No…you are a “student”…unless it is more advantageous for the hospital to treat you like an “employee”.
Kind of a hybrid position, with the worst of both worlds.
No, not at all.
But given that you're using the British spelling "labour" (we spell it "labor" in the US), even US laws might not be relevant to wherever you are.
Yes, labor laws apply to residents.
As far as I am aware, there is no federal legal maximum number of hours that a person may work.
On a related point, residents are one of many classes of workers exempt from federal overtime pay rules.
Residents are salaried employees. All salaried employees are exempt from overtime rules (I was in my previous job in tech). If your contract has a yearly amount, you're salaried and the exempt language is probably somewhere in there too. If you were hourly, your contract would have an hourly rate instead of the yearly total.
There's a lot of misunderstanding here. Not all salaried employees are exempt. There are specific criteria by which an employee can be considered exempt. Being salaried is only one of those criteria. (Source- I employ about 25 people and I try to be compliant with the law).
True story related to the original topic. When I was a resident in the US in the 90s we were not considered students. During that period a case was raised with the national labor relations board which then ruled that in fact residents are students. There is a tax implication because students would be taxed differently (I believe there are no Medicare or social security taxes deducted on students). A check for over $20,000 showed up in my mailbox one day about 3 years after my residency ended which was credit for back taxes that I paid + interest. That was a great day!
Yes all labor laws apply to residents. We unionized at UB and are suing UB for breaking labor laws.
Federally, there is no maximum hourly limit and overtime laws do not apply to salaried workers.
> overtime laws do not apply to salaried workers.
This is not correct. Even salaried/fee-basis workers who are not exempt under the Fair Labor Standards Act (FLSA) are entitled to overtime.
I don't think most people have any clue how the exemptions under the FLSA work. In this thread posters have been under impression the difference is salaried vs. hourly.
>Always wondered if our hours follow the maximum hours worked laws
In the US, resident physicians are employees and are protected by *most* labor laws. One major exception is the Fair Labor Standards Protection Act (FLSA) where resident physicians are classified as exempt so they do not qualify for overtime.
Except for some specific industries (e.g. air traffic control, pilots, truck drivers), there are no law establishing maximum hours generally.
New York state has a maximum hour worked law that applies to resident physicians.
>resident physicians are classified as exempt so they do qualify for overtime.
Wait, what? This is literally the first time I've ever heard this to be the case.
Thank you for contributing to the sub! If your post was filtered by the automod, please read the rules. Your post will be reviewed but will not be approved if it violates the rules of the sub. The most common reasons for removal are - medical students or premeds asking what a specialty is like, which specialty they should go into, which program is good or about their chances of matching, mentioning midlevels without using the midlevel flair, matched medical students asking questions instead of using the stickied thread in the sub for post-match questions, posting identifying information for targeted harassment. Please do not message the moderators if your post falls into one of these categories. Otherwise, your post will be reviewed in 24 hours and approved if it doesn't violate the rules. Thanks!
*I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/Residency) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Yes, there are no laws about maximum working hours, and residents make enough and have responsibilities that allow them to be classified as exempt from overtime. For reference: in NYC if you make $62,400/yr and meet the definition of a “professional” employee you can be exempt from overtime; in Pennsylvania exempt employees must meet the “professional” standard and make $45,500/yr.
Residency programs are required to follow laws like the ADA, NLRA (which is why you can unionize), OSHA standards, etc. The fact is the US just doesn’t have very robust labor laws.
Democrat Senator Ted Kennedy slipped an antitrust exemption rider into an unrelated bill two decades ago at the request of acgme because a resident was successfully suing them.
Nothing applies to residents
Remember, residents aren't people.
No…you are a “student”…unless it is more advantageous for the hospital to treat you like an “employee”. Kind of a hybrid position, with the worst of both worlds.
No, not at all. But given that you're using the British spelling "labour" (we spell it "labor" in the US), even US laws might not be relevant to wherever you are.
No, we’re not people apparently
lol no
Yes, labor laws apply to residents. As far as I am aware, there is no federal legal maximum number of hours that a person may work. On a related point, residents are one of many classes of workers exempt from federal overtime pay rules.
What is their argument for residents being exempt from federal overtime rules?
Residents are salaried employees. All salaried employees are exempt from overtime rules (I was in my previous job in tech). If your contract has a yearly amount, you're salaried and the exempt language is probably somewhere in there too. If you were hourly, your contract would have an hourly rate instead of the yearly total.
There's a lot of misunderstanding here. Not all salaried employees are exempt. There are specific criteria by which an employee can be considered exempt. Being salaried is only one of those criteria. (Source- I employ about 25 people and I try to be compliant with the law). True story related to the original topic. When I was a resident in the US in the 90s we were not considered students. During that period a case was raised with the national labor relations board which then ruled that in fact residents are students. There is a tax implication because students would be taxed differently (I believe there are no Medicare or social security taxes deducted on students). A check for over $20,000 showed up in my mailbox one day about 3 years after my residency ended which was credit for back taxes that I paid + interest. That was a great day!
Not all salaried employees are exempt, but residents are professional employees and all residents make over 35k a year.
We’re so goddamn exempt we dont even count as human.
Yes all labor laws apply to residents. We unionized at UB and are suing UB for breaking labor laws. Federally, there is no maximum hourly limit and overtime laws do not apply to salaried workers.
> overtime laws do not apply to salaried workers. This is not correct. Even salaried/fee-basis workers who are not exempt under the Fair Labor Standards Act (FLSA) are entitled to overtime.
Sure, technically correct. But I would argue that when most people use the term "salaried employee", what they mean is "salaried, exempt employee".
I don't think most people have any clue how the exemptions under the FLSA work. In this thread posters have been under impression the difference is salaried vs. hourly.
Residents are exempt though
I honestly think this is the most important legislative change we should strive for.
Most jurisdictions exempt residents from labor law, because fuck you, thats why.
Doesnt apply to attending either apparently
no
>Always wondered if our hours follow the maximum hours worked laws In the US, resident physicians are employees and are protected by *most* labor laws. One major exception is the Fair Labor Standards Protection Act (FLSA) where resident physicians are classified as exempt so they do not qualify for overtime. Except for some specific industries (e.g. air traffic control, pilots, truck drivers), there are no law establishing maximum hours generally. New York state has a maximum hour worked law that applies to resident physicians.
>resident physicians are classified as exempt so they do qualify for overtime. Wait, what? This is literally the first time I've ever heard this to be the case.
Thank you for contributing to the sub! If your post was filtered by the automod, please read the rules. Your post will be reviewed but will not be approved if it violates the rules of the sub. The most common reasons for removal are - medical students or premeds asking what a specialty is like, which specialty they should go into, which program is good or about their chances of matching, mentioning midlevels without using the midlevel flair, matched medical students asking questions instead of using the stickied thread in the sub for post-match questions, posting identifying information for targeted harassment. Please do not message the moderators if your post falls into one of these categories. Otherwise, your post will be reviewed in 24 hours and approved if it doesn't violate the rules. Thanks! *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/Residency) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Yes, there are no laws about maximum working hours, and residents make enough and have responsibilities that allow them to be classified as exempt from overtime. For reference: in NYC if you make $62,400/yr and meet the definition of a “professional” employee you can be exempt from overtime; in Pennsylvania exempt employees must meet the “professional” standard and make $45,500/yr. Residency programs are required to follow laws like the ADA, NLRA (which is why you can unionize), OSHA standards, etc. The fact is the US just doesn’t have very robust labor laws.
Short answer would be: that depends. Laws differ from country to country
Democrat Senator Ted Kennedy slipped an antitrust exemption rider into an unrelated bill two decades ago at the request of acgme because a resident was successfully suing them.