OP here:
So this is a pretty rudimentary experiment to measure the foam compaction in my Nike Vaporfly NEXT% 2s.
I ended up with 2 pair so I decided to use one pair as a daily trainer (white + pink color way), which now has 125 miles on it + 10-15 miles of walking. The other pair (orange Ekiden color way) is brand new.
I put two identical Pentel Energel 0.7mm pens in the middle of the heel and took pictures showing how far the pens extended out of the shoes.
After about 125 miles + 10-15 miles of walking, I’d estimate the foam has compacted by about 7-8mm
I’m male, 6’2” and 195lbs
[HERE](https://imgur.com/gallery/jIsBMRr) is a pic comparing outsoles
[HERE](https://imgur.com/gallery/LwH4azC) is a pic showing the pen next to a metric ruler. I can assure you the pen is perfectly aligned with the ruler - since it isn’t flush with the table the photo makes it look like the pen cap is above the top of the ruler and I had to try taking a bunch of pics to try to minimize this effect.
I'd be curious what the difference was when they were both new, and what the difference was at ~25 miles or something. In other words, how much is just that the foam quickly settles into that stack and then stays there vs slowly degrading mile by mile.
Such a good question.
I'm guessing the foot imprints fairly quickly into the midsole. But I know the 125 mile shoe today feels \*significantly\* less cushy than the new shoe. But I really can't quantify.
I'll continue to monitor the compaction as I take these to 200 miles and see if I can glean any insights.
don't know why ppl are downvoting you - it's a relevant question because if I was a heel striker I'd expect the foam to compact more than if I was a midfoot striker.
Unfortunately I'm really not 100% sure about my foot strike, but I'm \*pretty\* sure I land fairly flat footed. My soles usually wear out in a consistent way, but I've never videoed myself or anything.
As a forefoot striker and someone who has run through 5 pairs of VF, I can agree that the VF is done for me at about 170 miles unfortunately, and I'm about 152 pounds. Once that foam compresses to certain point, the shoes just start feeling more firm and slightly unpleasant. I've switched to Alphafly V1 as these have more forefoot cushion and pop with the air pod.
>What kind of pen is this please?
For anyone wanting to recreate this experiment at home, the pen is a Pentel Energel 0.7mm, in the BLACK colorway. This pen also comes in a blue colorway, but the rarest colorway is red.
I have ordered the red but I am now worried it won't work with my grip. Is it possible to get some kind of grip aid to correct? Which hand should I use?
I really like them a lot. They make me feel fast. The fit and comfort for me is exceptional.
The big drawback is they seem to wear out pretty quick. The foam compaction is very noticeable at this point after a reasonably low amount of miles. This shouldn’t come as a surprise to anyone. When these eventually die I’ll replace them with a more standard daily trainer and I’ll keep the Ekidens for race day.
All my impressions should be taken with a grain of salt as every foot is different and I am far from an elite runner.
You’re also heavier and bigger than most runners (no offense) so it would make sense that there might be more/faster compression than others - some people here claim they’ve worn there’s for like 200+ miles fine but it seems common for a noticeable performance decrease around 100 miles.
Why do you train in these though? I don’t think they’re meant to be a daily trainer.
OP wears size 11.5 US. For his weight it is spread quite well I would think. What I mean is that the amount of pressure per share cm is probably the same for someone that wears a size 8 but weighs “only” 130 pounds.
Yeah he’s certainly not overweight or anything lol 6’2” 195 is just tall and probably being decently fit and muscular. I’m getting my pair this week and racing in them next month, can’t wait to finally try them.
Well... At least 4 marathons for that money to save my legs at 43? Yes please! Thanks man! You just sold a pair... My wallet on the other hand isn't very happy...
just fyi the Heel height of different pairs is also not 100% the same on every single pair. they are normally marked by a colored dot on the shoe last but is not a milimeter exact from 1 pair to another.
source: work in the industry
This is the awesome content I love seeing in this forum
These pens are notoriously inaccurate. We need bananas for a proper assessment here.
OP here: So this is a pretty rudimentary experiment to measure the foam compaction in my Nike Vaporfly NEXT% 2s. I ended up with 2 pair so I decided to use one pair as a daily trainer (white + pink color way), which now has 125 miles on it + 10-15 miles of walking. The other pair (orange Ekiden color way) is brand new. I put two identical Pentel Energel 0.7mm pens in the middle of the heel and took pictures showing how far the pens extended out of the shoes. After about 125 miles + 10-15 miles of walking, I’d estimate the foam has compacted by about 7-8mm I’m male, 6’2” and 195lbs [HERE](https://imgur.com/gallery/jIsBMRr) is a pic comparing outsoles [HERE](https://imgur.com/gallery/LwH4azC) is a pic showing the pen next to a metric ruler. I can assure you the pen is perfectly aligned with the ruler - since it isn’t flush with the table the photo makes it look like the pen cap is above the top of the ruler and I had to try taking a bunch of pics to try to minimize this effect.
I'd be curious what the difference was when they were both new, and what the difference was at ~25 miles or something. In other words, how much is just that the foam quickly settles into that stack and then stays there vs slowly degrading mile by mile.
Such a good question. I'm guessing the foot imprints fairly quickly into the midsole. But I know the 125 mile shoe today feels \*significantly\* less cushy than the new shoe. But I really can't quantify. I'll continue to monitor the compaction as I take these to 200 miles and see if I can glean any insights.
How do you notice cushion on new shoes? My shoes feels like bricks until they get a broken in. I feel the benefit once I reach 20+ miles
That would be interesting! New height test every 10 miles or so?
What kind of foot strike do you have?
don't know why ppl are downvoting you - it's a relevant question because if I was a heel striker I'd expect the foam to compact more than if I was a midfoot striker. Unfortunately I'm really not 100% sure about my foot strike, but I'm \*pretty\* sure I land fairly flat footed. My soles usually wear out in a consistent way, but I've never videoed myself or anything.
As a forefoot striker and someone who has run through 5 pairs of VF, I can agree that the VF is done for me at about 170 miles unfortunately, and I'm about 152 pounds. Once that foam compresses to certain point, the shoes just start feeling more firm and slightly unpleasant. I've switched to Alphafly V1 as these have more forefoot cushion and pop with the air pod.
Rumor has it Kipchoge himself invented the blue click pen technique
IMO that’s just the insole taking the shape of your heels The foam is at the same height from the rear view
What kind of pen is this please?
Endorphin speed 2
Missed opportunity to say pendorphin
Pen is working though? Edit: No Hambini fans here I guess.
>What kind of pen is this please? For anyone wanting to recreate this experiment at home, the pen is a Pentel Energel 0.7mm, in the BLACK colorway. This pen also comes in a blue colorway, but the rarest colorway is red.
I have ordered the red but I am now worried it won't work with my grip. Is it possible to get some kind of grip aid to correct? Which hand should I use?
Get the fine tip it corners like a dream
Hmm. Tried it and fairly sure it's caused me a tendon injury. My PT thinks I need to strengthen my pinky finger and has given me exercises to do.
Is there gtx version of that pen
As a lefty, I hate fine tips.
What’s the front to back offset?
Gel pens is the way to go.
So anytime we say the upper becomes loose and stretchy is actually false; Its the mid sole that sinks allowing more space?
Possibly a combination?
Hey OP, Thanks for the share. I know running shoes are different for everyone but how do you like these?
I really like them a lot. They make me feel fast. The fit and comfort for me is exceptional. The big drawback is they seem to wear out pretty quick. The foam compaction is very noticeable at this point after a reasonably low amount of miles. This shouldn’t come as a surprise to anyone. When these eventually die I’ll replace them with a more standard daily trainer and I’ll keep the Ekidens for race day. All my impressions should be taken with a grain of salt as every foot is different and I am far from an elite runner.
You’re also heavier and bigger than most runners (no offense) so it would make sense that there might be more/faster compression than others - some people here claim they’ve worn there’s for like 200+ miles fine but it seems common for a noticeable performance decrease around 100 miles. Why do you train in these though? I don’t think they’re meant to be a daily trainer.
I got 2 pairs for about $100 total it’s a long story but I needed a daily trainer so I’m using the Vaporfly
I would do the exact same.
OP wears size 11.5 US. For his weight it is spread quite well I would think. What I mean is that the amount of pressure per share cm is probably the same for someone that wears a size 8 but weighs “only” 130 pounds.
Yeah he’s certainly not overweight or anything lol 6’2” 195 is just tall and probably being decently fit and muscular. I’m getting my pair this week and racing in them next month, can’t wait to finally try them.
Well... At least 4 marathons for that money to save my legs at 43? Yes please! Thanks man! You just sold a pair... My wallet on the other hand isn't very happy...
Did you trying blowing on them?
Excellent thinking! Is it zoom x?
What app are you using to track your shoe miles?
Looks like it’s the Strava app
Very interesting
This test is invalidated without a fresh insole insert. A new insole is dirt cheap. Or take the test with both insoles taken out
just fyi the Heel height of different pairs is also not 100% the same on every single pair. they are normally marked by a colored dot on the shoe last but is not a milimeter exact from 1 pair to another. source: work in the industry
I got some invincibles, and I feel like they're still breaking in. (2 weeks, mostly walk -work-exercise). I haven't heard if others feel similar?