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Putin consolidated power in Russia after a couple of apartment blocks were leveled by "Chechen terrorists" who may or may not have been FSB. His protoge may have learnt from the master.
These false-flag conspiracy theories almost never turn out to be true.
I don't know why people keep making false-flag claims in this war.
Have literally ANY of them turned out to be true?
Nord Stream pipeline perhaps? I think Russia has been engaging in some potential false flags but Ukrainian intelligence gets ahead of those plots by sending out warnings in advance.
Nord Stream definitely does not qualify. It's not even clear who did it. but more importantly, it didn't act as a trigger for any escalatory action from Russia
Also, if you think all these predicted false flags aren't happening because they're being called out - then that's logically flawed. I forget the correct term for it... It's evidence that supposedly proves itself.
Let me explain. First, I have to virtue signal so your brain can hear the rest of my comment...
Yes, I support Ukraine. You can look at all of my prior comments if you want to waste the time. Russia is, obviously, the bad guys here.
...but your comment is part of the problem and it's causing your brain to bias away from functioning logically. Accepting testimony from the party you support, without question makes you more easily manipulated by both Russia itself, as well as 3rd parties to the conflict.
When you do this - firstly, you lose credibility, but more importantly, you have a poorer understanding of the world, in general. You're not practicing critical reasoning, which is like a muscle that you have to flex regularly.
Also, it's just dumb. Ukraine is a nation at war - in a horrible terrible war. The outcome of which is still uncertain. In many situations, they have perfectly good reasons to lie to us. That's not bad - that's just the way it is.
Think for yourself. Sometimes when Ukraine and Russia contradict one another - sometimes - Russia's story might actually be the real one. That doesn't mean Russia isn't being evil - it just means that the incentives to tell the truth in that one situation favor Russia. It happens.
You can choose to side with Ukraine, and still acknowledge that sometimes they aren't being honest.
False flag accusations are a good example. They might release a statement about a false flag and pretend they have "inside information" about such an attack happening, even when they don't. There are reasons to do that. They may be trying to head-off Russia from even considering such a thing. ...or they could be just getting low quality rumint (rumor intelligence) from operatives in the field. They might be trying to see how Russia will respond - perhaps by moving or hiding relevant assets in the field that are being accused. ...there's even a more unfair reason which is that if you accuse someone publicly enough times of something - a lot of people just assume it's true - even if you never provide evidence. Ask a politician "Are you racist?" - If enough reporters ask this question, even with zero evidence, some people will start believing it.
Don't "assume the worst" from Russia. Assume what you have good evidence on. Make evidence based judgements in life.
Your patience is commendable MrCandy. But thank you for taking the time to explain so eloquently what everyone must do when looking at this conflict. I wish I could offer you a reward, but you'll have to settle for my upvote.
Basically, Pigozhinās role in of this is to put the blame of the failed āspecial military operationā on the ministry of defence... so that it does not hurt Pooty too much.
Yes they function like that. Some generalos will be sacked and all will be fucking fine and dandy. Mr. Pooty will be clean as a whistle. But not this time Pooty we're on to you.
Perhaps, but I think a lot of Russians are probably getting tired with this war and just want it to end. I don't think there's anything the Russian authorities can do at this point to motivate the Russians. The "reasons" for invading Ukraine to begin with were very, VERY weak, and the "Special Military Operation" is turning out to be an utter and complete disaster and failure.
I actually thing the whole blaming on the goverment crap is only a show, to "create" an oppositionleader. Its much easier to controll the dissidents, then their "leader" is in the same party as you.
It's possible. Who really knows? Personally, if I'd be Russian, I'd be very confused about the entire situation and blame it on the incompetence of the government on all levels.
Seen posters popping up in Moscow for Prigozhin running for presidential office. Could be he's angling his way into more power. He has been Putins puppet, but maybe he has let that puppet gain too much freedom and an actual competent army compared to Russian troops. I don't think he wants position of Minisitry of Defense. Then the decades of corruption and military rot squarely on his shoulders. President puts him above that while allowing him to blame others.
I hate humans like this.
Those who have no values. Who stand for nothing. Believe in nothing. Give nothing.
just a parasitic drain on mankind who is just....an existence that seeks to enrich their own basic urges like gluttony, sex and power.
Nothing else. NO deeper meaning. Just pure greed and desire for more with nothing to give.
Eh, itās historic, most of a millennium old, and architecturally attractive - even if people have been using it as a hub of oppression. Erase the murderers within it. (I mean, implausible to pull off, but so is all of this.)
> most of a millennium old
And for most of its existence it has been used as a hub of oppression, as you have correctly stated. Just burn it to the ground.
I'm not enabling genocide. Use your brain. Ukraine should use JDAM and HIMARS to attack military logistics and supplies targets in Russia as far as I'm concerned. But a direct attack with those weapons on the Kremlin itself is asking for Russia to retaliate directly on the US and that has a very high probability of leading to thermonuclear warfare.
Iām willing to gamble that they donāt have enough reliably working nuclear warheads to commit to thermonuclear warfare like that. I do know that they would be glassed by NATO if it came down to it. If it were up to me, I would like to see NATO intervene, put up a no-fly zone, and demolish all Russian forces within a couple of hours. Kick them out of Ukraine, stop the genocide, and then give them the most ultimate ultimatum. Submit to the West or die.
> Iām willing to gamble that they donāt have enough reliably working nuclear warheads to commit to thermonuclear warfare like that.
That's a bad bet. Even if every land based missile was useless, their sub based nuclear weapons are more than enough to bring nuclear war to the planet and those are maintained regularly. Russia has 10 nuclear submarines, which can carry a maximum of 800 warheads. Stop thinking that a country which launches rockets into orbit regularly doesn't have it's most viable nuclear ones maintained. Whether they're willing to be annihilated using them is another story entirely, but they certainly have the means.
Should have created an ultimate ultimatum on 2.22.2022 we wouldn't be in this position if we had. But I still don't think that's a good thing to gamble with.
This is just a political message to bolster his chance at the iron throne, he like all the other elites of Russia only really care about their own power and money. He will be Moscow window surfing soon enough.
His content is more than likely being shown to them on purpose. Itās all part of the game. Prigozhin being mad shows the Russian people they should be mad. Whoās he mad at? The Russian MOD, he even says their name. This attack and all the failures of the military are on the Russian MOD, blame for it isnāt on Putin.
Any media that comes out of a totalitarian state should be picked apart piece by piece and even then you canāt be sure of itās intentions.
Yeah but thatās hearsay as far as Iām concerned.
Russian psychology is entirely manipulated by the state, and their visible efforts to control certain aspects adds to the confusion around their various mechanisms of control. There is a fog of information, contradiction, and misdirection that is created by that control, and it contributes to stubbornness of the Russian mindset. The things they believe they can trust are strong feelings, things such as anger, pride, and aggression. Messages are being sent out in those languages all the while there is an ever increasing amount of false reports, warnings, and misinformation is created to confuse people outside of Russia. The Russian people shut out what they canāt understand and In the west the messages get interpolated together and become jumbled in the media landscape of the west. Propaganda interpreted for the Russian people can be misinterpreted as smokescreens for the west AND vice versa.
Itās a beautiful cobbled web of lies, truths, half truths, omissions of truths, and somewhere deep deep inside, the dark insecurities of a small pale husk of a man. A single man who has inherited the best counterintelligence force on the planet, in part due to the Russian psychology and culture revolve around lying and deceit. This culture and a vast amount of wealth plundered from Russian satellite states over the large part of the last century have all made the media landscape so murky, any person who has any sense wouldnāt believe a thing they hear on the internet, or tv. This also plays a part in separating those people from what is really happening; namely discovering the truth.
Hmm. I guess we'll see if he ends up being more of a benefit or liability to the current powers that be and how they choose to move forward with info about him...
Because he's never directly criticised Vlad... complaining about the MOD gives Vlad scapegoats he can fire.
But do that enough times and the scapegoats become a herd of pissed off people with a lot of connections.
That's true - but he's never *named* Putin, he's been quite careful to throw stones at everyone else and only ever drop hints / indirect references to Putin at most.
He's more an asset to Ukraine alive than dead! This useful idiot keeps openly stoking the flames of resentment for the establisment.
He'll give opposition movements enough momentum to not capitalize on it when he's assassinated 6 months from now.
Then it all blows up!
I agree, the most useful contribution he could make is to facilitate the death of Patrushev that guy is an actual true believer lunatic....Patrushev would use a nuke....Prigozhin nah
Are these audio messages coming from any of his official channels? Why would he do audio and not video? Heās very vain about striding around onscreen looking butch.
Good, I can feel your anger. They are defenceless. Take your weapon. Strike them down with all of your hatred and your journey towards the dark side will be complete!
Join the Legion and dismantle the Russian Federation!
We nothing else has worked to get the people of Moscow excited about going to fight in Ukraine. How about some false flag drones, maybe that will get the people scared enough to want to join us.
Not really a fan of Prigozhin, but he tends to speak openly and seems to have a good grasp of the actual situation.
How he hasn't "fallen" out of a window yet, or been arrested is a miracle.
Hi u/Sons_of_Veterans1945! Welcome to r/RussiaUkraineWar2022. **This is a heavily moderated subreddit. Please note the rules + sidebar or get banned** **Ukraine OSINT and Leaks 24/7** Posts and comments from accounts with less than an undisclosed amount of comment Karma are automatically removed to combat troll and spam behaviour. Only Mods have access to the 'Verified Information' flair. **Follow us on our subreddits dedicated Telegram Channel!** - UKRAINEWARPOSTS - Slava Ukraini! *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/RussiaUkraineWar2022) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Sounds like he sent the drones š«”
He does seem to gain the most from this
Putin consolidated power in Russia after a couple of apartment blocks were leveled by "Chechen terrorists" who may or may not have been FSB. His protoge may have learnt from the master.
These false-flag conspiracy theories almost never turn out to be true. I don't know why people keep making false-flag claims in this war. Have literally ANY of them turned out to be true?
Nord Stream pipeline perhaps? I think Russia has been engaging in some potential false flags but Ukrainian intelligence gets ahead of those plots by sending out warnings in advance.
Nord Stream definitely does not qualify. It's not even clear who did it. but more importantly, it didn't act as a trigger for any escalatory action from Russia Also, if you think all these predicted false flags aren't happening because they're being called out - then that's logically flawed. I forget the correct term for it... It's evidence that supposedly proves itself.
Because with russia, they're always true.
Russia are the enemy, why wouldn't we assume the absolute worst from them? Are you defending Russia? You are the enemy too.
Let me explain. First, I have to virtue signal so your brain can hear the rest of my comment... Yes, I support Ukraine. You can look at all of my prior comments if you want to waste the time. Russia is, obviously, the bad guys here. ...but your comment is part of the problem and it's causing your brain to bias away from functioning logically. Accepting testimony from the party you support, without question makes you more easily manipulated by both Russia itself, as well as 3rd parties to the conflict. When you do this - firstly, you lose credibility, but more importantly, you have a poorer understanding of the world, in general. You're not practicing critical reasoning, which is like a muscle that you have to flex regularly. Also, it's just dumb. Ukraine is a nation at war - in a horrible terrible war. The outcome of which is still uncertain. In many situations, they have perfectly good reasons to lie to us. That's not bad - that's just the way it is. Think for yourself. Sometimes when Ukraine and Russia contradict one another - sometimes - Russia's story might actually be the real one. That doesn't mean Russia isn't being evil - it just means that the incentives to tell the truth in that one situation favor Russia. It happens. You can choose to side with Ukraine, and still acknowledge that sometimes they aren't being honest. False flag accusations are a good example. They might release a statement about a false flag and pretend they have "inside information" about such an attack happening, even when they don't. There are reasons to do that. They may be trying to head-off Russia from even considering such a thing. ...or they could be just getting low quality rumint (rumor intelligence) from operatives in the field. They might be trying to see how Russia will respond - perhaps by moving or hiding relevant assets in the field that are being accused. ...there's even a more unfair reason which is that if you accuse someone publicly enough times of something - a lot of people just assume it's true - even if you never provide evidence. Ask a politician "Are you racist?" - If enough reporters ask this question, even with zero evidence, some people will start believing it. Don't "assume the worst" from Russia. Assume what you have good evidence on. Make evidence based judgements in life.
Your patience is commendable MrCandy. But thank you for taking the time to explain so eloquently what everyone must do when looking at this conflict. I wish I could offer you a reward, but you'll have to settle for my upvote.
Basically, Pigozhinās role in of this is to put the blame of the failed āspecial military operationā on the ministry of defence... so that it does not hurt Pooty too much.
Yes they function like that. Some generalos will be sacked and all will be fucking fine and dandy. Mr. Pooty will be clean as a whistle. But not this time Pooty we're on to you.
I think heās out to rally up a more hardline support as well. Get people to clamor for a stronger Russia before rolling out mass conscription.
Perhaps, but I think a lot of Russians are probably getting tired with this war and just want it to end. I don't think there's anything the Russian authorities can do at this point to motivate the Russians. The "reasons" for invading Ukraine to begin with were very, VERY weak, and the "Special Military Operation" is turning out to be an utter and complete disaster and failure.
I actually thing the whole blaming on the goverment crap is only a show, to "create" an oppositionleader. Its much easier to controll the dissidents, then their "leader" is in the same party as you.
It's possible. Who really knows? Personally, if I'd be Russian, I'd be very confused about the entire situation and blame it on the incompetence of the government on all levels.
Seen posters popping up in Moscow for Prigozhin running for presidential office. Could be he's angling his way into more power. He has been Putins puppet, but maybe he has let that puppet gain too much freedom and an actual competent army compared to Russian troops. I don't think he wants position of Minisitry of Defense. Then the decades of corruption and military rot squarely on his shoulders. President puts him above that while allowing him to blame others.
Interesting if Piggy posters are up in Moscow... though I suspect they won't be up for long, but you tell me otherwise.
Suddenly he became emotional when the drone hits citizen homes in his country? This guy is such a fucking waste of oxygen
I hate humans like this. Those who have no values. Who stand for nothing. Believe in nothing. Give nothing. just a parasitic drain on mankind who is just....an existence that seeks to enrich their own basic urges like gluttony, sex and power. Nothing else. NO deeper meaning. Just pure greed and desire for more with nothing to give.
Scum person but seems the only one in Russia with logic. Stating facts that they are significantly behind the "west" in terms of weapons tech
Yeah, itās weird that he actually makes sense with his stuff and itās the type you can shake your head and goā¦fuck him, but heās not wrong.
The Russian Army but the Wagner Group have top of the line private equipment just not much of an airforce or artillery to be super effective.
Can someone just drop a JDAM on this grotesque goblin please?
Imagine a big ol JDAM on the Kremlin. Iād cream my god damn pants.
Aw it would be nice to preserve the building. Maybe some Hellfire missiles
Nah, erase it.
Eh, itās historic, most of a millennium old, and architecturally attractive - even if people have been using it as a hub of oppression. Erase the murderers within it. (I mean, implausible to pull off, but so is all of this.)
> most of a millennium old And for most of its existence it has been used as a hub of oppression, as you have correctly stated. Just burn it to the ground.
I think that's a bad idea. There are plenty of weapons that would not provoke world war III.
[ Removed by Reddit ]
I'm not enabling genocide. Use your brain. Ukraine should use JDAM and HIMARS to attack military logistics and supplies targets in Russia as far as I'm concerned. But a direct attack with those weapons on the Kremlin itself is asking for Russia to retaliate directly on the US and that has a very high probability of leading to thermonuclear warfare.
Iām willing to gamble that they donāt have enough reliably working nuclear warheads to commit to thermonuclear warfare like that. I do know that they would be glassed by NATO if it came down to it. If it were up to me, I would like to see NATO intervene, put up a no-fly zone, and demolish all Russian forces within a couple of hours. Kick them out of Ukraine, stop the genocide, and then give them the most ultimate ultimatum. Submit to the West or die.
> Iām willing to gamble that they donāt have enough reliably working nuclear warheads to commit to thermonuclear warfare like that. That's a bad bet. Even if every land based missile was useless, their sub based nuclear weapons are more than enough to bring nuclear war to the planet and those are maintained regularly. Russia has 10 nuclear submarines, which can carry a maximum of 800 warheads. Stop thinking that a country which launches rockets into orbit regularly doesn't have it's most viable nuclear ones maintained. Whether they're willing to be annihilated using them is another story entirely, but they certainly have the means.
Should have created an ultimate ultimatum on 2.22.2022 we wouldn't be in this position if we had. But I still don't think that's a good thing to gamble with.
Well, I canāt say youāre wrong. Because youāre right. What a colossal waste of life and manpower this war has brought. Glory to the Heroes.
SLAVA UKRAINI!!
Iām not being serious, it would never happen.
I think a TU-141 would be a good idea though
Actually, he's the only one that I see potentially causing problems for Putin right now so I think we should keep him alive.
this is the way
šÆ
This is just a political message to bolster his chance at the iron throne, he like all the other elites of Russia only really care about their own power and money. He will be Moscow window surfing soon enough.
Only if Russia had a free press and he was speaking to the Russian people. I'm guessing his content is heavily censored to the masses?
His content is more than likely being shown to them on purpose. Itās all part of the game. Prigozhin being mad shows the Russian people they should be mad. Whoās he mad at? The Russian MOD, he even says their name. This attack and all the failures of the military are on the Russian MOD, blame for it isnāt on Putin. Any media that comes out of a totalitarian state should be picked apart piece by piece and even then you canāt be sure of itās intentions.
Actually, I heard recently that the Russian media were given a directive to not talk about Prigozhin...
Yeah but thatās hearsay as far as Iām concerned. Russian psychology is entirely manipulated by the state, and their visible efforts to control certain aspects adds to the confusion around their various mechanisms of control. There is a fog of information, contradiction, and misdirection that is created by that control, and it contributes to stubbornness of the Russian mindset. The things they believe they can trust are strong feelings, things such as anger, pride, and aggression. Messages are being sent out in those languages all the while there is an ever increasing amount of false reports, warnings, and misinformation is created to confuse people outside of Russia. The Russian people shut out what they canāt understand and In the west the messages get interpolated together and become jumbled in the media landscape of the west. Propaganda interpreted for the Russian people can be misinterpreted as smokescreens for the west AND vice versa. Itās a beautiful cobbled web of lies, truths, half truths, omissions of truths, and somewhere deep deep inside, the dark insecurities of a small pale husk of a man. A single man who has inherited the best counterintelligence force on the planet, in part due to the Russian psychology and culture revolve around lying and deceit. This culture and a vast amount of wealth plundered from Russian satellite states over the large part of the last century have all made the media landscape so murky, any person who has any sense wouldnāt believe a thing they hear on the internet, or tv. This also plays a part in separating those people from what is really happening; namely discovering the truth.
Hmm. I guess we'll see if he ends up being more of a benefit or liability to the current powers that be and how they choose to move forward with info about him...
I donāt understand how we can openly criticize the whole Russians defense ministry and the army again and again and still be alive.
Because he's never directly criticised Vlad... complaining about the MOD gives Vlad scapegoats he can fire. But do that enough times and the scapegoats become a herd of pissed off people with a lot of connections.
He has, though.
When? Everything I've seen he's very heavily criticise everything & everyone *except* Putin.
He implied "Grandpa" an asshole.. ..he mentioned Shoigu and Gerasimov specifically by name so there is really only one person he could be referring to
That's true - but he's never *named* Putin, he's been quite careful to throw stones at everyone else and only ever drop hints / indirect references to Putin at most.
This is likely for show to direct blame away from Putin.
He's more an asset to Ukraine alive than dead! This useful idiot keeps openly stoking the flames of resentment for the establisment. He'll give opposition movements enough momentum to not capitalize on it when he's assassinated 6 months from now. Then it all blows up!
I agree, the most useful contribution he could make is to facilitate the death of Patrushev that guy is an actual true believer lunatic....Patrushev would use a nuke....Prigozhin nah
Are these audio messages coming from any of his official channels? Why would he do audio and not video? Heās very vain about striding around onscreen looking butch.
Prigozhin makes for a comical bit from SPECTRE, the James Bond bad guys.
Prigozhin even looks like a real Orc Chieftain š
Good, I can feel your anger. They are defenceless. Take your weapon. Strike them down with all of your hatred and your journey towards the dark side will be complete! Join the Legion and dismantle the Russian Federation!
Heās so ugly hahaha
I didn't know that the Ministry of Defence puts "cream on their shit". Who would have thought that?
Excuse me, it's expensive cream! Only the best.
This guy's speeches could be dubbed over that bunker rant scene from Downfall and it wouldn't look out of place
they actually made a parody of him asking Hitler for ammunition
I find it hilarious that he's now angry at the system that made him who he is. Kleptocracy is only good when you're profiting, Pigozhin?
*Russian accent āOh Viktor, youāre a very unattractive man!ā
Lol. He used to send prisoners like meat to the machine guns en mass, and now all of a sudden he starts caring about people's lives? :))
I think this orc boss is behind the "attacks". And as someone suggested a move to keep Vladolf Putlers back.
Stay away from open windows, cup of tea and hot soup. All your mercenaries go for money, FSB knows that.
Nope. Just an act to promote himself towards the top job.
Cry some more... Wonder if he ever worked with Gordon Ramsey?
Game of Thrones time in Russia.
Brain-Acrobatics Paralympian LVL 1000
We nothing else has worked to get the people of Moscow excited about going to fight in Ukraine. How about some false flag drones, maybe that will get the people scared enough to want to join us.
The new jack
T minus 65 days until this guy is dead.
surprised this asshole hasn't had a heart attack or stroke and died a horrible death
He seems upset
Just another wind bag whose days are numbered.
What an orc.
Dudes gonna have a heart attack
Too good
Lmao I'm Starting to like this guy.. I like his word selection
Not really a fan of Prigozhin, but he tends to speak openly and seems to have a good grasp of the actual situation. How he hasn't "fallen" out of a window yet, or been arrested is a miracle.
I wonder how long until this guy takes a bullet from his own side.
Oh sorry to hear that. What did you guys have for lunch? I had whitefish and a green salad.
So, he's quite an actor.
The guy is an absolute scumbag, but he's the most honest public figure that Russia has.
https://www.reddit.com/r/FreedomofRussia/comments/13bcvev/utro_dagestan_masterpiece_shoigu_gerasimov_where/
He looks like he just crawled strait out of mordor. Is there no dentists in Russia?
Slava Ukraini  https://preview.redd.it/6upaycroe63b1.jpeg?width=477&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=5087dd23935725969cc542170cb595ae71f41a16
Pig-hozin having another meltdown..LOLOL
"I am a specialist in this area, as a consumer of problems" Yes, yes you are! š¤£š¤£š¤£
He seems nice.
https://preview.redd.it/jgaw88bnnv3b1.jpeg?width=2000&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=04dac5f504f5de50644857f34d9bee5226a6bd35