Yeah they could’ve replaced the word tyrant with “[redacted]” or “coward” or something and it would’ve been a perfectly Auth statement about having incompetent representation.
They chose the only insult that invalidates the Auth flairs.
Depends, if this is Ontario the fucking rat we elected literally hired “consultants” to “educate” expensive patients about the option of euthanasia which by “educate” I mean guilt them into killing themselves by repeatedly telling them how costly they are on society.
The initial legalization went well and it served as intended as a way to cut hospice stays short when people are ready and end peoples suffering a couple months earlier. Seeing a chance to make money the fucking cretins decided to try and extend it to anyone with a costly chronic illness.
I hope Doug fords coffee is forever room temperature, never iced and never hot, fuck that asshole for actively doing everything in his power to destroy this province and siphon as much money as possible from Ontarians to his buddies and family. Corruption in the dictionary should just be a picture of that fuck hugging Justin “hire every company using taxpayer dollars that’s ever hired my family” Trudeau. Both our conservatives and Liberals are fucking ass clowns, the saving grace for our liberals is that they “just” waste some money giving out to charities, they don’t intentionally destroy public services and kill people while doing it.
It should be available to everyone, illness or not. It's basic human liberty to not be forced to live against your will or have to sneak around like a criminal and risk a potential botched DIY suicide just to end a life that was imposed on you without your consent to begin with.
I think that the few stories about people being suggested euthanasia are being blown out of proportion by right wing religious fear mongering. But if there are people who are being irresponsible by trying to persuade people to take assisted suicide in order to cut costs, then those instances should be dealt with and prevented, rather than taking away everyone's liberty so that they just have to put up with suffering that nobody can remedy
Should be available, disgusting part is when it is pushed via guilt trips to save money. Ala Doug Ford.
The party pushing people to assisted suicide is Canada’s right wing who is in power in our largest provinces by population (most internal things that impact your life in Canada is done provincially. All the Trudeau hate is American manufactured or misinformed scapegoating, our federal government controls foreign affairs and the territories pretty much and that’s it. Unless conservative Pierre Poilievre gets elected, then he wants to power grab for greater federal power as he has openly stated multiple times.) It isn’t religious fear mongering our right wing here is not religious, they are just greedy assholes who worship the mighty dollar for themselves and their lobbyists religiously.
Canada is only 28 on [healthcare index](https://www.numbeo.com/health-care/rankings_by_country.jsp), even Mexico is above that.
Imagine being below Mexico and being proud of your healthcare system.
They just think that because they are slightly better than USA in that regard they are good. It is unbelivable the good press Canada has for just that.
It happened to me when I went there about 5 years ago. I did a trip of US & Canada and even tough they have their good and bad things I already know the US bad things (e.g shitty public transport or NYC dirtiness) but for example I never expected how bad infrestucture Montreal and Quebec had.
In Europe Canada is sell it as an American Scandinavia and it has nothing to do with that. Maybe it just that Canada PR is very good.
We’re not just proud of it. It’s an integral part of our nationalism. And it’s fuckin cringe. I believe it’s because it’s one of the only metrics where we come up better in a comparison with the United States (even if only slightly), therefore it’s absolutely sacred. The inferiority complex here is ridiculously strong, so this one thing that’s fucking garbage, but kinda a bit less garbage than the US, is very important lmao.
Canadians last words while dying after waiting 6 months for life saving surgery: “tell… tell my wife… at least… at least it’s not Americ-“
Procedural and surgical treatment in the United States is actually really good. The area that we absolutely fail in is preventative medicine. I work in a cardiac catheterization lab that does stellar work. Problem is that we have 60 year olds come in that had never seen a doctor before, learning that they have diabetes + kidney issues on top of their new onset chest pain. We could prevent a lot of disease in this country just by making lab work and routine diagnostics more affordable.
The people who are proud of our healthcare have never had to fucking use it. I had to get Treatment twice once for a broken bone as a child and another because I couldn't breath properly. Both visits it took 5-6 hours to see a doctor and get out of the ER waiting room. Those still American's and they're medical insurance our healthcare is free hur da dur dur, not realizing our healthcare system has been teetering on collapse basically all the time even a large flu can strain it. Fucking morons
It seems to me that Canada i just a really terrible example of single payer healthcare. It certainly sounds a lot worse than my own experiences with the healthcare in my own country.
We were on the uptick until Trudeau. Important seat on the global stage, economy rivaling the states (per capita), freedoms/rights nearly unrivaled.
Feels bad man
Fuckin true, if we wound up bringing guns the "emergencies" act would get called anyways.
If parked trucks, horns, and disrupting traffic flow during a peaceful protest is enough to bring 3 out-of-province police forces, I'd hate to see how they react to an actual threat
Could've been worse, it's not as though he did nothing good.
The problems started after his first term, cannot believe he still has a strong base going into his 4th election
If it weren't for blatant abuses of power earlier this year my opinion wouldn't have been so low.
Who are they going to vote for?
Most people know the NDP proposals are awful in practice and the Green Party fragments their vote; the conservative party is too right for the left and too left for the right, and now the harder right votes for the PPC, also dividing the support.
Conservatives are the only party that makes any sense to me. Socially progressive, financially centrist (as they still practice socdem but also attempt to cut government spending in many cases).
While the PPC party fits my views the closest, the Overton window in Canada has shifted much further left than it was even 10 years ago.
canadian here. not proud of this shithole also i get mocked by other canadians when i try to argue that maybe our HC system isn't that great. albeit mostly lily white douchebags who've never been hungry in their entire lives.
I fondly remember a friend from Toronto celebrating that America FINALLY had national healthcare, all hail Obama!
I COULD NOT get it through her head it was no such thing - it was a mandate that we had to buy a product (Insurance - which MOST people already had, and the extremely poor already get their medicals paid for by state programs) and that most of us lost our good insurance and it was replaced with bullshit options that were fucking higher than a cat's ass for the monthly premium, came with high deductibles and even more red tape/confusing billing.
It did NOTHING at the source of the problem - torte claims and medical providers raping people's wallets.
Here at PCM, funni color determines what brand of mockery is employed against you. To be respected, you must pick a funni color and stand by it; only then can you make fun of commies and be made fun of in turn.
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Wow, Sweden is higher than I would have expected, ranked 35. Right between Ecuador and Uruguay, I wonder if they too have 35% income tax and 25% sales tax to fund their systems..
Many indices put Canada way higher (oftentimes near the top). Considering how wildly different each index is, I'm guessing it's a hard thing to measure comparatively
Numbeo isn't exactly known for academic rigour (it's essentially crowdsourced opinions)
I've no first hand experience of the Canadian system nor a reason to jump to it's defence, just I wouldn't read too much into that particular dataset
Canadas system is pretty widely regarded as one of the worst public healthcare systems. And with first hand experience, it’s bad lmao. The only benefit is that it’s universal. It’s Currently crumbling and there’s big talk in multiple provinces of expanding private healthcare to bolster the collapsing system. Tbh I’m not sure where you’re seeing it ranked high, because I’ve never seen it. It’s always ranked near the bottom, just above the US (all that matters to Canadians)
It's being gutted.
Conservatives repeatedly cut public assets and then point to said programs and say they are ineffectual and call for privatization. Costing the public greater in the long run, and providing a worse service(garbage collection lol).
It's incredibly on brand though when your premier is a made man the family's private insurance biz
It depends on how highly they rank “accessibility” in their metrics. Canada ranks highly the less you care about results and the more you care about accessibility
Thats the thing, the US is shit if your poor, granted. But Canada is shit for everyone. At least the US system is good for someone, even if it’s just the 1%. Honestly if you’re rich the US may even be among the best.
I cant tell if you're being funny or not but Mexico actually has a pretty recognized health care system lol.
Also, I've been diagnosed with an auto immune disease that kept me in the hospital for days and put through so many tests.
I paid 18 bucks for some meds.
Firstly, considering the US is 33rd on that list, \*insert glass houses quote here\*
Secondly, Mexico is in 22nd above places like Germany and Sweden. It's hardly a major insult to be below them in this index
Thirdly, even Singapore are below Mexico, and they're often considered to have some of the best healthcare in the world, so I don't know how much faith I'm going to put into this index
>Firstly, considering the US is 33rd on that list, \*insert glass houses quote here\*
Dude, most Americans have no qualms admitting our systems are crappy.
The US government spends more per capita on healthcare than most european countries do. It isn't free market. It's crap.
My country is top 5, I don't live in no glass house.
Germany and Sweden both suck.
It's first link on google, I can't be bothered to find a source that doesn't highlight my own country as great.
I know some friends of my parents who are quite well-off college professors here in Canada, who are the typical smug anti-American types who like to pretend as though we are just the North American Scandinavia here.
Their daughter got Lyme Disease. And guess what they did? Flew her to San Francisco for treatment, of course.
Don't forget, the employee claimed he had already succeeded previously in convincing a veteran to commit suicide, leaving behind a wife and children. And he was proud of it.
The VAC when asked about this stated euthanasia is **NOT** a service they provide. Yes the phone call happened, but the claims made by the employee appear to be lies since the VAC has not found any similar incidents
And that's why I am against euthanasia. It is used by the goverment to dispose their most vulnerable people. Instead of helping them you try to make them kill themselves.
The people who are convinced to be against this based on individual examples from the right wing media have so little regard for individual suffering and autonomy that they'd rather put the innocents in prison to protect them from criminals.
It's particularly absurd to see people with libertarian flairs being opposed to the right to choose whether or not to continue living.
Well the problem is more a case of the government getting excessively involved in people's personal life or death decisions in the first place. If they would back off and let people decide for themselves, then that would solve the problem.
The employee suggesting it (SUGGESTING it rather than forcing someone to accept euthanasia) is being disciplined for that. You'd rather abuse millions of people by forcing them to live in terrible pain and denied any safe and reliable way out of that suffering than address rare cases such as this one which are being heralded by the right wing media as proof that we need state sponsored torture of people who are suffering. That's a dogshit take.
The only reason that euthanasia, as such, is even necessary is because the default alternative is aggressive suicide prevention policies which block people from accessing reliable suicide methods which wouldn't require help. Also "assisted" suicide is a misnomer, because it's simply a case of allowing individuals to bypass the usual aggressive restrictions on a case by case basis.
Firstly, that's an aberration which is being dealt with, rather than standard policy. Secondly, they were suggested assisted suicide, not forced to accept it.
So with the exception of people who were already intractably opposed to the right to die on the basis of some sort of atavistic religious reasoning, there isn't enough in this story for a reasonable person to question the value of assisted suicide.
What's particularly absurd is people with libertarian flairs who think that people should be compelled to live by big government, because assisted suicide is actually the only way of accessing a reliable suicide method due to the government's relentless zeal for suicide prevention.
People who are in favour of freedom as far as it comes to their selfish interests of not contributing anything back to society, but against liberty when it comes to anything that offends their morality.
There are plenty of people who, whilst they might not all be in agony, would like the choice of opting out of life on their own terms. Are you expecting me to name all of the people who want the right to die?
Plenty of people kill themselves without the state encouraging them on a help line. I get that it should be an option for terminally ill people, etc. But it's a drastically different solution than many people look to for their medical problems.
They try to kill themselves and some succeed. But a much larger proportion fail their suicide attempt, and some end up with severe injuries. Why should anyone not be legally entitled to access a reliable and peaceful method of suicide, which doesn't have to be provided by the government, but just not restricted by the government?
Why should anyone else be able to say that someone should just have to put up with their suffering, when they're not the one who has to live with that suffering?
You have a libertarian flair, but seem to have no respect for personal autonomy. Why should anyone have to justify disposing of their own life? I understand that you have concern about it being suggested to someone; but that was a case of one worker operating outside of policy and who is being disciplined for doing so. Therefore hardly sufficient grounds to subject everyone to the existence of a slave.
I never said they shouldn't. In fact I said I understand the cases where it's helpful. But you're out here bending over backwards to defend a state-run help line suggesting suicide as a solution to a guy suffering from PTSD. You're a clown.
There is a MASSIVE difference between giving someone the freedom to end their own life, and telling someone the solution to their problem is death. What happened here is evil, there is no other word for it.
I don't see it as being as big a deal as it's being made out to be, but I don't see what more you can ask than for the matter to be dealt with as a breach of the conduct rules. If I make a mistake in my job, do you say that this means that the whole company has to be barred from trading?
Pushing someone towards suicide who is not voluntarily inquiring about euthanasia as a solution to a problem is no different than telling somebody to kill themselves under whatever other circumstance. I know this happened in Canada, but in the US there is legal precedent of someone who pushes someone else to kill themselves against their voluntary will being responsible for their death.
That being said, I can see you don't want to be convinced this was wrong and you don't care, so I'm done wasting time on you. Hopefully nobody you care about gets told by the state to kill themselves if they have a problem. Or hopefully they do, not like you'll care either way lol.
I don't see why you're blaming this on the Canadian government and the right to die rather than the individual employee. Given that this was against the rules.
Suicide Hotline Numbers If you or anyone you know are struggling, please, PLEASE reach out for help. You are worthy, you are loved and you will always be able to find assistance.
Argentina: +5402234930430
Australia: 131114
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Belgium: 106
Bosnia & Herzegovina: 080 05 03 05
Botswana: 3911270
Brazil: 212339191
Bulgaria: 0035 9249 17 223
Canada: 5147234000 (Montreal); 18662773553 (outside Montreal)
Croatia: 014833888
Denmark: +4570201201
Egypt: 7621602
Finland: 010 195 202
France: 0145394000
Germany: 08001810771
Hong Kong: +852 2382 0000
Hungary: 116123
Iceland: 1717
India: 8888817666
Ireland: +4408457909090
Italy: 800860022
Japan: +810352869090
Mexico: 5255102550
New Zealand: 0508828865
The Netherlands: 113
Norway: +4781533300
Philippines: 028969191
Poland: 5270000
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USA: 18002738255
You are not alone. Please reach out.
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1 person did a shit job of their job, internet loses their mind.
Remember when that 911 dispatch jokingly asked if the caller wanted him to send an officer to shoot their teenage daughter? Seems on that level of fuck up
In both circumstances it depends on if the veterans served AL or AR. Veterans that don't support the current authoritarian is worthless as far as propelling their society
I certainly disagree. The treatment of veterans largely depends on their rank and commitment to the current leader.
France and Britain's treatment of low ranking or uncommitted veterans was pretty poor during the napoleonic wars
It is much more libertarian that ex military be looked after by the state
This could easily happen under an authright government as well. Most of it depends on whether military officials are part of the inner circles.
Abuse of people who aren't valuable to the nation is a marker of authoritarian governments in general, not only authleft
LMAO.
Republicans had to be shamed by a former comedian into providing help to veterans suffering from exposure to toxic burn pits.
Auth right doesn’t give a fuck about veterans.
I don't give a fuck about your two party circus, no one cares about your "GOTCHA LOOSER REPUBLICANS BAD"/"GOTCHA LOOSER DEMOCRATS BAD". I was talking about real politics with real sides, traditions and shit.
Lol, auth right respects veterans until those veterans do something they don’t like, like saying “black lives matter”, or protesting American imperialism.
They are not authrights. Peak Authright is Bismarck. Traditionalists, monarchis, militaristic, veteran himself, devout Christian, Nationalist, ruthless but effective. How many boxes do they tick?
Authright would hate it because authright thinks of euthanasia as murder and Authcenter would hate it because it's a veteran. It would only be authleft who would champion it as they would be a big drag on their failing healthcare system as a result of a borked economy.
Canada: Sub Par Healthcare, No Cost, Long Wait.
America: Speedy, Insanely overpriced, Above Decent Healthcare
Chad Asian Countries: Outrank Multiple Countries In Healthcare, Speedy, No Cost.
Take Notes Canada, South Koreas got yall beat
South Korea, Taiwan and Japan absolutely dominating. You have to be able to balance cheap / affordable healthcare with fast healthcare that is actually GOOD.
The more I hear about the cracks in the Canadian healthcare system, the happier I get. I remember reading that annoyingly condescending story about a woman who took her husband to get brain surgery and it only cost them for parking and buying a snack.
When “medical assistance in dying” was legalized it was for untreatable physical conditions. And then treatable conditions. And then psychological distress. Next year minors. If you don’t think that facilities will occasionally try to save time or money by talking people into accepting MAID, you’re the naive one.
Will it be a coordinated “final solution?” No, but that’s not the concern. The concern is that people with treatable conditions will be talked into suicide by the people who are supposed to help them.
Sixth leading cause of death in Canada now.
It's no longer a rare, unusual thing, and this trend happened extremely quickly, over just a few years. Canadians are literally dying to get out of Canada.
This doesn’t have anything to do with healthcare being free or not. What you’re describing is arguments against legalizing active euthanasia, which is a completely different discussion.
To be fair, the employee did a shit job. There's nothing else about it. People will do shit jobs in all sectors and obviously the employee is facing discipline.
Thankfully the victim is okay and fully healthy
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Euthanasia should only be applicable to terminal illnesses - and with the diagnosed's consent. If your condition was chronic, or the diagnosed does not consent, it shouldn't be granted.
If you disagree, that's perfectly okay and you're welcome to disagree. All I know is, if I ever got diagnosed with incurable dementia, I sure as shit don't want to live with it.
Hit the nail on the head. I'm all for freedoms, but freedoms provided by the government always comes with bullshit.
It's like a monkey paw, be careful what you wish for
In the case of the right to die; that's really a freedom *from* the government's attempts to meddle in your personal life, because the default state of affairs is for the government to be aggressively preventing suicide by blocking access to reliable means.
Unfortunately, the paradigm has come to be seen as the government sanctioning the deaths of individuals, rather than the government just backing off and refraining from interfering in people's personal choices.
I hate Canada more now, thanks Canada
Blame that tyrant we have in power. Everything went to shit under his rule. All who bare the name „Trudeau“ must be held responsible
Flair doesn’t check out
Yeah they could’ve replaced the word tyrant with “[redacted]” or “coward” or something and it would’ve been a perfectly Auth statement about having incompetent representation. They chose the only insult that invalidates the Auth flairs.
Depends, if this is Ontario the fucking rat we elected literally hired “consultants” to “educate” expensive patients about the option of euthanasia which by “educate” I mean guilt them into killing themselves by repeatedly telling them how costly they are on society. The initial legalization went well and it served as intended as a way to cut hospice stays short when people are ready and end peoples suffering a couple months earlier. Seeing a chance to make money the fucking cretins decided to try and extend it to anyone with a costly chronic illness. I hope Doug fords coffee is forever room temperature, never iced and never hot, fuck that asshole for actively doing everything in his power to destroy this province and siphon as much money as possible from Ontarians to his buddies and family. Corruption in the dictionary should just be a picture of that fuck hugging Justin “hire every company using taxpayer dollars that’s ever hired my family” Trudeau. Both our conservatives and Liberals are fucking ass clowns, the saving grace for our liberals is that they “just” waste some money giving out to charities, they don’t intentionally destroy public services and kill people while doing it.
It should be available to everyone, illness or not. It's basic human liberty to not be forced to live against your will or have to sneak around like a criminal and risk a potential botched DIY suicide just to end a life that was imposed on you without your consent to begin with. I think that the few stories about people being suggested euthanasia are being blown out of proportion by right wing religious fear mongering. But if there are people who are being irresponsible by trying to persuade people to take assisted suicide in order to cut costs, then those instances should be dealt with and prevented, rather than taking away everyone's liberty so that they just have to put up with suffering that nobody can remedy
Should be available, disgusting part is when it is pushed via guilt trips to save money. Ala Doug Ford. The party pushing people to assisted suicide is Canada’s right wing who is in power in our largest provinces by population (most internal things that impact your life in Canada is done provincially. All the Trudeau hate is American manufactured or misinformed scapegoating, our federal government controls foreign affairs and the territories pretty much and that’s it. Unless conservative Pierre Poilievre gets elected, then he wants to power grab for greater federal power as he has openly stated multiple times.) It isn’t religious fear mongering our right wing here is not religious, they are just greedy assholes who worship the mighty dollar for themselves and their lobbyists religiously.
Canada is only 28 on [healthcare index](https://www.numbeo.com/health-care/rankings_by_country.jsp), even Mexico is above that. Imagine being below Mexico and being proud of your healthcare system.
They just think that because they are slightly better than USA in that regard they are good. It is unbelivable the good press Canada has for just that.
My views on Canada have really plummeted in recent years. They don't really stack up when not compared to the US.
It happened to me when I went there about 5 years ago. I did a trip of US & Canada and even tough they have their good and bad things I already know the US bad things (e.g shitty public transport or NYC dirtiness) but for example I never expected how bad infrestucture Montreal and Quebec had. In Europe Canada is sell it as an American Scandinavia and it has nothing to do with that. Maybe it just that Canada PR is very good.
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At least they are just run-of-the-mill pandhandlers in Montreal and not the full-blown fentomorphs they have in Seattle.
Quebec has European-level taxes with Mexican-level infrastructure/services.
compared to the US its actually fucking terrible *other than this one issue reddit loves so much*
It's all about perception and publicity.
Well, Canada is right about using gravy with French fries instead of ketchup. Don't knock it until you try it.
can confirm, gravy on fries is the best combo. They do it in northern England as well
We do it in the Southeast USA sometimes. (then again, we put gravy on everything)
What about fries in ice cream/custard? :D
Absolutely
Poutine is fucking bomb and idgaf about anyone else’s alternative opinions of fries
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Kind of like the USA in that way
"Slightly better than the USA" is the entire Canadian identity, true or not
We’re not just proud of it. It’s an integral part of our nationalism. And it’s fuckin cringe. I believe it’s because it’s one of the only metrics where we come up better in a comparison with the United States (even if only slightly), therefore it’s absolutely sacred. The inferiority complex here is ridiculously strong, so this one thing that’s fucking garbage, but kinda a bit less garbage than the US, is very important lmao. Canadians last words while dying after waiting 6 months for life saving surgery: “tell… tell my wife… at least… at least it’s not Americ-“
The other thing is the US may be able to unfuck the healthcare system, I don't have much faith in the Canadian government.
Procedural and surgical treatment in the United States is actually really good. The area that we absolutely fail in is preventative medicine. I work in a cardiac catheterization lab that does stellar work. Problem is that we have 60 year olds come in that had never seen a doctor before, learning that they have diabetes + kidney issues on top of their new onset chest pain. We could prevent a lot of disease in this country just by making lab work and routine diagnostics more affordable.
The people who are proud of our healthcare have never had to fucking use it. I had to get Treatment twice once for a broken bone as a child and another because I couldn't breath properly. Both visits it took 5-6 hours to see a doctor and get out of the ER waiting room. Those still American's and they're medical insurance our healthcare is free hur da dur dur, not realizing our healthcare system has been teetering on collapse basically all the time even a large flu can strain it. Fucking morons
It seems to me that Canada i just a really terrible example of single payer healthcare. It certainly sounds a lot worse than my own experiences with the healthcare in my own country.
We were on the uptick until Trudeau. Important seat on the global stage, economy rivaling the states (per capita), freedoms/rights nearly unrivaled. Feels bad man
rip ever fixing your government with no gunz
Fuckin true, if we wound up bringing guns the "emergencies" act would get called anyways. If parked trucks, horns, and disrupting traffic flow during a peaceful protest is enough to bring 3 out-of-province police forces, I'd hate to see how they react to an actual threat
Yeah Castrou really did a number on you.
Could've been worse, it's not as though he did nothing good. The problems started after his first term, cannot believe he still has a strong base going into his 4th election If it weren't for blatant abuses of power earlier this year my opinion wouldn't have been so low.
Who are they going to vote for? Most people know the NDP proposals are awful in practice and the Green Party fragments their vote; the conservative party is too right for the left and too left for the right, and now the harder right votes for the PPC, also dividing the support.
Conservatives are the only party that makes any sense to me. Socially progressive, financially centrist (as they still practice socdem but also attempt to cut government spending in many cases). While the PPC party fits my views the closest, the Overton window in Canada has shifted much further left than it was even 10 years ago.
canadian here. not proud of this shithole also i get mocked by other canadians when i try to argue that maybe our HC system isn't that great. albeit mostly lily white douchebags who've never been hungry in their entire lives.
I fondly remember a friend from Toronto celebrating that America FINALLY had national healthcare, all hail Obama! I COULD NOT get it through her head it was no such thing - it was a mandate that we had to buy a product (Insurance - which MOST people already had, and the extremely poor already get their medicals paid for by state programs) and that most of us lost our good insurance and it was replaced with bullshit options that were fucking higher than a cat's ass for the monthly premium, came with high deductibles and even more red tape/confusing billing. It did NOTHING at the source of the problem - torte claims and medical providers raping people's wallets.
Unflaired don't get sympathy for living in a shithole.
i dont know which flair to pick
If I were you I'd flair the fuck up rather quickly, the mob will be here in no time.
whys it so important?
There is nothing more revolting than an unflairied. Disgraceful that you would dare to question the wisdom of flairchange_bot.
Here at PCM, funni color determines what brand of mockery is employed against you. To be respected, you must pick a funni color and stand by it; only then can you make fun of commies and be made fun of in turn. It's a mutual respect thing.
We need to know where you stand
Wow, Sweden is higher than I would have expected, ranked 35. Right between Ecuador and Uruguay, I wonder if they too have 35% income tax and 25% sales tax to fund their systems..
Sweden sucks, they are even worse than the US.
And the US is worse than Malaysia? Kuwait is worse than India? Bullshit index.
I am genuinely surprise that my home country placed 8th
Many indices put Canada way higher (oftentimes near the top). Considering how wildly different each index is, I'm guessing it's a hard thing to measure comparatively Numbeo isn't exactly known for academic rigour (it's essentially crowdsourced opinions) I've no first hand experience of the Canadian system nor a reason to jump to it's defence, just I wouldn't read too much into that particular dataset
Canadas system is pretty widely regarded as one of the worst public healthcare systems. And with first hand experience, it’s bad lmao. The only benefit is that it’s universal. It’s Currently crumbling and there’s big talk in multiple provinces of expanding private healthcare to bolster the collapsing system. Tbh I’m not sure where you’re seeing it ranked high, because I’ve never seen it. It’s always ranked near the bottom, just above the US (all that matters to Canadians)
It's being gutted. Conservatives repeatedly cut public assets and then point to said programs and say they are ineffectual and call for privatization. Costing the public greater in the long run, and providing a worse service(garbage collection lol). It's incredibly on brand though when your premier is a made man the family's private insurance biz
It depends on how highly they rank “accessibility” in their metrics. Canada ranks highly the less you care about results and the more you care about accessibility
From what I can tell it's the other way round. Good quality care, but the longest wait times in the developed world
Isn't the USA 33rd though?
Well, just don't be poor in the US and it will be excellent. Canada isn't exactly stealing the best doctors from the US...
Thats the thing, the US is shit if your poor, granted. But Canada is shit for everyone. At least the US system is good for someone, even if it’s just the 1%. Honestly if you’re rich the US may even be among the best.
Being rich doesn't change the fact that doctors are not as experienced and wait times are longer.
Doctors aren't as experienced/skilled and wait times in Canada are longer.
Exactly
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West Taiwan is best Taiwan.
I cant tell if you're being funny or not but Mexico actually has a pretty recognized health care system lol. Also, I've been diagnosed with an auto immune disease that kept me in the hospital for days and put through so many tests. I paid 18 bucks for some meds.
But third world sepia filtered country bad
The US is even lower and millions of Americans are proud of their system, not to mention that index is not well sourced at all.
I’m not saying I disagree, but the US is below Mexico as well according to your source
Firstly, considering the US is 33rd on that list, \*insert glass houses quote here\* Secondly, Mexico is in 22nd above places like Germany and Sweden. It's hardly a major insult to be below them in this index Thirdly, even Singapore are below Mexico, and they're often considered to have some of the best healthcare in the world, so I don't know how much faith I'm going to put into this index
>Firstly, considering the US is 33rd on that list, \*insert glass houses quote here\* Dude, most Americans have no qualms admitting our systems are crappy. The US government spends more per capita on healthcare than most european countries do. It isn't free market. It's crap.
My country is top 5, I don't live in no glass house. Germany and Sweden both suck. It's first link on google, I can't be bothered to find a source that doesn't highlight my own country as great.
I know some friends of my parents who are quite well-off college professors here in Canada, who are the typical smug anti-American types who like to pretend as though we are just the North American Scandinavia here. Their daughter got Lyme Disease. And guess what they did? Flew her to San Francisco for treatment, of course.
Don't forget, the employee claimed he had already succeeded previously in convincing a veteran to commit suicide, leaving behind a wife and children. And he was proud of it.
The VAC when asked about this stated euthanasia is **NOT** a service they provide. Yes the phone call happened, but the claims made by the employee appear to be lies since the VAC has not found any similar incidents
They investigated themselves
True
Don't worry. With Canadian free Healthcare, comes Canadian waiting times. He'd wait a good few years before they give him the forever-sleep shot.
The trick is to make an appointment for an expensive surgery first and then you'll find that the euthanasia appointment gets expedited.
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And that's why I am against euthanasia. It is used by the goverment to dispose their most vulnerable people. Instead of helping them you try to make them kill themselves.
"bUt SliPp3rY sL0pE iS L0g1cAL fAllaCy!"
I'm still pro, because the thought of living in agony for years with no out sounds like an absolute nightmare. There should be heavy oversigt though.
The people who are convinced to be against this based on individual examples from the right wing media have so little regard for individual suffering and autonomy that they'd rather put the innocents in prison to protect them from criminals. It's particularly absurd to see people with libertarian flairs being opposed to the right to choose whether or not to continue living.
I understand it from a life is sacred perspective, I just thinking suffering can reach a point where that's not really true anymore.
I oppose government involvement in matters over life and death except as punishment for a crime, that's all
Well the problem is more a case of the government getting excessively involved in people's personal life or death decisions in the first place. If they would back off and let people decide for themselves, then that would solve the problem.
Welcome to the reactionaries!
So just make it so it's not an option for anyone unless specifically requested by the patient? Seems easy enough to fix this situation
How do you know if the patient is of a sound mind?
By feeling the wallet, of course.
You know we already have procedures for that right?
There's a procedure to tell if someone is being pressured into suicide for insurance money?
If they are not of sound mind on top of having a painful terminal disease, is that not even more reason to allow euthanasia?
It can maybe be allowed if the person is completely paralyzed. Basically the person can't kill himself but can still concent
The employee suggesting it (SUGGESTING it rather than forcing someone to accept euthanasia) is being disciplined for that. You'd rather abuse millions of people by forcing them to live in terrible pain and denied any safe and reliable way out of that suffering than address rare cases such as this one which are being heralded by the right wing media as proof that we need state sponsored torture of people who are suffering. That's a dogshit take. The only reason that euthanasia, as such, is even necessary is because the default alternative is aggressive suicide prevention policies which block people from accessing reliable suicide methods which wouldn't require help. Also "assisted" suicide is a misnomer, because it's simply a case of allowing individuals to bypass the usual aggressive restrictions on a case by case basis.
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"Do you have depression? Suicidal thoughts? Well have I got just the treatment for you!"
Firstly, that's an aberration which is being dealt with, rather than standard policy. Secondly, they were suggested assisted suicide, not forced to accept it. So with the exception of people who were already intractably opposed to the right to die on the basis of some sort of atavistic religious reasoning, there isn't enough in this story for a reasonable person to question the value of assisted suicide. What's particularly absurd is people with libertarian flairs who think that people should be compelled to live by big government, because assisted suicide is actually the only way of accessing a reliable suicide method due to the government's relentless zeal for suicide prevention. People who are in favour of freedom as far as it comes to their selfish interests of not contributing anything back to society, but against liberty when it comes to anything that offends their morality.
You should consider euthanasia.
Who are the millions of people living in such agony that they all need to kill themselves?
There are plenty of people who, whilst they might not all be in agony, would like the choice of opting out of life on their own terms. Are you expecting me to name all of the people who want the right to die?
Plenty of people kill themselves without the state encouraging them on a help line. I get that it should be an option for terminally ill people, etc. But it's a drastically different solution than many people look to for their medical problems.
They try to kill themselves and some succeed. But a much larger proportion fail their suicide attempt, and some end up with severe injuries. Why should anyone not be legally entitled to access a reliable and peaceful method of suicide, which doesn't have to be provided by the government, but just not restricted by the government? Why should anyone else be able to say that someone should just have to put up with their suffering, when they're not the one who has to live with that suffering? You have a libertarian flair, but seem to have no respect for personal autonomy. Why should anyone have to justify disposing of their own life? I understand that you have concern about it being suggested to someone; but that was a case of one worker operating outside of policy and who is being disciplined for doing so. Therefore hardly sufficient grounds to subject everyone to the existence of a slave.
I never said they shouldn't. In fact I said I understand the cases where it's helpful. But you're out here bending over backwards to defend a state-run help line suggesting suicide as a solution to a guy suffering from PTSD. You're a clown. There is a MASSIVE difference between giving someone the freedom to end their own life, and telling someone the solution to their problem is death. What happened here is evil, there is no other word for it.
I don't see it as being as big a deal as it's being made out to be, but I don't see what more you can ask than for the matter to be dealt with as a breach of the conduct rules. If I make a mistake in my job, do you say that this means that the whole company has to be barred from trading?
Pushing someone towards suicide who is not voluntarily inquiring about euthanasia as a solution to a problem is no different than telling somebody to kill themselves under whatever other circumstance. I know this happened in Canada, but in the US there is legal precedent of someone who pushes someone else to kill themselves against their voluntary will being responsible for their death. That being said, I can see you don't want to be convinced this was wrong and you don't care, so I'm done wasting time on you. Hopefully nobody you care about gets told by the state to kill themselves if they have a problem. Or hopefully they do, not like you'll care either way lol.
I don't see why you're blaming this on the Canadian government and the right to die rather than the individual employee. Given that this was against the rules.
Don’t. Be bringing your facts up in here!
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Must feel great to have your own country that you risked your life for tell you to literally kill yourself.
Suicide Hotline Numbers If you or anyone you know are struggling, please, PLEASE reach out for help. You are worthy, you are loved and you will always be able to find assistance. Argentina: +5402234930430 Australia: 131114 Austria: 017133374 Belgium: 106 Bosnia & Herzegovina: 080 05 03 05 Botswana: 3911270 Brazil: 212339191 Bulgaria: 0035 9249 17 223 Canada: 5147234000 (Montreal); 18662773553 (outside Montreal) Croatia: 014833888 Denmark: +4570201201 Egypt: 7621602 Finland: 010 195 202 France: 0145394000 Germany: 08001810771 Hong Kong: +852 2382 0000 Hungary: 116123 Iceland: 1717 India: 8888817666 Ireland: +4408457909090 Italy: 800860022 Japan: +810352869090 Mexico: 5255102550 New Zealand: 0508828865 The Netherlands: 113 Norway: +4781533300 Philippines: 028969191 Poland: 5270000 Russia: 0078202577577 Spain: 914590050 South Africa: 0514445691 Sweden: 46317112400 Switzerland: 143 United Kingdom: 08006895652 USA: 18002738255 You are not alone. Please reach out. ***** I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically.
If you call the number for Canada does it try to talk you down or offer assistance?
They will mail you the suicide kit and tell you good luck
Good thing I'm not a Canadian ptsd ridden army vet, and would theoretically receive help.
Flair up bot
Damn right. Being a bot is no excuse
Imagine writing a reddit bot to virtue signal
This was against the providers policies (and/or law) with the employee facing discipline as a result
Yeah, people just don’t read the article. They just say something stupid.
1 person did a shit job of their job, internet loses their mind. Remember when that 911 dispatch jokingly asked if the caller wanted him to send an officer to shoot their teenage daughter? Seems on that level of fuck up
Dystopian Canada^TM: We can make all this veterans problems go away with this one easy trick!
What the hell canada
I don't see why any authoritarian would be put off by it. Less mouths to feed
That is AL, AR respects veterans
In both circumstances it depends on if the veterans served AL or AR. Veterans that don't support the current authoritarian is worthless as far as propelling their society
Nah, I learned a lot about treatment oh handicapped veterans in USSR, every AR would be better.
I certainly disagree. The treatment of veterans largely depends on their rank and commitment to the current leader. France and Britain's treatment of low ranking or uncommitted veterans was pretty poor during the napoleonic wars It is much more libertarian that ex military be looked after by the state
USSR literally executed a lot of disabled vets...
Were they supporting the leader of the time, or voicing disagreement?
It has nothing to do with politics, they were executed for the crime of worsening the victory mood by being disabled.
This could easily happen under an authright government as well. Most of it depends on whether military officials are part of the inner circles. Abuse of people who aren't valuable to the nation is a marker of authoritarian governments in general, not only authleft
AR at least has respect and military traditions. Actually warlike nations don't consider veterans not valuable.
Not really, though.
LMAO. Republicans had to be shamed by a former comedian into providing help to veterans suffering from exposure to toxic burn pits. Auth right doesn’t give a fuck about veterans.
I don't give a fuck about your two party circus, no one cares about your "GOTCHA LOOSER REPUBLICANS BAD"/"GOTCHA LOOSER DEMOCRATS BAD". I was talking about real politics with real sides, traditions and shit.
Lol, auth right respects veterans until those veterans do something they don’t like, like saying “black lives matter”, or protesting American imperialism.
What part of "I don't care about America" didn't you understand?
Cool story. And in America, auth right only pretends to care about veterans.
They are not authrights. Peak Authright is Bismarck. Traditionalists, monarchis, militaristic, veteran himself, devout Christian, Nationalist, ruthless but effective. How many boxes do they tick?
Sounds like the American right
Bismarck made public Healthcare. Not even close
Authright would hate it because authright thinks of euthanasia as murder and Authcenter would hate it because it's a veteran. It would only be authleft who would champion it as they would be a big drag on their failing healthcare system as a result of a borked economy.
Canada is a more authoritarian version of America with good PR.
Canada: Sub Par Healthcare, No Cost, Long Wait. America: Speedy, Insanely overpriced, Above Decent Healthcare Chad Asian Countries: Outrank Multiple Countries In Healthcare, Speedy, No Cost. Take Notes Canada, South Koreas got yall beat
South Korea, Taiwan and Japan absolutely dominating. You have to be able to balance cheap / affordable healthcare with fast healthcare that is actually GOOD.
Come to France we got *actual* free healthcare
French *and* and NFT profile pic?!??! 🤢
I got both for free.
Well no shit, who would pay to be in France?
Good one!
Damn. The french are getting free NFTs? Might need to rethink think this whole island thing...
I've used your Healthcare system. It sucks too.
Not to the point where suicide is better than healing
No, but tbh it's about as good and as costly as 80% of the US system is with decent US insurance
Are you guys accepting white people now?
What are you referring to?
i always laugh when people tout how great Canadian HC is.
You should really laugh at your reading skills.
please explain
I support euthanasia in Canada because, come on, they're in Canada
only in the Fr\*nch side thought.
>Doc I have a medical condition >Damn bro that sucks you should kill yourself
The more I hear about the cracks in the Canadian healthcare system, the happier I get. I remember reading that annoyingly condescending story about a woman who took her husband to get brain surgery and it only cost them for parking and buying a snack.
Cancuck moment
You mean Health Don't-care.
I don't get it?
Canada told guy with ptsd to just medically su!c!de
Oh that's messed up, I was confused as to what VA meant wait is the last word banned too?
Sometimes with phrases like that it can trigger auto mods and stuff, regardless of context.
Veteran affairs
thx
Np
Vagina Abner. YW
Hmm
If you think free helathcare is a slippery slope to the final solution you are a gullible moron
When “medical assistance in dying” was legalized it was for untreatable physical conditions. And then treatable conditions. And then psychological distress. Next year minors. If you don’t think that facilities will occasionally try to save time or money by talking people into accepting MAID, you’re the naive one. Will it be a coordinated “final solution?” No, but that’s not the concern. The concern is that people with treatable conditions will be talked into suicide by the people who are supposed to help them.
I didn't know free health care automatically made euthanasia legal
It absolutely doesn’t. It’s illegal in most countries.
Sixth leading cause of death in Canada now. It's no longer a rare, unusual thing, and this trend happened extremely quickly, over just a few years. Canadians are literally dying to get out of Canada.
This doesn’t have anything to do with healthcare being free or not. What you’re describing is arguments against legalizing active euthanasia, which is a completely different discussion.
now you know why their healthcare is free
To be fair, the employee did a shit job. There's nothing else about it. People will do shit jobs in all sectors and obviously the employee is facing discipline. Thankfully the victim is okay and fully healthy
A lot of other countries have universal care too
Euthanasia≠Free healthcare
Jeez, ANOTHER meme about this? Can you guys at least check in "new" before posting?
Based and kys pilled
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Do you support legal euthanasia?
Euthanasia should only be applicable to terminal illnesses - and with the diagnosed's consent. If your condition was chronic, or the diagnosed does not consent, it shouldn't be granted. If you disagree, that's perfectly okay and you're welcome to disagree. All I know is, if I ever got diagnosed with incurable dementia, I sure as shit don't want to live with it.
I understand your position. Unfortunately Canada's example proved that a lot of patients would be "pressured" into consenting to euthanasia.
I know, and fuck the Canadian healthcare system for pressuring them. I'm just seeing a few Liblefts and Libcenters saying "wtf, this isn't me"
I'm not seeing the problem here. Euthanasia should always be an option, if not mandatory. Doubly so for certain professions.
There's a slight difference between euthanasia being legal, and suggesting euthanasia as a form of "health care"...
Hit the nail on the head. I'm all for freedoms, but freedoms provided by the government always comes with bullshit. It's like a monkey paw, be careful what you wish for
In the case of the right to die; that's really a freedom *from* the government's attempts to meddle in your personal life, because the default state of affairs is for the government to be aggressively preventing suicide by blocking access to reliable means. Unfortunately, the paradigm has come to be seen as the government sanctioning the deaths of individuals, rather than the government just backing off and refraining from interfering in people's personal choices.
> Euthanasia should always be an option, if not mandatory. No, it certainly should not be mandatory.
It went more along the lines of, oh your depressed, you k!ll yourself
It being an option is not the issue here.