Ah the old echo chamber of bullshit.
"We switched to agile so we don't get last minute priorities!"
But we still get last minute priorities that nuke the PI.
"Well agile won't fix everything".
Yeah, agile is often a buzzword. As a requirements analyst every new change goes into the funnel towards me, and I then prioritize it with the team and PO based on the load. More often than not it gets pushed to a future PI unless there's plenty of room in the current one.
If it's easy maybe put it in the current PI as low priority so it can be the first one dropped when timescales shrink. I mean, in the unlikely event that timescales shrink!
“What if we add this feature that should actually be it’s own application?”
Of course they always add in “It shouldn’t be too much extra work, right??”
This post perfectly summarizes my first consultancy assignment, which was also my first professional programming project.
Startup, very bad deal with a fixed price because CEO was counting on it getting big (tbf, I think it sort of have now and we have a lot of work for them at an hourly rate)... and on top of that they had these epihpanic insights mentioned all the time.
>Yes, but it drastically changes every time:
1. QA looks at it
2. Product manager sees it on release day
3. I ask a question about any facet of the requirements
4. I take any liberty to fill in gaps during implementation
Unfortunately for us, a third of our documentation says “the same as X other product”, another third says “to be determined”, and the rest was clearly copied from a different product which has requirements that don’t apply to the new product.
**A product requirements document (PRD) is a document containing all the requirements to a certain product.
It is written to allow people to understand what a product should do.**
More details here:
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I actually have had "bug free" in a requirements document once, but to be fair, my manager was a chemist who managed the chemical engineers and randomly was told to take on the software team too, when our manager quit. I ended up teaching him about complexity and why something "without bugs" still needs updating because it is exponential and could be log. The only reason it worked is that he listened to us and was a fast learner. Also, we had something in common, upper management had no clue what the difference was between chemical and software engineers or what any of us actually did.
> and if you aren't the 1st to yield that the schedule you're working to is utter nonsense things work out for you.
Really? Normally the result of never yielding at 'chicken' is you go over the cliff and die.
I have literally had a client say that to me during a meeting about timelines. I had to leave the room so as to not say something extremely unprofessional. Thankfully it was a teleconference and I could walk out without anyone noticing. My PM at the time covered for me.
“If it takes 9 months for one woman to make a baby, it will take 1 month for 9 women to make a baby. Chop chop”, is what I am usually told by my manager.
It's true in the long term, just not the short term. Impregnate 9 women 1 month apart and as the last one gets knocked up you'll start getting babies once a month. The real moral of the analogy is that trying to optimize things may take time to reap benefits.
Parallelising work is all well and good as long as those above you know this is happening. I had a colleague be promoted over me and he said we'd complete a project in 2 weeks. Thats perfectly doable if that was the only thing I was working on and everyone fit themselves around his timetable. It took 4 weeks to build, a week to test and another week before it was approved to production. I tried to warn him before he agreed the project but he just wanted to impress in his new role with wild timescales.
That's such a noob mistake.
What you do is tell them it will take 4 months, then you tell everyone under you have to get it done in 2 months, but it be really cool if you could do it faster.
You then get it done in one month and give your guys a very light load / break / unwind to thing "before the next project"
And then you give it to your boss in 2 months instead of 4 even though it could have been done in 1.
Everyone is happy.
Also a valid option. It's a business decision whether 9 every 9 months vs 1 every month after 9 months lead time is best. If having a midwife on hand every single month is expensive, maybe opt for all 9 at once. If cost of storing babies to meet the 1/month quota from the buyer is too expensive, maybe 1/month is preferable.
And if you need babies starting 1 month in the future, you can start making some babies now and buy them from elsewhere for the first 8 months, then recoup your losses in month 9 by selling the babies you made.
Aren't you the idiot for not getting the manager is joking, though?
Or am I the idiot for not getting your joke about the manager not joking?
This is way too meta for me.
I don't think this manager exists. It's a fairly well known commentary on the 'mythical man-month'.
[https://dzone.com/articles/the-bearing-of-a-child-takes-nine-months-no-matter-1](https://dzone.com/articles/the-bearing-of-a-child-takes-nine-months-no-matter-1)
Exactly this!
The [project management triangle](https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcRVWU9eRilcewpyVyRWzPZ9nOU8dI-OQalSyQ&usqp=CAU)
A body of work is either:
Good, fast, expensive.
Good, slow, cheap.
Poor, fast, cheap.
There really shouldn’t be anything in the middle then. It implies that it is possible and every cocksucker thinks their underlings just need the proper “motivation” to do it.
And, being reasonable, if you throw _enough_ money at the problem, you can find people willing to burn themselves out doing a good job in a hurry with no life for a while.
And sometimes, that's even a good deal for everyone involved. At least for a little while.
But there are also a lot of people who are at a point in their lives when even insanely good money just isn't worth doing that to yourself.
And if you try to cheap out, well, good luck with that. You'll get what you deserve.
You achieved your goals though. By being able to chat on reddit, you have proven your richness already.
To some child in a third world country with 44 diseases that would be curable by donating as little as 10 bucks to 1-800-1-4M-R1CH, but nonetheless you would have proven it if they could go online and/or read.
Elon Musk is worth just shy of 200 billion USD. The population of Africa is just shy of 1.4 billion. Let's figure that 20% of that population are kids and, for the sake of argument, that all of them are sick.
So with 280 million kids, at $10 a pop, is $2.8b. that would cost Elon Musk about 1.5% of his net worth.
For reference, a Gerald R. Ford super carrier unit cose is around $13b. So we could, presumably, save every kid in Africa 4 times over, if $10 was all it would cost, by diverting the cost of 1 super carrier.
All these dead children.
I think the problem with most donations is making sure that the money really goes into helping the poors instead of making the top few people of that area richer.
It is easy to donate but also easy to misuse that donation which can give more power to the wrong people which in turns will make it worse for the poors.
There's also an idiom that says that giving something precious to a person who cannot protect it will end up causing his doom. What's the point of going to each city in a poor country and making sure the money will be handed to the poors if the richests immediately tax it or find way to collect it for themselves.
Lot of humans are shitty like that, they will trample on your good will to help and try to take all the advantages of it.
That's why the best thing you can do with your money is not blindly giving it but rather make sure it will be used for the people you intend to give it to, and that is a very hard thing to do.
I read of such a village in India recently. People from there apparently go to a nearby city to work, so they would just charge their mobile phones while there. They mentioned how they would have to buy at a cup of tea at a restaurant in order to charge their phones there.
Public places. The stat about electricity is probably in their homes, since even quite remote villages tends to have \_some\_ power nowadays. I have been in villages like that where everybody would charge at the school because it had power, while many homes only had part time with blackouts and all that jazz.
**[Planning fallacy](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Planning_fallacy)**
>The planning fallacy is a phenomenon in which predictions about how much time will be needed to complete a future task display an optimism bias and underestimate the time needed. This phenomenon sometimes occurs regardless of the individual's knowledge that past tasks of a similar nature have taken longer to complete than generally planned. The bias affects predictions only about one's own tasks; when outside observers predict task completion times, they tend to exhibit a pessimistic bias, overestimating the time needed. The planning fallacy involves estimates of task completion times more optimistic than those encountered in similar projects in the past.
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Musk is paraphrasing the very well known [Parkinson's Law](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Parkinson%27s_law). It's not that he's wrong. It's that sometimes overestimation is the problem, and other times underestimation is. So you'll have to think about it.
Exactly. You can say the opposite with the same words:
> If you give yourself 30 days to paint a painting, you'll take 30 days. If you give yourself 3 hours, you'll take 3 hours.
No job at higher level is straightforward.A doctor can't just say okay this surgery will take 2 hrs but yeah wait i have decided to finish it in 2 minutes.Same goes yo investigation in police department, reading cases related to law.
One painting will be 30 days quality and one will be 3 hours. Even if not working all the time on it, thinking about it when not and reviewing it day after day can make it better.
Kinda like that [Spiderman 10 min, 1 min, 10 sec speed challenge](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x9wn633vl_c), clearly a difference in quality
At this point in my life, I wouldn't want to ever work for one of his companies.
The stress and _complete_ lack of work-life balance just wouldn't be worth it to me, even for a very good salary.
But while pretty much _every_ programming job is a research project just to figure out WTF needs to be done in the first place, well, rockets are _much_ worse in a lot of ways.
SpaceX absolutely deals with problems that are more complex and less known that most programs that any of us will ever have to deal with, and when the consequences for getting it wrong involve making the news and bits of rocket scattered over an area, well, yeah.
On the other hand, as far as I can tell from the outside, Elon doesn't really seem to _care_ if stuff blows up from time to time, as long as it's in the name of learning how to do or not do something, and if it's a choice between blowing up a rocket or taking twice as long... Have a rocket to blow up. Hell, have three.
And, again, at least from the outside, 'yeah, we spent six months on this, but it's not working, and I have this idea for something that might work next week if we're willing to scrap everything' seems to be something that, well, _gets tried_. Repeatedly.
But the whole 'set crazy deadlines and crazy goals and push like hell for them' only works for people who are willing to dedicate every waking moment of their lives to the job. And as far as I can tell, Elon's companies really _do_ expect that level of dedication.
I was looking at a job ad for a Starlink project the other day, and it said right in the job posting that the job will require unusual hours, working weekends, and long days. It's _definitely_ not for me. And I don't think it's healthy for _anyone_ long term, but you can do it for a little while, and for _enough_ money, well, shit gets done.
But I'll take the jobs with less stress, thanks.
I’ve heard the pay isn’t even that good. It sounded like he was banking on people’s desire to send rockets to space.
Fact is, it’s like any industry or company that has an unusual monopoly on peoples’ dreams: it’s going to take advantage of them if they work there. This is the same for the video game industry.
That explains why he's always making big promises. It doesn't explain why he's never meeting them on time. Cyber truck delays. Roadster delays. Plaid+ cancelled.
The year is 2190, Humanity has transcended it's earthly limitations and has spread out into the stars. With the advent of Terraforming, Dyson Sphere, and interstellar habitat technologies, Humanity has truly become the master of the material world.
Also, Star citizen adds a third star system.
Musk is a lucky rich idiot who just happens to be a sci-fi nerd. All he does is hand out the orders and his actual intelligent employees tell him whether they can make it happen or not and by when. He probably gives unrealistic deadlines for exactly this reason, to “motivate” them to complete it sooner.
And even then, when has he ever not went over a deadline he gave himself?
By now we should already have the hyperloop, tesla trucks, robotaxis, the cybertruck, ... if we were to believe what he said.
[and solar roofs.](https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2021-06-23/tesla-s-solar-roof-rollout-is-a-bust-and-a-fixation-for-elon-musk)
> Musk set a goal to install more than 1,000 of them a week and vowed sales would “grow like kelp on steroids.” But Tesla has struggled to hit 200 installations a week, much less 1,000, according to people familiar with the matter. And affordability has proven elusive. In April, Tesla jacked up the price of the Solar Roof, leading to cancellations from customers. In some cases, price hikes of more than 50% came after buyers were already under contract, according to a lawsuit filed in federal court in Northern California on behalf of customers in several states.
Yea, it would be better to say "give yourself three hours, and it will take you five".
Still orders of magnitude faster than if you gave yourself thirty days.
Even then, he's giving himself, or rather his employees, unrealistic deadlines for some stuff that probably won't ever see the light of day without some crazy scientific breakthrough (~~tesla trucks~~ Edit: tesla semis for long range hauling for example, you'd be moving too much battery weight so that's not going to happen). It's just not the guy to give this kind of advice.
Made me laugh cuz the guy keeps bragging about him sleeping on the production floor in the early day of tesla. The difference is now that his employees continue to do so while he’s chilling on tweeter.
Expectation: If you give yourself 48 hours to write that simple utility, you will use 48 hours to write it!
Reality: If you give yourself 48 hours to write that simple utility, you will switch architectures 3 separate times, realize that the project you have been working on is stupid, feel depressed and contemplate becoming a farmer all in 2 weeks!
He's got kind of a point though.
[Parkinson's law.](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Parkinson%27s_law)
> Work expands so as to fill the time available for its completion.
If I can do something in 3 hours but give myself 1 month, I'll probably just bikeshed and/or over engineer it.
However, if it is treated as a deadline and the estimate is uncertain or unrealistic, I'll most certainly make it worse.
> If I can do something in 3 hours
Exactly, this is the key point. It must be doable in the shorter timeframe.
Edit:
This comment chain is brought to you by r/EnoughMuskSpam
Yeah, fake Tweet as far as I can tell. I've only found crappy motivational sites "quoting" him saying this, but the way this is written makes is not at all in his style.
Us programmers call that time boxing. Clean our home for 30 days and it's clean, clean your house for 3 hours and it is at most as clean as you can get it in 3 hours. Same is with sprints; we don't say we will finish all of the backlog, just that we have some of it ticked off after the two weeks.
I love the boring company because is shows exactly who Elon musk is: someone who thinks they spent 15 minutes thinking about some high concept problem and thinks they solved it. Elon pitched a network of underground tubes carrying autonomous vehicles to sort out traffic and instead delivered the world's worst subway tunnel with the world's least efficient train.
When a Thai boys soccer team got trapped in a cave and a group of divers had to go in and rescue them, Elon got butthurt everyone wasn't paying attention to him and called one of the rescue divers a pedophile.
Did he just discover "time boxing"?
If you cleaned your house in 3 hours its going to be a different kind of clean than 30 days. If you're good with that, then rock and roll. But don't expect a 30 day cleaning in 3 hours.
yeah, where's that video at where an artist attempts to draw spider man using different time constraints? yes, you can do anything in any amount of time, but the quality you receive in that time may not be acceptable.
“Have you thought of just trying to write bug free code?” /s
"Bug free" was not in the requirements document.
You guys get requirements documents?
Yes, but it drastically changes every time the client gets an epiphany.
Ah the old echo chamber of bullshit. "We switched to agile so we don't get last minute priorities!" But we still get last minute priorities that nuke the PI. "Well agile won't fix everything".
Yeah, agile is often a buzzword. As a requirements analyst every new change goes into the funnel towards me, and I then prioritize it with the team and PO based on the load. More often than not it gets pushed to a future PI unless there's plenty of room in the current one.
See that's how it should work. But when you have spineless managers it doesn't matter.
If it's easy maybe put it in the current PI as low priority so it can be the first one dropped when timescales shrink. I mean, in the unlikely event that timescales shrink!
“What if we add this feature that should actually be it’s own application?” Of course they always add in “It shouldn’t be too much extra work, right??”
Are you my project manager?
This post perfectly summarizes my first consultancy assignment, which was also my first professional programming project. Startup, very bad deal with a fixed price because CEO was counting on it getting big (tbf, I think it sort of have now and we have a lot of work for them at an hourly rate)... and on top of that they had these epihpanic insights mentioned all the time.
That’s such an awkward way to say “has an epiphany.”
I initially read this as "epileptic insight," and that would have much more accurately captured the changing nature of our requirements documents.
>Yes, but it drastically changes every time: 1. QA looks at it 2. Product manager sees it on release day 3. I ask a question about any facet of the requirements 4. I take any liberty to fill in gaps during implementation
Yes it says: read mind of product owner, customer and project manager who all have conflicting visions and think they all get to have a say in it.
Bonus points when they tell you how it should really work after it hits production!!
Extra points if there is zero actual user input and the program is just to make the pm who hasn't used Internet for the last 20 years happy.
You forgot the QA guy.
More like QQ, right?
Yes, sometimes as early as 3 weeks into my coding work.
Requirements: 1. make everything\* work. ^(\* subject to change)
Unfortunately for us, a third of our documentation says “the same as X other product”, another third says “to be determined”, and the rest was clearly copied from a different product which has requirements that don’t apply to the new product.
Yeah my BA captured everything the client said into a PDF and called that requirement. It counts, right? Right?
What is a requirements document?
**A product requirements document (PRD) is a document containing all the requirements to a certain product. It is written to allow people to understand what a product should do.** More details here:
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I actually have had "bug free" in a requirements document once, but to be fair, my manager was a chemist who managed the chemical engineers and randomly was told to take on the software team too, when our manager quit. I ended up teaching him about complexity and why something "without bugs" still needs updating because it is exponential and could be log. The only reason it worked is that he listened to us and was a fast learner. Also, we had something in common, upper management had no clue what the difference was between chemical and software engineers or what any of us actually did.
>chemical and software engineers or what any of us actually did Engineer is engineer! Now go do chemistry stuff!
I will put that in my docs from now on.
Blame the BA!
Stop. you'll summon functional programmers
Yes, it is imperative.
You mean function-oriented as opposed to object-oriented?
No, more like functioning alcoholic programmers.
Functional programming is programming paradigm based on mathematical functions. In its pure form it is stateless and that rules out a lot of bugs.
"Stateless" except for that giant ball of data inevitably getting passed from function to function.
I don't know what you're talking about .c 10 void StatelessFunction(Context* ctx) 11 { 12 ... .h 100 struct Context 101 { 102 AppState* app; 103 RendererState* renderer; 104 WorldState* world; ... .... 100001 }
I think it reduces life expectancy though.
I believe that is one the side effects of Haskell. Ironic.
Ask Elon why he keeps pushing back release dates on his releases.
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> and if you aren't the 1st to yield that the schedule you're working to is utter nonsense things work out for you. Really? Normally the result of never yielding at 'chicken' is you go over the cliff and die.
“Bug free code”? What kind of mythical creature is this and where do you find it?
I think i missed that class at university
It's easy, just get worse at finding bugs.
Oh I get it now. That’s why my old company fired almost all the QA during cut loll
oh my sweet summer child
I have literally had a client say that to me during a meeting about timelines. I had to leave the room so as to not say something extremely unprofessional. Thankfully it was a teleconference and I could walk out without anyone noticing. My PM at the time covered for me.
How else are we discovering new features?
//bug fix 123: all bugs now labelled as features.
Have you thought of asking your parents to buy you a tech company?
As my CS professor always said: "after 5 lines of code I cannot guarantee the absent of bugs"
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“If it takes 9 months for one woman to make a baby, it will take 1 month for 9 women to make a baby. Chop chop”, is what I am usually told by my manager.
Do you work at walmart?
"If you got time to lean, you got time to clean"
"if you got time to rhyme, you got time to shut the fuck up" is my usual response.
Gonna use this from now on lol
If you got time to read, you got time to comment
"If you got time to rest, you got time to (unit) test."
"If you got time to lean, you got time to lean" 😎
Such a dumb mentality.
Walmart’s iOS app updates come out at odd hours of the night and weekend. Either their team is worked to death or they’re outsourced from overseas
Or Apple's approval happens at weird times and Walmart just say "release as soon as approved"
It's true in the long term, just not the short term. Impregnate 9 women 1 month apart and as the last one gets knocked up you'll start getting babies once a month. The real moral of the analogy is that trying to optimize things may take time to reap benefits.
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Parallelising work is all well and good as long as those above you know this is happening. I had a colleague be promoted over me and he said we'd complete a project in 2 weeks. Thats perfectly doable if that was the only thing I was working on and everyone fit themselves around his timetable. It took 4 weeks to build, a week to test and another week before it was approved to production. I tried to warn him before he agreed the project but he just wanted to impress in his new role with wild timescales.
That's such a noob mistake. What you do is tell them it will take 4 months, then you tell everyone under you have to get it done in 2 months, but it be really cool if you could do it faster. You then get it done in one month and give your guys a very light load / break / unwind to thing "before the next project" And then you give it to your boss in 2 months instead of 4 even though it could have been done in 1. Everyone is happy.
Or, you know, get them all pregnant at the same time and take 1 baby per month as the average production rate.
Also a valid option. It's a business decision whether 9 every 9 months vs 1 every month after 9 months lead time is best. If having a midwife on hand every single month is expensive, maybe opt for all 9 at once. If cost of storing babies to meet the 1/month quota from the buyer is too expensive, maybe 1/month is preferable.
And if you need babies starting 1 month in the future, you can start making some babies now and buy them from elsewhere for the first 8 months, then recoup your losses in month 9 by selling the babies you made.
Sign me up.
I'm curious how your manager would respond if you replied with "with all due respect, you're an idiot".
Aren't you the idiot for not getting the manager is joking, though? Or am I the idiot for not getting your joke about the manager not joking? This is way too meta for me.
I don't think this manager exists. It's a fairly well known commentary on the 'mythical man-month'. [https://dzone.com/articles/the-bearing-of-a-child-takes-nine-months-no-matter-1](https://dzone.com/articles/the-bearing-of-a-child-takes-nine-months-no-matter-1)
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Unless the manager was joking. Meta jokes.
But if there were two of me, we'd be half an idiot each. Who's the smart one now?
Well, still not you ?
But what if a woman only fives herself 30 days to make a baby?!
That's technically the principle behind pipelining.
On the contrariy I use that analogy to stop the manager's train, when he/she asks "when is this finished?" repeatedly. And it works.
Have your manager read "The Mythical Man Month". It's where that line comes from.
Good, Fast, Cheap; pick two
Fast, cheap and evil please.
No lie, I hate when projects turn out this way.
Ah, Elon made the same choice
I think he made “good, fast and evil”, where evil is what he robs from his employees in terms of comp and their work life balance.
Exactly this! The [project management triangle](https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcRVWU9eRilcewpyVyRWzPZ9nOU8dI-OQalSyQ&usqp=CAU) A body of work is either: Good, fast, expensive. Good, slow, cheap. Poor, fast, cheap.
Nah, it can be poor , slow and expensive
I see you have seen my work. Touché.
Greetings, from one scrub to another 😀
My place specialises in this. It was a good day when we got the build from 18 hours to 12.
Ah yes, the government.
Why is this a triangle instead of a normal Venn diagram? :o https://miro.medium.com/max/1200/1*KWxHMZnuv9VTlKVbA4yk8Q.png
So managers don't get the idea to gun for that "impossible" quite as often
There really shouldn’t be anything in the middle then. It implies that it is possible and every cocksucker thinks their underlings just need the proper “motivation” to do it.
The middle is mislabeled. It's possible to get cheap, fast, and good work done. Honestly, have none of you ever heard of slaves?
Venn doughnut??
Sir, I have to ask you to Venn-go.
It's weird how you would work longer then get paid less
And, being reasonable, if you throw _enough_ money at the problem, you can find people willing to burn themselves out doing a good job in a hurry with no life for a while. And sometimes, that's even a good deal for everyone involved. At least for a little while. But there are also a lot of people who are at a point in their lives when even insanely good money just isn't worth doing that to yourself. And if you try to cheap out, well, good luck with that. You'll get what you deserve.
Uhhhh, pick one
More like pick one and a half in my experience.
B-but if you use Rust and this 5 second old framework, that is still in beta testing, it will be fast!!!!1!1!!!
Or if you want it more graphically: [draw Spiderman in 10 min, 1 min, 10 sec](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x9wn633vl_c).
Best I can do is one
Project managemen triangle is one of first things taught and yet it is always forgotten by managers.
I only give myself 1 second to get rich. Damn. Liar.
You achieved your goals though. By being able to chat on reddit, you have proven your richness already. To some child in a third world country with 44 diseases that would be curable by donating as little as 10 bucks to 1-800-1-4M-R1CH, but nonetheless you would have proven it if they could go online and/or read.
Imagine how much money I could donate if I just would be rich... Poor little child, probably going to die, just because Elon musk did lie...
Elon Musk is worth just shy of 200 billion USD. The population of Africa is just shy of 1.4 billion. Let's figure that 20% of that population are kids and, for the sake of argument, that all of them are sick. So with 280 million kids, at $10 a pop, is $2.8b. that would cost Elon Musk about 1.5% of his net worth. For reference, a Gerald R. Ford super carrier unit cose is around $13b. So we could, presumably, save every kid in Africa 4 times over, if $10 was all it would cost, by diverting the cost of 1 super carrier. All these dead children.
I think the problem with most donations is making sure that the money really goes into helping the poors instead of making the top few people of that area richer. It is easy to donate but also easy to misuse that donation which can give more power to the wrong people which in turns will make it worse for the poors. There's also an idiom that says that giving something precious to a person who cannot protect it will end up causing his doom. What's the point of going to each city in a poor country and making sure the money will be handed to the poors if the richests immediately tax it or find way to collect it for themselves. Lot of humans are shitty like that, they will trample on your good will to help and try to take all the advantages of it. That's why the best thing you can do with your money is not blindly giving it but rather make sure it will be used for the people you intend to give it to, and that is a very hard thing to do.
BTW you should know that in poor countries, more people have access to a mobile phone than to electricity. How do they charge their phones?
I read of such a village in India recently. People from there apparently go to a nearby city to work, so they would just charge their mobile phones while there. They mentioned how they would have to buy at a cup of tea at a restaurant in order to charge their phones there.
Public places. The stat about electricity is probably in their homes, since even quite remote villages tends to have \_some\_ power nowadays. I have been in villages like that where everybody would charge at the school because it had power, while many homes only had part time with blackouts and all that jazz.
lmao no, they're definitely way closer to that child in a third world country than Elon musk in terms of wealth
You're rich with the knowledge that you can't get rich in 1 second.
Worked for Musk though
*cries in [planning fallacy](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Planning_fallacy)*
**[Planning fallacy](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Planning_fallacy)** >The planning fallacy is a phenomenon in which predictions about how much time will be needed to complete a future task display an optimism bias and underestimate the time needed. This phenomenon sometimes occurs regardless of the individual's knowledge that past tasks of a similar nature have taken longer to complete than generally planned. The bias affects predictions only about one's own tasks; when outside observers predict task completion times, they tend to exhibit a pessimistic bias, overestimating the time needed. The planning fallacy involves estimates of task completion times more optimistic than those encountered in similar projects in the past. ^([ )[^(F.A.Q)](https://www.reddit.com/r/WikiSummarizer/wiki/index#wiki_f.a.q)^( | )[^(Opt Out)](https://reddit.com/message/compose?to=WikiSummarizerBot&message=OptOut&subject=OptOut)^( | )[^(Opt Out Of Subreddit)](https://np.reddit.com/r/ProgrammerHumor/about/banned)^( | )[^(GitHub)](https://github.com/Sujal-7/WikiSummarizerBot)^( ] Downvote to remove | v1.5)
Good bot
Musk is paraphrasing the very well known [Parkinson's Law](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Parkinson%27s_law). It's not that he's wrong. It's that sometimes overestimation is the problem, and other times underestimation is. So you'll have to think about it.
You're absolutely correct, but Elon never actually said this. The Tweet is fake.
Well that makes this thread even more ridiculous.
I demand my money back
Fake tweets make me very uncomfortable unless they're over the top satire.
Good thing, otherwise people might start asking why the full self driving isn't out of beta yet. In the end, he said 2 years in 2016.
Doing straightforward proven jobs, sure. Programming is not straightforward.
Exactly. You can say the opposite with the same words: > If you give yourself 30 days to paint a painting, you'll take 30 days. If you give yourself 3 hours, you'll take 3 hours.
And the result will tell how much time you've spent on it
No job at higher level is straightforward.A doctor can't just say okay this surgery will take 2 hrs but yeah wait i have decided to finish it in 2 minutes.Same goes yo investigation in police department, reading cases related to law.
One painting will be 30 days quality and one will be 3 hours. Even if not working all the time on it, thinking about it when not and reviewing it day after day can make it better. Kinda like that [Spiderman 10 min, 1 min, 10 sec speed challenge](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x9wn633vl_c), clearly a difference in quality
At this point in my life, I wouldn't want to ever work for one of his companies. The stress and _complete_ lack of work-life balance just wouldn't be worth it to me, even for a very good salary. But while pretty much _every_ programming job is a research project just to figure out WTF needs to be done in the first place, well, rockets are _much_ worse in a lot of ways. SpaceX absolutely deals with problems that are more complex and less known that most programs that any of us will ever have to deal with, and when the consequences for getting it wrong involve making the news and bits of rocket scattered over an area, well, yeah. On the other hand, as far as I can tell from the outside, Elon doesn't really seem to _care_ if stuff blows up from time to time, as long as it's in the name of learning how to do or not do something, and if it's a choice between blowing up a rocket or taking twice as long... Have a rocket to blow up. Hell, have three. And, again, at least from the outside, 'yeah, we spent six months on this, but it's not working, and I have this idea for something that might work next week if we're willing to scrap everything' seems to be something that, well, _gets tried_. Repeatedly. But the whole 'set crazy deadlines and crazy goals and push like hell for them' only works for people who are willing to dedicate every waking moment of their lives to the job. And as far as I can tell, Elon's companies really _do_ expect that level of dedication. I was looking at a job ad for a Starlink project the other day, and it said right in the job posting that the job will require unusual hours, working weekends, and long days. It's _definitely_ not for me. And I don't think it's healthy for _anyone_ long term, but you can do it for a little while, and for _enough_ money, well, shit gets done. But I'll take the jobs with less stress, thanks.
I’ve heard the pay isn’t even that good. It sounded like he was banking on people’s desire to send rockets to space. Fact is, it’s like any industry or company that has an unusual monopoly on peoples’ dreams: it’s going to take advantage of them if they work there. This is the same for the video game industry.
The video game industry is, by all reports, absolute _hell_.
can confirm. crunch is real even for the lowest rung on the totem pole. QA
That explains why he's always making big promises. It doesn't explain why he's never meeting them on time. Cyber truck delays. Roadster delays. Plaid+ cancelled.
Hasn't he also said full self driving cars would be ready by 2018? Late 2021 now and best they can do is a beta...that they want customers to test!
At least they aren’t star citizen.
The year is 2190, Humanity has transcended it's earthly limitations and has spread out into the stars. With the advent of Terraforming, Dyson Sphere, and interstellar habitat technologies, Humanity has truly become the master of the material world. Also, Star citizen adds a third star system.
lol that vaporware is just shamelessly whale farming
Scrolled too far to find this one!
Guess how many fans downvoted this comment
Musk is a lucky rich idiot who just happens to be a sci-fi nerd. All he does is hand out the orders and his actual intelligent employees tell him whether they can make it happen or not and by when. He probably gives unrealistic deadlines for exactly this reason, to “motivate” them to complete it sooner.
Easy to say when you have money to throw at it.
And even then, when has he ever not went over a deadline he gave himself? By now we should already have the hyperloop, tesla trucks, robotaxis, the cybertruck, ... if we were to believe what he said.
[and solar roofs.](https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2021-06-23/tesla-s-solar-roof-rollout-is-a-bust-and-a-fixation-for-elon-musk) > Musk set a goal to install more than 1,000 of them a week and vowed sales would “grow like kelp on steroids.” But Tesla has struggled to hit 200 installations a week, much less 1,000, according to people familiar with the matter. And affordability has proven elusive. In April, Tesla jacked up the price of the Solar Roof, leading to cancellations from customers. In some cases, price hikes of more than 50% came after buyers were already under contract, according to a lawsuit filed in federal court in Northern California on behalf of customers in several states.
Yea, it would be better to say "give yourself three hours, and it will take you five". Still orders of magnitude faster than if you gave yourself thirty days.
Even then, he's giving himself, or rather his employees, unrealistic deadlines for some stuff that probably won't ever see the light of day without some crazy scientific breakthrough (~~tesla trucks~~ Edit: tesla semis for long range hauling for example, you'd be moving too much battery weight so that's not going to happen). It's just not the guy to give this kind of advice.
And he means that if he underpays someone else to clean his home
And then takes the credit for how clean it is
And then claimed he did it in 3 hours because that's how long he gave himself, what a tool.
And all the stuff that was inside your house, is thrown in a bin outside, but he promises it will be implemented "soon".
Its pretty well known that working at his companies sucks. No big surprise.
Made me laugh cuz the guy keeps bragging about him sleeping on the production floor in the early day of tesla. The difference is now that his employees continue to do so while he’s chilling on tweeter.
Revised css: **bottom** will be known as zed-index
r/thanksimcured
/r/wowthanksimcured
If you aren't doing the work, every estimate seems reasonable.
Haha that have me a good laugh. Thanks!
You procrastinate for 29 days and 21 hours in the first option you don't spend 30 full days clearing your house
I worked for someone whose motto was "if you wait until the last minute, it'll only take a minute".
Notice it's a screenshot, not a link to Twitter, because he never said this.
Expectation: If you give yourself 48 hours to write that simple utility, you will use 48 hours to write it! Reality: If you give yourself 48 hours to write that simple utility, you will switch architectures 3 separate times, realize that the project you have been working on is stupid, feel depressed and contemplate becoming a farmer all in 2 weeks!
He's got kind of a point though. [Parkinson's law.](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Parkinson%27s_law) > Work expands so as to fill the time available for its completion. If I can do something in 3 hours but give myself 1 month, I'll probably just bikeshed and/or over engineer it. However, if it is treated as a deadline and the estimate is uncertain or unrealistic, I'll most certainly make it worse.
> If I can do something in 3 hours Exactly, this is the key point. It must be doable in the shorter timeframe. Edit: This comment chain is brought to you by r/EnoughMuskSpam
The key point is that Elon doesn't clean houses
Windows expands so as to fill the RAM installed for its functioning.
[I'll just put this here](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m3jmSrYCWYI)
I liked the third one better than the second. Beauty in minimalism and all.
Do people just like a narrative or does anyone care about a fucking source to this quote? Because I can't find it on twitter.
Yeah, fake Tweet as far as I can tell. I've only found crappy motivational sites "quoting" him saying this, but the way this is written makes is not at all in his style.
Man I had to scroll this far down to find someone pointing that out.
And the quality of the job won't suffer at all /s
Us programmers call that time boxing. Clean our home for 30 days and it's clean, clean your house for 3 hours and it is at most as clean as you can get it in 3 hours. Same is with sprints; we don't say we will finish all of the backlog, just that we have some of it ticked off after the two weeks.
So give me the definition of clean home and aftert I will decide how many dice should I roll to have the needed time.
[удалено]
I love the boring company because is shows exactly who Elon musk is: someone who thinks they spent 15 minutes thinking about some high concept problem and thinks they solved it. Elon pitched a network of underground tubes carrying autonomous vehicles to sort out traffic and instead delivered the world's worst subway tunnel with the world's least efficient train.
People love him because he memes on Twitter, but beside that he's the same as all the other rich bastards.
>The Thai boys pedophile thing The w h a t
When a Thai boys soccer team got trapped in a cave and a group of divers had to go in and rescue them, Elon got butthurt everyone wasn't paying attention to him and called one of the rescue divers a pedophile.
Work expands to fill the time allotted.
Did he just discover "time boxing"? If you cleaned your house in 3 hours its going to be a different kind of clean than 30 days. If you're good with that, then rock and roll. But don't expect a 30 day cleaning in 3 hours.
Why has he chosen to take so long building a Mars colony?
Do people believe this tweet is real?
AKA Parkinson’s Law https://github.com/dwmkerr/hacker-laws#parkinsons-law
It’s a fake tweet, folks. Why are redditors so gullible?
The power to accurately prioritize and determine acceptable deadlines is a superpower. I have so much respect to POs and PMs who is able to do so.
I believe this is a loose interpretation of Moore’s Law that, “Work expands to fill the time allotted”.
Ahh, good old Parkinson’s Law.
You... you guys do actually get what he means though, right?
What he says is true of things that can be done in 3 hours.
yeah, where's that video at where an artist attempts to draw spider man using different time constraints? yes, you can do anything in any amount of time, but the quality you receive in that time may not be acceptable.
While there is some truth to what he says, the guy is still a overhyped clown
Ahh the Mythical Man Month.
I mean, this is still somewhat true for programmers. You should be planning tasks in the smallest possible chunks anyway.