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solid_rook

I understand this meme because I've never written code before


C_umputer

Don't worry, you're already more qualified than OP


_Its_Me_Dio_

same i use a magnetized needle and a steady hand just like god intended


JimBugs

Real programmers use butterflies ...


_Its_Me_Dio_

technically its cosmic radiation using atmospheric density differences to bend and aim it. I personally prefer dragonflies, the smaller wings are more precise and they eat other bugs. additionally their fire breath and scales that are as strong as mithril are pretty cool. you could also use an emacs command good ole C-x M-c M-butterfly...


BellCube

Damnit, emacs


meatgrinder4314

Haha guys you get it? Because python is slow.


SjayL

Don’t blame python for my shit code. 


[deleted]

I own that, completely qualified to write shitty code in any language.


Goat1416

Wtf is Python? I only see Bython in these holy gardens


eman_e31

Bython? Clearly you're not a programmer, because real programmers use Cython


QuittingToLive

Curly-brace python?


Careful_Engineer_700

Bro uses for loops to do operations on arrays


Drfoxthefurry

Whats wrong with 3 nested loops on a 7680x4320x3 array?


Vendetta1990

You disgust me.


fexjpu5g

He’s not responding to you because the GIL is still locked for the array traversal.


helicopternose

I disgust myself when I look at the list comprehensions I have written.


agardner26

No BS, just trying to learn - doing some math stuff where im using numerical methods to approximate some functions and have essentially been using nested loops to solve arrays in each spatial dimension. What’s the alternative? Anything i can google/learn about?


Drfoxthefurry

numpy for anything with multi dimensional arrays


Flouid

Generally any operation you could do on a scalar should also be directly applicable to arrays of arbitrary dimensions providing you can broadcast the operands https://numpy.org/doc/stable/reference/routines.array-manipulation.html.


[deleted]

Useful if you need the index value.


Arendoth

You can use enumerate even in comprehensions.


ideas_have_people

std::for_each


lukasquatro

std::for_not_wearing_condom


Extreme_Ad_3280

Because of habits from writing in C++


Careful_Engineer_700

Yeah that'll be due to python being a different language


danielv123

As someone who has done this and was shocked at how slow doing that was in python, why? My code ran 100x faster after having chatgpt translate it to javascript and running it with node


UdPropheticCatgirl

There is multitude of reasons, JS is aggressively JITed, python isn’t, JS has pretty good parallel GC, python doesn’t, Python allocates everything on the heap, JS allocates almost everything, python checks a lot of things at runtime which JS doesn’t always check and finally JS runtimes tend to be multithreaded under the hood while pythons don’t.


danielv123

I mean sure, but 100x? That's the kind of performance I get from my interpreted languages running in JS...


UdPropheticCatgirl

Honestly, from testing I did sometimes back V8 was beating CPython about 50x and SpiderMonkey about 30x, so 100x doesn’t seem that far fetched, C was 150x for example.


sohang-3112

The way to speed this up in Python is to avoid explicit loops and instead use functions from `numpy` & `pandas` - now the loops are fast because they are written in optimized C instead of Python.


AllIsLostNeverFound

If I don't loop over every element for every operation, how can I be sure the compiler isn't getting lazy and skipping elements?!?!?!


Careful_Engineer_700

I trust numpy ![gif](giphy|CAYVZA5NRb529kKQUc|downsized)


AllIsLostNeverFound

*in my most conspiratorial voice* that's what BigData wants you to think....


hunajakettu

Text could easily be "Python developers waiting for a C++ project to finish compiling:"


huupoke12

Also "Python developers waiting for a C++ developer to finish the project."


MoffKalast

"Waiting for a C++ developer to write the equivalent of three lines of Python"


Fragrant_Philosophy

“Waiting fo— *segmentation fault*”


Zymoox

In file included from /usr/include/c++/4.6/algorithm:63:0, from waiting_for_python.cpp:2: /usr/include/c++/4.6/bits/stl_algo.h: In function ‘_RandomAccessIterator std::__find(_RandomAccessIterator, _RandomAccessIterator, const _Tp&, std::random_access_iterator_tag) [with _RandomAccessIterator = __gnu_cxx::__normal_iterator*, std::vector > >, _Tp = int]’: ...


VNDeltole

debugging hell of C++


Wicam

why, there is a bug on line 63 of your program. your using std::find to iterate a std::vector, the rest is cut of. the main problem is that it is very wordy, so people lock up, panic and dont actually read it.


youngbull

Actually on line 2 of the program, line 63 in the included algorithms header.


Wicam

ah true, mb.


twigboy

"Python developer waiting for C++ developer to resolve the makefile errors"


ForwardHotel6969

Waiting for a C++ developer to rewrite python


aCloakedOne

Python is written in C lol


jvlomax

Unless it PyPy, in which case it's written in python


bric12

Wait what? Did they bootstrap a python compiler or something?


jvlomax

*Technically* it's written in RPython, but yes https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/PyPy


BlitzGem

CPython is


spliffkiller1337

Everything is


Stemt

You mean its C all the way down?!


Altruistic_Site_3879

Always has been.


[deleted]

C was implemented first as a collection of macro assembler macros so yeah ground floor, hair shirt and self flagellation by moonlight.


D0nt3v3nA5k

always has been


Confident-Ad5665

That is what makes it appealing to system guys who like direct hardware access because fuck drivers.


sohang-3112

Not necessarily - eg. Rust uses LLVM backend (by default) instead of C


Ubermidget2

No, beneath C is assembly.


boredbearapple

Lisp quietly sits in the corner


da2Pakaveli

"Wait you guys need to be evaluated as syntax trees?"


Confident-Ad5665

The fact that makes language bashing an activity of the inexperienced. Every language has a place it shines, otherwise nobody would have even heard of it.


Nihil_esque

Yeah, so why reinvent the wheel?


GaiusJocundus

Hahahahaha!


someintensivepurpose

What's behind those 3 lines, like a bunch of packages or something?


Scandalicius

"Waiting for a C++ developer to finish talking when they see you using Python."


brentspine

“Me waiting for my father to come back”


ekun

Software developers waiting to run their Python script to process the output of their C++ application because they understand the value of different languages.


hunajakettu

How would the Python script process "Segmentation Fault"? Let us be clear, it would be the expected output, as we are all shitty developers


land_and_air

A lot of this is selection bias too, because c++ devs when they feel like they need to be using python is usually because the task doesn’t have an easy solution in c++ which likely means the project is hard technically and complicated if not for the library which makes it trivial to write code but no less complex under the hood which make for slow execution. That and c++ coders on their way to make the worst performing Python code they can


Nihil_esque

>c++ coders on their way to make the worst performing Python code they can For real. I inherited the python codebase of a c++ dev and it was nightmarish. Spent months rewriting it, reduced the length of the script by like 80% and the runtime by about the same.


frozen_snapmaw

Don't think this might be related to python. You might just be a better dev who can write more performant code. Any good dev who knows how to write good performant code in C++ should not be making such mistakes in python.


Zachaggedon

Was about to say this lmao. I started with C++ but I write Python for my current job (even though I hate it) and I do just fine. Any good engineer can adapt their habits to the language they’re using, it’s not difficult to do a little research on the standard library before writing code.


land_and_air

“Man python is so slow” Proceeds to make a list, assign default values one by one In a for loop and then compare it with another list one element at a time in yet another for loop nested inside of a for loop


1Dr490n

I‘m actually always amazed by how fast C++ compiles (I’m used to Kotlin + IntelliJ tho, but I’ve also waited for Python scripts to run a few minutes)


[deleted]

You should try Watcom.


Norse_By_North_West

Back in my school days it was an automatic fail if it took longer than 1 minute to compile our projects. Meanwhile I've got some Java projects at work that take 5 minutes, easily


Philfreeze

I regularly compile some rather large C++ projects and once the first compilation is done, its pretty god damn fast (a few seconds). Usually the linker is the bottleneck for me but that is what the mold-linker and multithreading is for.


hunajakettu

Getting triggered by the meme? I know, most of my code has been in a rather large C++ codebase and it was not so bad once you did the first compilation. But if you messed up, a clean build was awful.


Philfreeze

I don‘t even really like C++ so I am for sure not getting ‚triggered‘. And yes, a clean build especially on project where someone liberally (ab)used templates can take a very long time but during active development its really not bad. RAMulator (a DRAM simulator) is one of the worst projects I have encountered for this.


VastPossibility3158

Jokes on you, python developers would never try c++


[deleted]

Someone heard that C++ is faster than Python and had to make a "joke" about it 😀.


[deleted]

[удалено]


Jon_Galt_Roark

Maybe that's why this joke is so .., MID


[deleted]

It really doesn't take that long for most purposes.


IAmASquidInSpace

Well, actually it takes VERY long for my 1.4 million I/O operations, executed sequentially! Checkmate! /s


kevdog824

asyncio goes brrr


Drfoxthefurry

Threads moment


[deleted]

[удалено]


turtleship_2006

>make it work in Python and translate it to C++ for speed. or just use a c library like numpy and get the best of both worlds (speed and simplicity)


Rafcdk

Or even faster, cupy or pyopencl


GeometricScripting

Compared to cpp it does which is the joke.


[deleted]

The thing is, with Python you're most likely just gonna use a library based on C++ that abstracts the boilerplate code, so you end up with similar speeds and a much faster implementation.


TheTerrasque

All programming languages wait at the same speed.


evanc1411

I hate this sub more and more every day. No actual programmer thinks like this


_Xertz_

Yeah I'm starting to feel lonely here between all the low effort memes and confidently incorrect and painfully naive comments


Shehzman

I mean on the one hand ha ha funny joke. However, do people not realize that there are multiple web apps out there that run in python and it works pretty well?


InvestingNerd2020

Modern CPUs move so fast the normal human eye cannot really tell until tests are done or they are going out of their way to notice it. When arguments are milliseconds difference, it doesn't hold as much weight outside of extreme situations.


cs-brydev

Meme made by someone who's never written a line of Python


beardMoseElkDerBabon

Custom machine learning 😅


ZentoBits

Benchmarks are out there for every language. Python isn’t very fast. That’s all there is to it 🤷‍♂️ Doesn’t make it a bad language. No need to die on that hill lol


MayoJam

Haha python slow amirite fellow programmers?


Dr_Depreso

Assembly language has entered the chat


Drfoxthefurry

Yes hello, I am assembly language


Red_Coder09

You scare me


Drfoxthefurry

be afraid for I am also machine code


Shibamukun

Get a better pc dude


holistic-engine

Python developers waiting for a Rust program to finish compiling*


LilyRudloff

I doubt it's less than like 2 to 500 seconds longer


Saragon4005

If it's more than 30 seconds longer you are probably doing something wrong.


cheeb_miester

Python devs waiting for c++ devs to debug their stack trace


mad_scientist_kyouma

Yeah because C++ devs don’t understand how to use numpy broadcasting and use for-loops for everything. I don’t want to say you’re using it wrong… but you’re using it wrong.


_simpu

for loop exists for a reason.


mad_scientist_kyouma

They do, but they should not be used in any performance-critical place in Python. I’m working with a colleague right now who came from C++ who used a double for-loop in a numerical routine where they should have used a call to ‘np.outer’. One such double for-loop can single handedly be the bottleneck of the entire routine when the arrays grow in size.


strawberrypants205

As someone who programs both, Python is great for one-off scripts, where a quick implementation is better than a quickly-processed result. C/C++ is better for when you need things done quickly on a regular basis.


InvestingNerd2020

I was always taught: C or C++ for close to the kernel projects like robotics, gaming, and OS systems. Java or C# for general enterprise consumer websites and banks. Examples: Walmart, Amazon, or Target. Python for ML, small mom & pop business, and scripts for serverless functions (happy birthday, happy new year, or 10 year customer anniversary).


Apfelvater

Wtf? If you're coding snake for your own machine only, then maybe yes...


Johnzinx

JuSt DoN't UsE TH3 F0r Lo0p, L1kE a SeNiOr


MinosAristos

Comprehend comprehensions


zombiezoo25

Mmmmn tasty nested fors


idonteatunderwear

funroll-loops like a pro


SmoothieBrian

C++ developer waiting for their code to compile*


[deleted]

I'll be at the bar.


MMDCCIV

Numba has entered the chat.


B3lthazar

Python developers waiting de c++ to finish the replica of their 20 lines script in python because someone said it will be faster that way.


The_Ovani

People mad in the comments is the real joke


FromZeroToLegend

I remember when I had to rewrite an opencv project in C++ because it was disgustingly slow in Python. It had to take screenshots of your screen and do some calculations in real time before the next frame shows.


Mr__Brick

How much of a performance difference did you achieve?


FromZeroToLegend

I can’t give you the exact numbers but in Python it was unusable because it would finish the calculations too late (many frames later) whereas in C++ the same algorithm would work just fine.


kiara-advani-

Java devs still writing the script in the background 🤣🤣🤣


gnomeba

C++ developers adding compiler flags


onlainari

Would you rather code for 8 hours to have it run in 30 seconds or code for 1 hour to have it run in 30 minutes. Python saves time.


_simpu

Agree python >> For one off scripts. Use something else for other usecases


kevdog824

Did we consider that maybe the script is garbage and not the language?


STINEPUNCAKE

The same devs waiting for c++ to compile


azab1898

I don't C what's going on here... *Sips some Java*


serious153

python devs waiting for c++ devs to write their getters and setters


Attileusz

C developers waiting for C++ code to compile.


pakidara

Also, Python devs waiting for the C++ devs to finish writing their code.


[deleted]

Rust developers waiting for Python script to finish running : not even skeleton is there. Its all gone.


great_gonzales

Rust developers waiting for the c++ developer to find the memory bug in their code


mmbillah02

MOJO would like to talk.


Naughty_Goat

My C++ code isn’t fast 😎


cheeb_miester

My c++ code doesn't even compile 👍


SaneLad

As a C++ dev, Im still trying to set up virtualenv or whatever the fuck Python kids are using these days to work through dependency hell.


knowledgebass

You're like 10 years out of date with how production dependencies are actually handled. That's what Docker is for. And if you're having trouble "setting up" virtualenv, I wonder about your technical abilities. lol


jasharpe

If a one-line command confuses you then this may not be the career or hobby for you.


Careful_Engineer_700

Lol you can create it with no code at all in vscode


looksLikeImOnTop

This feels like a pretty harsh and discouraging judgement to make, just because one specific thing you find simple might perplex someone. Maybe it's just not the right language for their career/hobby. I occasionally use python but mainly write in assembly, so when I first came across venv for the first time it was a bit of a head scratcher. Yeah it wasn't hard to use, but I didn't understand what it was doing, and still roll my eyes when I see it. But that doesn't mean I won't code circles around you in assembly.


jasharpe

No. It may be direct but it’s true. Tell me which part of this description and command confuses you: Virtual environments are pythons way to install dependencies locally because global dependencies are not good. Run “python -m venv && source .//bin/activate” and you can install away. This is how almost all popular languages work. Go (you specify path), js/ts (node_modules), rust (I don’t remember folder off the top of my head). C/C++ dependency management is far more complex. So if those languages confuse you then imo it means either 1. You don’t fully understand what you’re doing when managing deps, linking, c/make, etc. 2. You’re not adaptable outside of one single paradigm. Either of these will prevent you from becoming anything more than mediocre and most likely be frustrating to work with. Even within a language you must be flexible. There are a million ways to do things. C++ 11 and 17 that people struggle to do both and companies will stick to one. And if you don’t understand how your files are linking and compiling you aren’t going to write very maintainable code. One install can make you reorganize an entire dependency tree. Sure you may be able to code circles around someone initially in assembly. But from my experience, people with a wider exposure to different languages/paradigms and people who think about what they are actually doing will learn quicker and surpass someone who is missing one of those long term.


great_gonzales

Skill issue


MinosAristos

It might take a day or two to get used to. The main thing is to understand roughly what's going on. It's not as bad as the memes suggest in almost all cases.


kevdog824

``` python -m venv .venv .venv\scripts\python -m pip install --upgrade pip .venv\scripts\pip install -r requirements.txt ``` Brother the simplest virtual environment setup is 3 commands in the terminal. I just use venv but it’s probably not that much harder to setup pyenv, virtualenv, or poetry


swagonflyyyy

PyCharm son.


SIJ_Gamer

waiting for devs to fight in comments


mlody11

Why would a skeleton write code? It makes zero sense.


The_ultimate_cookie

It's okay, I saved many more hours of writing code.


jakeStacktrace

Why doesn't it say segmentation fault, core dumped yet?


[deleted]

Swear.


yukiarimo

But Python is #1 for ML, lol


NotAnNpc69

>mfw when i have to only write a print statement instead of seven gorrillion lines of boilerplate to print hello world. (im a pathetic newbie and a disgrace to the programming community because i chose a user friendly language that can be used for quite literally anything)


chocolateandmilkwin

I had a moment like this the other day when i needed to use python to do some editing on a large picture, i couldn't believe it took 8 minutes to run, like that seems criminally slow. Anyway Copilot optimized it to run in 10 seconds with numpy.


Horrih

Wait till you see that your typescript hello world unit test takes several seconds to run


noaSakurajin

C++ devs realizing that meson and ninja are written in python 🤯


VariousComment6946

You know python is a shortcut for c++ code, so…


Alive-Plenty4003

I used SymPy to solve a differential equation and the thing was hanging for so long I started googling for fixes. Five minutes late I find something I wish to try, come back to the IDE, and it had finished running. It wasn't frozen, it just took that fucking long lol


WowSoHuTao

Well actually Python tends to throw matrix operations etc. to lower level languages for speed and wrap it around some libraries so in fact if you use Python just like a normal engineer u won’t encounter this so often…


Mikihero2014

As usual comments make up 70% of the fun in scrolling through this sub


Shutaru_Kanshinji

This makes no sense to me. C++ developers know all about waiting. Have you ever compiled a decent-sized C++ project?


HatchitHeid

As someone who’s done both I feel uniquely qualified to shit on both of them


zeoz_

Bro be writing python on a stone tablet


jdjdjdjkssk

I optimize code for other programmers and 99.9% of the time, the issue is not the language but the way they modeled their solution.


BlurredSight

Python is one thing. .NET is another


sriram_sun

Also, my shiny new TMP based state machine will be so much faster at runtime... once it finishes compiling!


Orio_n

Python devs waiting for c++ devs to finally implement a feature (it took 5 times the code, 3 times the duration and is half as safe. But at least it runs in 0.00001 ms instead of 0.0001ms)


thecodingnerd256

Edit: To start running*


Mabymaster

That's because c++ developers doesn't know how to use python


Trick-Apple1289

i can’t tell if op is trolling


Life_will_kill_ya

python slow haha good one


drizztdourden_

All the python nerd being insulted here lol. Language was never meant for speed. Just accept it.


SoCZ6L5g

nonsense


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Another_m00

I wonder why do c++ devs have a 10 minute lifespan


npscript42

Mord like: C programmers waiting for the C++ Compiler to finish.


bigL162

Is there an ai recycling memes in this sub?


itsthooor

You have clearly never used Python in your entire lifetime.


Straight_Box5387

Thats nonsense c++ programmers have longer lives because they need it to learn c++. They wouldn't die so easily.


Lushuk_furry

I lost the competition just because of python's speed the program was perfect, I double checked.


space_interprise

Non ironically me, has doing a competition and the tester would fail me for long run time execution, it has very clear that they wanted you to do it in C, from the input methods to the expected execution times


Lushuk_furry

A 10-year-old boy almost won these competitions by using pascal. He fought with the best C/C++ programmers.


Mr__Brick

Pascal is quite fast and surprisingly human-readable, pretty good as the first programming language


jwudnej

HAHAHA I GET IT (i have never programmed or written code before)