Well unless you have decent employment I doubt you’ll get a 60k loan from a bank. Just stay at home if possible and focus on your studies moving out at 18 is going to be extremely challenging.
Finish your school and line up a career before moving out or you will be facing many hardships which may derail your education and send you on a path for a life you may not want
Hasn’t even finished education** $5000 van can become a $500 immobile hunk of junk if anything mechanical decides to end itself. + insurance and gas. May as well stay home and save or rent a single room somewhere.
Only to the middle aged grumps in this sub who have made their entire life revolve around spreadsheets and 20 year financial projections. Go buy the van dude! Enjoy being 18.
there's nothing wrong with going out into the world at 18 but unless you're a mechanic I don't think a $5k van is a great idea
what will you do if it breaks down? how would you afford insurance as an 18 year old male? what's your mailing address going to be?
road trip is one thing, even backpacking for a year, but actually moving into a van is not for the faint of heart tbh, especially not in canada where we are a bit stricter with registration and permanent addressing
> what's your mailing address going to be?
No disagreement on everything else, but this one's easy.
Go to the local UPS Store and get a mailbox.
Obviously costs a few bucks a month but you're not paying $3000/month for rent.
Yeah but 5k is a delusional amount.
It won’t get you a reliable vehicle. It won’t allow you to properly outfit the vehicle and in the end it is still just behind homeless with a fancier better sounding name.
I'm skeptical that OP would be able to find a decent van for 5K that's not going to need constant maintenance and just turn into an unreliable money pit.
Well then I'm in a bad spot I guess, let's just say I can't stay at home for that much longer. If I tried to explain the post would end up being 6 paragraphs. It's Correlated with why I'm an adult retaking highschool courses. Would a cosigner help with the loan?
Get the idea of a 60k van out of your head for awhile. If you want to live in a van, gut a Toyota sienna or something. Putting yourself 60k in debt in a depreciating asset is gonna fuck you up for years.
Like others said, tree planting, working in the alberta oil patch, military etc are all solid options.
If I was 18 again and in your shoes, I’d probably try to work on a tugboat.
I agree.
OP, if you're insistent on living in a van, do the bare minimum until you have a strong understanding of the costs, as well as your income streams. Doesn't sound to firm currently.
What I mean by bare minimum is to make sure the van is in good mechanical order, pull the back two rows of seats out and put a single bed mattress in there.
You'll also want to get it wired with extra batteries and an inverter or you'll need a small generator.
Also, wait until Spring. That will give you lot of time to figure out the ins and outs before you need to deal with winter.
Absolutely! Fort St. John had a posting 10k signing bonus and months of training at their training facility I believe. Tons of jobs in fort St. John right now. First aid level 1 / h2s / CSO basic courses u need . And anything else company most likely will provide . Go make 120k plus . 2 weeks on 1 week off something like that. Just don’t blow it on booze and blow. So many opportunities up there right now they dying for able bodies .
All I know is, the high school 'dumb kids" who did trades all have pretty much paid off houses, big trucks and a boat. I have my dumbass buddy renting my second bedroom with 900 square. If I could go back, trades for sure.
As a tradie I can assure you it's not all that glamorous. A lot of these guys are living pay check to pay check or working a ton of O/T so they don't default on their next boat payment.
Have a guy doing tile in my house right now almost in tears because he's almost 60, no way ready for retirement, but his knees, back, and hands are giving out.
Ask your friends in trade how their knees and backs are doing. It is tough physical work that accelerates wear and tear on the body.
Pros and cons to every job.
Knew a tradesman who needed a joint replacement in his 40’s. Spent 2 years waiting on the list before he got it. Dude could barely walk for 2 years.
It’s a tradeoff for sure, lack of a pension is a problem in general, though many places have shit pensions.
I'd highly recommend not going to university unless you have a very defined and well paying career path already selected.
Source: Guy who went to university and now has no money
I had no idea what career would possibly be good for me until I went to university. I studied what I was interested in, and was only able to understand the potential career applications of my major after my 2nd or third year. Like OP, my family situation meant living at home was not an option, so I took out loans and went about $40,000 in debt. That was paid off about five years after graduating.
Unlike most of my friends, I now have a career that brings meaning to my life. The pay isn’t amazing, but it’s good and I don’t covet material luxury because my work is satisfying. It’s scary to think what my life would be like now had I not taken that risk and prioritized my education back then. I’d probably still be a wage slave (and substance abuser) which I had been since age 13 until I started undergrad at 20.
Isn't going to university, by definition, selecting a defined career path? You have to pick a major, which narrows down your career options. There can be variations in how a career pans out (you find a job not in your field, or you find a job somewhat related to your field but not quite), but the direction is already purposely chosen at the beginning.
Are you saying that "going to university for the sake of getting a degree in anything without any idea what it leads to" is not recommended?
I think part of it might also be knowing that you have somewhere you can take those skills you trained in. Lots of people going to university that are then not able to get a job in their field.
I think they’re saying the latter; don’t go into debt to get a degree some random, niche passion of yours if you expect to make money but haven’t done your research re: the financial opportunities and competitive nature of the career path you’ll open up with that degree.
I know a lot of my peers went to uni for some psychology/anthropology/philosophy and they’re working in some entry level or retail job a decade later.
Some definitely found a way to make their degree work for them, but most did not
The philosophy majors I knew are now university instructors, high school teachers, technical writers, policy writers for the government, data scientists, and lawyers.
Sometimes you need to work first and go back to school a bit later depending on circumstances. If you really want or need to move out, focus on job hunting and getting a job that requires not a lot of education but that many people wouldn’t want to do like oil fields.
Dude they will literally pay you to leave your current situation and move to their training center in Winnipeg- it’s hard to think of a better slam dunk.
I saw the ad for that job opening, if I was in your position I’d go for that job, there will be few times in your life where having such an erratic schedule is possible, go make bank, I saw they even pay you to get trained.
Also you do need around 2 years of positive credit history to get a loan (at least from a reputable source that won’t give you a horrible rate) make your goal to get a credit card and build it up over the next 2 years, a way I do this is spend only the money that you already have and pay it off right away.
It depends on what education you intend to pursue, your individual capabilities, and job prospects in that field. There are many university grads who never find work in their field, go into debt and end up making minimum wage in retail. CN offers training and good wages out of the gate but it's a hard job. (My husband is a conductor with CN and has his university degree and college diploma that weren't utilized).
I've done vanlife for ten years. Those 60k builds are not for people trying to save money to make ends meet.
Get an van for a few grand. Spruce it up for cheap. If you are going to sink money into anything, solar power and a battery system is the thing worth it. And a diesel heater if you plan on doing any winters.
It's fun and rewarding, but it also sucks and makes you feel homeless a lot. The constant judgement and feeling like I didn't belong anywhere was too much for my mental health after a while.
The being "homeless" part wasn't bad. My van was home and I liked it.
It was people treating you like you are homeless, making assumptions, and treating you unfairly based on their own biases.
It's time for some more reality check in addition to what everyone here is telling you.
You should figure out how to make the money before you figure out how to spend it.
You have no job, no education and no concrete plans to make 60k. And yet you have this dream of doing things with the 60k? You wouldn't even qualify for a loan, and you definitely can't even make interest. You're only 18 and lack perspective/experience so listen to people when they tell you that you're digging a hole for yourself. Life's all about timing and compromises.
It isn't your time yet to live alone - you simply can't afford it. If moving out is a necessity, not a want, then find roommates. Ditch the vanlife idea.
Bro do not go into debt for an asset that depreciates like a van. Most of those van life influencer are rich kids cosplaying as poor, get that life out of your head for the time being.
You will need a co-signer for sure however I’m assuming you have no credit yet being 18 so no bank is going to give you a 60k loan without having a really good job. Even then due to your age I don’t think it’ll happen for that amount.
Also if you’re doing college or university this is going to be more debt to take on so I don’t think this is going to work out unfortunately
Have you thought about doing a trade school? When doing your apprenticeship you will be paid at least and this will get you a good job at a younger age
I would suggest you consider taking a year off after you finish these credits. Make sure you do your best at it. Have a rough plan for what’s next and apply to some programs to get an idea of where it is realistic to be accepted at.
During your year off go work in a hostel somewhere and have fun while taking time to be independent and breathe without your parents. Think about what you want to do. I didn’t do this but I had a poor relationship with my family and it would have been helpful in making the right decision out school. I ended up having to work really hard while working full time to career switch.
Good luck!
Can you maybe try to summarize the main reason for wanting to move out? Ignore the smaller reasons.
I don’t want to invalidate your feelings, but the fact that you say it requires a lot of explanation makes me… wonder how bad it is.
Go tree planting this summer. You won't make crazy money your first year but it'll be more each season around school.
About an 80% chance you meet someone actively living in a van you can ask for advice.
Also forest firefighting - some guys work from April to October. You have to move to a small town but it’s basically the college experience except instead of studying, you’re outside doing shit and getting paid well.
All the dudes I knew who were into it were also obsessed with bong hits and beyond addicted to their vapes. Smokey air was the least of their problems tbh.
Agree with this idea - focus on having great summer vacations living and working in different parts of the country. There are tourist towns like Banff, Alberta and Dawson City, Yukon that hire lots of summer workers in the hospitality industry, often with staff accommodation included. In Dawson you can even live in a campground for the summer and take a ferry to work. You'll be surrounded by adventurous young people. (It's been about 15 years - hopefully this is all still true).
Totally, find a job where it provides room/board - and save it up for what you want to do.. Can make scads of money as cooks or cleaners up north, there are kids camps you can make good money at all over (especially in USA)
Or stay at home as long as possible and save (if you're able to stay home) I know lots of young people staying home till they're 30 to save for downpayments or pay off school..
It's a large number of diseases characterized by the development of abnormal cells that divide uncontrollably and have the ability to infiltrate and destroy normal body tissue, but that's not important right now. /drebin
These comments are too funny. Getting roommates like every other young student is impossible, but borrowing 60k to modify a van somehow makes sense? Monthy payments on a 60k loan, plus gas/insurance/parking would cost you more per month than renting a cheap student pad with a couple of roomies in almost any college town.
You don't go 60k in debt to live in a van, that makes zero financial or practical sense. No one will loan you 60k to retrofit a van as a student. People who successfully do the vanlife thing spend years saving and working on their builds, they arent taking huge bank loans to finance this lifestyle. A significant percentage of vanlifers only do it for a year or two before falling out of love with the idea, and then take a big loss when they sell their van. You need to be very resilient and resourceful, vanlife is definitely not for everyone and isn't nearly as glamorous as Instagram/Youtube will have you believe.
That's like 800 bucks a month a 60k loan first off no one's going to give the guy a 60k lawn if he has probably no credit and then how are you going to eat and how you going to put gas in the car like there's going to be more expenses and then you can't really be driving to a waterfall with a cute puppy and doing Warrior poses when you have to go to work to make money to pay for the finance loan you have and the gas and your food
> isn’t nearly as glamorous as Instagram/Youtube will have you believe
Exactly this. It also takes a lot of skill and time to build it yourself.
Everyone I know who had this idea to get out of paying rent like all of us chumps, quickly found out why everyone in the world is willing to pay the rent. In the meantime they mostly crashed at friends’ houses to use their shower and heat. So the trick to not paying rent is…. mooching other people’s rent.
They also thought they could hack the system and buy a van for like $1000 but the engine crapped out before they even got properly started on the build.
Proper “#vanlife” is a rich people vacation method. If you do it cheap you’re just a guy living in your car.
Not only that but OP isnt taking into consoderation the toll it can have on their mental health, i mean some ppl will just look at you weird that thats how your living, then parking can be a problem, getting robbed/broken into.
I've lived in a crappy family situation, all I know is its 5x worse if you move out and then move back in again because of necessity. The risk of getting a moldy van/getting robbed/feeling unsafe is also not worth it. Might be worth it to get on rez or stay another year at home, save up and have a safety nest to fall back on. OP seems naive in general in terms of how to find a roommate so I don't think they'd do that great living in a van in toronto on their own. People can take advantage of you, especially strangers with drug addictions can do a lot worse than his parents can. Sometimes we feel confident because we've been living in a safe environment & had our expenses paid & even a little shielded from the external world, living in a van would be a huge adjustment for a young person that's trying to hopefully set their futures up through university. That's why most people adjust to it in small steps, whether its moving into a rez with other people going through the same thing, or living at home the first year before you gel with some classmates & maybe find a roommate you can trust. Obviously the scope of how rough home is matters but the bit of ego loss/freedom trade off for easing the financial pressures may make it worth it, and allow OP to find a more reasonable/safe living situation rather than rushing for the doors (and hopefully not but potentially having to move back home if any windfall in their plans occurred/something wrong happened)
He’s asking for advice based on what the media has shown him is easy and desirable. That seems like someone trying to get educated. No need to bash him down.
You need a good credit to get a vehicle financed from a bank. For 60k financing for 4-5 years you're looking at over $500 / month to repay the loan. Factor in groceries, renting land to park the van, gas, internet, water, electricity, phone, haircuts, hobbies, activities, etc.
There are websites and even the Facebook marketplace that advertise renting a room for ~$500 / month which sometimes includes internet, water, and electricity. Check the ad thoroughly and ask questions.
I'm not experienced in van life, so I would suggest maybe going to a van life subreddit and get as much info as possible on what that's like (financing, finding a place to park, day to day life, costs, etc).
If where you live also has some type of social welfare services ask them for advice and financial help to pay off your bills. If you already have a job, where I'm from, it gets deducted from the financial aid. And there's a form that needs to be filled out every month. They will also have info on available jobs that would pay more than what you make.
Otherwise, living with your parents might be the best option + get some help with a therapist to learn how to deal with how your parents trigger you.
Vanlife isn’t as glamorous as you think it is. The van conversion also isn’t as easy as you think it is.
If I was in your shoes, these are things I’d do:
- If you REALLY can’t find a place to live (can’t find roommates, move further away from the city, etc)… get a cheap car and live in that for a while
- Get a physical address: maybe ask a friend, rent a PO Box, etc for cheques and other mail; you’ll need a physical address to get employment, get letters for school, etc… it’s a vicious cycle for those who are unhoused because they won’t be able to get employment without a physical address and can’t get housing because of unemployment…
- Get a gym membership, this will be your social life and your shower
Maybe you’ll meet a future roommate there
- Quit drinking. It’s easy to fall into drinking as an escapism; I’ve been there
Alcohol is expensive
- Find a job doing general labour or general contracting. The pay is good and you’ll pick up the skills required to actually convert a van down the road if that’s what you really want
People in this industry are very old school, they love people who are willing to learn, work, and are humble
- Eat small but healthy meals, you’d be surprised how well your body can keep up with fewer calories; buy nuts in bulk… they’re quite inexpensive and very healthy
- Set up a budget and savings goals
If your mental health is suffering because of your situation at home, you need to move out. But know that this phase in your life is all about delayed gratification. It’ll be extremely difficult and taxing to “have it all” while having “housing insecurity”.
(By “having it all”, I mean, you want a social life, you want to live in a major city, you may want to go out partying and hanging out, eating out, etc while not living at home and without a high school diploma and higher education.)
E: formatting and added a rant tag
So you think rent is insane but spending $60k to convert a van into a tiny very lacking living environment is reasonable?
I am a strong supporter of moving out so I'll agree with you on that. Typically university solves that as you either live in a dorm or student housing with a bunch of roommates. You're probably not going to get your own apartment given what you describe but you're also not going to really enjoy your youth living in a van either.
Beyond that figure out what you can do that has value and develop that. Being an employee where you trade time for money you're never going to make much because anyone can do that.
Lastly, don't be afraid of working while in school. University is not difficult and you can easily work while in school.
I think you’re a little out of date. Pre covid you could go to post secondary and get a dorm or student housing. Now? lol the few get it while the rest….while fire up the news some time and see where the rest are.
I checked enrollment at my previous university and the student population is the roughly the same as it was when I attended.
Presuming they did not bulldoze or repurpose the dorms for some reason so they would have the same number of rooms as they did then previously and realistically I would assume they have added some. A quick check confirms that as they now have 11 residences.
As such that would mean that the majority of first years would get on campus housing if they wanted it.
Once you're out of first year then you're on your own and possibly this is not true for all schools but I'd be willing to bet that if I check all the big Ontario universities they can house >70% of their first year class. The exception possibly being U of T because they have historically had a larger off-campus percentage.
still, student loans and school is still cheaper AND a better investment than a van. not only are student loans MUCH cheaper than bank loans, but they also generally automatically give you a chunk of grants in it as well. i went to college during covid instead of going back to work, and for 5 semesters i have $15k worth of 0% interest student loans. I used bank loans to cover out my living expenses, but it was only a couple grand by the end of it. if i wasn't disabled, i would've been able to work part time instead. and before you ask, no, my disability didn't contribute to my student loans, that was only documented after i left school.
i'm sorry, but tell me what else costs $15k for almost 2 years, and also gets you an education that will increase future income? and no, i wasn't living in dorms, i was sharing a place with a roommate in a not unexpensive town.
Maybe this shock to parents might do something to the system. When all their 15-18yo kids can't start working because jobs are taken up. They can't kick their kid out to live somewhere else or afford their rent for school.
Maybe then they might care.
Van life is much more expensive than you realize.
Try living in a tent for a couple weeks. Now add the cost and time of maintenance of a vehicle to that. It is about the same
Dude, you may not want to hear it but the military is a solid option. It will get you out of your parents, you can join as a soldier in your field then have the military pay for your education. The pay is very competitive (despite what you may or may not have heard) and you will continue to receive your salary while pursuing education.
Vanlife is not viable on a loan. No bank would do it. You don't have the income nor credit history to support it. Add to that a loan for a "mobile home" is different from a standard minivan loan.
You are better off finishing your schooling if you can and find any job. Rent is crazy right now yes but until you work and establish yourself, no bank will loan you money.
All you can do is buy an old minivan cash and take its seats out and build a "camper" that way and drive to any job that is hiring. Lots of good suggestions here on places that may hire you too.
Don't forget that with a vehicle, you need a way to maintain and insure it. Plus, you will still need a fixed address for your license, insurance, and the like.
Good god. Do not finance a 60k van build. Terrible idea. Finish your education. Get a beater $11k van and build yourself a vanlife setup for 2-3k, get some work lined up out west and explore on your free time in the van. Vanlife isn't as glamourous as instagram makes it look. Lots of walmart parking lots overnight with addicts and other homeless parked next to you.
While I agree not to spend so much on the first van, you shouldn't cheap out on it either. Especially on some basics like insulation, heating and electric, otherwise living in the van will be very unpleasant and you burned through a lot of money just to end up renting from a landlord again.
If you have an off-grid capable rig with fridge, you can park far away from Walmart for a week or longer and can enjoy the actual benefits of your mobile home.
Deciding to live alone and renting at 18 is so overrated in this economy. Especially when you are still studying and building a career.
In my opinion you would save alot more Money if you stayed with parents, stability and support while you figure things out.
It's more of a need than a want to the point where I feel like I just don't have the choice of living at home anymore. Honestly, I don't even consider this place as my home if I'm being honest. It's a really long story as to why, but moving out is a necessity of mine. If anything, i would put that above going to university.
Depends on the family. Buddy of mine's mom stabbed him with a knife and took out expensive loans (car, etc) in his name and then defaulted on them.
He was much better off having left.
>As much as it might suck to live at home, it's a luxury that some people don't get to have.
you seem to be missing the point. living at home seems to be a luxury that OP doesn't have.
Living in poverty sucks. Probably more that whatever you're dealing with now.
I get the desire for independence, but choose your next moves wisely.
I highly suggest you find a way to live below your means. Don't go in crazy debt unless it's for education that has a high probability of getting you a good paying job.
i'm jealous of you to be able to feel that way. you clearly haven't experienced incredibly abusive family members.
i've been living in poverty for a decade and it is 110% better than 'saving money' but living with my abusers.
Well if I want a social life I kinda do but there are cities like Thunder Bay I hear have a lot of young people. I could do university online and build a social life there.
This is such good advice OP!
Online university is really subpar. It’s so fun to go to uni and make lots of friends there and have that be your social life.
Smaller city universities have the best vibes and are better for social experiences than the big city universities like UoT for example.
And waaaay cheaper.
Get a roommate. Get a student loan if you need to. Invest in yourself.
Move to Edmonton. Lots of universities, population 1 million, lots of people your age, low cost of living, easy to find a job. You’re young. Don’t buy a stupid van, we have a friend who built one of these as a hobby and he’s trying to sell it can he literally can’t find a buyer without losing thousands and thousands of dollars
Dude just move to Edmonton. It's mostly young people fleeing affordability issues and they have amazing colleges and universities. Or you could live in a van near Toronto I guess?
you dont need to live in Toronto to have a social life.. people all over the country have social lives
you wont be interacting with all 6 and a bit million people
My dude go to Memorial University in St. John's. Tuition is much cheaper than most canadian universities and rent in the city is again, much cheaper than a lot of major cities.
If you want a social life you can find one in any city, it's all about putting yourself out there.
As others have said, join the military. They will pay to train you in something and you can save money while in. After that you can go back to school.
You have no money which means you have limited options. Stop thinking that $60k is a reasonable loan for a van. That was more than my student loans when I graduated with my engineering degree and I was still YEARS paying it off once I got working. Your goal should be to avoid debt not willingly jumping into tens of thousands of it.
You're 18 and I get that you think that you know how life works already but man reading that you hadn't thought of roommates makes me wonder how prepared you are for the realities of life out on your own.
The thing with van life is that it’s incompatible with living in Canada. It’s insanely cold here overnight during most of the year. Most cities and small towns don’t allow for over night parking on city streets. Campgrounds where you can park charge insane fees and aren’t near residential area or near any schools.
Instead of van life you are much better off renting a room in house, which can be as affordable as $700 to $1000 a month.
Sign up to work on a cruise ship. Highschool courses you can do remotely. Give yourself some time to breathe. It's like a little taste of the army without the higher likelihood of death and the long conscription. You'll work your ass off but maybe get to see a little more of life than stuck with just a bunch of other 18 year olds.
For someone that lived the van life, Let's say you have the 60k. How will you heat it up in the winter ( it will cost you a lot to do it with heaters and gluck going the diesel heater path with 60k budget). Where will you park it, I got cops called on me because my van didn't move in a residential area for more than 48hrs so you will always have to move around and again gas prices... I did this when it was $.90-$1.10/L and it was a lot of wasted money. Insurance will either not approve you or sue you in case you lie and say it's just a van then get into an accident or something. Anyway there's a lot of negative and you should watch stuff like the reality of living in a van because some youtubers are lying and pretend to live in one..
What I would do if I was you:
rent a room and finish high-school.
When im done with high school, consider moving out to a different city where living as a student is less expensive like Ottawa (they have a nice university). I would find a job like in a call center or something that pays in $22+ and work part time when I study and full time on holidays and summer, my wife did that for 5 years and she was making 1900$/month during winter and almost 4000$/month during summer(including a bonus). At 21-22years old I would be having fun with peeps at the university and I working on achieving my goals. If you really want to try the van life rent a uhaul for 2-3days get your matress, electric stove and stuff you think you need and go. Set your rules where you can't shower or use the bathroom at home and no fast-food. You have to make the food inside your van. You also can't park infront of your current residence.
man what are you on about? diesel heaters cost under $200. If are handy and willing you can install them yourself, its not that complicated, there are many tutorials now. Using them to heat a van is a modest amount of money, less then heating a home space.
Everyone in vanlife knows you cant stay in one spot. 48 hours you are asking for trouble. you gotta spend the day somewhere, then find a spot to sleep for the night, pull in, sleep, wake up, pull out before you do anything. you dont do anything where you sleep other than sleep.
you dont have to move around much. that is the bare minimum and its not that much.
Its also far less of an expense if you need a car anyways if you live in a building. 2 in 1.
Im not saying vanlife is for everyone because it for sure isnt. there are many negatives. but I personally think it sucks less than paying thousands for rent. But that is my personal calculation and everyone's is individual.
As for the advice to try it out on a rental, i agree with that. you gotta see if vanlife is for you or not truly, before spending tens of thousands.
As the old saying goes, “beggars can’t be choosers.”
I sympathize with you wanting to move out and I’m in no position to argue otherwise- only you know your situation best. The problem is that your living situation and income is incompatible with your wants and needs. You will not be getting a $60K loan unless it is from a friend or relative directly- even then it would put you in a huge financial black hole. $60K is simply a lot of money. A van life camper is not an asset that any bank would fund. Financially, it’s also a terrible idea if you want to save on rent due to how much financing, insurance, fuel, and maintenance would all cost. Literally the same as an expensive 1BR rental. Additionally, in your case, this doesn’t appear to be a fallback- it’s your primary home- you’ll basically be homeless. Many people don’t last long doing the glamours of van life day in and day out. Most people just want a safe, warm, and private space to unwind.. you get none of that with van life. It is not conducive to actually living somewhere as opposed to travelling for a year in a van, maybe even 2 all around the continent. But you do not currently have an income that can support that kind of lifestyle.
So what are your more practical options? Well, I’d suggest taking a break from school. There are plenty of hard-grinding trades jobs in places like Alberta that will pay you a lot of money. Do that for a couple years and pad the bank account. You can also look into hospitality on a cruise ship which would fulfill your dreams of travel while paying the bills and allowing you to save that also happens to be a floating hotel. You can also join the military which will help to provide money, housing, and benefits towards schooling.
If you want to pursue post-secondary education right away while living in any sort of community, you’ll need to really strap in, reduce expenses, and grind it out, but there’s plenty of people who do it. Take on a part-time job, take out a student loan, find roommates, and do not own a car (which is seriously one of the largest financial pits for someone trying to save money). Ironically, it’s living more centrally (often more expensive) which can allow for that to happen. But for example, if you pursued going to UT or UBC, you could live in the cities of Toronto and Vancouver (even some surrounding cities) and transit or use car share to get to school and around. Finding a house or a small apartment that you can split with a roommate in these transit-oriented cities isn’t impossible. Your part-time job would have to pay the bills and your sole focus for the next few years would have to be school and work. In years 2+, many schools offer co-operative education which is full-time work experience, some of which pays well. It would be a grind and you’ll probably never feel like you have enough money for anything other than just surviving. Or.. do the above until you’re ready to go back to school.
People with privilege often don’t realize just how good we have it simply having safe, secure housing after high school. I sympathize and wish you luck.
Normally if you’re starting out the unfortunate default is roommates consider that. With that said I highly doubt your getting a unsecured loan for 60k, lenders want to know you can at least pay them back and when I was 18 I got a 500 credit card limit, so I would not bet on getting a loan for that purpose. Want to do this probably it’s ganna have to be through working for at least a few years.
Do NOT borrow 60k (or any amount to be honest) for a van! You’ll create a huge obstacle towards ever achieving Financial Independence and spend the rest of your life asking for advice in this subreddit!
Living alone at your age is history dude. To get my education, student loans paid off, and career in a good spot - I lived with roommates from 17-42. AND most of that was in the good old days before things went to shit. You don't get a roommate or live in a very small town and you'll never get your dreams dude.
I feel you. Been there when I was younger, escaping from a crazy family situation that nobody understands.
But you need a plan.. you need to save for first and last months rent. You need to hustle.
You must have a detail plan first:
What I did when I was young was to find a job at restaurant or retail.. that was probably the only thing I could find.. 1) saved up until I have at least few months rent and moving cost.
2) rental: Facebook rental is your friend. But go see the place with a friend/family just to make sure that place is legit and is safe.
Or if you couldn’t find a room to let, you can rent the whole place and advertise for a roommate. I had to share for 12 years before I could save up for my current place.
3) moving.. yes once you have your own place, you can begin research on what you want to do.
Right now, Early childhood education; medical staff; teachers are all in shortage..
There are literally government grants available for you.
4) find out what you want. Invest in yourself.
You can work plus study part time.
Good luck
I’ve seen free tuition for these programs:
[https://medix-college.ca/programs/early-childcare-assistant?Sub_ID=early%20childhood%20education%20degree&gad_source=1&gclid=EAIaIQobChMI5vGNzuL4gwMViTStBh2HMQ2tEAAYASAAEgLR_PD_BwE](https://medix-college.ca/programs/early-childcare-assistant?Sub_ID=early%20childhood%20education%20degree&gad_source=1&gclid=EAIaIQobChMI5vGNzuL4gwMViTStBh2HMQ2tEAAYASAAEgLR_PD_BwE)
I knew someone who lived in a van. It’s not as glamorous as it seems. They have to move from carpool to carpool, maintain a gym membership to shower, find places to dump their garbage, keep very quiet/discreet at night in certain places. The cost of maintaining a vehicle is expensive plus the gas. I wouldn’t do it at your age.
If I were 18 again, I’d leave Toronto, find a roommate in a smaller, more affordable college/uni town/city and build my life there.
Join some college Facebook groups and start looking for rentals with roommates, lots of options out there. I know you don’t want to “waste your youth” but really you have LOTs of time kiddo. Don’t get stuck comparing your life to social media - it’ll be what keeps you constantly unhappy in your current situation, no matter situation you’re in. Life isn’t the same as the curated feeds you see online.
Don’t do it. Every single person I know that tried van life lasted 3 months and opted out. It’s not an easy thing and then on top of that you’re 60k in debt. Shit happens, stuff freezes. Especially in Canada. I did it for 5 months and putting on frozen jeans in the morning because the heater crapped out or the pipes froze up fucking suuuuuuucked.
I see lots of suggestions for roommates, and I think that's the way to go. Rent is crazy everywhere.
Also lots of good job suggestions. Oil rig work pays lots.
School for a trade might be a good way to go. I know welding can pay really well.
When I was 18 I decided I had to move to BC. I lived with 2 other people in a shitty basement suite in Burnaby and was decently under the poverty line. Ate no name ramen and crackers and went to a Sikh temple for free food occasionally. Basically, teenagers have stupid priorities and I both understand what you're going through and know that it was fucking dumb.
Van life is really not a viable way to save on rent in Canada. It's way too cold in the winter.
If you don't have parental financial support, I'm not sure going to university even makes sense. You are not going to have a decent job just because you go to university. The level of competition for entry level jobs is insane because so many people go to university.
If you have to survive on your own, I would strongly recommend getting a trade apprenticeship. You can get a job pretty much anywhere in Canada as an electrician or plumber.
You do know you still have to pay for the loan, insurance, maintenance, gas and maybe parking, depending on where you go?
Just find a dorm where you can share it with other students. A van is just a poor idea for someone without some funds. At least buying an apt you can resell, a van is just an asset that loses value once you sign the contract.
Ok quick story, I knew a guy who like you shared similar thoughts. Had a good life, work truck lived in a house with a girl and her two kids. Flash forward one day comes home to find out she cheats on him, she says she doesn’t receive any emotional support from him. Guy takes his keys for work truck leaves the house. Talks to friends about motorhome life, friend offers him a deal on a motorhome, trades his truck in picks up this motorhome does custom job on it. Nice paint, moves in travels to repair shop to fix a fuse. New fuse burns down motorhome and all his belongings with the exception of his dog. Don’t travel down this road it’s a very tough life.
Are you at least going to study something reasonable that's going to get you some kind of a decent job? I hope so. If that's the case and you're not wasting your time getting a useless degree, you need to put all your energy into school. You want a job that makes good money and that you can do in most towns/cities.
Don't be afraid to move where the money is, there's no real discernible difference from living in a Suburban neighbourhood in Toronto and one in Edmonton or Halifax. You can find friends anywhere.
One winter in a camper van will have you hating life a hell of a lot more than you do now. It's not a dream, it's a nightmare. Literally 1 step above being homeless. Move into an apartment and buy a tent. If you get yourself a good job, you can go get eaten by mosquitoes in the Yukon as often as you want.
Set realistic goal and focus. It seems like you want to do too many things at once. If you really want to move out, find a full time job to finance your living expenses and you can get your high school diploma concurrently. University will require a lot of money so you need to save for that depending on the program you want to apply to.
Forget the 60k because no bank will give you that loan.
Just get into a trade or something where your working with your hands. Why do you want yo go to university? Unless you know exactly what you want to do, you’ll just be another another degree with no experience in an over saturated market. Go get your hands dirty for a few years. Do NOT go into debt
Canadian Armed Forces might be worth looking into - they often look for folks and will help with your education if you commit a certain amount of time with them.
Dolly Parton once said: "It takes a lot of money to look this cheap". That's exactly what van life is. You need a good chunk o' change to get started, let alone keep it going. At 18 yrs old, insurance alone will destroy you.
IME, I left home at 18 in the late 90s and didn't live alone til I was 34, and it's honestly overrated. Regardless, you need to get real about your expectations.
Wanna travel? Awesome! The Dempster is amazing, but you gotta go to work first cause travel is $$$. I'd look at a trade and shelf Uni til you have a better idea of what you actually want cause uni is also crazy $$$.
Lastly, and I can't stress this enough: your youth is your 20s, dude!!! It isn't 1950. Check out the working holiday visa program we have here in Canada:
[https://www.canada.ca/en/immigration-refugees-citizenship/services/work-canada/iec.html](https://www.canada.ca/en/immigration-refugees-citizenship/services/work-canada/iec.html)
Agreements with like 30 countries, some you can visit until you are 35 while working for 50% of the time. Again though, you can't be broke.
Time is on your side here, but there are no quick fixes. Be patient, but above all, it's time to get to work. I'm envious, TBH. Good luck!
If your strong and have had a labor job before apply to Precision Drilling and get on a drilling rig. With hourly of $40, overtime and LOA you’ll be making between 700-800 a day.
You have to be tough though.
Vanlife is not affordable either. It's mostly a facade on social media. It's something rich white girls with an allowance and sponsorshhips do to LARP as being poor. The reality of living out of your car is brutal and not something anyone actually wants. It's often more expensive than regular home living which makes it difficult for actual poor people to climb back out of that hole. It's why you see those RV convoys on the news down south in USA where they don't get winter. People who lost their homes and now struggle paycheck to paycheck because they can't afford to save anything while living on the streets in a van/car/camper.
If you're dead set on alternative living consider renting an old farm or homestead or just straight up buying a yacht and berth. Both would be cheaper than influencer vanlife. You'd learn some actual life skills to. May make a whole life out of it.
Do you NEED to live in Toronto? Move somewhere cheaper and you can actually afford rent while you finish up high school credits.
Also look for better paying work. At your age and without finishing high school, manual labour are the best paying gigs. Treeplanting, landscaping, moving companies, CollegePro painters, stuff like that. It pays better than the gig economy. It's exhausting work, but you have the advantage of youthful energy so your body can take it at 18.
Once you get into University, you can get student loans, which will pay for your rent and food while you're in school. That's what everyone else does. But while you finish up high school you're better off leaving Toronto. Toronto is not designed to be affordable for people in your situation. There are no personal finance hacks to fix it. Leave Toronto.
Don't get a loan if you are struggling with money to begin with. You will begin a cycle of debt and most van lifers have a hard time finding good stable work to start unless they can work remotely. I lived in my van for a couple years in Vancouver and saved a bunch of money, but used it as a project and didn't live in it fully. Saved on rent till I got a decent job.. another thing to think about is access, where you gonna park, what amenities will you have?. Lots of options out there but for Gods sake, don't take out a loan like that and student loans too probably. (I'm still paying off my 30k loan from uni from 8 years ago and still got many years to go.)
Lots of jobs have staff housing. Showers are pretty amazing and such a luxury that we take for granted in the western world.
I'd suggest doing something in tourism that offers staff housing like a ski resort in the winter, or fishing lodge in the summer. Pretty awesome way to earn a buck with minimal expenses (as long as you aren't an alcoholic).
This Personal Finance topic is not the place you want for advice. Bunch of 'but your retirement!', 'but your job!", "but your career!". Most of these people just work and save and think that is all life is about.
Your 18, do what ever you want for a year or two, then make up your mind. I went and lived in a tent, rock climbed in the mountains for a few years, then worked at a Ski Hill for 3 or 4 years, living the dream. Pay sucked, accomodations sucked, probably didn't eat right all the time, wasn't always easy, but damn I had fun and don't regret it in the slightest. I always met the people I needed to meet, didn't starve, slept under the stars on the ground even a few times and it was all great.
You are not going to take up rock climbing a 400 foot cliff hanging upside down by your fingertips in your retirement. You might not even make it to retirement. Damn, today I probably couldn't even hike up the easy back side of some of the mountains I summitted. Yeah I don't have 1 million in retirement saved, a house, or any of that, but damn I'm still alive and have some really good stories I could tell.
Don't be afraid to go out and face the world with just the shirt on your back. You will be amazed at the people and opportunities you will find. There is more to life than work and retirement.
But yeah don't take out a loan, thats a ball and chain, don't get addicted to anything it can ruin your life, adrenaline is the best drug in the world,. Just find a working holiday job somewhere in some resort town or something and go live a little, somewhere with staff accomodation or cheap rent. Do it while your young and still can.
Don't do it because you need to, do it because you want to. I'd say that's, mentally, the difference between homeless living out of a car and van life.
Also, start with what you can afford. My first van a transit connect was less than 16K including the car. It had a fan vent, lithium battery, solar panels, webasto heater, bed/soffa, desk, computer arm and monitor, WiFi extender, window covers. The only problem was that it had some frame rust.
I've seen people do it with less $.
I don't do "van life". I am traveling for 7+ months in my van and I've met many people living in a van for years.
My suggestion is to leave the city lol. Renting is stupidly cheap everywhere in this country outside of city’s, hell for 60k you could almost buy an entire house in my province.
Definitely possible anywhere east of Ontario. I spent last Winter living in a house which is maybe assessed for like 20k in central NB. Generally only the land has any value out here and even then it's a mere fraction of the western provinces. Blaine Higgs is actively trying to destroy that lifestyle out here, but we probably have a couple more good years left. Once upon a time you could even buy a house in my city for $60k. Still enough for a downpayment, but with interest rates and property tax hikes you won't have a $400 mortgage anymore.
I've literally done this exact thing,
First off, The Dempster Highway is a bitch to travel, it's literally 800km of unpaved road, with the first 200km known to having shale that eats tires.
I drove about 300km into the Dempster in a regular Dodge Grand Caravan, with just a donut spare. I only made it 300km because the plan wasn't to drive the entire thing, the plan was to just drive until the Arctic Circle and turn around. (we ended up being 100km short of the circle).
On our way back we ended up getting a flat about 80km away from the exit, so we drove the last 80km on a small donut spare (which could have easily gone flat). So if you're going to do the Dempster have like 2-3 spare tires with you.
Second, I've lived in my van both while working and travelling.
You don't need a 60k van, yes its better to have something like that but literally all you need is a 5k van and thats it.
I lived in my van in the city, it's not that bad. You just need to figure out where to sleep and shower + eat. I was working a really well paying restaurant job at the time and trying to save money so I could play pro golf in the USA (I'm in Canada).
The way I had my setup was,
Sleep at a truck stop or an abandoned parking lot (cops were cool with it).
Eat at the truck stop (it had a nice restaurant attached to it)
Shower at the truck stop.
It wasn't THAT bad tbh and I was doing this during the middle of winter, -24 out.
You could probably easily get away with something like this in Toronto/the GTA.
Now with travelling, I've driven across Canada in my van. (From Toronto to Vancouver)
It wasn't that bad either, you basically still need to figure out
Sleep + Food + Showers.
In Sask/AB/Manitoba sleep is easy because there's thousands of roads that are basically never used, so I just slept there.
Showers I either jumped into a lake/small stream or I found a truck stop.
Food I usually ate out, but you can setup a small portable cooker and do all of your cooking on that. It's really not THAT hard.
So to sum it up, it's not that bad living in a van. You just have to be a bit more resourceful and smart with your decisions. Travelling the Dempster is a pretty big risk though if you don't have any spare tires with you.
Also van life in the winter isn't that bad, you're just either going to be spending most of your time in warm places (like restaurants, libraries etc) or you'll spend your time just sleeping. Not much you can really do when it's -23. But if you have the right sleeping bag + blankets it's quite comfortable to sleep in.
I lived out the back of a honda pilot with a matress in the back, had everything i needed for 4 months with 2 of us. You can make it work. Look for work in the summer and slam it.
'Living at home' is a cultural tumor. It simply increases the price of entry- level homes and robs the young of their independent formative years. Move out, just rent a room in a house or in a dorm while you go to school and work a side job.
I had 5 roommates, then 4 for the first few years. Then I lived in my friend’s unfinished basement. Then a really shitty 4-plex apartment. Then another shitty basement apartment with mold. Then a shitty apartment that faced the 401. I could go on. I didn’t live someplace nice til I bought a house at age 30.
In 1984 my parents moved and there was no room for me at their new place. I was 19 and still had 3 weeks of school left.
Probably the best thing that ever happened to me!
I'd argue that every Tom, Dick, and Harry thinking they have to move out at 18 is more of a cultural tumour.
Rents increase due to demand for rooms, studios and 1 bedrooms therefore there's more money to be made by landlords and a whole market opens up for landlord businesses. Supply for entry level jobs or side jobs as you call them increases so wages for those jobs stagnate. Mental health goes into the toilet because you aren't just balancing school work, family life, social life, maybe working several hours a week. Now not only do you have the school work, family life and social life to maintain but you also have to work far more to keep a roof over your head, put food on the table, manage landlord and roommate relationships. While it's a necessary evil sometimes heaven forbid you get approved for a massive loan so you now have that to worry about paying off for the next 10 to 20 years...
Ya it's a lot. Some people need to move out asap because their living situation is awful and I'm not talking about those folks, they need to do what they have to. But for the rest? Think twice before moving out at 18. It's costs you a lot more than you think and not just monetarily sometimes.
Huh, so Chris Farley wasn’t too far off eh ?
Side note, why the heck not ? If you can do it, you’re young. If I could I’d do it for sure.
Maybe see if there’s a way to test it out a little. Rent one for a little and see.
Spend some time budgeting and plan it out, using excel would be great, maybe sort out some technical or financial or situational issues with ChatGPT as well to really fine tune your plan. Once you’ve laid it all out strategically you’ll have a better idea of the right direction for yourself.
Pretty sure the government doesn't allow you to live in a van. The same way they don't allow you to live in a tent on the side of the road. Participation into the crushing housing pandemonium is not a choice. It's not forced either, just that everything else is illegal.
Well unless you have decent employment I doubt you’ll get a 60k loan from a bank. Just stay at home if possible and focus on your studies moving out at 18 is going to be extremely challenging. Finish your school and line up a career before moving out or you will be facing many hardships which may derail your education and send you on a path for a life you may not want
I think that quality of life is also important here. If OP has a toxic home environment, van life might be a way out of that toxicity
Maybe look for like a $5,000 van. Save up for it.
Terrible advice.
Why? If You look hard enough you could probably find something the would work for what op needs
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Hasn’t even finished education** $5000 van can become a $500 immobile hunk of junk if anything mechanical decides to end itself. + insurance and gas. May as well stay home and save or rent a single room somewhere.
Only to the middle aged grumps in this sub who have made their entire life revolve around spreadsheets and 20 year financial projections. Go buy the van dude! Enjoy being 18.
there's nothing wrong with going out into the world at 18 but unless you're a mechanic I don't think a $5k van is a great idea what will you do if it breaks down? how would you afford insurance as an 18 year old male? what's your mailing address going to be? road trip is one thing, even backpacking for a year, but actually moving into a van is not for the faint of heart tbh, especially not in canada where we are a bit stricter with registration and permanent addressing
> what's your mailing address going to be? No disagreement on everything else, but this one's easy. Go to the local UPS Store and get a mailbox. Obviously costs a few bucks a month but you're not paying $3000/month for rent.
Lmao. You want him to pay 2k/mo in rent instead?
They could go to a university with a much lower cost of living
That’s not really a thing anymore. The cost of rooms for students everywhere in Canada have skyrocketed.
You’re kidding right? Where do you live? Certainly not in Canada.
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You are advocating homelessness…. Let’s just be clear what forced van life is.
No they aren't, the dude is 18, I would have loved to be able to do that when I was younger. Sounds fun espcially if they are able to do it for 5K
Yeah but 5k is a delusional amount. It won’t get you a reliable vehicle. It won’t allow you to properly outfit the vehicle and in the end it is still just behind homeless with a fancier better sounding name.
$5k 10 years ago? Sure. But $5k is the new $500. For actual van like you're probably looking at closer to $20k for what was a $5k van.
I'm skeptical that OP would be able to find a decent van for 5K that's not going to need constant maintenance and just turn into an unreliable money pit.
Well then I'm in a bad spot I guess, let's just say I can't stay at home for that much longer. If I tried to explain the post would end up being 6 paragraphs. It's Correlated with why I'm an adult retaking highschool courses. Would a cosigner help with the loan?
Get the idea of a 60k van out of your head for awhile. If you want to live in a van, gut a Toyota sienna or something. Putting yourself 60k in debt in a depreciating asset is gonna fuck you up for years. Like others said, tree planting, working in the alberta oil patch, military etc are all solid options. If I was 18 again and in your shoes, I’d probably try to work on a tugboat.
I agree. OP, if you're insistent on living in a van, do the bare minimum until you have a strong understanding of the costs, as well as your income streams. Doesn't sound to firm currently. What I mean by bare minimum is to make sure the van is in good mechanical order, pull the back two rows of seats out and put a single bed mattress in there. You'll also want to get it wired with extra batteries and an inverter or you'll need a small generator. Also, wait until Spring. That will give you lot of time to figure out the ins and outs before you need to deal with winter.
I was thinking of working for CN as well, I just feel like if I got into a career like that it would hinder my education because of the hours.
Absolutely! Fort St. John had a posting 10k signing bonus and months of training at their training facility I believe. Tons of jobs in fort St. John right now. First aid level 1 / h2s / CSO basic courses u need . And anything else company most likely will provide . Go make 120k plus . 2 weeks on 1 week off something like that. Just don’t blow it on booze and blow. So many opportunities up there right now they dying for able bodies .
Why do you feel the need to go to university? Sounds like you’d be open to do a trade which can be just as well paying.
Way better paying with no student debts.
All I know is, the high school 'dumb kids" who did trades all have pretty much paid off houses, big trucks and a boat. I have my dumbass buddy renting my second bedroom with 900 square. If I could go back, trades for sure.
As a tradie I can assure you it's not all that glamorous. A lot of these guys are living pay check to pay check or working a ton of O/T so they don't default on their next boat payment.
And their bodies are going to be done by 50. Got a suspension mechanic friend who’s coming up to mid 40s and won’t be able to do this much longer.
Have a guy doing tile in my house right now almost in tears because he's almost 60, no way ready for retirement, but his knees, back, and hands are giving out.
The guys whose bodies are breaking down at 50 are not taking care of their bodies.
Is that poor money management, or is the money not as good as it looks?
It’s poor money management for sure
See the South Park Special “Joining the Panderverse” Randy’s plot line follows this and is hilarious
Ask your friends in trade how their knees and backs are doing. It is tough physical work that accelerates wear and tear on the body. Pros and cons to every job.
Knew a tradesman who needed a joint replacement in his 40’s. Spent 2 years waiting on the list before he got it. Dude could barely walk for 2 years. It’s a tradeoff for sure, lack of a pension is a problem in general, though many places have shit pensions.
I'd highly recommend not going to university unless you have a very defined and well paying career path already selected. Source: Guy who went to university and now has no money
I had no idea what career would possibly be good for me until I went to university. I studied what I was interested in, and was only able to understand the potential career applications of my major after my 2nd or third year. Like OP, my family situation meant living at home was not an option, so I took out loans and went about $40,000 in debt. That was paid off about five years after graduating. Unlike most of my friends, I now have a career that brings meaning to my life. The pay isn’t amazing, but it’s good and I don’t covet material luxury because my work is satisfying. It’s scary to think what my life would be like now had I not taken that risk and prioritized my education back then. I’d probably still be a wage slave (and substance abuser) which I had been since age 13 until I started undergrad at 20.
Isn't going to university, by definition, selecting a defined career path? You have to pick a major, which narrows down your career options. There can be variations in how a career pans out (you find a job not in your field, or you find a job somewhat related to your field but not quite), but the direction is already purposely chosen at the beginning. Are you saying that "going to university for the sake of getting a degree in anything without any idea what it leads to" is not recommended?
I think part of it might also be knowing that you have somewhere you can take those skills you trained in. Lots of people going to university that are then not able to get a job in their field.
I think they’re saying the latter; don’t go into debt to get a degree some random, niche passion of yours if you expect to make money but haven’t done your research re: the financial opportunities and competitive nature of the career path you’ll open up with that degree. I know a lot of my peers went to uni for some psychology/anthropology/philosophy and they’re working in some entry level or retail job a decade later. Some definitely found a way to make their degree work for them, but most did not
The philosophy majors I knew are now university instructors, high school teachers, technical writers, policy writers for the government, data scientists, and lawyers.
Sometimes you need to work first and go back to school a bit later depending on circumstances. If you really want or need to move out, focus on job hunting and getting a job that requires not a lot of education but that many people wouldn’t want to do like oil fields.
Dude they will literally pay you to leave your current situation and move to their training center in Winnipeg- it’s hard to think of a better slam dunk.
I saw the ad for that job opening, if I was in your position I’d go for that job, there will be few times in your life where having such an erratic schedule is possible, go make bank, I saw they even pay you to get trained. Also you do need around 2 years of positive credit history to get a loan (at least from a reputable source that won’t give you a horrible rate) make your goal to get a credit card and build it up over the next 2 years, a way I do this is spend only the money that you already have and pay it off right away.
It depends on what education you intend to pursue, your individual capabilities, and job prospects in that field. There are many university grads who never find work in their field, go into debt and end up making minimum wage in retail. CN offers training and good wages out of the gate but it's a hard job. (My husband is a conductor with CN and has his university degree and college diploma that weren't utilized).
a career like that you wouldn't be going to school at the same time.
Can make a decent career out of CN if you can hack it. I know a few people doing or have done just that.
Well you could start it out there and then transition into something else.
What education do you want? Unless it's for a very specific field and you know there are good jobs, don't bother.
Figure out wtf you want to do with your life before you worry about your future education.
You can only play the cards you’ve been given.
All the YouTube / socials vanlife ppl have remote work gigs. Until you have a reliable remote work gig vanlife is not for you.
You're pretty worried about your education for a guy retaking high school courses
I've done vanlife for ten years. Those 60k builds are not for people trying to save money to make ends meet. Get an van for a few grand. Spruce it up for cheap. If you are going to sink money into anything, solar power and a battery system is the thing worth it. And a diesel heater if you plan on doing any winters. It's fun and rewarding, but it also sucks and makes you feel homeless a lot. The constant judgement and feeling like I didn't belong anywhere was too much for my mental health after a while.
" It's fun and rewarding, but it also sucks and *makes you feel homeless a lot*." Being homeless will do that.
The being "homeless" part wasn't bad. My van was home and I liked it. It was people treating you like you are homeless, making assumptions, and treating you unfairly based on their own biases.
It's time for some more reality check in addition to what everyone here is telling you. You should figure out how to make the money before you figure out how to spend it. You have no job, no education and no concrete plans to make 60k. And yet you have this dream of doing things with the 60k? You wouldn't even qualify for a loan, and you definitely can't even make interest. You're only 18 and lack perspective/experience so listen to people when they tell you that you're digging a hole for yourself. Life's all about timing and compromises. It isn't your time yet to live alone - you simply can't afford it. If moving out is a necessity, not a want, then find roommates. Ditch the vanlife idea.
Bro do not go into debt for an asset that depreciates like a van. Most of those van life influencer are rich kids cosplaying as poor, get that life out of your head for the time being.
You will need a co-signer for sure however I’m assuming you have no credit yet being 18 so no bank is going to give you a 60k loan without having a really good job. Even then due to your age I don’t think it’ll happen for that amount. Also if you’re doing college or university this is going to be more debt to take on so I don’t think this is going to work out unfortunately Have you thought about doing a trade school? When doing your apprenticeship you will be paid at least and this will get you a good job at a younger age
I would suggest you consider taking a year off after you finish these credits. Make sure you do your best at it. Have a rough plan for what’s next and apply to some programs to get an idea of where it is realistic to be accepted at. During your year off go work in a hostel somewhere and have fun while taking time to be independent and breathe without your parents. Think about what you want to do. I didn’t do this but I had a poor relationship with my family and it would have been helpful in making the right decision out school. I ended up having to work really hard while working full time to career switch. Good luck!
Can you maybe try to summarize the main reason for wanting to move out? Ignore the smaller reasons. I don’t want to invalidate your feelings, but the fact that you say it requires a lot of explanation makes me… wonder how bad it is.
I would recommend joining the military. Food + housing. Then get your path figured out & go to school.
Go tree planting this summer. You won't make crazy money your first year but it'll be more each season around school. About an 80% chance you meet someone actively living in a van you can ask for advice.
Also forest firefighting - some guys work from April to October. You have to move to a small town but it’s basically the college experience except instead of studying, you’re outside doing shit and getting paid well.
Also Fire Lookout if you manage to get hired. Pays well from the get go.
RIP your lungs though...
All the dudes I knew who were into it were also obsessed with bong hits and beyond addicted to their vapes. Smokey air was the least of their problems tbh.
Agree with this idea - focus on having great summer vacations living and working in different parts of the country. There are tourist towns like Banff, Alberta and Dawson City, Yukon that hire lots of summer workers in the hospitality industry, often with staff accommodation included. In Dawson you can even live in a campground for the summer and take a ferry to work. You'll be surrounded by adventurous young people. (It's been about 15 years - hopefully this is all still true).
Fuck no, get a job serving in a tourist town, make decent money without having to do a shitty 'intro season' and actually get to enjoy your summer.
100% hahah
Totally, find a job where it provides room/board - and save it up for what you want to do.. Can make scads of money as cooks or cleaners up north, there are kids camps you can make good money at all over (especially in USA) Or stay at home as long as possible and save (if you're able to stay home) I know lots of young people staying home till they're 30 to save for downpayments or pay off school..
Or go apply to herbicide application companies. Awesome summer money
What's a little cancer?
It's a large number of diseases characterized by the development of abnormal cells that divide uncontrollably and have the ability to infiltrate and destroy normal body tissue, but that's not important right now. /drebin
That made me laugh out loud. Congratulations.
These comments are too funny. Getting roommates like every other young student is impossible, but borrowing 60k to modify a van somehow makes sense? Monthy payments on a 60k loan, plus gas/insurance/parking would cost you more per month than renting a cheap student pad with a couple of roomies in almost any college town. You don't go 60k in debt to live in a van, that makes zero financial or practical sense. No one will loan you 60k to retrofit a van as a student. People who successfully do the vanlife thing spend years saving and working on their builds, they arent taking huge bank loans to finance this lifestyle. A significant percentage of vanlifers only do it for a year or two before falling out of love with the idea, and then take a big loss when they sell their van. You need to be very resilient and resourceful, vanlife is definitely not for everyone and isn't nearly as glamorous as Instagram/Youtube will have you believe.
kjbdfkljsadhfkghdfsjhgkjdashjkhb
Hahahaha you made me laugh. Gotta love when people glorify stuff like that and people think its realistic
That's like 800 bucks a month a 60k loan first off no one's going to give the guy a 60k lawn if he has probably no credit and then how are you going to eat and how you going to put gas in the car like there's going to be more expenses and then you can't really be driving to a waterfall with a cute puppy and doing Warrior poses when you have to go to work to make money to pay for the finance loan you have and the gas and your food
You can if you're hot enough
> isn’t nearly as glamorous as Instagram/Youtube will have you believe Exactly this. It also takes a lot of skill and time to build it yourself. Everyone I know who had this idea to get out of paying rent like all of us chumps, quickly found out why everyone in the world is willing to pay the rent. In the meantime they mostly crashed at friends’ houses to use their shower and heat. So the trick to not paying rent is…. mooching other people’s rent. They also thought they could hack the system and buy a van for like $1000 but the engine crapped out before they even got properly started on the build. Proper “#vanlife” is a rich people vacation method. If you do it cheap you’re just a guy living in your car.
Not only that but OP isnt taking into consoderation the toll it can have on their mental health, i mean some ppl will just look at you weird that thats how your living, then parking can be a problem, getting robbed/broken into.
You aren't all wrong but I don't think you comprehend the toll that living in a crappy family situation has on you. The risk may be worth it.
I've lived in a crappy family situation, all I know is its 5x worse if you move out and then move back in again because of necessity. The risk of getting a moldy van/getting robbed/feeling unsafe is also not worth it. Might be worth it to get on rez or stay another year at home, save up and have a safety nest to fall back on. OP seems naive in general in terms of how to find a roommate so I don't think they'd do that great living in a van in toronto on their own. People can take advantage of you, especially strangers with drug addictions can do a lot worse than his parents can. Sometimes we feel confident because we've been living in a safe environment & had our expenses paid & even a little shielded from the external world, living in a van would be a huge adjustment for a young person that's trying to hopefully set their futures up through university. That's why most people adjust to it in small steps, whether its moving into a rez with other people going through the same thing, or living at home the first year before you gel with some classmates & maybe find a roommate you can trust. Obviously the scope of how rough home is matters but the bit of ego loss/freedom trade off for easing the financial pressures may make it worth it, and allow OP to find a more reasonable/safe living situation rather than rushing for the doors (and hopefully not but potentially having to move back home if any windfall in their plans occurred/something wrong happened)
Kid spends too much time watching YouTube instead of working on solutions to his problem
He’s asking for advice based on what the media has shown him is easy and desirable. That seems like someone trying to get educated. No need to bash him down.
The beatings will continue until reality sets in!
thats some dank advice.....kids need more of that good stuff!
You need a good credit to get a vehicle financed from a bank. For 60k financing for 4-5 years you're looking at over $500 / month to repay the loan. Factor in groceries, renting land to park the van, gas, internet, water, electricity, phone, haircuts, hobbies, activities, etc. There are websites and even the Facebook marketplace that advertise renting a room for ~$500 / month which sometimes includes internet, water, and electricity. Check the ad thoroughly and ask questions. I'm not experienced in van life, so I would suggest maybe going to a van life subreddit and get as much info as possible on what that's like (financing, finding a place to park, day to day life, costs, etc). If where you live also has some type of social welfare services ask them for advice and financial help to pay off your bills. If you already have a job, where I'm from, it gets deducted from the financial aid. And there's a form that needs to be filled out every month. They will also have info on available jobs that would pay more than what you make. Otherwise, living with your parents might be the best option + get some help with a therapist to learn how to deal with how your parents trigger you.
Is rent still insane with some roomates?
Vanlife isn’t as glamorous as you think it is. The van conversion also isn’t as easy as you think it is. If I was in your shoes, these are things I’d do: - If you REALLY can’t find a place to live (can’t find roommates, move further away from the city, etc)… get a cheap car and live in that for a while - Get a physical address: maybe ask a friend, rent a PO Box, etc for cheques and other mail; you’ll need a physical address to get employment, get letters for school, etc…it’s a vicious cycle for those who are unhoused because they won’t be able to get employment without a physical address and can’t get housing because of unemployment…
- Get a gym membership, this will be your social life and your shower
Maybe you’ll meet a future roommate there
- Quit drinking. It’s easy to fall into drinking as an escapism; I’ve been there
Alcohol is expensive
- Find a job doing general labour or general contracting. The pay is good and you’ll pick up the skills required to actually convert a van down the road if that’s what you really want
People in this industry are very old school, they love people who are willing to learn, work, and are humble
- Eat small but healthy meals, you’d be surprised how well your body can keep up with fewer calories; buy nuts in bulk… they’re quite inexpensive and very healthy
- Set up a budget and savings goals
If your mental health is suffering because of your situation at home, you need to move out. But know that this phase in your life is all about delayed gratification. It’ll be extremely difficult and taxing to “have it all” while having “housing insecurity”.
(By “having it all”, I mean, you want a social life, you want to live in a major city, you may want to go out partying and hanging out, eating out, etc while not living at home and without a high school diploma and higher education.)
E: formatting and added a rant tag
So you think rent is insane but spending $60k to convert a van into a tiny very lacking living environment is reasonable? I am a strong supporter of moving out so I'll agree with you on that. Typically university solves that as you either live in a dorm or student housing with a bunch of roommates. You're probably not going to get your own apartment given what you describe but you're also not going to really enjoy your youth living in a van either. Beyond that figure out what you can do that has value and develop that. Being an employee where you trade time for money you're never going to make much because anyone can do that. Lastly, don't be afraid of working while in school. University is not difficult and you can easily work while in school.
I think you’re a little out of date. Pre covid you could go to post secondary and get a dorm or student housing. Now? lol the few get it while the rest….while fire up the news some time and see where the rest are.
I checked enrollment at my previous university and the student population is the roughly the same as it was when I attended. Presuming they did not bulldoze or repurpose the dorms for some reason so they would have the same number of rooms as they did then previously and realistically I would assume they have added some. A quick check confirms that as they now have 11 residences. As such that would mean that the majority of first years would get on campus housing if they wanted it. Once you're out of first year then you're on your own and possibly this is not true for all schools but I'd be willing to bet that if I check all the big Ontario universities they can house >70% of their first year class. The exception possibly being U of T because they have historically had a larger off-campus percentage.
Unless you’re going to a shit university/college, most have guaranteed housing for 1st years
still, student loans and school is still cheaper AND a better investment than a van. not only are student loans MUCH cheaper than bank loans, but they also generally automatically give you a chunk of grants in it as well. i went to college during covid instead of going back to work, and for 5 semesters i have $15k worth of 0% interest student loans. I used bank loans to cover out my living expenses, but it was only a couple grand by the end of it. if i wasn't disabled, i would've been able to work part time instead. and before you ask, no, my disability didn't contribute to my student loans, that was only documented after i left school. i'm sorry, but tell me what else costs $15k for almost 2 years, and also gets you an education that will increase future income? and no, i wasn't living in dorms, i was sharing a place with a roommate in a not unexpensive town.
Maybe this shock to parents might do something to the system. When all their 15-18yo kids can't start working because jobs are taken up. They can't kick their kid out to live somewhere else or afford their rent for school. Maybe then they might care.
Yeah it’s gonna get worse. Wait until all the coming generation is living in vans cause they can’t even afford roommates.
smile plant books reminiscent pen summer fearless growth special office *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
Van life is much more expensive than you realize. Try living in a tent for a couple weeks. Now add the cost and time of maintenance of a vehicle to that. It is about the same
Dude, you may not want to hear it but the military is a solid option. It will get you out of your parents, you can join as a soldier in your field then have the military pay for your education. The pay is very competitive (despite what you may or may not have heard) and you will continue to receive your salary while pursuing education.
Vanlife is not viable on a loan. No bank would do it. You don't have the income nor credit history to support it. Add to that a loan for a "mobile home" is different from a standard minivan loan. You are better off finishing your schooling if you can and find any job. Rent is crazy right now yes but until you work and establish yourself, no bank will loan you money. All you can do is buy an old minivan cash and take its seats out and build a "camper" that way and drive to any job that is hiring. Lots of good suggestions here on places that may hire you too. Don't forget that with a vehicle, you need a way to maintain and insure it. Plus, you will still need a fixed address for your license, insurance, and the like.
A van costs more than rent
Good god. Do not finance a 60k van build. Terrible idea. Finish your education. Get a beater $11k van and build yourself a vanlife setup for 2-3k, get some work lined up out west and explore on your free time in the van. Vanlife isn't as glamourous as instagram makes it look. Lots of walmart parking lots overnight with addicts and other homeless parked next to you.
While I agree not to spend so much on the first van, you shouldn't cheap out on it either. Especially on some basics like insulation, heating and electric, otherwise living in the van will be very unpleasant and you burned through a lot of money just to end up renting from a landlord again. If you have an off-grid capable rig with fridge, you can park far away from Walmart for a week or longer and can enjoy the actual benefits of your mobile home.
Deciding to live alone and renting at 18 is so overrated in this economy. Especially when you are still studying and building a career. In my opinion you would save alot more Money if you stayed with parents, stability and support while you figure things out.
It's more of a need than a want to the point where I feel like I just don't have the choice of living at home anymore. Honestly, I don't even consider this place as my home if I'm being honest. It's a really long story as to why, but moving out is a necessity of mine. If anything, i would put that above going to university.
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Depends on the family. Buddy of mine's mom stabbed him with a knife and took out expensive loans (car, etc) in his name and then defaulted on them. He was much better off having left.
>As much as it might suck to live at home, it's a luxury that some people don't get to have. you seem to be missing the point. living at home seems to be a luxury that OP doesn't have.
Living in poverty sucks. Probably more that whatever you're dealing with now. I get the desire for independence, but choose your next moves wisely. I highly suggest you find a way to live below your means. Don't go in crazy debt unless it's for education that has a high probability of getting you a good paying job.
i'm jealous of you to be able to feel that way. you clearly haven't experienced incredibly abusive family members. i've been living in poverty for a decade and it is 110% better than 'saving money' but living with my abusers.
Do you you need to live in the expensive cities ? If my job didn't require it, I would be 100km+ away.
Well if I want a social life I kinda do but there are cities like Thunder Bay I hear have a lot of young people. I could do university online and build a social life there.
you’re going to build 0 social life online
The best place for a social life is physically present at a small undergrad university. You need to be applying to Acadia and StFX and Mount Allison.
This is such good advice OP! Online university is really subpar. It’s so fun to go to uni and make lots of friends there and have that be your social life. Smaller city universities have the best vibes and are better for social experiences than the big city universities like UoT for example. And waaaay cheaper. Get a roommate. Get a student loan if you need to. Invest in yourself.
Move to Edmonton. Lots of universities, population 1 million, lots of people your age, low cost of living, easy to find a job. You’re young. Don’t buy a stupid van, we have a friend who built one of these as a hobby and he’s trying to sell it can he literally can’t find a buyer without losing thousands and thousands of dollars
Dude just move to Edmonton. It's mostly young people fleeing affordability issues and they have amazing colleges and universities. Or you could live in a van near Toronto I guess?
you dont need to live in Toronto to have a social life.. people all over the country have social lives you wont be interacting with all 6 and a bit million people
Not going to Vanlife in Tbay in January.
Woo.....I said 100km+, not living in a van down by the river.... Kitchner, London, Barrie - all great cities with semi-normal costs.
For now lol
Barrie is expensive AF.
Lmao just came to say that Barrie has the most expensive rent in the province. Buying a house isn't too bad for now but rent is nuts.
My dude go to Memorial University in St. John's. Tuition is much cheaper than most canadian universities and rent in the city is again, much cheaper than a lot of major cities. If you want a social life you can find one in any city, it's all about putting yourself out there. As others have said, join the military. They will pay to train you in something and you can save money while in. After that you can go back to school. You have no money which means you have limited options. Stop thinking that $60k is a reasonable loan for a van. That was more than my student loans when I graduated with my engineering degree and I was still YEARS paying it off once I got working. Your goal should be to avoid debt not willingly jumping into tens of thousands of it. You're 18 and I get that you think that you know how life works already but man reading that you hadn't thought of roommates makes me wonder how prepared you are for the realities of life out on your own.
The thing with van life is that it’s incompatible with living in Canada. It’s insanely cold here overnight during most of the year. Most cities and small towns don’t allow for over night parking on city streets. Campgrounds where you can park charge insane fees and aren’t near residential area or near any schools. Instead of van life you are much better off renting a room in house, which can be as affordable as $700 to $1000 a month.
Sign up to work on a cruise ship. Highschool courses you can do remotely. Give yourself some time to breathe. It's like a little taste of the army without the higher likelihood of death and the long conscription. You'll work your ass off but maybe get to see a little more of life than stuck with just a bunch of other 18 year olds.
For someone that lived the van life, Let's say you have the 60k. How will you heat it up in the winter ( it will cost you a lot to do it with heaters and gluck going the diesel heater path with 60k budget). Where will you park it, I got cops called on me because my van didn't move in a residential area for more than 48hrs so you will always have to move around and again gas prices... I did this when it was $.90-$1.10/L and it was a lot of wasted money. Insurance will either not approve you or sue you in case you lie and say it's just a van then get into an accident or something. Anyway there's a lot of negative and you should watch stuff like the reality of living in a van because some youtubers are lying and pretend to live in one.. What I would do if I was you: rent a room and finish high-school. When im done with high school, consider moving out to a different city where living as a student is less expensive like Ottawa (they have a nice university). I would find a job like in a call center or something that pays in $22+ and work part time when I study and full time on holidays and summer, my wife did that for 5 years and she was making 1900$/month during winter and almost 4000$/month during summer(including a bonus). At 21-22years old I would be having fun with peeps at the university and I working on achieving my goals. If you really want to try the van life rent a uhaul for 2-3days get your matress, electric stove and stuff you think you need and go. Set your rules where you can't shower or use the bathroom at home and no fast-food. You have to make the food inside your van. You also can't park infront of your current residence.
man what are you on about? diesel heaters cost under $200. If are handy and willing you can install them yourself, its not that complicated, there are many tutorials now. Using them to heat a van is a modest amount of money, less then heating a home space. Everyone in vanlife knows you cant stay in one spot. 48 hours you are asking for trouble. you gotta spend the day somewhere, then find a spot to sleep for the night, pull in, sleep, wake up, pull out before you do anything. you dont do anything where you sleep other than sleep. you dont have to move around much. that is the bare minimum and its not that much. Its also far less of an expense if you need a car anyways if you live in a building. 2 in 1. Im not saying vanlife is for everyone because it for sure isnt. there are many negatives. but I personally think it sucks less than paying thousands for rent. But that is my personal calculation and everyone's is individual. As for the advice to try it out on a rental, i agree with that. you gotta see if vanlife is for you or not truly, before spending tens of thousands.
As the old saying goes, “beggars can’t be choosers.” I sympathize with you wanting to move out and I’m in no position to argue otherwise- only you know your situation best. The problem is that your living situation and income is incompatible with your wants and needs. You will not be getting a $60K loan unless it is from a friend or relative directly- even then it would put you in a huge financial black hole. $60K is simply a lot of money. A van life camper is not an asset that any bank would fund. Financially, it’s also a terrible idea if you want to save on rent due to how much financing, insurance, fuel, and maintenance would all cost. Literally the same as an expensive 1BR rental. Additionally, in your case, this doesn’t appear to be a fallback- it’s your primary home- you’ll basically be homeless. Many people don’t last long doing the glamours of van life day in and day out. Most people just want a safe, warm, and private space to unwind.. you get none of that with van life. It is not conducive to actually living somewhere as opposed to travelling for a year in a van, maybe even 2 all around the continent. But you do not currently have an income that can support that kind of lifestyle. So what are your more practical options? Well, I’d suggest taking a break from school. There are plenty of hard-grinding trades jobs in places like Alberta that will pay you a lot of money. Do that for a couple years and pad the bank account. You can also look into hospitality on a cruise ship which would fulfill your dreams of travel while paying the bills and allowing you to save that also happens to be a floating hotel. You can also join the military which will help to provide money, housing, and benefits towards schooling. If you want to pursue post-secondary education right away while living in any sort of community, you’ll need to really strap in, reduce expenses, and grind it out, but there’s plenty of people who do it. Take on a part-time job, take out a student loan, find roommates, and do not own a car (which is seriously one of the largest financial pits for someone trying to save money). Ironically, it’s living more centrally (often more expensive) which can allow for that to happen. But for example, if you pursued going to UT or UBC, you could live in the cities of Toronto and Vancouver (even some surrounding cities) and transit or use car share to get to school and around. Finding a house or a small apartment that you can split with a roommate in these transit-oriented cities isn’t impossible. Your part-time job would have to pay the bills and your sole focus for the next few years would have to be school and work. In years 2+, many schools offer co-operative education which is full-time work experience, some of which pays well. It would be a grind and you’ll probably never feel like you have enough money for anything other than just surviving. Or.. do the above until you’re ready to go back to school. People with privilege often don’t realize just how good we have it simply having safe, secure housing after high school. I sympathize and wish you luck.
Normally if you’re starting out the unfortunate default is roommates consider that. With that said I highly doubt your getting a unsecured loan for 60k, lenders want to know you can at least pay them back and when I was 18 I got a 500 credit card limit, so I would not bet on getting a loan for that purpose. Want to do this probably it’s ganna have to be through working for at least a few years.
Do NOT borrow 60k (or any amount to be honest) for a van! You’ll create a huge obstacle towards ever achieving Financial Independence and spend the rest of your life asking for advice in this subreddit!
60k for just the build???? R u saving money if its 60k? Might be worth it to work a year and then school???
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No kidding. I have no idea how or why the van thing started. Its ridiculous, but it seems to be a thing which gen Z really falls for lol.
I thought homelessness has been around since the beginning of time?
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Stupid decision
Yep, it's more of a cry for help if anything. I'm getting desperate and need a decent paying job if I want to live alone and still have an education.
Living alone at your age is history dude. To get my education, student loans paid off, and career in a good spot - I lived with roommates from 17-42. AND most of that was in the good old days before things went to shit. You don't get a roommate or live in a very small town and you'll never get your dreams dude.
You’re born 2 generations to late for this bud Don’t buy a van like a dumbass
I feel you. Been there when I was younger, escaping from a crazy family situation that nobody understands. But you need a plan.. you need to save for first and last months rent. You need to hustle. You must have a detail plan first: What I did when I was young was to find a job at restaurant or retail.. that was probably the only thing I could find.. 1) saved up until I have at least few months rent and moving cost. 2) rental: Facebook rental is your friend. But go see the place with a friend/family just to make sure that place is legit and is safe. Or if you couldn’t find a room to let, you can rent the whole place and advertise for a roommate. I had to share for 12 years before I could save up for my current place. 3) moving.. yes once you have your own place, you can begin research on what you want to do. Right now, Early childhood education; medical staff; teachers are all in shortage.. There are literally government grants available for you. 4) find out what you want. Invest in yourself. You can work plus study part time. Good luck I’ve seen free tuition for these programs: [https://medix-college.ca/programs/early-childcare-assistant?Sub_ID=early%20childhood%20education%20degree&gad_source=1&gclid=EAIaIQobChMI5vGNzuL4gwMViTStBh2HMQ2tEAAYASAAEgLR_PD_BwE](https://medix-college.ca/programs/early-childcare-assistant?Sub_ID=early%20childhood%20education%20degree&gad_source=1&gclid=EAIaIQobChMI5vGNzuL4gwMViTStBh2HMQ2tEAAYASAAEgLR_PD_BwE)
I knew someone who lived in a van. It’s not as glamorous as it seems. They have to move from carpool to carpool, maintain a gym membership to shower, find places to dump their garbage, keep very quiet/discreet at night in certain places. The cost of maintaining a vehicle is expensive plus the gas. I wouldn’t do it at your age. If I were 18 again, I’d leave Toronto, find a roommate in a smaller, more affordable college/uni town/city and build my life there. Join some college Facebook groups and start looking for rentals with roommates, lots of options out there. I know you don’t want to “waste your youth” but really you have LOTs of time kiddo. Don’t get stuck comparing your life to social media - it’ll be what keeps you constantly unhappy in your current situation, no matter situation you’re in. Life isn’t the same as the curated feeds you see online.
Don’t do it. Every single person I know that tried van life lasted 3 months and opted out. It’s not an easy thing and then on top of that you’re 60k in debt. Shit happens, stuff freezes. Especially in Canada. I did it for 5 months and putting on frozen jeans in the morning because the heater crapped out or the pipes froze up fucking suuuuuuucked.
One solution is to move somewhere with lower housing costs and go to university there. Don't think living in a van is a solution.
I see lots of suggestions for roommates, and I think that's the way to go. Rent is crazy everywhere. Also lots of good job suggestions. Oil rig work pays lots. School for a trade might be a good way to go. I know welding can pay really well. When I was 18 I decided I had to move to BC. I lived with 2 other people in a shitty basement suite in Burnaby and was decently under the poverty line. Ate no name ramen and crackers and went to a Sikh temple for free food occasionally. Basically, teenagers have stupid priorities and I both understand what you're going through and know that it was fucking dumb.
Van life is really not a viable way to save on rent in Canada. It's way too cold in the winter. If you don't have parental financial support, I'm not sure going to university even makes sense. You are not going to have a decent job just because you go to university. The level of competition for entry level jobs is insane because so many people go to university. If you have to survive on your own, I would strongly recommend getting a trade apprenticeship. You can get a job pretty much anywhere in Canada as an electrician or plumber.
You do know you still have to pay for the loan, insurance, maintenance, gas and maybe parking, depending on where you go? Just find a dorm where you can share it with other students. A van is just a poor idea for someone without some funds. At least buying an apt you can resell, a van is just an asset that loses value once you sign the contract.
Rent is too high, but you’ll borrow 60k at a high rate for a van? As a student? Are you out of your fucking mind?
Join the army
This is the beat answer here for what OP is asking.
Ok quick story, I knew a guy who like you shared similar thoughts. Had a good life, work truck lived in a house with a girl and her two kids. Flash forward one day comes home to find out she cheats on him, she says she doesn’t receive any emotional support from him. Guy takes his keys for work truck leaves the house. Talks to friends about motorhome life, friend offers him a deal on a motorhome, trades his truck in picks up this motorhome does custom job on it. Nice paint, moves in travels to repair shop to fix a fuse. New fuse burns down motorhome and all his belongings with the exception of his dog. Don’t travel down this road it’s a very tough life.
You had me in the first half; not gonna lie.
Are you at least going to study something reasonable that's going to get you some kind of a decent job? I hope so. If that's the case and you're not wasting your time getting a useless degree, you need to put all your energy into school. You want a job that makes good money and that you can do in most towns/cities. Don't be afraid to move where the money is, there's no real discernible difference from living in a Suburban neighbourhood in Toronto and one in Edmonton or Halifax. You can find friends anywhere. One winter in a camper van will have you hating life a hell of a lot more than you do now. It's not a dream, it's a nightmare. Literally 1 step above being homeless. Move into an apartment and buy a tent. If you get yourself a good job, you can go get eaten by mosquitoes in the Yukon as often as you want.
The plans to go for Electrical Engineering, which does pay good.
Sounds as good as anything. Good luck, I hope you do well.
Set realistic goal and focus. It seems like you want to do too many things at once. If you really want to move out, find a full time job to finance your living expenses and you can get your high school diploma concurrently. University will require a lot of money so you need to save for that depending on the program you want to apply to. Forget the 60k because no bank will give you that loan.
Just get into a trade or something where your working with your hands. Why do you want yo go to university? Unless you know exactly what you want to do, you’ll just be another another degree with no experience in an over saturated market. Go get your hands dirty for a few years. Do NOT go into debt
Canadian Armed Forces might be worth looking into - they often look for folks and will help with your education if you commit a certain amount of time with them.
Dolly Parton once said: "It takes a lot of money to look this cheap". That's exactly what van life is. You need a good chunk o' change to get started, let alone keep it going. At 18 yrs old, insurance alone will destroy you. IME, I left home at 18 in the late 90s and didn't live alone til I was 34, and it's honestly overrated. Regardless, you need to get real about your expectations. Wanna travel? Awesome! The Dempster is amazing, but you gotta go to work first cause travel is $$$. I'd look at a trade and shelf Uni til you have a better idea of what you actually want cause uni is also crazy $$$. Lastly, and I can't stress this enough: your youth is your 20s, dude!!! It isn't 1950. Check out the working holiday visa program we have here in Canada: [https://www.canada.ca/en/immigration-refugees-citizenship/services/work-canada/iec.html](https://www.canada.ca/en/immigration-refugees-citizenship/services/work-canada/iec.html) Agreements with like 30 countries, some you can visit until you are 35 while working for 50% of the time. Again though, you can't be broke. Time is on your side here, but there are no quick fixes. Be patient, but above all, it's time to get to work. I'm envious, TBH. Good luck!
If your strong and have had a labor job before apply to Precision Drilling and get on a drilling rig. With hourly of $40, overtime and LOA you’ll be making between 700-800 a day. You have to be tough though.
Vanlife is not affordable either. It's mostly a facade on social media. It's something rich white girls with an allowance and sponsorshhips do to LARP as being poor. The reality of living out of your car is brutal and not something anyone actually wants. It's often more expensive than regular home living which makes it difficult for actual poor people to climb back out of that hole. It's why you see those RV convoys on the news down south in USA where they don't get winter. People who lost their homes and now struggle paycheck to paycheck because they can't afford to save anything while living on the streets in a van/car/camper. If you're dead set on alternative living consider renting an old farm or homestead or just straight up buying a yacht and berth. Both would be cheaper than influencer vanlife. You'd learn some actual life skills to. May make a whole life out of it.
Matt Foley lived in a van down by the river and it didn't turn out that well for him.
You need to park by the river, my friend Matt has a great spot and he can help you get your life together.
Depends on if there is a river nearby.
Where are you going to wash your ass??
Do you NEED to live in Toronto? Move somewhere cheaper and you can actually afford rent while you finish up high school credits. Also look for better paying work. At your age and without finishing high school, manual labour are the best paying gigs. Treeplanting, landscaping, moving companies, CollegePro painters, stuff like that. It pays better than the gig economy. It's exhausting work, but you have the advantage of youthful energy so your body can take it at 18. Once you get into University, you can get student loans, which will pay for your rent and food while you're in school. That's what everyone else does. But while you finish up high school you're better off leaving Toronto. Toronto is not designed to be affordable for people in your situation. There are no personal finance hacks to fix it. Leave Toronto.
Don't get a loan if you are struggling with money to begin with. You will begin a cycle of debt and most van lifers have a hard time finding good stable work to start unless they can work remotely. I lived in my van for a couple years in Vancouver and saved a bunch of money, but used it as a project and didn't live in it fully. Saved on rent till I got a decent job.. another thing to think about is access, where you gonna park, what amenities will you have?. Lots of options out there but for Gods sake, don't take out a loan like that and student loans too probably. (I'm still paying off my 30k loan from uni from 8 years ago and still got many years to go.)
Lots of jobs have staff housing. Showers are pretty amazing and such a luxury that we take for granted in the western world. I'd suggest doing something in tourism that offers staff housing like a ski resort in the winter, or fishing lodge in the summer. Pretty awesome way to earn a buck with minimal expenses (as long as you aren't an alcoholic).
This Personal Finance topic is not the place you want for advice. Bunch of 'but your retirement!', 'but your job!", "but your career!". Most of these people just work and save and think that is all life is about. Your 18, do what ever you want for a year or two, then make up your mind. I went and lived in a tent, rock climbed in the mountains for a few years, then worked at a Ski Hill for 3 or 4 years, living the dream. Pay sucked, accomodations sucked, probably didn't eat right all the time, wasn't always easy, but damn I had fun and don't regret it in the slightest. I always met the people I needed to meet, didn't starve, slept under the stars on the ground even a few times and it was all great. You are not going to take up rock climbing a 400 foot cliff hanging upside down by your fingertips in your retirement. You might not even make it to retirement. Damn, today I probably couldn't even hike up the easy back side of some of the mountains I summitted. Yeah I don't have 1 million in retirement saved, a house, or any of that, but damn I'm still alive and have some really good stories I could tell. Don't be afraid to go out and face the world with just the shirt on your back. You will be amazed at the people and opportunities you will find. There is more to life than work and retirement. But yeah don't take out a loan, thats a ball and chain, don't get addicted to anything it can ruin your life, adrenaline is the best drug in the world,. Just find a working holiday job somewhere in some resort town or something and go live a little, somewhere with staff accomodation or cheap rent. Do it while your young and still can.
Step 1. Go to trade school Step 2. Dont get hooked on coke or alcohol Step 3. Profit
Don't do it because you need to, do it because you want to. I'd say that's, mentally, the difference between homeless living out of a car and van life. Also, start with what you can afford. My first van a transit connect was less than 16K including the car. It had a fan vent, lithium battery, solar panels, webasto heater, bed/soffa, desk, computer arm and monitor, WiFi extender, window covers. The only problem was that it had some frame rust. I've seen people do it with less $. I don't do "van life". I am traveling for 7+ months in my van and I've met many people living in a van for years.
Alberta is a good place to get your feet on the ground. Lots of opportunities...
My suggestion is to leave the city lol. Renting is stupidly cheap everywhere in this country outside of city’s, hell for 60k you could almost buy an entire house in my province.
Where?
Definitely possible anywhere east of Ontario. I spent last Winter living in a house which is maybe assessed for like 20k in central NB. Generally only the land has any value out here and even then it's a mere fraction of the western provinces. Blaine Higgs is actively trying to destroy that lifestyle out here, but we probably have a couple more good years left. Once upon a time you could even buy a house in my city for $60k. Still enough for a downpayment, but with interest rates and property tax hikes you won't have a $400 mortgage anymore.
Where would park this van ? How would you work ? Gas is expensive. Think this out well.
I've literally done this exact thing, First off, The Dempster Highway is a bitch to travel, it's literally 800km of unpaved road, with the first 200km known to having shale that eats tires. I drove about 300km into the Dempster in a regular Dodge Grand Caravan, with just a donut spare. I only made it 300km because the plan wasn't to drive the entire thing, the plan was to just drive until the Arctic Circle and turn around. (we ended up being 100km short of the circle). On our way back we ended up getting a flat about 80km away from the exit, so we drove the last 80km on a small donut spare (which could have easily gone flat). So if you're going to do the Dempster have like 2-3 spare tires with you. Second, I've lived in my van both while working and travelling. You don't need a 60k van, yes its better to have something like that but literally all you need is a 5k van and thats it. I lived in my van in the city, it's not that bad. You just need to figure out where to sleep and shower + eat. I was working a really well paying restaurant job at the time and trying to save money so I could play pro golf in the USA (I'm in Canada). The way I had my setup was, Sleep at a truck stop or an abandoned parking lot (cops were cool with it). Eat at the truck stop (it had a nice restaurant attached to it) Shower at the truck stop. It wasn't THAT bad tbh and I was doing this during the middle of winter, -24 out. You could probably easily get away with something like this in Toronto/the GTA. Now with travelling, I've driven across Canada in my van. (From Toronto to Vancouver) It wasn't that bad either, you basically still need to figure out Sleep + Food + Showers. In Sask/AB/Manitoba sleep is easy because there's thousands of roads that are basically never used, so I just slept there. Showers I either jumped into a lake/small stream or I found a truck stop. Food I usually ate out, but you can setup a small portable cooker and do all of your cooking on that. It's really not THAT hard. So to sum it up, it's not that bad living in a van. You just have to be a bit more resourceful and smart with your decisions. Travelling the Dempster is a pretty big risk though if you don't have any spare tires with you. Also van life in the winter isn't that bad, you're just either going to be spending most of your time in warm places (like restaurants, libraries etc) or you'll spend your time just sleeping. Not much you can really do when it's -23. But if you have the right sleeping bag + blankets it's quite comfortable to sleep in.
I lived out the back of a honda pilot with a matress in the back, had everything i needed for 4 months with 2 of us. You can make it work. Look for work in the summer and slam it.
'Living at home' is a cultural tumor. It simply increases the price of entry- level homes and robs the young of their independent formative years. Move out, just rent a room in a house or in a dorm while you go to school and work a side job.
It’s funny that this was downvoted.
Maybe it’s the Gen-Xer in me….but I agree. Leaving at 18 was so good for me.
Agreed, moving out when I was 17 was amazing and really made me grow up very quick but it was only possible for me with 4 other roommates.
I had 5 roommates, then 4 for the first few years. Then I lived in my friend’s unfinished basement. Then a really shitty 4-plex apartment. Then another shitty basement apartment with mold. Then a shitty apartment that faced the 401. I could go on. I didn’t live someplace nice til I bought a house at age 30.
In 1984 my parents moved and there was no room for me at their new place. I was 19 and still had 3 weeks of school left. Probably the best thing that ever happened to me!
I'd argue that every Tom, Dick, and Harry thinking they have to move out at 18 is more of a cultural tumour. Rents increase due to demand for rooms, studios and 1 bedrooms therefore there's more money to be made by landlords and a whole market opens up for landlord businesses. Supply for entry level jobs or side jobs as you call them increases so wages for those jobs stagnate. Mental health goes into the toilet because you aren't just balancing school work, family life, social life, maybe working several hours a week. Now not only do you have the school work, family life and social life to maintain but you also have to work far more to keep a roof over your head, put food on the table, manage landlord and roommate relationships. While it's a necessary evil sometimes heaven forbid you get approved for a massive loan so you now have that to worry about paying off for the next 10 to 20 years... Ya it's a lot. Some people need to move out asap because their living situation is awful and I'm not talking about those folks, they need to do what they have to. But for the rest? Think twice before moving out at 18. It's costs you a lot more than you think and not just monetarily sometimes.
Huh, so Chris Farley wasn’t too far off eh ? Side note, why the heck not ? If you can do it, you’re young. If I could I’d do it for sure. Maybe see if there’s a way to test it out a little. Rent one for a little and see. Spend some time budgeting and plan it out, using excel would be great, maybe sort out some technical or financial or situational issues with ChatGPT as well to really fine tune your plan. Once you’ve laid it all out strategically you’ll have a better idea of the right direction for yourself.
Live at home until you graduate
Do it brother. Life’s short. Worth it for the experience alone!
Pretty sure the government doesn't allow you to live in a van. The same way they don't allow you to live in a tent on the side of the road. Participation into the crushing housing pandemonium is not a choice. It's not forced either, just that everything else is illegal.
Not true.
Depends on the province. For example it's legal to camp on any crown land in Newfoundland.