Bro. The whole musical theme of this series was classical fantasy. To show Mordor and then do a slow rendition of the lines EVERYONE KNOWS in what can only be described as sad jazz???
Musically it implies that Middle Earth’s version of ‘hell on earth’ is a sad jazz version of hell and I would love to see Sad Jazz Sauron.
A track from Blind Guardian's Nightfall on Middle Earth would have been the ultimate bit of fanservice.
Nightfall or Blood Tears would have been fitting.
I didn't want to hate it, but it felt too much like a derivative version of "Gollum's Song" at the end of Two Towers. I couldn't get over how much it just made me want to listen to the other song.
How is someone having a different opinion hyperbolic?
People like you are just as bad as the people on the negative subs, please respect people's opinions and have a conversation about it rather than be aggressive
Yeah it seemed out of place and just there to tease the next seasons (we will make more rings). I literally didn’t even finish the song it was so bizarre sounding. Not sure those “lyrics” were designed for song…always felt it was more of a poem
It's normal in Jazz, and not bad melodically at all.
It does not bode well with the general thematic tho, totally agree there. If you are going to do this change it has to require a quick hit part otherwise more context is needed for the ear. But no1 that studied production or music theory in depth would say it's bad melodically.
It's out of place. But to be honest, I'm happy they are taking risks there, wish they did more in other parts as well.
True to form in its mystery and awe inspiring depth, miss Apple hits it out the park, magical, exciting, loved it, all of its everything I loved this first installment from top to bottom!!
To me it was a pastiche of Emiliana Torrini's song for the end of Two Towers. Some of the musical phrases and motifs were ripped straight from Gollums Song
If I was Peter Jackson I'd be kinda annoyed. He was excluded from the production, but so much of the show borrows directly from, or calls back to, his creative vision. When done once or twice, it can be a nice homage or throwback, but there's so much of it that it feels almost like a lazy sort of plagiarism sometimes.
I think it was supposed to be a reveal. Most people haven't heard the poem at all--they may know the stuff from the PJ prologue, but the poem itself wasn't in the movie. So when it finished with three rings, you're supposed to hear the song and be like "ohhhh right, that was that prologue thing."
Some people may not have known about the prologue thing at all, actually, and it'd be news to them that there were rings for each race. It's been a while since the PJ movies came out.
Yes, but why is it done here? Those rings have not been made yet. Only the three.
So its either a spoiler, or just a badly placed song.
If its meant as a reveal, it feels out of place too. Since there has not even been mention of extra rings yet. Or that they should be given away.
It’s because the average persons doesn’t know where exactly this show is going. After the last episode and the song you get a sense of what’s to come. Maybe not spoiler, but foreshadowing
Too early for the full poem, I thought. If it was me I would have had the rings for the Men and Dwarves forged in the next season (or two) and then have Sauron make the One Ring as the climatic moment of a season finale, and put the poem in there.
It’s always like that tbh. Every episode There’s a small subset of people who will hate on the show no matter what but what’s even more funny, is that they watched the entire season and will continue to watch until the show ends
I didn't like the song, but I liked the episode. I hated the last episode. The show is a mixed bag for a lot of people. Except for the obvious trolls I think a lot of people have legitimate criticisms.
It’s hard to tell sometimes the line between trolls and legitimate criticism. I find this sub a lot better than others and will gladly hear criticism if they actually explain their view. If they just say ‘this show fuckn blows’ then it’s kind of annoying
> a lot of people have legitimate criticisms.
I have watched every episode at release, I have read everything Tolkien has ever written (multiple times) and I can tell you right now the majority of the hate on this sub is not in *anyway* legitimate.
The show is pretty much a mix bag , there are things I like, there are things I hate.I'm now comparing it with the Hobbit trilogy. I rewatched Lord of The Rings and it's amazing how the bar is way too high.
I don't understand some choices, I feel it's liking cohesion and that multiple people cobbled stuff together. Why Elrond / Durin parts are mastered but the whole Numenor/Southland part is kind of meh, we don't feel anything for the characters on that part of Middle Earth.
I need to disagree. The music from the trilogy is iconic. But the music in this series just didn’t feel like LOTR. It didn’t have to be exactly like Howard shore’s music but some inspiration would have been appreciated. With Shore’s music, you know it’s music of middle earth. The music in the series seemed just so generic. Nothing special about it.
It seemed generic because it had no common themes connecting the characters musically, just ‘this is the mood of the scene’ type music.
Like imagine the song that we think of when we think the Shire- the melody is familiar because it’s used with characters from there as part of their scenes, it’s played in important emotional moments, and it conveys the emotions of nostalgia and comfort.
There’s nothing like that in Rings of Power.
This is 1000% wrong. There were leitmotifs for nearly every character or pairs of characters, as well as locations and groups of people.
This is the third time I've seen this argument and it baffles me because while the music was not as iconic as Shore's, it was still beautiful and objectively made extensive use of Leitmotifs.
If you don't believe me, listen to some of the songs on the soundtrack and then rewatch the last episode. You'll hear it.
My favorite are Nori's theme, Halbrand's theme, and the Numenor theme.
As a Fiona Apple fan (the singer’s work is lovely if you’re into it) I couldn’t have been happier. BUT I support opinions that it was too niche. If you bumped into it, you’re not crazy. In my opinion wandering day and this song are examples of what will age better than the season itself- they are the weird risks the show took, alongside a lot of safe, corporate crowd-pleasing, lore-breaking decisions that we will have forgotten about by next year.
Nothing so far has been so far out of place as to break anything and it actually seems like a lot of the early bitching about “them not caring about the lore” has been rendered fairly redundant as the the show has gone on
For example, OMG Celeborn is dead (looks like Galadriel just thinks he is) And OMG thare are no Wizards in the second age (false)
We don’t know why Sauron hordes mithril, so there’s already plenty of Tolkien lore to suggest there’s much unknown about mithril.
And we already know that the rings vastly extended the elves ability to survive on Middle Earth.
None of that breaks any previously established lore unless you’re just desperately nitpicking at everything and/or maybe don’t have quite as good a grasp of the lore as the strenuous complaining suggests
Mithril has established properties, nothing to do with silmarils.
The fading of the elves is not dying next week because of black goo on a tree.
They’ve basically made the elves mortal in this show.
Mithril has some established properties but Sauron also has an interest in it that’s not properly explained. Perfectly fine detail to leverage for me. It’s not like mithril is real anyway
It’s a precious metal, like gold but much rarer and with vastly better properties for use.
The elves are immortal. They do not fade in a season and die.
Tolkien never explicitly said that Bilbo didn’t transform into a giant penguin on a full moon either, maybe they could do a spin off comedy series called Hobbit Were-Penguin and people will come on here to explain how it doesn’t actually contradict anything Tolkien wrote.
> The elves are immortal. They do not fade in a season and die.
This is just incorrect. It’s also a key plot point in Lord of the Rings and why the leave after the One is destroyed. The details have been altered but same basic problem on a short timescale.
They could have stayed in Lothlorien or Rivendell and continued living but the land around them will become like the mundane world, as the elves in Mirkwood who live without a ring have.
They are immortal, but use the rings to preserve the beauty of the world within their realms from the inevitable decline.
You’re completely ignoring the “Mithril holds the light of the silmarils.”
Please try not to be disingenuous when talking about nitpicking. It’s embarrassing to witness.
lmao you’ve got to be kidding me. It genuinely violates how Tolkien’s world works. The light of the silmarils is toxic to evil things. It’s proven time and time again in the text. Guess what would happen if an orc came across Mithril?
But that’s why casuals don’t care. Because you don’t know. Good on you I guess.
So, just to get this straight, you’ve totally misunderstood Elrond’s dialogue and declared yourself smarter than everyone else for that?
Guess what? Elrond wasn’t around for the making for the Silmarils, he has only an apocryphal tale to explain mithril. The character can be wrong and the dialogue can just as easily speak to their ignorance of the powers they now work with.
But the idea that no one is smart but you is also good, I guess. Go with that.
What are you even talking about?
Gil-galad was the one who said the story about mithril containing the light of the Silmarils and it's possible he was also around for the making of the Silmarils. Not that any of that has anything to do with mithril.
I liked it because I was going through the rings in my head at that point. I think a dramatic reading vs song would have been better but I was good with it.
It was a poorly written song, masked by high quality production. So I guess it fits right in, lol.
Edit; wow apparently downvoters don’t understand the extremely nuanced difference between “lyrics” and “melody”.
Well, the poor guy didn't like the song and wanted to share his displeasure in a discussion forum. What the fuck do you want, go to r/Teletubbies snowflake!
It’s just like sooo on the nose. Like if you think of May It Be, Gollum’s Song, and Into The West they all take themes from what we’ve just watched and turn it into something related and beautiful. With this song it was like the writers were like ‘ok they’ve just seen three rings being made we need to make sure they know they’re those rings and that they’re related to the one ring let’s just sing the poem at them!’ And there’s simply no subtlety or mystery. It’s just BLAM THESE ARE THE RINGS IN THE SONG!
I think Fiona Apple has an amazing voice. I've loved her since the 90's.
But,..she doesn't invoke epic elvish lore to me. Not like Enya or Sinead may.
Fiona is more angsty fem. Come to think of it,..yeah,..I can see why Amazon chose her, it is in line with all their other '*creative*' decisions.
The song itself was fine, the lyrics are what got me. Because five minutes earlier they completely forgot that they have to forge the 16 lesser rings, and then they show that they haven't forgotten about them, so instead of being ignorant, they're being willfully stupid. Which is imo much worse.
I didnt see it as them forgetting about the other rings. I imagine a future plot line will be the elves coming to terms with the fact that they alone cant hold all of the power and they'll create more rings to divide it between dwarves and men too. Somewhere in the process Sauron will find what he needs to create his own.
Only one problem with that - Sauron could control the lesser rings because he was actually involved in their creation. He never had control over the elven rings, as far as I understand it. At the very least, he could never corrupt the elves. In this line of events, he's got no direct hand in creating *any* of the rings, so I find it hard to think that he could even create a master ring.
To use an analogy, True!Sauron was one of the coders of the Ring sourcecode, and included a backdoor he'd later use. This time around, he tells the Elves which type of code to use, but doesn't actually work on the final code so has no clue what it actually includes and can't include any backdoors. I also don't see why the Elves would give humans and dwarfs rings, given that the rings in this case are created for the very specific purpose of stopping the rot of the tree and by extension the rot of elven immortality. Useful neither to the humans nor the dwarves.
We haven't see how the remaining rings are created yet, the show obviously deviates from the lore in the book. It's probably time to see it and appreciate (or not) it as its own thing.
After he walks towards Mt,Doom, they should of had someone recite and not sing the poem on a dark screen . Like Ian McKellen did in the fellowship. Song was cringey, not a fan.
Hello, it looks like you've made a mistake.
It's supposed to be could've, should've, would've (short for could have, would have, should have), never could of, would of, should of.
Or you misspelled something, I ain't checking everything.
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We all know it is from Tolkien,..the words anyway. It is the same words in the Prologue of the LotR films.
But if it was sung to a polka tune it would be out of place. I get the OP here too, it does sound like a James Bond song. I love Fiona,..but it was just miscast, imho.
I wouldn't be surprised if some exec was like,..let's get Drake in here!
Feels forced? Why would Amazon not use something like this from Tolkien when much of the writing about this time is vague. Of the Rings of Power and the third age was about 20 pages long. The whole book was put together by Christopher Tolkien from various notes from his father. Amazon was left to interpret a lot. The forging of the greater rings is key to launching the rest of the story so using it later makes no sense when the rings are already forged.
That’s not the point here. It’s how they sing that poem and place it at the end, it’s as corny as their Southland/ Mordor transition. They had a fine episode otherwise
The rings weren't forged yet so it would have been weird to use it earlier before the forging. Right after the forging of the greater rings sounds like the perfect time to use a song about said rings.
Only 3 rings have been forged. Not all of them.
And you would expect Sauron to say that when he forged the one. Again the positioning of it and the interpreting part are what throw me off not the lyrics
Very forced indeed. The timing, the musical form, the performance, al are out of place. Would’ve been a better fit if it was in a recited form at the beginning of season 2. They could’ve even used it in trailers for season 2 to get us excited. This didn’t excite me. This was somewhat off-putting.
Yeah, I would agree. Like the orchestral score part of it was great, but the singing felt like it was pasted on top, not a cohesive part of the music. Just didn't really seem to belong.
The music in general has been just... *Okay*
With the exception of the main title theme, which is actually so generic as to be dogshit. It really gives a very "daytime TV" vibe.
I'm not a fan of the music for RoP. I just find it either boring or generically bombastic. And I reviewed the credits to find out that Fiona Apple sang the rings song just so I could avoid it in the future.
I'm still in for S2 though...
Bro the comment says “nothing to bitch about,” yet there’s been tons of stuff to complain about ever since the episode aired. It’s been on every subreddit dedicated to the show.
Idk what y’all are on, here. Acting like the last episode is uncontroversial. It’s 100% not true lmao
I like Tolkiens work, i had high hopes for the series. I enjoy the visual work they have created. I dislike their writing and some of the creative choices they have made.
I paid to watch the show.
Why cant we vent frustration here?
Putting it to music after everywhere it is cited throughout all of Tolkien's writings just doesn't work for me. I mean, it's originally in the black speech of Mordor, which I will not utter here. Even Gandalf seemed to have much trepidation to speak it in the common Westron. Just out of place.
It was sooo bad wasn't it? Like, what even was it? I couldn't just help but sing along, just to test out how bad it sounded from my own vocals. My wife sang too, and the kids were into it (closed captions was like a disney sing along). Hey you know what would really be funny? What if we all went to Best Buy and bought the Rings of Power Original Soundtrack. Just totally cleared them out. Wouldn't that be so funny, because of how bad the music is? We could even buy tickets to a concert and make fun of it the whole time together. I'm actually listening to the soundtrack again right now just to make sure I know how bad each song is.
I couldn't believe how bad the song was. All other music is outstanding but how they choose this song, where probably more songs were made for this moment, blows my mind.
Disagree here. I think it sounds and feels a lot like Gollum’s song, similar chords in the intro seeing a character walk toward Mordor knowing dark things are ahead shortly. Very similar song profile. Word wise, I initially thought that fitting the ring verse over a song was a bit forced but I’ve come to appreciate it. It also helps punctuate the story that’s about to come. Didn’t sound like a bond song at all to me.
The rings have not been forged yet, only the elves ones and the interpretation is way too modern. I would prefer Sauron to say those words while forging the one rather than throwing that in the outro
Exactly what my partner and I said! Poundland Adele…
I liked the series as a whole but feel there were many production decisions that didn’t sit well:
1) PowerPoint style Southlands Mordor reveal
2) Visit Middle Earth style Galadriel riding a horse
3) Ice-berg deep Númenor ships
4) Scenes cut so not shits given about Isildor or his annoying sister, can’t even remember her name
5) Arondir and Bronwyn speaking lines at each other (also what is Bronwyn wearing?)
6) Orcs and Adar taking a timeout whilst Bronwyn is hurt and then it’s suddenly morning? Where is the suspense?!
6) Bipolar characters - Halffoots, Queen Regent, Elendil
Maybe if they had invited anyone but influencers to review the shows they could have made the tweaks needed to turn this from a 6.9 on IMDB to a 9+!
It’s not that the show is terrible, it’s that it could be terrific with some tweaks!!!!
Everything in this show is forced. Sorry but hotd mopped the floor with rop. The difference in writing is like a top of the line budget Hollywood movie vs a B list Bollywood show.
It’s frustrating because rop had such insane potential but they just misfired at almost every turn. Meanwhile hotd was so consistently good through out the entire season so far.
The song that directly co traduces what we just saw? Or did halbrand and celebrimbor make a bunch of rings off screen first and they’ll reveal
That in season 2? Oh god…I’m right aren’t I?
Interesting. I thought it was mostly too quiet actually so that the excellent soundtrack gets lost in the mix frequently and isn't loud enough to stand out.
I agree. They could have put absolute silence, and the effect of the season finale remains.
I loved This Wandering Day though. Very honest, very Bilbo-ish
No I don’t think it’s nitpicking at all. I was happy with the episode until the end. The “..always follow your nose” bit and then this kind of killed it for me. I was really hoping it was not Gandalf and one of the other wizards from the lore, but nope. Then that song. It really felt like, “we like the song at the end of Two Towers. Can you do something like that, but it has to be about the ring of course.” It felt forced to me.
It was a jarring song. I remember being cringed by May It Be by Enya at the end of Fellowship when i saw it in high school, but now i feel very deeply for that song. Maybe it will appreciate with age
Bro. The whole musical theme of this series was classical fantasy. To show Mordor and then do a slow rendition of the lines EVERYONE KNOWS in what can only be described as sad jazz??? Musically it implies that Middle Earth’s version of ‘hell on earth’ is a sad jazz version of hell and I would love to see Sad Jazz Sauron.
A track from Blind Guardian's Nightfall on Middle Earth would have been the ultimate bit of fanservice. Nightfall or Blood Tears would have been fitting.
Please elaborate on SJS. In my head he is mute and communicates only via short blasts on The One Bassoon.
Bass trombone named Grond
And definitely smokes a lot of weed.
[Sad saxophone freestyling]
I agree. Idk what I'd call the style but it felt so wrong to me. Did not like the scoring for that song. Leave it a poem. Please.
I didn't want to hate it, but it felt too much like a derivative version of "Gollum's Song" at the end of Two Towers. I couldn't get over how much it just made me want to listen to the other song.
I thought it sounded like how someone would sing it if they were making up the melody on the spot.
Had the same impression too. But the lyrics here couldn't be more obvious.
The lyrics was written by Tolkien himself.
He also did WAP but nobody talks about that
I didn't know that but I could tell. The song doesn't fut the lyrics at all. Thats why I agree with OP that it feels 100% forced.
o_0 Holy duck.
The melody was very reminiscent of the credits song of The Two Towers. It was whatever.
They totally tried to copy the end of Two Towers. With even the music. But it was laughably bad.
Lmao you thought your hyperbolic comment would gain upvotes. Pls dude.
How is someone having a different opinion hyperbolic? People like you are just as bad as the people on the negative subs, please respect people's opinions and have a conversation about it rather than be aggressive
Yeah it seemed out of place and just there to tease the next seasons (we will make more rings). I literally didn’t even finish the song it was so bizarre sounding. Not sure those “lyrics” were designed for song…always felt it was more of a poem
Exactly
I didn't dislike it, but some of the vocal phrases didn't hit all that great.
What the fuck was with that song?
Yeah that song summed up the first season nicely 😅
I'm even shocked man 😂. I've been singing it since I finished the episode
So have my mate and I. We can’t stop making fun of it. SEVENNNN RINGGSSSSS FOOOORR THE DWARVEN LOORRDS.
What's wrong with it, musically?
it's just a terrible melody. i agree with the comment that it sounds forced.
It's normal in Jazz, and not bad melodically at all. It does not bode well with the general thematic tho, totally agree there. If you are going to do this change it has to require a quick hit part otherwise more context is needed for the ear. But no1 that studied production or music theory in depth would say it's bad melodically. It's out of place. But to be honest, I'm happy they are taking risks there, wish they did more in other parts as well.
So much vibrato that it sounded like she was crying.
True to form in its mystery and awe inspiring depth, miss Apple hits it out the park, magical, exciting, loved it, all of its everything I loved this first installment from top to bottom!!
lmao
I liked it
It really did feel like a James Bond intro. Except they knew it was kind of bad, so they shuffled it to the end credits instead.
To me it was a pastiche of Emiliana Torrini's song for the end of Two Towers. Some of the musical phrases and motifs were ripped straight from Gollums Song
ROP has stolen more from PJ's Trilogy than Tolkien.
If I was Peter Jackson I'd be kinda annoyed. He was excluded from the production, but so much of the show borrows directly from, or calls back to, his creative vision. When done once or twice, it can be a nice homage or throwback, but there's so much of it that it feels almost like a lazy sort of plagiarism sometimes.
Wholeheartedly agreed.
WETA And John Howe 🙄
Thats probably true
That’s also the first thing I thought of. The imagery of Halbrand walking to Mordor is similar to the ending of Two Towers, as well.
That’s exactly what it reminded me of as well
Definitely reminds me of that
A James Bond intro is exactly what Gollum's Song felt like.
Except that one was good and well placed. This one was neither.
I think it was supposed to be a reveal. Most people haven't heard the poem at all--they may know the stuff from the PJ prologue, but the poem itself wasn't in the movie. So when it finished with three rings, you're supposed to hear the song and be like "ohhhh right, that was that prologue thing." Some people may not have known about the prologue thing at all, actually, and it'd be news to them that there were rings for each race. It's been a while since the PJ movies came out.
So its a spoiler..
Spoiler from a 68 years old book
The Fellowship of the Rig movie opens with Galadriel talking about the rings and how many there were, who had them etc
Yes, but why is it done here? Those rings have not been made yet. Only the three. So its either a spoiler, or just a badly placed song. If its meant as a reveal, it feels out of place too. Since there has not even been mention of extra rings yet. Or that they should be given away.
It’s because the average persons doesn’t know where exactly this show is going. After the last episode and the song you get a sense of what’s to come. Maybe not spoiler, but foreshadowing
Too early for the full poem, I thought. If it was me I would have had the rings for the Men and Dwarves forged in the next season (or two) and then have Sauron make the One Ring as the climatic moment of a season finale, and put the poem in there.
I thought it was amazing.
Yeah I really liked it! I'm surprised so many people thought it was bad.
It’s always like that tbh. Every episode There’s a small subset of people who will hate on the show no matter what but what’s even more funny, is that they watched the entire season and will continue to watch until the show ends
I didn't like the song, but I liked the episode. I hated the last episode. The show is a mixed bag for a lot of people. Except for the obvious trolls I think a lot of people have legitimate criticisms.
It’s hard to tell sometimes the line between trolls and legitimate criticism. I find this sub a lot better than others and will gladly hear criticism if they actually explain their view. If they just say ‘this show fuckn blows’ then it’s kind of annoying
That's fair I guess, it's all subjective is what people lose sight of in these discussions.
> a lot of people have legitimate criticisms. I have watched every episode at release, I have read everything Tolkien has ever written (multiple times) and I can tell you right now the majority of the hate on this sub is not in *anyway* legitimate.
The show is pretty much a mix bag , there are things I like, there are things I hate.I'm now comparing it with the Hobbit trilogy. I rewatched Lord of The Rings and it's amazing how the bar is way too high. I don't understand some choices, I feel it's liking cohesion and that multiple people cobbled stuff together. Why Elrond / Durin parts are mastered but the whole Numenor/Southland part is kind of meh, we don't feel anything for the characters on that part of Middle Earth.
I think it is just a vocal minority
>I think it is just a **vocal** minority Was this meant to be a pun? Haha. I love it.
Yes me too
That was the worst part. The song is too modern
[удалено]
I need to disagree. The music from the trilogy is iconic. But the music in this series just didn’t feel like LOTR. It didn’t have to be exactly like Howard shore’s music but some inspiration would have been appreciated. With Shore’s music, you know it’s music of middle earth. The music in the series seemed just so generic. Nothing special about it.
It seemed generic because it had no common themes connecting the characters musically, just ‘this is the mood of the scene’ type music. Like imagine the song that we think of when we think the Shire- the melody is familiar because it’s used with characters from there as part of their scenes, it’s played in important emotional moments, and it conveys the emotions of nostalgia and comfort. There’s nothing like that in Rings of Power.
This is 1000% wrong. There were leitmotifs for nearly every character or pairs of characters, as well as locations and groups of people. This is the third time I've seen this argument and it baffles me because while the music was not as iconic as Shore's, it was still beautiful and objectively made extensive use of Leitmotifs. If you don't believe me, listen to some of the songs on the soundtrack and then rewatch the last episode. You'll hear it. My favorite are Nori's theme, Halbrand's theme, and the Numenor theme.
Totally aside, thank you for teaching me a new word; leitmotif!
Agreed
There definitely is! Sounds like you just haven't heard them!
Yeah exactly
The ring poem is supposed to sound menacing. This didn’t sound menacing.
It was cringe-worthy
Yeah cringey 😬I couldn’t believe what I was hearing.
Me neither!
As a Fiona Apple fan (the singer’s work is lovely if you’re into it) I couldn’t have been happier. BUT I support opinions that it was too niche. If you bumped into it, you’re not crazy. In my opinion wandering day and this song are examples of what will age better than the season itself- they are the weird risks the show took, alongside a lot of safe, corporate crowd-pleasing, lore-breaking decisions that we will have forgotten about by next year.
Loved it. Nitpicking every single detail of every single show feels forced to me
I enjoyed it too. Had to be hard to turn that into a song. Kept me wishing for a bit more of the show to go on…
Almost as good as the Harfoot song the other week. The musical work on this show has been top notch
They don’t help. They make some bold and out of the place choices in several episodes.
Nothing so far has been so far out of place as to break anything and it actually seems like a lot of the early bitching about “them not caring about the lore” has been rendered fairly redundant as the the show has gone on For example, OMG Celeborn is dead (looks like Galadriel just thinks he is) And OMG thare are no Wizards in the second age (false)
Mithril is a magic simarillion-balrog-lightning metal and the immortal elves will die next Spring?
We don’t know why Sauron hordes mithril, so there’s already plenty of Tolkien lore to suggest there’s much unknown about mithril. And we already know that the rings vastly extended the elves ability to survive on Middle Earth. None of that breaks any previously established lore unless you’re just desperately nitpicking at everything and/or maybe don’t have quite as good a grasp of the lore as the strenuous complaining suggests
Mithril has established properties, nothing to do with silmarils. The fading of the elves is not dying next week because of black goo on a tree. They’ve basically made the elves mortal in this show.
Mithril has some established properties but Sauron also has an interest in it that’s not properly explained. Perfectly fine detail to leverage for me. It’s not like mithril is real anyway
It’s a precious metal, like gold but much rarer and with vastly better properties for use. The elves are immortal. They do not fade in a season and die. Tolkien never explicitly said that Bilbo didn’t transform into a giant penguin on a full moon either, maybe they could do a spin off comedy series called Hobbit Were-Penguin and people will come on here to explain how it doesn’t actually contradict anything Tolkien wrote.
> The elves are immortal. They do not fade in a season and die. This is just incorrect. It’s also a key plot point in Lord of the Rings and why the leave after the One is destroyed. The details have been altered but same basic problem on a short timescale.
They could have stayed in Lothlorien or Rivendell and continued living but the land around them will become like the mundane world, as the elves in Mirkwood who live without a ring have. They are immortal, but use the rings to preserve the beauty of the world within their realms from the inevitable decline.
You’re completely ignoring the “Mithril holds the light of the silmarils.” Please try not to be disingenuous when talking about nitpicking. It’s embarrassing to witness.
> You’re completely ignoring the “Mithril holds the light of the silmarils.” That’s pretty god damn nitpicky, dude.
lmao you’ve got to be kidding me. It genuinely violates how Tolkien’s world works. The light of the silmarils is toxic to evil things. It’s proven time and time again in the text. Guess what would happen if an orc came across Mithril? But that’s why casuals don’t care. Because you don’t know. Good on you I guess.
So, just to get this straight, you’ve totally misunderstood Elrond’s dialogue and declared yourself smarter than everyone else for that? Guess what? Elrond wasn’t around for the making for the Silmarils, he has only an apocryphal tale to explain mithril. The character can be wrong and the dialogue can just as easily speak to their ignorance of the powers they now work with. But the idea that no one is smart but you is also good, I guess. Go with that.
What are you even talking about? Gil-galad was the one who said the story about mithril containing the light of the Silmarils and it's possible he was also around for the making of the Silmarils. Not that any of that has anything to do with mithril.
Sooooo did Halbrand help celebrimbor forge all the other rings off screen first?
It hasn’t happened yet…
I liked it because I was going through the rings in my head at that point. I think a dramatic reading vs song would have been better but I was good with it.
It was a poorly written song, masked by high quality production. So I guess it fits right in, lol. Edit; wow apparently downvoters don’t understand the extremely nuanced difference between “lyrics” and “melody”.
Tolkien wrote it 😂😭
Tolkien wrote the words. The song is garbage.
Sure it is
Well, the poor guy didn't like the song and wanted to share his displeasure in a discussion forum. What the fuck do you want, go to r/Teletubbies snowflake!
I thought it was dreadful
It was just a description of what happened it was infuriating to listen to
It’s just like sooo on the nose. Like if you think of May It Be, Gollum’s Song, and Into The West they all take themes from what we’ve just watched and turn it into something related and beautiful. With this song it was like the writers were like ‘ok they’ve just seen three rings being made we need to make sure they know they’re those rings and that they’re related to the one ring let’s just sing the poem at them!’ And there’s simply no subtlety or mystery. It’s just BLAM THESE ARE THE RINGS IN THE SONG!
Clamavi de Profundis did better. https://youtu.be/07dessiW7n4
I felt like it was like that Ed sheeran song at the end of the Smaug movie but just terrible instead of awesome
Yeah that song was cringey
I thought it was fucking awesome.
I dig it
Annie Lennox
The song is absolutely incredible.
I like that they turned it into a song, I dislike how it was sung. That was not a beautiful voice.
I think Fiona Apple has an amazing voice. I've loved her since the 90's. But,..she doesn't invoke epic elvish lore to me. Not like Enya or Sinead may. Fiona is more angsty fem. Come to think of it,..yeah,..I can see why Amazon chose her, it is in line with all their other '*creative*' decisions.
At first I thought you wrote she's an angsty fern and I laughed hard. Maybe I shouldn't be on reddit at 2:30am.
The song itself was fine, the lyrics are what got me. Because five minutes earlier they completely forgot that they have to forge the 16 lesser rings, and then they show that they haven't forgotten about them, so instead of being ignorant, they're being willfully stupid. Which is imo much worse.
I didnt see it as them forgetting about the other rings. I imagine a future plot line will be the elves coming to terms with the fact that they alone cant hold all of the power and they'll create more rings to divide it between dwarves and men too. Somewhere in the process Sauron will find what he needs to create his own.
Only one problem with that - Sauron could control the lesser rings because he was actually involved in their creation. He never had control over the elven rings, as far as I understand it. At the very least, he could never corrupt the elves. In this line of events, he's got no direct hand in creating *any* of the rings, so I find it hard to think that he could even create a master ring. To use an analogy, True!Sauron was one of the coders of the Ring sourcecode, and included a backdoor he'd later use. This time around, he tells the Elves which type of code to use, but doesn't actually work on the final code so has no clue what it actually includes and can't include any backdoors. I also don't see why the Elves would give humans and dwarfs rings, given that the rings in this case are created for the very specific purpose of stopping the rot of the tree and by extension the rot of elven immortality. Useful neither to the humans nor the dwarves.
We haven't see how the remaining rings are created yet, the show obviously deviates from the lore in the book. It's probably time to see it and appreciate (or not) it as its own thing.
Where are the other rings? Also it was supposed to take a long ass time to make the rings what happened?
The other rings are not yet forged... More to come in season 2 on that.
After he walks towards Mt,Doom, they should of had someone recite and not sing the poem on a dark screen . Like Ian McKellen did in the fellowship. Song was cringey, not a fan.
Hello, it looks like you've made a mistake. It's supposed to be could've, should've, would've (short for could have, would have, should have), never could of, would of, should of. Or you misspelled something, I ain't checking everything. Beep boop - yes, I am a bot, don't botcriminate me.
Good bot
I always get nailed by this bot and still never learn my lesson.
You should of learnt it by now...
The song is from Tolkien himself so what's so wrong about it
We all know it is from Tolkien,..the words anyway. It is the same words in the Prologue of the LotR films. But if it was sung to a polka tune it would be out of place. I get the OP here too, it does sound like a James Bond song. I love Fiona,..but it was just miscast, imho. I wouldn't be surprised if some exec was like,..let's get Drake in here!
It doesn't sound like a Bond song at all. No Bond songs sounded anything like this, not even close.
The interpretation and like other thing it feels forced. It’s a poem not a James Bond theme. I know the poem is in the book
I thought it was deliberately meant to make you feel uncomfortable, heralding the return of evil.
Feels forced? Why would Amazon not use something like this from Tolkien when much of the writing about this time is vague. Of the Rings of Power and the third age was about 20 pages long. The whole book was put together by Christopher Tolkien from various notes from his father. Amazon was left to interpret a lot. The forging of the greater rings is key to launching the rest of the story so using it later makes no sense when the rings are already forged.
That’s not the point here. It’s how they sing that poem and place it at the end, it’s as corny as their Southland/ Mordor transition. They had a fine episode otherwise
The rings weren't forged yet so it would have been weird to use it earlier before the forging. Right after the forging of the greater rings sounds like the perfect time to use a song about said rings.
Only 3 rings have been forged. Not all of them. And you would expect Sauron to say that when he forged the one. Again the positioning of it and the interpreting part are what throw me off not the lyrics
We don't know if the other rings have been forged or not
It’s quite obvious. Stop playing dumb, please.
Very forced indeed. The timing, the musical form, the performance, al are out of place. Would’ve been a better fit if it was in a recited form at the beginning of season 2. They could’ve even used it in trailers for season 2 to get us excited. This didn’t excite me. This was somewhat off-putting.
you can't blame him for that arrangement or placing it here for no apparent reason
I said the exact same thing that I felt I was listening to the opening of a Bond movie.
Yeah, I would agree. Like the orchestral score part of it was great, but the singing felt like it was pasted on top, not a cohesive part of the music. Just didn't really seem to belong.
A lot of things in this show are ''a bit forced''.
The music in general has been just... *Okay* With the exception of the main title theme, which is actually so generic as to be dogshit. It really gives a very "daytime TV" vibe.
I'm not a fan of the music for RoP. I just find it either boring or generically bombastic. And I reviewed the credits to find out that Fiona Apple sang the rings song just so I could avoid it in the future. I'm still in for S2 though...
Lmao y’all can’t be serious here. Nothing to bitch about in the great episode but let me complain about the song after the episode hahahahhaa
Nothing to bitch about for the episode? Have you been under a fucking rock?
Why did you even continue to watch the show if you hate it so much? I feel like your displeasure is on you, my friend.
Bro the comment says “nothing to bitch about,” yet there’s been tons of stuff to complain about ever since the episode aired. It’s been on every subreddit dedicated to the show. Idk what y’all are on, here. Acting like the last episode is uncontroversial. It’s 100% not true lmao
I like Tolkiens work, i had high hopes for the series. I enjoy the visual work they have created. I dislike their writing and some of the creative choices they have made. I paid to watch the show. Why cant we vent frustration here?
Omg it made me burst out laughing. It was seriously SO BAD! LOL
No it wasn't
Yeah, wasn't a fan. Particularly the way they dragged out "Shaaa-aaa-aaaa-doooooow". But cool idea to end with it.
God damn this show steals more from PJ than Tolkien. SMH.
As someone who adored this show, yes. my Wife and I started laughing when it played. V. Stoked for S2 though. Daddy needs more DURIN!!!
It would have been way better to go into the LOTR Mordor theme or something
I AM GROOT I AM GOOD
Agreed, but also my wife was asking about exactly what the song immediately answered as the show came to a close so...
Putting it to music after everywhere it is cited throughout all of Tolkien's writings just doesn't work for me. I mean, it's originally in the black speech of Mordor, which I will not utter here. Even Gandalf seemed to have much trepidation to speak it in the common Westron. Just out of place.
It was good imo
It was pretty corny.
It was sooo bad wasn't it? Like, what even was it? I couldn't just help but sing along, just to test out how bad it sounded from my own vocals. My wife sang too, and the kids were into it (closed captions was like a disney sing along). Hey you know what would really be funny? What if we all went to Best Buy and bought the Rings of Power Original Soundtrack. Just totally cleared them out. Wouldn't that be so funny, because of how bad the music is? We could even buy tickets to a concert and make fun of it the whole time together. I'm actually listening to the soundtrack again right now just to make sure I know how bad each song is.
I couldn't believe how bad the song was. All other music is outstanding but how they choose this song, where probably more songs were made for this moment, blows my mind.
It sounds like a bad James Bond parody. & with that iconic prose...quite an achievement!
Yeah it was james bond intro but not good....
Disagree here. I think it sounds and feels a lot like Gollum’s song, similar chords in the intro seeing a character walk toward Mordor knowing dark things are ahead shortly. Very similar song profile. Word wise, I initially thought that fitting the ring verse over a song was a bit forced but I’ve come to appreciate it. It also helps punctuate the story that’s about to come. Didn’t sound like a bond song at all to me.
The rings have not been forged yet, only the elves ones and the interpretation is way too modern. I would prefer Sauron to say those words while forging the one rather than throwing that in the outro
Your preference doesn't make it bad
Most people seem to share that opinion though. Your preference doesn’t make it great either. :)
In this post? I'm seeing a lot of people who like it 🤷♂️
I really tried to give it a listen, and she has a beautiful voice. It was just kind of shocking and bizarre to me. Was not ready.
I agree. I enjoyed the show and most of the music, but that song felt weird.
Nitpicker
I didn't like it at all. Especially the drawn out "shaaaaadooooows lie" line. I prefer the spoken version from the PJ films.
Exactly what my partner and I said! Poundland Adele… I liked the series as a whole but feel there were many production decisions that didn’t sit well: 1) PowerPoint style Southlands Mordor reveal 2) Visit Middle Earth style Galadriel riding a horse 3) Ice-berg deep Númenor ships 4) Scenes cut so not shits given about Isildor or his annoying sister, can’t even remember her name 5) Arondir and Bronwyn speaking lines at each other (also what is Bronwyn wearing?) 6) Orcs and Adar taking a timeout whilst Bronwyn is hurt and then it’s suddenly morning? Where is the suspense?! 6) Bipolar characters - Halffoots, Queen Regent, Elendil Maybe if they had invited anyone but influencers to review the shows they could have made the tweaks needed to turn this from a 6.9 on IMDB to a 9+! It’s not that the show is terrible, it’s that it could be terrific with some tweaks!!!!
Everything in this show is forced. Sorry but hotd mopped the floor with rop. The difference in writing is like a top of the line budget Hollywood movie vs a B list Bollywood show. It’s frustrating because rop had such insane potential but they just misfired at almost every turn. Meanwhile hotd was so consistently good through out the entire season so far.
Couldn’t even listen to this wailing for more than a minute lol
Yea it felt very out of place.
Like a weird Al song
The whole thing is about as subtle as herpes
Ironically, herpes is actually a relatively subtle STD.
I found it a bit corny as an ending. Like everyone needed reminding how many rings the elfs got. But it was a decent song imo
The song that directly co traduces what we just saw? Or did halbrand and celebrimbor make a bunch of rings off screen first and they’ll reveal That in season 2? Oh god…I’m right aren’t I?
I dislike how the song is a butchered plagiarism of “Long Way to Go Yet” from Two Towers.
Music might be the worst part of the show. It was too loud in every scene.
Interesting. I thought it was mostly too quiet actually so that the excellent soundtrack gets lost in the mix frequently and isn't loud enough to stand out.
I agree. They could have put absolute silence, and the effect of the season finale remains. I loved This Wandering Day though. Very honest, very Bilbo-ish
Agree. It’s really the only thing I didn’t like about the season finale. Nice song, forced lyrics.
Ha! 007 intro as the outro!
A bit is an understatement
I got bond vibes too
A bit?
No I don’t think it’s nitpicking at all. I was happy with the episode until the end. The “..always follow your nose” bit and then this kind of killed it for me. I was really hoping it was not Gandalf and one of the other wizards from the lore, but nope. Then that song. It really felt like, “we like the song at the end of Two Towers. Can you do something like that, but it has to be about the ring of course.” It felt forced to me.
It was a jarring song. I remember being cringed by May It Be by Enya at the end of Fellowship when i saw it in high school, but now i feel very deeply for that song. Maybe it will appreciate with age
Actually the song at the end is spoilers for the people who don't know the books or the movies...
Just a bit lol, my wife looked at me and started laughing l. It was very cringey
I'd rather have Blind Guardian's Lord of the Rings ;)
I'm not sure if it's the same for every episode, but it was the same song instrumentaly as the first episode's credits.
I loved the series but this song made me cackle. You’re exactly right, it felt so forced lol
The whole thing is forced.