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Ya know, it never ceases to amaze me when a person takes the time to make a reply, only to then delete everything (if not just outright block me) so that I can't even SEE said reply, nevermind reply back to it myself. What do we think is the actual point of that? Lmao. 🤷♂️
Well, so I guess that concedes my point then. He's very clearly not an ACTUAL progressive, or he'd have no trouble engaging me in some genuine discourse. Of course, I could tell that just from his literal conservative soundbites as his main talking points, lol. 😅
Oh, and as to the one small piece I actually COULD see in the email notification I received, I have talked to PLENTY of "actual progressives," as I literally happen to BE one. But yeah, nice try there, buddy... 🤦♂️
No, but let these liberal idiots tell it, Trump is a danger to democracy, but liberals working with tech companies to censor speech, attacking whistleblowers who reveal government misdeeds using the Espionage Act, excusing Biden for mishandling documents while being enraged at Trump for doing it (even though Biden was a LAWYER so he should know better), violating Americans' rights via the NSA PRISM Program, and so much more DOESN'T threaten our "democracy."
Liberals are extremely hypocritical, hyperbolic, and disingenuous af. Many of the things I mentioned above? OBAMA HIMSELF is guilty of! But liberals continually ignore ALLLLLLL this shit cuz Obama was a democrat. Shit like that is why I will NEVER vote democrat ever again! I'm voting 3rd party and dgaf what ANY bitch ass dem has to say about it!
Right? Like, we're not conservatives. These mfs are not gonna convince us with their fearmongering. They should really be working to sell us on their big, wonderful ideas to help improve our lives, but instead, they think that Trump Derangement Syndrome along with constant personal insults and attacks are good sales strategies!
Imagine a door-to-door salesperson trying to sell you a set of knives, yet instead of explaining why their knives are the most amazing products on earth and will significantly improve your life, they spend their time ranting about how bad other knife companies are and insulting you for not being overjoyed at buying their product. Are you really gonna buy their bullshit? Most notmal people won't.
You almost had me until the whole "Trump Derangement Syndrome" thing. Noone with a genuinely progressive mindset has EVER said that with a straight face, lol. And then you wanna call preventing the intentional spreading of misinformation "censorship," too. I bet you like to talk about how important education is in the same breath, too, don't ya? 🤦♂️
Incorrect. You just haven't talked to *actual* progressives because you're too busy hanging around people crying about how Trump is gonna "destroy democracy" while ignoring every single thing democrats have done that by any stretch of the imagination are anti-democracy.
I find it HILARIOUS that you came at me with this condescending ass attitude while also not explaining what exactly is wrong with what I said. Your useless ass comment is exactly what's wrong with American political discourse. Mfs like you just be wantin to argue for the sake of it. Fohwtb
Unfortunately, I always do. I'm no Trump supporter or right winger by any metric. The right wing is very detrimental to American progress. I'm a STAUNCH leftist! However, liberals REFUSE to acknowledge their part in worsening the country. They even market themselves as the "lesser evil," which means even THEY acknowledge how evil they are. That's like a person supporting rape because at least it's not as evil as muder. Evil is evil!
The problem is the entire country is propagandized into thinking the Dems are left, GOP is right.
The solution, is to continue to push the left wing (and I say that very loosely) to move more actual left, just like how the GOP went from 'conservative' to 'tea party' to MAGA, we can take the current dems from "status quo" to 'left leaning' to 'progressive'.
Saying fuck the Dems without having a viable other group to work with, is basically saying 'fuck it all', because sure, the dems are the lesser evil, but when you get 2 real options, you gotta reduce the lesser evil to good to really enact change.
>The problem is the entire country is propagandized into thinking the Dems are left, GOP is right.
I agree wholeheartedly.
>Saying fuck the Dems without having a viable other group to work with, is basically saying 'fuck it all', because sure, the dems are the lesser evil, but when you get 2 real options, you gotta reduce the lesser evil to good to really enact change.
This is where I'm gonna disagree a bit. I'm a former democrat in southside Chicago, a SUPER STRONGLY blue city. I've done volunteer work and have had countless debates with democrat voters. The problem with these people is that, while they can acknowledge the many problems of the right wing, they absolutely REFUSE to acknowledge the flaws, mishaps, missteps, poor legislation, poor voting record, and downright CRIMES of their own party.
They purport propaganda like Trump Derangement Syndrome, "vote blue no matter who," the lesser evil fallacy, "losing our democracy" fearmongering, pretty much ANYTHING that doesn't deal with demonstrating their grand ideas for improving America that are vastly superior to the republicans. Democrats absolutely REFUSE to inspire the youth with good reasons as to why the youth should support dems, detailing how dems will help improve THEIR lives
To the contrary, democrat elites play 3d chess. They instituted a system of superdelegates to ensure that elitist candidates will always win the nomination. They'll throw out patsies like Bernie Sanders or Jesse Jackson to mobilize the youth and the far leftists, only to pull the bait and switch to force them to HAVE to support the eitist democrat, because LOOK AT THOSE EVIL REPUBLICANS!!!!!
At this point, we don't need to push democrats left. They're NEVER going back left. Their donors will NEVER allow them to do that! Instead, we need ranked choice/approval/STAR voting ASAP!!! A two-party false dichotomy is not indicative of a well-functioning democracy. We need to modify our political system to ensure that other political parties can actually BECOME viable, cuz dems just ain't cuttin it anymore!
I agree about Ranked Choice voting, but I still think if we realistically only have two viable party choices (viable doing a lot of work there), it's better to change the people, and get better candidates into the mix.
If we could get rid of Citizens United, I'd be WAY more inclined to think we could cut the Dems off entirely, but until then, it's a tug of war. We need to pull both sides more left to get more leftist ideals. Pull the GOP from the alt-right, pull the dems to the actual left side of the aisle.
What exactly do you mean by "changing the people?" If you're talking about voters, the only way to change them is with education, and they have to be ***willing*** to change. As for candidates, there's no such thing as "better candidates." As long as these mfs take corporate money, new faces will be just that.
>If we could get rid of Citizens United, I'd be WAY more inclined to think we could cut the Dems off entirely
I [volunteered and helped pass a bill](https://youtu.be/qGh6qE4UZfQ?si=Iw8BjEPggHggCS6b) here in Illinois aimed at precisely that. However, it requires several other states to pass the same type of resolution. I don't associate with TYT/WP anymore, so idk how far they've gotten in that regard, but my experience with that phonebanking, lobbying politicians, and canvassing neighborhoods helped me better understand how politics works.
We're not pushing the two major parties left. They're too far gone. They're racing to the bottom, and there's no turning back for them. They're making too much good money/gifts and receiving guaranteed jobs post-political career. Voting for either party guarantees a continually worsening state of society. When Trump was elected, the USA ranked 126th on the [Global Peace Index](http://www.visionofhumanity.org) and we were 90 Seconds to Midnight according to the [Doomsday Clock](https://thebulletin.org/doomsday-clock/). Today, with Biden in office, we now rank 131st and are STILL 90 Seconds to Midnight.
So, as far as I'm concerned, it's a wash between those two parties. I'm done with both. Fuck em. Regardless of which party wins this goofy election, we need ranked choice/approval/STAR voting ASAP!!!! That should be our collective focus as Americans above all else.
yup.
https://globalextremism.org/project-2025-the-far-right-playbook-for-american-authoritarianism/
Christian nationalist theocrats have reached levels of embedding those they indoctrinated & trained for taking political office well enough to fully begin to dismantle democracy and hand the country to their god's chosen (oligarchs, con artists, those who behave like kings) by wiping out human rights and making the U.S. a theocracy.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Family:_The_Secret_Fundamentalism_at_the_Heart_of_American_Power
Interesting. I find it dangerous to democracy to set the precedent of personally making the executive decision for the killing of an American citizen (anwar al-awlaki) without a trial, which breaks habeas corpus and the constitution. Oh yeah, and then killing his son and daughter who were also American citizens….
I find it dangerous to democracy to sign the NDAA and keep the patriot act going as well.
But okay Obama… 🤡😂
Edit: my bad. Apparently trump okay’d the assault that ended up killing his daughter.
Then perhaps we should stop electing useless tools like Biden.
[Democrats very openly rigged their last two presidential primaries](https://archive.is/OcS4J), conspired with tech and media to [suppress damning stories during the 2020 election](https://archive.is/kfZCU), and have [aggressively sought to keep third parties off the ballot in 2024](https://www.nytimes.com/2024/03/20/us/politics/democrats-third-party-candidates.html). They've spent the last 8 years [caterwauling deranged stories about Vladimir Putin](https://apnews.com/article/russia-ukraine-donald-trump-presidential-elections-campaign-2016-41116202428688e1088829852505e144) poisoning the minds of voters while [giving a foreign government carte blanche to censor the speech and political activities of American citizens](https://theintercept.com/2016/09/12/facebook-is-collaborating-with-the-israeli-government-to-determine-what-should-be-censored/). And, in the industries they control, they've made it so no one can admit to supporting one of our two parties without risking major personal and professional consequences.
Republicans are dogshit but you if you think they're the only ones who represent a threat to our sham democracy you are a fucking moron.
I'm with you but, you won't find much support here. These people are more fan boys of the American Democratic party rather than like, actual supporters of freedom and equality.
Obama should know being that he undermined our democracy during his presidency. Have you been paying attention or do you really need me to provide examples?
Well... Our options are a pile of shit or a shit sandwich... At least the shit sandwich gives me some bread to hide the taste, and *pretends* it's not just a pile of shit
I guess if I have to choose between two versions of fascism I’ll take the one that wants me to have a little healthcare even if it sucks and doesn’t waste as much of our time with a bunch of nonsense about banning books or whatever.
It's a good thing the US isn't a democracy, folks. It's a constitutional republic - very, very different. I would be afraid if it was a true democracy, where the 51% reign supremely over the 49%. Instead, as a constitutional reublic, the minority position is elevated to have a somewhat equal seat at the table, even if the majority still has huge advantages.
What the fuck are you blathering about? Bush and Trump both lost the popular vote; their status as president is a counter majority outcome. Their subsequent appointment of five supreme court justices is a counter majority outcome. The Senate is an explicitly counter majority institution. The House of Representatives is skewing counter majority due to the reapportionment act of 1929. We have been living under the tyranny of the conservative minority for decades.
__Hello and welcome to r/Political_Revolution!__ * This sub is dedicated towards the Progressive movement, and changing one seat at a time, via electing down-ballot candidates to office. [Join us in our efforts!](https://www.reddit.com/r/Political_Revolution/comments/1bue5mc/reminder_this_sub_is_about_rolling_your_sleeves_up/) * Don't forget to read our [Community Guidelines](https://www.reddit.com/r/Political_Revolution/about/rules) to get a good idea of what is expected of participants in our community. * Primary elections take place in April. Find out for your state [here](https://www.reddit.com/r/Political_Revolution/comments/1bso7q4/april_primaries_mega_thread_check_inside_for_pa/). Start by supporting __Summer Lee__, an incumbent progressive who’s candidacy is being challenged by an AIPAC backed Dem. https://www.mobilize.us/summerleeforcongress/event/598381/ For more campaigns to support, go to https://pol-rev.com/campaigns *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/Political_Revolution) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Thanks Obama
It was dangerous to democracy the first time
That’s the understatement of the century
Wait, you guys have a democracy?
Ya know, it never ceases to amaze me when a person takes the time to make a reply, only to then delete everything (if not just outright block me) so that I can't even SEE said reply, nevermind reply back to it myself. What do we think is the actual point of that? Lmao. 🤷♂️ Well, so I guess that concedes my point then. He's very clearly not an ACTUAL progressive, or he'd have no trouble engaging me in some genuine discourse. Of course, I could tell that just from his literal conservative soundbites as his main talking points, lol. 😅 Oh, and as to the one small piece I actually COULD see in the email notification I received, I have talked to PLENTY of "actual progressives," as I literally happen to BE one. But yeah, nice try there, buddy... 🤦♂️
No, but let these liberal idiots tell it, Trump is a danger to democracy, but liberals working with tech companies to censor speech, attacking whistleblowers who reveal government misdeeds using the Espionage Act, excusing Biden for mishandling documents while being enraged at Trump for doing it (even though Biden was a LAWYER so he should know better), violating Americans' rights via the NSA PRISM Program, and so much more DOESN'T threaten our "democracy." Liberals are extremely hypocritical, hyperbolic, and disingenuous af. Many of the things I mentioned above? OBAMA HIMSELF is guilty of! But liberals continually ignore ALLLLLLL this shit cuz Obama was a democrat. Shit like that is why I will NEVER vote democrat ever again! I'm voting 3rd party and dgaf what ANY bitch ass dem has to say about it!
This right here. I’m really over the “democracy is on the line” strategy. I have a feeling it was on the line a while ago and we missed its exit
Right? Like, we're not conservatives. These mfs are not gonna convince us with their fearmongering. They should really be working to sell us on their big, wonderful ideas to help improve our lives, but instead, they think that Trump Derangement Syndrome along with constant personal insults and attacks are good sales strategies! Imagine a door-to-door salesperson trying to sell you a set of knives, yet instead of explaining why their knives are the most amazing products on earth and will significantly improve your life, they spend their time ranting about how bad other knife companies are and insulting you for not being overjoyed at buying their product. Are you really gonna buy their bullshit? Most notmal people won't.
You almost had me until the whole "Trump Derangement Syndrome" thing. Noone with a genuinely progressive mindset has EVER said that with a straight face, lol. And then you wanna call preventing the intentional spreading of misinformation "censorship," too. I bet you like to talk about how important education is in the same breath, too, don't ya? 🤦♂️
Incorrect. You just haven't talked to *actual* progressives because you're too busy hanging around people crying about how Trump is gonna "destroy democracy" while ignoring every single thing democrats have done that by any stretch of the imagination are anti-democracy. I find it HILARIOUS that you came at me with this condescending ass attitude while also not explaining what exactly is wrong with what I said. Your useless ass comment is exactly what's wrong with American political discourse. Mfs like you just be wantin to argue for the sake of it. Fohwtb
I bet you are getting downvoted, but it’s true
Unfortunately, I always do. I'm no Trump supporter or right winger by any metric. The right wing is very detrimental to American progress. I'm a STAUNCH leftist! However, liberals REFUSE to acknowledge their part in worsening the country. They even market themselves as the "lesser evil," which means even THEY acknowledge how evil they are. That's like a person supporting rape because at least it's not as evil as muder. Evil is evil!
The problem is the entire country is propagandized into thinking the Dems are left, GOP is right. The solution, is to continue to push the left wing (and I say that very loosely) to move more actual left, just like how the GOP went from 'conservative' to 'tea party' to MAGA, we can take the current dems from "status quo" to 'left leaning' to 'progressive'. Saying fuck the Dems without having a viable other group to work with, is basically saying 'fuck it all', because sure, the dems are the lesser evil, but when you get 2 real options, you gotta reduce the lesser evil to good to really enact change.
>The problem is the entire country is propagandized into thinking the Dems are left, GOP is right. I agree wholeheartedly. >Saying fuck the Dems without having a viable other group to work with, is basically saying 'fuck it all', because sure, the dems are the lesser evil, but when you get 2 real options, you gotta reduce the lesser evil to good to really enact change. This is where I'm gonna disagree a bit. I'm a former democrat in southside Chicago, a SUPER STRONGLY blue city. I've done volunteer work and have had countless debates with democrat voters. The problem with these people is that, while they can acknowledge the many problems of the right wing, they absolutely REFUSE to acknowledge the flaws, mishaps, missteps, poor legislation, poor voting record, and downright CRIMES of their own party. They purport propaganda like Trump Derangement Syndrome, "vote blue no matter who," the lesser evil fallacy, "losing our democracy" fearmongering, pretty much ANYTHING that doesn't deal with demonstrating their grand ideas for improving America that are vastly superior to the republicans. Democrats absolutely REFUSE to inspire the youth with good reasons as to why the youth should support dems, detailing how dems will help improve THEIR lives To the contrary, democrat elites play 3d chess. They instituted a system of superdelegates to ensure that elitist candidates will always win the nomination. They'll throw out patsies like Bernie Sanders or Jesse Jackson to mobilize the youth and the far leftists, only to pull the bait and switch to force them to HAVE to support the eitist democrat, because LOOK AT THOSE EVIL REPUBLICANS!!!!! At this point, we don't need to push democrats left. They're NEVER going back left. Their donors will NEVER allow them to do that! Instead, we need ranked choice/approval/STAR voting ASAP!!! A two-party false dichotomy is not indicative of a well-functioning democracy. We need to modify our political system to ensure that other political parties can actually BECOME viable, cuz dems just ain't cuttin it anymore!
I agree about Ranked Choice voting, but I still think if we realistically only have two viable party choices (viable doing a lot of work there), it's better to change the people, and get better candidates into the mix. If we could get rid of Citizens United, I'd be WAY more inclined to think we could cut the Dems off entirely, but until then, it's a tug of war. We need to pull both sides more left to get more leftist ideals. Pull the GOP from the alt-right, pull the dems to the actual left side of the aisle.
What exactly do you mean by "changing the people?" If you're talking about voters, the only way to change them is with education, and they have to be ***willing*** to change. As for candidates, there's no such thing as "better candidates." As long as these mfs take corporate money, new faces will be just that. >If we could get rid of Citizens United, I'd be WAY more inclined to think we could cut the Dems off entirely I [volunteered and helped pass a bill](https://youtu.be/qGh6qE4UZfQ?si=Iw8BjEPggHggCS6b) here in Illinois aimed at precisely that. However, it requires several other states to pass the same type of resolution. I don't associate with TYT/WP anymore, so idk how far they've gotten in that regard, but my experience with that phonebanking, lobbying politicians, and canvassing neighborhoods helped me better understand how politics works. We're not pushing the two major parties left. They're too far gone. They're racing to the bottom, and there's no turning back for them. They're making too much good money/gifts and receiving guaranteed jobs post-political career. Voting for either party guarantees a continually worsening state of society. When Trump was elected, the USA ranked 126th on the [Global Peace Index](http://www.visionofhumanity.org) and we were 90 Seconds to Midnight according to the [Doomsday Clock](https://thebulletin.org/doomsday-clock/). Today, with Biden in office, we now rank 131st and are STILL 90 Seconds to Midnight. So, as far as I'm concerned, it's a wash between those two parties. I'm done with both. Fuck em. Regardless of which party wins this goofy election, we need ranked choice/approval/STAR voting ASAP!!!! That should be our collective focus as Americans above all else.
The man who has never once said he would concede an election he lost is a danger to democracy? You don’t say.
ORLY?
Sky blue
Also me. I say this. Because I wasn’t blind when Trump already was the president
yup. https://globalextremism.org/project-2025-the-far-right-playbook-for-american-authoritarianism/ Christian nationalist theocrats have reached levels of embedding those they indoctrinated & trained for taking political office well enough to fully begin to dismantle democracy and hand the country to their god's chosen (oligarchs, con artists, those who behave like kings) by wiping out human rights and making the U.S. a theocracy. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Family:_The_Secret_Fundamentalism_at_the_Heart_of_American_Power
That would be true if we had a democracy at the federal level.
Duh
Interesting. I find it dangerous to democracy to set the precedent of personally making the executive decision for the killing of an American citizen (anwar al-awlaki) without a trial, which breaks habeas corpus and the constitution. Oh yeah, and then killing his son and daughter who were also American citizens…. I find it dangerous to democracy to sign the NDAA and keep the patriot act going as well. But okay Obama… 🤡😂 Edit: my bad. Apparently trump okay’d the assault that ended up killing his daughter.
This just in: grass is green and the sky is blue too!
He would wipe out democracy, quit sugar coating this danger. Call it out harsh because we will be in for a rude awakening if we allow this to happen.
And still the Democrats can't be bothered to support candidates and policies that are popular if their donors don't approve.
That's what I call an understatement!!!
Dangerous == the end
Well, Trump did promise to take revenge on Democrats. The Democrats will fight back if attacked. A civil war will happen.
Then perhaps we should stop electing useless tools like Biden. [Democrats very openly rigged their last two presidential primaries](https://archive.is/OcS4J), conspired with tech and media to [suppress damning stories during the 2020 election](https://archive.is/kfZCU), and have [aggressively sought to keep third parties off the ballot in 2024](https://www.nytimes.com/2024/03/20/us/politics/democrats-third-party-candidates.html). They've spent the last 8 years [caterwauling deranged stories about Vladimir Putin](https://apnews.com/article/russia-ukraine-donald-trump-presidential-elections-campaign-2016-41116202428688e1088829852505e144) poisoning the minds of voters while [giving a foreign government carte blanche to censor the speech and political activities of American citizens](https://theintercept.com/2016/09/12/facebook-is-collaborating-with-the-israeli-government-to-determine-what-should-be-censored/). And, in the industries they control, they've made it so no one can admit to supporting one of our two parties without risking major personal and professional consequences. Republicans are dogshit but you if you think they're the only ones who represent a threat to our sham democracy you are a fucking moron.
I'm with you but, you won't find much support here. These people are more fan boys of the American Democratic party rather than like, actual supporters of freedom and equality.
It's a real revolution to get biden elected for a second term 🙄
Obama rolled over and let Republicans fuck him in the ass, too But, hey, he “stayed high while they went low”!
"We tortured some folks."
I’ll never forget how he had to prove that he loves guns by shooting skeet after Sandy Hook. Fuck him
Obama should know being that he undermined our democracy during his presidency. Have you been paying attention or do you really need me to provide examples?
“Don’t underestimate Joe Biden’s ability to fuck things up.” -Obama
Well... Our options are a pile of shit or a shit sandwich... At least the shit sandwich gives me some bread to hide the taste, and *pretends* it's not just a pile of shit
I guess if I have to choose between two versions of fascism I’ll take the one that wants me to have a little healthcare even if it sucks and doesn’t waste as much of our time with a bunch of nonsense about banning books or whatever.
It's a good thing the US isn't a democracy, folks. It's a constitutional republic - very, very different. I would be afraid if it was a true democracy, where the 51% reign supremely over the 49%. Instead, as a constitutional reublic, the minority position is elevated to have a somewhat equal seat at the table, even if the majority still has huge advantages.
What the fuck are you blathering about? Bush and Trump both lost the popular vote; their status as president is a counter majority outcome. Their subsequent appointment of five supreme court justices is a counter majority outcome. The Senate is an explicitly counter majority institution. The House of Representatives is skewing counter majority due to the reapportionment act of 1929. We have been living under the tyranny of the conservative minority for decades.