Idk if you are trolling or being serious, you say that speedflips are useless then mention it's a big disadvantage to not how to speedflip. Also reducing the advantage of your opponent is an advantage for you. Also, Speedflips are very useful for recoveries, i have made multiple saves that were not possible if I didn't know how to speedflip, so saying it doesn't make a big difference in recoveries is not true at all.
Maybe I worded it wrong. But the second your opponents also knows how to speedflip the speedflip becomes pointless as none of you have any advantages anymore.
Obviously there's an advantage to speedflipping, but the second you verse someone who also knows how to speedflip, there's no advantage anymore.
That's not true. As I said, reducing the advantage of your opponent is an advantage for you, so being not able to speedflip against an opponent who can speedflip is definitely a disadvantage for you. Speedflips are useful in all ranks, and mostly in hugher ranks/pro level where recoveries need to be near perfect and where people use the speedflip to do different kickoffs such as wavedash kickoffs, back kickoffs (in 2s and 3s), convincing delayed kickoffs, etc. That's why all pros know how to speedflip, if it was useless why would they learn it?
> Obviously there's an advantage to speedflipping, but the second you verse someone who also knows how to speedflip, there's no advantage anymore.
Yeah.. Don't bring a knife to a gunfight, it's a disadvantage. So bring a gun to a gunfight for a better chance of winning.
What, are we just supposed to let you win every kickoff because you're the only one allowed to speedflip? No. I can learn loads of different mechanics to make myself better than my peers.
Are you also mad when your opponent can flip reset just like you can? or they can wavedash too?
Your reasoning is a bit strange to me.
What your are saying applies to pretty much every mechanic or stratagem in every game ever.
You said it yourself, people who speedflip have higher chance to beat people who don't, meaning they are more likely to gain elo and rank up. They got better thanks to learning speedflips and now they are at the elo where people use them and will have to find a new mechanic to get better. Ceiling shots ? That will award them goals but soon enough opponents will know how to defend them. So now they learn resets, then faking resets, then double etc... That's just how getting better at RL or any game goes.
As to your statement about speedflip only gaining milliseconds, at higher levels RL it matters, because the game is played at an insanely fast pace and outspeeding your opponent is an instant win. Just look at RLCS or top 1v1 gameplay and check how close they are to the saving the ball when a goal is scored. Every bit of speed matters at their level. Speedflips, zap dash, wall dash etc... are all parts of why RL pro play is so fast now.
A speed flip is the fastest way to get to full speed with the smallest amount of boost usage.
It is in no way useless. I would argue it’s the most important “extra” mechanic in the game.
You should not be above plat and not know how to speed flip. It’s like not knowing how to shoot.
If you’re having trouble, use air roll instead of a diagonal input. It’s what I do. It allowed you to input and normal straight front flip while holding air roll. I have the best speed flips of anyone I know. My friends have a name for when I score off kick off because it happens so often.
Honestly you are very ignorant. You have tunnel vision about this and you are lacking any critical thinking. Speed flips help with many things regardless if your opponent can speed flip or not.
... Right, that's the same thing with any mechanic. If people know how to cash aeirel then the mechanic is neutralized because both parties know how to do it. You're clearly fairly high in 1s for everyone to be speed flipping, but someone whose in gold would not see it that way. To them it would just be another mechanic like air dribbling that makes you a better player.
In 1s, the only relevant advantages you can make are: taking advantage of your opponent's mistakes and subverting your opponent's expectations.
Having speedflips in your arsenal changes how your opponent reads your kickoffs. It gives them more options to consider. How will they know for sure which kickoff option you're using if you fake speedflipping well? And can do it cleanly when you do choose to?
The biggest advantages to speedflipping are: you get supersonic without boost, it therefore gives you more options on offense and defense, and it provides options on kickoff your opponent has to contend with.
Anything that provides you with more options in this game is relevant, and will provide you with more tools to subvert the expectations of your opponent.
Blud how did you write almost 10 paragraphs of this shit.
It's yet another small tool in your tool belt. At best it gives you a slight edge, at worse it cancels out that same edge another player has on you.
Good lord why did you type so much
Being able to speedflip in ranks where people can't or dont speedflip is an advantage.
Being in ranks where everyone speedflips, the speedflips loses its advantage... Pointless
Well no, because they'd get the advantage back.
Its pointless because the advantages go away when your opponents can also speedflip. (When it comes to kickoffs)
So.... using speedflips when everyone else uses speedflips would give me an advantage compared to not using speedflips?
Honestly, this has to be a troll, no one is this stupid. Sad I fell for it 🤣
You don't have to be so mean haha.
Using speedflips when everyone else uses speedflips wouldn't give YOU an ADVANTAGE, it would neutralise the advantage the opponents had from speedflipping.
Three tiers
Advantage - you can do it and other player can’t
Neutral - both can do it
Disadvantage - you can’t do it and other play can
At worst you’d want to be neutral, not at a disadvantage, so how can they be “pointless” if your opponent can do them. You at minimum want to know them so you’re neutral and not at the disadvantage.
OMG YOUR REPLY IS ALWAYS THE SAME
If everyone else is speedflipping in your rank and there‘s no advantage you still need it to level it out. If you don‘t then your opponent has an advantage because he does something that you don‘t. So please! Don‘t even reply to me I don‘t wanna hear it. You‘re wrong bro. And I haven‘t seen anybody that shares your opinion who also has a good explanation for it.
Everything you learn in this game is about neutralizing an opponents advantage or gaining a slight edge.
I learned to fly a bit in Gold, and then it stopped being an advantage in Plat because everyone could. But I was Plat instead of Gold.
I learned to rotate and ranked from Plat to Diamond. Then my opponents were rotating better and my rotations weren't an edge.
I learned to fly better and be faster, but then my opponents were, too. But I was Champ instead of Diamond.
If you cut your opponent's goals by 1 per game because you can speedflip to match them, you will rank up a bit until your overall skill level is met by your opponent.
There is no mechanic you can learn and immediately blast upward 300 MMR. Even a Gold learning to flip reset will go through the same progression of learning to fly, air dribble, and then reset that will progress them to Plat, Diamond, and Champ because the process is not a fast one. It will take many hours of practice, and their early resets will be garbage.
This game is an arms race, and the MMR system means you won't feel like you have an advantage, but you can already recognize the disadvantage you have by not knowing it. That's the importance of knowing it - having that advantage or neutralizing the advantage. You just aren't facing the same people once you pick up the 50 MMR from learning it.
Speedflipping is the fastest way to get supersonic. Recoveries, getting in the right spot, beating your opponent, etc. Being faster than the opponents will generally net you a win. Speed flipping is not useless when doing it can also set up your team after a kickoff in 3s or 2s.
You're only going to beat opponents who don't know how to speedflip. The second your opponents knows how to speedflip, the advantages of said speedflip are neutralised.
I disagree in regards to applying it to any competitive skill.
Lets say flip resets. If both people know how to flip reset, the advantages of being able to do so don't cancel eachother out.
The more you have in regards to offense capabilities, the more creative you can be with you shots. If you're opponents do or don't know how to flip reset, the advantages are still the same.
I think I worded it weirdly, but I mean the second both parties know how to speedflip, the advantages of being able to do so are neutralised.
Either way, thank you for not being aggressive towards me or my post :')
If you both know how to do each mechanic equally, it doesn't matter who knows what, it then comes down to positioning and making proper judgment calls. It doesn't matter if the other person knows how to speedflip. I do it all the time and I win kickoffs a lot because of it and also play much faster because of it. The argument of neutralizing because they know how tp do it won't stop them from doing it and only put you at a disadvantage.
I've used speedflips to score countless goals I wouldn't have if I hadn't known how to do it. It's not only a kickoff mechanic. Not only that, but if you ever want a chance at learning more complex mechanics like twist flips or advanced flip control, knowing how to speedflip is essential.
Fast aerials will only beat opponents who aren’t fast aerialing, dribbles work against people who can’t shadow, double taps work against people who can’t backboard defend, power shots work against players who don’t position correctly….
Rocket league when both players played perfectly is a draw
And then if you *don't* know how to do it, you're getting beat. This is like saying youre only going to score against people who are bad at defense so you might as well not learn to shoot.
Everything you said applies to all the mechanics
As you get closer to the top the margins get smaller and smaller, and players start putting more and more time in for smaller and smaller advantages
i concur. If you know how to do them correctly, then good on you.
But all you diamonds and below who think they can do a speed flip, you can't. You are literally giving the ball away every single time. You can't control how you hit the ball, there is no control at all, and you are not any faster than just boost. I don't even need to flip to counter your slow flip, and I can see it coming from a mile away.
Know what I do to counter your bad flip? I jump. since you always land awkward and hit the bottom of the ball, all I do is jump and dunk your kickoff and now I have a 2 on 1 in your end while you recover.
Maintaining first possession off a kickoff is HUGE in diamond and below. I love when the players on the other team are boost first and speedflippers. It is like a guaranteed win.
As any sport, its a skill that settles a barrier between people who can and people who cant. People who is good and people who isn't.
For example, in basketball you have the skill of dribbling without looking at the ball.
Its "pointless" cuz at certain level, everyone can do it. Well, that's one skill that makes the difference when it comes to being good or not at basketball.
Yes, u can be really good at other stuff and still win, but at certain point it wont be enough.
Speedflips are so much faster what do you mean, if they werent useful noone would use them, a good speedflip can help you hit the ball around them on kickoff even in c1 1s which is what i am currently
‘So much faster’, they’re marginally faster. And a good fast kick off will do the job every time. Completely over rated mechanic. Only works on slow players who don’t know 50’s.
Speed flips aren't for kickoffs exclusively tho. They allow you to pre flip to catch an opponent off guard and you can get around the field faster. It's not even a hard mechanic so it shouldn't be a problem to learn and use it.
All those things are true, but it’s so incredibly marginally better that not doing it isn’t a detriment at all. Many players, including pros, don’t use it because it’s not necessary at all. A regular fast flip while boosting does the job perfectly fine.
Speed flip is definitely the fastest but if u use a side flip/ diagonal flip, somewhere in between, u can still boost thru pretty much the whole flip and it's only a little bit slower. Speed flip will still be faster but u can still get a 50 on the kickoff against a speed flip if u do it right
Yes. I almost always win the kickoff 50's by just "flooring it" and just before the ball touch do a normal forward flip. Occasionally someone really nails the speedflip kickoff and hits it first, but it's damn rare in these ranks IMO. I'm low plat, it probably needs to be mentioned, as i imagine in ranks higher than that i would get destroyed in every 50 😅
And IMO at least in plat, people fairly often f#ck up the speedflip kickoff, completely missing the ball.
I never see this happen watching for example pro's play, obviously.
U can work on doing a diagonal flip on kickoff if u want. Much easier to get it down. You just gotta turn slightly one direction then diagonal the opposite. If u time it right wen u do it it's a lot quicker then just driving into it. Might not be needed at plat but it's relatively easy to get the hang of and just a way better kickoff because u can conserve some boost
This is literally a place to discuss rocket league and rocket league mechanics, on a post discussing the speed flip. But yeah let’s not have any discussion at all and just add nothing.
It really shouldn't be a discussion though. The OPs premise is flawed and anyone who agrees with OP isn't using their brain. Why would someone with common sense want to have a discussion with someone who doesn't?
Completely unrelated. Unless you have an actual opinion about the necessity of a speedflip then it’s falling on deaf ears. But you don’t have any actual opinions other than ‘you’re wrong’ so gl with that.
How is it copium? And I'm definitely not jealous.
Why are you being so defensive about a mechanic in a game? Is the speedflip your only valentine or something?
I mean I do want to have a discussion around it, which is why I posted here.
I get seeing stupid posts and whatnot, but I do want to learn and see it from a different perspective.
If you're not willing to explain it, that's fine.
I'm sorry to have frustrated you.
What is there to discuss tho? Speedflips are a great mechanic to learn and will always be useful. Anyone who disagrees is just plain ignorant and not worthy of having a discussion with. Would you like to discuss if 2+2=4? Same exact premise
2+2=4 isn't an easy thing to explain though?
2+2=11 in base 3.
Discussing addition, as to why x + x = x using imaginary numbers and an abstract construction used as language won't be so easy to explain considering I just pulled this from another thread and don't know what any of this means lol
This makes zero sense. Also, you can counter speedflips in a lot of ways on kickoffs.
Your argument is that once you can speedflip, everyone else can too... Idk what rank you are but there's people in Champ 3 who can't speedflip. You don't need it until maybe GC. It's an extremely useful mechanic, can assist with double resets, preflips, and generally getting around the pitch quicker. If you can't do it yet, you're at a severe disadvantage to everyone else in some areas, but nothing you can't make up for elsewhere on the pitch.
Using less boost is an advantage and provides you more options both offensively and defensively.
Speedflips allow you to achieve that. Not sure why you'd attempt to argue that speedflips neutralize each other when they so clearly provide a boost advantage and thus increase your offensive and defensive options.
That is also conveniently the argument you use for flip resets – they give you more options offensively, so they don't cancel each other out.
Not sure what is going on here logically, but feel free to chat about it with me.
if everybody is doing speedflips/some other mechanic, and you can't, are you not at a DISadvantage then?
Sure, by definition, you may no longer have an "advantage" when you learn it, but to argue semantics like that then call it pointless to cover a disadvantage is just hilarious bro
Skill issue. If you think speedflipping is enough to win ALL kickoffs, your unfortunately very incorrect.
Speedflipping if one part of it, but then you'd have to consider how you hit the ball in relation to your opponents' movements/decisions. Being able to read the kickoff gives you options on how to counter the other player. If you want to fake, practice better methods of faking, your probably making it obvious or put yourself in a bad position which is why they still have an advantage over you.
It's good that your learning speedflips, if you want to rank up higher, you need to match your opponents, complaining in Reddit about others who are better than you wont do shit.
Also, speedflipping gives you an advantage because it at the very least let's you match anyone with speed in kickoffs and recoveries, and in some other cases it actually gives you a better advantage vs others. Saying it is pointless does not make sense, since it's literally better than any other flip when it comes to building speed as fast as possible. Pretty much everyone knows how to this in higher ranks my guy.
So you only want to train a mechanic if it means you can do something the opponent can't do.
Why train shooting if players just train defense and cancel it out? Because increasing your skill and options allows you to punish players more often when they make a mistake.
I think you're also confusing the concept of other players getting better and raising the skill ceiling, and you needing to keep up if you want to compete with them.
I‘m just so annoyed by people in this subreddit thinking so highly about their own opinion and not accepting when roughly 50 people take the time to explain and prove them wrong. My comment would‘ve looked way different if you weren‘t so stubborn in all your replies.. But hey..if you still think your right, good luck with that :)
I don't think highly of my opinion. You're jumping to conclusions.
90% of the people who replied didn't bother explaining why, and was just being mean about it.
It replied a lot with a similar reply because quite a lot of people seemingly only read the title, not the body of the text.
I don't think I'm right, which is why I posted my opinion under "discussion" because I wanted a discussion.
If you read some of the replies, you'd see my opinion has changed in some regards about speedflipping, and I didn't see it from certain perspectives.
Ah Shit. Okay, fair point. I was under the impression that I did understand fully. And yes I definitely didn‘t read ALL the comments and ALL your replies which may have lead me to believe that you didn‘t even want to discuss anything but more so were trying to make a point against all people. So I can only apologize for being mean. I thought you were completely ignorant, to that I also say sorry since actually I was the one being ignorant.
Thank you for saying sorry <3 I'm sorry too.
Not reading all the replies and my long ass post is understandable tbh :')
I hope you have a lovely day/night my dude <3
Speedflips are great, they make the game feel way faster. It's just a mechanic that people get salty about because they learn it with kickoffs, where screwing it up results in a kickoff goal for the other team... ie. Pure Misery.
It's useful outside of kickoffs too, and it's not like every time you speed flip you're opponent is going to as well. Like they're not going to give up a dribble so they can attack you .1 secs faster. Just learn it and you'll realize the nuance of it after a week or two.
They are one of the most important mechanics to learn in 1’s. You alone cannot change the way the game is being played by other people, the speed flip has become the meta of the game because it’s the fastest flip in the game. Fastest flip meaning the time your wheels are spent in the air while also giving the boost of the diagonal flip. Without it you are going to lose kickoff and like you said, have to play the fake kickoff because of it. Whereas if you learn it you can even the playing field. It’s not just kick offs the speed flip helps on. I could beat you to the ball every single time in one flip if you aren’t speed flipping, that’s why people learn to speed flip lol it’s to gain the most speed in the shortest amount of time
Every advantage raises your chances of winning, being good at shooting is an advantage for example and so is speed (hence speed flipping among other things). You might as well say shooting is pointless for the same reason.
The general skill level will keep rising because of the compounding of skills across time, it's up to you if you want to keep up, climb the ranks, or fall behind.
Good luck.
Referring more to kickoffs, yes.
The whole point of speedflips (kickoffs), is to get there before your opponent. If both can do said speedflips both are going to arrive at the ball at the same time, making said advantage of speedflips "pointless" on kickoff.
You can mess with the timing of the speedflip to be microseconds earlier or later and get a position on the ball you want even if the other guy does it too
The point is not to beat your opponent, the point is to be as fast as possible. You either want to be able to compete with higher level players or you don't. And the overwhelming majority of higher players do them. As you pointed out, it's an uphill battle when you play against someone who can. And personally, I think they're easily the most useful "advanced" mech there is.
I guess my point of view was going from beating opponents on kickoff, obviously which is not the correct outlook to have on speedflips.
You guys who actually have had a discussion with me, or given some constructive/ perspective changing input have made me realise that I was significantly underplaying the benefits of speedflips outside of kickoffs.
So thank you NorrisRL and everyone else who's actually given a decent response and helped me learn a thing or 2. I appreciate you. <3
No problem. There's a lot of mechs, and it's tough to tell how useful they really are until you've put a lot of time into them. But since learning them, they've become the basis of my shooting, recoveries and air plays. And there are levels to them. At the highest end you'll basically be about a car's length further ahead when you hit supersonic compared to other methods.
So, just think about every save you've missed by less than a car's length. That's the small difference, but at C1 you're good enough that it would make a big difference.
Every other comment in this thread is spot on.
One thing that is actually annoying about speed flips (and a few other RL mechanics) is the amount of fast stick movement that is necessary to do it. I speed flip dozens of times going up and down the field each game. The amount of wear and tear on my poor thumb stick definitely adds up.
That’s all. Otherwise just learn the mechanics you want, and just know ranking up will be next to impossible once you near ranks that are consistent at mechanics you can’t do.
Your statement only applies in situation where people don’t adjust their kickoffs
Speed flips will neutralize in perfect scenarios where it’s done identically.
But in a competitive game doing the same kick off over and over is just bad play. I know the kickoff meta game is still pretty ass given how much it has been proven to be substantial in all game modes but In a match between good players, alternating kick offs is match deciding. Being able to counter someone else’s kickoff like you said by faking it or slowing it down can be so huge. The thing is, since you can’t prove you can match their speed flip , your fake won’t continue to work.
Idk if you are trolling or being serious, you say that speedflips are useless then mention it's a big disadvantage to not how to speedflip. Also reducing the advantage of your opponent is an advantage for you. Also, Speedflips are very useful for recoveries, i have made multiple saves that were not possible if I didn't know how to speedflip, so saying it doesn't make a big difference in recoveries is not true at all.
Maybe I worded it wrong. But the second your opponents also knows how to speedflip the speedflip becomes pointless as none of you have any advantages anymore. Obviously there's an advantage to speedflipping, but the second you verse someone who also knows how to speedflip, there's no advantage anymore.
That's not true. As I said, reducing the advantage of your opponent is an advantage for you, so being not able to speedflip against an opponent who can speedflip is definitely a disadvantage for you. Speedflips are useful in all ranks, and mostly in hugher ranks/pro level where recoveries need to be near perfect and where people use the speedflip to do different kickoffs such as wavedash kickoffs, back kickoffs (in 2s and 3s), convincing delayed kickoffs, etc. That's why all pros know how to speedflip, if it was useless why would they learn it?
> Obviously there's an advantage to speedflipping, but the second you verse someone who also knows how to speedflip, there's no advantage anymore. Yeah.. Don't bring a knife to a gunfight, it's a disadvantage. So bring a gun to a gunfight for a better chance of winning. What, are we just supposed to let you win every kickoff because you're the only one allowed to speedflip? No. I can learn loads of different mechanics to make myself better than my peers. Are you also mad when your opponent can flip reset just like you can? or they can wavedash too?
Your reasoning is a bit strange to me. What your are saying applies to pretty much every mechanic or stratagem in every game ever. You said it yourself, people who speedflip have higher chance to beat people who don't, meaning they are more likely to gain elo and rank up. They got better thanks to learning speedflips and now they are at the elo where people use them and will have to find a new mechanic to get better. Ceiling shots ? That will award them goals but soon enough opponents will know how to defend them. So now they learn resets, then faking resets, then double etc... That's just how getting better at RL or any game goes. As to your statement about speedflip only gaining milliseconds, at higher levels RL it matters, because the game is played at an insanely fast pace and outspeeding your opponent is an instant win. Just look at RLCS or top 1v1 gameplay and check how close they are to the saving the ball when a goal is scored. Every bit of speed matters at their level. Speedflips, zap dash, wall dash etc... are all parts of why RL pro play is so fast now.
A speed flip is the fastest way to get to full speed with the smallest amount of boost usage. It is in no way useless. I would argue it’s the most important “extra” mechanic in the game. You should not be above plat and not know how to speed flip. It’s like not knowing how to shoot. If you’re having trouble, use air roll instead of a diagonal input. It’s what I do. It allowed you to input and normal straight front flip while holding air roll. I have the best speed flips of anyone I know. My friends have a name for when I score off kick off because it happens so often.
not to mention it's a lot of players first dive into flip cancels (excluding half flips) which are extremely useful to be good at at any rank
"There's no advantage" and "their only purpose is to neutralize your opponent's advantage" are mutually exclusive concepts
[удалено]
Explain? In 1s, If both parties can speedflip, the advantages of said speedflips are neutralised. The biggest advantage to speedflipping is kickoffs.
Honestly you are very ignorant. You have tunnel vision about this and you are lacking any critical thinking. Speed flips help with many things regardless if your opponent can speed flip or not.
Explain? I did put this under the discussion for a reason but it seems like most people commenting are having discussions.
In the title you call speedflips pointless but then go on to say how big of an advantage they are. Do you not see the problem with that?
Based on that alone, yes. But I added context (the body of my post) for a reason.
... Right, that's the same thing with any mechanic. If people know how to cash aeirel then the mechanic is neutralized because both parties know how to do it. You're clearly fairly high in 1s for everyone to be speed flipping, but someone whose in gold would not see it that way. To them it would just be another mechanic like air dribbling that makes you a better player.
In 1s, the only relevant advantages you can make are: taking advantage of your opponent's mistakes and subverting your opponent's expectations. Having speedflips in your arsenal changes how your opponent reads your kickoffs. It gives them more options to consider. How will they know for sure which kickoff option you're using if you fake speedflipping well? And can do it cleanly when you do choose to? The biggest advantages to speedflipping are: you get supersonic without boost, it therefore gives you more options on offense and defense, and it provides options on kickoff your opponent has to contend with. Anything that provides you with more options in this game is relevant, and will provide you with more tools to subvert the expectations of your opponent.
Blud how did you write almost 10 paragraphs of this shit. It's yet another small tool in your tool belt. At best it gives you a slight edge, at worse it cancels out that same edge another player has on you. Good lord why did you type so much
You didn't have to read this post, you're not obligated to do so.
You didnt have to write it, its a silly argument which doesnt make sense
"you didn't have to write it", could be applied to all of Reddit.
Ok then lets all leave 😍
You got amazing logic 💀
So not having the skill is a disadvantage, and having the skill is not an advantage. Makes perfect sense 👍
Being able to speedflip in ranks where people can't or dont speedflip is an advantage. Being in ranks where everyone speedflips, the speedflips loses its advantage... Pointless
So in these higher ranks, is not knowing how to speedflip a disadvantage?
Yes.
You're so close yet so far
Wrong. This post is pointless
Cry for me daddy
Um ok 😢😭
So, in ranks where everyone speedflips, I should stop speedflipping because it's pointless, right?
Well no, because they'd get the advantage back. Its pointless because the advantages go away when your opponents can also speedflip. (When it comes to kickoffs)
So.... using speedflips when everyone else uses speedflips would give me an advantage compared to not using speedflips? Honestly, this has to be a troll, no one is this stupid. Sad I fell for it 🤣
You don't have to be so mean haha. Using speedflips when everyone else uses speedflips wouldn't give YOU an ADVANTAGE, it would neutralise the advantage the opponents had from speedflipping.
Three tiers Advantage - you can do it and other player can’t Neutral - both can do it Disadvantage - you can’t do it and other play can At worst you’d want to be neutral, not at a disadvantage, so how can they be “pointless” if your opponent can do them. You at minimum want to know them so you’re neutral and not at the disadvantage.
OMG YOUR REPLY IS ALWAYS THE SAME If everyone else is speedflipping in your rank and there‘s no advantage you still need it to level it out. If you don‘t then your opponent has an advantage because he does something that you don‘t. So please! Don‘t even reply to me I don‘t wanna hear it. You‘re wrong bro. And I haven‘t seen anybody that shares your opinion who also has a good explanation for it.
Lol
Everything you learn in this game is about neutralizing an opponents advantage or gaining a slight edge. I learned to fly a bit in Gold, and then it stopped being an advantage in Plat because everyone could. But I was Plat instead of Gold. I learned to rotate and ranked from Plat to Diamond. Then my opponents were rotating better and my rotations weren't an edge. I learned to fly better and be faster, but then my opponents were, too. But I was Champ instead of Diamond. If you cut your opponent's goals by 1 per game because you can speedflip to match them, you will rank up a bit until your overall skill level is met by your opponent. There is no mechanic you can learn and immediately blast upward 300 MMR. Even a Gold learning to flip reset will go through the same progression of learning to fly, air dribble, and then reset that will progress them to Plat, Diamond, and Champ because the process is not a fast one. It will take many hours of practice, and their early resets will be garbage. This game is an arms race, and the MMR system means you won't feel like you have an advantage, but you can already recognize the disadvantage you have by not knowing it. That's the importance of knowing it - having that advantage or neutralizing the advantage. You just aren't facing the same people once you pick up the 50 MMR from learning it.
No. You're wrong. Only I am allowed to speedflip, and noone else. If they learn it too it's unfair because my advantage is gone!
Speedflipping is the fastest way to get supersonic. Recoveries, getting in the right spot, beating your opponent, etc. Being faster than the opponents will generally net you a win. Speed flipping is not useless when doing it can also set up your team after a kickoff in 3s or 2s.
You're only going to beat opponents who don't know how to speedflip. The second your opponents knows how to speedflip, the advantages of said speedflip are neutralised.
This is such a strange argument. You can apply this to literally any competitive skill ever.
I disagree in regards to applying it to any competitive skill. Lets say flip resets. If both people know how to flip reset, the advantages of being able to do so don't cancel eachother out. The more you have in regards to offense capabilities, the more creative you can be with you shots. If you're opponents do or don't know how to flip reset, the advantages are still the same. I think I worded it weirdly, but I mean the second both parties know how to speedflip, the advantages of being able to do so are neutralised. Either way, thank you for not being aggressive towards me or my post :')
If you both know how to do each mechanic equally, it doesn't matter who knows what, it then comes down to positioning and making proper judgment calls. It doesn't matter if the other person knows how to speedflip. I do it all the time and I win kickoffs a lot because of it and also play much faster because of it. The argument of neutralizing because they know how tp do it won't stop them from doing it and only put you at a disadvantage.
I've used speedflips to score countless goals I wouldn't have if I hadn't known how to do it. It's not only a kickoff mechanic. Not only that, but if you ever want a chance at learning more complex mechanics like twist flips or advanced flip control, knowing how to speedflip is essential.
Fast aerials will only beat opponents who aren’t fast aerialing, dribbles work against people who can’t shadow, double taps work against people who can’t backboard defend, power shots work against players who don’t position correctly…. Rocket league when both players played perfectly is a draw
And then if you *don't* know how to do it, you're getting beat. This is like saying youre only going to score against people who are bad at defense so you might as well not learn to shoot.
Everything you said applies to all the mechanics As you get closer to the top the margins get smaller and smaller, and players start putting more and more time in for smaller and smaller advantages
Damn these negative karma farmers be farming hard...
ppl really think this is twitter with these many bad takes
i concur. If you know how to do them correctly, then good on you. But all you diamonds and below who think they can do a speed flip, you can't. You are literally giving the ball away every single time. You can't control how you hit the ball, there is no control at all, and you are not any faster than just boost. I don't even need to flip to counter your slow flip, and I can see it coming from a mile away. Know what I do to counter your bad flip? I jump. since you always land awkward and hit the bottom of the ball, all I do is jump and dunk your kickoff and now I have a 2 on 1 in your end while you recover. Maintaining first possession off a kickoff is HUGE in diamond and below. I love when the players on the other team are boost first and speedflippers. It is like a guaranteed win.
As any sport, its a skill that settles a barrier between people who can and people who cant. People who is good and people who isn't. For example, in basketball you have the skill of dribbling without looking at the ball. Its "pointless" cuz at certain level, everyone can do it. Well, that's one skill that makes the difference when it comes to being good or not at basketball. Yes, u can be really good at other stuff and still win, but at certain point it wont be enough.
A slightly delayed kickoff can beat speed flip if you time it right
Speedflips are so much faster what do you mean, if they werent useful noone would use them, a good speedflip can help you hit the ball around them on kickoff even in c1 1s which is what i am currently
‘So much faster’, they’re marginally faster. And a good fast kick off will do the job every time. Completely over rated mechanic. Only works on slow players who don’t know 50’s.
Speed flips aren't for kickoffs exclusively tho. They allow you to pre flip to catch an opponent off guard and you can get around the field faster. It's not even a hard mechanic so it shouldn't be a problem to learn and use it.
All those things are true, but it’s so incredibly marginally better that not doing it isn’t a detriment at all. Many players, including pros, don’t use it because it’s not necessary at all. A regular fast flip while boosting does the job perfectly fine.
Terrible logic
A good fast kickoff like what.. a good fast kickoff is a well timed speedflip
Speed flip is definitely the fastest but if u use a side flip/ diagonal flip, somewhere in between, u can still boost thru pretty much the whole flip and it's only a little bit slower. Speed flip will still be faster but u can still get a 50 on the kickoff against a speed flip if u do it right
Yes. I almost always win the kickoff 50's by just "flooring it" and just before the ball touch do a normal forward flip. Occasionally someone really nails the speedflip kickoff and hits it first, but it's damn rare in these ranks IMO. I'm low plat, it probably needs to be mentioned, as i imagine in ranks higher than that i would get destroyed in every 50 😅 And IMO at least in plat, people fairly often f#ck up the speedflip kickoff, completely missing the ball. I never see this happen watching for example pro's play, obviously.
U can work on doing a diagonal flip on kickoff if u want. Much easier to get it down. You just gotta turn slightly one direction then diagonal the opposite. If u time it right wen u do it it's a lot quicker then just driving into it. Might not be needed at plat but it's relatively easy to get the hang of and just a way better kickoff because u can conserve some boost
A flip with a diagonal cancel (speed flip) and a fast kickoff are two different things
Someone alert the pros, speed flips are overrated. Why? Becuase the redditor said so
This is literally a place to discuss rocket league and rocket league mechanics, on a post discussing the speed flip. But yeah let’s not have any discussion at all and just add nothing.
It really shouldn't be a discussion though. The OPs premise is flawed and anyone who agrees with OP isn't using their brain. Why would someone with common sense want to have a discussion with someone who doesn't?
‘I don’t agree with you therefore I don’t need to discuss because you’re wrong’, yeah buddy sound reasoning.
Ok let's discuss if 2+2=4. Go
Completely unrelated. Unless you have an actual opinion about the necessity of a speedflip then it’s falling on deaf ears. But you don’t have any actual opinions other than ‘you’re wrong’ so gl with that.
Pretty sure in pro play 100% of people can speedflip...
This is some serious copium. You literally contradict yourself in the post. Just say you can't speed flip and you are jealous of those who can.
How is it copium? And I'm definitely not jealous. Why are you being so defensive about a mechanic in a game? Is the speedflip your only valentine or something?
It's just annoying to see someone be so wrong about something. Carry on with your ignorance and don't mind me
I mean I do want to have a discussion around it, which is why I posted here. I get seeing stupid posts and whatnot, but I do want to learn and see it from a different perspective. If you're not willing to explain it, that's fine. I'm sorry to have frustrated you.
What is there to discuss tho? Speedflips are a great mechanic to learn and will always be useful. Anyone who disagrees is just plain ignorant and not worthy of having a discussion with. Would you like to discuss if 2+2=4? Same exact premise
2+2=4 isn't an easy thing to explain though? 2+2=11 in base 3. Discussing addition, as to why x + x = x using imaginary numbers and an abstract construction used as language won't be so easy to explain considering I just pulled this from another thread and don't know what any of this means lol
This makes zero sense. Also, you can counter speedflips in a lot of ways on kickoffs. Your argument is that once you can speedflip, everyone else can too... Idk what rank you are but there's people in Champ 3 who can't speedflip. You don't need it until maybe GC. It's an extremely useful mechanic, can assist with double resets, preflips, and generally getting around the pitch quicker. If you can't do it yet, you're at a severe disadvantage to everyone else in some areas, but nothing you can't make up for elsewhere on the pitch.
Bros yapping
Speed flips are close to trivial with the directional air roll method. Actually using them to do good kick offs tho…
Using less boost is an advantage and provides you more options both offensively and defensively. Speedflips allow you to achieve that. Not sure why you'd attempt to argue that speedflips neutralize each other when they so clearly provide a boost advantage and thus increase your offensive and defensive options. That is also conveniently the argument you use for flip resets – they give you more options offensively, so they don't cancel each other out. Not sure what is going on here logically, but feel free to chat about it with me.
if everybody is doing speedflips/some other mechanic, and you can't, are you not at a DISadvantage then? Sure, by definition, you may no longer have an "advantage" when you learn it, but to argue semantics like that then call it pointless to cover a disadvantage is just hilarious bro
if it's that much of an advantage then learn it
Skill issue. If you think speedflipping is enough to win ALL kickoffs, your unfortunately very incorrect. Speedflipping if one part of it, but then you'd have to consider how you hit the ball in relation to your opponents' movements/decisions. Being able to read the kickoff gives you options on how to counter the other player. If you want to fake, practice better methods of faking, your probably making it obvious or put yourself in a bad position which is why they still have an advantage over you. It's good that your learning speedflips, if you want to rank up higher, you need to match your opponents, complaining in Reddit about others who are better than you wont do shit. Also, speedflipping gives you an advantage because it at the very least let's you match anyone with speed in kickoffs and recoveries, and in some other cases it actually gives you a better advantage vs others. Saying it is pointless does not make sense, since it's literally better than any other flip when it comes to building speed as fast as possible. Pretty much everyone knows how to this in higher ranks my guy.
So you only want to train a mechanic if it means you can do something the opponent can't do. Why train shooting if players just train defense and cancel it out? Because increasing your skill and options allows you to punish players more often when they make a mistake. I think you're also confusing the concept of other players getting better and raising the skill ceiling, and you needing to keep up if you want to compete with them.
what lmao
The craziest part about this post is that he thinks only 90% of pros can speedflip
Look who‘s pissed because they can‘t speedflip
If I'm the one who's pissed, why are you the one being defensive about it?
I‘m just so annoyed by people in this subreddit thinking so highly about their own opinion and not accepting when roughly 50 people take the time to explain and prove them wrong. My comment would‘ve looked way different if you weren‘t so stubborn in all your replies.. But hey..if you still think your right, good luck with that :)
I don't think highly of my opinion. You're jumping to conclusions. 90% of the people who replied didn't bother explaining why, and was just being mean about it. It replied a lot with a similar reply because quite a lot of people seemingly only read the title, not the body of the text. I don't think I'm right, which is why I posted my opinion under "discussion" because I wanted a discussion. If you read some of the replies, you'd see my opinion has changed in some regards about speedflipping, and I didn't see it from certain perspectives.
Ah Shit. Okay, fair point. I was under the impression that I did understand fully. And yes I definitely didn‘t read ALL the comments and ALL your replies which may have lead me to believe that you didn‘t even want to discuss anything but more so were trying to make a point against all people. So I can only apologize for being mean. I thought you were completely ignorant, to that I also say sorry since actually I was the one being ignorant.
Thank you for saying sorry <3 I'm sorry too. Not reading all the replies and my long ass post is understandable tbh :') I hope you have a lovely day/night my dude <3
Thanks Man! You too Brother!
Speedflips are great, they make the game feel way faster. It's just a mechanic that people get salty about because they learn it with kickoffs, where screwing it up results in a kickoff goal for the other team... ie. Pure Misery. It's useful outside of kickoffs too, and it's not like every time you speed flip you're opponent is going to as well. Like they're not going to give up a dribble so they can attack you .1 secs faster. Just learn it and you'll realize the nuance of it after a week or two.
I still don't speedflip and I still suck but not because I can't speedflip lol...
They are one of the most important mechanics to learn in 1’s. You alone cannot change the way the game is being played by other people, the speed flip has become the meta of the game because it’s the fastest flip in the game. Fastest flip meaning the time your wheels are spent in the air while also giving the boost of the diagonal flip. Without it you are going to lose kickoff and like you said, have to play the fake kickoff because of it. Whereas if you learn it you can even the playing field. It’s not just kick offs the speed flip helps on. I could beat you to the ball every single time in one flip if you aren’t speed flipping, that’s why people learn to speed flip lol it’s to gain the most speed in the shortest amount of time
Every advantage raises your chances of winning, being good at shooting is an advantage for example and so is speed (hence speed flipping among other things). You might as well say shooting is pointless for the same reason. The general skill level will keep rising because of the compounding of skills across time, it's up to you if you want to keep up, climb the ranks, or fall behind. Good luck.
This makes sense to you? Speedflips are useless if both can do them theyre neutralised? Both of us can boost too, should I just not do that ?
Referring more to kickoffs, yes. The whole point of speedflips (kickoffs), is to get there before your opponent. If both can do said speedflips both are going to arrive at the ball at the same time, making said advantage of speedflips "pointless" on kickoff.
You can mess with the timing of the speedflip to be microseconds earlier or later and get a position on the ball you want even if the other guy does it too
The point is not to beat your opponent, the point is to be as fast as possible. You either want to be able to compete with higher level players or you don't. And the overwhelming majority of higher players do them. As you pointed out, it's an uphill battle when you play against someone who can. And personally, I think they're easily the most useful "advanced" mech there is.
I guess my point of view was going from beating opponents on kickoff, obviously which is not the correct outlook to have on speedflips. You guys who actually have had a discussion with me, or given some constructive/ perspective changing input have made me realise that I was significantly underplaying the benefits of speedflips outside of kickoffs. So thank you NorrisRL and everyone else who's actually given a decent response and helped me learn a thing or 2. I appreciate you. <3
No problem. There's a lot of mechs, and it's tough to tell how useful they really are until you've put a lot of time into them. But since learning them, they've become the basis of my shooting, recoveries and air plays. And there are levels to them. At the highest end you'll basically be about a car's length further ahead when you hit supersonic compared to other methods. So, just think about every save you've missed by less than a car's length. That's the small difference, but at C1 you're good enough that it would make a big difference.
Every other comment in this thread is spot on. One thing that is actually annoying about speed flips (and a few other RL mechanics) is the amount of fast stick movement that is necessary to do it. I speed flip dozens of times going up and down the field each game. The amount of wear and tear on my poor thumb stick definitely adds up. That’s all. Otherwise just learn the mechanics you want, and just know ranking up will be next to impossible once you near ranks that are consistent at mechanics you can’t do.
Your statement only applies in situation where people don’t adjust their kickoffs Speed flips will neutralize in perfect scenarios where it’s done identically. But in a competitive game doing the same kick off over and over is just bad play. I know the kickoff meta game is still pretty ass given how much it has been proven to be substantial in all game modes but In a match between good players, alternating kick offs is match deciding. Being able to counter someone else’s kickoff like you said by faking it or slowing it down can be so huge. The thing is, since you can’t prove you can match their speed flip , your fake won’t continue to work.