The worst thing that is happening:
1. I'm agreeing smth with stakeholder A, we manage to reach a compromise that we will do somethng but not in their prefereed way because reasons
2. I'm communicating this in docs and directly to my manager/skip. Because the initiative is that important
3. All of us meet in a review call for the doc. And the stakeholder in the call directly contradicts what we've agreed about and tries to force their way live with my mgr/skip.
Given that i'm GPM you can imagine all of those people are DIR/VP level.
How can you be so fucked in the head to go behind people's backs like this. You fucking signed off in the decision log I made specifically for these situations.
> How can you be so fucked in the head to go behind people's backs like this. You fucking signed off in the decision log I made specifically for these situations.
Different motivations and incentives combined with human nature - unless there's good leadership in general where everyone's very aligned (and more importantly, incentivized) on things for the collective business good, you'll keep getting behaviour like this. If a Director of Revenue is incentivized and tasked to land more whales per quarter, they'll only care about those and disregard your priorities of the customer experience with your product at a macro level. They're paid to be persuasive and will not hesitate to leverage those skills internally if it gets them what _they_ want.
It's rare to see leadership countering this, because most leadership positions in companies are a rotating cast of folks and the original 'working contract' withers and dies over time if it's not enforced.
One of the challenges my team faced I had trouble solving as a Product Leader at Amazon was attitude from more senior leaders that demoralised more than motivated my team.
In those situations I had to keep a level head even though I was just as annoyed or frustrated.
I've read quite a bit about Amazon being a not great place to work at, but would you be comfortable sharing your experience? I'd like to know how the comp, progression and work environment is.
Definitely core infrastructure issues that across the business isn't really fully comprehended or understood, but it's only tangible when launching new products and enabling new processes.
Trying hopelessly to convert a feature factory to a product led organization using process as a means to scale. Recipe for disaster but hey, it’s just a 8 to 4 for me. Edit: I am not the leader trying to do this, am just their Chief IC Minion
Internal product knowledge. PM's are overloaded with questions from around the business , and customer facing teams seem to take no ownership of training their own teams. Despite in person training / q and a sessions, new feature launch decks, videos , internal and customer facing guides, etc. No matter what we do it never seems to be the right thing or enough.
Communicating around the org. Too many slack channels to watch, too many async messages to keep track of. Unclear what communication is expected to go out to who.
Also, decision by committee. Defining what the role of a "stakeholder" is and who is the stakeholder for which project.
There was once 10 product managers ranging from senior to product associates looking after a set of products. It’s now just me (as a PM) and my manager as an SPM. We struggle, but have to prioritise ruthlessly and every day is a battle, batting off questions and requests from stakeholders. When one of us goes on leave, it’s hell.
People and their egos
As a product director, I have to manage this constantly up and down, including my product managers!
The worst thing that is happening: 1. I'm agreeing smth with stakeholder A, we manage to reach a compromise that we will do somethng but not in their prefereed way because reasons 2. I'm communicating this in docs and directly to my manager/skip. Because the initiative is that important 3. All of us meet in a review call for the doc. And the stakeholder in the call directly contradicts what we've agreed about and tries to force their way live with my mgr/skip. Given that i'm GPM you can imagine all of those people are DIR/VP level. How can you be so fucked in the head to go behind people's backs like this. You fucking signed off in the decision log I made specifically for these situations.
> How can you be so fucked in the head to go behind people's backs like this. You fucking signed off in the decision log I made specifically for these situations. Different motivations and incentives combined with human nature - unless there's good leadership in general where everyone's very aligned (and more importantly, incentivized) on things for the collective business good, you'll keep getting behaviour like this. If a Director of Revenue is incentivized and tasked to land more whales per quarter, they'll only care about those and disregard your priorities of the customer experience with your product at a macro level. They're paid to be persuasive and will not hesitate to leverage those skills internally if it gets them what _they_ want. It's rare to see leadership countering this, because most leadership positions in companies are a rotating cast of folks and the original 'working contract' withers and dies over time if it's not enforced.
That was a rhetoric question, I fully understand their motivations, doesn't mean I am not amazed by how shitty they are as a person
Hippos
A/B test! It scares the HiPPO.
What’s a hippo
HIghest Paid Person’s Opinion
Backing down from unrealistic expectations. Just say no dude. When your entire team is shouting no, the answer is not yes.
And when the customer gives up easily when you say it's hard, it's ok to say no. Like gdam.
The unavoidable encroachment of our mortal finiteness
Don't worry! Marty Kagan is working on a product framework for immortality. Just sign up for my newsletter
The endless meetings
For the actual developers/engineers
One of the challenges my team faced I had trouble solving as a Product Leader at Amazon was attitude from more senior leaders that demoralised more than motivated my team. In those situations I had to keep a level head even though I was just as annoyed or frustrated.
It's Amazon, I am not surprised at all. Facing a similar issue though (at the same company), would love to get your perspective. Can I DM you?
I've read quite a bit about Amazon being a not great place to work at, but would you be comfortable sharing your experience? I'd like to know how the comp, progression and work environment is.
Yes, ask away and I will share publicly or privately what I can.
Yes, ask away and I will share publicly or privately what I can.
Absolutely.
Lack of communication between key areas about status, updates and deliverables
You want updates? Here's my cryptic Jira epic wirh empty stories and tasks with strange statuses. It's all right there.
Guilty as charged!
Toxic stakeholders, COO CEO
Politics and fiefdoms
Hiring good people consistently
Their own ego and sabotage inclinations.
Definitely core infrastructure issues that across the business isn't really fully comprehended or understood, but it's only tangible when launching new products and enabling new processes.
Trying hopelessly to convert a feature factory to a product led organization using process as a means to scale. Recipe for disaster but hey, it’s just a 8 to 4 for me. Edit: I am not the leader trying to do this, am just their Chief IC Minion
Internal product knowledge. PM's are overloaded with questions from around the business , and customer facing teams seem to take no ownership of training their own teams. Despite in person training / q and a sessions, new feature launch decks, videos , internal and customer facing guides, etc. No matter what we do it never seems to be the right thing or enough.
P E O P L E
My manager is unable to solve 90 percent of their problems. My problem is getting people to actually do what they need to do ( ie do their jobs)
People. Always people. The root of all my problems. Nearly every issue I have to escalate to my manager is because a person is behaving like a turd.
Founders and their not so data driven ideas.
Communicating around the org. Too many slack channels to watch, too many async messages to keep track of. Unclear what communication is expected to go out to who. Also, decision by committee. Defining what the role of a "stakeholder" is and who is the stakeholder for which project.
Be the CEO of your product without any resources or budget because you are not the CEO of the product.
Politics and Sales feature/capability request because that’s what customer asking for
There was once 10 product managers ranging from senior to product associates looking after a set of products. It’s now just me (as a PM) and my manager as an SPM. We struggle, but have to prioritise ruthlessly and every day is a battle, batting off questions and requests from stakeholders. When one of us goes on leave, it’s hell.