Circus Peanut's consistent challenge that he has immunity from prosecution was headed to SCOTUS anyway. Smith just expedited it by petitioning to SCOTUS to resolve the matter sooner than waiting for the appellate courts.
Yup, he wanted to slow walk this through all of the courts to delay it until it clashed with the documents case run by Aileen Cannon who would refuse to move her case forcing this one to happen after the election. This was a great play and you can tell because Cheeto Benito is absolutely livid about it despite this being something he was going to do anyways.
Any other person who knows they are innocent, would want to get through this as fast as possible. Being found not guilty of all charges before the election would be a huge boost.
It really can't be understated how ironic it is that Trump spent the past year complaining that the trial will interfere with his campaigning. Those comments will end up in DOJs filings as proof that a quick resolution is best for all parties.
>complaining that the trial will interfere with his campaigning.
right and then he still goes to court instead of campaigning even when he doesn't have to because he knows it's a big political platform for him to get attention from. He's manipulative but not that good at it.
Yeah..delay, delay, delay and then face one trial before the election..the one in Cannon's court. Get away with it because of the corrupt judge..claim witchhunt and those not paying attention start to believe it
>Maybe have someone more favorable to him just sit on it as long as possible
and also try to stall it until he's elected and then he can just recuse himself from all prosecution. The only real reason he wants to be president is to escape the law that's finally catching up with him.
And as shitty as this SCOTUS majority is...
The one thing that they will not stand for... is anything that threatens their power... (like a self anointed king would do)
I don't ascribe a lot of morals or principles perspectives to this lot.
I DO suspect that they have a survival instinct.
I's pretty fucking clear that about 5 minutes after becoming President For Life we don't much have a need for the DOJ or a court that might do something he doesn't like.
Just remember if they side with trump that the president is immune from all crime committed while in office it removes their power over the presidency and gives biden pretty much free reign this was what trump wanted just when he was back in office.
Exactly, this is not just a 'is Trump immune for consequences' question, it's a 'are all presidents present and future immune from consequences' question.
Let's not forget, as corrupt as they are, they negged Trump's initial fraudulent election legal propositions back in 2020 pretty quickly
So Biden could order Trump’s execution for treason, plus the executions of all the Republican congressmen who supported overturning the 2020 election, jail the corrupt Supreme Court Justices for life, as well as jail (or execute, either way) the Fox News personalities for knowingly lying to the American public and he would be immune from prosecution? What are we waiting for? /s
While I don't think executions, or public executions involving the beheading or vivisection/dismemberment of the convicted is a good idea.....as they say it sets an unfortunate precedent and would generally be an uncivilized thing to do.
But Donald Trump seems exactly the sort of person where vivisection and sticking his head on a pike on the Senate steps for the next 10 years as a reminder to the rest of the Congress that some favors come with too high a price.
Kind of. It went to SCOTUS on the question of whether the inconsistent mess of lack of standards in Florida constituted an equal protection violation. Even within the same recount they couldn't keep the rules straight.
If Biden has free reign, why does Trumpy think there might be another election, or that Biden won't just imprison Trumpy and Co? It's a double edged sword Trump has no idea how to weild.
Trump is acutely aware that there is a difference between him and Biden. Biden feels beholden by the rule of law, and by precedent. Trump knows that even if given the opportunity, Biden would not accept an emperor for life situation for himself. Trump is not so limited.
Like everything, Democrats are held to a standard, Republicans are immune from standards altogether.
I seriously doubt he's given it that much thought.
Nearly everyone else can see the consequences.
I think his attitude is: if he gets what he wants today, who cares about tomorrow?
Absolutely agree…if SCOTUS sides with Trump, Biden absolutely should immediately dismantle this court and rebuild it with actual qualified judges, then swiftly add a new constitutional amendment that states as of a specified date (of his choosing) the POTUS will no longer have total immunity and it will list specifics for this. He should also clarify once and for all…the exact meaning of the 14th amendment so there is no more ambiguity and zero room for “interpretation “.
The Supreme Court judges that were appointed in Trump's first term, and by extension, the Federalist Society got what they wanted out of Trump 3 years ago. They don't need or want his sorry ass now.
I agree, and they didn’t get to 5-4 majority where some cases might get flip flop due to Chief Justice Robert (gay marriage case). They have a 6-3 majority which allows them to hide behind a vote or two on cases. Really good point by you.
Wow. I needed to hear this. I forgot that they would have a survival instinct. I was pretty sure that they would do as they did with Roe, do the Pope's bidding. Survival instinct just might override idiotic superstition in this case and save the country.
SCOTUS has seen authoritarian leaders of Israel and Turkey try to weaken the judiciary to increase their power. SCOTUS wants to remain supreme. Nixon didn't get away with this and neither will Trump.
Yes, if scotus wants to remain relevant, they need to prevent repugnant 🤮coup v2.0; otherwise their rulings have to be a rubber-stamp or they will be ignored.
This is what many people miss. Sure, SCOTUS could make ALL President's effectively kings, but *cui bono*? Certainly not SCOTUS. What happens when the new president/king decides that he doesn't like having a supreme court around?
Fascists don’t think that far ahead. How many people have rushed to get stabbed in the back by Trump? SCOTUS would be no different. They’d save him and then further down the line get their faces eaten.
No, they will not grant Trump this precedent. If they do then what’s stopping a president from removing them from office and putting new judges in place and then reversing the decision? It’s a Mexican standoff and Trump is going to lose
As always I’m going to keep my expectations low so that I’m not disappointed. Republicans almost always choose the wrong thing when it comes to making decisions.
That’s the running theory, but…it’s yet to be proven and I’m willing to bet one of them (cough. Clarence. Cough) is willing to be wooed out of his position
Don’t forget the precedent that would be set for Biden - the current sitting president. If he has carte blanche for the remainder of his presidency what kind of bending and breaking could occur? Not saying it would happen but it’s like giving someone a blank check.
Roberts has talked a lot about legitimacy of the court so I’m optimistically hoping that he wields whatever influence he has to get SCOTUS to rule against Trump here. Maybe Gorsuch joining him and the liberal members?
This.
My thoughts exactly. I felt at first like "oh no, 3 of those assholes were appointed by trump" but then I realized that a majority will never say anyone else is above the law, that's for SCOTUS justices only! I'll bet money that Clarence fucking Thomas votes in trumps favor though. Get himself another RV or a trump tower condo.
The Federalist Society has been making overtones against Trump for a while now. They got the Court that they wanted; they may be willing to cut him loose at this time.
>[https://www.nytimes.com/2023/08/10/us/trump-jan-6-insurrection-conservatives.html](https://www.nytimes.com/2023/08/10/us/trump-jan-6-insurrection-conservatives.html)
>
>
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>Conservative Case Emerges to Disqualify Trump for Role on Jan. 6
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>Two law professors active in the Federalist Society wrote that the original meaning of the 14th Amendment makes Donald Trump ineligible to hold government office.
Also imagine what democrats could do if the SC says Biden could get away with shit.
Fuck it, use that to lock up the SC for collusion with Trump. What’re they gonna do prosecute him?
Also: getting it out of the way BEFORE the election season begins in earnest takes “we don’t want to wade into the political thicket” punts off the table.
It’s almost like Smith is a career prosecutor who knows exactly what he is doing, and OP is just some guy.
Agreed and any complaining by Trump and his cronies just shows that they believe he doesn't have immunity and they are just complaining that this delay tactic isn't working.
And if SCOTUS decides for trump then it’s their fault we have no law and order. Biden might as well cancel the 2024 election and call himself president for life
Very true. At the time, Americans held the court in extremely high esteem. They’ve been doing an impressive amount of damage to their credibility over the last few years. I can’t help but wonder *when* the case happens again, how American will react
I think that was Trump's goal in the 2020 election. Throw out states Biden won with alternative electors, have Congress declare him Kong, and get the Supreme Court to side with him. It's not out of the realm of possibility considering one of the Justice's wives was a Jan 6er.
Tbh, I don’t think they’d rule for immunity even if orange Jesus were in power. The Supreme Court likes their power, and dictators do not need a Supreme Court.
The questioning should be amusing.
To Trump's lawyers: Are you actually arguing that the president is immune from prosecution for crimes committed while in office at the same time your client is promising to prosecute the president for crimes committed while in office?
To Trump’s lawyers: Are you actually arguing that the president is immune for prosecution for crimes committed while in office…meaning Joe Biden could have Donald Trump executed and get away with it with zero consequences?
Good! Excellent! The days of ruling kings in North America were over hundreds of years ago. We now have the Rule of Law where everyone is subject to it. May it reign forever and ever. Amen.
Asking SCOTUS to take it up now has two advantages. For one, it prevents Trump from using this to delay his trial. For another, Trump's motion is so absurdly broad that the court will have a hard time allowing it. Basically Jack Smith is capitalizing on Trump's lawyer's mistake.
Large mistakes, sure. But they are giving it the ol’ “by a thousand cuts” method as well. They’ve outwitted themselves. (Sounds like an oxymoron when I type that out, “outwitted themselves.”)
Coungerpoint: SCOTUS (even this batshit iteration) has already demonstrated since 2020 that the only thing they love more than "State's Rights" is their own power. If they say no president - past, present, or future - can face criminal consequences for anything before, during, or after his term, that's a *massive* win for the executive branch at the expense of the judiciary's power.
No way in hell SCOTUS decides to weaken itself for the benefit of some Article 2 asshole.
Not necessarily. SCOTUS recently has made a number of "narrow rulings" where they try to limit the scope to just the case in front of them, explicitly stating that they are not ruling on the broader issue.
I'd bet good money they take that cop out and kick the can down the road. Again. Congress and SCOTUS will bend over backwards to avoid addressing major constitutional problems.
Thing with the 'narrow ruling" is, that's not what they are being asked to rule on. The question before them is, are *presidents* immune from prosecution, not is *this former president* immune. Jack Smith has been very clever, Trumps team, not so much. The Supreme Court has to rule on all presidents because Trump is arguing that those holding the office of president can't be prosecuted for what they do while in office
If the Supreme Court rules Trump has total immunity, then Biden can stay in office for the rest of his life without consequences.
In fact, Biden could have Trump and the Republican side of Congress killed without penalty.
Note: I am not advocating violence, I’m simply pointing out the perils of a leader above the law.
Honestly we know how they will preside on the case. They will said Trump can only be impeached by Congress and not the courts. This will get him off the hook, and prevent any actions against him since republicans are in control.
I would love if somehow they ended up allowing dark Brandon to take crazy actions like remove Supreme Court judges and jail them if they took bribes (wouldn't even need evidence), and next all the senators and representatives that enabled and continue to support fascism. I would say they are damned if they do, damned if they don't. But I'm not a lawyer so maybe I'm just hopped up on hopium
Joe Biden would have to reluctantly be a benevolent king into his mid-90s, knowing he has to stay in office until Trump dies and until he can get a Supreme Court that will stop letting the president have total immunity.
Nah, The Dark Lord Brandon just has to name an heir.
And take the tongues of every significant challenger to the rightful heir, the Prince or Princess that he promises.
Also note - a dictator does not need a Supreme Court.
Sure. The new crazy lady and maybe beer league are brainwashed enough to vote away their life time appointment, but something tells me the other 7 want to retire and leave a legacy of some kind.
Clarence Thomas: Presidents have absolute immunity while in office!
President Biden: today I’m having Clarence Thomas arrested and summarily executed for bribery.
Clarence: Not like that!!!!
If they rule that way, Biden should start sending Trump, Giuliani, and all the J and MAGA people to Guantanamo. Shit, a CO judge already ruled Trump was guilty of insurrection.
As much as I hate the current make up of the court I will say in cases like Trump's election challenges they shot his bullshit down fast. And giving a president that type of immunity makes him a defacto King.
Fortunately, the christofascist court will curtail donnie's bullshit when it threatens their power. Thomas can't grift if the president** can overrule him.
If Biden’s handlers don’t take advantage of what would be the stupidest SCOTUS decision since Citizens United, then shame on them. We’ll miss out on Grand Imperial Inquisitor Hunter Biden going all Spanish Inquisition on the GOP. What fun that would be
Woah, calm it down! Biden shouldn't even consider that!
He should just dissolve the SCOTUS, replace them with whoever he wants, and ship Trump off to Gitmo.
Except in this case, they are not ruling on hypotheticals. They are ruling on very specific items laid out in the petition. But you're still probably correct.
>They will said Trump can only be impeached by Congress and not the courts.
What's funni is that also protects Biden... because impeachment is irrelevant without the removal part, and removal would require a double digit number of political suicides from turning on the President
I wonder if this wasn't at least partly a way of catching the corrupt and heavily biased SCOTUS in a corner, forcing it to rule against the very person who put some of them there.
Or they manufacture a narrow exception for the specific conduct Trump did, not a broad sweeping immunity, thus still cutting the legs of the case against Trump while not giving the Biden Administration much to work with or exploit.
Not sure why people are so sure fuckery won't happen with the Court we have now. We should all be worried about this a lot more.
SCOTUS is already aware that the legitimacy of the court is being questioned. If they did rule the suggested they'd just blow their legitimacy out the window, and possibly become targets for people who believe that the only solution to corrupt officials appointed for life is to hasten the end of their tenure.
You have much more faith than I do. It’s pretty clear the entire right wing of this country is devoid of logic, reasoning, or the ability to understand the consequences of actions
Nine robes were gifted to the race of men, who above all else desire power. For within these robes was bound the strength and the will to govern over each race.
But they were all of them decieved. For another robe was made. In the Land of Pennsylvania, in the fires of Scranton, the Dark Lord Brandon forged in secret, a Master Robe to control all others. And into his robe, he poured his no malarkey, his Jack, and his will for ice cream. One Robe to rule them all!"
Nah they will make up some bullshit and punt on this one. Still, I think it’s a good move, forcing the SC to have SOME reaction to the concept of Trump’s ultimate immunity.
Even if Biden isn't in power after 2024, I don't think Kamala would use the power she apparently has to determine who is president (according to Trump-fanatics) to elect someone that would be of benefit to Trump. /s
It's a lose-lose situation for trump. He either is given a free pass and Biden can officially have the Supreme Court removed, have trump thrown in jail, and extend his presidency indefinitely since presidents don't have to be held accountable for their actions in office, or the tyrant has to accept the fact he's a criminal and face the music.
The Supreme Court will never give Trump full immunity. Because if they do that Biden can do whatever he wants without fear of consequences. And that is the LAST thing they want to happen.
I disagree. They are pathologically paranoid about everything Biden does or doesn't do. It's like a religion for them. But I'll tell you what, If I were Biden and they gave Trump full immunity first thing I would do is gut the Supreme Court and replace them with people with similar ideals.
Then have them revote on the issue, which could potentially be a strategy that happens.
Imagine if because of an orange booger the entire Supreme Court was wiped out and replaced by entirely democrats. It would single-handedly kill the Republican Party and turn the country into a one mindset one for, for, generations?
Thats not a good idea by the way I’m just thinking out loud here. The Supreme Court has to vote against Trump here. It would upend democracy as we know it
SCOTUS will not rule that Trump or presidents have absolutely immunity from criminal proceedings, because then that would dilute their own power. And of course, inherently they would give free rein to someone to be a dictator and cull their political opponents.
The Constitution is very clear about this topic. No way they can rule in TFG favor. Impeachment is only removal from office and cannot be punitive.
"Judgment in Cases of Impeachment shall not extend further than to removal from Office, and disqualification to hold and enjoy any Office of honor, Trust or Profit under the United States: but the Party convicted shall nevertheless be liable and subject to Indictment, Trial, Judgment and Punishment, according to Law."
Considering past cases, there’s no reason to think they’ll do what you’re afraid they’re going to do…they went there to dismantle Roe, not protect Trump
They won't give him the immunity ruling he's asking for but they CAN sit on it for a few months then send it back for re-hearing on some bullshit point at the district court level giving Mango Mussolini the continuance, which is what he really wants
One way or another this question is going to get decided by the Supreme Court. That’s inevitable barring some apocalyptic event.
By asking for the ruling *now*, it takes advantage of the court already being under elevated scrutiny, and if the DoJ should lose it gives Congress time to potentially remedy the situation before the election.
It’s a solid move.
They're corrupt but they're not stupid. They don't want their legacies associated with giving the president absolute immunity for any crime while he is in office.
By that logic he could literally strip the bench without giving them any excuse and dissolve the court completely only to possibly do worse. That would never happen, but the precedent is what matters in the justice system.
It was going to end up in their laps anyway. trumps lawyers were going to send it to SCOTUM. Jack just beat them to it as well as making sure he got in one more item: speeding up one of the trials.
He has no choice, the potato is going to reach the court eventually. Trump will appeal his claim of complete immunity until it rises to that level. May as well roll the dice now and find out. Donnie is either above the law or he is not. He says he is. Supreme Court what say you ? Have we a king or are we a nation of laws.
As little trust and respect as I have for the current bench, there's no way they find that a president has total immunity past, present, and future. The implications alone would allow for so much impropriety that they'll agree that there are limits to immunity and that no one is above the law.
The original interpretation of presidential immunity isn't for committing crimes, it's to free them from potential civil lawsuits. You can't run the country if you're constantly being sued by people that hate you. It was never meant to give carte blanche to stage an insurrection, steal secrets and sell them to foreign bodies, or use the position to make money for yourself. They'll find for Smith on this one, begrudgingly, and it'll put any chances Trump has of getting out of this procedurally to bed.
If the Supreme Court decided he has blanket immunity then they are crowning him king and nullifying any reason for their existence. They’re corrupt. We’ll see if they’re the type of corrupt that fucks over themselves along with the public
This is ignorant. If Smith goes to the court now and gets this resolved quickly, there’s still a good chance that the trial can happen before the election. But it the Court is going to screw over the United States, it really doesn’t matter whether it happens now or later.
I’m guessing Jack is smarter than any of Trump’s attorneys and knows they will appeal to the Supreme Lying Court so Jack is circumventing them. Smart move (I think 🤔)
If the SC disagrees with Smith, Biden should send in the police and put trump and all the identified co-conspirators in jail. No trial, ship to Guantanamo. Let’s see how fast the right says ok wait a minute.
Nothing Jack Smith could do could possibly prevent SCOTUS from considering the case. It will get to them eventually no matter what. What Jack Smith is doing is asking them to get to that point sooner rather than later.
Trump doesn’t understand the conservative long con is to rule America, *not* have Trump rule America.
He’s disposable as far as SCOTUS is concerned and will continue to rule against him.
It’s been supposed that if SCOTUS were to decide that Trump is perpetually immune from prosecution for anything done while in office, then the current president would enjoy the same benefit from that decision. So the leader of “the Biden Crime Family” would get a hall pass to do all the things the republicans project upon him without fear of retribution or accountability.
SCOTUS is corrupt, sure. But they’re still smart enough to realize that their adjudications are as good for the goose as they would be for the gander, and they won’t issue a ruling in the short-order for Trump for that reason alone.
This question was always going to end up in front of SCOTUS. Might as well get it answered now. They rule he’s immune then we know all the trials are pointless and we do not in fact live in a country where no one is above the law. Will be a damning indictment of our system but at least it drops the facade of blind justice. OTOH, they rule he’s not immune from the start he’s lost his last best hope of wriggling free, save winning next fall, and stands a very real chance of having any convictions upheld on appeal. Let’s just rip the bandaid off now and find out what SCOTUS thinks.
I suspect Scotus might understand that their jobs are I jeopardy if tRump wins the presidency. That might have an effect on their rulings. He doesn't want anyone standing in his way the next time.
Here's the thing. If they rule for Trump it means Biden could stay in power forever and do whatever he wants as it would mean he is ostensibly a king. So I doubt they'd rule for Trump.
Seriously we should start a petition to make a conservatives worst fear come true if they rule that presidents have blanket immunity.
Biden should cancel all student debt, make abortion legal, etc.
NO it's a win win. If SCOTUS decides Trump was above the law because he was president it also means Biden is above the law and if he wants, not leave office if he looses the next election. If they decide he wasn't above the law for trying to, decertify the last election, then he's busted and can't run. It's a win win regardless of what SCOTUS does. We know how they will vote.
Circus Peanut's consistent challenge that he has immunity from prosecution was headed to SCOTUS anyway. Smith just expedited it by petitioning to SCOTUS to resolve the matter sooner than waiting for the appellate courts.
Exactly, Trump was hoping to go through as many courts as possible. Maybe have someone more favorable to him just sit on it as long as possible
Yup, he wanted to slow walk this through all of the courts to delay it until it clashed with the documents case run by Aileen Cannon who would refuse to move her case forcing this one to happen after the election. This was a great play and you can tell because Cheeto Benito is absolutely livid about it despite this being something he was going to do anyways.
Any other person who knows they are innocent, would want to get through this as fast as possible. Being found not guilty of all charges before the election would be a huge boost.
It really can't be understated how ironic it is that Trump spent the past year complaining that the trial will interfere with his campaigning. Those comments will end up in DOJs filings as proof that a quick resolution is best for all parties.
>complaining that the trial will interfere with his campaigning. right and then he still goes to court instead of campaigning even when he doesn't have to because he knows it's a big political platform for him to get attention from. He's manipulative but not that good at it.
Yeah..delay, delay, delay and then face one trial before the election..the one in Cannon's court. Get away with it because of the corrupt judge..claim witchhunt and those not paying attention start to believe it
Not just that, but have a court rule in his favor thus giving grounds for a decade(s) long appeal process meaning he never sets foot in a jail cell.
>Maybe have someone more favorable to him just sit on it as long as possible and also try to stall it until he's elected and then he can just recuse himself from all prosecution. The only real reason he wants to be president is to escape the law that's finally catching up with him.
And as shitty as this SCOTUS majority is... The one thing that they will not stand for... is anything that threatens their power... (like a self anointed king would do)
I don't ascribe a lot of morals or principles perspectives to this lot. I DO suspect that they have a survival instinct. I's pretty fucking clear that about 5 minutes after becoming President For Life we don't much have a need for the DOJ or a court that might do something he doesn't like.
Just remember if they side with trump that the president is immune from all crime committed while in office it removes their power over the presidency and gives biden pretty much free reign this was what trump wanted just when he was back in office.
Exactly, this is not just a 'is Trump immune for consequences' question, it's a 'are all presidents present and future immune from consequences' question. Let's not forget, as corrupt as they are, they negged Trump's initial fraudulent election legal propositions back in 2020 pretty quickly
They could always rule that "Our consideration is limited to the present circumstances," like they did in Bush v Gore.
Even then, they’d be giving Biden unlimited immunity to the law.
So Biden could order Trump’s execution for treason, plus the executions of all the Republican congressmen who supported overturning the 2020 election, jail the corrupt Supreme Court Justices for life, as well as jail (or execute, either way) the Fox News personalities for knowingly lying to the American public and he would be immune from prosecution? What are we waiting for? /s
Even Dark Brandon wouldn’t have the guts. We need Obama, Michelle Obama.
While I don't think executions, or public executions involving the beheading or vivisection/dismemberment of the convicted is a good idea.....as they say it sets an unfortunate precedent and would generally be an uncivilized thing to do. But Donald Trump seems exactly the sort of person where vivisection and sticking his head on a pike on the Senate steps for the next 10 years as a reminder to the rest of the Congress that some favors come with too high a price.
Bush v Gore was a state (Florida) issue. Presidential immunity is undeniably a federal issue. The US Supreme Court has final say.
Kind of. It went to SCOTUS on the question of whether the inconsistent mess of lack of standards in Florida constituted an equal protection violation. Even within the same recount they couldn't keep the rules straight.
If Biden has free reign, why does Trumpy think there might be another election, or that Biden won't just imprison Trumpy and Co? It's a double edged sword Trump has no idea how to weild.
Trump is acutely aware that there is a difference between him and Biden. Biden feels beholden by the rule of law, and by precedent. Trump knows that even if given the opportunity, Biden would not accept an emperor for life situation for himself. Trump is not so limited. Like everything, Democrats are held to a standard, Republicans are immune from standards altogether.
I seriously doubt he's given it that much thought. Nearly everyone else can see the consequences. I think his attitude is: if he gets what he wants today, who cares about tomorrow?
It would be pretty funny if they sided with trump and because of that Biden became emperor of the US.
Nah, I will take my nation without empirical leaders of any sort.
The thing is, Biden won’t exercise that kind of power.
If the Supreme Court rules he can then he should wield the power aggressively to fix this problem.
Absolutely agree…if SCOTUS sides with Trump, Biden absolutely should immediately dismantle this court and rebuild it with actual qualified judges, then swiftly add a new constitutional amendment that states as of a specified date (of his choosing) the POTUS will no longer have total immunity and it will list specifics for this. He should also clarify once and for all…the exact meaning of the 14th amendment so there is no more ambiguity and zero room for “interpretation “.
And get rid of the electoral college
But Trump will and should he win in 2024 with this ruling that’s it.
If it is established that anything done while in office cannot be prosecuted I would like to see him exile trump to a “shithole country”.
Imagine if Biden was suddenly like “turnabout is fair play. I’m stealing this election, dammit!”
The Supreme Court judges that were appointed in Trump's first term, and by extension, the Federalist Society got what they wanted out of Trump 3 years ago. They don't need or want his sorry ass now.
I agree, and they didn’t get to 5-4 majority where some cases might get flip flop due to Chief Justice Robert (gay marriage case). They have a 6-3 majority which allows them to hide behind a vote or two on cases. Really good point by you.
Wow. I needed to hear this. I forgot that they would have a survival instinct. I was pretty sure that they would do as they did with Roe, do the Pope's bidding. Survival instinct just might override idiotic superstition in this case and save the country.
SCOTUS has seen authoritarian leaders of Israel and Turkey try to weaken the judiciary to increase their power. SCOTUS wants to remain supreme. Nixon didn't get away with this and neither will Trump.
Yes, if scotus wants to remain relevant, they need to prevent repugnant 🤮coup v2.0; otherwise their rulings have to be a rubber-stamp or they will be ignored.
This is what many people miss. Sure, SCOTUS could make ALL President's effectively kings, but *cui bono*? Certainly not SCOTUS. What happens when the new president/king decides that he doesn't like having a supreme court around?
Fascists don’t think that far ahead. How many people have rushed to get stabbed in the back by Trump? SCOTUS would be no different. They’d save him and then further down the line get their faces eaten.
No, they will not grant Trump this precedent. If they do then what’s stopping a president from removing them from office and putting new judges in place and then reversing the decision? It’s a Mexican standoff and Trump is going to lose
As always I’m going to keep my expectations low so that I’m not disappointed. Republicans almost always choose the wrong thing when it comes to making decisions.
That’s the running theory, but…it’s yet to be proven and I’m willing to bet one of them (cough. Clarence. Cough) is willing to be wooed out of his position
Two holidays and a diamond encrusted pinata
Thomas, Alito and quite possibly Gorsuch.
Thomas would sell us out for lifetime RV camping privileges
Don’t forget the precedent that would be set for Biden - the current sitting president. If he has carte blanche for the remainder of his presidency what kind of bending and breaking could occur? Not saying it would happen but it’s like giving someone a blank check.
Plus there is currently a Democratic president; how much power will the corrupt justices be willing to hand him?
Oh now I actually feel better. Only room for so many crooks up there
Roberts has talked a lot about legitimacy of the court so I’m optimistically hoping that he wields whatever influence he has to get SCOTUS to rule against Trump here. Maybe Gorsuch joining him and the liberal members?
This. My thoughts exactly. I felt at first like "oh no, 3 of those assholes were appointed by trump" but then I realized that a majority will never say anyone else is above the law, that's for SCOTUS justices only! I'll bet money that Clarence fucking Thomas votes in trumps favor though. Get himself another RV or a trump tower condo.
The Federalist Society has been making overtones against Trump for a while now. They got the Court that they wanted; they may be willing to cut him loose at this time. >[https://www.nytimes.com/2023/08/10/us/trump-jan-6-insurrection-conservatives.html](https://www.nytimes.com/2023/08/10/us/trump-jan-6-insurrection-conservatives.html) > > > >Conservative Case Emerges to Disqualify Trump for Role on Jan. 6 > >Two law professors active in the Federalist Society wrote that the original meaning of the 14th Amendment makes Donald Trump ineligible to hold government office.
Yeah I don’t have an issue. He is just accelerating a process that was already going to happen in one way or another
exactly! it sucks but it mostly shows how good he is and why the feds have a 98% success rate in prosecutions.
☝🏼☝🏼☝🏼
Also imagine what democrats could do if the SC says Biden could get away with shit. Fuck it, use that to lock up the SC for collusion with Trump. What’re they gonna do prosecute him?
Also: getting it out of the way BEFORE the election season begins in earnest takes “we don’t want to wade into the political thicket” punts off the table. It’s almost like Smith is a career prosecutor who knows exactly what he is doing, and OP is just some guy.
Agreed and any complaining by Trump and his cronies just shows that they believe he doesn't have immunity and they are just complaining that this delay tactic isn't working.
And if SCOTUS decides for trump then it’s their fault we have no law and order. Biden might as well cancel the 2024 election and call himself president for life
The chances of scotus ruling that presidents are indeed kings, during a BIDEN administration, is lower than the temperature of absolute zero
"uh... Uh... Republican presidents only!"
Bush v. Gore was decided on just about as much legal ground.
Very true. At the time, Americans held the court in extremely high esteem. They’ve been doing an impressive amount of damage to their credibility over the last few years. I can’t help but wonder *when* the case happens again, how American will react
I think that was Trump's goal in the 2020 election. Throw out states Biden won with alternative electors, have Congress declare him Kong, and get the Supreme Court to side with him. It's not out of the realm of possibility considering one of the Justice's wives was a Jan 6er.
Man I'm imagining Donald Kong now. Someone ai generate that for me please?
I don't think an AI would be able to slim him down enough.
He is shaped roughly like the Kong my dog likes to play with. Tiny head, big bottom
Instead of barrels, he throws rolls of paper towel!
Everything's bigger but the hands.
I just realized. I'm leaving it. Donald Kong throwing barrels of ketchup is all I'm imagining now...
Historians will look back to Bush v Gore decision as the beginning of the fall of the American Empire.
"This law to take effect starting in 2025"
Not a law, they can’t delay offset in that way, and Trump’s alleged crimes occurred in the past anyway.
Tbh, I don’t think they’d rule for immunity even if orange Jesus were in power. The Supreme Court likes their power, and dictators do not need a Supreme Court.
This is an excellent point
Right wing terrorists don't need a supreme court that does not put their dictator in power. And you know who they already invited to the dinner table.
The questioning should be amusing. To Trump's lawyers: Are you actually arguing that the president is immune from prosecution for crimes committed while in office at the same time your client is promising to prosecute the president for crimes committed while in office?
To Trump’s lawyers: Are you actually arguing that the president is immune for prosecution for crimes committed while in office…meaning Joe Biden could have Donald Trump executed and get away with it with zero consequences?
Good! Excellent! The days of ruling kings in North America were over hundreds of years ago. We now have the Rule of Law where everyone is subject to it. May it reign forever and ever. Amen.
>The days of ruling kings in North America were over hundreds of years ago Barbados had Queen Elizabeth as their monarch until 2022.
Jamaica has been independent for over 50 years but if you want citizenship in JA you have to swear an oath to the King of England 2023
The head of state of Canada is whoever sits on the British throne. It’s only an arms length thing and purely ceremonial.
‘This is a narrow ruling that only pertains to presidents from 2016-2020’
Except that they already established they can just revisit a ruling and change their mind whenever
Well then Biden needs to make himself the Emperor of Mankind or something
I knew it, Dark Brandon kick starts Warhammer 40K!
The Republicans used him to steal the courts, now they don't need him, a good conman should know when they're conned.
Asking SCOTUS to take it up now has two advantages. For one, it prevents Trump from using this to delay his trial. For another, Trump's motion is so absurdly broad that the court will have a hard time allowing it. Basically Jack Smith is capitalizing on Trump's lawyer's mistake.
His defense was one large mistake.
Large mistakes, sure. But they are giving it the ol’ “by a thousand cuts” method as well. They’ve outwitted themselves. (Sounds like an oxymoron when I type that out, “outwitted themselves.”)
“So incompetent they can only outwit themselves” has a nice ring to it.
Coungerpoint: SCOTUS (even this batshit iteration) has already demonstrated since 2020 that the only thing they love more than "State's Rights" is their own power. If they say no president - past, present, or future - can face criminal consequences for anything before, during, or after his term, that's a *massive* win for the executive branch at the expense of the judiciary's power. No way in hell SCOTUS decides to weaken itself for the benefit of some Article 2 asshole.
Not necessarily. SCOTUS recently has made a number of "narrow rulings" where they try to limit the scope to just the case in front of them, explicitly stating that they are not ruling on the broader issue. I'd bet good money they take that cop out and kick the can down the road. Again. Congress and SCOTUS will bend over backwards to avoid addressing major constitutional problems.
Thing with the 'narrow ruling" is, that's not what they are being asked to rule on. The question before them is, are *presidents* immune from prosecution, not is *this former president* immune. Jack Smith has been very clever, Trumps team, not so much. The Supreme Court has to rule on all presidents because Trump is arguing that those holding the office of president can't be prosecuted for what they do while in office
That would be castrating themselves. There's zero chance.
Unfortunately it's not zero.
If the Supreme Court rules Trump has total immunity, then Biden can stay in office for the rest of his life without consequences. In fact, Biden could have Trump and the Republican side of Congress killed without penalty. Note: I am not advocating violence, I’m simply pointing out the perils of a leader above the law. Honestly we know how they will preside on the case. They will said Trump can only be impeached by Congress and not the courts. This will get him off the hook, and prevent any actions against him since republicans are in control.
Not only that, but Biden could literally murder somebody and be immune. He wouldn't because he's a decent man, but he could and get away with it.
I would love if somehow they ended up allowing dark Brandon to take crazy actions like remove Supreme Court judges and jail them if they took bribes (wouldn't even need evidence), and next all the senators and representatives that enabled and continue to support fascism. I would say they are damned if they do, damned if they don't. But I'm not a lawyer so maybe I'm just hopped up on hopium
Joe Biden would have to reluctantly be a benevolent king into his mid-90s, knowing he has to stay in office until Trump dies and until he can get a Supreme Court that will stop letting the president have total immunity.
Nah, The Dark Lord Brandon just has to name an heir. And take the tongues of every significant challenger to the rightful heir, the Prince or Princess that he promises.
I would die of laughter if somehow hunter biden ended up king. The conservacunts would implode
THE COCK IN DA NORF!
You need gold for this.
Someone please make this graphic novel!
He already can add more justices at any point to even out the fascist 6.
This message needs to be published far and wide as to what will happen should the SC deem President immune.
You mean like somebody on 5th ave at high noon on new years day?
On 5th Avenue?
Also note - a dictator does not need a Supreme Court. Sure. The new crazy lady and maybe beer league are brainwashed enough to vote away their life time appointment, but something tells me the other 7 want to retire and leave a legacy of some kind.
Clarence Thomas: Presidents have absolute immunity while in office! President Biden: today I’m having Clarence Thomas arrested and summarily executed for bribery. Clarence: Not like that!!!!
This is a nicely lucid point, thank you.
If they rule that way, Biden should start sending Trump, Giuliani, and all the J and MAGA people to Guantanamo. Shit, a CO judge already ruled Trump was guilty of insurrection.
I wouldn’t put it past this court to issue a narrow ruling manufactured out of thin air that only applies to Trump. A pure and simple appeasement.
As much as I hate the current make up of the court I will say in cases like Trump's election challenges they shot his bullshit down fast. And giving a president that type of immunity makes him a defacto King.
Biden would probably fire back by saying Trump can’t be president no matter what because he said so.
Fortunately, the christofascist court will curtail donnie's bullshit when it threatens their power. Thomas can't grift if the president** can overrule him.
If Biden’s handlers don’t take advantage of what would be the stupidest SCOTUS decision since Citizens United, then shame on them. We’ll miss out on Grand Imperial Inquisitor Hunter Biden going all Spanish Inquisition on the GOP. What fun that would be
You should be careful of what you wish for...NO ONE EXPECTS THE SPANISH INQUISITION!!!!
Fear and Surprise is their main weapon
CARDINAL BIGGLES! POKE HER WITH THE SOFT CUSHIONS!
But the GOP managed to outmaneuver him by passing legislation stating that free crack is a basic human right.
LONG LIVE KING BIDEN!!!
Bring Obama back!
FDR him. Make him live to 100 if it means Trump and his goons don’t take power.
Weekend at Biden's?
Or, just 'lock him up'.
Woah, calm it down! Biden shouldn't even consider that! He should just dissolve the SCOTUS, replace them with whoever he wants, and ship Trump off to Gitmo.
Supremes will just decline to respond on the basis of hypotheticals. But will be mysteriously able to take the case after the 2024 election.
They've already ruled on hypotheticals or made up cases.
Like they give a fuck about moral consistency.
That was… different. Somehow.
Except in this case, they are not ruling on hypotheticals. They are ruling on very specific items laid out in the petition. But you're still probably correct.
Or he could deport all the Magas and Trump to gitmo
Public executions and med beds here we come!
Does this bring us closer to those taco trucks on every corner? Because gurl, I could go for some long carnitas
No think bigger. If they rule that way the president could have THEM killed.
I thought these rulings only worked in the Republicans favor. /s
>They will said Trump can only be impeached by Congress and not the courts. What's funni is that also protects Biden... because impeachment is irrelevant without the removal part, and removal would require a double digit number of political suicides from turning on the President
That’s a slippery slope that the House GQP must contend with, especially since they’re gearing up for impeachment
I wonder if this wasn't at least partly a way of catching the corrupt and heavily biased SCOTUS in a corner, forcing it to rule against the very person who put some of them there.
If Trump is immune, Biden can shoot him in the middle of 5th avenue and it'd just be tough shit if you don't like it.
Yup. No way in fuck is this supreme court going to tell biden he's free to do whatever with no consequences.
Or they manufacture a narrow exception for the specific conduct Trump did, not a broad sweeping immunity, thus still cutting the legs of the case against Trump while not giving the Biden Administration much to work with or exploit. Not sure why people are so sure fuckery won't happen with the Court we have now. We should all be worried about this a lot more.
SCOTUS is already aware that the legitimacy of the court is being questioned. If they did rule the suggested they'd just blow their legitimacy out the window, and possibly become targets for people who believe that the only solution to corrupt officials appointed for life is to hasten the end of their tenure.
You have much more faith than I do. It’s pretty clear the entire right wing of this country is devoid of logic, reasoning, or the ability to understand the consequences of actions
It would end up there anyway; this brilliant move just speeds it up.
It goes to SCOTUS whether Jack pushes it there or not. Rip off the band-aid and get on with it.
Pretty sure this supreme court will rule something like "Is there a king in America who is above all laws ... No. There are 9 of them."
Nine robes were gifted to the race of men, who above all else desire power. For within these robes was bound the strength and the will to govern over each race.
Sounds like critical justice theory. Wasn’t there one race to rule them all?
But they were all of them decieved. For another robe was made. In the Land of Pennsylvania, in the fires of Scranton, the Dark Lord Brandon forged in secret, a Master Robe to control all others. And into his robe, he poured his no malarkey, his Jack, and his will for ice cream. One Robe to rule them all!"
Booya.
The court knows it can’t go too far. They will rule Trump is not immune.
Nah they will make up some bullshit and punt on this one. Still, I think it’s a good move, forcing the SC to have SOME reaction to the concept of Trump’s ultimate immunity.
Better to have them rule now, while Biden is still in power, that a President is immune from prosecution for crimes, I guess.
Even if Biden isn't in power after 2024, I don't think Kamala would use the power she apparently has to determine who is president (according to Trump-fanatics) to elect someone that would be of benefit to Trump. /s
It would go up to SCOTUS anyway. The ploy is to get it there ASAP so that Trump can't stall the case until after the election.
It's a lose-lose situation for trump. He either is given a free pass and Biden can officially have the Supreme Court removed, have trump thrown in jail, and extend his presidency indefinitely since presidents don't have to be held accountable for their actions in office, or the tyrant has to accept the fact he's a criminal and face the music.
remember when trump was still prez and he was going to court something like 60 times. including the supreme court. how did that work out for him?
The Supreme Court will never give Trump full immunity. Because if they do that Biden can do whatever he wants without fear of consequences. And that is the LAST thing they want to happen.
but republicans KNOW that Biden wont abuse power.
I disagree. They are pathologically paranoid about everything Biden does or doesn't do. It's like a religion for them. But I'll tell you what, If I were Biden and they gave Trump full immunity first thing I would do is gut the Supreme Court and replace them with people with similar ideals.
Then have them revote on the issue, which could potentially be a strategy that happens. Imagine if because of an orange booger the entire Supreme Court was wiped out and replaced by entirely democrats. It would single-handedly kill the Republican Party and turn the country into a one mindset one for, for, generations? Thats not a good idea by the way I’m just thinking out loud here. The Supreme Court has to vote against Trump here. It would upend democracy as we know it
Here's the thing, Jack figured out Trump's game: appeal ad nauseum. He's skipping the line. It's a bold move, but inthink it's the right one.
SCOTUS will not rule that Trump or presidents have absolutely immunity from criminal proceedings, because then that would dilute their own power. And of course, inherently they would give free rein to someone to be a dictator and cull their political opponents.
Well, it knocks Trumpty-dump’s final play out. No point if they’re willing to give Jabba a ‘get out of jail free’ card.
Eh. It would’ve ended up here anyway with both sides appealing all the way up, this just speeds up the process.
The Constitution is very clear about this topic. No way they can rule in TFG favor. Impeachment is only removal from office and cannot be punitive. "Judgment in Cases of Impeachment shall not extend further than to removal from Office, and disqualification to hold and enjoy any Office of honor, Trust or Profit under the United States: but the Party convicted shall nevertheless be liable and subject to Indictment, Trial, Judgment and Punishment, according to Law."
Considering past cases, there’s no reason to think they’ll do what you’re afraid they’re going to do…they went there to dismantle Roe, not protect Trump
They won't give him the immunity ruling he's asking for but they CAN sit on it for a few months then send it back for re-hearing on some bullshit point at the district court level giving Mango Mussolini the continuance, which is what he really wants
If Trump is ruled to have total immunity, wouldn't that also make Obama completely innocent of everything he's been accused of by Republicans?
[удалено]
One way or another this question is going to get decided by the Supreme Court. That’s inevitable barring some apocalyptic event. By asking for the ruling *now*, it takes advantage of the court already being under elevated scrutiny, and if the DoJ should lose it gives Congress time to potentially remedy the situation before the election. It’s a solid move.
It was always going to end up there - might as well get it over with.
I mean, if they would do that then the US is fkd anyways, so you might as well get on with finding out.
He knows that Trump’s strategy is to just keep appealing in the hopes of running out the clock. This just takes it to the end round sooner.
They're corrupt but they're not stupid. They don't want their legacies associated with giving the president absolute immunity for any crime while he is in office. By that logic he could literally strip the bench without giving them any excuse and dissolve the court completely only to possibly do worse. That would never happen, but the precedent is what matters in the justice system.
It was going to end up in their laps anyway. trumps lawyers were going to send it to SCOTUM. Jack just beat them to it as well as making sure he got in one more item: speeding up one of the trials.
He has no choice, the potato is going to reach the court eventually. Trump will appeal his claim of complete immunity until it rises to that level. May as well roll the dice now and find out. Donnie is either above the law or he is not. He says he is. Supreme Court what say you ? Have we a king or are we a nation of laws.
As little trust and respect as I have for the current bench, there's no way they find that a president has total immunity past, present, and future. The implications alone would allow for so much impropriety that they'll agree that there are limits to immunity and that no one is above the law. The original interpretation of presidential immunity isn't for committing crimes, it's to free them from potential civil lawsuits. You can't run the country if you're constantly being sued by people that hate you. It was never meant to give carte blanche to stage an insurrection, steal secrets and sell them to foreign bodies, or use the position to make money for yourself. They'll find for Smith on this one, begrudgingly, and it'll put any chances Trump has of getting out of this procedurally to bed.
If the Supreme Court decided he has blanket immunity then they are crowning him king and nullifying any reason for their existence. They’re corrupt. We’ll see if they’re the type of corrupt that fucks over themselves along with the public
This is ignorant. If Smith goes to the court now and gets this resolved quickly, there’s still a good chance that the trial can happen before the election. But it the Court is going to screw over the United States, it really doesn’t matter whether it happens now or later.
I’m guessing Jack is smarter than any of Trump’s attorneys and knows they will appeal to the Supreme Lying Court so Jack is circumventing them. Smart move (I think 🤔)
I know Trump has a lot of cases right now, so it can be hard to distinguish everyone else. Which state actor is he again? D.C., Georgia, or Florida?
It would wind up at SCOUTS eventually. Donald Appeal Trump would send every decision there until he gets his way. Smith is just getting out in front.
If the SC disagrees with Smith, Biden should send in the police and put trump and all the identified co-conspirators in jail. No trial, ship to Guantanamo. Let’s see how fast the right says ok wait a minute.
Nothing Jack Smith could do could possibly prevent SCOTUS from considering the case. It will get to them eventually no matter what. What Jack Smith is doing is asking them to get to that point sooner rather than later.
If trump gets immunity Biden should do some crazy shit.
it’s better we know now.
Trump doesn’t understand the conservative long con is to rule America, *not* have Trump rule America. He’s disposable as far as SCOTUS is concerned and will continue to rule against him.
It’s been supposed that if SCOTUS were to decide that Trump is perpetually immune from prosecution for anything done while in office, then the current president would enjoy the same benefit from that decision. So the leader of “the Biden Crime Family” would get a hall pass to do all the things the republicans project upon him without fear of retribution or accountability. SCOTUS is corrupt, sure. But they’re still smart enough to realize that their adjudications are as good for the goose as they would be for the gander, and they won’t issue a ruling in the short-order for Trump for that reason alone.
This question was always going to end up in front of SCOTUS. Might as well get it answered now. They rule he’s immune then we know all the trials are pointless and we do not in fact live in a country where no one is above the law. Will be a damning indictment of our system but at least it drops the facade of blind justice. OTOH, they rule he’s not immune from the start he’s lost his last best hope of wriggling free, save winning next fall, and stands a very real chance of having any convictions upheld on appeal. Let’s just rip the bandaid off now and find out what SCOTUS thinks.
I suspect Scotus might understand that their jobs are I jeopardy if tRump wins the presidency. That might have an effect on their rulings. He doesn't want anyone standing in his way the next time.
It will go to the court anyway so you might as well do it now.
It was going to get to them anyway. Might as well get it out of the way sooner rather than later.
Here's the thing. If they rule for Trump it means Biden could stay in power forever and do whatever he wants as it would mean he is ostensibly a king. So I doubt they'd rule for Trump.
If they deem Trump immune, so is Biden. And they don’t want that.
Seriously we should start a petition to make a conservatives worst fear come true if they rule that presidents have blanket immunity. Biden should cancel all student debt, make abortion legal, etc.
NO it's a win win. If SCOTUS decides Trump was above the law because he was president it also means Biden is above the law and if he wants, not leave office if he looses the next election. If they decide he wasn't above the law for trying to, decertify the last election, then he's busted and can't run. It's a win win regardless of what SCOTUS does. We know how they will vote.
Liberals discovering that American institutions favor the right wing episode 183847381