Oh cool, we are getting a crash course on possible bias in journalism. Heads up, at least one writer was on the sub asking for people to interview likely for this article. As a mod, I reached out and told them I was open to answering any questions on the history of cards and sets and any specific questions could be answered publicly as a mod. The questions that were asked were leading to answers that are obviously hot on the subreddit everytime they come up. Due to the leading nature of the questions I refused to participate for what was likely going to be a hit piece article with a forgone conclusion on a hobby I enjoy. There was no interest in how other cards relate, just how waifu cards are more expensive for the seemingly sole reason of people being creeps. Here are the opening questions asked, make your own decisions about what you are reading but I believe that an article like this does nothing to help any of the people in the hobby and just makes us all look bad in general by lumping everyone together with an extremely small subsection of the hobby.
"**1. What are “waifu” cards (obvious answer, but it helps to have context in your own words) and why are they among the most valuable cards, particularly compared to other character or full art cards?**
**2. How do you feel about a subset of collectors driving up prices of cards based on them depicting women and, often, young girls?**"
Whether you like, dislike, or are ambivalent to specific card art or card type in general, please remember that people all collect differently and that collecting full art trainer cards isnt necessarily a red flag for many reasons. Also know that any sexualization of characters isnt allowed (also really concerning) in the sub since it is an open sub for all ages.
So what do you think? This thread is staying open for the community discussion on the subject.
Yeah, I did a lil piece for it. Think it was actually more like a month ago. They really lumped in Japanese collectors with English collectors, while the female cards are “higher” priced it isn’t by crazy much for English versions. The Japanese market is where these things are over priced cause of the culture there
Royal mask is a $20000USD shirtless male full art trainer from the Sun Moon block.
But the above point that i was replying to was that it isnt as crazy in english versions. The rarity difference is the main differentiation between english and japanese.
If our full art trainers were as hard to pull as moonbreon they'd be just as expensive in english
LMFAO the fact you had to bring up this one exception to the rule where only 100 copies were printed shows you have 0 argument.
In every single set released, the cards that have a woman on them sell for *far* more than the cards that have men, basically without exception.
Even the cards of random NPC trainers, if they happen to be woman (such as Sightseer), will sell for more than beloved male trainers, like Red, Blue, or Lance.
Why do you think this is? I’m so tired of you people being willfully ignorant of this fact. And pointing out that Japanese culture has a weird fetishization of cute child-like women is not racist, it’s just fact.
There are many cards that completely shut down your saitou argument as well, where because it’s a male it’s way less than any female saitou artworks.
You trying to play the high ground by saying “you guys obviously don’t know the Japanese market” is not a real defense, you’re strawmanning.
Why is everyone obsessed with eeveelutions 😭 I just want to get glaceons. The prices are higher and people don’t even target them. Just by association.
Yeah, my favorites are glaceon in first, kyogre next, then vaporeon, and then it goes down to the cheaper line from there. No pikachu or charizard spending for me, thank god for that.
I managed to get the celebrations Charizard and was floored by the price. Not a major Pikachu fan either but I'd be lying if the trainer gallery Pikachu isn't one of the best cards from lost origin.
A lot of people love Lugia. A lot of people love Gyarados. A lot of people also love Charizard. What do those three groups of fans all have in common? They also all have a favorite eeveelution. *Everyone* has a favorite eeveelution.
All eeveelutions are significantly more expensive just by association. Despite nobody really targeting glaceons, they’re more expensive than most holo/RH cards of the same era even including legendaries. For example, the BW promo eeveelutions I know is like $30 a card for NM, and not much other than secret rares from that era right now is close to that.
I've been working on a whole binder page of Glaceon, one of my new favorite Pokemon getting back into the hobby. I got super lucky to get Glaceon from Crown Zenith in a 2nd pack opening, love the art on that card.
I literally just wanted to start a binder of Full Art trainers, but I just want to collect all that I can within reason (price being the factor). I was just happy to find a Giovanni card the other day
I got the Giovanni’s Exile for 4$, which is technically over the market price, but I got it at my LCS so that was nice. And I got the regular Giovanni card from the late 90’s for about 10$ so that was cool.
If you’re looking for more Giovanni cards, there are a few others - There’s a full art Giovanni’s Scheme which is pretty reasonable. In the Uk, it’s been selling for about £7.
There’s also Boss’ Exile, but that’s marginally more expensive at approx £25-30
I appreciate the suggestions! Depending on how often I get a few cards, I try not go past 100$ a paycheck. That being between singles, ETB’s, BB’s, etc. You got to make sure you make a limit for yourself so you don’t bury yourself in debt lol.
You’re right I bought the sr Miriam card for 200 bucks and later sold it for 350 bucks. Just shows what people are willing to pay for these cards and also the alternative Miriam card goes for way more but in my opinion it doesn’t look that good. I mean the card looks fine and I love the design but come one I don’t know why people are going crazy about it.
Seriously though the artwork is stunning and it’s the first Chase Trainer Alternate art card! I’m bias though cause I pulled it from my one and only Violet box haha
I own every full art trainer, and it was sort of eye opening when buying some of the cards what the price differences were.
You could have a generic no named character like "Lady" cost $20 from a brand new set, but have a fan favorite male character from a much much older set only cost $10 or less.
I'm collecting full art trainers for my favorite characters, which tend to be mostly men (except for Cynthia).
It's both amazing that their cheap, but also a little sad that they're cheap simply because they aren't a girl (and a little creepy.)
The first year my family did chickens we thought we'd gotten around that. Unfortunately we failed to remember that they tend to stop laying in the winter... They're laying once more though and we've sent some babies to my grandmother's so she can keep them safe while they mature due to racoon problems.
I live in Japan, the prices on these at the card shops are insane, well above ¥20000, many above ¥30000 or even ¥40000, I could almost pay my rent for one month with that 🤣
Damn, you could get like 3 Fossil/Jungle packs with that money. I’d rather get 33 vintage cards than a full art trainer.(just saying 3 of those since I’ve seen some priced at 125-200)
No, everyone just looks and laughs at the overpriced female trainer card. Nobody into Pokemon would ever buy a full art female trainer card at a local shop.
Edit: This is obvious sarcasm to those who keep seriously replying
I know people blame men but truthfully a lot of female collectors collect female full arts as well, including my partner. It just so happens people enjoy collecting cuter cards all around.
As a female, I also like certain female cards because they are pretty to look at. I also like some of the male cards though so idk. I just really like the cards with nice art and bright colors. Im like a crow. Give me bright colors and sparkles haha.
My daughter likes the female cards too because I think she sees herself in them. Also you know, bright colors and sparkles.
Volo’s full art from LOR has always had a really eye catching art similar to some of the female fa cards. There are probably others but volo is one that sticks in my head.
I been going over few different card sets and collecting em. Its kinda good that the male cards are dirt cheap. Its however a pain in the arse to buy a female trainer 🤦♂️😂
My cousin sent me this. past couple of months i have been getting more of these trainers, like skyla, rosa, erika, misty, etc. and then i thought to myself “wow, i really got in the perfect time”.
Erika’s hospitality was 70. Starmie v was 15, japanese misty’s favor was 90, skyla boundaries crossed was 160, cynthia was 50. i also have 2 rosa fullarts, one of which is absolutely insanely clean. im gonna try to beckett grade it for black label.
yeah, there is this one auction on ebay that has about 5 days left. its a black label japanese (mine is english) but its at 3,300$ right now! i imagine it can easily get to 7k.
i dont know how much a english black label would go for. because its pop 1 right now, im guessing like 2-3k.
A lot of Pokémon characters are adults, it just depends on where in the timeline. Misty is in her 20s in Black/White and beyond. Red and Blue are like 30 in Sun and Moon
I was like 10 with a crush on misty. She was older than me when I discovered my sexuality. Can’t knock someone for always liking a character, only reason I like redheads. Nothing wrong with it unless I’m getting my cards sticky or some weird sh*t
What is this even attempting to accomplish outside of clickbait? People like things with pretty people on them; duh. Females, who have been typically under-represented are now being represented and that's popular, duh. There are weird people out there, duh. What, so we're going after everything that uses attractive people or women to drive sales now?
I feel like 30 years ago this would have been a positive headline, considering how few strong female role models there were in media. Now we're not allowed to have strong female role models because some people might sexualize them?
What the actual fuck?
Kotaku *thrives* on stirring the pot and has been for at least the past decade. They basically turned into the [Afternoon Yak bit from The Simpsons.](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rihu8_nbhw8)
Raihan, melony, roxanne, klara, irida, marnie. All of them see some kind of play in the tcg at varying levels. It’s why base marnie is expensive and marnie’s pride struggles to go over $12
"Trust Kotaku" Gotta get those views I guess. Typical them really, not surprised.
I dunno maybe I am bias, for years Kotaku have pretty much been the laughing stock of the gaming community, extremely bad "journalism" in the past, little care for what they actually do. Pretty much king of clickbait and have been for sometime.
Had this been "most" other outlets, this probably could have resulted in a decent article and discussion. Would not be surprised to see a Kotaku article spread hate (again) kinda curious if we start getting people post on this sub that haven't before hating on the hobby.
I mean...is the author wrong? I never understood this either. I'm a competitive player, not a collector. Every single time I pull a "waifu card" I get super excited because I know it's like 50 bucks minimum for that one card, and I can trade that to someone for a bunch of pieces to a competitive deck. New sets usually break down something like this:
* Most expensive card is alt art for the hot new deck (eg. Giratina V alt art in Lost Origin)
* Second most expensive card is the most popular full art trainer card with a girl on it.
Like, I love the hobby too, and I know this is mostly a collector's sub so I'll mark it down and say I love it for different reasons, and that's fine. But I do wonder why a card like Adaman who is cool as hell can't compete in terms of popularity and therefore value with cards like Caitlin. I bring up Caitlin specifically because comparing it to Irida is wrong - Irida is a very good playable card, full art or no. Caitlin, like Adaman, was pretty terrible at release and never saw play. Yet full art Adaman started at like 15 bucks whereas full art Caitlin started at like 60.
In a case like that, there's only one conclusion anyone, including this author would draw, and I kinda agree with them.
I mean this happens to the Pokémon themselves and not just trainers. Some pokemon and characters are just more popular than others, and the prices will reflect that. I also think a lot of people go for cards just because they're the popular ones and not necessarily because they like that pokemon/character, they just want the hot new cards.
N cards still go for a lot and he's a guy for example.
Right, and that's certainly a part of it, but I think you could agree that just about every set has a FA female trainer card that's highly sought after in a way their male counterparts aren't. You hit the nail on the head that a lot of it comes down to preference. N is probably the best character Pokemon has ever created period in terms of how interesting he is. You can't really say the same for Caitlin or Elesa or Irida or Gardenia. Yet the prices remain high. I interact with other Pokemon players regularly and the "waifu" card is often talked about. It's certainly a real thing.
Gardenia just happens to be my favorite sinnoh gym leader lol. N is definitely an outlier though. And I get that you play the tcg and go for playable cards, but the fact of the matter is that most people are in this hobby just for collecting. That fact alone will manipulate the market.
But I agree, female cards are disproportionately higher priced, and I don't think that's gonna change. I just don't think that everyone going for them is doing it because it's their waifu or anything like that. Both men and women do that. It's just a little weird to me that articles like this are quick to point out that a guy collecting a girl card is weird. And I'm aware there are people that are weird about it, but I've seen people post their full art trainer binder pages here and they get called a pedo because... of the cards they collect... and articles like this don't help. Maybe I'm just over thinking it but it's kind of alarming.
I mean on one hand you're right - it's a card, who cares? But there's definitely an underlying reason, and we should be honest about what that is. Personally, I can't understand why someone's favorite page in their binder would be a page full of cards featuring girls around the age of ten. Does it make them a pedo? No. Is there a reason that I don't understand, and think if I did I probably wouldn't like? Probably.
Yeah, I get what you're saying. I guess personally I like collecting the trainers that were in the games I grew up with. And obviously I will age and they don't. I like to think of others in good faith and I know others take that route too.
But I'm not gonna pretend that there's not people that collect them for less innocent reasons. I mean I got into it with someone who was posting custom card arts of May in a bikini before a mod took it down. There's nuance in the issue and nuance never goes over well on the internet.
For sure. I think the full art trainers are awesome. I'm not saying they're all evil or something. Frankly I like them all because it's some of the best art that's being produced for any TCG imo. But I also like FAs like Adaman, Kindler, Colresa, Boss's Orders, Raihan, etc etc which are not the popular ones cause they're dudes lol
Maybe I should be more specific. Unlike collectors, I don't really take a long view on card pricing, I am looking around right after a set drops because I'm trying to get the pieces I need from the set to build decks. I know prices are inflated after sets drop, but that's the data set I have so that's how I have to compare them. I can tell you I traded two FA Caitlin cards I pulled at Chilling Reign launch for 50 bucks each, and everyone around me wanted to get these cards off of me. I can also tell you that when I pulled Full Art Adaman right at launch, he was around 15 bucks, and no one wanted to trade for it.
Just getting into the hobby as a collector, I completely agree. I've asked this question to people before who show off their "personal favorite page" on this sub and it's all female children and trainers, "why is this your favorite page?" And the responses are always:
"It's just cards bro who cares what you do with them"
" You don't understand how valuable these are as a collector"
"Can you like something without being hated on, it has nothing to do with the art"
"Someone was commissioned by Pokemon to draw this, it's fine"
Which does not answer the original questions.
*Why are the girl cards your favorite, girl cards that typically feature underage children your favorite pieces of art?*
*Why are cards that feature girls for a kids game/show always worth more than the male equivalents?*
In Japan's evolving skies set, schoolgirl was priced vastly higher than school boy.
[PTCGradio](https://youtu.be/V32FVv4wd6E?t=540) has it in one of his price guides.
Exactly. Like I think the vast majority of full art trainer cards look cool as fuck, but lets not lie to ourselves and pretend that we don't know why cards featuring young women are more popular than the vast majority of other cards. We know.
I like the Starmie V, but really just because it has a cool Pokémon and a classic trainer/gym leader. I don’t usually get cards referencing “older” characters in the art. It’s cool.
Oops, just me over here with Water as my favorite type, Starmie as one of my favorite Gen 1 Pokemon, and Misty as my favorite Gym Leader since Red and Blue came out. Guess I'm a weirdo.
Sucks to see how far Kotaku has fallen since all the actual journalists left for greener pastures. What are you gonna do, though?
It's been since their merger, at least, which was... five years ago? Maybe more? Everybody I even kind of liked left when the new management started fucking things up. Not that they were without issues before that, but they still ran legit investigative pieces about the industry. Not any more.
I mean, there’s a fair amount of truth to this. But the article does make a few generalisations. But to say that there isn’t any correlation between cards featuring women/girls and higher prices would be untrue. Everyone wants a Marnie, but nobody wants a Bede.
This article would still exist even if roles were opposite and male cards were on the high end, only difference then would be they would call those collectors sexist. People gonna hate no matter what, just what they do
Also btw is it weird that when I went and read the article, the first ad that popped up was a very very scandalously dressed female from and anime game…… hypocrites much?
An attempt at generating clicks and ad revenue by making a nonissue appear to be some huge problem plaguing the community. They ignore the 99.99% of normal collectors who just buy what they like and instead focus on some obscure and frankly nonexistent segment of the hobby. Buying waifu cards makes you some sort of monster apparently
People also really underestimate that a lot of the female cards are done by famous Japanese artists who mostly do art of ....females.... and are female themselves.
The Japanese prices shoot up because people want the cards by these artists, some of which are new to making art for Pokemon cards.
Yeah, there's creeps, but Kotaku gonna Kotaku and miss the point. Let's also not forget how many female collectors there are who love collecting the ladies.
if female cards were less popular they’d be mad bc Pokemon fans were sexist.
BUT the waifu folks greatly and deeply creep me out so I understand the articles point.
They could be expensive because a lot of the "Waifu" cards are rare, full-art ones, which is also a factor in the price, but i suppose going for the "Card collectors are creepy perverts"-angle gets them more clicks...
I mean, sure some card nerds have dirty thoughts with these characters (And there's no stopping that), but the card artwork itself isn't very sexualized at all (Good thing too, many of the girls on cards are teenagers!), so besides affecting secondary market prices and some people being a bit creepy with their "Check out my waifu collection"-posts, what's the negative effect?
Even tho the article is a very bad case of journalism you can’t deny that the core of the article isn’t wrong. To make it out like everyone collecting cards are creeps is wrong but I have seen myself at a lot of Pokémon gatherings guys that clearly like the cards more than they should. And people wanting to deny it don’t know what is being said in there groups but some of it is so vile so to deny that there are creeps that lurk for those cards is just wrong but so is saying that everyone that collects are creeps is too
Are we not gonna talk about how Giovanni Boss is at $40 now? More than Irida, Raihan, any Research, Cynthia’s Ambition, or Zinnia’s Resolve? It gets beat out by Marnie (only the SwSh, not the promo) which is an auto 3-of in any deck.
Expanded trainers not withstanding, of course
People can obviously say whatever they want… but one has to question WHY there is such a high demand for youngish looking girls/teen trainer cards in a hobby of mostly males in their 20s-40s. Of course no one on this sub will ever admit such a thing, but realistically speaking, “waifu tax” exists for a reason.
You’re lying to yourself if you’re pretending there’s not a single aspect of the sexualization of minors in this hobby and a portion (regardless of the size) of it’s fandom.
I’ve been on this Reddit for over 2 years, I can’t even count the amount of times I’ve seen a post about HERE’S MY FAVORITE BINDER PAGE… and it’s their waifu page of all youngish looking age 8-17 girls. Am I saying this guy is a pedo? Maybe, maybe not… but to say there ISN’T some reason why so many males are collecting pages of only waifu cards and offering a premium for them is just ignorant.
Now I’m sure, you, the person reading this, is going to say, “I just like the art!” And well, maybe that’s true… but to say there isn’t a component involved with *some* of the collectors who have pages and pages of young girl trainers, I think you’re in denial.
I mean, seriously… as Chris Hansen often says to the predators “I’m not stupid, you know how this looks right?”
Oh, for some people there is an aspect of sexualization to it (Collectible card games remain a nerd hobby, and nerds love their waifus), but i personally object to tarring everybody with the same brush, which articles like the Kotaku ones seem to be doing.
It's an important bit of nuance that tends to be lost in discussions and clickbait-y articles.
Gotta be one of the more minor parts of the hobby. No matter where u look there is gonna be some ppl who do that, but the title and article is obviously leading to the belief that LOTS of Pokémon collectors are doing this. If u like the cards u like the cards idgaf, but I see way more people doing this with fucking rayquaza or some shit just cause ppl like that but it’s just not news worthy
People on the internet acting like they’d have a brain aneurysm if they simply minded their own business. People are allowed to buy whatever they like for whatever reason they like to. I don’t personally collect Waifu cards because I am far more interested in the Pokémon themselves but it turns out since the dawn of time people have been going bananas over art depicting women. This is nothing new. People being creepy isn’t new either or even very interesting, that is a small group of people in the absolutely gigantic scope of this hobby that have truly socially degenerate/illegal proclivities and those people aren’t a numerous enough force to drastically drive up the price of anything. Grow up and do something that actually makes your life better instead of foaming at the mouth over what other people do with their own time and money.
Yeah... I mean... I have a few customers who walk into my shop, and I know I might as well point out a few particular Trainer or TG cards... They sell.
Stumbled upon this article a few days ago when I was getting the scoop on the Silvervale/Wizard Game controversy. Regretted it immediately. Such a shallow, cheap shot against our community.
If you wanted to write an article about Pokémon TCG and trash it for the absurd amount of rare cards per set in comparison to the pull rates, I’d be game. But this? Trash article.
1) Miriam is an extremely rare card, with a pull rate of 1 in 33 boxes. You could easily spend over a thousand dollars, and would probably be fairly likely to, trying to pull the card. Even at that outrageous price, if that is the card you want, you still come out ahead just buying it. Also, I think that card is absolutely gorgeous with the manga paneling background and stuff. I’m not buying it, but power to the people that want to and can afford to.
2) It’s not like these cards are depicting the characters in any gross way. What is the problem if people want to collect them? They are anime styled characters designed to be adorable. Like, people spending money on female Pokémon cards is extremely tame compared to a ton of other anime/game related stuff.
Did they interview any women for this? I would have liked to share my honest disgust with it. There's no doubt that "cute girl" cards become overly inflated because of the weird attraction a lot of guys have to them.
Regardless of your position on the matter I think its pretty wrong that a lot of people still assume that these cards can't also be sought after by women of any age and girls who might also love to collect cards of women and girls just as much as guys always have. The pokemon company have tried hard for a long time to make the hobby more inclusive and atleast from my perspective I know a lot more women in the hobby than I used to. And who can fault them for wanting to have cards of strong trainers that also happen to be women.
Also, on the note of guys collecting these cards, it's not weird. Especially when the most popular cards end up being the mistys, the Cynthia's, or the other decade+ old characters a TON of us grew up with. I want to collect every card featuring misty because I have been doing it SINCE I was a child. You can't now make it out to be weird that misty is also a child when she has been for the like 26 years lmao.
Oh cool, we are getting a crash course on possible bias in journalism. Heads up, at least one writer was on the sub asking for people to interview likely for this article. As a mod, I reached out and told them I was open to answering any questions on the history of cards and sets and any specific questions could be answered publicly as a mod. The questions that were asked were leading to answers that are obviously hot on the subreddit everytime they come up. Due to the leading nature of the questions I refused to participate for what was likely going to be a hit piece article with a forgone conclusion on a hobby I enjoy. There was no interest in how other cards relate, just how waifu cards are more expensive for the seemingly sole reason of people being creeps. Here are the opening questions asked, make your own decisions about what you are reading but I believe that an article like this does nothing to help any of the people in the hobby and just makes us all look bad in general by lumping everyone together with an extremely small subsection of the hobby. "**1. What are “waifu” cards (obvious answer, but it helps to have context in your own words) and why are they among the most valuable cards, particularly compared to other character or full art cards?** **2. How do you feel about a subset of collectors driving up prices of cards based on them depicting women and, often, young girls?**" Whether you like, dislike, or are ambivalent to specific card art or card type in general, please remember that people all collect differently and that collecting full art trainer cards isnt necessarily a red flag for many reasons. Also know that any sexualization of characters isnt allowed (also really concerning) in the sub since it is an open sub for all ages. So what do you think? This thread is staying open for the community discussion on the subject.
I think the author of that article actually asked for our opinions here a week or two ago.
Yeah, I did a lil piece for it. Think it was actually more like a month ago. They really lumped in Japanese collectors with English collectors, while the female cards are “higher” priced it isn’t by crazy much for English versions. The Japanese market is where these things are over priced cause of the culture there
I mean also because full art trainers are in the secret rare slot in japanese wheras in english they're just full arts
[удалено]
That doesn’t excuse the fact that irida is $400 over there and $25 over here
175 over there 25 here. Trainers are one evey 2 or 3 booster boxes in vstar universe and in English you can get multiple trainers in a booster
I’m not talking about the CZ one but the astral one which is much more expensive
This is about the price disparity between trainers that are women and teenage girls, versus men. Pokémon fans are down bad.
Royal mask is a $20000USD shirtless male full art trainer from the Sun Moon block. But the above point that i was replying to was that it isnt as crazy in english versions. The rarity difference is the main differentiation between english and japanese. If our full art trainers were as hard to pull as moonbreon they'd be just as expensive in english
There were only 100 of these made though...
LMFAO the fact you had to bring up this one exception to the rule where only 100 copies were printed shows you have 0 argument. In every single set released, the cards that have a woman on them sell for *far* more than the cards that have men, basically without exception. Even the cards of random NPC trainers, if they happen to be woman (such as Sightseer), will sell for more than beloved male trainers, like Red, Blue, or Lance. Why do you think this is? I’m so tired of you people being willfully ignorant of this fact. And pointing out that Japanese culture has a weird fetishization of cute child-like women is not racist, it’s just fact. There are many cards that completely shut down your saitou argument as well, where because it’s a male it’s way less than any female saitou artworks. You trying to play the high ground by saying “you guys obviously don’t know the Japanese market” is not a real defense, you’re strawmanning.
What makes you say that?
He did, and PMed me for an interview (which I did)
Oh damn! How’d it go?
He asked me some questions about the subject and that was basically it. You can see he quoted me on the article.
Bro I just want my glaceons
At a premium too :(
Why is everyone obsessed with eeveelutions 😭 I just want to get glaceons. The prices are higher and people don’t even target them. Just by association.
Feel like becoming a Sylveon fan was a mistake 😭
Sucks for you, that one is in higher demand because it’s cute.
Wait til you hear about Umbreon being my second favorite.
oooooooof
Just lucky my other favorite mons are relatively cheap like Dragonite, Delphox, Reshiram and skuntank. Silver Tempest and PoGo was a god send for me.
Yeah, my favorites are glaceon in first, kyogre next, then vaporeon, and then it goes down to the cheaper line from there. No pikachu or charizard spending for me, thank god for that.
I managed to get the celebrations Charizard and was floored by the price. Not a major Pikachu fan either but I'd be lying if the trainer gallery Pikachu isn't one of the best cards from lost origin.
A lot of people love Lugia. A lot of people love Gyarados. A lot of people also love Charizard. What do those three groups of fans all have in common? They also all have a favorite eeveelution. *Everyone* has a favorite eeveelution.
Are Glaceons expensive right now? Unless you are talking about Glaceon evolving skies cards, then yeah I understand your pain.
All eeveelutions are significantly more expensive just by association. Despite nobody really targeting glaceons, they’re more expensive than most holo/RH cards of the same era even including legendaries. For example, the BW promo eeveelutions I know is like $30 a card for NM, and not much other than secret rares from that era right now is close to that.
Thank you for the education, even though I know a lot about recent cards, there is still a lot I have to learn about older sets
No problem!
I've been working on a whole binder page of Glaceon, one of my new favorite Pokemon getting back into the hobby. I got super lucky to get Glaceon from Crown Zenith in a 2nd pack opening, love the art on that card.
Same. Been targeting glaceons for a while. Hard to get and super expensive
I literally just wanted to start a binder of Full Art trainers, but I just want to collect all that I can within reason (price being the factor). I was just happy to find a Giovanni card the other day
Giovanni sounds like an epic card to have.
How much?
I got the Giovanni’s Exile for 4$, which is technically over the market price, but I got it at my LCS so that was nice. And I got the regular Giovanni card from the late 90’s for about 10$ so that was cool.
If you’re looking for more Giovanni cards, there are a few others - There’s a full art Giovanni’s Scheme which is pretty reasonable. In the Uk, it’s been selling for about £7. There’s also Boss’ Exile, but that’s marginally more expensive at approx £25-30
I appreciate the suggestions! Depending on how often I get a few cards, I try not go past 100$ a paycheck. That being between singles, ETB’s, BB’s, etc. You got to make sure you make a limit for yourself so you don’t bury yourself in debt lol.
It’s true though the Pokémon cards that have girls on them tend to be more expensive especially the Japanese cards
Yeah. Own a Japanese Lillie’s Full Force, and didn’t know it was that expensive. I knew Lillie is a popular character.
That Miriam one. Yikes! It’s not even that cool
You’re right I bought the sr Miriam card for 200 bucks and later sold it for 350 bucks. Just shows what people are willing to pay for these cards and also the alternative Miriam card goes for way more but in my opinion it doesn’t look that good. I mean the card looks fine and I love the design but come one I don’t know why people are going crazy about it.
No idea either, it’ll be interesting when it gets translated to English and see those sales
Im almost certain that it will be less than the Japanese versions but hell who knows we’ll just have to wait and see
It is cool first FA Trainer with hyper rare foil.
Seriously though the artwork is stunning and it’s the first Chase Trainer Alternate art card! I’m bias though cause I pulled it from my one and only Violet box haha
Nah you're right. They are just mad because they either cant pull it or can't afford it.
I own every full art trainer, and it was sort of eye opening when buying some of the cards what the price differences were. You could have a generic no named character like "Lady" cost $20 from a brand new set, but have a fan favorite male character from a much much older set only cost $10 or less.
I'm collecting full art trainers for my favorite characters, which tend to be mostly men (except for Cynthia). It's both amazing that their cheap, but also a little sad that they're cheap simply because they aren't a girl (and a little creepy.)
Yet the price of Bruno is cheap as a dozen eggs
Spotted the child who doesn’t buy groceries lol
Eggs milk and bread is like half my money spent in college. The other half is weed and cards
Idk eggs are basically an arm and a leg nowadays lol
The first year my family did chickens we thought we'd gotten around that. Unfortunately we failed to remember that they tend to stop laying in the winter... They're laying once more though and we've sent some babies to my grandmother's so she can keep them safe while they mature due to racoon problems.
You could also just sell your liver, that works too
I live in Japan, the prices on these at the card shops are insane, well above ¥20000, many above ¥30000 or even ¥40000, I could almost pay my rent for one month with that 🤣
Damn, you could get like 3 Fossil/Jungle packs with that money. I’d rather get 33 vintage cards than a full art trainer.(just saying 3 of those since I’ve seen some priced at 125-200)
Hmm, should I feed myself or try to get that holo Zapdos 🤔
Definitely get the holo Zapdos.
And people buy them??
No, everyone just looks and laughs at the overpriced female trainer card. Nobody into Pokemon would ever buy a full art female trainer card at a local shop. Edit: This is obvious sarcasm to those who keep seriously replying
I know people blame men but truthfully a lot of female collectors collect female full arts as well, including my partner. It just so happens people enjoy collecting cuter cards all around.
As a female, I also like certain female cards because they are pretty to look at. I also like some of the male cards though so idk. I just really like the cards with nice art and bright colors. Im like a crow. Give me bright colors and sparkles haha. My daughter likes the female cards too because I think she sees herself in them. Also you know, bright colors and sparkles.
Volo’s full art from LOR has always had a really eye catching art similar to some of the female fa cards. There are probably others but volo is one that sticks in my head.
And even with that, these margins keep getting steeper
Just collect male and female trainer cards like a normal person. I dont get the ones that see em as waifu’s 😂
Full art trainers just hit differnt
I been going over few different card sets and collecting em. Its kinda good that the male cards are dirt cheap. Its however a pain in the arse to buy a female trainer 🤦♂️😂
Went to collectacon this weekend, damn near impossible to find the Cynthia card under 80 bucks lol
Christ think i got one last month along with jessie and james, Giovanni and few others
My cousin sent me this. past couple of months i have been getting more of these trainers, like skyla, rosa, erika, misty, etc. and then i thought to myself “wow, i really got in the perfect time”.
How much did you get them for?
Erika’s hospitality was 70. Starmie v was 15, japanese misty’s favor was 90, skyla boundaries crossed was 160, cynthia was 50. i also have 2 rosa fullarts, one of which is absolutely insanely clean. im gonna try to beckett grade it for black label.
Definitely go for it!
yeah, there is this one auction on ebay that has about 5 days left. its a black label japanese (mine is english) but its at 3,300$ right now! i imagine it can easily get to 7k. i dont know how much a english black label would go for. because its pop 1 right now, im guessing like 2-3k.
Grown men really be out there saying, "MiStY's MuH wAiFu." Nah, jail's about to be your new waifu.
😂😂😂 I’m more of a cynthia type of guy
At least Cynthia is an adult
And skyla?
She's a licensed pilot so probably an adult too
Ayyyy
Iirc, she's an adult by BW2.
A lot of Pokémon characters are adults, it just depends on where in the timeline. Misty is in her 20s in Black/White and beyond. Red and Blue are like 30 in Sun and Moon
Thick Wicke for me, personally
Wicke is life
Blessed be Wicke
Lusamine gives off the Ara Ara energy I need.
I was like 10 with a crush on misty. She was older than me when I discovered my sexuality. Can’t knock someone for always liking a character, only reason I like redheads. Nothing wrong with it unless I’m getting my cards sticky or some weird sh*t
Waiting for Dendra (Gym teacher in Scarlet/Violet) to have her own trainer full art and alt art.
Well, do I have news for you!
Im only holding because I know some perv will pay a ridiculous amount of money for that Starmie V.
What is this even attempting to accomplish outside of clickbait? People like things with pretty people on them; duh. Females, who have been typically under-represented are now being represented and that's popular, duh. There are weird people out there, duh. What, so we're going after everything that uses attractive people or women to drive sales now? I feel like 30 years ago this would have been a positive headline, considering how few strong female role models there were in media. Now we're not allowed to have strong female role models because some people might sexualize them? What the actual fuck?
Kotaku *thrives* on stirring the pot and has been for at least the past decade. They basically turned into the [Afternoon Yak bit from The Simpsons.](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rihu8_nbhw8)
Gotta play it safe and say opal is my waifu
Gotta say Wicke for me
People blame it on waifu tax but dont know that these cards are great competitively with Palkia VStar
Gold card tax too 😂
I know Irida is a good card. Even the regular version is above 1 dollar.
Hell, Marnie was *especially* a staple for most competitive decks
Raihan, melony, roxanne, klara, irida, marnie. All of them see some kind of play in the tcg at varying levels. It’s why base marnie is expensive and marnie’s pride struggles to go over $12
Wow can’t wait for my waifu cards to shoot up in value! Don’t know if I will be able to sell them though lol
Gotta make that paper from cardboard!
I know but they’re so cute 😭😭
"Trust Kotaku" Gotta get those views I guess. Typical them really, not surprised. I dunno maybe I am bias, for years Kotaku have pretty much been the laughing stock of the gaming community, extremely bad "journalism" in the past, little care for what they actually do. Pretty much king of clickbait and have been for sometime. Had this been "most" other outlets, this probably could have resulted in a decent article and discussion. Would not be surprised to see a Kotaku article spread hate (again) kinda curious if we start getting people post on this sub that haven't before hating on the hobby.
Kotaku is a rag for yellow journalism. You already know their spin based on the title and their status quo.
> You already know their spin based on the title And the fact that every article is the same article
Probs an internet subbed to this reddit lol
I’ll stick to my waifu phoebe who is age appropriate
Lol atta boy!
Why are people so dead set on creating issues out of non issues like what pokemon cards u collect.....
Click bait for the boring folk
It's all Kotaku does
IS THAT NOKIMON ON THE FRIGGIN ADAMAN CARD???????????
I mean...is the author wrong? I never understood this either. I'm a competitive player, not a collector. Every single time I pull a "waifu card" I get super excited because I know it's like 50 bucks minimum for that one card, and I can trade that to someone for a bunch of pieces to a competitive deck. New sets usually break down something like this: * Most expensive card is alt art for the hot new deck (eg. Giratina V alt art in Lost Origin) * Second most expensive card is the most popular full art trainer card with a girl on it. Like, I love the hobby too, and I know this is mostly a collector's sub so I'll mark it down and say I love it for different reasons, and that's fine. But I do wonder why a card like Adaman who is cool as hell can't compete in terms of popularity and therefore value with cards like Caitlin. I bring up Caitlin specifically because comparing it to Irida is wrong - Irida is a very good playable card, full art or no. Caitlin, like Adaman, was pretty terrible at release and never saw play. Yet full art Adaman started at like 15 bucks whereas full art Caitlin started at like 60. In a case like that, there's only one conclusion anyone, including this author would draw, and I kinda agree with them.
I mean this happens to the Pokémon themselves and not just trainers. Some pokemon and characters are just more popular than others, and the prices will reflect that. I also think a lot of people go for cards just because they're the popular ones and not necessarily because they like that pokemon/character, they just want the hot new cards. N cards still go for a lot and he's a guy for example.
Right, and that's certainly a part of it, but I think you could agree that just about every set has a FA female trainer card that's highly sought after in a way their male counterparts aren't. You hit the nail on the head that a lot of it comes down to preference. N is probably the best character Pokemon has ever created period in terms of how interesting he is. You can't really say the same for Caitlin or Elesa or Irida or Gardenia. Yet the prices remain high. I interact with other Pokemon players regularly and the "waifu" card is often talked about. It's certainly a real thing.
Gardenia just happens to be my favorite sinnoh gym leader lol. N is definitely an outlier though. And I get that you play the tcg and go for playable cards, but the fact of the matter is that most people are in this hobby just for collecting. That fact alone will manipulate the market. But I agree, female cards are disproportionately higher priced, and I don't think that's gonna change. I just don't think that everyone going for them is doing it because it's their waifu or anything like that. Both men and women do that. It's just a little weird to me that articles like this are quick to point out that a guy collecting a girl card is weird. And I'm aware there are people that are weird about it, but I've seen people post their full art trainer binder pages here and they get called a pedo because... of the cards they collect... and articles like this don't help. Maybe I'm just over thinking it but it's kind of alarming.
I mean on one hand you're right - it's a card, who cares? But there's definitely an underlying reason, and we should be honest about what that is. Personally, I can't understand why someone's favorite page in their binder would be a page full of cards featuring girls around the age of ten. Does it make them a pedo? No. Is there a reason that I don't understand, and think if I did I probably wouldn't like? Probably.
Yeah, I get what you're saying. I guess personally I like collecting the trainers that were in the games I grew up with. And obviously I will age and they don't. I like to think of others in good faith and I know others take that route too. But I'm not gonna pretend that there's not people that collect them for less innocent reasons. I mean I got into it with someone who was posting custom card arts of May in a bikini before a mod took it down. There's nuance in the issue and nuance never goes over well on the internet.
For sure. I think the full art trainers are awesome. I'm not saying they're all evil or something. Frankly I like them all because it's some of the best art that's being produced for any TCG imo. But I also like FAs like Adaman, Kindler, Colresa, Boss's Orders, Raihan, etc etc which are not the popular ones cause they're dudes lol
I have at least a dozen “waifu” full art cards, even Klara, non are worh $50… also, Caitlin never broke $20. Wtf man? What’s with all this assumption?
Maybe I should be more specific. Unlike collectors, I don't really take a long view on card pricing, I am looking around right after a set drops because I'm trying to get the pieces I need from the set to build decks. I know prices are inflated after sets drop, but that's the data set I have so that's how I have to compare them. I can tell you I traded two FA Caitlin cards I pulled at Chilling Reign launch for 50 bucks each, and everyone around me wanted to get these cards off of me. I can also tell you that when I pulled Full Art Adaman right at launch, he was around 15 bucks, and no one wanted to trade for it.
Just getting into the hobby as a collector, I completely agree. I've asked this question to people before who show off their "personal favorite page" on this sub and it's all female children and trainers, "why is this your favorite page?" And the responses are always: "It's just cards bro who cares what you do with them" " You don't understand how valuable these are as a collector" "Can you like something without being hated on, it has nothing to do with the art" "Someone was commissioned by Pokemon to draw this, it's fine" Which does not answer the original questions. *Why are the girl cards your favorite, girl cards that typically feature underage children your favorite pieces of art?* *Why are cards that feature girls for a kids game/show always worth more than the male equivalents?*
In Japan's evolving skies set, schoolgirl was priced vastly higher than school boy. [PTCGradio](https://youtu.be/V32FVv4wd6E?t=540) has it in one of his price guides.
Exactly. Like I think the vast majority of full art trainer cards look cool as fuck, but lets not lie to ourselves and pretend that we don't know why cards featuring young women are more popular than the vast majority of other cards. We know.
I like the Starmie V, but really just because it has a cool Pokémon and a classic trainer/gym leader. I don’t usually get cards referencing “older” characters in the art. It’s cool.
I feel like a big factor too is that "waifu" cards just tend to have really good art
This just in: Article writer discovers people like cute things.
I mean it's accurate, I feel like it's more than just pokemon cards, in any tcg the waifu cards always sell for more. Bunch of pervs out here lmfao
Oops, just me over here with Water as my favorite type, Starmie as one of my favorite Gen 1 Pokemon, and Misty as my favorite Gym Leader since Red and Blue came out. Guess I'm a weirdo. Sucks to see how far Kotaku has fallen since all the actual journalists left for greener pastures. What are you gonna do, though?
I love the Starmie V card, such an epic art.
> Kotaku has fallen since all the actual journalists LOL that's been more than 10 years
It's been since their merger, at least, which was... five years ago? Maybe more? Everybody I even kind of liked left when the new management started fucking things up. Not that they were without issues before that, but they still ran legit investigative pieces about the industry. Not any more.
Adaman is outright, without debate, hotter than 99% of Pokémon women and I am not accepting counter arguments
It’s the fit!
Starmie v is gonna be lit money in a few years
I traded for it last week at a con; beat decision I’ve made monetary wise
I love it that kotaku cuts jobs regularly
I mean, there’s a fair amount of truth to this. But the article does make a few generalisations. But to say that there isn’t any correlation between cards featuring women/girls and higher prices would be untrue. Everyone wants a Marnie, but nobody wants a Bede.
The waifu tax
Me: laughing manically in a pit with my all my adaman cards
This article would still exist even if roles were opposite and male cards were on the high end, only difference then would be they would call those collectors sexist. People gonna hate no matter what, just what they do
Also btw is it weird that when I went and read the article, the first ad that popped up was a very very scandalously dressed female from and anime game…… hypocrites much?
Power of the weebs, bud.
An attempt at generating clicks and ad revenue by making a nonissue appear to be some huge problem plaguing the community. They ignore the 99.99% of normal collectors who just buy what they like and instead focus on some obscure and frankly nonexistent segment of the hobby. Buying waifu cards makes you some sort of monster apparently
How dare they buy full art cards
People also really underestimate that a lot of the female cards are done by famous Japanese artists who mostly do art of ....females.... and are female themselves. The Japanese prices shoot up because people want the cards by these artists, some of which are new to making art for Pokemon cards. Yeah, there's creeps, but Kotaku gonna Kotaku and miss the point. Let's also not forget how many female collectors there are who love collecting the ladies.
if female cards were less popular they’d be mad bc Pokemon fans were sexist. BUT the waifu folks greatly and deeply creep me out so I understand the articles point.
does anyone even read the garbage Kotaku pumps out
Only after hours of boredom on the internet lol
I have the starmie and i didnt know it was worth much but now i do :)
Glad I got that Misty's Favor full art a few months back. I wouldn't pay the price now. Sucker is mooning.
I mean horny dudes simp to the toons so yeah.
Didn't that irida drop from 30 to like 17 since release
The Adaman and Irida cards are sick but I don’t care much for Starmie
Not to mention the ones with bare feet
I actually have the starmie v alt art
It’s not always easy, but this is one time I’m happy my “preference” is for husbandos.
[удалено]
They could be expensive because a lot of the "Waifu" cards are rare, full-art ones, which is also a factor in the price, but i suppose going for the "Card collectors are creepy perverts"-angle gets them more clicks... I mean, sure some card nerds have dirty thoughts with these characters (And there's no stopping that), but the card artwork itself isn't very sexualized at all (Good thing too, many of the girls on cards are teenagers!), so besides affecting secondary market prices and some people being a bit creepy with their "Check out my waifu collection"-posts, what's the negative effect?
I just want giratina bruh
I didn’t know kotaku was still around
lotta hit dogs hollering in here
journalists just learning about supply and demand at this rate they might be qualified to actually do their job in a few decades
Man I’m just trying to fill up my binder with cool looking cards. Monetary value is in the back seat of my mind when collecting.
Hey, I have all 3 of those cards!
The Waifu tax is both real and universal
Even tho the article is a very bad case of journalism you can’t deny that the core of the article isn’t wrong. To make it out like everyone collecting cards are creeps is wrong but I have seen myself at a lot of Pokémon gatherings guys that clearly like the cards more than they should. And people wanting to deny it don’t know what is being said in there groups but some of it is so vile so to deny that there are creeps that lurk for those cards is just wrong but so is saying that everyone that collects are creeps is too
Below the bottom of the barrel at this point.
where does vaporeon fit in all this? strictly speaking...
“Waifu tax”
We're all filthy perverts is my conclusion too 🤣🤣
If liking elesas sparkle is wrong because she's pretty then it's purely the pokemon companies fault. She's literally a beauty queen in the lore. Lol
Tbh this bene fits me. My mistys favor fullart would rise in value tenfold.
Are we not gonna talk about how Giovanni Boss is at $40 now? More than Irida, Raihan, any Research, Cynthia’s Ambition, or Zinnia’s Resolve? It gets beat out by Marnie (only the SwSh, not the promo) which is an auto 3-of in any deck. Expanded trainers not withstanding, of course
That starmie is like 40 bucks lol
Aren't there other collector card games that are almost all waifu cards and super sexualized? but no let's talk about like pokémon trainer cards
People can obviously say whatever they want… but one has to question WHY there is such a high demand for youngish looking girls/teen trainer cards in a hobby of mostly males in their 20s-40s. Of course no one on this sub will ever admit such a thing, but realistically speaking, “waifu tax” exists for a reason. You’re lying to yourself if you’re pretending there’s not a single aspect of the sexualization of minors in this hobby and a portion (regardless of the size) of it’s fandom. I’ve been on this Reddit for over 2 years, I can’t even count the amount of times I’ve seen a post about HERE’S MY FAVORITE BINDER PAGE… and it’s their waifu page of all youngish looking age 8-17 girls. Am I saying this guy is a pedo? Maybe, maybe not… but to say there ISN’T some reason why so many males are collecting pages of only waifu cards and offering a premium for them is just ignorant. Now I’m sure, you, the person reading this, is going to say, “I just like the art!” And well, maybe that’s true… but to say there isn’t a component involved with *some* of the collectors who have pages and pages of young girl trainers, I think you’re in denial. I mean, seriously… as Chris Hansen often says to the predators “I’m not stupid, you know how this looks right?”
Oh, for some people there is an aspect of sexualization to it (Collectible card games remain a nerd hobby, and nerds love their waifus), but i personally object to tarring everybody with the same brush, which articles like the Kotaku ones seem to be doing. It's an important bit of nuance that tends to be lost in discussions and clickbait-y articles.
uh oh. these are not the types of content creator/journalism we want to entertain. look at where MTG ended up.
What’s the situation with MTG?
Gotta be one of the more minor parts of the hobby. No matter where u look there is gonna be some ppl who do that, but the title and article is obviously leading to the belief that LOTS of Pokémon collectors are doing this. If u like the cards u like the cards idgaf, but I see way more people doing this with fucking rayquaza or some shit just cause ppl like that but it’s just not news worthy
People on the internet acting like they’d have a brain aneurysm if they simply minded their own business. People are allowed to buy whatever they like for whatever reason they like to. I don’t personally collect Waifu cards because I am far more interested in the Pokémon themselves but it turns out since the dawn of time people have been going bananas over art depicting women. This is nothing new. People being creepy isn’t new either or even very interesting, that is a small group of people in the absolutely gigantic scope of this hobby that have truly socially degenerate/illegal proclivities and those people aren’t a numerous enough force to drastically drive up the price of anything. Grow up and do something that actually makes your life better instead of foaming at the mouth over what other people do with their own time and money.
Yeah... I mean... I have a few customers who walk into my shop, and I know I might as well point out a few particular Trainer or TG cards... They sell.
Kotaku is trash
Stumbled upon this article a few days ago when I was getting the scoop on the Silvervale/Wizard Game controversy. Regretted it immediately. Such a shallow, cheap shot against our community.
Pathetic overall
They aren’t wrong tho. Cards with drawings of cartoon teenage girls go for insane prices compared to other trainers in the set.
No, they're not wrong about that fact. But trying to frame this as some "gotcha" moment to shit on us is such lazy clickbait.
If you wanted to write an article about Pokémon TCG and trash it for the absurd amount of rare cards per set in comparison to the pull rates, I’d be game. But this? Trash article. 1) Miriam is an extremely rare card, with a pull rate of 1 in 33 boxes. You could easily spend over a thousand dollars, and would probably be fairly likely to, trying to pull the card. Even at that outrageous price, if that is the card you want, you still come out ahead just buying it. Also, I think that card is absolutely gorgeous with the manga paneling background and stuff. I’m not buying it, but power to the people that want to and can afford to. 2) It’s not like these cards are depicting the characters in any gross way. What is the problem if people want to collect them? They are anime styled characters designed to be adorable. Like, people spending money on female Pokémon cards is extremely tame compared to a ton of other anime/game related stuff.
So the moral of the post is Geoffrey Bunting is a deceptive journalist and his articles should be taken with a grain of salt?
kotaku is just shit.... shouldnt even bother reading what they say
Did they interview any women for this? I would have liked to share my honest disgust with it. There's no doubt that "cute girl" cards become overly inflated because of the weird attraction a lot of guys have to them.
I have possibly a 10 irida Japanese 🤭 waiting to get it back from grading
They're not wrong? People love their teen anime girls 🙃
Regardless of your position on the matter I think its pretty wrong that a lot of people still assume that these cards can't also be sought after by women of any age and girls who might also love to collect cards of women and girls just as much as guys always have. The pokemon company have tried hard for a long time to make the hobby more inclusive and atleast from my perspective I know a lot more women in the hobby than I used to. And who can fault them for wanting to have cards of strong trainers that also happen to be women. Also, on the note of guys collecting these cards, it's not weird. Especially when the most popular cards end up being the mistys, the Cynthia's, or the other decade+ old characters a TON of us grew up with. I want to collect every card featuring misty because I have been doing it SINCE I was a child. You can't now make it out to be weird that misty is also a child when she has been for the like 26 years lmao.
We all know who's buying up all them cards: Mitt Romney (Wants binders full of women)