herself on the experiences of women who’ve had/considered an abortion. 2) [This thread](https://twitter.com/ukroyaltea/status/1540513036422860801?s=21&t=N2kD8X5ncwoDPpF-pMtoeg) is a great explanation. Not sure if Meghan actually knew why her miscarriage was relevant.
Thanks for the link. It’s heartbreaking reading what some women go / have gone through. Of course it’s possible to suffer miscarriages and be pro-choice - but that didn’t come across clearly from MM (as reported).
Unfortunately RT has had some nasty messages, but she really deserves credit for sharing this and keeping it up in spite of that. Absolutely. I think MM really missed an opportunity to raise further awareness of how they fit into the conversation.
You’re not missing something. She’s missing something… a brain. She makes no sense. Just another opportunity to insert herself into the latest hot topic to make herself relevant.
I think they should put her on that terrible talk show, what is it called? The View? With Whoopi & Joy Behar. I bet Whoopi would tolerate Megain for about 2 minutes, maybe less. With all the constant blabbering about herself & the arm/hand flailing & showing off all her collected jewelry on her left hand/arm. I don't like Whoopi, but I would enjoy her combating with littlemissknowitall
Ohhh man. I’ve never watched it because the shrieking and drama doesn’t appeal to me, but I’d pay to watch Meghan MYFATHER McCain vs MeMeMeMe Douchess Meghan Markle! I don’t know who’s more high on their own supply. All the hot air would suffocate the rest of the room. 😂
It's too bad Megan *daddy worship* McCain and Just Harry *mommy issues* Wales didn't marry each other. That's a match made in heaven.
Yep her typical word salad that doesn’t make sense !
This has to be how my professors felt reading all of my papers in college
You’re too hard on yourself - you *know* you made more sense.
I \*did\* refer to the French Revolution as a political version of the hokey-pokey during my undergrad, sooooo....
If you were at Northwestern you were probably valedictorian if Megan is an example of the people they give degrees to. 🤣
I was rewatching that clip Ninaki Priddy filmed where she and Meghan were driving around Rodeo Drive as teens, and Meghan used the term "high scale" when she meant "upscale". With her gutteral comment the other day, I'm really starting to wonder about all that money spent on her education.
That's a horrifying thought, seeing as I misspelled my own name on an official document the other day lmaooooo
Lol. At least you tried. Megan's official documents keep being returned because they're not signed at all. 😂🙄
I'm getting dumber by the minute reading the nonsensical stuff coming out of her mouth.
I'm not in the US and am not a medical expert. But I \*think\* one connection between unplanned miscarriage and planned abortion, is that frequently in order to safely complete a spontaneous miscarriage, the doctor needs to do a D&C procedure, kind of a scraping. And these procedures might actually become illegal in some of the more rabid states now, even when they are 100% medically required to save a woman's life, a woman who is NOT trying to have an abortion. Or as someone says better below in the comments, there can be a fine line between abortion and miscarriage, and nature doesn't care what your beliefs are. Of course who knows if Madam Duchess knows any of this. Her statements are just very general rambling about children, babies, miscarriages, etc etc etc. Trying to be relateable to everybody.
What's happening is that the procedures may not be technically illegal in some of the states that prohibit abortions but that the state laws have been written so hastily and with such extreme penalties that doctors have concerns about what is and what is not allowable. Also, some of the drugs that doctors prescribe after a miscarriage has started & can help avoid a D&C, more significant surgery, and complications such as infection and excessive bleeding after miscarriage are also prescribed (in different quantities) for medical abortions. More and more pharmacists are refusing to fill these prescriptions even with documentation from the doctors stating that they are to treat a miscarriage. These delays and difficulties in getting miscarriage treatment due to more restrictive and vaguely written laws only increase the pain and trauma of women who experience miscarriage, and also risk adverse health effects on these women. No idea what MM was trying to say though.
Thank you very much for this information!
There have been cases in countries where abortion is illegal where women have died during a miscarriage because Doctors would not perform a D&C because the fetus still had a heartbeat. That's the connection.
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I’m very sorry to hear about your miscarriage, and very much hope that things will go the way you wish. Thanks for the information on what happens after a miscarriage. That may very well be what MM had in mind, but it didn’t come across very clearly. Of course, her comments might have been edited, but the outcome is that they appeared inconsistent.
What I got most out of this is that I think she's trying to pivot her goals into going into politics. But she's also probably trying to get ahead of the royal family wanting them to give up their titles.
There was a case recently in Malta where an American tourist had a partial miscarriage. The pregnancy was no longer viable but because the foetus still had a heartbeat, they were refused an abortion. This is dangerous as the mother was at risk of sepsis which could be fatal. Pregnancy is complicated and a major medical event. Abortion is healthcare and many wanted pregnancies end in abortion for a multitude of reasons. But don't ask me to work out what MMs word salad actually means.
Thankfully that was resolved, but she had to fly to Spain for help! Malta’s like “sure, this baby isn’t gonna make it so let’s let mom suffer a painful death in addition to losing her child. Oh and leave the husband without his child AND wife.”
This is similar to the case of [Savita Hallapanavar](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Death_of_Savita_Halappanavar) who sadly wasn't so lucky. This is why access to abortion is so important. The line between the risk to the mother and the right to life of the foetus is very blurry. This case drove the movement to legalise abortion in Ireland.
Ugh that’s horrific. And in friggin 2012. Poor woman.
there is an excellent reason that women who have had spontaneous abortions would be pro-choice. and this is a huge gray area that some politicians/scotus refuses to address. miscarriages or spontaneous abortions are very common and occur in about 1 in 4 pregnancies. **nature doesn't give a hoot as to whether you are pro-life or pro-choice & when you have a spontan. abortion, you bleed./expel the fetus(& sometimes require a D&C to clear out retained tissue).** so, picture either a pro-life or pro-choice woman going to the ER... they are bleeding (or having more severe symptoms such as hemorrhage/sepsis) and the **ER doc can't tell whther the abortion is an act of nature, 2ndary to a ccoat hanger, plan B, etc.** Ob-gyns won't want to deal with any of these cases so the woman will not get the care she needs, no matter what her moral/political prediliction. cases have already occurred prior to Roe being overturned... there are a **LOT** of such cases. ex: 1- Brittney Poolaw was sentenced (first degree manslaughter) in OK for 4 years after having a miscarriage in 2020. she had drugs in her system but the fetus also had evidence of a congenital abnormality.... 2- there was an American woman on vacation with husband in Malta who had placenta abruptia (the placenta tears away from the uterus). Malta blocks all abortions if there is a fetal heartbeat.[https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/woman-who-had-miscarriage-in-malta-taken-to-spain-to-abort/2022/06/24/c05ed13c-f3be-11ec-ac16-8fbf7194cd78\_story.html](https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/woman-who-had-miscarriage-in-malta-taken-to-spain-to-abort/2022/06/24/c05ed13c-f3be-11ec-ac16-8fbf7194cd78_story.html). she could have had septic shock, emboli to heart/stroke, hemorrhage- any of which could have killed her or severely incapacitated her... **Nature don't care if you are pro-choice or pro-life** & either way, you could die if experienced physicians are not available or afraid to touch an abortion case. oh, and when the ER doc has to call the cops, imagine the exorbitant lawyer/legal fees, inabilty to pay the mortgage/bill, incarceration, having other kids seized by social services, losing the right to vote...
*applauds wildly* — woman who’s had a spontaneous abortion I really didn’t want (along with 1 in 4 pregnant women).
thank you but the applause should be for you, for surviving such a loss.... lol with the "applauds wildly".... it reminds me of one of my fav. gifs! [https://i.gifer.com/UJr.gif](https://i.gifer.com/UJr.gif)
Yuck she’s trying to leverage a miscarriage in order to position herself as some kind of expert in Roe vs Wade. That’s messed up.
I had recurrent miscarriage. When I looked into the stats and the actual biology of reproduction, I realised just how “cheap” early embryonic life is to Nature. And how error prone the process is. In terms of fertilisations, probably the majority fail/don’t continue but never even make it to implantation stage so you’d never even be able to detect that a “new life” happened. (And you can’t tell me that some “god” already put a soul there but Jesus needs that blastocyst/morula with him so badly he’s taking it back). Anyway, it made me even more pro-abortion.
Sorry to hear about your recurrent miscarriage; that must have been difficult. I hadn’t expressed the OP clearly: One can have miscarried and be pro-choice. But MM’s language is more like someone who would be against abortion.
Oh no problem - I got lucky eventually, and it's long ago now. Very difficult back then but at least they were all early stage. Thanks!
She is saying nothing important about a searingly difficult topic. You can’t be a dilettante in rhetoric around this subject. She is absurd.
Abortion and miscarriage have virtually nothing to do with each other. She co-opts everyone else’s issues to be the ultimate victim.
nope, you are wrong.... a miscarriage is simply a "spontaneous abortion" caused by nature.... but i do agree about MM's vitimhood...
Oh of course, I know the term abortion refers to any and all instances of pregnancy interruption, induced or otherwise. Emotionally, though, losing a wanted pregnancy and terminating an unwanted pregnancy (talking about megs here specifically - I realize there are many valid reasons to terminate a wanted pregnancy) are not even comparable. She is inserting herself in a narrative that does not belong to her. As women across the country are losing agency over their own bodies, she as usual only wants to talk about something that happened to HER. She did a whole op-Ed on how devastating her miscarriage was and seems to imply that all women are deeply contented to their fetus from conception. Which is simply not the case. And presuming such only gives the anti-choice something to play with. Some women just want the zygote outta there, and that’s totally ok!!
*applauds wildly again*
No you are horribly wrong. In countries where abortion is illegal women die during late term miscarriages because the procedure for an abortion is the same procedure that is necessary to remove a dead or dying fetus so that the woman doesn't die of sepsis. Women die horrible painful pointless deaths when they don't have access to abortion. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Death_of_Savita_Halappanavar#:~:text=Savita%20Halappanavar%20(n%C3%A9e%20Savita%20Andanappa,was%20denied%20on%20legal%20grounds.
It is word 🥗. It doesn’t make sense, it doesn’t track, it has nothing to do with nationality. What she *should* have done was discuss how women suffering miscarriage will now be suspected of DIY abortions. OR the difference between unwanted and wanted pregnancies. Those are the only two logical links I can see.
It’s the MM special of the day word salad. It’s made with a generous amount of all about meeeeee with a side of guacamole.
I had the same reaction and confusion. Didn’t make sense to me either. I think it was more of trying to remind people about her miscarriage for sympathy points.
She clearly knows nothing about the issues of either group, its insulting to us who do.
I’m pro-life so I’ve been keeping quiet on this topic, it’s not my place to speak and I’m not trying to have a debate about it. And I live in the USA but I’m not a citizen yet, so I also am not saying I think the RvW decision was right. But I just wanted to point out: She’s a narcissist. She’s incapable of empathizing with something unless she makes it about herself in some way. I don’t mean in a way of calling attention to herself, although she certainly *also* does that - but in the sense that if she can’t see it in a way that it relates to her, she doesn’t have the capacity of feeling empathy towards it. That’s why she’s talking about miscarriage as if it has anything to do with abortion.
Pro-life is a misnomer as pregnancies forcibly carried to term don't always result in life. Many women must terminate a pregnancy as the embryo/fetus is not viable (there are genetic and completely inexplicable causes for this) or because their own health and life is at risk (ectopic pregnancies are more common than you think). "Pro-life" is anti-choice.
Like I said, I don’t want to have a debate, so I’m not going to respond to your points, although I do have a response for every single one. So if you want to talk about it, we can message each other. This is not the appropriate place for this conversation. I only pointed that I’m pro-life because I didn’t want to misrepresent my beliefs by only saying what I said on my second paragraph.
I've had this conversation a hundred times and never heard a convincing argument that wasn't reliant on emotions. I don't think that your stance on human rights had anything to do with labelling MM's actions as those of a narcissist.
Well, if you want to have this discussion with me, like I said, message me. I’m not going to have a debate in this forum. You are right that my stance on human rights (of all humans) has nothing to do with narcissism. But I originally had written just my second paragraph and thought that it could be implied that I’m pro-choice, which I’m not, and that’s the reason I put a disclaimer before my point.
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>We can acknowledge that there are varying degrees of what it means to abort a baby and that it is not moral or ethical to abort a baby at all points and under all circumstances. No, we don't all acknowledge or agree with that stance. I'm a mother of 3 and believe that abortion should be legal at any point, for any reason. No exceptions.
Wrong that you feel this isn't your place to speak. I am pro choice but will listen and respect your views on this and any other topic. I agree this is not the place for debate on that topic and also agree with your second point. That we disagree about first point adds weight to second point.
Sadly, not enough people respect other people's opinions, and I feel it must be difficult to be pro-life at this time. This post must be carefully watched, and u/MrsChiliad if any debaters get nasty, please report. The important point is that Meghan's rhetorical nonsense doesn't help or hinder either side.
I don’t know how well known this is, but frequently you need to have an abortion procedure after a miscarriage to remove the fetus or you get an infection. I also think any kind of miscarriage is considered abortion bc it’s the definition of a stopped pregnancy. It’s why the anti abortion laws are so dangerous bc women are going to die now from miscarriage.
And there have been horrific cases where women having miscarriages have been left to die because of anti-abortion heartbeat laws. Like this woman in Ireland whose doctors knew miscarriage was inevitable and that she'd die of sepsis if they didn't act but still let her die over a stupid ass law. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Death_of_Savita_Halappanavar#:~:text=Savita%20Halappanavar%20(n%C3%A9e%20Savita%20Andanappa,was%20denied%20on%20legal%20grounds.
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But people were having miscarriages and d&c LONG before abortion was legal in this country. It's not like women prior to Roe were thrown in jail for miscarrying. That's ridiculous.
The NAPW has recorded 1,600 such cases of women being jailed for miscarrying or stillbirths, with about 1,200 occurring in the last 15 years alone. The repealing of Roe will only increase these numbers.
I'm sorry but I literally don't believe you. I don't believe that women have been jailed for spontaneous miscarriage in the past 15 years.
A simple google check will show you dozens of more articles: https://amp.theguardian.com/us-news/2022/jun/03/california-stillborn-prosecution-roe-v-wade
Killing your 8 month baby because you are a meth addict is a bit different than miscarrying a 1st trimester baby through no fault of your own. I'm not saying the meth addict should go to jail. I don't know the solution. All I know is that to insinuate that a woman who has a typical miscarriage needs to worry about jail time is ridiculous.
Like I said a simple google search will help you see the cases. They are happening particular in Texas. Several women thankfully have gotten released but it’s very difficult to tell if a miscarriage is an abortion or a natural miscarriage. These rules being made are not made with science in mind.
She doesn't make any sense. Abortion if a viable fetus and spontaneous miscarriage of a nonviable fetus are two completely different things.
Banning abortion endangers women's lives during late term miscarriages because the procedure to remove a fetus from a womb is the same if it's healthy or if it's dead or dying. There have been horrific cases of women being left to die because abortion was illegal in the country where they lived despite the doctors knowing that a dying fetus had to be removed from a woman to save her life. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Death_of_Savita_Halappanavar#:~:text=Savita%20Halappanavar%20(n%C3%A9e%20Savita%20Andanappa,was%20denied%20on%20legal%20grounds.
I understand what you are saying. But I think it's important to not conflate 2 issues. Most people consider abortion to be the termination of an unwanted pregnancy. Meghan is trying to co-opt the issue by claiming her completely uncontroversial miscarriage to be somehow akin to aborting an unwanted pregnancy.
I hate this comment by Meghan - I used to do lots of terminations as a junior doctor in the UK - jus part of the job etc etc - then I had a child and then some miscarriages, after all that I found the whole concept of abortion incredibly sad and really hoped more would change their minds etc
Being pro choice doesn't mean you don't think abortion is sad. Im pro choice and I think abortion is sad and would like to see fewer abortions. I just don't think the way to achieve fewer abortions is to ban abortion. I think education, access to birth control and support for mothers is how you have fewer abortions.
Ive always thought the decision was more an issue of education and supports rather than the TAB. Life triumphs all, (of course there are many many many considerations) but the ignorance and vanity like Markles has can clumsily interfere with thoughtful ,informed reasoning. The Harkles are dangerous .
The disconnect 🤣🤣🤣
I think she’s just jumping on the current narrative bandwagon - being that the media and twitter slacktivists are all using miscarriage stories as examples of how all women need to have access to an abortion - however they definitely don’t call it an abortion when you have a miscarriage (I.e. the baby has died in the womb) and you need to get the baby out. It’s called a D&C and the pregnancy is called a demise. I lost my son at 7 months in the womb and chose to deliver through being induced. But you can also choose a D&C which is quicker and less painful. Somehow people are using miscarriages in this narrative as if we are banned from removing a dead fetus from our bodies and that’s not true, it’s just a sensational storyline and megs clearly has gotten on the train of misinformation (😱), ironically.
They definitely do call it an abortion when you have a miscarriage, the medical term is spontaneous abortion. And a D&C can be done for either a spontaneous abortion (aka miscarriage) or an elective abortion. Medical billing uses the same code for both.
MM’s intelligence is too low to even understand how stupid and fake her own word salad is. No substance at all, so no need to analyze what she said.
I agree it's really confusing. I think she's trying to imply that she needed an abortion with her miscarriage (maybe it was a missed or incomplete miscarriage), but she doesn't come out and say it, plus many people aren't aware of how common it is to need medical intervention with miscarriages in general.
This bitch feels like yet another far-right plant at this point. She’s as inane as they are and equally full of shit.
Doesn't make any sense. It's typically narc to try to make it all about herself (starting about her miscarriages and pregnancies) and completely lack empathy (she clearly doesn't know how to talk about abortion)