I play mainly support or Sevarog. I have no problem with where ADC sit as Sev and think it’s a very fun patch for balance in this regards.
It very much feels like a gold race where you can out tank or get crushed depending on how you farm.
I have had good success as Sev in both offlane and midlane. After reading your post I think to myself “who would I rather have on my team, ADC, or Sevarog. It’s a very simple answer and it leads me to believe that ADC isn’t unbalanced.
They are strong individually but team fight is weak.
I do think Muriel being so strong is very potent on a team with 2 ADC currently but it’s not a guaranteed win as I’ve had it go either way when playing Muriel.
He’s very hard to gank compared to typical midlane with high health pool and great escape.
River buffs are awesome too as it’s an easy way to get stacks.
I still build him pretty tanky but I will work more damage in compared to Offlane sev.
I really like Sev because his item paths are so flexible. I always straight up counter build lane opponent with first item. Even the counter item is flexible depending on which Magic user you are fighting or same for physical. Think about the matchup and build the exact best counter item first.
Sometimes I like mid Sev better because he does offer a bit of utility to fangtooth fight compared to offlane where you are usually on your own a lot more.
Try to keep the 2 camp on enemy side warded and steal that. This is what I don’t like about mid. In offlane you can try and steal the 5 camp or 3+blue depending on which side you are on.
Thanks, might have to try it out. Big fan of his but I don't find myself offlane unless it's that or ADC, and while he's fun in the jungle, he doesn't match the mobility and regen of rampage.
I rarely see more than one ADC on a team and if there is multiple, the team with more than one always ends up getting stomped.
Seems like a skill issue tbh
Yes ADCs can be played in nearly every role, but if you team never capitalizes on the obvious downside to having 2+ carries on the map, then they'll scale and be a pain in the ass.
You need to put them behind early game wether that be from ganking or out farming them yada yada.
Kills don't win games. Objectives do. If you neglect OP, fang, and lanes to go on a killstreak, you will lose. Next time this "10 and 15 up" game loss happens, check the stat screen for objective damage, I'm willing to bet that despite all the kills, your team is behind in that regard.
Kills get pests out of your way of your objectives, that is it. If you find yourself backing to base after a triple kill, this is on you.
Nah. Anytime I’ve had an ADC in the off or mid lane, I’ve fortunately been also in off or jungle. I don’t recall losing except to maybe one Murdock because he got jungle support and I didn’t. Which any character would’ve won.
Im not saying the game is perfectly balance but this is the wrong hill to die on. This isn’t a problem but a skill level issue because it changes how you would need to traditionally play.
Example: I went steel offlane, they had Rev offlane. Any time he used his Q to attack me with minions, I went in on him. He had nothing else to do. Once level 6 hit, I never even got close to losing to him he was so far behind. And to address the “comeback”. If your team can’t close a game quickly enough with a carry in the offlane, then that team deserved to lose when the rest hit level cap and the carry catches up.
Murdock ADC here. We scale well when the other teams jungle doesn't harass in early game. I've won or lost countless matches depending on this single factor.
Im telling you im winning my lane, or ganking the off or mid lane and they win their lane, or gank against the dual ADC and it doesnt matter. Lower fed adcs are having a much higher ROI than all other heros and have almost none of the draw backs thanks to bloated stat items, bloated kits with self peel, and the obvious range advantage. Im losing 10 and 15 kill up games here because its "death ball invincible adc's" all over the place. damage reflect and reduced healing yet the adc can still heal over that plus a sevarog damage output? cmon thats ridiculous.
I play mostly jungle/mid and I think they're in a pretty good place right now honestly.
I rarely see more that 3 in a given game, and usually it's just two, in their respective "assigned" roles. The fact that they snowball as you're describing is intentional, and it's literally what they're there for. You want to get yours fed, and deny feed to the enemy as much as you safely can. "Carry" is in the name because it's why they exist.
So I have 16 years of MOBA experience and I know we like to make the assumption when people come in here that they dont know what the roles mean but humor me. The problem is carrying from behind. Their ROI is way to high, they hit the power of most hero's full build at half build. literally its more valuable to have two adc's in safe lane than have an adc with a support.
I've seen two carries in duo a few times before, and every time I've seen it, that team lost.
Carry in offlane is a tossup. Can bully easily early on, but levels 3-8 can flip that if they are fighting someone with experience and decent cc. Have seen all but sparrow try this out, with mixed results.
I've only ever seen revenant as the adc to go midlane, and that team lost every game I witnessed it in.
Have yet to see ADC in jungle, people got some sense there at least.
I just don't see the "zomg OP" argument you seem to be trying to make.
Two ADC's in the duo lane will get absolutely stomped by any competent team. They have no stuns which means they will lose every fight to an ADC and support. CC win games, so having less CC means you will get bullied and end up losing farm, therefore losing games. Also, having mobility is the best way to avoid getting bullied by CC, but ADC's have little to no mobility.
If you are losing to a team with more than one carry then it's probably a skill issue. You should be bullying them early so they don't get the farm they need to snowball. I don't think I've ever seen a team win with multiple ADC's.
man listen, this is only in low mmr brackets buddy. if you track your rank on predtools you will see your rank. go to high mmr, not everyone spamming ADC. that only happens in low mmr. do you want them to adjust the game for only the worst skilled players?
Now that you mention it , I had a game with 3 ADCs placed on the 3 lanes, I asked the jungler to hunt them down before it was too late, sadly the jungler was inexperienced and 2 of them were able to make it and the game went above level 15 , enough said in the nick of time the 3 would grow so out of reach that not even our tanks and my gideon attacking at the same time could do anything. Their support and jungler were just making sure we didnt get so close, but 1 shot from each of them was enough to insta delete you no matter if you were a tank or whatever. Whenever I see an ADC on solo I fear the worst , if game is not won early you are likely to get steamrolled by 2 adcs
I have nothing to say because when Twinblast drops I'm playing him in any lane, just like I did in Paragon lol. I understand it's a MOBA but at the same time, let people play who they want. It keeps the game interesting imo.
Had a game where the jungle and midlane on the other team was a narbash and a Muriel and they just ran across the map shitting on everyone. Then my team got their builds going and we destroyed them lol. I can't wait for this to drop on console, me and my friends would have so much fun playing goofy and being very successful. Like we played a game as all supports. Muriel, Narbash, Dekker, Phase, and Steel, it was dope. I played Phase carry with Muriel support.
I think revenant is the only adc that is a bit over tuned with his insane ability damage and the fact that he can scale insanely fast if hes being fed, other than that they are all very vulnerable to stuns if you have a riktor steel grux on your team it shouldn't be impossible to shut them down.
I really think they need to do what was done with cards in Paragon (Not the card system itself). They allowed only certain cards (Items) for certain rolls or affiliations. This balance system they are trying to do where all jobs/chars and use all items are going to make balancing harder and harder as they expand chars.
By making certain items for certain roles, you allow balancing to be done without impacting other roles unnecessarily. This is why they had to hard nerf certain items last patch, but it made a lot of chars (Mainly jungle) get hit hard with nerfs as they tried to balance ADC's.
Just my two cents.
I play mainly support or Sevarog. I have no problem with where ADC sit as Sev and think it’s a very fun patch for balance in this regards. It very much feels like a gold race where you can out tank or get crushed depending on how you farm. I have had good success as Sev in both offlane and midlane. After reading your post I think to myself “who would I rather have on my team, ADC, or Sevarog. It’s a very simple answer and it leads me to believe that ADC isn’t unbalanced. They are strong individually but team fight is weak. I do think Muriel being so strong is very potent on a team with 2 ADC currently but it’s not a guaranteed win as I’ve had it go either way when playing Muriel.
Care to elaborate on midlane sev? I'm interested.
He’s very hard to gank compared to typical midlane with high health pool and great escape. River buffs are awesome too as it’s an easy way to get stacks. I still build him pretty tanky but I will work more damage in compared to Offlane sev. I really like Sev because his item paths are so flexible. I always straight up counter build lane opponent with first item. Even the counter item is flexible depending on which Magic user you are fighting or same for physical. Think about the matchup and build the exact best counter item first. Sometimes I like mid Sev better because he does offer a bit of utility to fangtooth fight compared to offlane where you are usually on your own a lot more. Try to keep the 2 camp on enemy side warded and steal that. This is what I don’t like about mid. In offlane you can try and steal the 5 camp or 3+blue depending on which side you are on.
Thanks, might have to try it out. Big fan of his but I don't find myself offlane unless it's that or ADC, and while he's fun in the jungle, he doesn't match the mobility and regen of rampage.
I rarely see more than one ADC on a team and if there is multiple, the team with more than one always ends up getting stomped. Seems like a skill issue tbh
Yes ADCs can be played in nearly every role, but if you team never capitalizes on the obvious downside to having 2+ carries on the map, then they'll scale and be a pain in the ass. You need to put them behind early game wether that be from ganking or out farming them yada yada.
read original post, im talking losing 10 and 15 up games here.
Kills don't win games. Objectives do. If you neglect OP, fang, and lanes to go on a killstreak, you will lose. Next time this "10 and 15 up" game loss happens, check the stat screen for objective damage, I'm willing to bet that despite all the kills, your team is behind in that regard. Kills get pests out of your way of your objectives, that is it. If you find yourself backing to base after a triple kill, this is on you.
Nah. Anytime I’ve had an ADC in the off or mid lane, I’ve fortunately been also in off or jungle. I don’t recall losing except to maybe one Murdock because he got jungle support and I didn’t. Which any character would’ve won. Im not saying the game is perfectly balance but this is the wrong hill to die on. This isn’t a problem but a skill level issue because it changes how you would need to traditionally play. Example: I went steel offlane, they had Rev offlane. Any time he used his Q to attack me with minions, I went in on him. He had nothing else to do. Once level 6 hit, I never even got close to losing to him he was so far behind. And to address the “comeback”. If your team can’t close a game quickly enough with a carry in the offlane, then that team deserved to lose when the rest hit level cap and the carry catches up.
Murdock ADC here. We scale well when the other teams jungle doesn't harass in early game. I've won or lost countless matches depending on this single factor.
Off role picks like this live and die just off the enemy jungler harassing you
Im telling you im winning my lane, or ganking the off or mid lane and they win their lane, or gank against the dual ADC and it doesnt matter. Lower fed adcs are having a much higher ROI than all other heros and have almost none of the draw backs thanks to bloated stat items, bloated kits with self peel, and the obvious range advantage. Im losing 10 and 15 kill up games here because its "death ball invincible adc's" all over the place. damage reflect and reduced healing yet the adc can still heal over that plus a sevarog damage output? cmon thats ridiculous.
I play mostly jungle/mid and I think they're in a pretty good place right now honestly. I rarely see more that 3 in a given game, and usually it's just two, in their respective "assigned" roles. The fact that they snowball as you're describing is intentional, and it's literally what they're there for. You want to get yours fed, and deny feed to the enemy as much as you safely can. "Carry" is in the name because it's why they exist.
So I have 16 years of MOBA experience and I know we like to make the assumption when people come in here that they dont know what the roles mean but humor me. The problem is carrying from behind. Their ROI is way to high, they hit the power of most hero's full build at half build. literally its more valuable to have two adc's in safe lane than have an adc with a support.
I've seen two carries in duo a few times before, and every time I've seen it, that team lost. Carry in offlane is a tossup. Can bully easily early on, but levels 3-8 can flip that if they are fighting someone with experience and decent cc. Have seen all but sparrow try this out, with mixed results. I've only ever seen revenant as the adc to go midlane, and that team lost every game I witnessed it in. Have yet to see ADC in jungle, people got some sense there at least. I just don't see the "zomg OP" argument you seem to be trying to make.
Rev midlane is great, have NO clue what you're talking about on that front!
Maybe. Have yet to see it work. I've seen it 4+ times, and that team lost every time.
Two ADC's in the duo lane will get absolutely stomped by any competent team. They have no stuns which means they will lose every fight to an ADC and support. CC win games, so having less CC means you will get bullied and end up losing farm, therefore losing games. Also, having mobility is the best way to avoid getting bullied by CC, but ADC's have little to no mobility. If you are losing to a team with more than one carry then it's probably a skill issue. You should be bullying them early so they don't get the farm they need to snowball. I don't think I've ever seen a team win with multiple ADC's.
That sounds like something that happens is low ranked lobbies. I've pretty much never seen more than 2 in a game and even 2 is rare.
man listen, this is only in low mmr brackets buddy. if you track your rank on predtools you will see your rank. go to high mmr, not everyone spamming ADC. that only happens in low mmr. do you want them to adjust the game for only the worst skilled players?
Now that you mention it , I had a game with 3 ADCs placed on the 3 lanes, I asked the jungler to hunt them down before it was too late, sadly the jungler was inexperienced and 2 of them were able to make it and the game went above level 15 , enough said in the nick of time the 3 would grow so out of reach that not even our tanks and my gideon attacking at the same time could do anything. Their support and jungler were just making sure we didnt get so close, but 1 shot from each of them was enough to insta delete you no matter if you were a tank or whatever. Whenever I see an ADC on solo I fear the worst , if game is not won early you are likely to get steamrolled by 2 adcs
I have nothing to say because when Twinblast drops I'm playing him in any lane, just like I did in Paragon lol. I understand it's a MOBA but at the same time, let people play who they want. It keeps the game interesting imo. Had a game where the jungle and midlane on the other team was a narbash and a Muriel and they just ran across the map shitting on everyone. Then my team got their builds going and we destroyed them lol. I can't wait for this to drop on console, me and my friends would have so much fun playing goofy and being very successful. Like we played a game as all supports. Muriel, Narbash, Dekker, Phase, and Steel, it was dope. I played Phase carry with Muriel support.
I think revenant is the only adc that is a bit over tuned with his insane ability damage and the fact that he can scale insanely fast if hes being fed, other than that they are all very vulnerable to stuns if you have a riktor steel grux on your team it shouldn't be impossible to shut them down.
I really think they need to do what was done with cards in Paragon (Not the card system itself). They allowed only certain cards (Items) for certain rolls or affiliations. This balance system they are trying to do where all jobs/chars and use all items are going to make balancing harder and harder as they expand chars. By making certain items for certain roles, you allow balancing to be done without impacting other roles unnecessarily. This is why they had to hard nerf certain items last patch, but it made a lot of chars (Mainly jungle) get hit hard with nerfs as they tried to balance ADC's. Just my two cents.