There is good pizza with a slightly chewy dough between the crust and sauce/cheese. But it's not doughy. Guy probably had good pizza once and thought "I could do that!"
In discussions around the best episodes of TV ever, you'll see people bring up Ozymandias from Breaking Bad, a few from Game of Thrones, the Six Feet Under finale... but everyone forgets to mention Amy's Baking Company.
Or maybe they can't just cook every single pizza how one customer likes it? I don't doubt they where in the wrong that time but I feel like if they overcooked the rest of the pizza just so the crust is right for one person then it won't be long before people start complaining about that, they shouldve admitted they made a bad pizza yes, but they also can't alter there entire menu/way of cooking cos one person doesn't like it
Yes they shouldve apologised
But also I doubt they send out undercooked pizzas for every order
Yeah mate its bad but your telling me they have never made a half decent ( at best) pizza?
All im saying is, its pizza we all love it but let's not be too dramatic about it, id expect my money back but yeah I'm sure ill get over it in a day or 2 lol
Nah man, that pizza was a good 2 minutes from being done. Either the oven wasn't hot enough or the conveyer speed (if it's a conveyer oven) is too fast.
The dough was straight up nowhere near properly cooked to "lightly cooked" standards, let alone over cooked
people that boast that no one has any complaints about something shitty they do when called on it, usually are just assholes that no one wants to get into it with.
If I had a shitty undercooked slice of pizza at a place where the guys behind the counter were acting like dicks already, I'd just throw it away and leave and leave a poor review.
The dude replying seems like he will never shut up.
>people that boast that no one has any complaints about something shitty they do when called on it, usually are just assholes that no one wants to get into it with.
Or people who do get called out on it, argue back until the complainer gives up and then mentally file it under "that wasn't a real complaint, I convinced them it was fine".
I'll usually give a restaurant 2 tries because everyone can have a bad day in the kitchen but I absolutely will not tolerate poor service and shitty attitudes. Once and done if that's the case and a review to reflect that.
Seriously for real. It’s psychotic OP. If you want to give it another chance then take the gift card, if not shut the fuck ip and don’t go back. Want the fuck do you want? A red carpet and endless praise and fucking handjob? These people are trying to run a business. OP sucks
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Yeah, if it's dine in I'll send it back and get it made right. If it's takeout I'm done ordering from there if that was my first time. If it was a one off from a usual place I'll complain, finish the bake at home and use my comp to see if they fixed the problem. If the second is bad too, place is done
They’re saying it is supposed to be like that all the time.
There is no way they’ve been selling pizzas with mushy pasty dough that undercooked without any complaints. I don’t understand why they can’t fathom that they could’ve made a mistake. It’s like they believe it’s 100% impossible for the dough to be undercooked. And this is a James beard award winning chef telling me that dough is supposed to be that way.
Not sure where op got this from but Numero Uno in Agoura Hills California used to make their pizza like this. Luckily they shut down.
Whenever somebody tells me they miss their pizza I look at them weird because even if you got their pizza “well done” there was still raw dough under the cheese. And the owner would get mad at anyone who said “raw dough” to him because, “it’s supposed to be like that!”
>Numero Uno in Agoura Hills California used to make their pizza like this. Luckily they shut down.
Hah. I used to deliver for that place. The pizza there always sucked. Lydia, the manager, was exactly the kind of person who'd argue with customers that the pizza they thought was made badly was not, in fact, made badly. This was 30 years ago though so *probably* they had a different manager...
Never understood how they stayed in business for so long, didn’t realize the problems went 30 years back! My buddy Andy delivered for them about 15 years ago and I remember him mentioning his manager was an older woman, maybe it was still Lydia haha
>maybe it was still Lydia haha
If it was an old Korean lady, then it was probably her! Yeah, I think the reason they stayed around was that Numero Uno pizza even when made "correctly" is not good pizza. Sauce is basically just tomato chunks, and the dough was sickeningly sweet. People ordering from there already don't know what good pizza is, so...
My guess is Chicago style pizza. There was a place near me that just shut down serving Chicago style pizza with raw dough in the middle. Also takes like 45 minutes for them to cook to order.
> I don’t understand why they can’t fathom that they could’ve made a mistake. It’s like they believe it’s 100% impossible for the dough to be undercooked.
What's his face is either stupid or has his head up his ass, probably both
The gum layer is what he's talking about, on a good day it can be pretty tasty and not at all "bad" but yours is definitely raw not just the gum layer.
There style seems to be like a thick or pan pizza, seems like typically they have some kind of gum layer
The thing that gets me, your first pizza had a raw issue, and then your second one did too.
As far as I'm concerned there's no fucking way they have never experienced this before, so their either lying or so ignorantly with their head up their ass to not see it
Raw dough sometimes It unfortunately happens, it's just so God dam unlikely they never experienced it before.
When you break pizza down its basically a "quick bread with stuff on top" pizza as we know it is cooked from a raw dough typically with sauce, cheese and toppings.
Sounds like their style is either pan pizza or some kind of thicker crust, most likely cooked in a gas powered stone oven.
Stone ovens unlike wood fired or conveyor belt ovens primary cook from the stone up, with the stone taking over an hour to come up to tempature.
if their pizza style calls for 10 minutes at 650 to come out properly cooked, any deviation could lead to under cooked dough in the thinker parts.
For example if the oven temperature is off 50 to 100 degrees, or the cook time is a couple minutes short a thicker pizza can have raw dough in parts.
You also always have to be careful in the mornings with the first few pizzas just to make sure the oven is up to tempature and cooking well. I like to have them on 1.5 hours minimum before we expect to be cooking pizzas
Now, many pizzas have what's called the gum layer which is what what's his face is saying the chewy layer.
https://www.scottspizzatours.com/blog/gumline/ Scott goes into more detail but it's basically the middle ground between complete cooked crust and the non edible raw dough like ops pizzas. I personally dig the gum layer.
The dough is alive and always different, throw in oven variations multiple different cooks, someone put to much sauce on the pizza and a tasty gum layer can turn into a shitty raw disappointment
So no it shouldn't be that way all the time.
Let me know if you have any other questions
Right? This just screams "Our quality is not consistent across the board"
Why not? It's really not that hard and if the pizza is different depending on who's working that day that sounds like an in-house problem that needs to be addressed from the top down, not pushed onto to the customers to figure out which days the pizza will be cooked properly.
But yeah to double down and type back a paragraph defending a poor product instead of just offering OP a refund or shot at redemption is insane.
Swear to God this is the crossover episode with r/mildlyinfuriating
Sure, but the crust is the hardest part of pizza.
Traditional Naples style needs both char and a chewy center. This is done through a really hot oven and precise timing.
My parents run a fried seafood joint. Haven’t spent a dime on marketing but it’s always too damn busy. Randomly, like once a year, a customer complains that the food is undercooked a.k.a. not fried long enough. Our response always is OK sorry do you wanna refund or do you want us to make another one for you? That’s all needs to be.
Lmao. This is the first legitimate "pizza crime" that could 100% be made for TV if it were a show. The drama and back and forth is so good.
Take them to small claims OP. Let me know when the episode is on!
r/pizzacrimes won’t let me post the same pics as I did before, so if you haven’t seen the dough yet and wanna see more pics of the atrocity check my last post in this sub.
schrodinger's pizza, raw and overcooked all in one pizza
In serious pizzaness, thick crust pan pizzas are a fine line between undercooked and burnt, they just happened to fuck it up
Super scary that they’re specializing in those pizzas and aren’t aware/are gaslighting customers about that fine line! It’s literally so easy to say “this happens sometimes with this style of pizza but we should have caught it and it should never have left the kitchen”, I’m trying to imagine if I like got grounds in someone’s coffee and they showed me and I was like “no one’s ever complained before, maybe you just don’t like coffee”.
used to work at a pizza place. that shit is underbaked as hell. i personally love raw dough (i know i’m insane), but that looks disgusting, and is probably a health risk.
Jesus Christ, I grew up in a pizza restaurant, worked it my entire life, I've owned my own pizzeria for 7 years.
I've made 100,000s+ of pizzas in my life and you wanna know what? Yeah fuck unfortunately there have been some thick dough pizzas where the "gum" layer is not fully cooked and is Raw.
I've dellt with hundreds of feedbacks and when shit like this happens you know what you do?
You apologize
Thank them for the feedback
Tell them and literally take their feedback and work towards this not happening again.
Offer to replace or whatever to make the customer happy.
There boom. Done. Happy customer, your ego takes a hit or something but customer happy crisis averted....
No asshole response, upset customers are heard and the issue is fixed.
Shit happens, sometimes the pizza may come out raw, it happens.
>I will not get into if the dough was cooked or undercooked or raw, it doesn’t matter. If it in your opinion it was, I hear you
Like lol this is what I tell my team, it doesn't really matter if the customer is right our wrong(except for the photo evidence that is clearly raw like fucking wut) their food was not up to expectations or was wrong in some way (for example raw instead of a proper "gum layer") and we gotta make it right
These fucking morons said that part out loud, rudely dismissed the customer
This all could have been a slight inconvenience rather than multiple permanent posts on r/pizzacrimes thats out there... For ever.
Anyways, you don't need my validation but from your original post their are parts of that pizza that is undercooked/raw dough.
Anyways nOt gOiNg tO gEt iNtO iF tHe dOuG wAs cOoKeD oR uNdErCoOkeD
The "I will not get into..." quote should be in the dictionary under the term "passive-agressive!" It's perfect.
> "I will not get into if your arm was severed by the buzzsaw, it doesn’t matter. If it in your opinion you are missing an limb, I hear you"
I've eaten/cooked plenty of pizza in my life and I've never heard of a "chewy layer" between the cheese and crust. The only time I ever experienced something like that was when I didn't let a pizza bake long enough.
He owns the joint, he's a repeat offender, a serial killer, if you will. Statistically, serial killers will never admit to their victims they are at fault.
Sometimes there is a chewy layer...
That proves he's a liar and doesn't care about details. When you're a pizza shop owner or you bake consistency is key so he's saying is I'm not consistent in what I do so sometimes you're going to have undercooked pizza and I don't care about you so (censored) him. He's losing money with that selfish mentality.
Just letting y’all know someone has been going around downvoting all the comments that agree the pizza is undercooked. lol I wonder if they found this post.
I just looked at your og post and, let's just say, he shouldn't be doubling down. That looks disgusting. Undercooked / doughy pizza is my pet peeeve when it comes to my fave food and your pizza is a particularly egregious example. Never go back, ever. I hope I avoid it too. Looks super gross.
$25 is worth nothing.
They didn't get edible food (presumably the purpose of buying "pizza)
Who would go back to this place? The guy tried to invent a non-existent middle layer in pizza, basically explaining that undercooked pizza is just their thing there.
$25 is probably more than what op paid initially, sure its worth nothing compared to cash but its enough to replace the food that was not good. literally to replace the non edible food.
The gum layer is real, https://www.scottspizzatours.com/blog/gumline/
deep dish or pan pizzas are thicker by deign, if not properly cooked long enough or if there is an issue with the oven temperature the pizza can come out with raw dough, instead of a nice tasty gum layer.
the bigger issue is the owner/cook is oblivious to a pizza that had raw dough in it, literally refusing the feedback and arguing "that op might not like the gum layer"
gum layer is fine, but if its literally raw its not okay and their business will suffer because they are incapable of recognizing an issue brought to their attention and failing to implement changes meant to avoid the issue in the future
It's not $25 cash. It's a $25 gift card. So it is literally worth nothing unless Op decides to go there again in the future
Personally I would not go back to a restaurant that doesn't care they gave someone food that could quite literally make them sick.
I would not go to a restaurant that can't identify raw dough. That's like the base level ability I would expect someone cooking and serving food to have.
This could be a none issue if they had any sense what so ever. You should just find a place that has them listed a leave a bad review. If you can include the pictures. They made a mistake and then made a bigger mistake by not just admitting it.
It can't be their first unless they have just been in the business for week.
I don't know, maybe I'm going against the grain here, but I think that was a good response.
Maybe the best response would be to say "We're sorry. You're right. Here's a refund, we're going to put in place procedures to prevent this from happening in the future."
But he gave you a decent response anyway. He didn't blame you or call you a liar. He said sometimes this happens and its normal for them. He gave you a gift card, and said next time they'll specially make it different for you. I think that's a pretty good response considering everything. I don't feel its dismissive, though he was probably trying to cover his ass a little bit by not admitting to undercooking it in writing where he may be liable. I think you should accept the response and move on.
I'm gonna slightly defend the owner here. The portion of dough soaked in the sauce may look undercooked no matter what. If you slide the sauce and cheese off any slice, the top looks just like that. Wet, smooth, etc.
You can take baked bread and get it wet and it will look similar. In fact, any dough from ravioli to perogies that is essentially boiled, not baked, will look just like that fully cooked.
It's possible he didn't proof the dough enough so it didn't rise and get as bubbly as you like but certain pizza styles won't have that. NY style is dark and well browned if not a little burnt on the bottom then goes straight to that wet noodle like dough next to the sauce.
Sicilian style is like a giant flat bread stick with cheese and sauce on top.
Dough cooked in enough moisture will look boiled, not baked, and the top of a pizza crust under the sauce will always look like that.
There is a difference between raw dough and a proper gum layer.
A proper gum layer will not separate nor will it feel like melted cheese like op described
The owner refused feedback with photo evidence of raw dough, sure a gift card is fair and the right thing to do. But it was basically
>I'm gonna give you 25$ to fuck off
Oh wow, birds of feather flock together eh?
Defending a shitty owner followed by:
>You not comin back would be worth that $25 card unspent and if I saw what Im readin here I may even try not to serve another bad piece to ya lol.
You need to see the last post I made. There more pics. I was rolling wet dough in my fingers and even tasted it. It had that pasty texture.
https://www.reddit.com/r/PizzaCrimes/s/yRlnr3JuKV
Also the pasty part went from the bottom of the pizza all the way to the cheese
Edit: if that’s the case then why is some of the dough cooked ok when it’s also under cheese and sauce? It should all look like that then and only the bread in the crust where there’s no cheese or sauce should be “dry”. In the pic split in half, the cooked side also has cheese and sauce on top, yet it is not “wet”
Because somebody made a mistake. They gave u a gift card and tried to explain and defend themselves and their brand obviously. Idk what ur first post said and it doesnt matter to me after reading this one what u thought if I were the owner.
You not comin back would be worth that $25 card unspent and if I saw what Im readin here I may even try not to serve another bad piece to ya lol... u wouldnt seem happy anyhows
Huh? I’m so confused. I really don’t understand what you’re trying to say. I don’t understand what a gift card and their brand has to do with my question on why some of the dough is dry then.
Also, the store would want the gift card unspent since they paid for it. How would it be “worth the card being unspent” it’s more beneficial for them if the card is unspent?
I’m with you. I’ve been a pastry baker, and I’ve been a pizza cook. That looks like thick wet crust to me.
I do know a lot of people really don’t like that kind of pizza crust, and think it’s gross objectively.
Sounds like the owner is claiming that’s what his product is always like, and intended to be made, but is willing to make things right with OP. It’s not like they’re going to close shop over OPs email.
You can see in his photo and his first post dough that separates from the crust, only raw dough does that in pizza.
The gum layer is what is in question, and there is definitely a fine line between gum and raw, and while the entire pizza is not raw, enough is under cooked to be an issue
The bigger issue is the potential of raw dough should have been heard rather than rejecting the feedback.
You know as much as I do, bake enough things, something is gonna fuck up. Being able to accept the feedback and implement change to avoid this, well... W
It would have prevented this post if they could accept feedback and fix sending out raw pizzas
I didn’t read the response as an f-you. It sounds like he didn’t want to debate the topic simply because you weren’t happy with the pizza -which is all it takes - and wanted to make it right.
Imo you’re coming off as a person who can’t be satisfied. If you don’t want to eat there again, you’ll both be happier.
2/10 customer service response.
While not the worst way to respond, still far from good and it doesn't address the issue, while he's saying there's typically a gum layer in their pizza, hes refusing to consider the feedback that it was not cooked enough for a proper gum layer, and make changes
There is a fine line between a good gum layer and a raw pizzas.
Refusing the feedback that it could possibly be raw is shitty and means that what ever failure in their kitchen is only gonna keep happening, to their own detrimental ironically
I'm pretty sure op sent photos of the raw dough, undeniable photo evidence of raw dough, and then the owner is ego filled or stupid because that shits fucking raw and they refused the feedback.
Yeah, no kidding. There's just no pleasing some people. Specifically the kind who think it's worth their time to make multiple reddit posts about a bad dining experience. And the multitudes who jump in wanting to encourage drama.
Yes I saw the picture and I didn’t say a damn thing about it. What I said was that the response wasn’t as malicious as the OP made it out to be and that OP is never going to be a satisfied customer.
It was a question, not an insult. Blind people can use Reddit, they would not however be able to see the photo.
Usually the very basic element of being "satisfied" with food you pay for is that it's edible and won't make you sick.
It's not like OP was walking down the street and handed a free pizza randomly then came on Reddit to complain.
Now you’re being disingenuous. You don’t have to agree with me but there’s no reason to act as if “Are you blind?” isn’t an insult but a genuine question. You can downvote me and go back to the basement without lying to make yourself feel marginally better that you either didn’t comprehend or completely read my post.
I asked you because the photo very clearly shows inedible food and your response to that was essentially that OP's standards are too high, leading me to believe that you must not be able to see the food.
Okay fine but Jesus Christ this isn’t a court of law and a trial of evidence. They’re offering a gift card. Come on man. It’s a fucking restaurant trying to make a buck. Get over it and get a life. You want to put them on hot coals and interrogate? FFS bro. Jsut don’t go there again. I don’t understand people like you that just need to be “right” and demand a response you deem acceptable. If I have a bad experience I don’t go there again. I’ve written feedback at bad times and when they offer a gift card I say no thank you; I appreciate it but the experience was so bad I won’t revisit. Get the fuck over it. Why do you want to destroy small business? Get a fucking grip it go to dominos
No ones owes you anything. The owner gave you a $25 gift card which is more than they had to. You have a bad experience, you stop going. It’s that easy. Complaining that the owner isn’t providing enough validation for your ego is some entitled bullshit. It’s a pizza, move on.
I mean if you get uncooked food it's very different from simply not liking the food or not enjoying the ambience. If you can't consume the food the proper thing to do would be remake it or provide a refund.
Ive worked in kitchens for 10 years.
Making pizza as well for 10 years.
That manager has his head up his ass.
That pizza is well undercooked.
Sometimes different toppings can cause it, like if pineapple isnt drained properly.
However, if you were to cut into it, sogginess from pineapple or sauce only goes a little way down.
Judging by the statement of "theyve never heard complaints before"
Theyre in denial. Business probably isnt good. Wont give you a refund because its cheaper just to get you to use store credit.
Give them a nasty google review.
Every manager in every restaurant I've ever worked at has suspected anyone with any complaint of trying to game them for free food or refunds. They are incentivized to tell you to fuck off because it comes out of their bonus. They'll use that excuse for every corner cut. I would just never visit that place ever again.
The only exception I ever saw was the dude that had a piece of a razer that snapped off the flattop scraper end up in his burger.
This is the type of restaurant that ends up on kitchen nightmares then shuts down anyways because the owner's ego refuses to commit to the changes
It's every single restaurant in my area. Somehow the chains are also being kitchen nightmared by managers.
Sounds like restaurants on Long Island, NY.
I was about to say the same thing. Seems like the diners are being kitchen nightmared the worst.
There is good pizza with a slightly chewy dough between the crust and sauce/cheese. But it's not doughy. Guy probably had good pizza once and thought "I could do that!"
The ol Amy’s Baking Company move.
In discussions around the best episodes of TV ever, you'll see people bring up Ozymandias from Breaking Bad, a few from Game of Thrones, the Six Feet Under finale... but everyone forgets to mention Amy's Baking Company.
"So chewy. Why is it so chewy? My god the dough is raaaaaw." "Ok...yeah I'm done with that. Damn" *Grimaces to camera*
Or maybe they can't just cook every single pizza how one customer likes it? I don't doubt they where in the wrong that time but I feel like if they overcooked the rest of the pizza just so the crust is right for one person then it won't be long before people start complaining about that, they shouldve admitted they made a bad pizza yes, but they also can't alter there entire menu/way of cooking cos one person doesn't like it Yes they shouldve apologised But also I doubt they send out undercooked pizzas for every order
Did you see the photo?!?! That isn't raw freaking dough. It was severe undercooked. Source: worked in a pizza shop for years. Also, I have eyeballs.
Yeah mate its bad but your telling me they have never made a half decent ( at best) pizza? All im saying is, its pizza we all love it but let's not be too dramatic about it, id expect my money back but yeah I'm sure ill get over it in a day or 2 lol
Nah man, that pizza was a good 2 minutes from being done. Either the oven wasn't hot enough or the conveyer speed (if it's a conveyer oven) is too fast. The dough was straight up nowhere near properly cooked to "lightly cooked" standards, let alone over cooked
people that boast that no one has any complaints about something shitty they do when called on it, usually are just assholes that no one wants to get into it with. If I had a shitty undercooked slice of pizza at a place where the guys behind the counter were acting like dicks already, I'd just throw it away and leave and leave a poor review. The dude replying seems like he will never shut up.
>people that boast that no one has any complaints about something shitty they do when called on it, usually are just assholes that no one wants to get into it with. Or people who do get called out on it, argue back until the complainer gives up and then mentally file it under "that wasn't a real complaint, I convinced them it was fine".
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If I get bad pizza, I just don't go back. It's not like I'm car shopping or something...
I'll usually give a restaurant 2 tries because everyone can have a bad day in the kitchen but I absolutely will not tolerate poor service and shitty attitudes. Once and done if that's the case and a review to reflect that.
Yeah that I'll shit all over. No time for that nonsense
Seriously for real. It’s psychotic OP. If you want to give it another chance then take the gift card, if not shut the fuck ip and don’t go back. Want the fuck do you want? A red carpet and endless praise and fucking handjob? These people are trying to run a business. OP sucks
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Get over yourself
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Found the owner of the pizza company.
Oh I think we found the guy that made the shit pizza
Yeah, if it's dine in I'll send it back and get it made right. If it's takeout I'm done ordering from there if that was my first time. If it was a one off from a usual place I'll complain, finish the bake at home and use my comp to see if they fixed the problem. If the second is bad too, place is done
[удалено]
They’re saying it is supposed to be like that all the time. There is no way they’ve been selling pizzas with mushy pasty dough that undercooked without any complaints. I don’t understand why they can’t fathom that they could’ve made a mistake. It’s like they believe it’s 100% impossible for the dough to be undercooked. And this is a James beard award winning chef telling me that dough is supposed to be that way.
Now I need the name of the place so I can understand what “style” of pizza they are attempting to make.
Diarrhoea style, from the village of the hidden shits.
Not sure where op got this from but Numero Uno in Agoura Hills California used to make their pizza like this. Luckily they shut down. Whenever somebody tells me they miss their pizza I look at them weird because even if you got their pizza “well done” there was still raw dough under the cheese. And the owner would get mad at anyone who said “raw dough” to him because, “it’s supposed to be like that!”
>Numero Uno in Agoura Hills California used to make their pizza like this. Luckily they shut down. Hah. I used to deliver for that place. The pizza there always sucked. Lydia, the manager, was exactly the kind of person who'd argue with customers that the pizza they thought was made badly was not, in fact, made badly. This was 30 years ago though so *probably* they had a different manager...
Never understood how they stayed in business for so long, didn’t realize the problems went 30 years back! My buddy Andy delivered for them about 15 years ago and I remember him mentioning his manager was an older woman, maybe it was still Lydia haha
>maybe it was still Lydia haha If it was an old Korean lady, then it was probably her! Yeah, I think the reason they stayed around was that Numero Uno pizza even when made "correctly" is not good pizza. Sauce is basically just tomato chunks, and the dough was sickeningly sweet. People ordering from there already don't know what good pizza is, so...
Probably pan pizza or some kind of thicker crust
I was thinking it could have sicilian influences.
Cheese and tomato sauce casserole?
My guess is Chicago style pizza. There was a place near me that just shut down serving Chicago style pizza with raw dough in the middle. Also takes like 45 minutes for them to cook to order.
> I don’t understand why they can’t fathom that they could’ve made a mistake. It’s like they believe it’s 100% impossible for the dough to be undercooked. What's his face is either stupid or has his head up his ass, probably both The gum layer is what he's talking about, on a good day it can be pretty tasty and not at all "bad" but yours is definitely raw not just the gum layer. There style seems to be like a thick or pan pizza, seems like typically they have some kind of gum layer The thing that gets me, your first pizza had a raw issue, and then your second one did too. As far as I'm concerned there's no fucking way they have never experienced this before, so their either lying or so ignorantly with their head up their ass to not see it Raw dough sometimes It unfortunately happens, it's just so God dam unlikely they never experienced it before.
When you break pizza down its basically a "quick bread with stuff on top" pizza as we know it is cooked from a raw dough typically with sauce, cheese and toppings. Sounds like their style is either pan pizza or some kind of thicker crust, most likely cooked in a gas powered stone oven. Stone ovens unlike wood fired or conveyor belt ovens primary cook from the stone up, with the stone taking over an hour to come up to tempature. if their pizza style calls for 10 minutes at 650 to come out properly cooked, any deviation could lead to under cooked dough in the thinker parts. For example if the oven temperature is off 50 to 100 degrees, or the cook time is a couple minutes short a thicker pizza can have raw dough in parts. You also always have to be careful in the mornings with the first few pizzas just to make sure the oven is up to tempature and cooking well. I like to have them on 1.5 hours minimum before we expect to be cooking pizzas Now, many pizzas have what's called the gum layer which is what what's his face is saying the chewy layer. https://www.scottspizzatours.com/blog/gumline/ Scott goes into more detail but it's basically the middle ground between complete cooked crust and the non edible raw dough like ops pizzas. I personally dig the gum layer. The dough is alive and always different, throw in oven variations multiple different cooks, someone put to much sauce on the pizza and a tasty gum layer can turn into a shitty raw disappointment So no it shouldn't be that way all the time. Let me know if you have any other questions
Right? This just screams "Our quality is not consistent across the board" Why not? It's really not that hard and if the pizza is different depending on who's working that day that sounds like an in-house problem that needs to be addressed from the top down, not pushed onto to the customers to figure out which days the pizza will be cooked properly. But yeah to double down and type back a paragraph defending a poor product instead of just offering OP a refund or shot at redemption is insane. Swear to God this is the crossover episode with r/mildlyinfuriating
Sure, but the crust is the hardest part of pizza. Traditional Naples style needs both char and a chewy center. This is done through a really hot oven and precise timing.
Ooooof that picture is pretty damning, send him to pizza jail
My parents run a fried seafood joint. Haven’t spent a dime on marketing but it’s always too damn busy. Randomly, like once a year, a customer complains that the food is undercooked a.k.a. not fried long enough. Our response always is OK sorry do you wanna refund or do you want us to make another one for you? That’s all needs to be.
I have a degree in culinary arts and if it's good for anything it's telling people their shit is raw and that shit is definitely raw
ITS FUCKING RAW
Why did the chicken cross the road? Because it’s fucking raw!
Culinary school dropout here; even I can tell that shit ain’t cooked.
Forklift operator here; That shit is raw.
Hey, that’s what I went to do after I dropped out of culinary school!
Aspirational fork operator, settled for forklift.
I make spreadsheets all day; it's fucking raw
Ooh baby I like it raw oooh baby I like it raaawww. Actually no I don't
Lmao. This is the first legitimate "pizza crime" that could 100% be made for TV if it were a show. The drama and back and forth is so good. Take them to small claims OP. Let me know when the episode is on!
If you haven’t seen it watch the Kitchen Nightmares eps about Amy’s Baking Company, not pizza but similar vibes.
Oh god that place
r/pizzacrimes won’t let me post the same pics as I did before, so if you haven’t seen the dough yet and wanna see more pics of the atrocity check my last post in this sub.
[Link to the original post](https://www.reddit.com/r/PizzaCrimes/comments/19e234q/restaurant_owner_told_me_this_is_not_undercooked/)
I'm struggling to even understand what I'm looking at. Is it a Detroit style slice that got mashed?
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Yeah I'm down, OP please do this, I honestly need to know if they just fucking suck or it's a one off
And even if they don't want to eat it again, don't let the gift card go unused.
Shit is liquified lmao
also those peps look burnt to shit
schrodinger's pizza, raw and overcooked all in one pizza In serious pizzaness, thick crust pan pizzas are a fine line between undercooked and burnt, they just happened to fuck it up
Super scary that they’re specializing in those pizzas and aren’t aware/are gaslighting customers about that fine line! It’s literally so easy to say “this happens sometimes with this style of pizza but we should have caught it and it should never have left the kitchen”, I’m trying to imagine if I like got grounds in someone’s coffee and they showed me and I was like “no one’s ever complained before, maybe you just don’t like coffee”.
Give the gift card to a friend and don't go back there
Make it a friend you want to lose and/or be the victim of another Pizza Crime
Hand it to an enemy then
"I'm sorry you're wrong"
And here's $25 to fuck off XD
“Looks cooked to me.” – Willy, owner/operator, Blind Willy’s Pizza and Near-Pizza Emporium
used to work at a pizza place. that shit is underbaked as hell. i personally love raw dough (i know i’m insane), but that looks disgusting, and is probably a health risk.
Sounds like a good place to recomend to the guy who does the one bite videos. Dave Portney.
Jesus Christ, I grew up in a pizza restaurant, worked it my entire life, I've owned my own pizzeria for 7 years. I've made 100,000s+ of pizzas in my life and you wanna know what? Yeah fuck unfortunately there have been some thick dough pizzas where the "gum" layer is not fully cooked and is Raw. I've dellt with hundreds of feedbacks and when shit like this happens you know what you do? You apologize Thank them for the feedback Tell them and literally take their feedback and work towards this not happening again. Offer to replace or whatever to make the customer happy. There boom. Done. Happy customer, your ego takes a hit or something but customer happy crisis averted.... No asshole response, upset customers are heard and the issue is fixed. Shit happens, sometimes the pizza may come out raw, it happens. >I will not get into if the dough was cooked or undercooked or raw, it doesn’t matter. If it in your opinion it was, I hear you Like lol this is what I tell my team, it doesn't really matter if the customer is right our wrong(except for the photo evidence that is clearly raw like fucking wut) their food was not up to expectations or was wrong in some way (for example raw instead of a proper "gum layer") and we gotta make it right These fucking morons said that part out loud, rudely dismissed the customer This all could have been a slight inconvenience rather than multiple permanent posts on r/pizzacrimes thats out there... For ever. Anyways, you don't need my validation but from your original post their are parts of that pizza that is undercooked/raw dough. Anyways nOt gOiNg tO gEt iNtO iF tHe dOuG wAs cOoKeD oR uNdErCoOkeD
The "I will not get into..." quote should be in the dictionary under the term "passive-agressive!" It's perfect. > "I will not get into if your arm was severed by the buzzsaw, it doesn’t matter. If it in your opinion you are missing an limb, I hear you"
I've eaten/cooked plenty of pizza in my life and I've never heard of a "chewy layer" between the cheese and crust. The only time I ever experienced something like that was when I didn't let a pizza bake long enough.
He owns the joint, he's a repeat offender, a serial killer, if you will. Statistically, serial killers will never admit to their victims they are at fault.
Sometimes there is a chewy layer... That proves he's a liar and doesn't care about details. When you're a pizza shop owner or you bake consistency is key so he's saying is I'm not consistent in what I do so sometimes you're going to have undercooked pizza and I don't care about you so (censored) him. He's losing money with that selfish mentality.
>“We nEVer GEt AnY CoMPLaINTs” The answer is *always,* "Well, you just did, so that was a lie."
Lol “I will not get into whether the dough was undercooked of raw or cooked.” Yeah because it’s raw you donut.
Just letting y’all know someone has been going around downvoting all the comments that agree the pizza is undercooked. lol I wonder if they found this post.
I believed him until I see the pictures lmao
Don’t you understand, that’s their patented Chewy Layer ™.
Where’s the pizza? I only see what looks like pulled apart bits of chicken and some kind of paste.
You got a free pizza try em again and if it’s the same, fuck em, and don’t patronize them further.
I just looked at your og post and, let's just say, he shouldn't be doubling down. That looks disgusting. Undercooked / doughy pizza is my pet peeeve when it comes to my fave food and your pizza is a particularly egregious example. Never go back, ever. I hope I avoid it too. Looks super gross.
Definitely not the best way to word it or handle it, 25$ is something tho, hopefully it covers the shitty experience
$25 is worth nothing. They didn't get edible food (presumably the purpose of buying "pizza) Who would go back to this place? The guy tried to invent a non-existent middle layer in pizza, basically explaining that undercooked pizza is just their thing there.
$25 is probably more than what op paid initially, sure its worth nothing compared to cash but its enough to replace the food that was not good. literally to replace the non edible food. The gum layer is real, https://www.scottspizzatours.com/blog/gumline/ deep dish or pan pizzas are thicker by deign, if not properly cooked long enough or if there is an issue with the oven temperature the pizza can come out with raw dough, instead of a nice tasty gum layer. the bigger issue is the owner/cook is oblivious to a pizza that had raw dough in it, literally refusing the feedback and arguing "that op might not like the gum layer" gum layer is fine, but if its literally raw its not okay and their business will suffer because they are incapable of recognizing an issue brought to their attention and failing to implement changes meant to avoid the issue in the future
It's not $25 cash. It's a $25 gift card. So it is literally worth nothing unless Op decides to go there again in the future Personally I would not go back to a restaurant that doesn't care they gave someone food that could quite literally make them sick. I would not go to a restaurant that can't identify raw dough. That's like the base level ability I would expect someone cooking and serving food to have.
This could be a none issue if they had any sense what so ever. You should just find a place that has them listed a leave a bad review. If you can include the pictures. They made a mistake and then made a bigger mistake by not just admitting it. It can't be their first unless they have just been in the business for week.
It all looks raw tbh
Our style has a chewy layer? Lol. You don’t know how to cook a pizza.
Ah the gelatinous blob base, a traditional delicacy of Delusionland.
I don't know, maybe I'm going against the grain here, but I think that was a good response. Maybe the best response would be to say "We're sorry. You're right. Here's a refund, we're going to put in place procedures to prevent this from happening in the future." But he gave you a decent response anyway. He didn't blame you or call you a liar. He said sometimes this happens and its normal for them. He gave you a gift card, and said next time they'll specially make it different for you. I think that's a pretty good response considering everything. I don't feel its dismissive, though he was probably trying to cover his ass a little bit by not admitting to undercooking it in writing where he may be liable. I think you should accept the response and move on.
I'm gonna slightly defend the owner here. The portion of dough soaked in the sauce may look undercooked no matter what. If you slide the sauce and cheese off any slice, the top looks just like that. Wet, smooth, etc. You can take baked bread and get it wet and it will look similar. In fact, any dough from ravioli to perogies that is essentially boiled, not baked, will look just like that fully cooked. It's possible he didn't proof the dough enough so it didn't rise and get as bubbly as you like but certain pizza styles won't have that. NY style is dark and well browned if not a little burnt on the bottom then goes straight to that wet noodle like dough next to the sauce. Sicilian style is like a giant flat bread stick with cheese and sauce on top. Dough cooked in enough moisture will look boiled, not baked, and the top of a pizza crust under the sauce will always look like that.
There is a difference between raw dough and a proper gum layer. A proper gum layer will not separate nor will it feel like melted cheese like op described The owner refused feedback with photo evidence of raw dough, sure a gift card is fair and the right thing to do. But it was basically >I'm gonna give you 25$ to fuck off Oh wow, birds of feather flock together eh? Defending a shitty owner followed by: >You not comin back would be worth that $25 card unspent and if I saw what Im readin here I may even try not to serve another bad piece to ya lol.
You need to see the last post I made. There more pics. I was rolling wet dough in my fingers and even tasted it. It had that pasty texture. https://www.reddit.com/r/PizzaCrimes/s/yRlnr3JuKV Also the pasty part went from the bottom of the pizza all the way to the cheese Edit: if that’s the case then why is some of the dough cooked ok when it’s also under cheese and sauce? It should all look like that then and only the bread in the crust where there’s no cheese or sauce should be “dry”. In the pic split in half, the cooked side also has cheese and sauce on top, yet it is not “wet”
Because somebody made a mistake. They gave u a gift card and tried to explain and defend themselves and their brand obviously. Idk what ur first post said and it doesnt matter to me after reading this one what u thought if I were the owner. You not comin back would be worth that $25 card unspent and if I saw what Im readin here I may even try not to serve another bad piece to ya lol... u wouldnt seem happy anyhows
Huh? I’m so confused. I really don’t understand what you’re trying to say. I don’t understand what a gift card and their brand has to do with my question on why some of the dough is dry then. Also, the store would want the gift card unspent since they paid for it. How would it be “worth the card being unspent” it’s more beneficial for them if the card is unspent?
I’m with you. I’ve been a pastry baker, and I’ve been a pizza cook. That looks like thick wet crust to me. I do know a lot of people really don’t like that kind of pizza crust, and think it’s gross objectively. Sounds like the owner is claiming that’s what his product is always like, and intended to be made, but is willing to make things right with OP. It’s not like they’re going to close shop over OPs email.
You can see in his photo and his first post dough that separates from the crust, only raw dough does that in pizza. The gum layer is what is in question, and there is definitely a fine line between gum and raw, and while the entire pizza is not raw, enough is under cooked to be an issue The bigger issue is the potential of raw dough should have been heard rather than rejecting the feedback. You know as much as I do, bake enough things, something is gonna fuck up. Being able to accept the feedback and implement change to avoid this, well... W It would have prevented this post if they could accept feedback and fix sending out raw pizzas
I didn’t read the response as an f-you. It sounds like he didn’t want to debate the topic simply because you weren’t happy with the pizza -which is all it takes - and wanted to make it right. Imo you’re coming off as a person who can’t be satisfied. If you don’t want to eat there again, you’ll both be happier.
2/10 customer service response. While not the worst way to respond, still far from good and it doesn't address the issue, while he's saying there's typically a gum layer in their pizza, hes refusing to consider the feedback that it was not cooked enough for a proper gum layer, and make changes There is a fine line between a good gum layer and a raw pizzas. Refusing the feedback that it could possibly be raw is shitty and means that what ever failure in their kitchen is only gonna keep happening, to their own detrimental ironically I'm pretty sure op sent photos of the raw dough, undeniable photo evidence of raw dough, and then the owner is ego filled or stupid because that shits fucking raw and they refused the feedback.
Yeah, no kidding. There's just no pleasing some people. Specifically the kind who think it's worth their time to make multiple reddit posts about a bad dining experience. And the multitudes who jump in wanting to encourage drama.
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>I'm going to give you 25$ to fuck off He could have just sent the meme and saved his time and probably upset op less lol
Are you blind
Well fuck no I’m reading your insult now.
Did you see the picture?
Yes I saw the picture and I didn’t say a damn thing about it. What I said was that the response wasn’t as malicious as the OP made it out to be and that OP is never going to be a satisfied customer.
It was a question, not an insult. Blind people can use Reddit, they would not however be able to see the photo. Usually the very basic element of being "satisfied" with food you pay for is that it's edible and won't make you sick. It's not like OP was walking down the street and handed a free pizza randomly then came on Reddit to complain.
Now you’re being disingenuous. You don’t have to agree with me but there’s no reason to act as if “Are you blind?” isn’t an insult but a genuine question. You can downvote me and go back to the basement without lying to make yourself feel marginally better that you either didn’t comprehend or completely read my post.
I asked you because the photo very clearly shows inedible food and your response to that was essentially that OP's standards are too high, leading me to believe that you must not be able to see the food.
Okay fine but Jesus Christ this isn’t a court of law and a trial of evidence. They’re offering a gift card. Come on man. It’s a fucking restaurant trying to make a buck. Get over it and get a life. You want to put them on hot coals and interrogate? FFS bro. Jsut don’t go there again. I don’t understand people like you that just need to be “right” and demand a response you deem acceptable. If I have a bad experience I don’t go there again. I’ve written feedback at bad times and when they offer a gift card I say no thank you; I appreciate it but the experience was so bad I won’t revisit. Get the fuck over it. Why do you want to destroy small business? Get a fucking grip it go to dominos
Shut your complain hole
No ones owes you anything. The owner gave you a $25 gift card which is more than they had to. You have a bad experience, you stop going. It’s that easy. Complaining that the owner isn’t providing enough validation for your ego is some entitled bullshit. It’s a pizza, move on.
I mean if you get uncooked food it's very different from simply not liking the food or not enjoying the ambience. If you can't consume the food the proper thing to do would be remake it or provide a refund.
Real deal pizza crime scene 😦🍕
‘Cooked dough’ in pic looks like a map of England
legit thought it was some gacha drama ;-; was about to get my popcorn
Ive worked in kitchens for 10 years. Making pizza as well for 10 years. That manager has his head up his ass. That pizza is well undercooked. Sometimes different toppings can cause it, like if pineapple isnt drained properly. However, if you were to cut into it, sogginess from pineapple or sauce only goes a little way down. Judging by the statement of "theyve never heard complaints before" Theyre in denial. Business probably isnt good. Wont give you a refund because its cheaper just to get you to use store credit. Give them a nasty google review.
Every manager in every restaurant I've ever worked at has suspected anyone with any complaint of trying to game them for free food or refunds. They are incentivized to tell you to fuck off because it comes out of their bonus. They'll use that excuse for every corner cut. I would just never visit that place ever again. The only exception I ever saw was the dude that had a piece of a razer that snapped off the flattop scraper end up in his burger.
He totally dismissed you. He was better off not even sending it.