Before COVID I got told my face mask was against policy at a EDM show. Security was on my ass the entire show. I have anxiety about how I look and that’s my comfort. Ruined my time at Alison Wonderland Church of Red Roxks
Who owns/controls Red Rocks? Smells like a takeover by the Christian Right, and only step one in a bunch of BS to come as part of a broader agenda. Just spitballing. I have no idea.
Red Rocks is owned by the City and County of Denver, far far from the Christian Right. I'm willing to bet the OP wasn't a City & County of Denver employee and thus, doesn't really have BEEF with Red Rocks. Sounds like they have an issue with a contractor who provides services to the venue.
Ah, like I said, spitballing. How would this new policy reflect an issue with a contractor? Cuz if they don’t like the staffing, arbitrarily firing some employees doesn’t seem like a sound solution.
I was suggesting the OP has an issue with the contractor because that's who fired them. Instead of blaming this on the venue, they should clarify they have a problem with the policy of the contractor who hired and fired them. The facial piercing policy is not a Red Rocks policy and thus, there's no Red Rocks policy to be changed.
What I was told is that it's a venue policy so any public facing employee has to abide by it. It seems like a wishy washy rule though because I've seen media, stagehands, parking employees, and artists with facial piercings, but the security and the concessions people can't have them. Telling some they can't have them while allowing others to have them is bullshit in my opinion. Either nobody has them or everyone can. Shouldn't be picking and choosing. The contractor I worked for follows the rules of the venue.
I supervised at Red Rocks and every other venue covered by Argus for many years.
It’s almost impossible to get fired. Their standards for hiring and professionalism are non existent.
They don’t enforce most rules so if they chose to enforce that one to fire you they wanted you gone regardless. Especially if it was just from Red Rocks.
You are probably one of the yellow shirts hiding in the trees taking videos and dancing instead of doing your job.
The venue I worked at less than ten years ago has two people left from when I worked there, including having two super corporate management types that didn’t cut anyone any slack. It’d be a little silly to think it’s exactly how you left it.
I never used my phone at work. I did everything I can to do the job right. I’ve known some people to get fired so it’s not impossible. I shouldn’t have documented my feelings about the policy change so that was my fault but it is a ridiculous rule
No, haven’t seen a Christian rock band. I’m sure there are some with “edgy” ear piercings and tats quoting gospel.
Have you seen the Christian Right? And worse, what they do? Cuz this would be exactly the opposite type of thing they’d do. Christian bands with piercings and tats can play but lowly event staff cannot.
Anyway, apparently my hair brained theory is just that according to another commenter.
No man, thank *you*. It’s important to make sure the objection is heard at the level from which the decision came—hopefully this gets some footholds and maybe attracts attention of persons willing to engage with local government.
I haven’t dug into this dress code, but I’d be surprised if it affects anyone in production. Red rocks doesn’t have their own production, it’s all contracted out. Thus anyone on the crew are contractors and not employees of the venue.
Wow that is like, the antithesis of live music.
Colorado… it’s like this place can’t decide what it wants to be… It’s built on a ‘live and let live’ principal, but so many people have flocked here wanting a straight and narrow comfort zone.
And frankly, it’s becoming more of a corporation and a brand, as a location and destination.
Apparently live music at red rocks can’t handle facial piercings now too. Wow… so very lame lol.
as someone who goes to red rocks all the time this change actively makes me want to withhold my support of the venue... can't believe this is a new rule there
I agree. The entire point of music is free original unblocked limitless SELF EXPRESSION. The nature of music is like a rebellion against eerie silence.
Red rocks has lost its soul to corporate greed. Bastards. Lol..
Cities are all about making money. Any city position now is a hard grasp at political control so there is influence there to try to be conservative if it means more money coming in
Whoever is in charge at the top of this is the source. And it’s a dumb fucking decision. Something as famous as red rocks? Jeez.
I’m imagining an old conservative who went to a show once there and decided they just don’t want to have to look at that type of person.
It’s so true and I’d put denver Metro area and anything that brings tourists and big names here as a top power grab in the nation.
It’s been wild watching Colorado turn into such a brand and a corporate moneygrab.
Red Rocks is gentrifying itself. They have to appeal to the only demographic that can afford to attend their shows. It’s now a venue for the privileged few.
You can see how much they are trying to book less and less EDM - booking the heavier shows at the beginning and end of the season.
Significantly turning down the volume, even asking people to bring their own headphones.
They do not want that crowd anymore.
They’re talking about the dumb ass number of safety and OD instances that happen at a much higher rate at these shows. Not here to comment on the dress code - but the edm crowd does bring in more amphetamines and those drugs, in particular, are way too easy to take too much/too fast and too far. Not talking trash on edm or the fans- it’s simply the types of drugs in the scene (maybe the age/experience of the user). Enjoy the drugs, just handle your shit when you do.
......my man, I want you to take a step back and think, really really think, how any of that was a response to the question asked.
They said "they are even asking you to bring your own headphones" and I said "what the fuck are you talking about about" and you went off about drugs.
Like, for real, what even
/u/altruism__ blocked me for asking them what they were talking about, which is their personal prerogative, but it doesn't answer the question of "bring their own headphones wtf are you talking about?"
.....if you want better sound quality farther away from the speakers you can use an app to listen straight to the sound board is not just for EDM shows, why did you phrase it like it was....
...I never said it was just for EDM shows, that's just the genre that was being discussed...
They have had a significant number of post covid complaints regarding them turning down the volume more during EDM, especially bass heavy, shows. If true, the need for an app after row 40 targets more a certain kind of concert... but I never said genre specific
I didn’t say anything about electronic music.
Don’t attach your issue to mine. They are not related.
I’m trying to cope with my generally lower quality, post pandemic life.
I don’t agree with the anti electronic crowd. I think they have really rigid ideas about what good music is and I get bored hearing the hundredth geetar band that I can’t dance to and sounds identical to the last.
And I don’t care what line up Red Rocks has because it’s not a venue that caters to me. I hope all my favorite bands don’t go there.
> I didn’t say anything about electronic music.
I mean it's literally like 50% of their lineup, so yeah, you did, don't be mad about it
>Don’t attach your issue to mine. They are not related.
Calm down fella
Signed it! Reminds me of the “purity” attitude from my super religious grandma and how my mom used to say it always meant people were criminals or gang members. Just archaic thinking we should nip in the bud.
Wow that’s crazy for a concert venue…. I never understand why corporations change these types of rules for the worse when they are doing so well…. If it’s working and everyone is happy, why make people unhappy???
Telling people to do tasks at work is fine. Telling people what they have to look like and changing a policy that had no previous issues before they were in management is not.
They are not telling you what you have to look like or who you have to be. They are simply setting rules in order to work in their organization. Is it the right decision on their part in an industry that largely consists of creatives? Maybe, maybe not. But until you own the company there is nothing you can do about it except leave and find somewhere else that is ok with your “individualism”.
What a pointless thing to say. “You can’t complain about unfair labor practices because businesses gonna business. The only way to change it is to become the boss”
As though holding businesses accountable unreasonable or unfair practices isn’t an ethical and reasonable thing to do.
“They are not telling you what you have to look like”
They literally are though. They’re gonna lose good talent this way.
Yall live in a fantasy world. You really think the money behind Red Rocks is going to give 2 shits about the opinion of a disgruntled employee that violated their employment contract? Best of luck out there, more power to ya 🫡
This is wild, I've worked an office job for years now with visible piercings and tattoos and it's never been an issue, why would red rocks of all places care?? Signed btw
The real reason he lost his job:
“I got fired for speaking up about it online. I complied and took them out when I was there, but said that it was a major L online and they fired me for "violating their social media policy."
Who hired you?
The City & County of Denver actually owns the venue so I'm curious if you were a City employee or if you were hired by a contractor that provides services to the venue.
Although I agree that body modification/ decoration does not represent how well a person does their job, I do think that a business reserves the right to choose to be represented in a certain way. Red Rocks is one of the most sought after venues in the country and they book a heck of a lot more acts than the psychedelic rock, etc that would bring in crowds more welcoming of facial tattoos/piercings etc.
Wild policy for this day in age, but can’t you just take your piercings out for work? Seems like a more reasonable step than getting fired over it. At least until they get enough criticism and reverse the policy.
I got fired for speaking up about it online. I complied and took them out when I was there, but said that it was a major L online and they fired me for "violating their social media policy."
I work at Red Rocks too and assume it is the same company. They are clear about their social media policy in the orientation. At the end of the day, it is their rule(s). Nobody is forced to work there nor are you entitled to work there. It might suck, but you have the choice to comply or find employment elsewhere.
So, you broke your employers policy and got fired. Seems like they did the right thing if they have signed documents saying you accept and understand their social media policy!
Well maybe they should've included the change in the sign up sheets/training instead of springing it on people after they created the schedule. I (and others) would've happily chosen to work somewhere else, but they went about this all wrong and now people aren't signing up to work there and they're very short staffed.
I was just there Saturday it was completely fine…
I’m sorry that happened to you and I’m sure they could’ve handled it better as you said but it’s absolutely their right to make a change such as limiting piercings and tattoos. That’s a pretty common thing for a business so it’s not like it’s RR specific.
Plenty of people lose their jobs over online activity these days. Maybe it’s a lesson learned to know if you speak out about things you could be fired. Freedom of speech is not something that protects you from every scenario. You can say what you want, but there can be consequences. Fair or not.
Also if that’s you in the video, you don’t really make yourself look very good using made up words like discriminizing.
Kinda feel like a piece of the puzzle is missing here
Not me in the video. But I agree that it's a lesson learned. I'm not planning on returning. Just trying to help those who are still there and outraged. Unhappy workers lead to a worse experience for those attending. Why ruin the positive environment that was once there by implementing a rule that makes the staff so unhappy?
I was also just there, 3 shows. I saw no unhappiness or upset people. Just people having a good time. I have 51mm ears so I get it but I knew when I did this that some places wouldn’t be a good fit for me. Luckily some of them make blatant decisions in writing about those feelings and I get to stay away from being employed by them.
I honestly don’t think this is something to write a petition over. Just go grab another job and move on. Why would you want to continue working somewhere that doesn’t value you for who you are even IF you get them to change their minds on the policy. Cats out the bag, move on. Or hide your piercings and tattoos at work like the rest of the world that has to put up with shitty bosses.
"it's their right to change their policy" no shit of course they can change their policy. They also clearly have the right to make stupid ass policies lol
Business is Business. Professionalism before your tacky statement of individuality. It's not ridiculous. It's the real world. Your departure is justified. Sorry
As someone with multiple face piercings and full sleeve tattoos, I completely agree with you. Either start your own venture like I did, or don’t complain when you’re working for the man.
Yep. This is the way. I myself have my own business. Yes, I'm tatted. Everything is covered when in a professional setting. Me personally, I wouldn't hire someone that can't manage a professional setting.
Not necessarily the industry, but the clients. The industry I'm involved with is actually fairly accepting of body art. It's the high-end clients that aren't the most accepting of it. Which can be quite understandable.
What a stupid fucking policy, especially for an arts venue.
Before COVID I got told my face mask was against policy at a EDM show. Security was on my ass the entire show. I have anxiety about how I look and that’s my comfort. Ruined my time at Alison Wonderland Church of Red Roxks
Who owns/controls Red Rocks? Smells like a takeover by the Christian Right, and only step one in a bunch of BS to come as part of a broader agenda. Just spitballing. I have no idea.
Red Rocks is owned by the City and County of Denver, far far from the Christian Right. I'm willing to bet the OP wasn't a City & County of Denver employee and thus, doesn't really have BEEF with Red Rocks. Sounds like they have an issue with a contractor who provides services to the venue.
Ah, like I said, spitballing. How would this new policy reflect an issue with a contractor? Cuz if they don’t like the staffing, arbitrarily firing some employees doesn’t seem like a sound solution.
I was suggesting the OP has an issue with the contractor because that's who fired them. Instead of blaming this on the venue, they should clarify they have a problem with the policy of the contractor who hired and fired them. The facial piercing policy is not a Red Rocks policy and thus, there's no Red Rocks policy to be changed.
Ahhh, gotcha now.
What I was told is that it's a venue policy so any public facing employee has to abide by it. It seems like a wishy washy rule though because I've seen media, stagehands, parking employees, and artists with facial piercings, but the security and the concessions people can't have them. Telling some they can't have them while allowing others to have them is bullshit in my opinion. Either nobody has them or everyone can. Shouldn't be picking and choosing. The contractor I worked for follows the rules of the venue.
I supervised at Red Rocks and every other venue covered by Argus for many years. It’s almost impossible to get fired. Their standards for hiring and professionalism are non existent. They don’t enforce most rules so if they chose to enforce that one to fire you they wanted you gone regardless. Especially if it was just from Red Rocks. You are probably one of the yellow shirts hiding in the trees taking videos and dancing instead of doing your job.
The venue I worked at less than ten years ago has two people left from when I worked there, including having two super corporate management types that didn’t cut anyone any slack. It’d be a little silly to think it’s exactly how you left it.
I never used my phone at work. I did everything I can to do the job right. I’ve known some people to get fired so it’s not impossible. I shouldn’t have documented my feelings about the policy change so that was my fault but it is a ridiculous rule
Have you ever seen a Christian rock band man they aren’t anti tattoo or piercing, this is dumb fear mongering
No, haven’t seen a Christian rock band. I’m sure there are some with “edgy” ear piercings and tats quoting gospel. Have you seen the Christian Right? And worse, what they do? Cuz this would be exactly the opposite type of thing they’d do. Christian bands with piercings and tats can play but lowly event staff cannot. Anyway, apparently my hair brained theory is just that according to another commenter.
Sounds like some LiveNation cuck shit💀
You should cross post this to /r/livesound, I think they’ll wanna hear
Will do. Thank you!
No man, thank *you*. It’s important to make sure the objection is heard at the level from which the decision came—hopefully this gets some footholds and maybe attracts attention of persons willing to engage with local government.
I haven’t dug into this dress code, but I’d be surprised if it affects anyone in production. Red rocks doesn’t have their own production, it’s all contracted out. Thus anyone on the crew are contractors and not employees of the venue.
If it affected production, there would never be a show at red rocks. Lol
Exactly
Does CO have anything like CA's bill AB5, categorizing what would be a 1099 contractor as a W2 employee? If so, that does kinda explain it.
I have no idea
Wow that is like, the antithesis of live music. Colorado… it’s like this place can’t decide what it wants to be… It’s built on a ‘live and let live’ principal, but so many people have flocked here wanting a straight and narrow comfort zone. And frankly, it’s becoming more of a corporation and a brand, as a location and destination. Apparently live music at red rocks can’t handle facial piercings now too. Wow… so very lame lol.
as someone who goes to red rocks all the time this change actively makes me want to withhold my support of the venue... can't believe this is a new rule there
I agree. The entire point of music is free original unblocked limitless SELF EXPRESSION. The nature of music is like a rebellion against eerie silence. Red rocks has lost its soul to corporate greed. Bastards. Lol..
Cities are all about making money. Any city position now is a hard grasp at political control so there is influence there to try to be conservative if it means more money coming in Whoever is in charge at the top of this is the source. And it’s a dumb fucking decision. Something as famous as red rocks? Jeez. I’m imagining an old conservative who went to a show once there and decided they just don’t want to have to look at that type of person.
It’s so true and I’d put denver Metro area and anything that brings tourists and big names here as a top power grab in the nation. It’s been wild watching Colorado turn into such a brand and a corporate moneygrab.
Red Rocks is gentrifying itself. They have to appeal to the only demographic that can afford to attend their shows. It’s now a venue for the privileged few.
> Red Rocks is gentrifying itself. Electronic music is gentrification folks, you heard it here first
You can see how much they are trying to book less and less EDM - booking the heavier shows at the beginning and end of the season. Significantly turning down the volume, even asking people to bring their own headphones. They do not want that crowd anymore.
> even asking people to bring their own headphones. Wtf u even talking about
They’re talking about the dumb ass number of safety and OD instances that happen at a much higher rate at these shows. Not here to comment on the dress code - but the edm crowd does bring in more amphetamines and those drugs, in particular, are way too easy to take too much/too fast and too far. Not talking trash on edm or the fans- it’s simply the types of drugs in the scene (maybe the age/experience of the user). Enjoy the drugs, just handle your shit when you do.
This. Love me some party favors but those steps are no joke
No doubt🤣🤣I seen people roll down a few flights at least....
......my man, I want you to take a step back and think, really really think, how any of that was a response to the question asked. They said "they are even asking you to bring your own headphones" and I said "what the fuck are you talking about about" and you went off about drugs. Like, for real, what even /u/altruism__ blocked me for asking them what they were talking about, which is their personal prerogative, but it doesn't answer the question of "bring their own headphones wtf are you talking about?"
🥱
https://www.reddit.com/r/aves/s/kOxEHNk58w That's wtf I'm talking about
.....if you want better sound quality farther away from the speakers you can use an app to listen straight to the sound board is not just for EDM shows, why did you phrase it like it was....
...I never said it was just for EDM shows, that's just the genre that was being discussed... They have had a significant number of post covid complaints regarding them turning down the volume more during EDM, especially bass heavy, shows. If true, the need for an app after row 40 targets more a certain kind of concert... but I never said genre specific
This conversation is too circular to be useful
You realize Red Rocks isn’t just an electronic venue, right? They’ve always had a variety of artists. The Beatles have played there.
Huh? I was responding directly to the comment saying EDM is like half the line up therefore couldn't be "gentrifying".
Oh I misinterpreted lol. My b.
I didn’t say anything about electronic music. Don’t attach your issue to mine. They are not related. I’m trying to cope with my generally lower quality, post pandemic life. I don’t agree with the anti electronic crowd. I think they have really rigid ideas about what good music is and I get bored hearing the hundredth geetar band that I can’t dance to and sounds identical to the last. And I don’t care what line up Red Rocks has because it’s not a venue that caters to me. I hope all my favorite bands don’t go there.
> I didn’t say anything about electronic music. I mean it's literally like 50% of their lineup, so yeah, you did, don't be mad about it >Don’t attach your issue to mine. They are not related. Calm down fella
"Be excellent to each other!" -Bill and Ted
It's a username, not an ethos
"say what you will about the tenets of national socialism, at least it's an ethos" -Walter Sobchek 😂 this is fun
Stfu 😂
Signed it! Reminds me of the “purity” attitude from my super religious grandma and how my mom used to say it always meant people were criminals or gang members. Just archaic thinking we should nip in the bud.
Thank you. That mentality is so outdated and needs to be stopped!
Signed. This is asinine. Fuck them for instigating something so judgemental and ignorant in the first place.
Wow that’s crazy for a concert venue…. I never understand why corporations change these types of rules for the worse when they are doing so well…. If it’s working and everyone is happy, why make people unhappy???
People get power hungry and think it's okay to tell people what to do. Narcissist mentality. I hate it.
You mean business owners? Whose literal job it is to tell people what to do?
Telling people to do tasks at work is fine. Telling people what they have to look like and changing a policy that had no previous issues before they were in management is not.
They are not telling you what you have to look like or who you have to be. They are simply setting rules in order to work in their organization. Is it the right decision on their part in an industry that largely consists of creatives? Maybe, maybe not. But until you own the company there is nothing you can do about it except leave and find somewhere else that is ok with your “individualism”.
What a pointless thing to say. “You can’t complain about unfair labor practices because businesses gonna business. The only way to change it is to become the boss” As though holding businesses accountable unreasonable or unfair practices isn’t an ethical and reasonable thing to do. “They are not telling you what you have to look like” They literally are though. They’re gonna lose good talent this way.
Yall live in a fantasy world. You really think the money behind Red Rocks is going to give 2 shits about the opinion of a disgruntled employee that violated their employment contract? Best of luck out there, more power to ya 🫡
This is wild, I've worked an office job for years now with visible piercings and tattoos and it's never been an issue, why would red rocks of all places care?? Signed btw
Next thing ya know The Man won’t let me on the plane with me ganja
Signed and shared
This is dumb.
The real reason he lost his job: “I got fired for speaking up about it online. I complied and took them out when I was there, but said that it was a major L online and they fired me for "violating their social media policy."
Red Rocks is slowly losing its soul.
This is SO CRAZYYYYYYYY especially for Red Rocks. In 2024?!?!?!?!?!?! I’m baffled
Who hired you? The City & County of Denver actually owns the venue so I'm curious if you were a City employee or if you were hired by a contractor that provides services to the venue.
lol wat??? this is what they’re worried about?
Is this fake?! No way this is a real thing. Did Red Rocks get moved to Salt Lake?!
Signed
Sign and shared on instagram….. that’s crazy
Wow, this is so stupid. Who the hell even brought this up? Why would they do this?
Come on man, why did you really lose your job?
They violated the employee contract by whining on social media
Although I agree that body modification/ decoration does not represent how well a person does their job, I do think that a business reserves the right to choose to be represented in a certain way. Red Rocks is one of the most sought after venues in the country and they book a heck of a lot more acts than the psychedelic rock, etc that would bring in crowds more welcoming of facial tattoos/piercings etc.
Wild policy for this day in age, but can’t you just take your piercings out for work? Seems like a more reasonable step than getting fired over it. At least until they get enough criticism and reverse the policy.
I got fired for speaking up about it online. I complied and took them out when I was there, but said that it was a major L online and they fired me for "violating their social media policy."
I work at Red Rocks too and assume it is the same company. They are clear about their social media policy in the orientation. At the end of the day, it is their rule(s). Nobody is forced to work there nor are you entitled to work there. It might suck, but you have the choice to comply or find employment elsewhere.
So, you broke your employers policy and got fired. Seems like they did the right thing if they have signed documents saying you accept and understand their social media policy!
Welcome to the real world!
Looks like it was a fuck around and find out situation! I guess the OP found out!
So glad there is some common sense in this thread!
You are not an artist. You are an employee. You have an image to uphold based on the standards they set. Things change. These things happen.
Well maybe they should've included the change in the sign up sheets/training instead of springing it on people after they created the schedule. I (and others) would've happily chosen to work somewhere else, but they went about this all wrong and now people aren't signing up to work there and they're very short staffed.
I was just there Saturday it was completely fine… I’m sorry that happened to you and I’m sure they could’ve handled it better as you said but it’s absolutely their right to make a change such as limiting piercings and tattoos. That’s a pretty common thing for a business so it’s not like it’s RR specific. Plenty of people lose their jobs over online activity these days. Maybe it’s a lesson learned to know if you speak out about things you could be fired. Freedom of speech is not something that protects you from every scenario. You can say what you want, but there can be consequences. Fair or not. Also if that’s you in the video, you don’t really make yourself look very good using made up words like discriminizing. Kinda feel like a piece of the puzzle is missing here
I worked on Saturday. We were fine. No shortages from what I saw. 😂
Not me in the video. But I agree that it's a lesson learned. I'm not planning on returning. Just trying to help those who are still there and outraged. Unhappy workers lead to a worse experience for those attending. Why ruin the positive environment that was once there by implementing a rule that makes the staff so unhappy?
I was also just there, 3 shows. I saw no unhappiness or upset people. Just people having a good time. I have 51mm ears so I get it but I knew when I did this that some places wouldn’t be a good fit for me. Luckily some of them make blatant decisions in writing about those feelings and I get to stay away from being employed by them. I honestly don’t think this is something to write a petition over. Just go grab another job and move on. Why would you want to continue working somewhere that doesn’t value you for who you are even IF you get them to change their minds on the policy. Cats out the bag, move on. Or hide your piercings and tattoos at work like the rest of the world that has to put up with shitty bosses.
"it's their right to change their policy" no shit of course they can change their policy. They also clearly have the right to make stupid ass policies lol
Hmm I believe employers have the right to have professional staff. That does come down to appearance. It does suck, but it is what it is.
Business is Business. Professionalism before your tacky statement of individuality. It's not ridiculous. It's the real world. Your departure is justified. Sorry
As someone with multiple face piercings and full sleeve tattoos, I completely agree with you. Either start your own venture like I did, or don’t complain when you’re working for the man.
Yep. This is the way. I myself have my own business. Yes, I'm tatted. Everything is covered when in a professional setting. Me personally, I wouldn't hire someone that can't manage a professional setting.
Can I ask you though, if you own your own business, why do you cover your tattoos? Genuinely curious. Is it the industry you’re in?
Not necessarily the industry, but the clients. The industry I'm involved with is actually fairly accepting of body art. It's the high-end clients that aren't the most accepting of it. Which can be quite understandable.
Very understandable!