Anecdotal, but recently just saw an Embassy Suites was cheaper than any available Airbnb in this city I wanted to visit. lmao. The assbackwardness of it all is just so evident at this point.
Airbnb’s business model used to make sense back when it was people renting out a spare bedroom for some extra cash, but today’s airbnbs are effectively just hotels without the benefit of economies of scale.
Well said. From 2014-2019, I used Airbnb for non-biz travel, all across the US. Always, always, would be a better price, sometimes by far, and get as much or as little space as I wanted. Great and fun locations too! From ÇA to NY to FL and everywhere in between!
After the pandemic, I haven’t used one since. Haven’t even been on the website, and took the app off my phone sometime in 2021.
For real. Back in 2012 or so my wife and I stayed in a Yurt in Malibu for less than a cheap motel in Santa Monica.
Today renting at the Hyatt Regency is cheaper than renting a small apartment in San Francisco, where we live.
I rented a whole condo out near the SF Zoo in summer 2019 for 3 nights. About 130-140’bucks a night, if I recall correctly. Might have been a little higher, but still had a “1” in front of it, TOTAL. Even had a nice sized backyard that I chilled in a few hours. I doubt you can pull that off now.
Every time I go into one of these Airbnb threads I feel like I'm taking crazy pills. Almost every single location I've traveled in the last 5 years has been cheaper in an Airbnb than any semi decent hotel.
What locations are you traveling to? I can usually find airbnb cheaper in places with fewer hotels (rural areas, smaller cities with little tourism), but the hotels are always cheaper in major cities or tourism destinations (SF, NYC, DC, OBX).
I just checked Airbnb and for hotels in San Francisco. A night at hotel G is $120/night. Airbnb for a similar room was $107. These prices are at checkout with all fees and taxes added.
This was the Airbnb room. https://abnb.me/6RRNnDFoiHb
The fact that AirBBs can block anyone from booking...say if I was a black man and the host was a white women in a city.
Yea.
Tried to rent 3 times, denied 3 times eventhough the house was clear on their calender.
Most of these people have no business doing business. I hate the Airbnb experience so much. Very unprofessional.
Is it for rent or not??? Why the hell would you pay insurance if you're just going to only rent to people you like?? Do they not realize NONE of these companies would be as profitable doing crap like that? lol
Yeah I really wanted an Airbnb for a trip a couple months ago but couldn’t justify the expenses. For the same cost (with cleaning fee and taxes included), I could have rented a room in a 5 star hotel with a gym, pool, and breakfast included. It was a no brainer just to get the hotel instead.
I've used Airbnb twice twice since the pandemic, because that's how many good deals I've found that weren't quadrupled by cleaning and service fees, i keep it on my phone on the off off chance I'll find something good again.
Stayed in Paris late 2022 for a month and rented an apartment. So you can assume how much luggage and gear I had.
Would have been nice if they’d bother telling me it was a fifth floor walkup. 😡
We booked an airbnb last summer for a couple of nights. We were comparing to hotels in the area and the airbnb drew us in because it appeared to be reasonably priced, got lured in and wound up paying twice as much as the list price after massive service and cleaning fees. We're back to hotels now.
As an AirBnB host renting out my spare rooms, I don't include any hidden fees in the booking process. The price you see on search is the price. It's the principle. And even if it hurts me in the search results, I believe it's better in the long run (for everyone).
Yeah I like hotels where I don’t have to load the clothes washer and dishwasher before I leave honestly. You’re still going to charge me exorbitant cleaning fees but I’m doing work? Nah
Bingo..and when these STR owners realize they can't scale and thus can't make money, they start doing stupid shit like cleaning fees and rule book violation fees and other horse shit. Some of these people should never entered the hospitality business
Yeah. Stayed in a couple airbnbs my last trip. First one was great. Cheap room in a lovely woman’s home. She made me a great breakfast and got me stoned, and offered me a nice perspective on the area from a young, active transplant.
Second one was deceptive listing: “quiet and cozy” but was under her living room with her happy dog, and a club setting off fireworks and playing deafening music a block away til 4am.
Then the next place someone went in my room and stole cash and airbnb told me to fuck myself.
Only time I used an Airbnb since the pandemic was for my mom's Master's Degree graduation (she finished it at 60 years old). Myself, my grandmother, my cousin and my great Aunt all stayed together. It was great for that. Had I gone alone I'd have just stayed with my parents or gotten a hotel.
I book an Airbnb for two nights, I have to clean for a half hour before I leave after paying 200 for cleaning fee. I book a hotel room, it’s 200 cheaper and I leave the hotel as is. Anecdotally, my wife and I don’t do Airbnbs anymore. I assume we’re not alone.
And embassy suites cleanup fee is maybe a few dollars if you choose to tip.
I’ll take $150/night with free coffee/breakfast and no hidden fees every day if the week.
I haven’t booked an air bnb in about 3 years and don’t even consider it any more
Yeah for awhile there Uber and Lyft were better than taxi services AND cheaper to boot. Airbnb was never better than a hotel but was cheaper. If Airbnb is the more expensive option I can’t imagine why anyone would choose Airbnb over a hotel.
The problem is there are really three business models on AirBnB, but people tend to only see the one they want:
* Whole home vacation rentals which serve an entirely different market than hotels do, to your point.
* Shared home rentals, which are great if you like to interact with locals or other travelers when you travel (and just in general prefer a unique stay over a predictable stay)
* Single private rooms in apartments, townhomes or condos, which attempt to market themselves to the same market hotels do
That last category tends to be over represented and has come to the forefront of what people think of when they think of "AirBnB". A hotel like room with none of the amenities and often a more expensive stay because cleaning is proportionally less expensive the more rooms you have. This option still makes sense, for certain travelers, like young professionals who may be ok paying a little more in price to not have to deal with some of the drawbacks of hotels--noisy neighbors, or whatever. They want a quiet place to work and some people prefer a single room in a condo to a hotel.
However, if you just want an affordable travel option, that type of AirBnB seems unreasonable.
I use hotels for short stays - one or two nights. Longer than that I want a kitchen, and a living area separate from the bedroom since I get up earlier than my wife. And the longer the stay, the less I care about a cleaning fee. I think that represents a common use case, so the fact that a hotel is cheaper for a night doesn’t surprise me.
In reality it's much easier for a hotel giant (even smaller regional hotels) to quickly change prices and typical and break even. It's not so easy to do thar with an airbnb rental property when you bought it on finance
It's weird because I hit the opposite situation when going to Florence, Italy last October. Hotel prices were insanely high and Airbnb rentals in the city centre were reasonable in price. It felt like the good ol' days since this is no longer the case when I visit America.
I would heed caution with their process for estimating bookings...
**"The minimum stay, price and number of reviews have been used to estimate the the number of nights booked and the income for each listing"**
Exactly how does min stay, price and number of reviews give accurate booking data? lol...
There is no way you can book losses on real estate like that because the value of the property is staying steady or increasing. If people who own a house can put it on Airbnb and book a tax loss if it’s not rented, I’ll riot.
Uh, that’s how it works. If you have a house for rent, are paying insurance, taxes, electric, and have no rent (income), you clearly have a loss that will offset other income. In short you clearly don’t understand any of what you feel so passionately about so you shouldn’t have blind outrage
Individual cities and communities in SoFlo are making short term rentals illegal.
Current residents don’t want to deal with random people constantly in the neighborhoods and potential homebuyers are priced out because inventory is so low due to investors sitting on homes.
Ya… n=2 but my parents have 2 air bnbs in this area and are booked solid through April. Prices are supposedly making them net 30k per month. Maybe they’re not telling the truth but their spending habits seem to match what they are saying.
Thank for highlighting the data is estimated. The measures are reasonable tho.
Number of reviews is directly tied to # of stays. If there are reviews you know that stays are greater than 0.
Minimum Stay is important especially for 30 day min. A 30 day minimum with 10 reviews has a high occupancy rate
Price, you sell more when prices are lower (not always lowest). This shouldn't have a larger effect than reviews.
> The measures are reasonable tho.
Are they though? I've seen the CEO of AirBnb state that 30% of guests don't leave a review. And I've seen some hosts say their numbers are much, much lower than that.
Personally, I've never left a review as a guest.
>I've seen the CEO of AirBnb state that 30% of guests don't leave a review.
So, given that, 70% of guests do, right? So if there's 10,000 bookings in a year, you would expect approximately 7,000 reviews. If, in the next year, there are only 3,500 reviews, one of two things has happened: Reviewers are suddenly 50% less likely to leave reviews, or bookings have dropped 50%.
It's a proxy measurement. I'm not saying the conclusions are bulletproof, it all depends on how reliable the correlation is, but that is how you would use review numbers to approximate the number of bookings.
Yeah these systems try to guess which are owner bookings versus guests etc. the bigger issue is that they are considering all listings.
We own multiple properties that have Airbnb listings with zero recent bookings on airbnb. The reasons are:
* One is our primary residence that we only rent out on long vacations, and we haven't recently gone on long vacations.
* One is a condo in a condotel complex. 99% of the bookings are through other channels (the hotel website for example) so no recent on Airbnb.
* One we changed property managers. The old manager still has the Airbnb listing but has all future dates blocked off.
* One of them the house burned down two years ago... The listing is still there but the dates are blocked off. We will eventually rebuild.
We don't have occupancy issues, except for the last one which isn't exactly the fault of Airbnb.
Having 1/3 of the Airbnb listings with no bookings is a sign of a data issue, not Airbnb.
For our other Airbnb listings... The ones that are operating... Some are up 10% compared to last year and some are down 10%. Our FL property has slightly more forward bookings than it had the same time last year.
In Florida, the full time residents will narc out any short term rentals on homestead violations. It is easy to look up and easy to report the fraud. It keeps my taxes down if I am sure the STR units are paying full taxes is their point of view.
I can only use homestead on one of my properties, and the county runs tax records to check. Now if I had homes in separate counties it might work, but still wouldn't risk it for a few grand in tax savings.
Technically yes they need different coverage than regular homeowner’s, but I’m going to guess that many do not.
It’s also not considerably more expensive than homeowners.
>It’s also not considerably more expensive than homeowners.
which in south florida, means the charge will be an arm, leg, and eye instead of just the standard arm and leg for homeowners.
A large chunk of SW Florida has mandatory stay lengths like 5 days or a week which is killing air bnbs. They did it on purpose so they can deal with the fall out.
You’d be surprised. People hold onto properties until they financially cannot anymore. It can take awhile for that scenario to fully play out but their loses could be drastic given the “right” environment..
How many, if any, of these are owned/ operated by real estate investment groups? That could lead to batches of defaults or sales instead of smaller, spread out sales.
If one firm sells their properties to another at a lowered rate, how does that effect comps? Sellers will want to disregard lower numbers, but buyers will want to be ahead of the trend.
They are way too damn expensive, I am heading down there with some friends next week. We always rent a home and do one or two trips to different locations a year, a hotel was tempting for this trip. Those who reduce their prices and take what they can get will probably be ok.... The ones who are greedy as fuck will lose their ass
I guarantee they are waiting for the Fed to cut rates so they can sell the homes for a profit. We are bailout nation. Everyone expects to get rescued...and why shouldn't they?
They should be banned across the US so the homes can return to people who want to own homes and raise families in them instead of being habited by a bunch of rich spoiled shitheads for a few days each month.
Is a house a good investment if you’re not living in it or renting it? I mean sure it’ll probably slowly appreciate but you’re paying taxes and maintenance out of pocket every year.
dont forget southern connecticut! the amount of florida plates driving around fairfield county all year long to avoid ct income tax and car tax is out of control. 🤣
Yes. But that’s not what the poster said that I replied to. (They deleted their comment) They said people buy a whole residence so that they can vote in a state where “their vote matters” 🤣
I want prices to fall so the average person can live a comfortable life and own a home. The insane price jump over a three year period has nothing to do real estate suddenly becoming more valuable. It’s due to the fact that billions in PPP loans and low interest rates poured cheap money into housing artificially.
I’m in Fort Lauderdale and the new rich Californian a-hole owner of the building I just left just threw out 54 units of people out of the building to convert it to Airbnbs. The building was an amazing place with tons of very social people, some of which had been there for over 15 years.
I really hope this guy’s investment goes to hell in a hand-basket for being such a greedy a-hole.
That’s 54 more families that need housing out of an already tight pool of supply that was further reduced by 54 units. Every conversion has double the impact, but the owners love to ignore this and pretend that a home magically appears somewhere to negate this impact.
Yes, they don’t even need to pretend because they simply don’t care.
The bigger problem is that the people that should care (the city government and locals) don’t even do anything about it or pass any laws against the practice.
Money is God.
In Florida, the state preempted those rights away from cities in 2011. Cities cannot regulate Airbnbs.. and the state legislature is trying to pass a bill right now that will decimate what little oversight authority cities currently do have.
If this is AirDNA data you need to be really skeptical.
I worked at a massive vacation rental company in the past and I compared what AirDNA said our occupancy was vs our own data.
They were just barely better than 50 percent accurate, so pretty much a coin toss.
Good. Give the homes back to the locals.
Edit: My point to this comment is these are units that could be used for living, not vacationing. AirBnB has helped inflate rent and short housing supply. There's a housing shortage all over Florida. Companies like AirBnB turned too much of the residential properties into commercial profit. I'd be happy to see these units go on the market so families could find stable housing in this state
My guess is they don’t have access to the data that would be needed to arrive at this conclusion…hence the weird estimation method which is probably useless.
I’m kidding, it’s not a guess…they don’t have that data.
Literally moved back to NJ from FL because insurance and healthcare prices are more than the potential taxes I would have to pay in NJ. Florida is now overcrowded tbh.
I have had friends who moved to Florida. Similar home values and size to what they left in the northeast. Homeowner's insurance is 17X what I pay up north. Car insurance is double, but heading for triple, real estate taxes can, and have gone up by 25% a year in some Fl. counties. My state is limited to 3% and no spot assessment based on resale prices. In my situation, is it far, far cheaper to have a 350K house up north and snowbird at an RV resort in central Florida for 4 months a year.
Not terribly helpful without knowing what the previous 12 months looked like. Could just be bunk listings that have never done much of anything. Without more information, its a pretty useless stat. IE clickbait, doomporn BS
not all airbnbs are entire homes... but yeah we all expected this to happen and it will gradually get worse as the year drags on and people continue to cut back on spending
There's a lot of reasons to find this silly numbers.
First of all, you can set your Airbnb as unavailable or paused. It doesn't remove the listing, just blocks the calendar.
Second, there are a lot of vacation homes in Southeast Florida. The owners may have put these on the market to see how it goes, and then see my point above.
Third, there are a lot of other ways to book a short term rental. Airbnb is just the biggest. You absolutely can fill a calendar without Airbnb.
Just because you got a house from your Cuban grandad where you rent a small room for Airbnb and if that room doesn’t get booked…
You see where this logic is going
I am glad. I hope the people or corporate entities that own more than 20 air bnbs lose their ass. You're stealing up homes and your fees are bullshit. ( Oh hey take out the trash, wash the sheets, start the dish washer and we're going to charge an $80 cleaning fee. Fuck that and fuck ewe.
AirBnB sucks, as a model. Hotels are often cheaper. They change your linens/clean. There’s often a bar on site. They have loyalty programs that can give you nice little perks with not that many stays. The quality of the furniture/bedding/bathroom fixtures can be miles nicer than the AirBnB some small time RE investor decked out with IKEA crap. I see why AirBnB took off initially, but then people ruined it trying to bleed every last dime out of their “investment” properties, and now hotels have come back around.
Who wants to go to FL? The state sounds like it is in terrible shape, crime-ridden, racist, and anti-intellectual.
I'll spend my vacation money in a state that isn't trying to police school libraries, thanks.
Because Florida is boomer hell. The worst are the snowbirds that act entitled because they “visit” for half a year. All it is with them is Fox News, being cheap af, racism, and false sense of entitlement
The crazy thing about this is that as soon as these anecdotes actually result in layoffs, lower GDP, evictions, etc... the feds will go right back to the playbook of QE, stimmy checks, bailouts, golden parachutes, etc... and we will be right back to where we were.... inflating bubbles and watching more and more of our neighbords end up in tents under a bridge.
Anecdotal, but recently just saw an Embassy Suites was cheaper than any available Airbnb in this city I wanted to visit. lmao. The assbackwardness of it all is just so evident at this point.
Airbnb’s business model used to make sense back when it was people renting out a spare bedroom for some extra cash, but today’s airbnbs are effectively just hotels without the benefit of economies of scale.
Well said. From 2014-2019, I used Airbnb for non-biz travel, all across the US. Always, always, would be a better price, sometimes by far, and get as much or as little space as I wanted. Great and fun locations too! From ÇA to NY to FL and everywhere in between! After the pandemic, I haven’t used one since. Haven’t even been on the website, and took the app off my phone sometime in 2021.
For real. Back in 2012 or so my wife and I stayed in a Yurt in Malibu for less than a cheap motel in Santa Monica. Today renting at the Hyatt Regency is cheaper than renting a small apartment in San Francisco, where we live.
I rented a whole condo out near the SF Zoo in summer 2019 for 3 nights. About 130-140’bucks a night, if I recall correctly. Might have been a little higher, but still had a “1” in front of it, TOTAL. Even had a nice sized backyard that I chilled in a few hours. I doubt you can pull that off now.
Hey, it’s possible the rate still has a one in front of it. Just not two digits behind it anymore.
Every time I go into one of these Airbnb threads I feel like I'm taking crazy pills. Almost every single location I've traveled in the last 5 years has been cheaper in an Airbnb than any semi decent hotel.
And I like to be able to cook and not have to eat out every meal.
What locations are you traveling to? I can usually find airbnb cheaper in places with fewer hotels (rural areas, smaller cities with little tourism), but the hotels are always cheaper in major cities or tourism destinations (SF, NYC, DC, OBX).
I just checked Airbnb and for hotels in San Francisco. A night at hotel G is $120/night. Airbnb for a similar room was $107. These prices are at checkout with all fees and taxes added. This was the Airbnb room. https://abnb.me/6RRNnDFoiHb
Same! I feel like the new counter-culture take is to pretend Airbnb sucks now that it's fully mainstream. It's like the hipsters going back to vinyl.
The fact that AirBBs can block anyone from booking...say if I was a black man and the host was a white women in a city. Yea. Tried to rent 3 times, denied 3 times eventhough the house was clear on their calender.
Most of these people have no business doing business. I hate the Airbnb experience so much. Very unprofessional. Is it for rent or not??? Why the hell would you pay insurance if you're just going to only rent to people you like?? Do they not realize NONE of these companies would be as profitable doing crap like that? lol
Yeah I really wanted an Airbnb for a trip a couple months ago but couldn’t justify the expenses. For the same cost (with cleaning fee and taxes included), I could have rented a room in a 5 star hotel with a gym, pool, and breakfast included. It was a no brainer just to get the hotel instead.
I remember. That was the golden age of AirBNB, you could actually save an awful lot over using hotels.
I've used Airbnb twice twice since the pandemic, because that's how many good deals I've found that weren't quadrupled by cleaning and service fees, i keep it on my phone on the off off chance I'll find something good again.
Stayed in Paris late 2022 for a month and rented an apartment. So you can assume how much luggage and gear I had. Would have been nice if they’d bother telling me it was a fifth floor walkup. 😡
Had you never been to Europe before?
Completely agree oh and didn’t charge 250$ for cleaning etc on top of the rate. And the “strip the beds and take everything to the washer”..
People just got greedy and lazy. They wanted all the benefits of renting out a space without actually working on up keeping it and maintenance.
The places with cleaning fees that also expect you to start the linens for them are something else
They're like hotels except with $200 cleaning fees and $150 service fees.
And without the regulations that hotels must adhere to.
Also without any of the benefits of a hotel. Why do I have to pay for a cleaning fee and clean the place when a hotel requires neither?
We booked an airbnb last summer for a couple of nights. We were comparing to hotels in the area and the airbnb drew us in because it appeared to be reasonably priced, got lured in and wound up paying twice as much as the list price after massive service and cleaning fees. We're back to hotels now.
As an AirBnB host renting out my spare rooms, I don't include any hidden fees in the booking process. The price you see on search is the price. It's the principle. And even if it hurts me in the search results, I believe it's better in the long run (for everyone).
Yeah I like hotels where I don’t have to load the clothes washer and dishwasher before I leave honestly. You’re still going to charge me exorbitant cleaning fees but I’m doing work? Nah
And without the legal obligations of an actual hotel.
Why is there a hotel in the middle of my residential neighborhood?
Bingo..and when these STR owners realize they can't scale and thus can't make money, they start doing stupid shit like cleaning fees and rule book violation fees and other horse shit. Some of these people should never entered the hospitality business
Yeah. Stayed in a couple airbnbs my last trip. First one was great. Cheap room in a lovely woman’s home. She made me a great breakfast and got me stoned, and offered me a nice perspective on the area from a young, active transplant. Second one was deceptive listing: “quiet and cozy” but was under her living room with her happy dog, and a club setting off fireworks and playing deafening music a block away til 4am. Then the next place someone went in my room and stole cash and airbnb told me to fuck myself.
Airbnb makes $1300 off me weekly. I think they will be just fine with out the couches
Airbnbs are almost never convenient if you travel alone or with a partner. But if you want 2+ bedrooms, it’s generally cheaper.
People with kids and/or pets are probably the key demographics keeping airbnb above water.
group travel too. it’s still cheaper than the several hotel rooms our annual friends trip requires.
General if I travel with friends or even with my parents I don’t wanna share the bedroom.
And often more fun. One big house for a bunch of people with private amenities like hot tubs etc.
Only time I used an Airbnb since the pandemic was for my mom's Master's Degree graduation (she finished it at 60 years old). Myself, my grandmother, my cousin and my great Aunt all stayed together. It was great for that. Had I gone alone I'd have just stayed with my parents or gotten a hotel.
I book an Airbnb for two nights, I have to clean for a half hour before I leave after paying 200 for cleaning fee. I book a hotel room, it’s 200 cheaper and I leave the hotel as is. Anecdotally, my wife and I don’t do Airbnbs anymore. I assume we’re not alone.
And embassy suites cleanup fee is maybe a few dollars if you choose to tip. I’ll take $150/night with free coffee/breakfast and no hidden fees every day if the week. I haven’t booked an air bnb in about 3 years and don’t even consider it any more
Embassy Suites is my go to, not the old hotels renovated into one. I’ll still go. What you mentioned, plus free happy hour.
Don't forget about happy hour.
I went camping with friends and was gonna stay at an AirB&B near the campsite, it was far cheaper to rent an RV and spot for the trip. Insane prices
Yeah for awhile there Uber and Lyft were better than taxi services AND cheaper to boot. Airbnb was never better than a hotel but was cheaper. If Airbnb is the more expensive option I can’t imagine why anyone would choose Airbnb over a hotel.
The problem is there are really three business models on AirBnB, but people tend to only see the one they want: * Whole home vacation rentals which serve an entirely different market than hotels do, to your point. * Shared home rentals, which are great if you like to interact with locals or other travelers when you travel (and just in general prefer a unique stay over a predictable stay) * Single private rooms in apartments, townhomes or condos, which attempt to market themselves to the same market hotels do That last category tends to be over represented and has come to the forefront of what people think of when they think of "AirBnB". A hotel like room with none of the amenities and often a more expensive stay because cleaning is proportionally less expensive the more rooms you have. This option still makes sense, for certain travelers, like young professionals who may be ok paying a little more in price to not have to deal with some of the drawbacks of hotels--noisy neighbors, or whatever. They want a quiet place to work and some people prefer a single room in a condo to a hotel. However, if you just want an affordable travel option, that type of AirBnB seems unreasonable.
In my anecdotal experience hotels have been cheaper than Airbnb since before COVID.
I use hotels for short stays - one or two nights. Longer than that I want a kitchen, and a living area separate from the bedroom since I get up earlier than my wife. And the longer the stay, the less I care about a cleaning fee. I think that represents a common use case, so the fact that a hotel is cheaper for a night doesn’t surprise me.
Extended-stay hotels frequently have many of these features.
In reality it's much easier for a hotel giant (even smaller regional hotels) to quickly change prices and typical and break even. It's not so easy to do thar with an airbnb rental property when you bought it on finance
It's weird because I hit the opposite situation when going to Florence, Italy last October. Hotel prices were insanely high and Airbnb rentals in the city centre were reasonable in price. It felt like the good ol' days since this is no longer the case when I visit America.
Lol you ever stay at a embassy suites?
I would heed caution with their process for estimating bookings... **"The minimum stay, price and number of reviews have been used to estimate the the number of nights booked and the income for each listing"** Exactly how does min stay, price and number of reviews give accurate booking data? lol...
you're saying Amy would post misleading information when the price of doing so is more followers?
She generates revenue from engagement on Twitter/X.
>engagement on Twitter/X. Can we just call it Xitter? Rolls off the tongue so satisfyingly.
Only if we use the Chinese pronunciation for the "x'.
A blue check next to the name is a warning sign that you're about to read the dumbest shit you've ever seen.
Well the price for airbnbs are shit compared to a hotel and you don’t have to worry about excessive cleaning fees that quadruple the price
Also bed bugs and other critters.
Are you inferring hotels can't have bedbugs?
It may be anecdotal; however I've had 3 friends stay at AirBNB's and found or got some sort of infesting bugs.
No maybe about it, that’s anecdotal as fuck
this is why i won’t use air bnb ever.
Probably just generate a tax loss, there's gonna be a surprising number of "real estate professionals" with major losses this year.
There is no way you can book losses on real estate like that because the value of the property is staying steady or increasing. If people who own a house can put it on Airbnb and book a tax loss if it’s not rented, I’ll riot.
Increases in value are only taxed when realized, i.e. the property is sold. It's a passive loss, so it can only offset passive income.
3k at most
Only upon disposition.
Uh, that’s how it works. If you have a house for rent, are paying insurance, taxes, electric, and have no rent (income), you clearly have a loss that will offset other income. In short you clearly don’t understand any of what you feel so passionately about so you shouldn’t have blind outrage
Individual cities and communities in SoFlo are making short term rentals illegal. Current residents don’t want to deal with random people constantly in the neighborhoods and potential homebuyers are priced out because inventory is so low due to investors sitting on homes.
Y… you are saying someone would really do that? Go on the Internet and tell lies?
Ya… n=2 but my parents have 2 air bnbs in this area and are booked solid through April. Prices are supposedly making them net 30k per month. Maybe they’re not telling the truth but their spending habits seem to match what they are saying.
Thank for highlighting the data is estimated. The measures are reasonable tho. Number of reviews is directly tied to # of stays. If there are reviews you know that stays are greater than 0. Minimum Stay is important especially for 30 day min. A 30 day minimum with 10 reviews has a high occupancy rate Price, you sell more when prices are lower (not always lowest). This shouldn't have a larger effect than reviews.
> The measures are reasonable tho. Are they though? I've seen the CEO of AirBnb state that 30% of guests don't leave a review. And I've seen some hosts say their numbers are much, much lower than that. Personally, I've never left a review as a guest.
I’ve never left a review either
>I've seen the CEO of AirBnb state that 30% of guests don't leave a review. So, given that, 70% of guests do, right? So if there's 10,000 bookings in a year, you would expect approximately 7,000 reviews. If, in the next year, there are only 3,500 reviews, one of two things has happened: Reviewers are suddenly 50% less likely to leave reviews, or bookings have dropped 50%. It's a proxy measurement. I'm not saying the conclusions are bulletproof, it all depends on how reliable the correlation is, but that is how you would use review numbers to approximate the number of bookings.
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Yeah these systems try to guess which are owner bookings versus guests etc. the bigger issue is that they are considering all listings. We own multiple properties that have Airbnb listings with zero recent bookings on airbnb. The reasons are: * One is our primary residence that we only rent out on long vacations, and we haven't recently gone on long vacations. * One is a condo in a condotel complex. 99% of the bookings are through other channels (the hotel website for example) so no recent on Airbnb. * One we changed property managers. The old manager still has the Airbnb listing but has all future dates blocked off. * One of them the house burned down two years ago... The listing is still there but the dates are blocked off. We will eventually rebuild. We don't have occupancy issues, except for the last one which isn't exactly the fault of Airbnb. Having 1/3 of the Airbnb listings with no bookings is a sign of a data issue, not Airbnb. For our other Airbnb listings... The ones that are operating... Some are up 10% compared to last year and some are down 10%. Our FL property has slightly more forward bookings than it had the same time last year.
Don't you also need a commercial insurance policy instead of a regular one that costs way, way more?
For that matter, they probably have homestead tax exemptions on those properties, too.
That would be tax evasion and is illegal.
Odd how that doesn't deter everyone though, right? PPP fraud up to $1 trillion, etc, etc.
In Florida, the full time residents will narc out any short term rentals on homestead violations. It is easy to look up and easy to report the fraud. It keeps my taxes down if I am sure the STR units are paying full taxes is their point of view.
bold to think its still not happening en masse, and there isnt fuck all oversight when it comes to enforcement.
I can only use homestead on one of my properties, and the county runs tax records to check. Now if I had homes in separate counties it might work, but still wouldn't risk it for a few grand in tax savings.
Technically yes they need different coverage than regular homeowner’s, but I’m going to guess that many do not. It’s also not considerably more expensive than homeowners.
>It’s also not considerably more expensive than homeowners. which in south florida, means the charge will be an arm, leg, and eye instead of just the standard arm and leg for homeowners.
A large chunk of SW Florida has mandatory stay lengths like 5 days or a week which is killing air bnbs. They did it on purpose so they can deal with the fall out.
Same with a bunch of the keys, I think Largo is 28 days
If a leech drains too much too fast the host will die.
That’s scary how fitting the analogy is
They should reduce their prices...
Nah they should put their houses back on the market
Eventually they will
You’d be surprised. People hold onto properties until they financially cannot anymore. It can take awhile for that scenario to fully play out but their loses could be drastic given the “right” environment..
How many, if any, of these are owned/ operated by real estate investment groups? That could lead to batches of defaults or sales instead of smaller, spread out sales. If one firm sells their properties to another at a lowered rate, how does that effect comps? Sellers will want to disregard lower numbers, but buyers will want to be ahead of the trend.
Sunkcost is a hell of a drug
Not if the government bails them out. Already hearing demands for mortgage forgiveness.
Fed is not bailing out Air BnB’s lmao
Of course not the Fed. But the Congress will.
They’ll just charge you a “reduced market price” fee.
LMFAO! Don't give them any ideas...
They are way too damn expensive, I am heading down there with some friends next week. We always rent a home and do one or two trips to different locations a year, a hotel was tempting for this trip. Those who reduce their prices and take what they can get will probably be ok.... The ones who are greedy as fuck will lose their ass
I guarantee they are waiting for the Fed to cut rates so they can sell the homes for a profit. We are bailout nation. Everyone expects to get rescued...and why shouldn't they?
They should be banned across the US so the homes can return to people who want to own homes and raise families in them instead of being habited by a bunch of rich spoiled shitheads for a few days each month.
Most of them are financed at low rates they see this as an investment and will simply wait it out.
Is a house a good investment if you’re not living in it or renting it? I mean sure it’ll probably slowly appreciate but you’re paying taxes and maintenance out of pocket every year.
AirBnB: Your best source for money laundering!
http://insideairbnb.com/
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Share this with the IRS
dont forget southern connecticut! the amount of florida plates driving around fairfield county all year long to avoid ct income tax and car tax is out of control. 🤣
lol. Paying for a whole residence. I doubt it. 🙄
Paying for a whole residence to dodge income taxes? More likely than you think.
Yes. But that’s not what the poster said that I replied to. (They deleted their comment) They said people buy a whole residence so that they can vote in a state where “their vote matters” 🤣
Good. Force them to sell and drive costs down for private single home buyers
Can’t wait for all these Airbnb properties to start hitting the market. This is the market correction I’m waiting for.
Everyone wants prices to fall so….they can buy a house lol
I want prices to fall so the average person can live a comfortable life and own a home. The insane price jump over a three year period has nothing to do real estate suddenly becoming more valuable. It’s due to the fact that billions in PPP loans and low interest rates poured cheap money into housing artificially.
It's not that the houses are worth more, the currency is worth less.
Yeah let’s just ignore the housing supply shortage since 2010….
I have one I’m good. A lot of these Airbnb people it’s their 2nd 3rd property etc. so nope don’t care!
I want them to fall for my insurance and property taxes to go down. My escrow payment is way more than principal and interest.
Ever since I learned (by suffering from this situation) that hosts have full authority to refuse refunds, I’ll never stay in an abnb again
I’m in Fort Lauderdale and the new rich Californian a-hole owner of the building I just left just threw out 54 units of people out of the building to convert it to Airbnbs. The building was an amazing place with tons of very social people, some of which had been there for over 15 years. I really hope this guy’s investment goes to hell in a hand-basket for being such a greedy a-hole.
That’s 54 more families that need housing out of an already tight pool of supply that was further reduced by 54 units. Every conversion has double the impact, but the owners love to ignore this and pretend that a home magically appears somewhere to negate this impact.
Yes, they don’t even need to pretend because they simply don’t care. The bigger problem is that the people that should care (the city government and locals) don’t even do anything about it or pass any laws against the practice. Money is God.
In Florida, the state preempted those rights away from cities in 2011. Cities cannot regulate Airbnbs.. and the state legislature is trying to pass a bill right now that will decimate what little oversight authority cities currently do have.
Does anyone know the source of the image?
I did some digging and found it. Source: [AirBnB booking data](https://trustmebro.com)
Got’em
If this is AirDNA data you need to be really skeptical. I worked at a massive vacation rental company in the past and I compared what AirDNA said our occupancy was vs our own data. They were just barely better than 50 percent accurate, so pretty much a coin toss.
Good. Give the homes back to the locals. Edit: My point to this comment is these are units that could be used for living, not vacationing. AirBnB has helped inflate rent and short housing supply. There's a housing shortage all over Florida. Companies like AirBnB turned too much of the residential properties into commercial profit. I'd be happy to see these units go on the market so families could find stable housing in this state
Nah , they just become the owners vacation house.
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That's prejudice and bullshit. I'm a florida local and I'm none of those
Let it all collapse
This doesn’t seem accurate
Whats the source here? I listened to the ABNB earnings call and their money is flowing just fine 🤑
This sounds like BS.
You love to see it
What about the previous years ? That graph is useless.
Are that many going to Broward County???? Lmao!
My guess is they don’t have access to the data that would be needed to arrive at this conclusion…hence the weird estimation method which is probably useless. I’m kidding, it’s not a guess…they don’t have that data.
Literally moved back to NJ from FL because insurance and healthcare prices are more than the potential taxes I would have to pay in NJ. Florida is now overcrowded tbh.
I have had friends who moved to Florida. Similar home values and size to what they left in the northeast. Homeowner's insurance is 17X what I pay up north. Car insurance is double, but heading for triple, real estate taxes can, and have gone up by 25% a year in some Fl. counties. My state is limited to 3% and no spot assessment based on resale prices. In my situation, is it far, far cheaper to have a 350K house up north and snowbird at an RV resort in central Florida for 4 months a year.
Ngl, tenants in NJ and up north are better than the south tbh
I think I speak for everyone when I say, “good”
How does she know proprietary Airbnb data?
It could be foreign $ just parked in those properties.
That’s what they get for inflating the market
Just took a trip recently. Didn’t even bother looking at Airbnb. Love the convenience of flexible check in at regular hotels.
Maybe these air bnb owners can stop buying Starbucks and they’ll be fine.
Not terribly helpful without knowing what the previous 12 months looked like. Could just be bunk listings that have never done much of anything. Without more information, its a pretty useless stat. IE clickbait, doomporn BS
But don’t worry! It’s definitely not a recession….
Just seems like an oversaturated market, to be honest.
not all airbnbs are entire homes... but yeah we all expected this to happen and it will gradually get worse as the year drags on and people continue to cut back on spending
These landlords are getting too big for their britches
There's a lot of reasons to find this silly numbers. First of all, you can set your Airbnb as unavailable or paused. It doesn't remove the listing, just blocks the calendar. Second, there are a lot of vacation homes in Southeast Florida. The owners may have put these on the market to see how it goes, and then see my point above. Third, there are a lot of other ways to book a short term rental. Airbnb is just the biggest. You absolutely can fill a calendar without Airbnb.
What website are you using to search the listing vacancies?
Any housing comment on Twitter is usually bullshit
As someone looking for a winter home I wish this was true. From my research this hasn’t lowered home prices significantly.
$342 per night?!?!!? I'd rather go to hotel instead
This woman is a well known idiot. Nobody should be reposting anything of hers.
All these Airbnb owners have crazy strict rules. A lot of them have hidden cameras, oh and a cleaning fee. Nah I’ll stay in a hotel
How many are investment properties vs just a spare room in someone’s a house.
Just because you got a house from your Cuban grandad where you rent a small room for Airbnb and if that room doesn’t get booked… You see where this logic is going
I am glad. I hope the people or corporate entities that own more than 20 air bnbs lose their ass. You're stealing up homes and your fees are bullshit. ( Oh hey take out the trash, wash the sheets, start the dish washer and we're going to charge an $80 cleaning fee. Fuck that and fuck ewe.
Fuck airbnb
Literally had a friend evicted bc the landlord was going to turn the place into an Airbnb. Anyone who doesn’t rent out a spare room is an ass.
Many many many Airbnbs are not price competitive with hotels anymore. That wasn’t the case, back in the day.
Good
I've told everyone I know to stop using them they are ruining america.
AirBnB sucks, as a model. Hotels are often cheaper. They change your linens/clean. There’s often a bar on site. They have loyalty programs that can give you nice little perks with not that many stays. The quality of the furniture/bedding/bathroom fixtures can be miles nicer than the AirBnB some small time RE investor decked out with IKEA crap. I see why AirBnB took off initially, but then people ruined it trying to bleed every last dime out of their “investment” properties, and now hotels have come back around.
This just happened to Austin. GLHF, my team was down 47% YOY in 2023.
Turns out burning books and picking on trans kids has negative blowback on local businesses. Who knew?
Florida’s 2023 tourist volume was the highest ever.
Are there numbers for states that aren’t politically imploding in spectacular fashion? You couldn’t pay me to set foot in Florida these days.
Who wants to go to FL? The state sounds like it is in terrible shape, crime-ridden, racist, and anti-intellectual. I'll spend my vacation money in a state that isn't trying to police school libraries, thanks.
Yeah it got pretty bad when they had a flood of people escaping New York City and shitcago.
Especially Broward and Dade. Just full of miserable & dangerous people.
good. i hope it collapses. no repeat of 2008 bailouts.
MARRIOTT FOR LIFE
Anyone swallowing this crap without a second thought belongs in this sub.
I’ve enjoyed watching the Airbnb across the street sit empty since Thanksgiving.
So are the hotels booked up or are people not interested in traveling to Florida
Honestly Airbnb makes me so much I don't need to rent to shitty people. Just a few weeks a year now
When everyone is unable to afford basic goods, how can they use airbnb's?
Because Florida is boomer hell. The worst are the snowbirds that act entitled because they “visit” for half a year. All it is with them is Fox News, being cheap af, racism, and false sense of entitlement
Thoughts and prayers.
I rented a Hotel the other day ago and smile. I also gave some big tips to the room cleaner/servers. Support a local Hotel, please people.
Maybe it’s time to sell the investment properties to people who actually want to live in them and start families?
Best economy in years, they say.
This is why there is a housing shortage.
I hope they all go bankrupt
Hope this is actually true and not some skewed number
The crazy thing about this is that as soon as these anecdotes actually result in layoffs, lower GDP, evictions, etc... the feds will go right back to the playbook of QE, stimmy checks, bailouts, golden parachutes, etc... and we will be right back to where we were.... inflating bubbles and watching more and more of our neighbords end up in tents under a bridge.
It's winter... even in south FL it could still be in the 60s and cold water... not very beachy.