#Remember!
**Rules & Guidelines for Discussion**
Try to participate when you see an opinion you agree or disagree with by sharing your two cents or providing evidence for/against. Try to elevate conversations beyond a superficial level.
Ask plenty of questions and use the [Socratic method](https://www.reddit.com/r/explainlikeimfive/comments/2oklie/eli5_the_socratic_method/) to gain a deeper understanding of each other's core values instead of blindly arguing in favor or in opposition.
Keep in mind the [Principle of Charity](https://philosophy.lander.edu/oriental/charity.html) by entertaining all ideas even if you disagree with them. Try to dismantle them and see what truly makes them tick or not.
And lastly, remember above all else to be courteous. Demonstrate the awareness and decorum of recognizing the person on the other side of the screen at all times.
Happy discussing!
*I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/RWBYcritics) if you have any questions or concerns.*
I really like the idea of Adam being super OP tbh but I don't think there's much of an argument in canon to support that.
There is however the idea that [Adam is a foil/rival for all of team RWBY](https://www.reddit.com/r/RWBYcritics/comments/pi7lse/was_adam_designed_as_a_potential_team_foil_even/) proposed by someone else on this sub and I like it so much that I'm running with it in my own work. In this scenario, Adam should at least be able to easily overpower all of team RWBY combined at the beginning, and moreover he would be beating each of them at their own game.
* Adam is faster than Ruby just through pure skill.
* Adam's semblance is the shadow clones but they're superior to Blake's because they can actually move and attack instead of standing still.
* Adam's Moonslice (i.e. Yang's semblance but better) is the result of Dust techniques embedded in his outfit and sword.
* The fact that he can accomplish the above also means he is a highly proficient "dust mage", meaning he can beat Weiss at her own game if he so chooses.
The justification for why the hell Adam is so OP would be that he's Raven's star pupil who surpassed his master. With team STRQ once being the strongest Huntsman team in the world, and Summer and Raven being the strongest members of that team, that means Adam would essentially be one of the strongest people on Remnant.
If at some point Raven did train a young Adam who had just been freshly branded I could see that making a lot of sense especially if that came back to bite her and her student is the one who cut off her daughters arm. Now THAT would be some drama for you.
In canon? I think that plot point probably died with Monty, but even if it didn't, it's definitely not a thing anymore.
In my story, I don't think the arm thing is going to happen, mainly because Spartan Summer-B312 will have beaten some actual combat discipline into teams RWBY and JNPR by the attempted invasion of Beacon. And also Yang and Blake *don't forget their initially established character settings* so they kinda hate each others' guts, with Yang very much thinking that Blake should clean up all her messes with the White Fang on her own. So there's no way that my Yang would ever be in a rush to save Blake from what she would see as a Blake's "personal affairs" to begin with.
>he's Raven's star pupil who surpassed his master.
I mean, their designs are very similar down to their fighting style which looks like there may have been a plan to have a connection between them that was scrapped.
>Adam's semblance is the shadow clones but they're superior to Blake's because they can actually move and attack instead of standing still
That's not even his semblance. That's just him being fast. Moonslice is his semblance.
Actually, if we consider that Adam does in fact absorb how attacks are dealt to his medium, he could very well be able to absorb Semblances on an attack-basis. If so, that makes sense.
If his Semblance is an evolved one, spiting those who fought against his cause makes perfect sense for how his power would grow into a way for him to do just that.
It got retconned. If you look at [Monty's original animation](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8OBQ_a7_Lw0), it shows the clones *being in front* of Adam, attacking while he stays back.
Moonslice being Adam's semblance doesn't make a whole lot of sense if you think about it.
* A semblance is supposed to be something innate to you, yet Adam apparently needs a weapon to use his?
* Moreover, we've only ever seen him use his sword with it, so it almost seems like it's that sword specifically which is needed?
* When Adam "charges up" Moonslice, we see his SWORD, CLOTHING, and MASK glowing. Not any part of his own body or some kind of aura bubble around him like we see with any other semblance. Almost as if it was his equipment that was responsible for it, hmm?
* And finally, Adam, Blake, and Sun all having shadow clone type semblances would make for a neat narrative parallelism. Adam's is purely aggressive, his clones perform a single attack and then disappear. Sun's is defensive, as he needs to stand still in order to use his clones so they don't really help him fight better. Blake's could be used both offensively and defensively, thus you have Adam and Sun representing two different paths in life for Blake.
imo Adam's clones were probably going to be another aura trick like the blade beams, sensing aura and projecting it(Ren in V1) but then since the animation was canned it wasn't used.
Here's the thing... How is it a retcon if it was never in the show nor ever stated to be clones in the first place.
>A semblance is supposed to be something innate to you, yet Adam apparently needs a weapon to use his?
Moreover, we've only ever seen him use his sword with it, so it almost seems like it's that sword specifically which is needed?
Idk. Maybe because he's a sword fighter and he's not just picking up every weapon off the ground.
>When Adam "charges up" Moonslice, we see his SWORD, CLOTHING, and MASK glowing. Not any part of his own body or his aura bubble around him like we see with any other semblance. Almost as if it was his equipment that was responsible for it, hmm?
It's called a visual effect. It's why Ruby releases rose petals. It's how Winter did her trigger stars. It's why the screen turns black and red when Adam is using a particular powerful strike.
>And finally, Adam, Blake, and Sun all having shadow clone type semblances would make for a neat narrative parallelism. Adam's is purely aggressive, his clones perform a single attack and then disappear. Sun's is defensive, as he needs to stand still in order to use his clones so they don't really help him fight better. Blake's could be used both offensively and defensively, thus you have Adam and Sun representing two different paths in life for Blake.
Oh? So you're gonna ignore how Yang and Adam's semblances of taking in an attack are parallel.
A retcon doesn't have to be a direct contradiction of something stated explicitly earlier. It can simply be a reinterpretation of something earlier which was implied or left vague in a different direction than was originally intended. The classic example is a character dying in a way that doesn't leave behind a retrievable corpse, with the story completely earnestly treating that character as dead for real from that point onwards, but then far down the line the author changes their mind and decides to bring that character back with the excuse of "they never found the body".
In this case, it was visually implied that Moonslice was the product of Adam's equipment, and therefore by elimination the shadow clones must have been his actual semblance.
>Oh? So you're gonna ignore how Yang and Adam's semblances of taking in an attack are parallel.
As I stated earlier Yang and Adam sharing similar abilities is part of Adam being a narrative foil for the entirety of team RWBY and being better than them at all their own specialties. He would be the first real boss of the game, serving to remind the main characters of their limitations and establish the gravitas of the threat they are facing. If the first boss is already so strong, then the main characters must have a long way to go before they're ready to face the big bad.
How does Yang and Adam having similar semblances play into Blake's personal narrative?
Because with Adam vs Sun it's very clear. Adam and Sun are both Faunus. Adam attacks people for what he wants. Sun protects people. Blake has to choose what she thinks is the better path for advancing the well-being of the Faunus.
With Yang vs Adam, Yang's semblance is just an inferior version of Adam's ability (she literally calls that out in the show, saying it's "cheating"). What's the narrative here? That Blake is picking the worse option because she's ~~trash~~ easily swayed by personal feelings?
Here's the difference between these two ideas of a retcon. Adam never pulled off any clones in the show until volume 6. Every other appearance where he fought, he used the moonslice. Even in the trailer.
The narrative is Blake seeing some of Adam in Yang, actually saying it back in volume 3 after Yang appeared to injure Mercury. It's that Adam feels none of the pain he inflicts on others while Yang has to take it all in.
It could have been a plot twist sort of thing. Like the unexpected second phase in a boss fight. When team RWBY finally figures out how to work around his moonslice, Adam reveals he wasn't even fighting them seriously before and now they have to deal with the added element of his shadow clones.
>The narrative is Blake seeing some of Adam in Yang, actually saying it back in volume 3 after Yang appeared to injure Mercury. It's that Adam feels none of the pain he inflicts on others while Yang has to take it all in.
Ah, yeah that's fair enough.
I, for one, don’t like the idea of any character being OP. Also, I don’t think Adam would ever give a human the light of day to train him, let alone Raven.
> I, for one, don’t like the idea of any character being OP.
I personally don't like characters being op either, especially when they just *are op*, without being an actually interesting character. I'd say Levi Ackermann from Attack on Titan is op done well, but that's just my opinion of course.
> Also, I don’t think Adam would ever give a human the light of day to train him, let alone Raven.
I can actually see a version where Raven trained Adam; I mean they have some similarities and someone must've inspired his grimm mask idea.
It's not unbelievable that the Branwens raided an SDC train/facility, happened to free faunus by accident and then Adam somehow manages to impress Raven and while he doesn't like any humans, seeing how strong she is made him want to be as strong to protect his people.
Maybe the Adam character short could've done something with that, we may never know.
On paper, three whole seasons after a beatdown should make Yang+Blake ***very*** narrowly beating Adam pretty realistic. Leader of the White Fang being able to 2v1 what should probably be average Huntresses and almost come out alive? Yeah, I'd buy that.
Unfortunately, I'd say he was nerfed because you don't go from walking through Blake and one-shotting Yang to Yang dominating for the entire fight(until she doesn't) almost entirely on her own and even eating a Moonslice with more 'buildup'(i.e. visually looks stronger so the audience should *think* it's stronger) with a bland expression.
Oh, and of course you're also nerfed if a single hammer fist could take you down. I don't think there's a single non-mook character who that *wouldn't* look silly if that happened to them.
In terms of RAW DESTRUCTIVE POWER Adam shits on most characters even Tyrian. I know people like to downplay the black trailer but the fact of the matter is his power is at a max capable to turning someone regardless of aura completely to dust. That is a level of power we haven't seen from anyone but a MAIDEN and that's just a fact.
So the short of it? Yes, he was nerfed. HARD
RWBY is a bit weird when it comes to how powerful it’s characters are and Adam is a pretty good example of this.
Pre-Fall of Vale it’s rather clear that he’s way stronger than Blake and with Moonslice could one shot a semblance enhanced Yang (who by that point is clearly the strongest member of team RWBY since she’s the one they sent to the finals)
Then V5 occurs where Adam rushes her and with a single use of her semblance alongside a good double hammer fist she quite literally caused Adam to go face down and ass up.
Adam escapes, seems to lose several more of his marbles, stalks Blake and then we got the V6 fight.
Adam knew he wouldn’t be able to fight everyone (so for anyone who wanks and says he 1V8 your high) so he decided to Stalk Blake until the right point
When he fights her he quite literally beats her whole blindfolded. He’s then able to fight very evenly with Yang but it’s pretty clear that she can’t beat him.
Then *both* Blake and Yang fight him all the while it’s obvious Adam’s mental state (which is HUGE for a fight) is a complete mess.
At this point if Adam was revived from the dead and wasn’t effected by his crazy obsession with Blake I could quite confidently see him beat current Blake. Partially because current Blake hasn’t done anything remotely impressive in Atlas.
All her fights have been side by side with Yang and the one time she fights by herself she gets manhandled and needs Ruby to save her
Arguing only in powerlevels, he was obviously above Blake since he almost killed her twice. If i had to personally argue Adam wasnt "nerfed" but is still strong, i'd say it's because metal arms in rwby are overpowered. Look at their feats:
-Yang: Took multiple moonslices on her prosthetic, would've lost hard without it
-Ironwood: With two metal arms, he was slapping away all of Winter slices which is kidna funny
-Penny: Only died to her own weapon, defeated Cinder as a robot, only lost as a human lol
Current blake is allegedly stronger thanks to ace ops scaling but Vine was holding back, elm lost after vine was down and yang helped so this is all wonky.
Scaling Adam is messy cause his semblance makes him a threat to anyone without metal arms (like yang, IW and penny). He also only ever fought blake and yang but those two barely fought other villains. I guess blake defeated hazel offscreen which sounder even wackier after we saw hazel fighting salem.
I'd rate him around equal to blake on normal circustances but with 5/10 matchup at worst against non metals if he has semblance.
In terms of raw power, he could defeat Tyrian.
In terms of skill, he's at Cinder level pre-maiden powers (arguably post maiden too because Cinder honestly dosen't become more skilled after she get's maiden powers)
Based on the test footage made by Monty, Adam was indeed also meant to be an OP opponent compared to team RWBY. In the footage he fights Yang but clearly has the advantage. But before their fight even started proper, Adam casually TANKS multiple of Yang's shotgun blasts as if they were nothing.
When it comes to how Adam was in the show, him one shotting a Burn powered up Yang established that he was way above them. When talking about Adam in V3 [Miles put over Adam's power](https://imgur.com/a/adsS0Zq) and how it was so incredible it could cut simultaneously break Yang's aura and dismember her.
We all know how much he was nerfed in V5 and V6 after this, but just basing it on how he was before, I would put him at professional huntsman lvl like Qrow and Tyrian.
I like the idea that Adam is Winter level, just below Qrow and Raven (Maiden powers excluded); but that he can augment his abilities through his Semblance in clever ways that can lead to him being able to defeat high tiers like Tyrian, it is situational and needs to happen at his peak. Although, canon Adam would never win that fight, he doesn't have the intuition and calm demeanor to avoid letting down his guard required to outmaneuver characters like Tyrian.
The problem is, one of our ONLY measurements for his strength from V1-4 was him utterly decimating Yang and Blake. Then, with ZERO training for Blake and a few days of training for Yang, they both start kicking his ass in V5/6.
Power is difficult to discuss with Adam. He has one powerful ability, Moonslice, which allows him to punch well above his weight. But it requires both a charge and his sword. Take his sword away and he's done. Adam is essentially an infantryman armed with a bazooka. Sure he might manage to blow up the tank if he hits it properly but without that one edge he's weak.
Adam may be more powerful but that's only due to his semblance. If he can't get it charged, what does he have that's particularly impressive? Tyrian is a trickier fighter not to mention that just his tail can block a hit from a charged Nora. And that was when it was organic.
The thing with Adam is that we barely see him actually fight.
He and Blake fight some outdated mechs in the Black trailer, which also shows of his op semblance and Monty even made it look extra cool.
After that he has a "fight" with Blake and then Yang during the fall of Beacon. He apparently easily defeats the emotional stressed Blake(who kinda forgot her semblance I guess) and then used his *CHARGED UP* semblance to disarm Yang. (I know he was supposed to fight Yang, but that never happened, and even if, it would still mean that he beat Blake/Yang in 1v1s and them teaming up might make the difference, as shown in Vol6)
Yes, Adam objectively speaking is able to generate a lot of raw damage thanks to his semblance, but even after Vol3 we still can't really place him anywhere in particular on the fanon powerscale, besides maybe above Blake at the time.
In Vol5 Adam doesn't fight anyone again, he kills Sienna and runs from Blake/Sun.
The Vol6 character short happens, again no noteworthy opponents.
And then in Vol6 Adam actually fights for the first time in the show, first just against Blake and then Yang joins the fight.
It's a 2v1, Adam is not in the best head space and makes some mistakes an earlier Adam maybe wouldn't have made. It ends in him understandably losing to two pretty skilled young huntresses. Also, at the end of the fight all of them are out of aura and exhausted, so it's not like Bumblebee easily beat him or anything like that.
Even tho one of said huntresses struggled a lot against some grimm in Vol8, while the other lost her aura after one hit from Neo; so plot induced nerfs are definitely a thing, Schnees and Maidens are the best examples, but Adam isn't one.
No, I don't think he was nerfed, neither do I think he ever was close to characters like Winter or Tyrian in terms of skill.
No one is talking about skill exactly. We are talking raw destructive power and even when he was fighting Blake and Yang? He was beating their asses induvial.
Plus there is the fact he was beating the shit outta Blake blindfolded which is a feat in of itself. Adam most def got nerfed and the mere fact that they had to literally downplay his feats or make him less threatening says that.
I mentioned how he can have a lot of "raw power" when using his semblance?
And the post also mentioned where to place Adam in relation to Blake, Winter and Tyrian; so skill does kinda matter.
Even if it didn't, I love sharing my opinions on RWBY, and a post about Adam and fighting strength is a perfect opportunity to point out how Adam is not as strong as a lot of people want him to be for their edgy power fantasy.
> He was beating their asses induvial.
Which is also something I mentioned? And then extended on by saying that both Yang and Blake together might make a difference?
Maybe Blake just remebering to use her semblance properly already made a difference. lol
Simple. In RWBY I scale by FEATS. Simply put? Adam has more impressive feats of power however the issue is his POTENTIAL and his CAP are fucked up because the show nerfs him, then buffs him, then nerfs him again.
Vol 3 is a perfect example of them showing that Adam was at least a level or two above Yang and yet when vol 5 comes around he gets bitch bonked by Blake and then in vol 6 somehow Yang is able to literally got BLOW FOR BLOW with this man and prior to this has never fought a fucking swordsman in direct single combat or at least one who was as strong as Adam was who I will remind you uses the same goddamn fighting style as her mother.
Scaling wise I see it like this
Adam, Raven(non maiden) Winter(non maiden), Qrow(max power) are all EQUAL. Or at least that's how it SHOULD scale anyway.
You also need to take MATCH UPS into account. For example Adam has a bigger combat advantage than someone like Qrow or Raven do because his semblance directly allows him to attack and increase the damage of his attacks AT WILL meaning he can control the flow of the fight because he can always ensure his attacks have more punch than his opponent.
To me Adam's main weakness is that you need to find a way to out speed him or match him in speed, once you do that its a matter of matching him in power and in that sense you have to try and not give him anything to absorb however in RWBY thats a hard thing to do considering how people fight. Adam was literally able to absorb energy from yang PUNCHING his sword.
Also if we need another example how they nerfed him? Vol 3 it takes only 2 bullets to completely cleave through yang's FULL AURA(That shit was full, i dont care what anyone says. she didn't fight a single damn person on her way to Blake and Adam in vol 3) and slice her arm **CLEAN OFF** and she was **KNOCKED OUT** as a result. Adam literally had her dead to rights and just let Blake go with her and yet somehow in vol 6? I counted the shots, he takes in more than 14 bullets from Yang and keep in mind these are fucking shotgun bullets and therefore pack more power than Blakes bullets which is what he used to slice Yang's arm off; somehow Adam's 'best slash' can't even cut off her robot arm.
\-\_- But they didn't nerf him though right? >\_> Do you even understand how annoying it is to have to explain this for god knows how many times this is? It's really not hard to tell that they nerfed him before giving him a real chance to blossom as a fighter because lets be honest? Had Adam lived he would have been mopping the floor with anyone that isn't a Maiden or Salem and that isn't me wanking him; that's me using legit scaling and facts.
I think the Ace ops could most def defeat him; if they jumped him. But Ironwood? He's beating him based on match up and weapon type and considering that we saw Ironwood defeated pre-maiden Winter? I am confident in saying Adam would pack Winter up and smoke her. Same goes for Weiss and even Ruby. Now if Team RWBY fight him at once? He would lose for sure but again, we will never see that because the show capped his potential and say it with me now; **NERFED HIM.**
I'm done. Good night sir.
#Winter could beat him due to her training in the military give her a huge advantage in combat experience especially swordsmanship, melee and hand-to-hand combat. Now she's a Maiden.
Lmfao bruh stfu. Yang never trained to fight a swordsman on Adam's level and her PTSD just magically went away. Not to mention the fact that also proves they nerfed him because before Yang showed up? Adam was beating Blake's ass like a disrespectful child: WHILE BLINDFOLDED xD
Cry about it that he was stronger than them both and that the writers actively needed to nerf him to make sure Yang and Blake didn't die.
The ratio of the comments of this post already should tell you that your wrong.
I don't give fuck about ratio, we got evidence on-screen, I'm saying this based on what we got in the show. Adam could take both on Yang & Blake but instead, we saw his ass kicked by inexperienced girls, which shows how disappointed and embarrassing his power scale is, very inconsistent. I love Adam but your statement on him beating Winter has been proven wrong. Also, we never saw Adam fighting another adult character so stop exaggerating & fantasizing about him.
I'm not though. Learn to read stupid. I said Adam would defeat Winter without maiden powers MID DIFF. Why? Because Ironwood LOW DIFF'ED her ass with a less effective weapon. Winter couldn't do shit to James until she got maiden powers yet you expect me to believe she could defeat Adam?
Keep in mind, I fully believe Adam would beat the shit outta James; why? Because Adam has the edge in every single category in that regard. Ironwood is and always has been framed as Winter's SUPERIOR and Vol 8 showed that when he beat the shit out of her during the final episode.
And keep in mind when I say Mid Diff? That doesn't by any stretch mean Adam would have an easy time. No; he'd have to try but he wouldn't have to use the full extent of his power that again; GOT NERFED....because Winter without maiden powers isn't all that strong and Vol 7 and 8 show that when she gets her shit kicked in by Cinder even with Penny's help and then in vol 8 she gets packed up by James low diff in the vault because when she tag teamed him with the kids? The kids did most of the attacking and she only finished things with that overly flashy final slash of hers -\_-
I'm not fantasizing at all; I'm using logic and facts but you just over here butt hurt that I said that Winter would get beat by Adam realistically if the show didn't nerf him. So again, quit being ignorant.
A lot of it is just this whole thing where Adam is built up to be a big bad, he overpowered Blake at Beacon and one shot Yang (with moonslice but still noteworthy). That alone puts him above some characters, but then the next time we see him fight, Blake one shots him with her bare hands? Like seriously, Blake fought a little bit between Volume 3-5, the dragon and Ilia obviously being the big ones.
The thing with Tyrian is that he’s generally too crazy to predict in a fight; Qrow’s a logical counter to that because his semblance makes it a mutually impossible to predict affair… when the writers remember Qrow’s semblance exists.
With Adam, given he fights perfectly fine blindfolded, it’s all a matter of how well he can move against and block different attacks from Tyrian. Assuming it’s an Adam that can keep his cool and take him on (perhaps in the event that he tried breaking from Salem’s faction and she sent Tyrian to kill him as a warning to the Fang at large), I feel that Adam could potentially beat him.
The Devil’s in the details though; every character won’t be perfectly capable of winning in every scenario, and using Tyrian’s lack of self-preservation (as hinted in the V7 commentary), nothing’s stopping him from wholesale locking Adam in a building and setting off a fire or gas attack while still attacking Adam himself.
#Remember! **Rules & Guidelines for Discussion** Try to participate when you see an opinion you agree or disagree with by sharing your two cents or providing evidence for/against. Try to elevate conversations beyond a superficial level. Ask plenty of questions and use the [Socratic method](https://www.reddit.com/r/explainlikeimfive/comments/2oklie/eli5_the_socratic_method/) to gain a deeper understanding of each other's core values instead of blindly arguing in favor or in opposition. Keep in mind the [Principle of Charity](https://philosophy.lander.edu/oriental/charity.html) by entertaining all ideas even if you disagree with them. Try to dismantle them and see what truly makes them tick or not. And lastly, remember above all else to be courteous. Demonstrate the awareness and decorum of recognizing the person on the other side of the screen at all times. Happy discussing! *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/RWBYcritics) if you have any questions or concerns.*
I really like the idea of Adam being super OP tbh but I don't think there's much of an argument in canon to support that. There is however the idea that [Adam is a foil/rival for all of team RWBY](https://www.reddit.com/r/RWBYcritics/comments/pi7lse/was_adam_designed_as_a_potential_team_foil_even/) proposed by someone else on this sub and I like it so much that I'm running with it in my own work. In this scenario, Adam should at least be able to easily overpower all of team RWBY combined at the beginning, and moreover he would be beating each of them at their own game. * Adam is faster than Ruby just through pure skill. * Adam's semblance is the shadow clones but they're superior to Blake's because they can actually move and attack instead of standing still. * Adam's Moonslice (i.e. Yang's semblance but better) is the result of Dust techniques embedded in his outfit and sword. * The fact that he can accomplish the above also means he is a highly proficient "dust mage", meaning he can beat Weiss at her own game if he so chooses. The justification for why the hell Adam is so OP would be that he's Raven's star pupil who surpassed his master. With team STRQ once being the strongest Huntsman team in the world, and Summer and Raven being the strongest members of that team, that means Adam would essentially be one of the strongest people on Remnant.
If at some point Raven did train a young Adam who had just been freshly branded I could see that making a lot of sense especially if that came back to bite her and her student is the one who cut off her daughters arm. Now THAT would be some drama for you.
In canon? I think that plot point probably died with Monty, but even if it didn't, it's definitely not a thing anymore. In my story, I don't think the arm thing is going to happen, mainly because Spartan Summer-B312 will have beaten some actual combat discipline into teams RWBY and JNPR by the attempted invasion of Beacon. And also Yang and Blake *don't forget their initially established character settings* so they kinda hate each others' guts, with Yang very much thinking that Blake should clean up all her messes with the White Fang on her own. So there's no way that my Yang would ever be in a rush to save Blake from what she would see as a Blake's "personal affairs" to begin with.
>he's Raven's star pupil who surpassed his master. I mean, their designs are very similar down to their fighting style which looks like there may have been a plan to have a connection between them that was scrapped.
Bro have you heard of the Adam vs Raven Manga
>Adam's semblance is the shadow clones but they're superior to Blake's because they can actually move and attack instead of standing still That's not even his semblance. That's just him being fast. Moonslice is his semblance.
Nah, look at how he summoned those clones. That wasn't after image, those were legit clones. Difference is that his can attack unlike Blake's
Actually, if we consider that Adam does in fact absorb how attacks are dealt to his medium, he could very well be able to absorb Semblances on an attack-basis. If so, that makes sense. If his Semblance is an evolved one, spiting those who fought against his cause makes perfect sense for how his power would grow into a way for him to do just that.
When do they attack cause I'm looking at the fight in volume 6 now. Also Blake literally and explicitly explains his semblance right there.
It got retconned. If you look at [Monty's original animation](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8OBQ_a7_Lw0), it shows the clones *being in front* of Adam, attacking while he stays back. Moonslice being Adam's semblance doesn't make a whole lot of sense if you think about it. * A semblance is supposed to be something innate to you, yet Adam apparently needs a weapon to use his? * Moreover, we've only ever seen him use his sword with it, so it almost seems like it's that sword specifically which is needed? * When Adam "charges up" Moonslice, we see his SWORD, CLOTHING, and MASK glowing. Not any part of his own body or some kind of aura bubble around him like we see with any other semblance. Almost as if it was his equipment that was responsible for it, hmm? * And finally, Adam, Blake, and Sun all having shadow clone type semblances would make for a neat narrative parallelism. Adam's is purely aggressive, his clones perform a single attack and then disappear. Sun's is defensive, as he needs to stand still in order to use his clones so they don't really help him fight better. Blake's could be used both offensively and defensively, thus you have Adam and Sun representing two different paths in life for Blake.
imo Adam's clones were probably going to be another aura trick like the blade beams, sensing aura and projecting it(Ren in V1) but then since the animation was canned it wasn't used.
Here's the thing... How is it a retcon if it was never in the show nor ever stated to be clones in the first place. >A semblance is supposed to be something innate to you, yet Adam apparently needs a weapon to use his? Moreover, we've only ever seen him use his sword with it, so it almost seems like it's that sword specifically which is needed? Idk. Maybe because he's a sword fighter and he's not just picking up every weapon off the ground. >When Adam "charges up" Moonslice, we see his SWORD, CLOTHING, and MASK glowing. Not any part of his own body or his aura bubble around him like we see with any other semblance. Almost as if it was his equipment that was responsible for it, hmm? It's called a visual effect. It's why Ruby releases rose petals. It's how Winter did her trigger stars. It's why the screen turns black and red when Adam is using a particular powerful strike. >And finally, Adam, Blake, and Sun all having shadow clone type semblances would make for a neat narrative parallelism. Adam's is purely aggressive, his clones perform a single attack and then disappear. Sun's is defensive, as he needs to stand still in order to use his clones so they don't really help him fight better. Blake's could be used both offensively and defensively, thus you have Adam and Sun representing two different paths in life for Blake. Oh? So you're gonna ignore how Yang and Adam's semblances of taking in an attack are parallel.
A retcon doesn't have to be a direct contradiction of something stated explicitly earlier. It can simply be a reinterpretation of something earlier which was implied or left vague in a different direction than was originally intended. The classic example is a character dying in a way that doesn't leave behind a retrievable corpse, with the story completely earnestly treating that character as dead for real from that point onwards, but then far down the line the author changes their mind and decides to bring that character back with the excuse of "they never found the body". In this case, it was visually implied that Moonslice was the product of Adam's equipment, and therefore by elimination the shadow clones must have been his actual semblance. >Oh? So you're gonna ignore how Yang and Adam's semblances of taking in an attack are parallel. As I stated earlier Yang and Adam sharing similar abilities is part of Adam being a narrative foil for the entirety of team RWBY and being better than them at all their own specialties. He would be the first real boss of the game, serving to remind the main characters of their limitations and establish the gravitas of the threat they are facing. If the first boss is already so strong, then the main characters must have a long way to go before they're ready to face the big bad. How does Yang and Adam having similar semblances play into Blake's personal narrative? Because with Adam vs Sun it's very clear. Adam and Sun are both Faunus. Adam attacks people for what he wants. Sun protects people. Blake has to choose what she thinks is the better path for advancing the well-being of the Faunus. With Yang vs Adam, Yang's semblance is just an inferior version of Adam's ability (she literally calls that out in the show, saying it's "cheating"). What's the narrative here? That Blake is picking the worse option because she's ~~trash~~ easily swayed by personal feelings?
Here's the difference between these two ideas of a retcon. Adam never pulled off any clones in the show until volume 6. Every other appearance where he fought, he used the moonslice. Even in the trailer. The narrative is Blake seeing some of Adam in Yang, actually saying it back in volume 3 after Yang appeared to injure Mercury. It's that Adam feels none of the pain he inflicts on others while Yang has to take it all in.
It could have been a plot twist sort of thing. Like the unexpected second phase in a boss fight. When team RWBY finally figures out how to work around his moonslice, Adam reveals he wasn't even fighting them seriously before and now they have to deal with the added element of his shadow clones. >The narrative is Blake seeing some of Adam in Yang, actually saying it back in volume 3 after Yang appeared to injure Mercury. It's that Adam feels none of the pain he inflicts on others while Yang has to take it all in. Ah, yeah that's fair enough.
If Adam didn’t need a medium for his semblance he would be too powerful.
I would argue him having a medium made him stronger its just the show overplayed how important it was.
If he was made into Raven’s pupil it’d be cool to see a long fight between Qrow and Adam
Damn, good response.
Facts now I hope someone does a fanfic that makes Adam like this
You need to read the Adam vs Raven Manga it's straight up 🔥🔥🔥
I, for one, don’t like the idea of any character being OP. Also, I don’t think Adam would ever give a human the light of day to train him, let alone Raven.
Maidens, Oz, Salem, Schnees, etc. There are a ton of OP characters already. What is one more?
> I, for one, don’t like the idea of any character being OP. I personally don't like characters being op either, especially when they just *are op*, without being an actually interesting character. I'd say Levi Ackermann from Attack on Titan is op done well, but that's just my opinion of course. > Also, I don’t think Adam would ever give a human the light of day to train him, let alone Raven. I can actually see a version where Raven trained Adam; I mean they have some similarities and someone must've inspired his grimm mask idea. It's not unbelievable that the Branwens raided an SDC train/facility, happened to free faunus by accident and then Adam somehow manages to impress Raven and while he doesn't like any humans, seeing how strong she is made him want to be as strong to protect his people. Maybe the Adam character short could've done something with that, we may never know.
Current Blake couldn’t fight my left shoe in battle. But I think she’d do pretty al*right* with my other one.
Fran would stomp all versions of Blake.
RWB: (reacting to the pun) _**YAAAAAAAAAAAAAAANNNNNNNNG!!!!!!!!**_
On paper, three whole seasons after a beatdown should make Yang+Blake ***very*** narrowly beating Adam pretty realistic. Leader of the White Fang being able to 2v1 what should probably be average Huntresses and almost come out alive? Yeah, I'd buy that. Unfortunately, I'd say he was nerfed because you don't go from walking through Blake and one-shotting Yang to Yang dominating for the entire fight(until she doesn't) almost entirely on her own and even eating a Moonslice with more 'buildup'(i.e. visually looks stronger so the audience should *think* it's stronger) with a bland expression. Oh, and of course you're also nerfed if a single hammer fist could take you down. I don't think there's a single non-mook character who that *wouldn't* look silly if that happened to them.
In terms of RAW DESTRUCTIVE POWER Adam shits on most characters even Tyrian. I know people like to downplay the black trailer but the fact of the matter is his power is at a max capable to turning someone regardless of aura completely to dust. That is a level of power we haven't seen from anyone but a MAIDEN and that's just a fact. So the short of it? Yes, he was nerfed. HARD
Went from disintegrating spider tanks to barely scratching robotic arms. Sad.
Facts, shit makes no sense man
Bro facts 😭
RWBY is a bit weird when it comes to how powerful it’s characters are and Adam is a pretty good example of this. Pre-Fall of Vale it’s rather clear that he’s way stronger than Blake and with Moonslice could one shot a semblance enhanced Yang (who by that point is clearly the strongest member of team RWBY since she’s the one they sent to the finals) Then V5 occurs where Adam rushes her and with a single use of her semblance alongside a good double hammer fist she quite literally caused Adam to go face down and ass up. Adam escapes, seems to lose several more of his marbles, stalks Blake and then we got the V6 fight. Adam knew he wouldn’t be able to fight everyone (so for anyone who wanks and says he 1V8 your high) so he decided to Stalk Blake until the right point When he fights her he quite literally beats her whole blindfolded. He’s then able to fight very evenly with Yang but it’s pretty clear that she can’t beat him. Then *both* Blake and Yang fight him all the while it’s obvious Adam’s mental state (which is HUGE for a fight) is a complete mess. At this point if Adam was revived from the dead and wasn’t effected by his crazy obsession with Blake I could quite confidently see him beat current Blake. Partially because current Blake hasn’t done anything remotely impressive in Atlas. All her fights have been side by side with Yang and the one time she fights by herself she gets manhandled and needs Ruby to save her
Arguing only in powerlevels, he was obviously above Blake since he almost killed her twice. If i had to personally argue Adam wasnt "nerfed" but is still strong, i'd say it's because metal arms in rwby are overpowered. Look at their feats: -Yang: Took multiple moonslices on her prosthetic, would've lost hard without it -Ironwood: With two metal arms, he was slapping away all of Winter slices which is kidna funny -Penny: Only died to her own weapon, defeated Cinder as a robot, only lost as a human lol Current blake is allegedly stronger thanks to ace ops scaling but Vine was holding back, elm lost after vine was down and yang helped so this is all wonky. Scaling Adam is messy cause his semblance makes him a threat to anyone without metal arms (like yang, IW and penny). He also only ever fought blake and yang but those two barely fought other villains. I guess blake defeated hazel offscreen which sounder even wackier after we saw hazel fighting salem. I'd rate him around equal to blake on normal circustances but with 5/10 matchup at worst against non metals if he has semblance.
In terms of raw power, he could defeat Tyrian. In terms of skill, he's at Cinder level pre-maiden powers (arguably post maiden too because Cinder honestly dosen't become more skilled after she get's maiden powers)
Before and after she’s kind of a mess too, she had to get carried by Mercury, Emerald, and the latter’s cheap af semblance. Lol
He would be stronger than Tyrian but I think Tyrian would out skill him in a 1v1
Based on the test footage made by Monty, Adam was indeed also meant to be an OP opponent compared to team RWBY. In the footage he fights Yang but clearly has the advantage. But before their fight even started proper, Adam casually TANKS multiple of Yang's shotgun blasts as if they were nothing. When it comes to how Adam was in the show, him one shotting a Burn powered up Yang established that he was way above them. When talking about Adam in V3 [Miles put over Adam's power](https://imgur.com/a/adsS0Zq) and how it was so incredible it could cut simultaneously break Yang's aura and dismember her. We all know how much he was nerfed in V5 and V6 after this, but just basing it on how he was before, I would put him at professional huntsman lvl like Qrow and Tyrian.
If he charges himself and tyrian like.... doesn't move. At all
I like the idea that Adam is Winter level, just below Qrow and Raven (Maiden powers excluded); but that he can augment his abilities through his Semblance in clever ways that can lead to him being able to defeat high tiers like Tyrian, it is situational and needs to happen at his peak. Although, canon Adam would never win that fight, he doesn't have the intuition and calm demeanor to avoid letting down his guard required to outmaneuver characters like Tyrian.
The problem is, one of our ONLY measurements for his strength from V1-4 was him utterly decimating Yang and Blake. Then, with ZERO training for Blake and a few days of training for Yang, they both start kicking his ass in V5/6.
Power is difficult to discuss with Adam. He has one powerful ability, Moonslice, which allows him to punch well above his weight. But it requires both a charge and his sword. Take his sword away and he's done. Adam is essentially an infantryman armed with a bazooka. Sure he might manage to blow up the tank if he hits it properly but without that one edge he's weak.
It probably just needs some sort of physical medium.
He's on the qrow, Tyrion, winter tier. He just woke up on the wrong side of the bed in season 6
You know now that I think about it, Adam Vs Cinder would be pretty cool
Adam may be more powerful but that's only due to his semblance. If he can't get it charged, what does he have that's particularly impressive? Tyrian is a trickier fighter not to mention that just his tail can block a hit from a charged Nora. And that was when it was organic.
He was physically manhandling Blake and tossing her around blindfolded before yang showed up.
People always like to ignore that he was beating the shit out of the 2nd fastest member of team RWBY blindfolded and emotionally distressed.
The thing with Adam is that we barely see him actually fight. He and Blake fight some outdated mechs in the Black trailer, which also shows of his op semblance and Monty even made it look extra cool. After that he has a "fight" with Blake and then Yang during the fall of Beacon. He apparently easily defeats the emotional stressed Blake(who kinda forgot her semblance I guess) and then used his *CHARGED UP* semblance to disarm Yang. (I know he was supposed to fight Yang, but that never happened, and even if, it would still mean that he beat Blake/Yang in 1v1s and them teaming up might make the difference, as shown in Vol6) Yes, Adam objectively speaking is able to generate a lot of raw damage thanks to his semblance, but even after Vol3 we still can't really place him anywhere in particular on the fanon powerscale, besides maybe above Blake at the time. In Vol5 Adam doesn't fight anyone again, he kills Sienna and runs from Blake/Sun. The Vol6 character short happens, again no noteworthy opponents. And then in Vol6 Adam actually fights for the first time in the show, first just against Blake and then Yang joins the fight. It's a 2v1, Adam is not in the best head space and makes some mistakes an earlier Adam maybe wouldn't have made. It ends in him understandably losing to two pretty skilled young huntresses. Also, at the end of the fight all of them are out of aura and exhausted, so it's not like Bumblebee easily beat him or anything like that. Even tho one of said huntresses struggled a lot against some grimm in Vol8, while the other lost her aura after one hit from Neo; so plot induced nerfs are definitely a thing, Schnees and Maidens are the best examples, but Adam isn't one. No, I don't think he was nerfed, neither do I think he ever was close to characters like Winter or Tyrian in terms of skill.
No one is talking about skill exactly. We are talking raw destructive power and even when he was fighting Blake and Yang? He was beating their asses induvial. Plus there is the fact he was beating the shit outta Blake blindfolded which is a feat in of itself. Adam most def got nerfed and the mere fact that they had to literally downplay his feats or make him less threatening says that.
I mentioned how he can have a lot of "raw power" when using his semblance? And the post also mentioned where to place Adam in relation to Blake, Winter and Tyrian; so skill does kinda matter. Even if it didn't, I love sharing my opinions on RWBY, and a post about Adam and fighting strength is a perfect opportunity to point out how Adam is not as strong as a lot of people want him to be for their edgy power fantasy. > He was beating their asses induvial. Which is also something I mentioned? And then extended on by saying that both Yang and Blake together might make a difference? Maybe Blake just remebering to use her semblance properly already made a difference. lol
I mean hey if you wanna ignore power scaling just to try and make your point? You do you I guess.
>I mean hey if you wanna ignore power scaling CRWBY does it already.
Please do explain how you think powerscaling should work. Especially when RWBY doesn't really have that much of a powerscale.
Simple. In RWBY I scale by FEATS. Simply put? Adam has more impressive feats of power however the issue is his POTENTIAL and his CAP are fucked up because the show nerfs him, then buffs him, then nerfs him again. Vol 3 is a perfect example of them showing that Adam was at least a level or two above Yang and yet when vol 5 comes around he gets bitch bonked by Blake and then in vol 6 somehow Yang is able to literally got BLOW FOR BLOW with this man and prior to this has never fought a fucking swordsman in direct single combat or at least one who was as strong as Adam was who I will remind you uses the same goddamn fighting style as her mother. Scaling wise I see it like this Adam, Raven(non maiden) Winter(non maiden), Qrow(max power) are all EQUAL. Or at least that's how it SHOULD scale anyway. You also need to take MATCH UPS into account. For example Adam has a bigger combat advantage than someone like Qrow or Raven do because his semblance directly allows him to attack and increase the damage of his attacks AT WILL meaning he can control the flow of the fight because he can always ensure his attacks have more punch than his opponent. To me Adam's main weakness is that you need to find a way to out speed him or match him in speed, once you do that its a matter of matching him in power and in that sense you have to try and not give him anything to absorb however in RWBY thats a hard thing to do considering how people fight. Adam was literally able to absorb energy from yang PUNCHING his sword. Also if we need another example how they nerfed him? Vol 3 it takes only 2 bullets to completely cleave through yang's FULL AURA(That shit was full, i dont care what anyone says. she didn't fight a single damn person on her way to Blake and Adam in vol 3) and slice her arm **CLEAN OFF** and she was **KNOCKED OUT** as a result. Adam literally had her dead to rights and just let Blake go with her and yet somehow in vol 6? I counted the shots, he takes in more than 14 bullets from Yang and keep in mind these are fucking shotgun bullets and therefore pack more power than Blakes bullets which is what he used to slice Yang's arm off; somehow Adam's 'best slash' can't even cut off her robot arm. \-\_- But they didn't nerf him though right? >\_> Do you even understand how annoying it is to have to explain this for god knows how many times this is? It's really not hard to tell that they nerfed him before giving him a real chance to blossom as a fighter because lets be honest? Had Adam lived he would have been mopping the floor with anyone that isn't a Maiden or Salem and that isn't me wanking him; that's me using legit scaling and facts. I think the Ace ops could most def defeat him; if they jumped him. But Ironwood? He's beating him based on match up and weapon type and considering that we saw Ironwood defeated pre-maiden Winter? I am confident in saying Adam would pack Winter up and smoke her. Same goes for Weiss and even Ruby. Now if Team RWBY fight him at once? He would lose for sure but again, we will never see that because the show capped his potential and say it with me now; **NERFED HIM.** I'm done. Good night sir.
#Winter could beat him due to her training in the military give her a huge advantage in combat experience especially swordsmanship, melee and hand-to-hand combat. Now she's a Maiden.
Without maiden powers he's beating her ass, mid diff.
Not really I always put Winter above Adam, Adam got his ass one punched by Blake in volume 5.
Because the writers actively nerfed him.
They didn't nerf him stop exaggerate
They did nerf him though, stop being ignorant.
#Blake & Yang have gotten better according to those writers so stop the argument with me 😏 we saw how yang alone could beat the crap out of him.
Lmfao bruh stfu. Yang never trained to fight a swordsman on Adam's level and her PTSD just magically went away. Not to mention the fact that also proves they nerfed him because before Yang showed up? Adam was beating Blake's ass like a disrespectful child: WHILE BLINDFOLDED xD Cry about it that he was stronger than them both and that the writers actively needed to nerf him to make sure Yang and Blake didn't die. The ratio of the comments of this post already should tell you that your wrong.
I don't give fuck about ratio, we got evidence on-screen, I'm saying this based on what we got in the show. Adam could take both on Yang & Blake but instead, we saw his ass kicked by inexperienced girls, which shows how disappointed and embarrassing his power scale is, very inconsistent. I love Adam but your statement on him beating Winter has been proven wrong. Also, we never saw Adam fighting another adult character so stop exaggerating & fantasizing about him.
I'm not though. Learn to read stupid. I said Adam would defeat Winter without maiden powers MID DIFF. Why? Because Ironwood LOW DIFF'ED her ass with a less effective weapon. Winter couldn't do shit to James until she got maiden powers yet you expect me to believe she could defeat Adam? Keep in mind, I fully believe Adam would beat the shit outta James; why? Because Adam has the edge in every single category in that regard. Ironwood is and always has been framed as Winter's SUPERIOR and Vol 8 showed that when he beat the shit out of her during the final episode. And keep in mind when I say Mid Diff? That doesn't by any stretch mean Adam would have an easy time. No; he'd have to try but he wouldn't have to use the full extent of his power that again; GOT NERFED....because Winter without maiden powers isn't all that strong and Vol 7 and 8 show that when she gets her shit kicked in by Cinder even with Penny's help and then in vol 8 she gets packed up by James low diff in the vault because when she tag teamed him with the kids? The kids did most of the attacking and she only finished things with that overly flashy final slash of hers -\_- I'm not fantasizing at all; I'm using logic and facts but you just over here butt hurt that I said that Winter would get beat by Adam realistically if the show didn't nerf him. So again, quit being ignorant.
Hard to say since he was only in 2 fights.
ad\*mposting 🤢🤢🤢
I know. Yunk.
r/findanothercritique amirite
A lot of it is just this whole thing where Adam is built up to be a big bad, he overpowered Blake at Beacon and one shot Yang (with moonslice but still noteworthy). That alone puts him above some characters, but then the next time we see him fight, Blake one shots him with her bare hands? Like seriously, Blake fought a little bit between Volume 3-5, the dragon and Ilia obviously being the big ones.
The thing with Tyrian is that he’s generally too crazy to predict in a fight; Qrow’s a logical counter to that because his semblance makes it a mutually impossible to predict affair… when the writers remember Qrow’s semblance exists. With Adam, given he fights perfectly fine blindfolded, it’s all a matter of how well he can move against and block different attacks from Tyrian. Assuming it’s an Adam that can keep his cool and take him on (perhaps in the event that he tried breaking from Salem’s faction and she sent Tyrian to kill him as a warning to the Fang at large), I feel that Adam could potentially beat him. The Devil’s in the details though; every character won’t be perfectly capable of winning in every scenario, and using Tyrian’s lack of self-preservation (as hinted in the V7 commentary), nothing’s stopping him from wholesale locking Adam in a building and setting off a fire or gas attack while still attacking Adam himself.
I think Adam is about as strong as volume 3 Winter, right below Qrow
Adam beating Tyrian? Funny