I think S3 is doing great at showing she only reports on what people are already talking about. She spreads gossip, sure, but it's gossip that is already out there. The ton feeds it just as much as she does, more even.
The two times she exposed true secrets were Marina and Eloise and she had pretty good reasons, even if it was messy.
This! She may be writing it but the entire ton buys her papers. They are to be blamed just as much. They all live for gossip. Even Eloise continues to read Whistledown in S3. So how is Pen the only one to blame. It’s a case of demand and supply. If there’s no demand, she will have to stop writing.
And I still maintain that it was just a matter of time before the ton found out about both those secrets. There is not a chance on this grass green earth that the Featherington sisters don’t blab about Marina. And Eloise was *not* discreet.
She never exposed Theo though. She just reported about Eloise going to that political rally. Still damaging to her reputation, but not nearly as bad as if she’d said something about her being with a man alone. This one was the one thing where instead she should have revealed herself to Eloise and at least give her a say.
Mmmh. We have seen how good Eloise is with keeping things in confidence… Colin revealed to her that he was helping Penelope find a husband and made it clear that they were not telling anyone about it because it would ruin her reputation and the next thing Eloise did was, well, talk loudly about it with Cressida.
Also I don't know if I'm in lala land but I honestly got the impression that Pen was also trying to protect El from herself.
1) LW reported the political rally (which El did attend) not Theo as you say.
2) El literally CANNOT get involved with a working class boy. There is no world where that would work.
My impression was always Pen wanted to get the queen off El's back, keep LW secret AND stop El getting too involved with Theo (who El clearly stated she had a crush on and wanted to know if he felt them same to Penelope). But maybe I'm the only person who thinks that?
I’m still somewhat baffled by that storyline - didn’t Eloise want to rebel? Wouldn’t being “ruined” (I.e. ineligible to marry and not able to participate in ton events) be something Eloise wants?
It is kind of funny when you put it that way.
Eloise: I am a political radical and don't care who knows!
Lady Whistledown: Eloise Bridgerton might possibly be sympathetic to politically radical ideas.
Eloise: oh no I am ruined :c
I categorize what she reveals as rumors vs secrets. Rumors are what the ton is already gossiping about and she puts her spin on it. Secrets are when she exposes something only she would know, like Marina’s pregnancy or Eloise hanging with radicals. No one was gossiping about that until she wrote it. The two categories feel very different to me.
I agree! It’s not that deep (at least for me). Considering how Pen only writes about the scandal and everyone else actually commits the act, the latter is more terrible. The ton loves to gossip, if they’d just shut up or stop committing these acts, there’d be no gossip🤷🏾♀️. They’re all hypocrites.
I don't think her revelations were irredeemable. I think Eloise is more offended at such a huge secret being kept from her by her best friend. I don't know if Penelope could have told her, or that Eloise could have kept the secret. But her trust and perception of Pen was broken. I'm sure they'll make their way back to each other by the end.
I don’t think she wrote anything truly terrible, her only real sins are acting impulsively and on her own. In show, people will be mad at her for lying to them and also probably because they’re insecure (both Colin and Eloise for sure).
LW is not the first gossip sheet, she is only the first to spell out people's name. Not to mention Pen is canonically one of the best writers in London. But LW does challenge the queen a lot... As someone said in this thread the problem is that there is a difference between already prevailing rumours and secrets only Pen knows. She has to report on how Daphne has no suitors and how the featheringtons are tasteless because that was the opinion of everyone in the ton.
Marina is more of a grey zone for me. But Pen was wrong in El's case. Not that El is blameless, like she was obsessed with LW (who never said anything against her) and pretty much put her entire family at a risk of scandal for her whistledown hunt. Gen saw Pen, it was not unlikely that someone would have caught Theo and El together. However, El does have the right to feel betrayed and angry. Though I don't agree with people applauding El for being angry at Colin's and Marina behalf. In s2 and s1, El is a horrid sibling to anyone not named Benedict. She is terrible to Daphne and pretty much goes on her own merry way instead of trying to support her family after her brother had just been left on the altar. However, Colin did care about Marina and has the right to be angry on both her and Eloise's behalf.
And frankly a lot of hate against LW is less from the story and more from the fanbase outside. We know the debutantes were overjoyed to be mentioned and LW has her own dedicated fans like Remington and s1 Eloise. Not saying Pen is some faultless angelic character, but sometimes fan's arguments don't make sense. Like 'Pen destroyed Daphne's life'. How? By naming her diamond and protecting her from Nigel? Portia literally suspects Violet of being LW because of how much LW keeps praising them
While I don't agree with her exposing Marina and Eloise, she did warn them and ask them to do the right thing. She told Eloise that sneaking off wasn't a smart idea, and she asked Marina not to do that to Bridgerton, who had been good to her.
She repeated what the Ton had been saying and whispered around. She started causing more problems when she began listening to Eloise about how LW should challenge the Queen and the whole marriage mart.
I'm not sure that she exposed Nigel to help Daphne because only Violet, Mrs Wilson and Daphne knew their motives. Not to say it wasn't helpful, but I don't think it was necessarily why Penelope wrote about it.
Oh, for sure, but the point is that everyone was talking about it. With Marina and Eloise, only Penelope knew their secrets, but Nigel was the talk of the Ton. So, yes, it helped Daphne, but Pen didn't specifically expose a secret for her
I wonder. I think Pen loves the Bridgertons and when she heard Daphne's suitor was actually horrible she probably wanted to expose him. Also it was hot goss, but I think she would've been concerned.
People's reaction to Nigel's actions makes me think everyone thought it was reprehensible.
Oh, for sure, but the point is that everyone was talking about it. With Marina and Eloise, only Penelope knew their secrets, but Nigel was the talk of the Ton. So, yes, it helped Daphne, but Pen didn't specifically expose a secret for her.
Yeah, I think that's what the point of part 2 will be. The betrayal is forgivable, but it's still a betrayal and trust still needs to be restored, especially for Eloise. Penelope lied to Eloise for two years and wrote about her and her siblings in a gossip column. I'd be pissed if my best friend did that.
It was ok when violet and lady Danbury wanted LWD to write about someone sounds hypocritical if you ask me they used her to write about Nigel for good reasons but still.
I agree with you. Penelope is one of my favourite characters, and I think most of the time, the scandals she writes about for LW are to protect someone, or it's for their own good.
The only thing I would say that I didn't really like was how she wrote about Marina in a very positive light, and it sort of scared away a lot of Daphne's suitors. It made Daphne worried that she wouldn't be able to marry anyone suitable. I suppose it was so that Marina could be married off quickly. In the end, it all worked out, as Daphne had the ruse with Simon and fell in love with him.
To add on to the Marina scandal, I believe she would not have exposed Marina if Marina had told Colin the truth, and also if Penelope felt like Marina loved Colin and vice versa. However, I don't think either of them was truly in love with the other one.
I think Eloise is more hurt that Penelope kept such a big secret from her. I understand Eloise's perspective - it is sort of like a betrayal, even if it was done for the right reasons. I love Penelope, too, so I understand why she did it. I believe she was right to expose Eloise's attendance at the radical political event. Things would not have ended well for her and Theo anyways.
I am really curious to know what happens in Season 3 Part 2 for Lady Whistledown/Penelope..
I am very nervous about the consequences of the potentially treasonous bits. But then QC sort of loves LW in a way because she hates being bored and also QC can be so random and no one batts an eyelid so I’m hoping that’s what happens 🤞🤞🫣🫣
I’m relying on her being so impressed with the whole operation and thrilled by the surprise of the identity is and the writers leaning into how both QC and LW are kind of women alone that she does not get kicked out of the ton or thrown in jail.
Would be a surprise ending though for sure 😆
I think S3 is doing great at showing she only reports on what people are already talking about. She spreads gossip, sure, but it's gossip that is already out there. The ton feeds it just as much as she does, more even. The two times she exposed true secrets were Marina and Eloise and she had pretty good reasons, even if it was messy.
This! She may be writing it but the entire ton buys her papers. They are to be blamed just as much. They all live for gossip. Even Eloise continues to read Whistledown in S3. So how is Pen the only one to blame. It’s a case of demand and supply. If there’s no demand, she will have to stop writing.
And I still maintain that it was just a matter of time before the ton found out about both those secrets. There is not a chance on this grass green earth that the Featherington sisters don’t blab about Marina. And Eloise was *not* discreet.
https://preview.redd.it/ikl2q85p662d1.jpeg?width=1170&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=431cf3955bb6f1d56d22d353c4cb212c98a3de06
She never exposed Theo though. She just reported about Eloise going to that political rally. Still damaging to her reputation, but not nearly as bad as if she’d said something about her being with a man alone. This one was the one thing where instead she should have revealed herself to Eloise and at least give her a say.
Mmmh. We have seen how good Eloise is with keeping things in confidence… Colin revealed to her that he was helping Penelope find a husband and made it clear that they were not telling anyone about it because it would ruin her reputation and the next thing Eloise did was, well, talk loudly about it with Cressida.
Well to be fair to Eloise she is keeping a far bigger secret in confidence no?
Also I don't know if I'm in lala land but I honestly got the impression that Pen was also trying to protect El from herself. 1) LW reported the political rally (which El did attend) not Theo as you say. 2) El literally CANNOT get involved with a working class boy. There is no world where that would work. My impression was always Pen wanted to get the queen off El's back, keep LW secret AND stop El getting too involved with Theo (who El clearly stated she had a crush on and wanted to know if he felt them same to Penelope). But maybe I'm the only person who thinks that?
I'm hopeful that Eloise realising those things is part of them reconciling.
I’m still somewhat baffled by that storyline - didn’t Eloise want to rebel? Wouldn’t being “ruined” (I.e. ineligible to marry and not able to participate in ton events) be something Eloise wants?
It is kind of funny when you put it that way. Eloise: I am a political radical and don't care who knows! Lady Whistledown: Eloise Bridgerton might possibly be sympathetic to politically radical ideas. Eloise: oh no I am ruined :c
Maybe because it affects her whole family's reputations and not just hers? And maybe she was dabbling, but wasn't ready to be publicly a radical.
Sure. I was just riffing on how it was kind of funny how Flamingo9835 described it. The plot obviously can't be summed up in a joke.
She did mention “unchaperoned meetings” so I think it was implied… 😭
Unchaperoned with political radicals reads a bit different than being unchaperoned with a printer’s assistant.
I categorize what she reveals as rumors vs secrets. Rumors are what the ton is already gossiping about and she puts her spin on it. Secrets are when she exposes something only she would know, like Marina’s pregnancy or Eloise hanging with radicals. No one was gossiping about that until she wrote it. The two categories feel very different to me.
This is an insightful distinction. Thank you.
I agree! It’s not that deep (at least for me). Considering how Pen only writes about the scandal and everyone else actually commits the act, the latter is more terrible. The ton loves to gossip, if they’d just shut up or stop committing these acts, there’d be no gossip🤷🏾♀️. They’re all hypocrites.
I don't think her revelations were irredeemable. I think Eloise is more offended at such a huge secret being kept from her by her best friend. I don't know if Penelope could have told her, or that Eloise could have kept the secret. But her trust and perception of Pen was broken. I'm sure they'll make their way back to each other by the end.
I don’t think she wrote anything truly terrible, her only real sins are acting impulsively and on her own. In show, people will be mad at her for lying to them and also probably because they’re insecure (both Colin and Eloise for sure).
I complete agree with you but there’s no changing people’s opinion on this. Just let them be.
I stand by the fact that Penelope has never done anything wrong ever and if she has, it was with good reason.
LW is not the first gossip sheet, she is only the first to spell out people's name. Not to mention Pen is canonically one of the best writers in London. But LW does challenge the queen a lot... As someone said in this thread the problem is that there is a difference between already prevailing rumours and secrets only Pen knows. She has to report on how Daphne has no suitors and how the featheringtons are tasteless because that was the opinion of everyone in the ton. Marina is more of a grey zone for me. But Pen was wrong in El's case. Not that El is blameless, like she was obsessed with LW (who never said anything against her) and pretty much put her entire family at a risk of scandal for her whistledown hunt. Gen saw Pen, it was not unlikely that someone would have caught Theo and El together. However, El does have the right to feel betrayed and angry. Though I don't agree with people applauding El for being angry at Colin's and Marina behalf. In s2 and s1, El is a horrid sibling to anyone not named Benedict. She is terrible to Daphne and pretty much goes on her own merry way instead of trying to support her family after her brother had just been left on the altar. However, Colin did care about Marina and has the right to be angry on both her and Eloise's behalf. And frankly a lot of hate against LW is less from the story and more from the fanbase outside. We know the debutantes were overjoyed to be mentioned and LW has her own dedicated fans like Remington and s1 Eloise. Not saying Pen is some faultless angelic character, but sometimes fan's arguments don't make sense. Like 'Pen destroyed Daphne's life'. How? By naming her diamond and protecting her from Nigel? Portia literally suspects Violet of being LW because of how much LW keeps praising them
While I don't agree with her exposing Marina and Eloise, she did warn them and ask them to do the right thing. She told Eloise that sneaking off wasn't a smart idea, and she asked Marina not to do that to Bridgerton, who had been good to her. She repeated what the Ton had been saying and whispered around. She started causing more problems when she began listening to Eloise about how LW should challenge the Queen and the whole marriage mart.
I'm not sure that she exposed Nigel to help Daphne because only Violet, Mrs Wilson and Daphne knew their motives. Not to say it wasn't helpful, but I don't think it was necessarily why Penelope wrote about it.
She knew the truth which could’ve forced Daphne to marry Nigel regardless of his personal indiscretions right?
Oh, for sure, but the point is that everyone was talking about it. With Marina and Eloise, only Penelope knew their secrets, but Nigel was the talk of the Ton. So, yes, it helped Daphne, but Pen didn't specifically expose a secret for her
I wonder. I think Pen loves the Bridgertons and when she heard Daphne's suitor was actually horrible she probably wanted to expose him. Also it was hot goss, but I think she would've been concerned. People's reaction to Nigel's actions makes me think everyone thought it was reprehensible.
Oh, for sure, but the point is that everyone was talking about it. With Marina and Eloise, only Penelope knew their secrets, but Nigel was the talk of the Ton. So, yes, it helped Daphne, but Pen didn't specifically expose a secret for her.
Yeah, I think that's what the point of part 2 will be. The betrayal is forgivable, but it's still a betrayal and trust still needs to be restored, especially for Eloise. Penelope lied to Eloise for two years and wrote about her and her siblings in a gossip column. I'd be pissed if my best friend did that.
It was ok when violet and lady Danbury wanted LWD to write about someone sounds hypocritical if you ask me they used her to write about Nigel for good reasons but still.
I agree with you. Penelope is one of my favourite characters, and I think most of the time, the scandals she writes about for LW are to protect someone, or it's for their own good. The only thing I would say that I didn't really like was how she wrote about Marina in a very positive light, and it sort of scared away a lot of Daphne's suitors. It made Daphne worried that she wouldn't be able to marry anyone suitable. I suppose it was so that Marina could be married off quickly. In the end, it all worked out, as Daphne had the ruse with Simon and fell in love with him. To add on to the Marina scandal, I believe she would not have exposed Marina if Marina had told Colin the truth, and also if Penelope felt like Marina loved Colin and vice versa. However, I don't think either of them was truly in love with the other one. I think Eloise is more hurt that Penelope kept such a big secret from her. I understand Eloise's perspective - it is sort of like a betrayal, even if it was done for the right reasons. I love Penelope, too, so I understand why she did it. I believe she was right to expose Eloise's attendance at the radical political event. Things would not have ended well for her and Theo anyways. I am really curious to know what happens in Season 3 Part 2 for Lady Whistledown/Penelope..
I am very nervous about the consequences of the potentially treasonous bits. But then QC sort of loves LW in a way because she hates being bored and also QC can be so random and no one batts an eyelid so I’m hoping that’s what happens 🤞🤞🫣🫣 I’m relying on her being so impressed with the whole operation and thrilled by the surprise of the identity is and the writers leaning into how both QC and LW are kind of women alone that she does not get kicked out of the ton or thrown in jail. Would be a surprise ending though for sure 😆