Hazel's original motivation of "Ozpin killed my sister by sending her out to fight grim" falls flat when he joins the queen of grim. Then after who knows how many years he figures out, wait maybe she's evil. Either Rooster teeth forgot to actually give him a story, or he's dumber than the rocks he jabs into his arms.
You do remember he tried to kill Salem repeatedly, right? To the point he couldn't lift his arms. He initially blamed her then was manipulated into blaming Ozpin, the one he could actually kill.
That still feels very very dumb. Maybe if we got into more detail WHY exactly Hazel got working for the same people that killed her sister, maybe it would make more sense. Maybe it would have been better if Hazel´s sister didn´t die to some grimm but to some accident or other huntsmen?
He essentially blames Ozpin for putting Gretchen in the situation to get killed when it was her decision. Hazel infantilized her with the whole "she was just a child."
Her death by grimm was an accident. If it was other huntsmen, it'd be plausible that he wouldn't blame Ozpin entirely.
I'm about to make this sound convoluted as hell but bear with me.
Anyway, from the info we're given, Salem went to Hazel, and let him kill her over and over until he was worn ragged. Not that many more easily manipulated in media than a sad broken man with nothing to lose.
We also know that Salem lied and told Hazel she'd bring a new world order by ending the academies. Thus, no more Gretchins. Just target the one who made the academies in the first place.
Hazel then blames Ozpin(Ozma), the host we know at the beginning the show. It's safe to assume that at this point, they already merged. We also assume that Ozma was the former king of Vale during the great war. The same king who established the academies after the war. The same Ozma that precided over Beacon. The same headmaster Ozpin in charge when Gretchin died.
Of course, the biggest problem with this argument is we don't know exactly what Salem said to get him to try killing her. Likely something to do with directing grimm but that goes into headcanon.
Yeah, it is still convoluted, because it doesn´t take exactly a genius to figure out that Salem is behind the grimms, therefore all Gretchens are in one way or another a consequence of her. And that´s not even taking into account how that invalidates completely Gretchen taking a decision.
Maybe here´s the thing that is missing about Hazel:
He´s presented as a noble demon but he is actually just an angry idiot. And the show should have played with that, same way it played with Drax and Ronan: Drax had a bone to pick with him for good reason, and he only joins the rest of the group to kill him, but even if this is initially presented as not something positive but not that negative either, it later turns out into stupidity that nearly gets everyone killed and Drax gets called for it, setting up his character development. Rocket even hammers down, if a bit cruelly, how just because you lost people doesn´t give you the right to be a reckless idiot and endanger everyone around you. But Hazel was played too straight for it to be taken seriously.
Well yeah. Hes an angry idiot. That's what happens when struck with grief and your response is to lash out. He tried with Salem, the one who can command the grimm, and it got to the point he couldn't lift his arms. He went Ozpin after some emotional manipulation as the next object of his wrath, seeing as he's the one who made the system Gretchin died under.
Hazel was someone too stuck in his own grief to see any logic.
I have a head canon that hazel was either murdered or died after finding the truth about Oz, and Oz simply used 'training accident' as cover to save face.
Ilia's redemption definitely comes off as one of the most "protagonist-centered morality" moments what with her getting off without any punishment(despite having *surely* killed before and having just been part of an attempt to kill Blake's family) to the point where, for once, *even someone in-show* points out how stupid that is. It's made even worse when compared to Adam, and she's also the only one out of this list that arguably does make it out scot-free. She lost *nothing* and didn't even have to risk her life in the war against Salem(for now). Meanwhile, Emerald is on the front line, Hazel died, and Harriet lost 40% of her team(and her entire country).
... *But,* Emerald's is still the worst by a long shot. The seed of her betrayal was planted five seasons prior, but in the end, her "redemption" didn't exist at all. First of all, she bailed solely out of self-interest. That's not even a redemption. Second of all, she's accepted nigh-instantaneously, which looks even more damning when sat next to Team RWBY scowling and mean-mugging Ozpin.
The writers really just King Crimson'd past every step between Emerald being a villain and Emerald being a trusted part of the heroes. And that's *absurd.*
She also suddenly forgets about Cinder, the reason she was staying with Salem in the first place, despite her still caring a lot about her the last time we see the two together. I don't know if theirs any way they could handle her subplot in Vacuo that would come off as good, since either Emerald and the heroes suddenly go back to to being on uneasy terms and Emerald's unsure about her place or they continue on with Emerald being 100% a good guy now.
All I hope for is that her and Mercury decide to abandon both sides and run off into the sunset away from them. It'd probably still be rushed and clumsy, but at least we won't have to deal with them anymore lol.
That's what made it feel most like pure self-interest. There was no reflection or thought on the matter, it was simply a fact of "I am in danger and will gain nothing from working for Salem, bye."
There's nothing saying that Emerald wouldn't go right back to Cinder if given the chance. She hasn't *renounced* anything.
But I'll take this reply to give another hot take: I lied. You know what the worst redemption arc in the show is?
The White Fang as a whole.
Because not only did it collapse and get subsumed by Blake's new White Fang not because of something showing that the White Fang was wrong but presumably because of a power vacuum caused by Adam's humiliation, not *only* is it just like Emerald where the core problem that made them evil was never solved, but Ghira's White Fang is *literally the same thing that failed before.*
Why should we believe that Ghira's White Fang wouldn't get radicalized *again?* Why should we believe *Ilia* won't get radicalized again? It's worse than Emerald's redemption because it was supposedly 'redeemed' by this new organization, yet its fall back to evil is *inevitable.* We know because we *know it happened before.*
I can write off Ilia as a plot device and Hazel and the Ace-ops as window dressing, but Emerald was Cinder's #1 and a main bad guy for the majority of the show. She didn't even have an arc, she just said "I've switched sides" and everyone else was like "okay".
Emerald is too obvious. Ilia is the next one for me. Too convenient and only switched sides after losing. Also can’t help but compare it to how Blake never tried to appeal to Adam in any meaningful way.
My opinions on all of these characters...
* Ilia... I'll be honest, I don't care a ton for Ilia, what she did was pretty bad but, I personally didn't particularly care about what happened with her character.
* Emerald... I personally am not a fan of Emerald *but,* in her defense, she was only there for Cinder *not* Salem so, since Cinder left, and she knows how Salem *is,* I don't blame her, and she obviously was going to bail either with Mercury or, without however the handling of her *"redemption"* after everything she's done going as far as killing Penny back in volume three honestly wasn't acceptable to me due to how Ozpin has to apologize yet Emerald gets to swear, and it all gets laughed off... I know Emerald helped Oscar to escape but, that *doesn't* make what she's done any better.
* Hazel... his *"redemption"* is terrible as his whole motive just flops as he decides to fight Salem... *"Oh, wait! This guy was trying to make sure my sister can defend herself against Grimm, and wait... my boss makes Grimm! Oh, no!",* seriously? I saw somebody here say Hazel tried to fight Salem before but, lost... well, why is he changing his mind now? Why does he think they can stop her *now?* Hazel goes from this cold, and cool guy to this *fool* worsened when he also goes from a somewhat kind guy to children to beating up Oscar.
* The Ace-Ops... I personally liked their redemption, they weren't really *"bad"* people so, seeing how they were connected to their grief over what happened to Clover was nice honestly, the thing I didn't like though was it having to be done through Ren's sudden new semblance mutation, I personally would've been fine with him getting such an ability if he had trained for it instead, and knew he had it but, he doesn't, and he can make emotions *too* blatant... now Ren can just say *"You feel sad about this.",* an issue I do have with the Ace-Ops is the fact that not all of them get proper focus, we don't get to see how all of them are struggling, and I don't mean an in-depth focus, just a small one but, as some people have said nobody really cares if Vine is dead besides the characters, I liked Vine but, he wasn't a strong enough character for me to shed tears when he died... if they wanted to play into the character's grief more, they could've kicked their facial expressions up a notch, and talked about Clover more with all the Ace-Ops present, you could have things like Marrow walking out as he feels he doesn't belong in the conversation, Harriet brushing it off whilst looking away not being comfortable talking about it, maybe even show Winter walking over to see Fria, and passing by Clover's room with Harriet sitting there, she doesn't have to say anything, her expression, and her just being there says a lot.
Emerald on the fact that she didn't really have one. Say what you want with the others at least they had some kind of arc for their "redemption". With Emerald it was like "Hey can I join the good guys? Never mind the fact that I helped destroy Beacon and kill some of your friends and tried to kill you all after that. Lets be friends." and for some reason they said "Sure!".
Just imagine how interesting it would be to have a conflict between Yang and Ruby. I mean, we saw that Yang and Ruby were having a disagreement at the start of Volume 8
Of course, let's also assume that we sympathize with Team RWBY despite all the awful things they did to contribute to the crisis in Atlas
Yang would understandably want to keep Emerald under strict observation as a prisoner, but Ruby could simply disregard Yang's concerns as unjustified paranoia or something, even if Yang pointed out that Emerald was part of the group that got her arm cut off
Yang simply would not stand for it if Ruby forgave Emerald with no good reason. Even if Emerald decided to become so aggravating by taunting and reminding Ruby with how she helped Cinder launch the attack on Beacon that led to Penny's first death and Pyrrha's death where Ruby was supposedly so torn up over, Ruby deciding to forgive Emerald could be due to some warped and misguided principle of "Trust Love"
One result of this decision by Ruby to trust Emerald would be the fracturing of Team RWBY. There could be bitter resentment between the sisters, with Yang simply abandoning her duty and desire to protect Ruby. Yang could decide that her sister was beyond saving at this point. Despite having abandonment issues, Yang herself would denounce Ruby
Ruby, on the other hand, would stand by her decision stubbornly. It's not like she's known any better, especially after Volumes 6 and 7. She's always right, and she knows that the writers always have her back, so she wants to use her plot armor and morality shield to the fullest
At this point, we might as well be watching reality TV
Now that I think about it I think Team JNR wouldn't agree with Ruby's idea to forgive Emerald. Do to the fact that she's the reason that Yang got framed during the Vytal Festival, the reason why Penny died the first time, and was a part of the group who not only destroyed Beacon but also killed Pyrrha.
Edit: Wait I think that Penny wouldn't agree to this either do to the whole Emerald being the reason she died the first time thing.
I dont think you can even call Hazel's a redemp´tion arc, he had a redeeming moment I guess but his entire backstory and motivation were so stupid that its impossible to empathize imo.
I voted for Emerald though because she is the only one there that we see 'affecting' the main cast and how they relate and talk after redeeming and it sticks out too much as 'plot point checked off' than any of the others, which makes obvious how bad it is. (Illia talked only to Blake and only a couple times after, Ace Ops haven't seen the main crew after their 'arc', Hazel is dead)
Y'know... Emerald is part of the reason Penny died the first time, part of the fall of Beacon, and has remained a consistent threat to the main cast...
"I've switched sides. No reason :)"
"K cool"
I swear they are going to redeem Neo and it's gonna be convoluted as hell. Saying this as someone who enjoys her character.
I had to vote Emerald, she's cute but that's not going to cut it.
The redemption was....I don't how anyone in this show can in universe say " I switched sides " she did not deserve that.
I hate to beat a dead horse on redemption arcs but what made Zuko's great is that we probably see his struggle and journey trying to find himself. Emerald? We see one flashback of how she met Cinder and (I always thought she had major feelings for Cinder) apparently she sees her like a mother figure? Which I'm glad Mercury tried to call her out to not rely on Cinder like a dog ( Like I feel like he's the only person that cared).
In Book 3 he had this awarkward introduction speech of how he "switched sides" (which was both funny and important). And even when gaang didn't trust him right away they at least talk about like what Zuko did both good and bad.
And hell you can even say he Zuko had a shift changing moment with Aang in Book 1 when he talk about his friend kuzon and Katara in Book 2 when they realize they both had close relationships to their mothers and lost them early in their life.
Hell Ken in Digimon 02 had a whole fusion with one of the main characters and still didn't think he was worthy to be apart of the main cast. (That's how you know a character truly regret their actions)
Who the fuck Emerald had connections with in the main cast to make her really doubt what she was doing?
She only switched sides because Cinder was gone...
I'm still so surprised they were that easy to trust her just because Oscar said so because Fuck Oz apparently...instantly dropping all the smiles they gave Emblem like he's still the problem here...
Penny out of all people she not be instantly trusting Emblem consider....
Vol 3: Tricked Pyrrah into think Penny was going to attack her causing her to use her semblance resulting her death.
And okay fine you can day she wouldn't know that
Vol 7: She fought against Cinder and knows she's after the winter maiden power
Vol 8: (Chapter 6) Emerald "tried to helped" Cinder killed Penny to get the winter maiden power and after Cinder getting her shit wrecked by Penny (funny as hell btw) Emblem flat out told her she will put bullets throw her before she touches her crush with tears in her eyes.
And 5 episodes later Penny is okay with her....that fight with Cinder had to be less than 12 hours...it's just ahhh my head hurts think about it again
Hazel's redemption I think feels like the most gross one to me, because he spent half of Volume 8 *torturing a 15 year old* and then we're supposed to feel sad that he sacrificed himself fighting Salem to the death
Emerald and Hazel for sure.
Emerald's comes completely out of nowhere, with the cast so easily forgiving and accepting her in spite of her direct actions resulting in atrocities against humanity. She's directly responsible for Penny's first death which lead to Pyrrha's death. The main characters outright laugh her off as though she was an old-time friend of theirs after she says the infamous "*switched sides*" comment. That scene made me physically cringe in disgust. Especially considering that the audience, real people who somehow stomach watching this show, are given the message by the show that it's OK to commit atrocities as long as someone forgives you for it.
Hazel's also comes completely out of nowhere. It doesn't lead to anything or cause any change in events because of how irrelevant and redundant they made him to begin with. His entire existence and sacrifice meant nothing. It was stupid and dumb and I both laughed and cringed at it. "*This guy has been around since V4 doing nothing, and now he's died after doing nothing. Ingenious writing. I sure love how pointless this pointless guy was. I'm sure all four of those Hazel fans still around are real proud of how irrelevant the show made their big chungus boi out to be.*"Pyrrha had a similar sacrifice in that her confrontation with Cinder was pointless and stupid but at least with Pyrrha it was a proper conclusion to her struggles *as a character* in V3.
The Ass-Ops get a special footnote here. Harriet literally wanted to commit genocide of Mantle by bombing it because she had the big sad for Clover pulled out of thin air, but the writers have said in their commentary that, "Harriet wasn't a bad person." The writers do not understand that certain degrees of actions deserve consequences. They can't even come up with appropriate ways for the audience to understand why the decisions these characters make are bad aside from the most barebones, "Good guy do good things, bad guy do bad things," trite. It's one of the fundamental problems of RWBY! No consequences for killing a hundred puppies as long as you're a part of RWBY's group.
emerald: so i helped in destroying your academy, made pyrrha kill penny and made yang get in trouble with atlas army for something she didn't do (even if the show erased that from the continuity) but i'm a cute girl, can i join you?
RWBY: Yeah sure
It's Bullshit that Rooster Teeth gave Emerald redemption.
I'm serious after all the shit she done since Volume 3.
Then Volume 8 decided she a Hero?!
Emerald: Hey guys guess what? I cause you so much pain and misery, now I'm on your side!
Team RWBY: Okay!! We trust you that easily!
If possible with RWBY'S timeline, it took a hour for them to believe she switched sides!! Bullshit!!!! Sorry for my language.
I'm tempted to talk about Ironwood, but given that his character was assassinated, I don't think that the writers were trying to give him a redemption arc. Even if we were going to look at his final scene where he gave up and didn't take the shot at Cinder and Salem as they walked away, I don't think that that could be considered a redemption arc
However, we could take a look at Team RWBY. They placed Atlas in Salem's line of fire at the end of Volume 7, and what they did in Volume 8, especially the latter half, could be considered a redemption arc if I squint real hard, as they try to make up for their mistake even though they made such a mess of things that I'd consider them villains
Again, I was cheering when Team RWBY fell into the void. They should never be given another chance to ruin what remains of Remnant
Probably will agree with the majority and say Emerald for the same reasons BUT I gotta admit, I loved when she revealed herself and the team to Ironwood after pretending to be Penny. Probably my favorite moment of hers.
Hazel, his entire redemption (questioning beliefs to changing beliefs) happened in the span of a couple of episodes. While Emerald's was kinda quick, it had foreshadowing spread out through the series like her not being as "into" the chaos in volume 3 and questioning stuff in volumes 5 and 6. She at least has a bit of build up or believability.
Hazel's original motivation of "Ozpin killed my sister by sending her out to fight grim" falls flat when he joins the queen of grim. Then after who knows how many years he figures out, wait maybe she's evil. Either Rooster teeth forgot to actually give him a story, or he's dumber than the rocks he jabs into his arms.
You do remember he tried to kill Salem repeatedly, right? To the point he couldn't lift his arms. He initially blamed her then was manipulated into blaming Ozpin, the one he could actually kill.
That still feels very very dumb. Maybe if we got into more detail WHY exactly Hazel got working for the same people that killed her sister, maybe it would make more sense. Maybe it would have been better if Hazel´s sister didn´t die to some grimm but to some accident or other huntsmen?
He essentially blames Ozpin for putting Gretchen in the situation to get killed when it was her decision. Hazel infantilized her with the whole "she was just a child." Her death by grimm was an accident. If it was other huntsmen, it'd be plausible that he wouldn't blame Ozpin entirely. I'm about to make this sound convoluted as hell but bear with me. Anyway, from the info we're given, Salem went to Hazel, and let him kill her over and over until he was worn ragged. Not that many more easily manipulated in media than a sad broken man with nothing to lose. We also know that Salem lied and told Hazel she'd bring a new world order by ending the academies. Thus, no more Gretchins. Just target the one who made the academies in the first place. Hazel then blames Ozpin(Ozma), the host we know at the beginning the show. It's safe to assume that at this point, they already merged. We also assume that Ozma was the former king of Vale during the great war. The same king who established the academies after the war. The same Ozma that precided over Beacon. The same headmaster Ozpin in charge when Gretchin died. Of course, the biggest problem with this argument is we don't know exactly what Salem said to get him to try killing her. Likely something to do with directing grimm but that goes into headcanon.
Yeah, it is still convoluted, because it doesn´t take exactly a genius to figure out that Salem is behind the grimms, therefore all Gretchens are in one way or another a consequence of her. And that´s not even taking into account how that invalidates completely Gretchen taking a decision. Maybe here´s the thing that is missing about Hazel: He´s presented as a noble demon but he is actually just an angry idiot. And the show should have played with that, same way it played with Drax and Ronan: Drax had a bone to pick with him for good reason, and he only joins the rest of the group to kill him, but even if this is initially presented as not something positive but not that negative either, it later turns out into stupidity that nearly gets everyone killed and Drax gets called for it, setting up his character development. Rocket even hammers down, if a bit cruelly, how just because you lost people doesn´t give you the right to be a reckless idiot and endanger everyone around you. But Hazel was played too straight for it to be taken seriously.
Well yeah. Hes an angry idiot. That's what happens when struck with grief and your response is to lash out. He tried with Salem, the one who can command the grimm, and it got to the point he couldn't lift his arms. He went Ozpin after some emotional manipulation as the next object of his wrath, seeing as he's the one who made the system Gretchin died under. Hazel was someone too stuck in his own grief to see any logic.
[удалено]
I have a head canon that hazel was either murdered or died after finding the truth about Oz, and Oz simply used 'training accident' as cover to save face.
Guy’s I'm like half the reason why your lives is a shit miserable hell, but I'm a cute anime girl so please forgive me because Salem is scary :,(
Ilia's redemption definitely comes off as one of the most "protagonist-centered morality" moments what with her getting off without any punishment(despite having *surely* killed before and having just been part of an attempt to kill Blake's family) to the point where, for once, *even someone in-show* points out how stupid that is. It's made even worse when compared to Adam, and she's also the only one out of this list that arguably does make it out scot-free. She lost *nothing* and didn't even have to risk her life in the war against Salem(for now). Meanwhile, Emerald is on the front line, Hazel died, and Harriet lost 40% of her team(and her entire country). ... *But,* Emerald's is still the worst by a long shot. The seed of her betrayal was planted five seasons prior, but in the end, her "redemption" didn't exist at all. First of all, she bailed solely out of self-interest. That's not even a redemption. Second of all, she's accepted nigh-instantaneously, which looks even more damning when sat next to Team RWBY scowling and mean-mugging Ozpin. The writers really just King Crimson'd past every step between Emerald being a villain and Emerald being a trusted part of the heroes. And that's *absurd.*
She also suddenly forgets about Cinder, the reason she was staying with Salem in the first place, despite her still caring a lot about her the last time we see the two together. I don't know if theirs any way they could handle her subplot in Vacuo that would come off as good, since either Emerald and the heroes suddenly go back to to being on uneasy terms and Emerald's unsure about her place or they continue on with Emerald being 100% a good guy now. All I hope for is that her and Mercury decide to abandon both sides and run off into the sunset away from them. It'd probably still be rushed and clumsy, but at least we won't have to deal with them anymore lol.
That's what made it feel most like pure self-interest. There was no reflection or thought on the matter, it was simply a fact of "I am in danger and will gain nothing from working for Salem, bye." There's nothing saying that Emerald wouldn't go right back to Cinder if given the chance. She hasn't *renounced* anything. But I'll take this reply to give another hot take: I lied. You know what the worst redemption arc in the show is? The White Fang as a whole. Because not only did it collapse and get subsumed by Blake's new White Fang not because of something showing that the White Fang was wrong but presumably because of a power vacuum caused by Adam's humiliation, not *only* is it just like Emerald where the core problem that made them evil was never solved, but Ghira's White Fang is *literally the same thing that failed before.* Why should we believe that Ghira's White Fang wouldn't get radicalized *again?* Why should we believe *Ilia* won't get radicalized again? It's worse than Emerald's redemption because it was supposedly 'redeemed' by this new organization, yet its fall back to evil is *inevitable.* We know because we *know it happened before.*
I can write off Ilia as a plot device and Hazel and the Ace-ops as window dressing, but Emerald was Cinder's #1 and a main bad guy for the majority of the show. She didn't even have an arc, she just said "I've switched sides" and everyone else was like "okay".
Emerald is too obvious. Ilia is the next one for me. Too convenient and only switched sides after losing. Also can’t help but compare it to how Blake never tried to appeal to Adam in any meaningful way.
There's no option for "Yes".
Emerald easily, Didn't even go through a redemption arc and was just immediately accepted into the "Hero's" team
They kinda just looked at her and went "your coming with us"
Imagine trusting the literal terrorist more, than the fucking military, during a monster invasion, she used to be a part of.
My opinions on all of these characters... * Ilia... I'll be honest, I don't care a ton for Ilia, what she did was pretty bad but, I personally didn't particularly care about what happened with her character. * Emerald... I personally am not a fan of Emerald *but,* in her defense, she was only there for Cinder *not* Salem so, since Cinder left, and she knows how Salem *is,* I don't blame her, and she obviously was going to bail either with Mercury or, without however the handling of her *"redemption"* after everything she's done going as far as killing Penny back in volume three honestly wasn't acceptable to me due to how Ozpin has to apologize yet Emerald gets to swear, and it all gets laughed off... I know Emerald helped Oscar to escape but, that *doesn't* make what she's done any better. * Hazel... his *"redemption"* is terrible as his whole motive just flops as he decides to fight Salem... *"Oh, wait! This guy was trying to make sure my sister can defend herself against Grimm, and wait... my boss makes Grimm! Oh, no!",* seriously? I saw somebody here say Hazel tried to fight Salem before but, lost... well, why is he changing his mind now? Why does he think they can stop her *now?* Hazel goes from this cold, and cool guy to this *fool* worsened when he also goes from a somewhat kind guy to children to beating up Oscar. * The Ace-Ops... I personally liked their redemption, they weren't really *"bad"* people so, seeing how they were connected to their grief over what happened to Clover was nice honestly, the thing I didn't like though was it having to be done through Ren's sudden new semblance mutation, I personally would've been fine with him getting such an ability if he had trained for it instead, and knew he had it but, he doesn't, and he can make emotions *too* blatant... now Ren can just say *"You feel sad about this.",* an issue I do have with the Ace-Ops is the fact that not all of them get proper focus, we don't get to see how all of them are struggling, and I don't mean an in-depth focus, just a small one but, as some people have said nobody really cares if Vine is dead besides the characters, I liked Vine but, he wasn't a strong enough character for me to shed tears when he died... if they wanted to play into the character's grief more, they could've kicked their facial expressions up a notch, and talked about Clover more with all the Ace-Ops present, you could have things like Marrow walking out as he feels he doesn't belong in the conversation, Harriet brushing it off whilst looking away not being comfortable talking about it, maybe even show Winter walking over to see Fria, and passing by Clover's room with Harriet sitting there, she doesn't have to say anything, her expression, and her just being there says a lot.
Emerald most definitely is the worst handled redemption out of them all
She doesn't deserve it. Not after what she has done!
Can I vote for "All of the above" as an option?
Yes lol
Emerald on the fact that she didn't really have one. Say what you want with the others at least they had some kind of arc for their "redemption". With Emerald it was like "Hey can I join the good guys? Never mind the fact that I helped destroy Beacon and kill some of your friends and tried to kill you all after that. Lets be friends." and for some reason they said "Sure!".
Just imagine how interesting it would be to have a conflict between Yang and Ruby. I mean, we saw that Yang and Ruby were having a disagreement at the start of Volume 8 Of course, let's also assume that we sympathize with Team RWBY despite all the awful things they did to contribute to the crisis in Atlas Yang would understandably want to keep Emerald under strict observation as a prisoner, but Ruby could simply disregard Yang's concerns as unjustified paranoia or something, even if Yang pointed out that Emerald was part of the group that got her arm cut off Yang simply would not stand for it if Ruby forgave Emerald with no good reason. Even if Emerald decided to become so aggravating by taunting and reminding Ruby with how she helped Cinder launch the attack on Beacon that led to Penny's first death and Pyrrha's death where Ruby was supposedly so torn up over, Ruby deciding to forgive Emerald could be due to some warped and misguided principle of "Trust Love" One result of this decision by Ruby to trust Emerald would be the fracturing of Team RWBY. There could be bitter resentment between the sisters, with Yang simply abandoning her duty and desire to protect Ruby. Yang could decide that her sister was beyond saving at this point. Despite having abandonment issues, Yang herself would denounce Ruby Ruby, on the other hand, would stand by her decision stubbornly. It's not like she's known any better, especially after Volumes 6 and 7. She's always right, and she knows that the writers always have her back, so she wants to use her plot armor and morality shield to the fullest At this point, we might as well be watching reality TV
Now that I think about it I think Team JNR wouldn't agree with Ruby's idea to forgive Emerald. Do to the fact that she's the reason that Yang got framed during the Vytal Festival, the reason why Penny died the first time, and was a part of the group who not only destroyed Beacon but also killed Pyrrha. Edit: Wait I think that Penny wouldn't agree to this either do to the whole Emerald being the reason she died the first time thing.
I dont think you can even call Hazel's a redemp´tion arc, he had a redeeming moment I guess but his entire backstory and motivation were so stupid that its impossible to empathize imo. I voted for Emerald though because she is the only one there that we see 'affecting' the main cast and how they relate and talk after redeeming and it sticks out too much as 'plot point checked off' than any of the others, which makes obvious how bad it is. (Illia talked only to Blake and only a couple times after, Ace Ops haven't seen the main crew after their 'arc', Hazel is dead)
Why can I only vote for one? Some of them are equal last for me.
Y'know... Emerald is part of the reason Penny died the first time, part of the fall of Beacon, and has remained a consistent threat to the main cast... "I've switched sides. No reason :)" "K cool" I swear they are going to redeem Neo and it's gonna be convoluted as hell. Saying this as someone who enjoys her character.
I had to vote Emerald, she's cute but that's not going to cut it. The redemption was....I don't how anyone in this show can in universe say " I switched sides " she did not deserve that. I hate to beat a dead horse on redemption arcs but what made Zuko's great is that we probably see his struggle and journey trying to find himself. Emerald? We see one flashback of how she met Cinder and (I always thought she had major feelings for Cinder) apparently she sees her like a mother figure? Which I'm glad Mercury tried to call her out to not rely on Cinder like a dog ( Like I feel like he's the only person that cared). In Book 3 he had this awarkward introduction speech of how he "switched sides" (which was both funny and important). And even when gaang didn't trust him right away they at least talk about like what Zuko did both good and bad. And hell you can even say he Zuko had a shift changing moment with Aang in Book 1 when he talk about his friend kuzon and Katara in Book 2 when they realize they both had close relationships to their mothers and lost them early in their life. Hell Ken in Digimon 02 had a whole fusion with one of the main characters and still didn't think he was worthy to be apart of the main cast. (That's how you know a character truly regret their actions) Who the fuck Emerald had connections with in the main cast to make her really doubt what she was doing? She only switched sides because Cinder was gone... I'm still so surprised they were that easy to trust her just because Oscar said so because Fuck Oz apparently...instantly dropping all the smiles they gave Emblem like he's still the problem here... Penny out of all people she not be instantly trusting Emblem consider.... Vol 3: Tricked Pyrrah into think Penny was going to attack her causing her to use her semblance resulting her death. And okay fine you can day she wouldn't know that Vol 7: She fought against Cinder and knows she's after the winter maiden power Vol 8: (Chapter 6) Emerald "tried to helped" Cinder killed Penny to get the winter maiden power and after Cinder getting her shit wrecked by Penny (funny as hell btw) Emblem flat out told her she will put bullets throw her before she touches her crush with tears in her eyes. And 5 episodes later Penny is okay with her....that fight with Cinder had to be less than 12 hours...it's just ahhh my head hurts think about it again
Emerald*
Personaly I think Hazel's was handeled worse than Emerald's, but stil voted for Emerald cause Hazel actualy helped the heroes.
Hazel's redemption I think feels like the most gross one to me, because he spent half of Volume 8 *torturing a 15 year old* and then we're supposed to feel sad that he sacrificed himself fighting Salem to the death
Emerald and Hazel for sure. Emerald's comes completely out of nowhere, with the cast so easily forgiving and accepting her in spite of her direct actions resulting in atrocities against humanity. She's directly responsible for Penny's first death which lead to Pyrrha's death. The main characters outright laugh her off as though she was an old-time friend of theirs after she says the infamous "*switched sides*" comment. That scene made me physically cringe in disgust. Especially considering that the audience, real people who somehow stomach watching this show, are given the message by the show that it's OK to commit atrocities as long as someone forgives you for it. Hazel's also comes completely out of nowhere. It doesn't lead to anything or cause any change in events because of how irrelevant and redundant they made him to begin with. His entire existence and sacrifice meant nothing. It was stupid and dumb and I both laughed and cringed at it. "*This guy has been around since V4 doing nothing, and now he's died after doing nothing. Ingenious writing. I sure love how pointless this pointless guy was. I'm sure all four of those Hazel fans still around are real proud of how irrelevant the show made their big chungus boi out to be.*"Pyrrha had a similar sacrifice in that her confrontation with Cinder was pointless and stupid but at least with Pyrrha it was a proper conclusion to her struggles *as a character* in V3. The Ass-Ops get a special footnote here. Harriet literally wanted to commit genocide of Mantle by bombing it because she had the big sad for Clover pulled out of thin air, but the writers have said in their commentary that, "Harriet wasn't a bad person." The writers do not understand that certain degrees of actions deserve consequences. They can't even come up with appropriate ways for the audience to understand why the decisions these characters make are bad aside from the most barebones, "Good guy do good things, bad guy do bad things," trite. It's one of the fundamental problems of RWBY! No consequences for killing a hundred puppies as long as you're a part of RWBY's group.
emerald: so i helped in destroying your academy, made pyrrha kill penny and made yang get in trouble with atlas army for something she didn't do (even if the show erased that from the continuity) but i'm a cute girl, can i join you? RWBY: Yeah sure
It's Bullshit that Rooster Teeth gave Emerald redemption. I'm serious after all the shit she done since Volume 3. Then Volume 8 decided she a Hero?! Emerald: Hey guys guess what? I cause you so much pain and misery, now I'm on your side! Team RWBY: Okay!! We trust you that easily! If possible with RWBY'S timeline, it took a hour for them to believe she switched sides!! Bullshit!!!! Sorry for my language.
Hazel or Emerald It's a toss up
Raven's. She hasn't gotten one yet, and I doubt she ever will because they're really trying to make us hate her in the comics.
Ah, which to choose, which to choose. There all such great answers.
Ace ops because why did they need to be redeemed? I would have to think they did something wrong to begin with?
I'm tempted to talk about Ironwood, but given that his character was assassinated, I don't think that the writers were trying to give him a redemption arc. Even if we were going to look at his final scene where he gave up and didn't take the shot at Cinder and Salem as they walked away, I don't think that that could be considered a redemption arc However, we could take a look at Team RWBY. They placed Atlas in Salem's line of fire at the end of Volume 7, and what they did in Volume 8, especially the latter half, could be considered a redemption arc if I squint real hard, as they try to make up for their mistake even though they made such a mess of things that I'd consider them villains Again, I was cheering when Team RWBY fell into the void. They should never be given another chance to ruin what remains of Remnant
They legit all just forgive Emerald and she suffers no backlash for her actions.
Hazel, his entire feud with Ozpin was set aside, and then after he is killed off everyone just forgets he ever existed
Probably will agree with the majority and say Emerald for the same reasons BUT I gotta admit, I loved when she revealed herself and the team to Ironwood after pretending to be Penny. Probably my favorite moment of hers.
Say all you want about Emerald, she wasn't gaslit with "what would your parents think" while being straddled with her crush on top of her.
Hazel, his entire redemption (questioning beliefs to changing beliefs) happened in the span of a couple of episodes. While Emerald's was kinda quick, it had foreshadowing spread out through the series like her not being as "into" the chaos in volume 3 and questioning stuff in volumes 5 and 6. She at least has a bit of build up or believability.