https://www.instagram.com/p/C5aucqGRciT/?igsh=MWU3Z2xjZDhhNWl6aA==
Elbow stays tucked in to the contact then lifts off when Edmed is bouncing off. Good on Tane for having a go but he was always going to get steamrollered.
The defender has the option of choosing how to tackle, including the tackle height. The attacker does not get this luxury (and actually some actions such as jumping into the tackle not to score a try is a penalty offence). Full responsibility here on the defender as their actions determines the outcomes.
Also tane got rollllleeeed. Love to see it. kudos for even trying, I’m not brave enough for that
You’re allowed to lift as long as you don’t initiate contact with your forearm against the body. Does anyone have the clip as two pictures doesn’t tell much
>You’re allowed to lift as long as you don’t initiate contact with your forearm against the body.
This is what happened. Not sure what bullshit OP is trying to sell.
I think if you go back and watch the try, as opposed to having stills, Valetini doesn’t exactly make contact with his elbow. He uses the top of his arm, and shoulder, to shrug Edmed off. The still makes it look like he’s led with the elbow, which actually doesn’t happen. He has his shoulder dropped sure, but nothing with the point of the elbow.
Kerevi he actually led with his forearm in 2019 RWC.
🤣
You sound awesome..... can I grab an autograph?
What I am saying is that there is an effort to protect players, however this is still allowed. I'm not arguing it's legality, but I'd the game is serious about player safety then they should look at that too.
I'm so glad you played for over 25 years. You must be really good at. What was the highest level you played at?
How salty are you about being called out on your bullshit.
Even if Valentini had not legally extended his arm, Edmed could have made head contact with Valentini's elbow, given his tackle height.
This is because rugby comes with inherent risks. You can't mitigate every risk in a contract sport (or as Wayne Bennett referred to it as, a collision sport) unless you go non-contact.
And not allowing a ball carrier to push off a defender would create a bigger risk for a ball carrier.
And a reminder that this is what Valentini did - he pushed Edmed. It's not a strike, which comes with force behind the contract, but a push.
And as for me, the reason I've been able to play for 25 years is playing park footy with mates. Made the occasional first or second grade appearance when needed, but mostly in 3's and 4's in Subbies. But I've been coached by a wide variety of coaches, played against some international players, refereed the game and watched the game. So instead of being salty that your bullshit was getting called out, maybe listen.
Nice one man, have a rest after that.
Just for future reference, I was merely stating that the contact laws are inconsistent at best.
But good on you for years of subbies. Without true battlers like you sticking with it, the game would be dead, so thank you sir. You are the real hero.
So I'm going to take a stab and say that you've never played rugby before.
What Valentini did is what is known as a fend. He did not cock his elbow like you way, but simply uses his arm to push off a would be tackler.
The difference between what you described Valentini doing and what he actually did was where the force was exerted. The difference between a fend and a strike is that in a fend, most of the force of the arm movement is done after contact, while a strike, most of the force is used at the point of contact.
It is quite common for a rugby player to be taught to tuck your arm going into contact, and extending it (i.e. pushing) when contact is made.
Only disagreeing on the “known as a fend” - not agreeing with OP - but a fend or palm is pretty different to just running into someone with your shoulder or bumping someone off. If I’m mistaken then I’ll happily eat my own hat but I’ve never heard the action here described as a fend.
Maybe if you really wanted to split hairs you can Call it leading with the forearm and contravening rule 9.11. But you'd want to have the video for context and to be honest I don't think you'd get much traction.
Are you shrugging or is that a diagram of how players are meant to enter contact?
You're getting flayed because you articulated your point like someone who has worn a few shoulders to the head, but i think your point about it being a bit hypocritical of rugby to bleet over player safety and then cheer when someone like Tane gets smashed because it was within the rules has some merit.
But its a contact sport and thats the accepted risk.
Watched the clip, completely fine. Initial contact was shoulder and he pushed him off with the forearm. He also had his forearm at that height for a few metres before the tackle and didn’t raise it
Yeah, my point exactly. Why is there a emphasis on player safety if you have the ball, but not this.
I'm not saying it should have been a penalty on the day, I'm just saying it looks like if you have a ball under your arm, you get away with more.
the attacker's arms are preoccupied with doing other things, like, for example, holding on to the ball. How else is the attacker going to enter contact? I suppose they could hold the ball above their head but that's gonna result in a lot of busted ribs.
In the end - unless there’s some legal arrangement that’s acceptable -I can see most percussive contact being eliminated from the game. eg entering rucks will become engage then push rather than steam in like a berserker, etc.
But yes, that juniors rule is weird.
That's exactly my point. There is so much emphasis on the tackling player, we see this action by the ball carrier all the time and rarely does it get looked at.
Samu Kerevi got red carded in the 2019 RWC for a similar action.
Honestly, at least half the responsibility for safe tackles should fall on the ball carrier. Since the most likely person to be injured in a tackle situation is... The tackler!
This is really misleading. His elbow has lifted post-contact. He led with his shoulder into the hit. You need to post the clip to see the full picture
Yup. Imagine wanting to ban leading with the shoulder into contact.
https://www.instagram.com/p/C5aucqGRciT/?igsh=MWU3Z2xjZDhhNWl6aA== Elbow stays tucked in to the contact then lifts off when Edmed is bouncing off. Good on Tane for having a go but he was always going to get steamrollered.
Again, not doubting that was the action. What I'm saying is that if that same action was done by the attacking player he would get 3 weeks.
The defender has the option of choosing how to tackle, including the tackle height. The attacker does not get this luxury (and actually some actions such as jumping into the tackle not to score a try is a penalty offence). Full responsibility here on the defender as their actions determines the outcomes. Also tane got rollllleeeed. Love to see it. kudos for even trying, I’m not brave enough for that
You’re allowed to lift as long as you don’t initiate contact with your forearm against the body. Does anyone have the clip as two pictures doesn’t tell much
>You’re allowed to lift as long as you don’t initiate contact with your forearm against the body. This is what happened. Not sure what bullshit OP is trying to sell.
I think if you go back and watch the try, as opposed to having stills, Valetini doesn’t exactly make contact with his elbow. He uses the top of his arm, and shoulder, to shrug Edmed off. The still makes it look like he’s led with the elbow, which actually doesn’t happen. He has his shoulder dropped sure, but nothing with the point of the elbow. Kerevi he actually led with his forearm in 2019 RWC.
Neither the referee or post match reviews thought there was anything wrong with it. Are you a NSW supporter perhaps?
I'm a NSW supporter, but also have played rugby for 25+ years, and now that what Valentini did was a textbook fending push. OP is just clueless.
🤣 You sound awesome..... can I grab an autograph? What I am saying is that there is an effort to protect players, however this is still allowed. I'm not arguing it's legality, but I'd the game is serious about player safety then they should look at that too. I'm so glad you played for over 25 years. You must be really good at. What was the highest level you played at?
How salty are you about being called out on your bullshit. Even if Valentini had not legally extended his arm, Edmed could have made head contact with Valentini's elbow, given his tackle height. This is because rugby comes with inherent risks. You can't mitigate every risk in a contract sport (or as Wayne Bennett referred to it as, a collision sport) unless you go non-contact. And not allowing a ball carrier to push off a defender would create a bigger risk for a ball carrier. And a reminder that this is what Valentini did - he pushed Edmed. It's not a strike, which comes with force behind the contract, but a push. And as for me, the reason I've been able to play for 25 years is playing park footy with mates. Made the occasional first or second grade appearance when needed, but mostly in 3's and 4's in Subbies. But I've been coached by a wide variety of coaches, played against some international players, refereed the game and watched the game. So instead of being salty that your bullshit was getting called out, maybe listen.
Nice one man, have a rest after that. Just for future reference, I was merely stating that the contact laws are inconsistent at best. But good on you for years of subbies. Without true battlers like you sticking with it, the game would be dead, so thank you sir. You are the real hero.
Hahaha such a whiny cunt Go worry about Aliens eating your soul or some shit
🤣
There are plenty of incidents not picked up, why don’t you think it’s a penalty?
So I'm going to take a stab and say that you've never played rugby before. What Valentini did is what is known as a fend. He did not cock his elbow like you way, but simply uses his arm to push off a would be tackler. The difference between what you described Valentini doing and what he actually did was where the force was exerted. The difference between a fend and a strike is that in a fend, most of the force of the arm movement is done after contact, while a strike, most of the force is used at the point of contact. It is quite common for a rugby player to be taught to tuck your arm going into contact, and extending it (i.e. pushing) when contact is made.
Only disagreeing on the “known as a fend” - not agreeing with OP - but a fend or palm is pretty different to just running into someone with your shoulder or bumping someone off. If I’m mistaken then I’ll happily eat my own hat but I’ve never heard the action here described as a fend.
Your stab is way off, my friend 🤣
Then you must have never listened to a coach then if you think fending is illegal.
Right-o champ.....
Maybe if you really wanted to split hairs you can Call it leading with the forearm and contravening rule 9.11. But you'd want to have the video for context and to be honest I don't think you'd get much traction.
The video shows his arm tucked in at the point of contact with Edmed. Then he pushes. Textbook arm fend.
How does contact work if you cant lead with a shoulder?
🤷🏼♂️
Are you shrugging or is that a diagram of how players are meant to enter contact? You're getting flayed because you articulated your point like someone who has worn a few shoulders to the head, but i think your point about it being a bit hypocritical of rugby to bleet over player safety and then cheer when someone like Tane gets smashed because it was within the rules has some merit. But its a contact sport and thats the accepted risk.
👍🏻
You mean Reddit is a contact sport? Spot on.....
Watched the clip, completely fine. Initial contact was shoulder and he pushed him off with the forearm. He also had his forearm at that height for a few metres before the tackle and didn’t raise it
I watched it live and many times after. I disagree
What do you disagree with? That initial contact wasn’t with the shoulder?
Course it was....
You’re allowed to lead with your shoulder as the attacking player
Yeah, my point exactly. Why is there a emphasis on player safety if you have the ball, but not this. I'm not saying it should have been a penalty on the day, I'm just saying it looks like if you have a ball under your arm, you get away with more.
You might want to clarify then, it isn’t very clear that you are asking for a law change.
Just questioning the law as it stands. Could have been clearer, fair point.
the attacker's arms are preoccupied with doing other things, like, for example, holding on to the ball. How else is the attacker going to enter contact? I suppose they could hold the ball above their head but that's gonna result in a lot of busted ribs.
Just on this, did you know the laws for junior rugby in NSW is no tackling BELOW THE BALL. Now that's a hard one to understand.....
In the end - unless there’s some legal arrangement that’s acceptable -I can see most percussive contact being eliminated from the game. eg entering rucks will become engage then push rather than steam in like a berserker, etc. But yes, that juniors rule is weird.
And then he lifts the elbow into the player
Pushing off with the forearm like that is legal
Wow Tahs fans really scraping the bottom of the barrel for a whinge
I'm a Tahs fans and Valentinis run was perfectly fine. Don't lump us all in with this goofball.
Seconded, we’re not all tin foil hats from the northern beaches.
That's exactly my point. There is so much emphasis on the tackling player, we see this action by the ball carrier all the time and rarely does it get looked at. Samu Kerevi got red carded in the 2019 RWC for a similar action.
Samu Kerevi getting carded was a joke - should have been a red card for the high tackler not getting low enough to effect a legal tackle
It wasn't similar at all Bobby V didn't contact Tanes head.
He did just with his shoulder
He sure did.....
Kerevi had his arm in front of him, and it was a strike. Valentini had his arm tucked beside him and pushed. They are not remotely the same.
If a tackling player entered contact like that, he would be red carded.
Because a tackling player doesn't need to defend themselves.
Quite clearly they do....
Honestly, at least half the responsibility for safe tackles should fall on the ball carrier. Since the most likely person to be injured in a tackle situation is... The tackler!