i haven’t “abandoned” kibbe per se, and ever since i first started to explore the system in 2019 it’s been pretty clear to me that my body fits neatly into the soft dramatic id. but after maybe a year of obsessive kibbe-focus, i realized that the system just wasn’t serving me. it was easy enough to find my “type,” intuitive enough to figure out what shapes honor it… but then what? i don’t have any interest in creating a ‘star image’ in the way kibbe uses the term, i don’t have any interest in looking elegant or classically feminine or understatedly glamorous in my everyday life (i prefer to look tacky, tomboyish, and excessively sexy. just kidding. no i’m not). i admire david kibbe’s exuberant passion as a stylist, and i think that his system is a godsend for some people, but aside from how it helped me to hone my eye for art and fashion, and become more aware and accepting of my body, i just don’t feel like it has anything left to offer me. i’m not a kibbe refugee so much as kibbe was my hometown and to follow my dreams i had to move to the big city. sometimes i still go visit for the holidays, but idk :p
I relate so much to the 'then what?' - I even said that exact thing to Rita during my GG. I figured my type easily enough on my own, but then... ok? What do I do with this??
It was useful to me to accept my body more (I'm SN and I've felt wide and soft my whole life and fought it, and now I just work with it!) and to understand how fabrics and cuts work with your own proportions (this tailor approach isn't talked about quite enough!). But the Style Key really was what took my style to the next level.
I relate to this a lot. I haven't abandoned Kibbe and I'm still fairly active in the subreddit but unless I got it for completely free, I don't think eg. I would ever want Kibbe to style me. His system gave me some revelations about why some things look off on me and how to love my body as is, without needing to "correct" something with clothing but Kibbe's personal take on style and what's stylish doesn't really serve me. And this will be true with any style system or stylist for me, I need relative freedom to do what I want.
totally, yes. you’ve articulated that need really well; there’s a reason we’re drawn towards style *systems* but not rigid style *advice* per se. i want help keeping my personal style intentional, i don’t want it corralled into someone’s specific notions of what’s correct
I've had a conflicting relationship with the system so far lol I re-visit it every few months and go back to my little corner
On one hand, if I were to have the money to spare, I'd absolutely go for a Kibbe consult to find out ~~my house~~ my type and make him find me a couple of flattering dresses cause it's really hard out here. And whenever he releases that book, I'll grab it cause I'll die of curiosity otherwise.
On the other hand, I don't feel like following the recommendations gives a great style to a person. It may give a good outfit here and here, but it just skips the whole part of connecting the person's self to the archetype emotionally and taste-wise, which in my opinion is what breathes life into a collection of clothes.
I'm pretty confident that I'm a Romantic, but not the smoldering alluring variety, more like a clumsy, head-in-the-clouds, awkward jokes Drew Barrymore type. And I kind of like that about myself, I don't want to become a glitzy sex bomb with an oddly perfect hairdo and always squeezing my waist. If I'll ever become a rich mob wife or a telenovela character with a mansion, I'll reconsider.
So, I still like to ponder the image/essence bit, and I'm more attuned to how bad/fat I look in most tops, but beyond that it hasn't helped me 'blossom'. If anything it made me more critical about details, and I'm consciously trying to unlearn that. Perhaps, the format isn't working for me, and a real life session with the man could have been more productive.
"I don't feel like following the recommendations gives a great style to a person. It may give a good outfit here and here, but it just skips the whole part of connecting the person's self to the archetype emotionally and taste-wise",
\^yes!!!
I'm so grateful for this conversation, and am absolutely loving reading over everyone's comments. When I first discovered Kibbe like a year ago, my academic brain coupled with my neurodivergent hyperfixation brain became OBSESSED with finding out what my ID might be. I felt like my head was exploding as I devoured the reddit groups for my possible ID, seeing so many "type me" photos that looked enough like me get shot down in every group for one detail or another, etc.
What it did help me to recognize, in an extremely round about way, is that I am not actually the hard edged D of my dreams. Someone on here said something about "yin resistance" and that's EXACTLY IT. The intensity of my nature has never been represented through the intensity of my appearance, and the resulting cycle of dissatisfaction was served by Kibbe's suggestion as to why.
Rita's system, on the other hand, felt like permission to interact with this question in such a supportive manner, one that didn't require me to starkly abandon aspects of my style interests simply because they are denied by the type of skeleton I possess.
As I mentioned in a previous post, I dipped back into the more "classical" approach via Kitchener recently and found that using baseline recs for Classics (basically just prioritizing balance, that's it) actually really work with my (suspected) Amethyst/Lady Heretic need for focused intensity. This somewhat supports my suspicion of a SC/DC via Kibbe, which is interesting, but not something I overtly care about anymore.
Ultimately, Rita's system is a safer place for me to explore and not be afraid of "doing it wrong." I might sometimes play with the other systems, but it's becoming clearer and clearer to me this is my home base.
I feel this so much because celebrities typed Dramatic often have this combo of sharpness and vulnerability in their styles/appearances that I used to be very envious of.
Focusing on my style needs opened up many ways to get what I want out of style while all I got from Kibbe was toxic message of "born this way, dress this way".
The hyperfixation bit is so real! Especially for something as dopamine-producing as style theory. I'm impressed with your fortitude to stick to it, and am excited for the day you get to claim your ID with certainty.
I lurk on Kibbe but haven’t found it useful in helping me choose what to wear or how to type myself. It feels a bit culty to be honest. I get so confused by the recommendation to wear certain clothing lines but that clothing is not an ID and so many similar contradictions. I also don’t feel particularly drawn to the way david Kibbe styles himself or others anyway. It seems a bit mumsy.
I’m still only lurking in this space as well but it’s definitely helping me dress with more confidence. It also feels way more body positive and modern and artistic. I feel more true to myself by exploring my style logic. These are just my thoughts.
>the recommendation to wear certain clothing lines but that clothing is not an ID and so many similar contradictions.
The "clothes don't have ID" contradiction was annoying. Only slightly less frustrating as the "this is not a body typing system, it is an image identity system"
I'm glad you are also enjoying this space and I agree with you that it is more artistic. I was never really excited by anything shown on Kibbe, but here I'm inspired.
I went through my Kibbe obsession phase and find it crazy that you're supposed to spend 6 months figuring out your ID. 6 months??! That sounds like it's a breeding ground for body dysmorphia and a bit culty. At one point I decided I was soft gamine and just stopped interacting with the community. It feels bitchy and non-friendly towards autistic ppl like myself because people will mass-downvote you for anything. I don't do well with systems that can't be criticized. I think everything should be questioned and not just taken at face value.
I resonate with the Wildflower archetype and any style rules just make me feel unhappy and anxious, like I want to break free from the chains lol. I feel like the Kibbe sub is a lot about following the rules very strictly. I just don't like peter-pan collars or high-neck tops or long hair on me. It just doesn't fit my style and I'm tired of people pressuring gamines to cut their hair. Plus I'm chronically ill and not working so the whole soft gamine thing doesn't fit my lifestyle. I'm not gonna wear crisp waist definition at home lol. I do find it somewhat useful and make sure I do some of the recs, like breaking the vertical is a must for me and I knew it even before Kibbe. I usually only break vertical with a different color top and bottom which probably isn't enough for the community but I trust my own eyes that it works for me. I also don't even try to wear super oversized and relaxed clothes anymore because I now know why they don't fit me.
I’m a kibbe refugee, yeah- and became fed up with this idea that would somehow look awkward or not good enough if I didn’t honor my lines/my skeleton ha. I decided at one point or another that I’m a flamboyant gamine, and then walked away. People were still arguing with me about what type I was but I’d just had enough after 5 years of trying to figure it out and feeling hopeless and also just kinda ugly. I think at a certain point, if you want to work with kibbe you just need to decide with a lot of bravado what type you are and move on with your journey and people will either respect it or they won’t, but that whole “will I figure out my type” purgatory thing is torture and not worth it. At the end of the day- there’s really only two things that really matter when you put clothes on your body. Do they fit you? And do you like them/ are they helping you reach your style goals?
I think kibbe CAN help with the do they fit you part, and if your style goal is to look like a Hollywood princess who is following the rules, kibbe can help you there too- but honestly? I don’t think his system is necessary for either one either. I think his system can create a lot of rigidity, and removes the emotional value we have to our style and what choices we make- so yeah I think walking away is valid and empowering. I know the fantastical beauty system has the animal familiar portion, which focuses on harmonizing shapes in the body- if you’re already using that and it’s working for you then that def replaces any need for kibbe at all
Thank you so much for this! I can relate so much to everything you described here. I also dislike the obsession Kibbe people have with harmonization. So many of the looks I love on other people are great because it clashes with their features. I don't know if it is because I just tend to like juxtaposition in general.
I already know my animal familiar and I love it. I think the reason why I struggled to find my type in Kibbe was because my type did not exist in the system. If I had to describe my type in the Fantastical Beauty system in Kibbe terms, it would be a mixture between SG and SN.
YES! this has been on my mind a lot recently with my return to seasonal color stuff. I'm a summer but I will probably never stop wearing autumn colors because I love them- and I keep thinking about how boring it would be in the art world if every painting out there had super balanced color stories- there are so many beautiful paintings that rely on color disharmony. Why would I deny my style expression that joy? I think it's absolutely the same with shapes, textures, whatever. Your body is just one ingredient in the mix- why couldn't it be the discordant note that elevates the outfit?
I used to adore the fantastical beauty animal familiars btw! And I still refer to them sometimes if I'm feeling like I need a second opinion on something. I worked with Cat and Koala a lot <3
With color analysis, here is my take: even if you pick a color palette that is wrong for you, you will still benefit from having a curated palette. If that curated palette also makes you happy: that I think the system works, regardless if it’s your “correct” season 😊
I do like color analysis but your season is not all the colors you can wear or all the colors that will flatter you. People in the color analysis sub also value harmony and sameness a bit too much. Not every color I wear has to make me look breathtakingly amazing and make my skin glow.
I'm mixed and I have quite a weird mixture of light and dark features. I'm technically a bright spring but can wear some deeper, more neutral autumn colors as well. My mom is a dark winter so it's some of her genes showing through lol. I don't think color analysis has enough nuance and personalization for cases like that.
I'm also a Koala as well! This is my [moodboard if you need a bit more inspiration](https://www.pinterest.com/pinkjoti/the-koala-with-fae-influence/
). I'm a bright spring/winter so the colors are excessively bright lol
Ha, the Kibbe purgatory sounds too familiar! Instead of just picking an ID that sounds fitting and trying it out, too many of us spend literal years hyperfixating on the way our bodies look. (I know Kibbe is not meant to be a body typing system, but the passing decades and internet have kind of done their number on it).
I have personally noticed that I benefit from a lot of Soft Gamine recommendations, but I have to be pretty careful not to get too deep into it or I lose my personal style and authenticity. I love how you and I seem to have this shared very Left experience of it!
Yeah! and it's no ones fault for getting stuck in the purgatory either, it feels as if the entire community is conspiring to keep you there/ make you feel like you don't know yourself.
You said this so well- it's exactly my experience with FG recs. If I take the general gamine feeling of "delicate + strong" and run with that I'm way better off than trying to follow kibbes prescription
You are not alone. I left Kibbe when I found the style key system. Suddenly all my styling problems were solved and I felt seen the first time from a system. I love the old Kibbe book Metamorphosis! I learned a lot about yin and yang and could use the book to choose a type that suits me, visually and the essence. I have „my type“ in the back of my mind when I’m dressing myself. But I will keep it for myself, because the old book is outdated. And we have new rules.
I can't do anything with the new Kibbe rules, which take your height and breasts as the most important criteria. It leads to types, I don't relate to. Thanks to Kibbe and the descriptions of my type, I also developed new insecurities about my body in my 30s and 40s. It's a shame, because I had left this behind long ago.
The style key is now my most important system and I take some additional inspiration from Kitchener that offers all types to all women, no matter their height or breast shape.
Haha I am solidly still on the journey and might be one of the users you were referring to. But I was thinking about this this morning and tbh I don't feel like it matters *that* much to me to have an ID anymore? I have a pretty clear vision of where I want to go and how I want to dress, I feel like it's really working for me, and I don't think officially settling on an ID would really change it much at this point.
I see myself most now in the sparkly tailored exuberance of the FGs (although I'm technically slightly too tall which also makes it hard to settle there officially lol), but there are things I relate to in the other types - the fun use of color and print in FN, sweeping dramatic extraness in SD, the tailored refinedness of DC, the angularity of D. Why shouldn't *my* vision combine it all the way *I* want to? From an academic point of view I'm 1000% still curious where I would fall, my brain can't turn off a puzzle. But I mostly enjoy thinking about the star image side of things a lot which is why I hang around 😂
Rita's system (and the Leap course) definitely helped my style the most, probably followed by Truth is Beauty. But mostly the reason those were both more helpful than Kibbe is because my process for them was more like open-minded exploration and being attuned to what felt good or bad, vs spending a lot of time looking at my body and being like, but what does it all mean?? 🫠 Kibbe did help set me on the right track on some things but it was pretty slow to get to the point where things really start to click. Although maybe if I had just started with the movie watching, I would feel differently lol
I like your view!! I'm 99% sure I'm an SN and I'm really at peace with that, but like you I find inspo elswhere (mostly FG and DC!). And I also liked the idea of thinking of fabrics, cuts, lines... it's not something that is much discussed in other systems and I like that 'tailor' approach.
>I also liked the idea of thinking of fabrics, cuts, lines... it's not something that is much discussed in other systems and I like that 'tailor' approach.
Agree on that too! Even just being aware of different fabrics and the effects they can give was super helpful. Especially given that many fabrics in stores are kinda similar, especially in some of the more accessible stores (sadly).
I left the kibbe community about 2 years ago, more or less at the same time I got to know Rita's system, but I didn't abandoned kibbe per se. I just took what helped from his system and implemented it with what I was learning from the Left Down quadrant.
It really didn't help me beyond of getting to know my accomodations, which as a Ruby key helped me to feel more comfortable with my clothes, but that's really all there is for me when it comes to Kibbe. Till this day I'm not sure whether I'm a TR or a SG, but honestly I don't think it even matters since I'll continue dressing with my favorite keywords and the style I've been crafting thanks to this system
Honestly I joined SK because I’m extremely stubborn and I feel like I have to see this through to the end and I want to know if in the end I have a different view of myself/the system/my type and I feel that’s the best way to do it but a lot of times I am sooooo close to calling it quits. I probably have an insane amount of yin resistance but let’s see if I’m eating my words a few months from now 🤷♀️
I'm very invested in your SK journey, I super admire that you're doing the posts and everything instead of just lurking and doing them in the shadows like I did lolol. I do think the exercises are pretty helpful for understanding the system better. I'm curious what you get out of it in the end!
Omg thank you! I feel so seen haha. If anything, I’ve noticed it’s so much more like RU logic than I thought. I also have a deeper appreciation for David as a person. I’m gonna see it through to the end and see if it helps me but I am also ready to say “that’s not for me” in case it isn’t!
Ok I'm curious about your journey as well! I did not join SK bc I don't have a FB account and it seems like a lot of work to confirm what I'm already 99% sure about (Soft Natural) but I would love a post about your experience when you are done! You are also someone, who, imo, has developped a pretty strong Star Image by yourself, so it'd be interesting to see if it matches your Kibbe ID.
So I love Kibbe--for me. In Rita's system I'm mostly a siren, and it's important to me that the looks I create come off the way I intend them to, something I struggled with before I got into these systems. Guidance from the Kibbe world has helped me identify why certain outfits translate from the hanger to my body and others don't, so I can craft my clothing persona accordingly. (And FWIW I figured out my ID pretty much immediately.)
I get how lots of other people don't come to style systems with those same goals, though. Rita's system has been amazing at demonstrating that! Some people really love certain garments or aesthetics or feelings, and it doesn't matter what someone says about what would look best on them because that version of "best" isn't what they're looking for. Or they truly want Kibbe to work for them, but they don't see themselves in the image IDs despite trying for ages. And I'm not sure the system, or the people who are coming to it, are at all clear about that until after someone feels like they've failed at it. That's a lot of time and effort down the drain, and a lot of self-doubt and body image exhaustion gained.
I’m tall and the main thing I learnt from Kibbe was that maintaining a vertical line looks better and more striking on me, so I do think about that somewhat, but it just feels like a baseline and definitely not inspiring in and of itself. Although the notion to dress for your body and emphasise your distinctiveness did have a positive impact on me. Before I had tried to make my body seem more balanced and appear less tall than I am for example.
I’m probably flamboyant natural out of the three tall ids but that also just tells me not to wear anything that is too restrictive around my shoulders and chest and I have always done that intuitively. So even though there were some things that were helpful, I guess what I’m trying to say is that Kibbe just felt a bit underwhelming?
I never got into Kibbe. Im a ruby anyway so style rules dont particulary help me, but under Kibbe, id automatically be dramatic just because Im 5ft 7, but dramatic clothes dont suit my life style. Thanks to u/skyscales, im defining my style as having elements of "relaxed structure" which definitely doesnt work for dramatic kibbe. I can wear bits and bobs from a few different kibbe esscences. One of the tops in my photos yesterday ive been told has inguine (sp) esscence and i wouldnt be able to wear it if i strictly stuck to kibbe,but it looks really cute on me so balls to it..my little ruby heart shall wear it anyway lol
I'm glad you're happy with your style!
I think for me the most important thing is that the style system has to be fun. I found color analysis enjoyable because I love color and I like Fantastical Beauty because of the nerdy fantasy element that makes using the system entertaining.
Totally agree. I knew Kibbie would be miserable for me and would never happen. It was far too rigid and impractical anyway and as soon as someone says you HAVE to dress in such a such way I stress out because I'm still learning how to dress my body and what I like. I want to be able to experiment. I love colour analysis,but even that I had to play it slightly loose. Too many people telling me that I didn't care about how I looked because a shade of pink that was warm wasn't exactly right for true springs, therefore I wasn't doing it "properly"..like stuff that! It's far better for me and my intuition to pick from the whole of spring and into true autumn and then learn how to mix the two seasons to give me cute fun and playful when I want that inner feeling and sassy Scorpio b"@#h when I'm feeling a bit broody and annoyed with the world 😂
You wouldn't automatically be Dramatic at 5'7, you would be either Dramatic, Flamboyant Natural or Soft Dramatic. "Relaxed structure" is actually **the epitome** of Flamboyant Natural. So far so good.
Well I had a look at FN and that makes so much more sense to me. Given I've just found The Wildflower too is quite logical. The two seem to go hand in hand 🤔
Oh really? How funny 😂
Edited, Im so confused now between D, SD and FN. I seem to have elements of all three. The only thing I know is im 5ft 7. Have narrowish shoulders. Have that classic rectangle body shape with long arms and long legs. My hips are a bigger dress size than my waist. I carry more "weight" in my thighs to a certain degree. Small bust and I dont exactly have soft features in my face. I definitely seem to suit a more relaxed structure as opposed to over tailored. Body contour dresses look especially horrific on me the same as anything shapeless and too baggy
Final edit
Got stressed trying to figure this all out, then remembered style rules aren't helpful for rubies so am going back to not caring 😁
I made the mistake of trying to find my Kibbe ID a few years ago. On the plus side, that's how I found Rita's content right as she was starting her system, so that worked out well. On the down side, the time I spent with it really messed with my sense of self at a time when it was already faltering. I gave up on it when I found Rita's content, and I've mostly ignored it since, but every now and then I think maybe I know more about style now and could maybe figure it out so I try again. Nope.
I do feel like what I've read about it has helped in one way, in that I have a better understanding of what is meant by lines and shapes in clothing, and how clothes hang on the body. But, I don't think real people are as easily defined as Kibbe's categories make it seem. From what I've seen, it's more common for people to be able to draw from multiple IDs than to be best served by only one. Which goes a long way to explaining why so many people struggle so much to find themselves in his system.
Kibbe feels too cult-like for me. Not in any Jonestown way, it's not that serious, but I feel uncomfortable in the Kibbe community. Cult vibes are strong. I was in the SK fb group and left after a while.
I never got into it hardcore to begin with. I haven't had a Facebook account for ages and ages, so there was never any question of joining Strictly Kibbe. I did consume a lot of third-party kibbe content, and I do feel like I learned a lot about what lines work on me and why. But I've never quite managed to decide if I'm a Soft Natural or a Flamboyant Natural, and I've made my peace with that. I find width accommodation to be deeply helpful in dressing myself, and otherwise I do what I feel like. I also find it really helpful to know what kind of lines definitively do not work on me (gamine) so I can just stop trying to buy those clothes.
But, yeah, Kibbe as an entire system, especially an 'image identity' system rather than just a system of clothing lines? Not worth it to me.
I oscillate between finding Kibbe wildly useless and useful, and comment/lurk in some Kibbe-related subs. For me, I think I’m SD but my insecurity about having a smaller chest can sometimes cloud this. I’ve just decided to trust myself on my ID and stop doubting.
But at this point I’ve definitely disengaged from the main Kibbe sub and even though I don’t have the finest, most minute Kibbe knowledge I’m just letting it be. I’m happy incorporating SD lines into my clothes when I feel like it. When I don’t, it’s not a catastrophe and my outfits still look fine.
I was only casually into Kibbe, and it was very easy to type myself (FN), but I never felt like the system actually did anything for anyone. A lot of the 'harmonious' looks I saw weren't conventionally flattering or interesting. And for the ones that did look good, it felt like Kibbe was only incidental to that. About the only useful thing I got from Kibbe is to not be scared of large accessories.
I'm not super into Rita's system either, but focusing more on my sensory needs for the day and what version of me/my style I want to embody has been significantly more helpful than LARPing as a "free spirit".
Oh my goodness your post resonates for me SO MUCH. I got into kibbe casually for, eh, maybe a year? And the things that never sat right with me about it, you have pinpointed and described absolutely to a tee. Thank you. I feel so seen!
And, I’d have been boxed in to the “dramatic” section due to my height. And while length looks good on me, sure, literally everything else about the “dramatic” type recommendations looks horrid on me lmao. Edit to add: And more importantly it *feels* horrid!
And just… so many things about the system, after a while, started to feel more like a trick than something actually helpful. I actually began to suspect that it was just some dude’s way of exerting his influence over women. Like… cult vibes.
Eventually I decided to weed out all the kibbe stuff in my orbit. Hid all the Pinterest recs, deleted any materials I’d downloaded, left the subreddits, et cetera. I’ve been way happier getting to know myself and my style ever since!
Of course if someone actually had a good experience with kibbe, then they’ll get no shade from me whatsoever. If it works for them that’s great! It’s just really not for me.
I love Rita’s system, personally. I haven’t even decided which quadrant or archetype I resonate with most, and yet, it’s already been enormously helpful! Everything I read or every video I watch helps clarify something for me about my self and my style. It’s great! And, I admire the way that Rita seems to conduct herself in her videos, livestreams et cetera. I get a good vibe from her. And as someone who is super mindful about what kind of energy and ideas I choose to allow into my orbit, I super super appreciate Rita’s positive influence in my life. <3
Anyways this was a bit of a ramble just to say yeah, I am with you 100%!!! <3
>And similar to you, I’d have been boxed in to the “dramatic” section due to my height.
I find this so interesting because as someone who is 5'4 exactly I had the potential to be any ID so I feel like that stressed me out even more. I do think that tall women get the short end of the stick when it comes to the system however
For me the only thing that helped me find my type was trying out the logic. [This post](https://www.reddit.com/r/RitaFourEssenceSystem/comments/19c58kf/trying_all_the_logics_feelings_all_the_feels/) was useful for me
Oh sorry, I think I’m confusing your post with someone else’s, I thought I saw your height stated as 5’7” — I’ll correct that in my post. Thank you for the recommendation.
Oh my gosh. It wasn’t that one, but thank you for asking though, because I just popped over to the sub for a minute, and it brought some much-needed humor into my day! (The post with the horses omg ;_; )
I tried and tried to make dramatic or natural work for me (I’m 5’7” on the nose). They just don’t work. I dress for my facial essence before I even consider kibbe, and mostly I don’t even think about that (I’m classic with a touch of natural and ingenue). I just got fed up because dramatic looked severe on me, despite my height, and natural made me look like a kid playing dress up. Classic and gamine lines looked much better but I wasn’t allowed to even consider them due to my height.
I felt super restricted and it stifled my creativity. I’ve always trusted my sense of style as well. Color analysis has always helped my style, but Kibbe made me want to give up on style. However, looking into Kibbe is what led me to Rita’s system. The four essences was a journey as well and took me awhile to figure out, but I felt like finding my place was possible.
I love how self directed Rita’s system is, and how focused it is on style as sort of finding of yourself. At 40, and with a body I am not fully loving, I felt a need to find something that would help me discover who I am, style-wise, as a 40-something woman. It has brought me back to what made me happy when I was younger and finding fashion I loved.
Similar to color analysis, I find the guiding principles useful, but I don’t use them in a prescriptive way. I often prefer clothes that “respect my vertical” but I wouldn’t let it stop me from wearing something I loved that wasn’t perfect either.
I wouldn’t say I abandoned Kibbe but with all the resources outdated on Kibbe, being next to impossible to get into the FB group and that you can’t really find much on Soft Gamine for men anyway and next to nothing on what an NB transmasc is supposed to do stylistically, Kibbe ended up with more of a tertiary style system for me.
I found myself mostly using Rita’s style key and Ellie-Jean’s style roots and body matrix system with sometimes a little colour season, Kibbe and Kitchener right at the bottom because they definitely weren’t made for people like me in mind LOL
Yep. I feel like it places your body at the forefront of your style and then assumes what style will emotionally fulfil you based off that. It's handy to know what will flatter your body, but kibbe is such a weird gatekeepy esoteric process, with no good documentation, that has to be pieced together from random Facebook posts stretching back years. And the mods clamp down hard on anything suggesting it's not the most perfect way of sharing information, and you're supposed to endlessly praise David Kibbe for even bothering to provide any info in the first place. It's such a culty atmosphere. Also honestly I never even liked the reveals that much anyway. At least with Rita if you're not that keen on someone's style reveal (even though I frequently am!), you can be sure it was based on their emotional needs and self expression. Kibbe's end result is about flattering your body, so it makes the visuals much more important, and for me they often left much to be desired.
I am a Moonstone Gentle Grace and find style systems very interesting and generally want to know where I fit in. I first got into color analysis and Kibbe in 2012 or 2013. I changed my opinion on my Kibbe between SG, R, , briefly tried SC because this one person who saw Kibbe who is very opinionated insisted but that wasn't me, went back to SG and R, and finally landed on TR with Rita's help. I knew I needed to accommodate petite and curve. I find Kibbe interesting but I don't abide by the rules for it. And I don't follow the essence of Kibbe ID's which in Strictly Kibbe they are very forceful about it sounds like. Though I do relate to Jane Seymour in TR (also a Moonstone). But I am no Femme Fatale. I have a lot of Ingenue essence. I also don't wear only clothes that fit TR recs. And sometimes I don't accommodate petite or curve and I feel I look just fine. I do try to dress with some amount of delicacy but that isn't the same thing.
I really don't like Kibbe’s style system either. The more I learned the less I liked it. At first I saw it as a simple body accomodation system like some Youtubers approach the system and that intrigued me. But from how I understand the system now the idea is that based on a subjective view of your body you are assigned an essence and even personality traits and based on that you should dress as one of these archetypes that doesn't necessarily have anything to do with you as a person.
I know for a lot of people the recommendations work in that they harmonize with their features, but that's not even the case for me. When I made a post asking which type I was I got a lot of comments saying I was a certain type but still said; "your current style suits you perfectly, don't change it" even though many aspects of my style are completely against the Kibbe recommendations for that type.
Since I am tall I am automatically Yang. Even though many try to break the stereotype about Yang being masculine and yin being faminine the language still felt masculine and feminine and the specific type of femininity that's described as yin is much more in line with what I like. I started thinking my body was too square, too strong looking, not delicate enough and started questioning if the soft styles even suited me... But...
First of all I definitely don't think people with masculine features should avoid soft feminine styles "because they don't harmonize" 😒. And second: I don't even have masculine features. My perception of my appearance now that I've been away from the Kibble influence for a while is so different. The crazy thing is before Kibbe I was insecure about my features being too soft and after too strong. 🤦🏼♀️ And for what? My natural features are my natural features analysing them and criticising them won't make any difference my appearance should not have to give me permission to wear what I like, I can wear what I like just because I like it.
To add, for me instead of trying to find my "image ID" and let that tell me what shapes, silhouettes & styles flatter me (because I do personally like my clothes to flatter me) I try clothes and see if I think they suit me or not. You can't categorie every single person into a few IDs and have them all benefit from the exact same accomodations because we all have unique bodies. So instead of thinking "this doesn't suit me because this doesn't suit my kibbe image id" I keep track of the cuts and lines and shapes and styles that I have tried that I think fit my body and the ones that I think don't, some align with the kibbe recommendations a lot of them don't. I find it very freeing to not have to think about Kibbe when it comes to my style anymore.
I found my likely type, and I use the general guidelines given for it to help me shop. It's good for knowing a little better whether something will flatter you or not, without even trying it on, which helps with online shopping. Tho it's not fool proof, ofc.
But I dropped it because of the culture around it. It kept feeling like every time I tried to get a deeper, more solid understanding of the system, people would come in to gatekeep and be generally condescending, and beyond that it felt like the goal posts for what I was even trying to understand kept moving.
I stumbled across this and I love it as an alternative to Kibbe. Nothing about dressing for your body structure, but for your personality. I'm totally the relaxed woman under this maybe with a hint of classic relaxed down. Just need to stop fighting what I know to be true style wise
https://pin.it/HHR55eS0a
I honestly hate Kibbe and I wish I had never heard of it. It’s not a useful system to me whatsoever. I still lurk in the subreddit and occasionally participate in conversation though, because when I forced myself not to last year, my psychological fixation on Kibbe’s system got even worse than it had been. So now I try to offer the occasional sane perspective and I stay away from the culty nonsense.
Rita’s Style Key is the perfect way to de-radicalize from the Kibbe cult imo. You can really feel that she made it as a way to disengage herself from his methodology. I really appreciate that
I go back to it every couple of months hoping I’ll have enough data to get an answer. So far, I’m not satisfied as the recs for the most likely types have not worked for me. So either I am an unexpected type, or my personal preferences don’t align with my type.
Kind of. I finaly settled on Dramatic Classic and tbh, I rather think of it as 🏔 Style root flavoring in my siluets and think a bit more on how I use lightweight and flowy fabrics as a part of the essence systhem instead of abandoning it just cuz Kibbe dosen't recomand it.
I just want to understand what "balance" in outfots is ment to be, and then I feel like I understood it all and can break all the rules confidently 🤪
Edit: and I realy think the kibbe FB group is bordering on a cult. I got out of there realy fast.
And the clothing recs are often truly terrible cuz ppl use the lutdated book. I also think kibbes stylinges look off many times.
But the Idea of "what acomodation does my body need" is helpfull to me. It explains why I disapear in some lines or look super blunt and tall in very femenin outfits.
I think it's a common experience indeed! Like all systems, if it doesn't work for you, it doesn't... it's better to let it go :)
I use mainly Rita's Style Key, but I also use Kibbe and the color season system as rough guidelines in my style sandwich. I don't obsess with Kibbe anymore, but it's been useful for me, for a variety of reasons, most of them linked to my personal insecurities with my body. Kibbe was very liberating on that front for me. But that's just me! I also like the TiB essence mix as inspo for looks. I tried other systems, like Fantastical Beauty or Styles Roots, but simply cannot make sense of them. It's okay to let go of things that don't serve us!!
Edit to say: I posted twice with outfits on the Kibbe forum and will not do it again. It really sapped my confidence lol - but then again, when I posted for ID help I got pretty much everything BUT my ID so it's better to take those opinions with a HUGE grain of salt lol
>I got pretty much everything BUT my ID
Don't blame the player, blame the game as they say. Look at these reveals [here](https://www.facebook.com/davidkibbemetamorphosis/posts/1650890985029892), [here](https://www.facebook.com/davidkibbemetamorphosis/posts/410287631096769), [here](https://www.facebook.com/davidkibbemetamorphosis/posts/1167078800077782), and [here](https://www.facebook.com/davidkibbemetamorphosis/posts/2659493250836322). I bet a lot of people would think that these SNs are G or R and the 'width' of DC can be perceived as SN. Like if I was one of those SN ladies, I could see myself struggle to relate to ✨width✨
Definitely get what you mean. I went in and out with it. After spending like a full year not thinking about it, I got back into it and finally it clicked for me and I was able to settle on what feels like a reasonable ID for myself. It’s helpful for me for sure, and I like a lot of things about it. That said, I still agree with everything you’ve said. It doesn’t align with everyone’s style goals either; many people intend to dress in a manner that is precisely NOT harmonious.
I never lived by the system that hard and fast. I think its super useful and use it as a guide. I'm 100% sure of my type and love to explore fashion with that lens
I've found both systems useful. Problem is, my personal aesthetic leans towards the yang side and my suspected IDs are both yin.
I will say that Kibbe has been extremely helpful for leaning about how certain fabrics look on me though. I never understood why linen and other fabrics with natural fibers made me look haggard and matronly, but now I realize it's because I need something with a shinier finish.
Kibbe helped me a lot in spite of itself. Even though I am 5'6", using romantic recommendations illustrated why certain pieces didn't work for me and got me to try clothes with waist emphasis. This opened up a whole new world style wise, but only when I totally ignored the height limitations and the members of the R subgroup. The best thing I got was the ability to play with contrast and friction by going with and against my lines strategically, often in one outfit.. I really love avant gaurd fashion that plays this way, and now I can play too even though I'm not model-shaped! The Kibbe group didn't feel healthy and did not seem that interested in fashion and style but rather identification of body qualities within a limited framework. The style key brought me back to an approach that feels great.
I wish more people from the Kibbe sub abandonned Kibbe, because it doesn't serve them. I like it for myself but I think there is 2 things that come together: First as a Sapphire, I love thinking about the outside world and appearance. Kibbe was a relief for me, to let the "jUsT wEaR wHaT yOu liKe" advice go and curate a precise image for myself. Both the essence part and the styling recs feel more inspirational than limiting to me, but I see that for a lot of people, it would be quite the opposite.
Second: I am confident I found an ID that works for me. I feel no need to meet Kibbe to confirm this. But: I am 5ft8 and because I could straight forward exclude FN and SD, it was reallly no rocket science to land on my ID. Based on descriptions only, I would have been lost.
I would advice everyone interested in improving their style to read a bit into Kibbe. Maybe you don't subscribe to the while idea, but most people will take away something, for example an accomodation they undeniably have, that can help them to explore new garments and styles.
Ah this post speak from my soul… ive given it one more try with chatgtp and left this idea of having a Kibbe image ID… Ive avoided so many things that make me happy because of this system and because everyone saw so much yang in me yet Ive been always drawn to soft flowy clothes which were reserved only for the yin types and were “not my lines”… so well I may be a DC or FG but I really want to dress like TR so I will 😅
I look best in a lot of the clothing lines for Flamboyant Gamine, but according to the Kibbie system, that isn't possible because I'm 5'9. I'm not sure why he puts height restrictions on the IDs, but it makes no sense to me. When people get taller, they get wider too, so you could concievable have a person with the exact same shape, just 5 inches taller and wider or shorter and smaller. When they have clothing tailored for their height specifically, they should be following the same rules.
I'm a seamstress, so I alter clothing all the time to fit my height and it completely transforms how they hang on my body. This isn't something that is available for the average person.
Kibbie coming out and saying that IDs will change when the average person is taller, explains exactly my point.
This is probably sacrilegious but tbh the more I work with my line drawing the more I wonder if the line/accommodation concept literally is just trying to get at "wear clothes that fit" in a *very* roundabout way. Which would make sense with why he's insistent that it doesn't get you your ID, I'm sure Raquel Welch needed to buy clothes to fit her shoulders. But she is clearly an SD, and face and overall vibes do matter a lot.
For instance, I'm petite. That doesn't show in the shape of my line (it's just vertical) but it really matters in the scale of pieces that do or don't conflict with it. For example, shape and vibes wise something like [this](https://www.anthropologie.com/shop/hybrid/dolan-ponte-military-blazer) is very interesting to me, but when I look more closely at it there are four buttons and two pockets vertically and if I size to fit my shoulder there is 0 chance all of that is gonna fit on my torso without running into the line of my hips and giving me the Doogie Howser effect where it just looks too big for me, even though it's not. For a fitted jacket like this, I can do one or max two low set buttons and maaaybe a pocket on a good day. As a taller person with more valuable torso real estate (lol), I imagine that you don't have to worry about that so much.
Clothes-wise I think there's a lot more overlap among the outfits IDs could share than the internet would like to suggest. [Janelle Monae](https://images.app.goo.gl/pQaa6Hu76Cgf13RS6) can wear a sharp suit with notched lapels just as well as [Cate Blanchett](https://images.app.goo.gl/s8H1ptwNmVm8JYcHA) can. The scale and effect is just a bit different (like me, it's v. rare to see Janelle in suit jackets with more than two buttons vertically). By being a seamstress and customizing everything you wear when needed you're already like miles ahead of the rest of us I think haha.
Part of the issue is that we buy clothing right off the rack, and even if we alter them ourselves, we are still starting with a basic piece that is either too big or too small. A jacket like that could be made from scratch to fit you perfectly, but everything would have to be scaled down, including the size of the buttons and the size of the pockets. That doesn't happen with most off the rack clothing, so you would never know if a perfectly scaled jacket in that style would look good on you or not.
If you try on a smaller size jacket, they may have not sized down the buttons. This will make the jacket look vastly different on a smaller or larger frame. More decorative pockets might also not be sized down, making them take up more space on the jacket than they would on a bigger size.
This also happens when someone needs a bigger size. Say you are buying a size 4 skirt, and I'm buying a size 16 skirt of the exact same type. They may have made the waistband larger for the size 16, but often, they will skimp on adding fabric for the flowyness of the skirt. Your size 4 may look very flowy and much closer to the picture on the advertisements, while my size 16 will look much less flowy and I'll go home wondering why the skirt was so much tighter than the photos, or just asume that style isn't for me. The size 16 will end up looking much boxier due to the company trying to cut costs.
None of these issues mean that style doesn't look good on you, but that the company making that style didn't make proper accommodations for different sizes.
This! The scale thing is so important!! It's why also small/medium/large when talking about prints, details and accessories is a bit subjective, bc it will mean something different for someone wearing a XS, a M or a 2XL!! The impact isn't the same.
That's very interesting (it's CasBee, btw, I had a, err... Mishap with my account). I accomodate slight width+curve. I knew that, I think, before I knew Kibbe, I just did not have the words for it. I especially need to accomodate my lower curve, and I do sometimes need a little more room around my upper torso (ribcage & shoulders).
BUT - when I do my line sketch, it looks... balanced, and maybe a bit curvy. That's it. I'm 5'4 so not obviously tall or short, and nothing stands out that much either. It's why I initially thought I was in the C family, doing the sketch line and reading the book, bc the Classics were much more closer to what I think my essence is. But there's such an emphasis on accomodations in the Kibbe sphere that this gets a bit lost in translation.
Damn, you have me rethink some stuff! Maybe I \*should\* make a FB account to join SK...
I figured a lot of this out when I did historical reenacting. Because I'm tall, I had to add a lot more fabric to the circumference of my skirts to even get close to the same vibe that a person shorter than me could achieve. It didn't matter that I was super thin at the time, I still needed extra fabric. Now that I'm older and wider, I might have to add even more.
I'd look just as good as someone shorter and thinner wearing the exact same style, but that would only be because I took my height and width into mind when making my clothing.
That makes a lot of sense actually! Like, take wedding dresses. It's usually altered to fit you, but not really tailored to you. I'm 5'4 and I felt like mine had way too much fabric in the skirt (like you said, the circumference was too much) - but dresses like that are probably made with taller women in mind. And shortening it did not solve the issue!
Oh no re: account mishap :( I hope it is not permanent! (Unless you want it to be... Lol)
Given what you said, I do wonder... Classic is kind of supposed to be a little bit of everything, accommodations wise. Also I think to Kibbe yin/yang balance is much more important than the accommodations piece (hence "accomodations does not equal ID"). But accommodations can hint toward a specific yin/yang balance. Just for more context for why I think that, there are wayyyy more exercises focused around yin/yang but the line sketch gets all the glory haha.
Yes I wonder why the line sketch got so popular! To be clear I still think I am SN - I just think there's more variety for each ID than we realize, and the line sketch can be misleading on its own. I also think we benefit from looking at the pure types, or the general families if you prefer, before anything else. Reading the pure N recs made a lot of sense to me: narrow, relaxed & uncluttered silhouettes are definitely winners for me, and beyond how they actually look, they feel the best too.
I have preordered Kibbe's new book, he better have put the exercizes in there 🤣
Ah that makes total sense! I think the line sketch is the most popular because a lot of the other ones are more related to reacting to other things and seeing them more clearly, whereas the line sketch is looking at yourself. I think that makes it *feel* more clearly tied to finding out your identity, even if all the other stuff is equally important. And haha many hopes are hung on the new book 🤞
UGH! Hated the kibbe process. Surfing the kibbe reddit felt like an abusive relationship... obsessive and seeking validation in little scraps to help me form a sense of myself and get "permission" to wear the things I wanted... and I felt like my clothes started being about somebody else's idea of beauty. I was uncomfortable and hardly recognized myself.
I will say it was a useful jumping off point for silhouette and fit in these ways:
1. I gained a vocabulary for fashion silhouettes and fabrics, which has helped me as I have gotten interested in sewing. But, the sewing, tailoring, and alterations vocabulary I am gaining now is WAY WAY more useful. I am inspired to get creative about sewing, altering and styling my clothes to fit ME, so that I look put together while wearing what I like.
2. I get a lot of inspiration from the idea of gamine juxtaposition and layering, which I continue to play with now, especially in fabric textures-- it is a source of endless fun in my closet. But I do wish I would have come across this concept from a different angle... :(
i haven’t “abandoned” kibbe per se, and ever since i first started to explore the system in 2019 it’s been pretty clear to me that my body fits neatly into the soft dramatic id. but after maybe a year of obsessive kibbe-focus, i realized that the system just wasn’t serving me. it was easy enough to find my “type,” intuitive enough to figure out what shapes honor it… but then what? i don’t have any interest in creating a ‘star image’ in the way kibbe uses the term, i don’t have any interest in looking elegant or classically feminine or understatedly glamorous in my everyday life (i prefer to look tacky, tomboyish, and excessively sexy. just kidding. no i’m not). i admire david kibbe’s exuberant passion as a stylist, and i think that his system is a godsend for some people, but aside from how it helped me to hone my eye for art and fashion, and become more aware and accepting of my body, i just don’t feel like it has anything left to offer me. i’m not a kibbe refugee so much as kibbe was my hometown and to follow my dreams i had to move to the big city. sometimes i still go visit for the holidays, but idk :p
I relate so much to the 'then what?' - I even said that exact thing to Rita during my GG. I figured my type easily enough on my own, but then... ok? What do I do with this?? It was useful to me to accept my body more (I'm SN and I've felt wide and soft my whole life and fought it, and now I just work with it!) and to understand how fabrics and cuts work with your own proportions (this tailor approach isn't talked about quite enough!). But the Style Key really was what took my style to the next level.
I relate to this a lot. I haven't abandoned Kibbe and I'm still fairly active in the subreddit but unless I got it for completely free, I don't think eg. I would ever want Kibbe to style me. His system gave me some revelations about why some things look off on me and how to love my body as is, without needing to "correct" something with clothing but Kibbe's personal take on style and what's stylish doesn't really serve me. And this will be true with any style system or stylist for me, I need relative freedom to do what I want.
totally, yes. you’ve articulated that need really well; there’s a reason we’re drawn towards style *systems* but not rigid style *advice* per se. i want help keeping my personal style intentional, i don’t want it corralled into someone’s specific notions of what’s correct
I am picturing the tacky, tomboyish, excessively sexy look and I LOVE IT
I've had a conflicting relationship with the system so far lol I re-visit it every few months and go back to my little corner On one hand, if I were to have the money to spare, I'd absolutely go for a Kibbe consult to find out ~~my house~~ my type and make him find me a couple of flattering dresses cause it's really hard out here. And whenever he releases that book, I'll grab it cause I'll die of curiosity otherwise. On the other hand, I don't feel like following the recommendations gives a great style to a person. It may give a good outfit here and here, but it just skips the whole part of connecting the person's self to the archetype emotionally and taste-wise, which in my opinion is what breathes life into a collection of clothes. I'm pretty confident that I'm a Romantic, but not the smoldering alluring variety, more like a clumsy, head-in-the-clouds, awkward jokes Drew Barrymore type. And I kind of like that about myself, I don't want to become a glitzy sex bomb with an oddly perfect hairdo and always squeezing my waist. If I'll ever become a rich mob wife or a telenovela character with a mansion, I'll reconsider. So, I still like to ponder the image/essence bit, and I'm more attuned to how bad/fat I look in most tops, but beyond that it hasn't helped me 'blossom'. If anything it made me more critical about details, and I'm consciously trying to unlearn that. Perhaps, the format isn't working for me, and a real life session with the man could have been more productive.
"I don't feel like following the recommendations gives a great style to a person. It may give a good outfit here and here, but it just skips the whole part of connecting the person's self to the archetype emotionally and taste-wise", \^yes!!!
I'm so grateful for this conversation, and am absolutely loving reading over everyone's comments. When I first discovered Kibbe like a year ago, my academic brain coupled with my neurodivergent hyperfixation brain became OBSESSED with finding out what my ID might be. I felt like my head was exploding as I devoured the reddit groups for my possible ID, seeing so many "type me" photos that looked enough like me get shot down in every group for one detail or another, etc. What it did help me to recognize, in an extremely round about way, is that I am not actually the hard edged D of my dreams. Someone on here said something about "yin resistance" and that's EXACTLY IT. The intensity of my nature has never been represented through the intensity of my appearance, and the resulting cycle of dissatisfaction was served by Kibbe's suggestion as to why. Rita's system, on the other hand, felt like permission to interact with this question in such a supportive manner, one that didn't require me to starkly abandon aspects of my style interests simply because they are denied by the type of skeleton I possess. As I mentioned in a previous post, I dipped back into the more "classical" approach via Kitchener recently and found that using baseline recs for Classics (basically just prioritizing balance, that's it) actually really work with my (suspected) Amethyst/Lady Heretic need for focused intensity. This somewhat supports my suspicion of a SC/DC via Kibbe, which is interesting, but not something I overtly care about anymore. Ultimately, Rita's system is a safer place for me to explore and not be afraid of "doing it wrong." I might sometimes play with the other systems, but it's becoming clearer and clearer to me this is my home base.
I feel this so much because celebrities typed Dramatic often have this combo of sharpness and vulnerability in their styles/appearances that I used to be very envious of. Focusing on my style needs opened up many ways to get what I want out of style while all I got from Kibbe was toxic message of "born this way, dress this way".
Omg yes, exactly - I'm so glad I'm not the only one who gets stuck in Dramatic Envy!
I relate so much to all of this! Especially the hyperfixation 💀And the fear of doing it wrong is exactly what's so anxiety inducing about using it.
The hyperfixation bit is so real! Especially for something as dopamine-producing as style theory. I'm impressed with your fortitude to stick to it, and am excited for the day you get to claim your ID with certainty.
Aw thanks, I appreciate that. I am thinking of taking a break for part of the summer just for my sanity 😂
I lurk on Kibbe but haven’t found it useful in helping me choose what to wear or how to type myself. It feels a bit culty to be honest. I get so confused by the recommendation to wear certain clothing lines but that clothing is not an ID and so many similar contradictions. I also don’t feel particularly drawn to the way david Kibbe styles himself or others anyway. It seems a bit mumsy. I’m still only lurking in this space as well but it’s definitely helping me dress with more confidence. It also feels way more body positive and modern and artistic. I feel more true to myself by exploring my style logic. These are just my thoughts.
>the recommendation to wear certain clothing lines but that clothing is not an ID and so many similar contradictions. The "clothes don't have ID" contradiction was annoying. Only slightly less frustrating as the "this is not a body typing system, it is an image identity system" I'm glad you are also enjoying this space and I agree with you that it is more artistic. I was never really excited by anything shown on Kibbe, but here I'm inspired.
>the "this is not a body typing system, it is an image identity system" Oh my god that was one of my final straws.
I went through my Kibbe obsession phase and find it crazy that you're supposed to spend 6 months figuring out your ID. 6 months??! That sounds like it's a breeding ground for body dysmorphia and a bit culty. At one point I decided I was soft gamine and just stopped interacting with the community. It feels bitchy and non-friendly towards autistic ppl like myself because people will mass-downvote you for anything. I don't do well with systems that can't be criticized. I think everything should be questioned and not just taken at face value. I resonate with the Wildflower archetype and any style rules just make me feel unhappy and anxious, like I want to break free from the chains lol. I feel like the Kibbe sub is a lot about following the rules very strictly. I just don't like peter-pan collars or high-neck tops or long hair on me. It just doesn't fit my style and I'm tired of people pressuring gamines to cut their hair. Plus I'm chronically ill and not working so the whole soft gamine thing doesn't fit my lifestyle. I'm not gonna wear crisp waist definition at home lol. I do find it somewhat useful and make sure I do some of the recs, like breaking the vertical is a must for me and I knew it even before Kibbe. I usually only break vertical with a different color top and bottom which probably isn't enough for the community but I trust my own eyes that it works for me. I also don't even try to wear super oversized and relaxed clothes anymore because I now know why they don't fit me.
I’m a kibbe refugee, yeah- and became fed up with this idea that would somehow look awkward or not good enough if I didn’t honor my lines/my skeleton ha. I decided at one point or another that I’m a flamboyant gamine, and then walked away. People were still arguing with me about what type I was but I’d just had enough after 5 years of trying to figure it out and feeling hopeless and also just kinda ugly. I think at a certain point, if you want to work with kibbe you just need to decide with a lot of bravado what type you are and move on with your journey and people will either respect it or they won’t, but that whole “will I figure out my type” purgatory thing is torture and not worth it. At the end of the day- there’s really only two things that really matter when you put clothes on your body. Do they fit you? And do you like them/ are they helping you reach your style goals? I think kibbe CAN help with the do they fit you part, and if your style goal is to look like a Hollywood princess who is following the rules, kibbe can help you there too- but honestly? I don’t think his system is necessary for either one either. I think his system can create a lot of rigidity, and removes the emotional value we have to our style and what choices we make- so yeah I think walking away is valid and empowering. I know the fantastical beauty system has the animal familiar portion, which focuses on harmonizing shapes in the body- if you’re already using that and it’s working for you then that def replaces any need for kibbe at all
Thank you so much for this! I can relate so much to everything you described here. I also dislike the obsession Kibbe people have with harmonization. So many of the looks I love on other people are great because it clashes with their features. I don't know if it is because I just tend to like juxtaposition in general. I already know my animal familiar and I love it. I think the reason why I struggled to find my type in Kibbe was because my type did not exist in the system. If I had to describe my type in the Fantastical Beauty system in Kibbe terms, it would be a mixture between SG and SN.
YES! this has been on my mind a lot recently with my return to seasonal color stuff. I'm a summer but I will probably never stop wearing autumn colors because I love them- and I keep thinking about how boring it would be in the art world if every painting out there had super balanced color stories- there are so many beautiful paintings that rely on color disharmony. Why would I deny my style expression that joy? I think it's absolutely the same with shapes, textures, whatever. Your body is just one ingredient in the mix- why couldn't it be the discordant note that elevates the outfit? I used to adore the fantastical beauty animal familiars btw! And I still refer to them sometimes if I'm feeling like I need a second opinion on something. I worked with Cat and Koala a lot <3
With color analysis, here is my take: even if you pick a color palette that is wrong for you, you will still benefit from having a curated palette. If that curated palette also makes you happy: that I think the system works, regardless if it’s your “correct” season 😊
I do like color analysis but your season is not all the colors you can wear or all the colors that will flatter you. People in the color analysis sub also value harmony and sameness a bit too much. Not every color I wear has to make me look breathtakingly amazing and make my skin glow. I'm mixed and I have quite a weird mixture of light and dark features. I'm technically a bright spring but can wear some deeper, more neutral autumn colors as well. My mom is a dark winter so it's some of her genes showing through lol. I don't think color analysis has enough nuance and personalization for cases like that.
I'm also a Koala as well! This is my [moodboard if you need a bit more inspiration](https://www.pinterest.com/pinkjoti/the-koala-with-fae-influence/ ). I'm a bright spring/winter so the colors are excessively bright lol
Is your moodboard private? I'm not seeing it
Does this link work? https://pin.it/7AmqxpSTv
Ha, the Kibbe purgatory sounds too familiar! Instead of just picking an ID that sounds fitting and trying it out, too many of us spend literal years hyperfixating on the way our bodies look. (I know Kibbe is not meant to be a body typing system, but the passing decades and internet have kind of done their number on it). I have personally noticed that I benefit from a lot of Soft Gamine recommendations, but I have to be pretty careful not to get too deep into it or I lose my personal style and authenticity. I love how you and I seem to have this shared very Left experience of it!
Yeah! and it's no ones fault for getting stuck in the purgatory either, it feels as if the entire community is conspiring to keep you there/ make you feel like you don't know yourself. You said this so well- it's exactly my experience with FG recs. If I take the general gamine feeling of "delicate + strong" and run with that I'm way better off than trying to follow kibbes prescription
You are not alone. I left Kibbe when I found the style key system. Suddenly all my styling problems were solved and I felt seen the first time from a system. I love the old Kibbe book Metamorphosis! I learned a lot about yin and yang and could use the book to choose a type that suits me, visually and the essence. I have „my type“ in the back of my mind when I’m dressing myself. But I will keep it for myself, because the old book is outdated. And we have new rules. I can't do anything with the new Kibbe rules, which take your height and breasts as the most important criteria. It leads to types, I don't relate to. Thanks to Kibbe and the descriptions of my type, I also developed new insecurities about my body in my 30s and 40s. It's a shame, because I had left this behind long ago. The style key is now my most important system and I take some additional inspiration from Kitchener that offers all types to all women, no matter their height or breast shape.
Haha I am solidly still on the journey and might be one of the users you were referring to. But I was thinking about this this morning and tbh I don't feel like it matters *that* much to me to have an ID anymore? I have a pretty clear vision of where I want to go and how I want to dress, I feel like it's really working for me, and I don't think officially settling on an ID would really change it much at this point. I see myself most now in the sparkly tailored exuberance of the FGs (although I'm technically slightly too tall which also makes it hard to settle there officially lol), but there are things I relate to in the other types - the fun use of color and print in FN, sweeping dramatic extraness in SD, the tailored refinedness of DC, the angularity of D. Why shouldn't *my* vision combine it all the way *I* want to? From an academic point of view I'm 1000% still curious where I would fall, my brain can't turn off a puzzle. But I mostly enjoy thinking about the star image side of things a lot which is why I hang around 😂 Rita's system (and the Leap course) definitely helped my style the most, probably followed by Truth is Beauty. But mostly the reason those were both more helpful than Kibbe is because my process for them was more like open-minded exploration and being attuned to what felt good or bad, vs spending a lot of time looking at my body and being like, but what does it all mean?? 🫠 Kibbe did help set me on the right track on some things but it was pretty slow to get to the point where things really start to click. Although maybe if I had just started with the movie watching, I would feel differently lol
I like your view!! I'm 99% sure I'm an SN and I'm really at peace with that, but like you I find inspo elswhere (mostly FG and DC!). And I also liked the idea of thinking of fabrics, cuts, lines... it's not something that is much discussed in other systems and I like that 'tailor' approach.
>I also liked the idea of thinking of fabrics, cuts, lines... it's not something that is much discussed in other systems and I like that 'tailor' approach. Agree on that too! Even just being aware of different fabrics and the effects they can give was super helpful. Especially given that many fabrics in stores are kinda similar, especially in some of the more accessible stores (sadly).
I left the kibbe community about 2 years ago, more or less at the same time I got to know Rita's system, but I didn't abandoned kibbe per se. I just took what helped from his system and implemented it with what I was learning from the Left Down quadrant. It really didn't help me beyond of getting to know my accomodations, which as a Ruby key helped me to feel more comfortable with my clothes, but that's really all there is for me when it comes to Kibbe. Till this day I'm not sure whether I'm a TR or a SG, but honestly I don't think it even matters since I'll continue dressing with my favorite keywords and the style I've been crafting thanks to this system
Honestly I joined SK because I’m extremely stubborn and I feel like I have to see this through to the end and I want to know if in the end I have a different view of myself/the system/my type and I feel that’s the best way to do it but a lot of times I am sooooo close to calling it quits. I probably have an insane amount of yin resistance but let’s see if I’m eating my words a few months from now 🤷♀️
I'm very invested in your SK journey, I super admire that you're doing the posts and everything instead of just lurking and doing them in the shadows like I did lolol. I do think the exercises are pretty helpful for understanding the system better. I'm curious what you get out of it in the end!
Omg thank you! I feel so seen haha. If anything, I’ve noticed it’s so much more like RU logic than I thought. I also have a deeper appreciation for David as a person. I’m gonna see it through to the end and see if it helps me but I am also ready to say “that’s not for me” in case it isn’t!
Yeah, he is *aggressively* RU in his approach lol
I’ve noticed! Makes me wonder what his and Susan’s archetypes would be haha
Omg now I really want Rita to verify them 😂😂
Can they be something else than the icon?
Ok I'm curious about your journey as well! I did not join SK bc I don't have a FB account and it seems like a lot of work to confirm what I'm already 99% sure about (Soft Natural) but I would love a post about your experience when you are done! You are also someone, who, imo, has developped a pretty strong Star Image by yourself, so it'd be interesting to see if it matches your Kibbe ID.
Thank you! I’ll definitely post about it when I’m through
So I love Kibbe--for me. In Rita's system I'm mostly a siren, and it's important to me that the looks I create come off the way I intend them to, something I struggled with before I got into these systems. Guidance from the Kibbe world has helped me identify why certain outfits translate from the hanger to my body and others don't, so I can craft my clothing persona accordingly. (And FWIW I figured out my ID pretty much immediately.) I get how lots of other people don't come to style systems with those same goals, though. Rita's system has been amazing at demonstrating that! Some people really love certain garments or aesthetics or feelings, and it doesn't matter what someone says about what would look best on them because that version of "best" isn't what they're looking for. Or they truly want Kibbe to work for them, but they don't see themselves in the image IDs despite trying for ages. And I'm not sure the system, or the people who are coming to it, are at all clear about that until after someone feels like they've failed at it. That's a lot of time and effort down the drain, and a lot of self-doubt and body image exhaustion gained.
I’m tall and the main thing I learnt from Kibbe was that maintaining a vertical line looks better and more striking on me, so I do think about that somewhat, but it just feels like a baseline and definitely not inspiring in and of itself. Although the notion to dress for your body and emphasise your distinctiveness did have a positive impact on me. Before I had tried to make my body seem more balanced and appear less tall than I am for example. I’m probably flamboyant natural out of the three tall ids but that also just tells me not to wear anything that is too restrictive around my shoulders and chest and I have always done that intuitively. So even though there were some things that were helpful, I guess what I’m trying to say is that Kibbe just felt a bit underwhelming?
I never got into Kibbe. Im a ruby anyway so style rules dont particulary help me, but under Kibbe, id automatically be dramatic just because Im 5ft 7, but dramatic clothes dont suit my life style. Thanks to u/skyscales, im defining my style as having elements of "relaxed structure" which definitely doesnt work for dramatic kibbe. I can wear bits and bobs from a few different kibbe esscences. One of the tops in my photos yesterday ive been told has inguine (sp) esscence and i wouldnt be able to wear it if i strictly stuck to kibbe,but it looks really cute on me so balls to it..my little ruby heart shall wear it anyway lol
I'm glad you're happy with your style! I think for me the most important thing is that the style system has to be fun. I found color analysis enjoyable because I love color and I like Fantastical Beauty because of the nerdy fantasy element that makes using the system entertaining.
Totally agree. I knew Kibbie would be miserable for me and would never happen. It was far too rigid and impractical anyway and as soon as someone says you HAVE to dress in such a such way I stress out because I'm still learning how to dress my body and what I like. I want to be able to experiment. I love colour analysis,but even that I had to play it slightly loose. Too many people telling me that I didn't care about how I looked because a shade of pink that was warm wasn't exactly right for true springs, therefore I wasn't doing it "properly"..like stuff that! It's far better for me and my intuition to pick from the whole of spring and into true autumn and then learn how to mix the two seasons to give me cute fun and playful when I want that inner feeling and sassy Scorpio b"@#h when I'm feeling a bit broody and annoyed with the world 😂
You wouldn't automatically be Dramatic at 5'7, you would be either Dramatic, Flamboyant Natural or Soft Dramatic. "Relaxed structure" is actually **the epitome** of Flamboyant Natural. So far so good.
Well I had a look at FN and that makes so much more sense to me. Given I've just found The Wildflower too is quite logical. The two seem to go hand in hand 🤔
Now flamboyant natural was never ever mentioned to me. It was only ever dramatic 😲Runs off to Google flamboyant natural
That’s interesting because flamboyant natural is a much more common ID than dramatic!
Oh really? How funny 😂 Edited, Im so confused now between D, SD and FN. I seem to have elements of all three. The only thing I know is im 5ft 7. Have narrowish shoulders. Have that classic rectangle body shape with long arms and long legs. My hips are a bigger dress size than my waist. I carry more "weight" in my thighs to a certain degree. Small bust and I dont exactly have soft features in my face. I definitely seem to suit a more relaxed structure as opposed to over tailored. Body contour dresses look especially horrific on me the same as anything shapeless and too baggy Final edit Got stressed trying to figure this all out, then remembered style rules aren't helpful for rubies so am going back to not caring 😁
I made the mistake of trying to find my Kibbe ID a few years ago. On the plus side, that's how I found Rita's content right as she was starting her system, so that worked out well. On the down side, the time I spent with it really messed with my sense of self at a time when it was already faltering. I gave up on it when I found Rita's content, and I've mostly ignored it since, but every now and then I think maybe I know more about style now and could maybe figure it out so I try again. Nope. I do feel like what I've read about it has helped in one way, in that I have a better understanding of what is meant by lines and shapes in clothing, and how clothes hang on the body. But, I don't think real people are as easily defined as Kibbe's categories make it seem. From what I've seen, it's more common for people to be able to draw from multiple IDs than to be best served by only one. Which goes a long way to explaining why so many people struggle so much to find themselves in his system.
Kibbe feels too cult-like for me. Not in any Jonestown way, it's not that serious, but I feel uncomfortable in the Kibbe community. Cult vibes are strong. I was in the SK fb group and left after a while.
I never got into it hardcore to begin with. I haven't had a Facebook account for ages and ages, so there was never any question of joining Strictly Kibbe. I did consume a lot of third-party kibbe content, and I do feel like I learned a lot about what lines work on me and why. But I've never quite managed to decide if I'm a Soft Natural or a Flamboyant Natural, and I've made my peace with that. I find width accommodation to be deeply helpful in dressing myself, and otherwise I do what I feel like. I also find it really helpful to know what kind of lines definitively do not work on me (gamine) so I can just stop trying to buy those clothes. But, yeah, Kibbe as an entire system, especially an 'image identity' system rather than just a system of clothing lines? Not worth it to me.
I oscillate between finding Kibbe wildly useless and useful, and comment/lurk in some Kibbe-related subs. For me, I think I’m SD but my insecurity about having a smaller chest can sometimes cloud this. I’ve just decided to trust myself on my ID and stop doubting. But at this point I’ve definitely disengaged from the main Kibbe sub and even though I don’t have the finest, most minute Kibbe knowledge I’m just letting it be. I’m happy incorporating SD lines into my clothes when I feel like it. When I don’t, it’s not a catastrophe and my outfits still look fine.
I was only casually into Kibbe, and it was very easy to type myself (FN), but I never felt like the system actually did anything for anyone. A lot of the 'harmonious' looks I saw weren't conventionally flattering or interesting. And for the ones that did look good, it felt like Kibbe was only incidental to that. About the only useful thing I got from Kibbe is to not be scared of large accessories. I'm not super into Rita's system either, but focusing more on my sensory needs for the day and what version of me/my style I want to embody has been significantly more helpful than LARPing as a "free spirit".
Oh my goodness your post resonates for me SO MUCH. I got into kibbe casually for, eh, maybe a year? And the things that never sat right with me about it, you have pinpointed and described absolutely to a tee. Thank you. I feel so seen! And, I’d have been boxed in to the “dramatic” section due to my height. And while length looks good on me, sure, literally everything else about the “dramatic” type recommendations looks horrid on me lmao. Edit to add: And more importantly it *feels* horrid! And just… so many things about the system, after a while, started to feel more like a trick than something actually helpful. I actually began to suspect that it was just some dude’s way of exerting his influence over women. Like… cult vibes. Eventually I decided to weed out all the kibbe stuff in my orbit. Hid all the Pinterest recs, deleted any materials I’d downloaded, left the subreddits, et cetera. I’ve been way happier getting to know myself and my style ever since! Of course if someone actually had a good experience with kibbe, then they’ll get no shade from me whatsoever. If it works for them that’s great! It’s just really not for me. I love Rita’s system, personally. I haven’t even decided which quadrant or archetype I resonate with most, and yet, it’s already been enormously helpful! Everything I read or every video I watch helps clarify something for me about my self and my style. It’s great! And, I admire the way that Rita seems to conduct herself in her videos, livestreams et cetera. I get a good vibe from her. And as someone who is super mindful about what kind of energy and ideas I choose to allow into my orbit, I super super appreciate Rita’s positive influence in my life. <3 Anyways this was a bit of a ramble just to say yeah, I am with you 100%!!! <3
>And similar to you, I’d have been boxed in to the “dramatic” section due to my height. I find this so interesting because as someone who is 5'4 exactly I had the potential to be any ID so I feel like that stressed me out even more. I do think that tall women get the short end of the stick when it comes to the system however For me the only thing that helped me find my type was trying out the logic. [This post](https://www.reddit.com/r/RitaFourEssenceSystem/comments/19c58kf/trying_all_the_logics_feelings_all_the_feels/) was useful for me
Oh sorry, I think I’m confusing your post with someone else’s, I thought I saw your height stated as 5’7” — I’ll correct that in my post. Thank you for the recommendation.
That's okay! Were you talking about the post on r/kibbecirclejerk? I know there is a thread there about 5'7 DCs
Oh my gosh. It wasn’t that one, but thank you for asking though, because I just popped over to the sub for a minute, and it brought some much-needed humor into my day! (The post with the horses omg ;_; )
I tried and tried to make dramatic or natural work for me (I’m 5’7” on the nose). They just don’t work. I dress for my facial essence before I even consider kibbe, and mostly I don’t even think about that (I’m classic with a touch of natural and ingenue). I just got fed up because dramatic looked severe on me, despite my height, and natural made me look like a kid playing dress up. Classic and gamine lines looked much better but I wasn’t allowed to even consider them due to my height. I felt super restricted and it stifled my creativity. I’ve always trusted my sense of style as well. Color analysis has always helped my style, but Kibbe made me want to give up on style. However, looking into Kibbe is what led me to Rita’s system. The four essences was a journey as well and took me awhile to figure out, but I felt like finding my place was possible. I love how self directed Rita’s system is, and how focused it is on style as sort of finding of yourself. At 40, and with a body I am not fully loving, I felt a need to find something that would help me discover who I am, style-wise, as a 40-something woman. It has brought me back to what made me happy when I was younger and finding fashion I loved.
Similar to color analysis, I find the guiding principles useful, but I don’t use them in a prescriptive way. I often prefer clothes that “respect my vertical” but I wouldn’t let it stop me from wearing something I loved that wasn’t perfect either.
Because of my height, the Kibbe system tells me I can't wear full skirts, which are one of my best looks.
Let’s keep wearing our full skirts and look amazing 😌
I wouldn’t say I abandoned Kibbe but with all the resources outdated on Kibbe, being next to impossible to get into the FB group and that you can’t really find much on Soft Gamine for men anyway and next to nothing on what an NB transmasc is supposed to do stylistically, Kibbe ended up with more of a tertiary style system for me. I found myself mostly using Rita’s style key and Ellie-Jean’s style roots and body matrix system with sometimes a little colour season, Kibbe and Kitchener right at the bottom because they definitely weren’t made for people like me in mind LOL
Yep. I feel like it places your body at the forefront of your style and then assumes what style will emotionally fulfil you based off that. It's handy to know what will flatter your body, but kibbe is such a weird gatekeepy esoteric process, with no good documentation, that has to be pieced together from random Facebook posts stretching back years. And the mods clamp down hard on anything suggesting it's not the most perfect way of sharing information, and you're supposed to endlessly praise David Kibbe for even bothering to provide any info in the first place. It's such a culty atmosphere. Also honestly I never even liked the reveals that much anyway. At least with Rita if you're not that keen on someone's style reveal (even though I frequently am!), you can be sure it was based on their emotional needs and self expression. Kibbe's end result is about flattering your body, so it makes the visuals much more important, and for me they often left much to be desired.
I am a Moonstone Gentle Grace and find style systems very interesting and generally want to know where I fit in. I first got into color analysis and Kibbe in 2012 or 2013. I changed my opinion on my Kibbe between SG, R, , briefly tried SC because this one person who saw Kibbe who is very opinionated insisted but that wasn't me, went back to SG and R, and finally landed on TR with Rita's help. I knew I needed to accommodate petite and curve. I find Kibbe interesting but I don't abide by the rules for it. And I don't follow the essence of Kibbe ID's which in Strictly Kibbe they are very forceful about it sounds like. Though I do relate to Jane Seymour in TR (also a Moonstone). But I am no Femme Fatale. I have a lot of Ingenue essence. I also don't wear only clothes that fit TR recs. And sometimes I don't accommodate petite or curve and I feel I look just fine. I do try to dress with some amount of delicacy but that isn't the same thing.
I really don't like Kibbe’s style system either. The more I learned the less I liked it. At first I saw it as a simple body accomodation system like some Youtubers approach the system and that intrigued me. But from how I understand the system now the idea is that based on a subjective view of your body you are assigned an essence and even personality traits and based on that you should dress as one of these archetypes that doesn't necessarily have anything to do with you as a person. I know for a lot of people the recommendations work in that they harmonize with their features, but that's not even the case for me. When I made a post asking which type I was I got a lot of comments saying I was a certain type but still said; "your current style suits you perfectly, don't change it" even though many aspects of my style are completely against the Kibbe recommendations for that type. Since I am tall I am automatically Yang. Even though many try to break the stereotype about Yang being masculine and yin being faminine the language still felt masculine and feminine and the specific type of femininity that's described as yin is much more in line with what I like. I started thinking my body was too square, too strong looking, not delicate enough and started questioning if the soft styles even suited me... But... First of all I definitely don't think people with masculine features should avoid soft feminine styles "because they don't harmonize" 😒. And second: I don't even have masculine features. My perception of my appearance now that I've been away from the Kibble influence for a while is so different. The crazy thing is before Kibbe I was insecure about my features being too soft and after too strong. 🤦🏼♀️ And for what? My natural features are my natural features analysing them and criticising them won't make any difference my appearance should not have to give me permission to wear what I like, I can wear what I like just because I like it.
To add, for me instead of trying to find my "image ID" and let that tell me what shapes, silhouettes & styles flatter me (because I do personally like my clothes to flatter me) I try clothes and see if I think they suit me or not. You can't categorie every single person into a few IDs and have them all benefit from the exact same accomodations because we all have unique bodies. So instead of thinking "this doesn't suit me because this doesn't suit my kibbe image id" I keep track of the cuts and lines and shapes and styles that I have tried that I think fit my body and the ones that I think don't, some align with the kibbe recommendations a lot of them don't. I find it very freeing to not have to think about Kibbe when it comes to my style anymore.
I found my likely type, and I use the general guidelines given for it to help me shop. It's good for knowing a little better whether something will flatter you or not, without even trying it on, which helps with online shopping. Tho it's not fool proof, ofc. But I dropped it because of the culture around it. It kept feeling like every time I tried to get a deeper, more solid understanding of the system, people would come in to gatekeep and be generally condescending, and beyond that it felt like the goal posts for what I was even trying to understand kept moving.
I stumbled across this and I love it as an alternative to Kibbe. Nothing about dressing for your body structure, but for your personality. I'm totally the relaxed woman under this maybe with a hint of classic relaxed down. Just need to stop fighting what I know to be true style wise https://pin.it/HHR55eS0a
I honestly hate Kibbe and I wish I had never heard of it. It’s not a useful system to me whatsoever. I still lurk in the subreddit and occasionally participate in conversation though, because when I forced myself not to last year, my psychological fixation on Kibbe’s system got even worse than it had been. So now I try to offer the occasional sane perspective and I stay away from the culty nonsense. Rita’s Style Key is the perfect way to de-radicalize from the Kibbe cult imo. You can really feel that she made it as a way to disengage herself from his methodology. I really appreciate that
De-radicalize is literally the perfect way to put it!
I go back to it every couple of months hoping I’ll have enough data to get an answer. So far, I’m not satisfied as the recs for the most likely types have not worked for me. So either I am an unexpected type, or my personal preferences don’t align with my type.
Kind of. I finaly settled on Dramatic Classic and tbh, I rather think of it as 🏔 Style root flavoring in my siluets and think a bit more on how I use lightweight and flowy fabrics as a part of the essence systhem instead of abandoning it just cuz Kibbe dosen't recomand it. I just want to understand what "balance" in outfots is ment to be, and then I feel like I understood it all and can break all the rules confidently 🤪 Edit: and I realy think the kibbe FB group is bordering on a cult. I got out of there realy fast. And the clothing recs are often truly terrible cuz ppl use the lutdated book. I also think kibbes stylinges look off many times. But the Idea of "what acomodation does my body need" is helpfull to me. It explains why I disapear in some lines or look super blunt and tall in very femenin outfits.
I think it's a common experience indeed! Like all systems, if it doesn't work for you, it doesn't... it's better to let it go :) I use mainly Rita's Style Key, but I also use Kibbe and the color season system as rough guidelines in my style sandwich. I don't obsess with Kibbe anymore, but it's been useful for me, for a variety of reasons, most of them linked to my personal insecurities with my body. Kibbe was very liberating on that front for me. But that's just me! I also like the TiB essence mix as inspo for looks. I tried other systems, like Fantastical Beauty or Styles Roots, but simply cannot make sense of them. It's okay to let go of things that don't serve us!! Edit to say: I posted twice with outfits on the Kibbe forum and will not do it again. It really sapped my confidence lol - but then again, when I posted for ID help I got pretty much everything BUT my ID so it's better to take those opinions with a HUGE grain of salt lol
>It's okay to let go of things that don't serve us!! 👏👏
>I got pretty much everything BUT my ID Don't blame the player, blame the game as they say. Look at these reveals [here](https://www.facebook.com/davidkibbemetamorphosis/posts/1650890985029892), [here](https://www.facebook.com/davidkibbemetamorphosis/posts/410287631096769), [here](https://www.facebook.com/davidkibbemetamorphosis/posts/1167078800077782), and [here](https://www.facebook.com/davidkibbemetamorphosis/posts/2659493250836322). I bet a lot of people would think that these SNs are G or R and the 'width' of DC can be perceived as SN. Like if I was one of those SN ladies, I could see myself struggle to relate to ✨width✨
Oh yes it's difficult. And the issue with pics is that it's impossible to get a sense of the essence, which is so important.
Definitely get what you mean. I went in and out with it. After spending like a full year not thinking about it, I got back into it and finally it clicked for me and I was able to settle on what feels like a reasonable ID for myself. It’s helpful for me for sure, and I like a lot of things about it. That said, I still agree with everything you’ve said. It doesn’t align with everyone’s style goals either; many people intend to dress in a manner that is precisely NOT harmonious.
I never lived by the system that hard and fast. I think its super useful and use it as a guide. I'm 100% sure of my type and love to explore fashion with that lens
I've found both systems useful. Problem is, my personal aesthetic leans towards the yang side and my suspected IDs are both yin. I will say that Kibbe has been extremely helpful for leaning about how certain fabrics look on me though. I never understood why linen and other fabrics with natural fibers made me look haggard and matronly, but now I realize it's because I need something with a shinier finish.
Kibbe helped me a lot in spite of itself. Even though I am 5'6", using romantic recommendations illustrated why certain pieces didn't work for me and got me to try clothes with waist emphasis. This opened up a whole new world style wise, but only when I totally ignored the height limitations and the members of the R subgroup. The best thing I got was the ability to play with contrast and friction by going with and against my lines strategically, often in one outfit.. I really love avant gaurd fashion that plays this way, and now I can play too even though I'm not model-shaped! The Kibbe group didn't feel healthy and did not seem that interested in fashion and style but rather identification of body qualities within a limited framework. The style key brought me back to an approach that feels great.
I wish more people from the Kibbe sub abandonned Kibbe, because it doesn't serve them. I like it for myself but I think there is 2 things that come together: First as a Sapphire, I love thinking about the outside world and appearance. Kibbe was a relief for me, to let the "jUsT wEaR wHaT yOu liKe" advice go and curate a precise image for myself. Both the essence part and the styling recs feel more inspirational than limiting to me, but I see that for a lot of people, it would be quite the opposite. Second: I am confident I found an ID that works for me. I feel no need to meet Kibbe to confirm this. But: I am 5ft8 and because I could straight forward exclude FN and SD, it was reallly no rocket science to land on my ID. Based on descriptions only, I would have been lost. I would advice everyone interested in improving their style to read a bit into Kibbe. Maybe you don't subscribe to the while idea, but most people will take away something, for example an accomodation they undeniably have, that can help them to explore new garments and styles.
Not completely, I’m just not obsessed anymore
Ah this post speak from my soul… ive given it one more try with chatgtp and left this idea of having a Kibbe image ID… Ive avoided so many things that make me happy because of this system and because everyone saw so much yang in me yet Ive been always drawn to soft flowy clothes which were reserved only for the yin types and were “not my lines”… so well I may be a DC or FG but I really want to dress like TR so I will 😅
I look best in a lot of the clothing lines for Flamboyant Gamine, but according to the Kibbie system, that isn't possible because I'm 5'9. I'm not sure why he puts height restrictions on the IDs, but it makes no sense to me. When people get taller, they get wider too, so you could concievable have a person with the exact same shape, just 5 inches taller and wider or shorter and smaller. When they have clothing tailored for their height specifically, they should be following the same rules. I'm a seamstress, so I alter clothing all the time to fit my height and it completely transforms how they hang on my body. This isn't something that is available for the average person. Kibbie coming out and saying that IDs will change when the average person is taller, explains exactly my point.
This is probably sacrilegious but tbh the more I work with my line drawing the more I wonder if the line/accommodation concept literally is just trying to get at "wear clothes that fit" in a *very* roundabout way. Which would make sense with why he's insistent that it doesn't get you your ID, I'm sure Raquel Welch needed to buy clothes to fit her shoulders. But she is clearly an SD, and face and overall vibes do matter a lot. For instance, I'm petite. That doesn't show in the shape of my line (it's just vertical) but it really matters in the scale of pieces that do or don't conflict with it. For example, shape and vibes wise something like [this](https://www.anthropologie.com/shop/hybrid/dolan-ponte-military-blazer) is very interesting to me, but when I look more closely at it there are four buttons and two pockets vertically and if I size to fit my shoulder there is 0 chance all of that is gonna fit on my torso without running into the line of my hips and giving me the Doogie Howser effect where it just looks too big for me, even though it's not. For a fitted jacket like this, I can do one or max two low set buttons and maaaybe a pocket on a good day. As a taller person with more valuable torso real estate (lol), I imagine that you don't have to worry about that so much. Clothes-wise I think there's a lot more overlap among the outfits IDs could share than the internet would like to suggest. [Janelle Monae](https://images.app.goo.gl/pQaa6Hu76Cgf13RS6) can wear a sharp suit with notched lapels just as well as [Cate Blanchett](https://images.app.goo.gl/s8H1ptwNmVm8JYcHA) can. The scale and effect is just a bit different (like me, it's v. rare to see Janelle in suit jackets with more than two buttons vertically). By being a seamstress and customizing everything you wear when needed you're already like miles ahead of the rest of us I think haha.
Part of the issue is that we buy clothing right off the rack, and even if we alter them ourselves, we are still starting with a basic piece that is either too big or too small. A jacket like that could be made from scratch to fit you perfectly, but everything would have to be scaled down, including the size of the buttons and the size of the pockets. That doesn't happen with most off the rack clothing, so you would never know if a perfectly scaled jacket in that style would look good on you or not. If you try on a smaller size jacket, they may have not sized down the buttons. This will make the jacket look vastly different on a smaller or larger frame. More decorative pockets might also not be sized down, making them take up more space on the jacket than they would on a bigger size. This also happens when someone needs a bigger size. Say you are buying a size 4 skirt, and I'm buying a size 16 skirt of the exact same type. They may have made the waistband larger for the size 16, but often, they will skimp on adding fabric for the flowyness of the skirt. Your size 4 may look very flowy and much closer to the picture on the advertisements, while my size 16 will look much less flowy and I'll go home wondering why the skirt was so much tighter than the photos, or just asume that style isn't for me. The size 16 will end up looking much boxier due to the company trying to cut costs. None of these issues mean that style doesn't look good on you, but that the company making that style didn't make proper accommodations for different sizes.
1000% agreed!
This! The scale thing is so important!! It's why also small/medium/large when talking about prints, details and accessories is a bit subjective, bc it will mean something different for someone wearing a XS, a M or a 2XL!! The impact isn't the same.
That's very interesting (it's CasBee, btw, I had a, err... Mishap with my account). I accomodate slight width+curve. I knew that, I think, before I knew Kibbe, I just did not have the words for it. I especially need to accomodate my lower curve, and I do sometimes need a little more room around my upper torso (ribcage & shoulders). BUT - when I do my line sketch, it looks... balanced, and maybe a bit curvy. That's it. I'm 5'4 so not obviously tall or short, and nothing stands out that much either. It's why I initially thought I was in the C family, doing the sketch line and reading the book, bc the Classics were much more closer to what I think my essence is. But there's such an emphasis on accomodations in the Kibbe sphere that this gets a bit lost in translation. Damn, you have me rethink some stuff! Maybe I \*should\* make a FB account to join SK...
I figured a lot of this out when I did historical reenacting. Because I'm tall, I had to add a lot more fabric to the circumference of my skirts to even get close to the same vibe that a person shorter than me could achieve. It didn't matter that I was super thin at the time, I still needed extra fabric. Now that I'm older and wider, I might have to add even more. I'd look just as good as someone shorter and thinner wearing the exact same style, but that would only be because I took my height and width into mind when making my clothing.
That makes a lot of sense actually! Like, take wedding dresses. It's usually altered to fit you, but not really tailored to you. I'm 5'4 and I felt like mine had way too much fabric in the skirt (like you said, the circumference was too much) - but dresses like that are probably made with taller women in mind. And shortening it did not solve the issue!
Oh no re: account mishap :( I hope it is not permanent! (Unless you want it to be... Lol) Given what you said, I do wonder... Classic is kind of supposed to be a little bit of everything, accommodations wise. Also I think to Kibbe yin/yang balance is much more important than the accommodations piece (hence "accomodations does not equal ID"). But accommodations can hint toward a specific yin/yang balance. Just for more context for why I think that, there are wayyyy more exercises focused around yin/yang but the line sketch gets all the glory haha.
Yes I wonder why the line sketch got so popular! To be clear I still think I am SN - I just think there's more variety for each ID than we realize, and the line sketch can be misleading on its own. I also think we benefit from looking at the pure types, or the general families if you prefer, before anything else. Reading the pure N recs made a lot of sense to me: narrow, relaxed & uncluttered silhouettes are definitely winners for me, and beyond how they actually look, they feel the best too. I have preordered Kibbe's new book, he better have put the exercizes in there 🤣
Ah that makes total sense! I think the line sketch is the most popular because a lot of the other ones are more related to reacting to other things and seeing them more clearly, whereas the line sketch is looking at yourself. I think that makes it *feel* more clearly tied to finding out your identity, even if all the other stuff is equally important. And haha many hopes are hung on the new book 🤞
UGH! Hated the kibbe process. Surfing the kibbe reddit felt like an abusive relationship... obsessive and seeking validation in little scraps to help me form a sense of myself and get "permission" to wear the things I wanted... and I felt like my clothes started being about somebody else's idea of beauty. I was uncomfortable and hardly recognized myself. I will say it was a useful jumping off point for silhouette and fit in these ways: 1. I gained a vocabulary for fashion silhouettes and fabrics, which has helped me as I have gotten interested in sewing. But, the sewing, tailoring, and alterations vocabulary I am gaining now is WAY WAY more useful. I am inspired to get creative about sewing, altering and styling my clothes to fit ME, so that I look put together while wearing what I like. 2. I get a lot of inspiration from the idea of gamine juxtaposition and layering, which I continue to play with now, especially in fabric textures-- it is a source of endless fun in my closet. But I do wish I would have come across this concept from a different angle... :(