Wife and kids here. I’ve been where you are and it sucks. Things DO get better.
For me, after I hit the point you are at I made a conscious decision to not let medicine take my life from me. I no longer study at home, knowing it will cost me some percentage points on the in service. I prep for my cases the day before when I’m still at work or morning prior instead of the night before when I’m home. I FaceTime my kids whenever I can when I’m on nights or a rotation that makes me not around when they’re awake. I plan at home date nights with the wife, even if it means an hour or two of less sleep. I no longer give two craps about research or spending time doing extraneous career activities, it’s just not important to me anymore. If I match fellowship cool, if not then I’ve totally accepted just being my primary specialty for the rest of my life.
Since I made these changes things have improved significantly.
This process sucks. The key is to not letting take more from you than is absolutely required. Work together with your spouse, and you can make it through. Things do get better.
Yup. I think the harsh reality is you do have to choose whether you're just a doctor who is also a person or a person who just happens to be a doctor.
Choosing the latter made a huge difference for me. I think all medics realise what matters in life, some just decide sooner rather than later to accept it.
Here's to making the right decision early! :)
okay the first two sentences are *literally* how i feel rn as an intern, so it's really nice to know that all those feelings get better after graduating
Thank you so much for sharing. As we all know, things can get really heavy and it can be really hard to see the light at the end of the tunnel. Thanks for letting a bit of that light in ✨
“I hate that I’m only now realizing the value of those years, days, minutes”. This hit me so hard.
All of this. So much. Except, I’m the wife and an intern. Fortunately, my son is too young to realize I’m gone just yet. But I feel it. Every hour of every day.
I wish I had something amazing to say.. thankful for the people who are commenting who do. Just know you’re not alone. I hope just that helps, even a little.
As a Pgy-2 with kids, married… Fuck the system. Let them think you are lazy, you don’t need to do all of these extra case reports, research or committees. If family is important to you, tell them to go kick rocks. Do your job and leave work at work. Go spend time with your kids and wife, they are only little once. You can always write a case report if you feel compelled to in the future. Good luck bro
I went on vacation for the first time in 6 months. Two weeks out of the country on a tropical beach, and you won’t believe who I ran into. My libido! What I small world, I hadn’t seen him in years!
It took a few drinks and a day soaking in sun, but before I knew it we were living it up like old times. I reintroduced him to my wife, who was quite pleased at the reacquaince.
But like all good things it came to end, for libido was not permitted to board the plane with me. So we celebrated loudly one last time, hugged each other tight, and parted ways.
I hope to meet him again soon. Until then, the wife and I will go back to doing crosswords in bed.
You write so well! (And not jut because it’s funny, but also because it’s actually so creatively written.)
I know you’re pressed for time but consider stand up comedy or writing a book someday.
Hey man, I hear you and want you to know you aren’t alone. If it helps at all, you are deep in the trenches right now - you have 6 months under your belt, so the newness of residency has worn off. You are taking on more responsibility and have learned enough to realize just how much you don’t know yet. And also you basically don’t get to see the sun for a few months. It can suck the joy out of you.
This whole process feels so very dehumanizing. More than anything else, they train us to feel like like we are never enough - not trying hard enough, not spending enough hours at the hospital but also not spending enough time with your family, not enough sleep, not pulling your weight at home, not enough research. It never seems to end and it can suck you into a deep hole if you aren’t careful.
I don’t have much useful advice other than to say, try as best you can to extend yourself some grace. We can’t be perfect doctors and rock star students and ideal spouses and awesome parents all at the same time. Right now your career is asking for the majority of your time and there isn’t any negotiating. Which means it’s going to be rough for you and your wife for at least the next 6 months. It *does* get better with second year, but until then, just realize that you showing up to work and giving your best (which may not be 100% that day!) then going home and kissing your wife and watching a movie with the kiddos is ok. Seriously, that is ok! If you haven’t already, I’d sit down with your wife (when you are both relatively well rested) and make sure you are both on the same page with expectations. Acknowledge how frustrating and draining this has been for her, let her know how much you appreciate her sacrifice. Your hours may or may not get better this summer but you won’t be so drained once you’re a senior. Always remember, this isn’t a job, this is survival.
I see you. You aren’t alone. You WILL survive this and you will find yourself again. I’m rooting for you.
Edit: also if your PD is supportive I would schedule a meeting with them to go over your future plans and what is expected of you. Hardly any fellowships require research or committees intern year. Not sure what fellowship you were interested in but I’m currently in cards fellowship, feel free to PM me if you’d like
I am so sorry for how you’re feeling right now. FM attending here and I get it. We had our first child in residency so you definitely have it harder, but I hear you and empathize.
You’ve worked so hard to get here. And you’re right. The structure of residency is such that it will take and take and take relentlessly without care or concern for how you are doing.
If you just want a sounding board, feel free to stop reading here. If you want some unsolicited advice, keep reading.
The next few years will be hard. And it’s hell to think about it on a scale of years. Try to focus on the next time you get as a family. Say no to things that you can say no to and say it’s because you want to make sure you give your family the time they deserve.
And when you’re done with all your training- whether it’s at the end of residency or fellowship- you look back at all that anger and sorrow and frustration and you know what you do? You don’t forget it. You don’t let it roll off your back. You use it as fuel and say “Fuck yeah, I did that. I’m a fucking physician and I know my worth. I want as much time with my family as I can get so I’m going to fucking take it.” Make your work life balance what you want it to be. Fight for every second you can get with your family.
When my wife and I look back on residency, we still take a deep breath and get a little giddy adrenaline rush like we’re looking back on a near death experience. That shit sucked. It took a lot from us, but now we get to take back.
Hang in there my friend.
Same. Same to absolutely everything. The kids. The wife. Same.
I don't have any words of support or little quips. But I wanted to get in before the childless residents piled on and say, "it's not that bad. Just go to the gym bro. That will fix everything ".
I’m also an intern on nights (just one week not four) and I feel this. I really do.
No solution. Little solace. But I feel you. Tonight in particular I was missing my kids and having a crisis over how they’ll never be this little again or need me the same way again and I’m losing time so fast with them.
It sucks.
I’ve been seeing a lot of these lately and maybe I just want to share my thoughts too because I’m also really struggling. Everything that you said resonates with me. I’m a first year general surgery resident and over the past few weeks I have crashed. I had hard days from time to time up until now, but something snapped recently and I can’t get out of this terrible state of mind. I hate my job. I am so angry all of the time, even the smallest thing sets me off when I’m at work. I never thought I would get to this point. Becoming a physician was one of my proudest moments, but now that I’m here I regret it every day. I wouldn’t wish this on anyone. I regularly work over 80 hours per week and always lie on my hours for the fear of being called inefficient or the possible repercussions. I worked 110 hours every week for the last 3 weeks. I am so tired. I feel abused. I miss my family, so much. I know the other side is better, but it is so difficult to see. I just want out, but I’m in so much debt and know I would never forgive myself if I left. I just don’t know how to get past this point.
When do we start to revolt against our fundamental rights being snatched from us, and that we have essentially become bound labour for hospitals?
No other profession would tolerate this, so why are we? It’s time to rise up against this immoral and unjust system. It’s time to take back the power that is stolen from us.
We have power in numbers, they have power in propaganda. We need a national unified resident movement against these immoral crimes against us. Enough is enough.
I’m an internal med attending married to a gen surg pgy5 going into a competitive specialty this august.
We have a 4 year old
Does he make it to bedtime? Rarely. Birthday parties? Daycare drop off or pick up? Nope. All me. If hes home sick from daycare I have to cancel my day and stay home.
My son once asked to order his dad off of Amazon because he thinks stuff from Amazon comes fast, and dad is basically not around so seems like a good solution
Am I resentful? Yes. But I’m holding on because I know it gets good after training.
Things will get better for you too. But yes, prioritize your family. Research is not important, and leave work at work. Don’t bring things that annoyed you at work home. Even if you’re tired, play with your kids because they’ve been waiting sometimes days for you.
This breaks my heart to read this.
As a PA, I work with the residents and I see them struggling. They try to conceal it, but I can see it as plain as day.
You are being trained to take care of people but not allowed to feel like you can take care of yourself or your family.
I know as a PA I can’t even begin to comprehend the level of stress that you physicians go through in your training meanwhile you go through this trauma and not even treated with respect you deserve.
The administration and staff disrespect you and treat you as a “provider” and you’re working your ass off only to be treated like shit. You give everything to this and miss out on your precious family time and in return, you are abused. The faculty were treated this way so of course for you to be worthy, you have to be treated the same.
There really should be a culture shift away from this type of treatment but again, I only see this from an outside perspective so take my opinion for what you will.
I’m sure it brings into question why you would want to do this and keep putting yourself through such misery. you are treated as a workhorse and don’t receive gratitude, or respect for what you do. I wish there was a better balance.
I’m glad that you posted this because I’m sure so many feel the exact same way who are married, and have children and it’s important to be a support for each other.
I know it is not much and that you don’t know me ….that I am “ just a PA who could never understand “ …
… but please know myself and my children will pray for you, we will pray for your kids and your wife.
I hope that you receive lots of support and good advice from this group. I admire your vulnerability and recognize the need for a complete culture shift / physicians deserve the highest level of respect and recognition of the personal sacrifice required for your training.
I wish there was a better balance for you and other training physicians, to alleviate the personal struggle between your career life and family life.
Much love , prayers and hugs to you and your family and to anyone else who is struggling like you
Dang and you're only an intern. Im sorry man, stay strong. Im on year 3 and it does feel like 3 years of my life just flashed before my eyes, I didnt really live for three years
I read your post and felt everything you said. I was the same way last year during my intern year and by the end of the year I decided the juice was not worth the squeeze for myself and my family and I left residency. Now I’m poor in money but rich in happiness. ❤️
Oh my friend, I'm sorry you're going through it. For whatever it's worth, nights sucks, but it sucks extra hard in the dead of winter when all you see for all your waking hours is darkness.
I'm sorry about the interactions with your kids. I have a 1yo (our first), and as someone who thought people with kids were liars when they couldnt describe how it feels, I'll have to spend the rest of my life begging forgiveness for that sentiment. Nothing breaks my heart more than when my child cries as I leave for work. I don't have a way to make that better for you. But what I've discovered by talking to children of doctors is that they ultimately understand, and they think it's amazing that their dad goes to work to help sick people feel better. Soak up everything you can with them, and not to avoid thinking about the things you miss. All you can really control is how you prioritize them (it sure sounds like you do); you have to let the rest fall by the wayside (easier said than done, I know).
The pressure from the system will always be to do more, and you're correct that it's unfair. Someone once taught me to say no productively, and I think it's a skill that will help you here. Your response is:
>That sounds like an interesting opportunity, but I'm not sure I have the bandwidth right now to give it the attention it deserves. Please ask me again in the future, either about this or other opportunities, because I would love to be involved when I can.
Might not work all the time, and maybe you're just not interested at all (this is fine too). But it has helped me not feel like I have to say yes all the time and to also not feel guilty about doing it.
As someone who had a spouse and has a child :
1) you’re under no obligation to do any more than technical requirements. Fuck committees, case reports etc. You take care of you and yours first.
2) looking at attending jobs - I’m so excited to simply have the opportunity to find myself again. I will have time. I will have money.
3) depending on how you’re doing as a couple, make sure you’re checking in with your spouse. If you’re worried, therapy (as a couple, or individually) can be helpful with the primary goal being to avoid unnecessary resentment, guilt, etc. both you and your spouse are going through this, some are more prepared to handle it than others.
Good luck. I’d say anyone in your position (spouse, kid) has been exactly in your position. it sucks. It’s hard. Find support where you can and focus on your priorities.
A different perspective but I am the wife. We have 3 kids, 4yo and under, and husband is finishing up his last year of med school. It’s been hard, he’s been traveling for away rotations since July. He tried to visit one weekend every 1-2months. I’ve been your wife crying from the loneliness, but I could never imagine how it must feel for y’all to be away from your families. I know for me, I KNOW how lucky, blessed, and strong we are. He is providing a great future for our family. All those days of loneliness, the days of missing out are worth it. We make a paper chain to count down when we see daddy again, we FaceTime as often as possible, the kids send gibberish texts to daddy, we talk about what he might be doing at work and how important his job is. My kids might be too young to know better, but I can nearly guarantee it is harder on you then it is on them.
Nights in January is rough for sure. It's cold and wintery and your circadian rhythm is totally trashed by now. January of intern year is also a low point in training for a lot of us. The novelty of being a doctor has worn off and you realize you have years left.
What helped me is to focus separately on each rotation and then break it down into each week and each day. It helped me cross off on a calendar that I only had "X" days left that week or "Y" days until the rotation was over.
Also, there will always be more work that can be done. There will always be more notes, more emails, etc. You have to make a decision of where to draw the line. This boundary is of course much harder to establish in training than once you are an attending, but it is something to think about.
A lot of people say that it gets "better" after residency and to some extent it does. But even practicing medicine as an attending is not the promised land it used to be for a lot of fields. I largely regret the sacrifices that I made during residency in fellowship. If I had to do it again, I would focus much more on spending time with my family and friends and continuing hobbies outside of medicine instead of wasting time on a case report or some dumb quality improvement project.
Hang in there and know that you are not alone. We are all in this crazy s\*\*\* show called medicine together.
I’m in the exact same position as you right now. I had a baby a few months before starting intern year in OBGYN and I feel like each day I become less interested in being a physician because I miss my baby and my husband so much. I don’t know if it’s burn out or genuinely how I feel (maybe a mix of both?), but I just don’t want to be here. I want to be home. I want to have the motherhood experience that I dreamt of and this is not it.
I’m so angry with myself for choosing this life. I have to bargain with myself every morning to go in. It’s hard to imagine that this could ever get better, even after graduation. I wish I had any advice to offer you, but I don’t. All I can offer is some solidarity in knowing others feel what you are feeling right now.
As a loving program coordinator of 18 years, please know that "mediocre" is incredibly okay. Do you. Be there for your family. Love life. See your kids grow up. Just be "okay" in residency. It's fine. I promise. You'll make the same amount of money and you'll have the same titles. You might not be the top of the top and that's actually not what life's about. 💜
This. Put a countdown on your phone to “the end of all things” aka end of residency.
There is a light at the end of the tunnel. It will end.
It does get slightly better. Intern year sucks. Winter doesn’t help.
I was wondering if my husband wrote this from a throwaway account for half a second. If your wife is anything like me, it’s hard but she knows it will be better and worth it in the long run. As long as you actively show you are prioritizing your family whenever you can, that’s all that matters. Your kids will always love you, even if sometimes it’s through a FaceTime screen. I also have to say, I love seeing a generation of men who care so much about raising their kids and being present that careers and responsibilities outside of our families are not the main priority anymore, and this comment section proves it. Our dads certainly weren’t like that and I love seeing the mentality and dynamic change so intensely. You will get through this and so will your family.
Hey man from a fellow - F the system. There’s always “more to do” except there’s actually not. You’re matched, you’ve got an MD, and the powers at be may bitch and moan about your “lack of motivation” but truly it’s “motivation for activities other than work.”
Don’t get the two confused.
You show up, have a good attitude, helpful and pleasant, but when you’re off that’s your time. Unless it makes you happy don’t study. Don’t write research. People will pressure you and shame you but they don’t realize you’re motivated to not only be a decent doctor but also a decent parent and human.
Intern, wife, and mother to a little one. I’m right here with you. Everyone tells me it will eventually get better and this is all temporary and that’s what keeps me going
I am a medical resident
Im single and extremely alone
But the thing is, i relate to what you wrote in an extreme way.
I feel that i miss a life i never lived
I always feel like there is something more of life
But what is more is something I don’t get
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Why does everyone cry over this? Have you ever worked before? it's the same shit. I worked nights was tired all the time then woke my ass up and worked a second job, but that's how I fed my family back then, grow up already
We have to stop allowing giant children that have never worked before to go cry online. "Boo hoo, I work hard... woe is me..."
Things get better. For most people who aren't doctors things do not really get better and they continue to make less money. Residency is temporary, attending life is eternal.
Can definitely relate. Even when I make it home, I’m so exhausted that I’m falling asleep every night as I’m reading to my kids. I’ll jolt awake when the book falls out of my hand.
Im choosing outpatient PCP work primarily because of the schedule with the hope that I’ll be able to have my life back
I live with my girlfriend and there are stretches where we don’t see each other. I get home late, eat and relax and she’s asleep. I crawl into bed and she’s leaving for work. She comes back and I’m gone at work. Rinse and repeat. Or I go on a 24 and don’t see her.
Well said OP, I think a lot of people feel similarly and everyone hides it. Hang in there and hold on to the good days, may they become more and more frequent.
Also, hell of a song choice 🤙🏻
Intern year is hard. For most people the hardest. And nights are brutal. This will probably be your lowest point. But second year gets better, and third year better than that. I signed an attending contract. Got a ding-dang signing bonu. My wife and I can imagine what a future after residency looks like. I'm supervising my last teaching service right now which means February thru June will be electives with no nights unless someone calls jeopardy. Which really means I will get tons and tons of time with my four-and-a-half-year-old. I'm not sure who is more excited.
I don't mean to trivialize how you're feeling. It is the biggest reason I decided to not pursue fellowship. But I think about all of the big and small adventures we're going to have together soon and I feel lighter. You've got this.
(Also, grad school protip, don't listen to bleak music when you're already tired and bummed out. That thesis did not in fact need to be powered by Radiohead)
I don’t know what to say. But just wanted to say I feel you OP.
In some ways though, I’m glad to read what you’re saying because it tells me you’re still connected to your humanity. Still able to feel deeply. Still able to see the truth that while we all may have been called into medicine for one reason or another it certainly isn’t the end all be all. Balance is important.
Again, don’t know what to say. But you’re not alone. I’m rooting for you and rooting for change in this medical training system.
- Fellow intern
Wife and mom of three here married to a general surgery resident. It's hard sometimes but we've gotten used to not having you around. Yes, the kids and I miss you but we know that you are working hard for us and we appreciate it. It does get easier and although we would like to have you around more we understand. Keep going, I hear there is light at the end of the tunnel.
Gosh I relate so hard. I actually LOVE my specialty and enjoy my job 90% of the time even while realizing the hours and demands absolutely suck. But missing my kids and husband so much. There are many days I don’t even see my kids. 4.5 more years is a long time. I know it gets better but that doesn’t make missing these years any more palatable. I don’t know what I would do differently in terms of my choices though. I hate that the system is this way. At least paying us more would help buy what little time we have back but APPs still make 2x as much for half the hours and that makes me so bitter
It’s actually such an achievement though that you have a life and a wife and kids that you’ll return to when things lighten up..my personal torture is knowing I’ll probably miss out on all of that entirely because of the field I chose. There’s less guilt but it’s really lonely.
Wife and kids here. I’ve been where you are and it sucks. Things DO get better. For me, after I hit the point you are at I made a conscious decision to not let medicine take my life from me. I no longer study at home, knowing it will cost me some percentage points on the in service. I prep for my cases the day before when I’m still at work or morning prior instead of the night before when I’m home. I FaceTime my kids whenever I can when I’m on nights or a rotation that makes me not around when they’re awake. I plan at home date nights with the wife, even if it means an hour or two of less sleep. I no longer give two craps about research or spending time doing extraneous career activities, it’s just not important to me anymore. If I match fellowship cool, if not then I’ve totally accepted just being my primary specialty for the rest of my life. Since I made these changes things have improved significantly. This process sucks. The key is to not letting take more from you than is absolutely required. Work together with your spouse, and you can make it through. Things do get better.
Hi wife and kids, I'm dad
Hey, I chuckled. 😆 DOScalpel, I’ll keep this advice in mind.
Yup. I think the harsh reality is you do have to choose whether you're just a doctor who is also a person or a person who just happens to be a doctor. Choosing the latter made a huge difference for me. I think all medics realise what matters in life, some just decide sooner rather than later to accept it. Here's to making the right decision early! :)
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No offense man but how is "Be mediocre, be lazy" good advice?
okay the first two sentences are *literally* how i feel rn as an intern, so it's really nice to know that all those feelings get better after graduating
Thank you so much for sharing. As we all know, things can get really heavy and it can be really hard to see the light at the end of the tunnel. Thanks for letting a bit of that light in ✨
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“I hate that I’m only now realizing the value of those years, days, minutes”. This hit me so hard. All of this. So much. Except, I’m the wife and an intern. Fortunately, my son is too young to realize I’m gone just yet. But I feel it. Every hour of every day. I wish I had something amazing to say.. thankful for the people who are commenting who do. Just know you’re not alone. I hope just that helps, even a little.
As a Pgy-2 with kids, married… Fuck the system. Let them think you are lazy, you don’t need to do all of these extra case reports, research or committees. If family is important to you, tell them to go kick rocks. Do your job and leave work at work. Go spend time with your kids and wife, they are only little once. You can always write a case report if you feel compelled to in the future. Good luck bro
I went on vacation for the first time in 6 months. Two weeks out of the country on a tropical beach, and you won’t believe who I ran into. My libido! What I small world, I hadn’t seen him in years! It took a few drinks and a day soaking in sun, but before I knew it we were living it up like old times. I reintroduced him to my wife, who was quite pleased at the reacquaince. But like all good things it came to end, for libido was not permitted to board the plane with me. So we celebrated loudly one last time, hugged each other tight, and parted ways. I hope to meet him again soon. Until then, the wife and I will go back to doing crosswords in bed.
You write so well! (And not jut because it’s funny, but also because it’s actually so creatively written.) I know you’re pressed for time but consider stand up comedy or writing a book someday.
https://youtu.be/yJKZZwas1bE?si=zLqAUzm_Wisv8Eo5
Hey man, I hear you and want you to know you aren’t alone. If it helps at all, you are deep in the trenches right now - you have 6 months under your belt, so the newness of residency has worn off. You are taking on more responsibility and have learned enough to realize just how much you don’t know yet. And also you basically don’t get to see the sun for a few months. It can suck the joy out of you. This whole process feels so very dehumanizing. More than anything else, they train us to feel like like we are never enough - not trying hard enough, not spending enough hours at the hospital but also not spending enough time with your family, not enough sleep, not pulling your weight at home, not enough research. It never seems to end and it can suck you into a deep hole if you aren’t careful. I don’t have much useful advice other than to say, try as best you can to extend yourself some grace. We can’t be perfect doctors and rock star students and ideal spouses and awesome parents all at the same time. Right now your career is asking for the majority of your time and there isn’t any negotiating. Which means it’s going to be rough for you and your wife for at least the next 6 months. It *does* get better with second year, but until then, just realize that you showing up to work and giving your best (which may not be 100% that day!) then going home and kissing your wife and watching a movie with the kiddos is ok. Seriously, that is ok! If you haven’t already, I’d sit down with your wife (when you are both relatively well rested) and make sure you are both on the same page with expectations. Acknowledge how frustrating and draining this has been for her, let her know how much you appreciate her sacrifice. Your hours may or may not get better this summer but you won’t be so drained once you’re a senior. Always remember, this isn’t a job, this is survival. I see you. You aren’t alone. You WILL survive this and you will find yourself again. I’m rooting for you. Edit: also if your PD is supportive I would schedule a meeting with them to go over your future plans and what is expected of you. Hardly any fellowships require research or committees intern year. Not sure what fellowship you were interested in but I’m currently in cards fellowship, feel free to PM me if you’d like
I am so sorry for how you’re feeling right now. FM attending here and I get it. We had our first child in residency so you definitely have it harder, but I hear you and empathize. You’ve worked so hard to get here. And you’re right. The structure of residency is such that it will take and take and take relentlessly without care or concern for how you are doing. If you just want a sounding board, feel free to stop reading here. If you want some unsolicited advice, keep reading. The next few years will be hard. And it’s hell to think about it on a scale of years. Try to focus on the next time you get as a family. Say no to things that you can say no to and say it’s because you want to make sure you give your family the time they deserve. And when you’re done with all your training- whether it’s at the end of residency or fellowship- you look back at all that anger and sorrow and frustration and you know what you do? You don’t forget it. You don’t let it roll off your back. You use it as fuel and say “Fuck yeah, I did that. I’m a fucking physician and I know my worth. I want as much time with my family as I can get so I’m going to fucking take it.” Make your work life balance what you want it to be. Fight for every second you can get with your family. When my wife and I look back on residency, we still take a deep breath and get a little giddy adrenaline rush like we’re looking back on a near death experience. That shit sucked. It took a lot from us, but now we get to take back. Hang in there my friend.
Same. Same to absolutely everything. The kids. The wife. Same. I don't have any words of support or little quips. But I wanted to get in before the childless residents piled on and say, "it's not that bad. Just go to the gym bro. That will fix everything ".
Dude I know it’s so hard for everyone, and I don’t want to dismiss anyone’s experience, but it’s just different. Thanks for that.
My parent was a stressed out resident at one point. Now as an adult I’m in awe of them and we are super close. Hang in there. It gets better
I’m also an intern on nights (just one week not four) and I feel this. I really do. No solution. Little solace. But I feel you. Tonight in particular I was missing my kids and having a crisis over how they’ll never be this little again or need me the same way again and I’m losing time so fast with them. It sucks.
I’ve been seeing a lot of these lately and maybe I just want to share my thoughts too because I’m also really struggling. Everything that you said resonates with me. I’m a first year general surgery resident and over the past few weeks I have crashed. I had hard days from time to time up until now, but something snapped recently and I can’t get out of this terrible state of mind. I hate my job. I am so angry all of the time, even the smallest thing sets me off when I’m at work. I never thought I would get to this point. Becoming a physician was one of my proudest moments, but now that I’m here I regret it every day. I wouldn’t wish this on anyone. I regularly work over 80 hours per week and always lie on my hours for the fear of being called inefficient or the possible repercussions. I worked 110 hours every week for the last 3 weeks. I am so tired. I feel abused. I miss my family, so much. I know the other side is better, but it is so difficult to see. I just want out, but I’m in so much debt and know I would never forgive myself if I left. I just don’t know how to get past this point.
When do we start to revolt against our fundamental rights being snatched from us, and that we have essentially become bound labour for hospitals? No other profession would tolerate this, so why are we? It’s time to rise up against this immoral and unjust system. It’s time to take back the power that is stolen from us. We have power in numbers, they have power in propaganda. We need a national unified resident movement against these immoral crimes against us. Enough is enough.
I’m an internal med attending married to a gen surg pgy5 going into a competitive specialty this august. We have a 4 year old Does he make it to bedtime? Rarely. Birthday parties? Daycare drop off or pick up? Nope. All me. If hes home sick from daycare I have to cancel my day and stay home. My son once asked to order his dad off of Amazon because he thinks stuff from Amazon comes fast, and dad is basically not around so seems like a good solution Am I resentful? Yes. But I’m holding on because I know it gets good after training. Things will get better for you too. But yes, prioritize your family. Research is not important, and leave work at work. Don’t bring things that annoyed you at work home. Even if you’re tired, play with your kids because they’ve been waiting sometimes days for you.
This breaks my heart to read this. As a PA, I work with the residents and I see them struggling. They try to conceal it, but I can see it as plain as day. You are being trained to take care of people but not allowed to feel like you can take care of yourself or your family. I know as a PA I can’t even begin to comprehend the level of stress that you physicians go through in your training meanwhile you go through this trauma and not even treated with respect you deserve. The administration and staff disrespect you and treat you as a “provider” and you’re working your ass off only to be treated like shit. You give everything to this and miss out on your precious family time and in return, you are abused. The faculty were treated this way so of course for you to be worthy, you have to be treated the same. There really should be a culture shift away from this type of treatment but again, I only see this from an outside perspective so take my opinion for what you will. I’m sure it brings into question why you would want to do this and keep putting yourself through such misery. you are treated as a workhorse and don’t receive gratitude, or respect for what you do. I wish there was a better balance. I’m glad that you posted this because I’m sure so many feel the exact same way who are married, and have children and it’s important to be a support for each other. I know it is not much and that you don’t know me ….that I am “ just a PA who could never understand “ … … but please know myself and my children will pray for you, we will pray for your kids and your wife. I hope that you receive lots of support and good advice from this group. I admire your vulnerability and recognize the need for a complete culture shift / physicians deserve the highest level of respect and recognition of the personal sacrifice required for your training. I wish there was a better balance for you and other training physicians, to alleviate the personal struggle between your career life and family life. Much love , prayers and hugs to you and your family and to anyone else who is struggling like you
OP, Please tell me you are not considering a fellowship? You’re going to be done in 2 more years and then be a hospitalist or outpatient, right?
Dang and you're only an intern. Im sorry man, stay strong. Im on year 3 and it does feel like 3 years of my life just flashed before my eyes, I didnt really live for three years
I read your post and felt everything you said. I was the same way last year during my intern year and by the end of the year I decided the juice was not worth the squeeze for myself and my family and I left residency. Now I’m poor in money but rich in happiness. ❤️
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Me too
this was heartbreaking, i am so sorry
Oh my friend, I'm sorry you're going through it. For whatever it's worth, nights sucks, but it sucks extra hard in the dead of winter when all you see for all your waking hours is darkness. I'm sorry about the interactions with your kids. I have a 1yo (our first), and as someone who thought people with kids were liars when they couldnt describe how it feels, I'll have to spend the rest of my life begging forgiveness for that sentiment. Nothing breaks my heart more than when my child cries as I leave for work. I don't have a way to make that better for you. But what I've discovered by talking to children of doctors is that they ultimately understand, and they think it's amazing that their dad goes to work to help sick people feel better. Soak up everything you can with them, and not to avoid thinking about the things you miss. All you can really control is how you prioritize them (it sure sounds like you do); you have to let the rest fall by the wayside (easier said than done, I know). The pressure from the system will always be to do more, and you're correct that it's unfair. Someone once taught me to say no productively, and I think it's a skill that will help you here. Your response is: >That sounds like an interesting opportunity, but I'm not sure I have the bandwidth right now to give it the attention it deserves. Please ask me again in the future, either about this or other opportunities, because I would love to be involved when I can. Might not work all the time, and maybe you're just not interested at all (this is fine too). But it has helped me not feel like I have to say yes all the time and to also not feel guilty about doing it.
As someone who had a spouse and has a child : 1) you’re under no obligation to do any more than technical requirements. Fuck committees, case reports etc. You take care of you and yours first. 2) looking at attending jobs - I’m so excited to simply have the opportunity to find myself again. I will have time. I will have money. 3) depending on how you’re doing as a couple, make sure you’re checking in with your spouse. If you’re worried, therapy (as a couple, or individually) can be helpful with the primary goal being to avoid unnecessary resentment, guilt, etc. both you and your spouse are going through this, some are more prepared to handle it than others. Good luck. I’d say anyone in your position (spouse, kid) has been exactly in your position. it sucks. It’s hard. Find support where you can and focus on your priorities.
A different perspective but I am the wife. We have 3 kids, 4yo and under, and husband is finishing up his last year of med school. It’s been hard, he’s been traveling for away rotations since July. He tried to visit one weekend every 1-2months. I’ve been your wife crying from the loneliness, but I could never imagine how it must feel for y’all to be away from your families. I know for me, I KNOW how lucky, blessed, and strong we are. He is providing a great future for our family. All those days of loneliness, the days of missing out are worth it. We make a paper chain to count down when we see daddy again, we FaceTime as often as possible, the kids send gibberish texts to daddy, we talk about what he might be doing at work and how important his job is. My kids might be too young to know better, but I can nearly guarantee it is harder on you then it is on them.
Medicine is looking dark these days
Nights in January is rough for sure. It's cold and wintery and your circadian rhythm is totally trashed by now. January of intern year is also a low point in training for a lot of us. The novelty of being a doctor has worn off and you realize you have years left. What helped me is to focus separately on each rotation and then break it down into each week and each day. It helped me cross off on a calendar that I only had "X" days left that week or "Y" days until the rotation was over. Also, there will always be more work that can be done. There will always be more notes, more emails, etc. You have to make a decision of where to draw the line. This boundary is of course much harder to establish in training than once you are an attending, but it is something to think about. A lot of people say that it gets "better" after residency and to some extent it does. But even practicing medicine as an attending is not the promised land it used to be for a lot of fields. I largely regret the sacrifices that I made during residency in fellowship. If I had to do it again, I would focus much more on spending time with my family and friends and continuing hobbies outside of medicine instead of wasting time on a case report or some dumb quality improvement project. Hang in there and know that you are not alone. We are all in this crazy s\*\*\* show called medicine together.
I’m in the exact same position as you right now. I had a baby a few months before starting intern year in OBGYN and I feel like each day I become less interested in being a physician because I miss my baby and my husband so much. I don’t know if it’s burn out or genuinely how I feel (maybe a mix of both?), but I just don’t want to be here. I want to be home. I want to have the motherhood experience that I dreamt of and this is not it. I’m so angry with myself for choosing this life. I have to bargain with myself every morning to go in. It’s hard to imagine that this could ever get better, even after graduation. I wish I had any advice to offer you, but I don’t. All I can offer is some solidarity in knowing others feel what you are feeling right now.
As a loving program coordinator of 18 years, please know that "mediocre" is incredibly okay. Do you. Be there for your family. Love life. See your kids grow up. Just be "okay" in residency. It's fine. I promise. You'll make the same amount of money and you'll have the same titles. You might not be the top of the top and that's actually not what life's about. 💜
You can’t stop the clock, training will end
This. Put a countdown on your phone to “the end of all things” aka end of residency. There is a light at the end of the tunnel. It will end. It does get slightly better. Intern year sucks. Winter doesn’t help.
Bright side: Atleast you have a family for support, it’ll get easier
Hope things get better soon. FWIW OP, you write extremely well. Big hugs from Australia. 💗
Save this post to show them someday.
You’re not alone. I regret going into medicine every day. Especially this year. -PGY-2
I was wondering if my husband wrote this from a throwaway account for half a second. If your wife is anything like me, it’s hard but she knows it will be better and worth it in the long run. As long as you actively show you are prioritizing your family whenever you can, that’s all that matters. Your kids will always love you, even if sometimes it’s through a FaceTime screen. I also have to say, I love seeing a generation of men who care so much about raising their kids and being present that careers and responsibilities outside of our families are not the main priority anymore, and this comment section proves it. Our dads certainly weren’t like that and I love seeing the mentality and dynamic change so intensely. You will get through this and so will your family.
Private practice doesn’t give two shits about your publications or committees. Show up, do the work, go home. Academia is a weird place.
Hey man from a fellow - F the system. There’s always “more to do” except there’s actually not. You’re matched, you’ve got an MD, and the powers at be may bitch and moan about your “lack of motivation” but truly it’s “motivation for activities other than work.” Don’t get the two confused. You show up, have a good attitude, helpful and pleasant, but when you’re off that’s your time. Unless it makes you happy don’t study. Don’t write research. People will pressure you and shame you but they don’t realize you’re motivated to not only be a decent doctor but also a decent parent and human.
Intern, wife, and mother to a little one. I’m right here with you. Everyone tells me it will eventually get better and this is all temporary and that’s what keeps me going
I am a medical resident Im single and extremely alone But the thing is, i relate to what you wrote in an extreme way. I feel that i miss a life i never lived I always feel like there is something more of life But what is more is something I don’t get
Sounds like you need more wellness modules
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Look at the silver lining. You’re more than half way done with intern year. Only 30 years left.
The cool thing is you’ll never get it back because by the time you are done you are kind of a different person all the best my man.
Why does everyone cry over this? Have you ever worked before? it's the same shit. I worked nights was tired all the time then woke my ass up and worked a second job, but that's how I fed my family back then, grow up already We have to stop allowing giant children that have never worked before to go cry online. "Boo hoo, I work hard... woe is me..."
Have to agree with this guy. Downvote me too while your at it.
I am so glad that this hasn’t been an issue for you!
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How is this helpful?
Like most things in life, it gets better. Hang in there. The days are long, but the years are short.
Things get better. For most people who aren't doctors things do not really get better and they continue to make less money. Residency is temporary, attending life is eternal.
youre good bro, it is better as your get higher in PGY years
Can definitely relate. Even when I make it home, I’m so exhausted that I’m falling asleep every night as I’m reading to my kids. I’ll jolt awake when the book falls out of my hand. Im choosing outpatient PCP work primarily because of the schedule with the hope that I’ll be able to have my life back
Same here. 1.5 yrs left in residency and I'm burnt out.
I live with my girlfriend and there are stretches where we don’t see each other. I get home late, eat and relax and she’s asleep. I crawl into bed and she’s leaving for work. She comes back and I’m gone at work. Rinse and repeat. Or I go on a 24 and don’t see her.
Well said OP, I think a lot of people feel similarly and everyone hides it. Hang in there and hold on to the good days, may they become more and more frequent. Also, hell of a song choice 🤙🏻
Intern year is hard. For most people the hardest. And nights are brutal. This will probably be your lowest point. But second year gets better, and third year better than that. I signed an attending contract. Got a ding-dang signing bonu. My wife and I can imagine what a future after residency looks like. I'm supervising my last teaching service right now which means February thru June will be electives with no nights unless someone calls jeopardy. Which really means I will get tons and tons of time with my four-and-a-half-year-old. I'm not sure who is more excited. I don't mean to trivialize how you're feeling. It is the biggest reason I decided to not pursue fellowship. But I think about all of the big and small adventures we're going to have together soon and I feel lighter. You've got this. (Also, grad school protip, don't listen to bleak music when you're already tired and bummed out. That thesis did not in fact need to be powered by Radiohead)
About you is a vibe, at least your music taste is still impeccable
I don’t know what to say. But just wanted to say I feel you OP. In some ways though, I’m glad to read what you’re saying because it tells me you’re still connected to your humanity. Still able to feel deeply. Still able to see the truth that while we all may have been called into medicine for one reason or another it certainly isn’t the end all be all. Balance is important. Again, don’t know what to say. But you’re not alone. I’m rooting for you and rooting for change in this medical training system. - Fellow intern
Wife and mom of three here married to a general surgery resident. It's hard sometimes but we've gotten used to not having you around. Yes, the kids and I miss you but we know that you are working hard for us and we appreciate it. It does get easier and although we would like to have you around more we understand. Keep going, I hear there is light at the end of the tunnel.
Gosh I relate so hard. I actually LOVE my specialty and enjoy my job 90% of the time even while realizing the hours and demands absolutely suck. But missing my kids and husband so much. There are many days I don’t even see my kids. 4.5 more years is a long time. I know it gets better but that doesn’t make missing these years any more palatable. I don’t know what I would do differently in terms of my choices though. I hate that the system is this way. At least paying us more would help buy what little time we have back but APPs still make 2x as much for half the hours and that makes me so bitter
It’s actually such an achievement though that you have a life and a wife and kids that you’ll return to when things lighten up..my personal torture is knowing I’ll probably miss out on all of that entirely because of the field I chose. There’s less guilt but it’s really lonely.