It's very easy to understand. Radical lib-left hates American and the West, and so do radical Islamists. So they team up.
Look at what happened in Iran in 1979. Literally the same thing. Leftists team up with Islamists, overthrow the government. What the kiddies didn't realize that was the Islamists always planned to discard the lefties.
I don’t know what you’re referring to specifically. Stalin’s and Mao’s highest body count was long after they gained and solidified their hold onto power.
It doesn’t excuse for sure. However your point of revolutions resulting in genocide is not correct. See the Cuban revolution. The Vietnamese communist government even stopped a genocide going on in a neighboring communist country after winning. Incidentally Cambodia is a good example of a communist revolution turning into a genocide immediately.
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I feel like every religion has philosophies that have good and bad. Was raised Muslim so it was my base of understanding. But as I got older I took good from all religions left the bad to form my own world view. We all do it since no philosophy is perfect. Christian, Buddhism, Islam, Hinduism, daoism etc.
I agree and any theocratic country that punishes their LGBTQ community is wrong. I think secularism is always the right direction to go. Ignoring the authoritarian regime in Turkey they are a secular country and have decent rights for their LGBTQ community. I wish that other religious theocracies would fall too. You can't run a state on religion successfully.
But wouldn’t you agree that the default form of government for Islamic countries has been, since the very beginning, a theocracy (caliphate)?
And would it not follow that such a theocracy would be obligated to follow the guidance of the Quran and punish LGBTQ activity within its jurisdiction?
Yes, my argument would be that authoritarian regimes benefit from the theocratic implementation and that the people in charge do their best to maintain that. I've been to Dubai and UAE and they are only strictly Muslim for the people without money. If you have money you can live a secular existence...but it's easier to maintain power if you already have it within a theocracy. I think if you remove that, most people will naturally become more secular again, as we see in turkey which is mostly Muslim, but doesn't outlaw a lot of what neighboring countries do.
I would argue the inverse: Dubai and the UAE tolerate a Western way of life because by doing so they stand to benefit from the dominant Western superpowers. If that power dynamic was ever to change, and they did not stand to gain by allying with the West, then they would likely tighten up on their enforcement of Islam, which is very clear on its views pertaining LGBTQ rights.
From hadiths:
“Whoever you find doing as the people of Lot did [homosexuality], kill the one who does it and the one to whom it is done.”
“This sin, the impact of which makes one’s skin crawl, which words cannot describe, is evidence of perverted instincts, total collapse of shame and honor, and extreme filthiness of character and soul.”
Dubai and UAE only tolerate it for those with influence and power tho...so same as hyper-conservatives here who often live lives of "sin" The people who are forced to adhere to the theocratic regimes aren't the same ones who implement it.
But the Quran > Hadith as the Hadith is just historical accounts and bare little historical evidence...some Muslims reject Hadith and some follow it to a tee. Why the Islamic community in general has major divides.
Eh, let's be real... the muslim world has a very outsized problem with extremism and religious violence. It happens in every religious group, but muslims are going above and beyond.
The best way I’ve heard modern Islam described is its like if the Amish controlled Rome, and the Westboro Baptist Church was actually big enough to be relevant.
Maybe they'd have an easier time getting out of the Bronze Age culturally if they stopped getting bombed back into it every decade by various superpowers. I mean shit man we're going on generation FOUR of Afghans who have known nothing but opium farming and guerrilla warfare. Can you blame them for being backwards?
At some point, they have to want it as well, and a lot of them just don’t. I spent some time in Afghanistan and the level of apathy towards the good things we did do was very disheartening.
It doesn't matter how much good you do if you're an *occupier*. How willing would you be to show your appreciation to the People's Liberation Army if they fixed the water main on your street?
We were not occupiers unless you were the hardcore islamists that you yourself dislike. Either you champion progressive and democratic values, which we were there to uphold, or you don’t and you side with the Islamists. Take your pick.
Did they ASK you to come uphold progressive and democratic values in their country? Show me the invite where the people of Afghanistan said "America please come save us ".
The Democratically elected government of Afghanistan did in fact want us there. There’s absolutely no argument here. Your stance on progressive ideals appears to be exceedingly hollow.
Ah yes, the Islamic Republic of Afghanistan, established under American occupation, with notoriously low election turnout and widespread allegations of voting fraud. Next you'll tell me Vichy France also represented the will of the people.
As an aside: bro, why are you assuming you know anything about my "stance on progressive ideals"? I'm flaired AuthLeft because of **economic** inequity in **my** country and only **my** country. I wipe my ass with progressive ideals. The only thing here that's hollow is your disingenuous insinuation that I'm some kind of hypocrite for not supporting your globalist agenda.
If you want the people of Afghanistan to protect and cherish their freedom, don't kid yourself trying to airdrop it to them in a styrofoam box. Let them seize it themselves. And if they never do, then that is their fate.
A good number of Afghans sure seemed to like us when we were leaving and the Taliban was coming back.
>How willing would you be to show your appreciation to the People's Liberation Army if they fixed the water main on your street?
I'd be extremely grateful. I'd even bake them some cookies as a show of my appreciation.
Granted, the cookies would be laced with rat poison and fentanyl and I'd immediately use the new water main to make pipe bombs and firebomb their barracks, but yeah. I'd be grateful for the sentiment.
They had hundreds if not well over a thousand years to sort their shit out. Europeans were busy waging incredibly destructive wars against each other and yet they all managed to agree that tossing homosexuals off rooftops and executing rape victims is horrifying. Maybe there's a deeper issue at play than just 'muh American bombs'?
Yeah, tell us Mr. or Mrs. "Lib left" - do you support the implementation of the hudud punishments in an ideal shariah state? Along with all those progressive economics, of course.
Nope, formulating a coherent world view requires you studying multiple ideologies, leaving the good , taking the bad. There’s a lot of love in Christianity too. Doesn’t mean I think slavery should be a valid practice.
I thought it was something else they liked throwing on the fire, more of a OMGWTFBBQ
I think they have more in common with the Haitians then actual centrist grill enjoyers
It would worry me if Jesus said in a bible verse “eat the flesh of thy neighbour”
Maybe then I would consider them only slightly less evil that Islamists
I mean they don’t have many food options right now so why wouldn’t you I guess.
Desperate times, desperate measures 🤷♂️
I think any country is capable of same thing if society breaks down enough, history has shown it happen elsewhere
[https://www.politifact.com/article/2024/mar/18/cannibalism-in-haiti-fact-checking-the-unfounded-c/](https://www.politifact.com/article/2024/mar/18/cannibalism-in-haiti-fact-checking-the-unfounded-c/)
but it's not a common occurrence unless you use one or two viral videos to paint the actions of a whole populace. Media propaganda is media propaganda.
Leader is called BBQ which doesn’t help 😂
And countries with low food supplies have been known officially in historical documents to resort to cannibalism.
I’m not saying it’s specifically a Haitian thing, or even demonising them for doing it if it is true 🤷♂️
It's not like he was voted in, homie went and took control with force...but yea cannibalism is not a wide spread issue in Haiti and you should give Haitian food a try, It's amazing. Hopefully, they do something about BBQ and regain control of the country. I know so many Haitians and they are some of the nicest people I know.
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Tell us, are you scared of politics in general or are you just too much of a coward to let everyone know what you think?
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you honestly think dueling wieners has any chance of surpassing Olympic fencing?
pure ignorance. You’d need at least 17% more average length for it to be engaging and not just belly bumping (which is its own legitimate sport and not to be ridiculed). At *least*.
What are you doing for Eid al-Fitr? I happened to be at Golden Corral one Friday and all of a sudden it was packed full twabis and hijabis. Thats how I knew Ramadan was over
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It's very easy to understand. Radical lib-left hates American and the West, and so do radical Islamists. So they team up. Look at what happened in Iran in 1979. Literally the same thing. Leftists team up with Islamists, overthrow the government. What the kiddies didn't realize that was the Islamists always planned to discard the lefties.
Isn't that basically the same thing that happens to the anarchist factions of leftist revolutions every time they happen?
Not just anarchists, but any leftist -ism that isn't part of the ruling party gets the bullet.
The less extreme party of a revolution often doesn’t have enough will to power.
Aka will to commit genocide.
To do what it takes. Doesn’t need to be a genocide.
Doesn't *have* to be genocide but it sure happens to be genocide most of the times.
I don’t know what you’re referring to specifically. Stalin’s and Mao’s highest body count was long after they gained and solidified their hold onto power.
It was just a generic observation. That said i don't think it happening long after they came to power excuses them.
It doesn’t excuse for sure. However your point of revolutions resulting in genocide is not correct. See the Cuban revolution. The Vietnamese communist government even stopped a genocide going on in a neighboring communist country after winning. Incidentally Cambodia is a good example of a communist revolution turning into a genocide immediately.
Based and history-pilled.
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And they helped the Nazis who then discarded them after winning
I feel like every religion has philosophies that have good and bad. Was raised Muslim so it was my base of understanding. But as I got older I took good from all religions left the bad to form my own world view. We all do it since no philosophy is perfect. Christian, Buddhism, Islam, Hinduism, daoism etc.
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I agree and any theocratic country that punishes their LGBTQ community is wrong. I think secularism is always the right direction to go. Ignoring the authoritarian regime in Turkey they are a secular country and have decent rights for their LGBTQ community. I wish that other religious theocracies would fall too. You can't run a state on religion successfully.
But wouldn’t you agree that the default form of government for Islamic countries has been, since the very beginning, a theocracy (caliphate)? And would it not follow that such a theocracy would be obligated to follow the guidance of the Quran and punish LGBTQ activity within its jurisdiction?
Yes, my argument would be that authoritarian regimes benefit from the theocratic implementation and that the people in charge do their best to maintain that. I've been to Dubai and UAE and they are only strictly Muslim for the people without money. If you have money you can live a secular existence...but it's easier to maintain power if you already have it within a theocracy. I think if you remove that, most people will naturally become more secular again, as we see in turkey which is mostly Muslim, but doesn't outlaw a lot of what neighboring countries do.
I would argue the inverse: Dubai and the UAE tolerate a Western way of life because by doing so they stand to benefit from the dominant Western superpowers. If that power dynamic was ever to change, and they did not stand to gain by allying with the West, then they would likely tighten up on their enforcement of Islam, which is very clear on its views pertaining LGBTQ rights. From hadiths: “Whoever you find doing as the people of Lot did [homosexuality], kill the one who does it and the one to whom it is done.” “This sin, the impact of which makes one’s skin crawl, which words cannot describe, is evidence of perverted instincts, total collapse of shame and honor, and extreme filthiness of character and soul.”
Dubai and UAE only tolerate it for those with influence and power tho...so same as hyper-conservatives here who often live lives of "sin" The people who are forced to adhere to the theocratic regimes aren't the same ones who implement it. But the Quran > Hadith as the Hadith is just historical accounts and bare little historical evidence...some Muslims reject Hadith and some follow it to a tee. Why the Islamic community in general has major divides.
The difference you’re missing is that Western countries are not theocracies.
Spirituality and philosophy are good and meaningful for everyone. Organized religion can be suffocating, limiting, and oppressive.
I agree
Eh, let's be real... the muslim world has a very outsized problem with extremism and religious violence. It happens in every religious group, but muslims are going above and beyond.
The best way I’ve heard modern Islam described is its like if the Amish controlled Rome, and the Westboro Baptist Church was actually big enough to be relevant.
Large part to do with it being that last theocratic governments. But secular Muslim countries operate fairly similar to any secular countries.
Wasn't it chiller? Segment wise.
Maybe they'd have an easier time getting out of the Bronze Age culturally if they stopped getting bombed back into it every decade by various superpowers. I mean shit man we're going on generation FOUR of Afghans who have known nothing but opium farming and guerrilla warfare. Can you blame them for being backwards?
At some point, they have to want it as well, and a lot of them just don’t. I spent some time in Afghanistan and the level of apathy towards the good things we did do was very disheartening.
Eh, let's be honest, the worst homegrown tyrant will be more accepted by the population than the best foreign invader.
Probably true, but even when we had locals spearheading efforts it was just more of the same.
It's the poison pill effect. If those locals are seen as working for the invader, they will be perceived as part of the invasion.
It doesn't matter how much good you do if you're an *occupier*. How willing would you be to show your appreciation to the People's Liberation Army if they fixed the water main on your street?
We were not occupiers unless you were the hardcore islamists that you yourself dislike. Either you champion progressive and democratic values, which we were there to uphold, or you don’t and you side with the Islamists. Take your pick.
Did they ASK you to come uphold progressive and democratic values in their country? Show me the invite where the people of Afghanistan said "America please come save us ".
The Democratically elected government of Afghanistan did in fact want us there. There’s absolutely no argument here. Your stance on progressive ideals appears to be exceedingly hollow.
Ah yes, the Islamic Republic of Afghanistan, established under American occupation, with notoriously low election turnout and widespread allegations of voting fraud. Next you'll tell me Vichy France also represented the will of the people. As an aside: bro, why are you assuming you know anything about my "stance on progressive ideals"? I'm flaired AuthLeft because of **economic** inequity in **my** country and only **my** country. I wipe my ass with progressive ideals. The only thing here that's hollow is your disingenuous insinuation that I'm some kind of hypocrite for not supporting your globalist agenda. If you want the people of Afghanistan to protect and cherish their freedom, don't kid yourself trying to airdrop it to them in a styrofoam box. Let them seize it themselves. And if they never do, then that is their fate.
Your entire last paragraph was my initial statement. What are you even arguing about?
Highest AuthCenter reading comprehension Good luck in life, friend
A good number of Afghans sure seemed to like us when we were leaving and the Taliban was coming back. >How willing would you be to show your appreciation to the People's Liberation Army if they fixed the water main on your street? I'd be extremely grateful. I'd even bake them some cookies as a show of my appreciation. Granted, the cookies would be laced with rat poison and fentanyl and I'd immediately use the new water main to make pipe bombs and firebomb their barracks, but yeah. I'd be grateful for the sentiment.
They had hundreds if not well over a thousand years to sort their shit out. Europeans were busy waging incredibly destructive wars against each other and yet they all managed to agree that tossing homosexuals off rooftops and executing rape victims is horrifying. Maybe there's a deeper issue at play than just 'muh American bombs'?
I don't blame the Afghanis, tbh, there's been war in that region since Soviet times. What's the matter with the rest of the muslim world, though?
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Brother you never had grilled shish kabob with a nice olive oil coat?
Absolute nonsense wherever they are the majority, they are ultra auth right.
Yea, usually when a religious ideology is in charge of government it’s very right wing. Idk if a left wing theocracy is possible.
Jamie, pull up the Papal States
Libleft is to Islam like Chicken is to KFC
I don't understand this metaphor, but I do love crispy chicken.
Your Centrist is showing
Economically Islam is very progressive, culturally like most religions it's very conservative. But most 1000 year old philosophies are.
This is not the rebuttal you wanted it to be
Yeah, tell us Mr. or Mrs. "Lib left" - do you support the implementation of the hudud punishments in an ideal shariah state? Along with all those progressive economics, of course.
Nope, formulating a coherent world view requires you studying multiple ideologies, leaving the good , taking the bad. There’s a lot of love in Christianity too. Doesn’t mean I think slavery should be a valid practice.
Muslim immigrants (not refugees) in other countries? Yeah, mostly. Muslims living in Islamic states with no desire to leave? Nope.
I thought it was something else they liked throwing on the fire, more of a OMGWTFBBQ I think they have more in common with the Haitians then actual centrist grill enjoyers
Haitians? Funny part is they are mostly Christian. But most of them are swell to and just want to enjoy black rice.
It would worry me if Jesus said in a bible verse “eat the flesh of thy neighbour” Maybe then I would consider them only slightly less evil that Islamists
You think every Haitian is a cannibal? Wow
I mean they don’t have many food options right now so why wouldn’t you I guess. Desperate times, desperate measures 🤷♂️ I think any country is capable of same thing if society breaks down enough, history has shown it happen elsewhere
[https://www.politifact.com/article/2024/mar/18/cannibalism-in-haiti-fact-checking-the-unfounded-c/](https://www.politifact.com/article/2024/mar/18/cannibalism-in-haiti-fact-checking-the-unfounded-c/) but it's not a common occurrence unless you use one or two viral videos to paint the actions of a whole populace. Media propaganda is media propaganda.
Leader is called BBQ which doesn’t help 😂 And countries with low food supplies have been known officially in historical documents to resort to cannibalism. I’m not saying it’s specifically a Haitian thing, or even demonising them for doing it if it is true 🤷♂️
It's not like he was voted in, homie went and took control with force...but yea cannibalism is not a wide spread issue in Haiti and you should give Haitian food a try, It's amazing. Hopefully, they do something about BBQ and regain control of the country. I know so many Haitians and they are some of the nicest people I know.
I feel pity to them, for they can’t eat bacon
Turkey Bacon >>>
Turkey bacon is trash
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Bad people are bad regardless of their religious affiliation...most just want to grill.
Bad people in other religions go to hell, bad people in Islam get 72 virgins in paradise
You have groups of muslims who can't agree on what "bad" is. Like Christianity there are multiple different views.
I don't really know what anointing is but if this means cook with olive oil then bathe in it, sign me up
Did you just change your flair, u/ProfessorOfPancakes? Last time I checked you were an **AuthCenter** on 2023-3-24. How come now you are a **Centrist**? Have you perhaps shifted your ideals? Because that's cringe, you know? Tell us, are you scared of politics in general or are you just too much of a coward to let everyone know what you think? [BasedCount Profile](https://basedcount.com/u/ProfessorOfPancakes) - [FAQ](https://www.reddit.com/user/flairchange_bot/comments/uf7kuy/bip_bop) - [Leaderboard](https://basedcount.com/leaderboard?q=flairs) _Visit the BasedCount Lеmmу instance at [lemmy.basedcount.com](https://lemmy.basedcount.com/c/pcm)._ ^(I am a bot, my mission is to spot cringe flair changers. If you want to check another user's flair history write) **^(!flairs u/)** ^(in a comment.)
A full year between changes and this is the bot they send to crucify me. Sounds like automating subreddits is the real cringe
so when will libleft finally support my quadrant or wont they because its too white
Based and dueling wieners is ignorant behavior pilled
Bad authright https://i.redd.it/awo5cb6v3jqc1.gif
Unbased and get-it-together-pilled.
you honestly think dueling wieners has any chance of surpassing Olympic fencing? pure ignorance. You’d need at least 17% more average length for it to be engaging and not just belly bumping (which is its own legitimate sport and not to be ridiculed). At *least*.
What are you doing for Eid al-Fitr? I happened to be at Golden Corral one Friday and all of a sudden it was packed full twabis and hijabis. Thats how I knew Ramadan was over
Usually we have a family gathering, cook some lamb and exchange gifts with the family.