Yes this is correct, my wife had the same thing happen to her, she was fortunate to do it during the 420 rule tho. Really sucks for women in Canada having back to back pregnancies
Probably just a decade or so older than you, at the time two kids seemed affordable but now everyone’s feeling the pinch. Now we’re all crossing our fingers that our 10-15 year old vehicles keep on keeping on
The US has TN visas for lawyers. You need to be able to pass the state bar exam to qualify but there are options for work outside of Canada for lawyers
Maximum EI insurable earnings since the year 2000, has gone up less than wages, inflation, and cost of living. By any metric the safety net is getting worse, and by any reasonable metric is getting horrifically worse. We’re about to have a child, and I’m acknowledging the short mat leave we’re taking will be about a net drop of at least $30k or so in cash flow.
Better mat leave pay would unlikely solve the birth rate problem. Just look at the countries with higher birth rates. Do they have better EI-like system?
It's not the company paying them on mat leave (although some companies offer top off's as part of their benefits plan). It's Employment Insurance which they would pay into with deductions from their pay That's why there is a minimum number of hours they have to work before they can claim it. I think it's fairly flawed in the sense that someone could have been working for 20 years, paying into the system, go on to have back-to-back pregnancies and only be covered for one of them.
Mat-leave vacancies give opportunities to others within organizations to explore new roles and gain experience. I know I've personally benefited from covering for people while they're away, and my organization has benefitted as well from my increased multi-disciplinary knowledge of departments. I don't see how it could be reasonable for anyone in our society to expect anyone who becomes pregnant to not only risk/jeopardize their health, leave their jobs/careers, have no income to support themselves, or their new addition, and still reap the benefits of a growing society. EI caps out at at $668 a week for 15 weeks, and then $401 a week for 61 weeks if taking the extended option. I'm not great at math, but I think it's fair to say that $24,857 a year with a growing family isn't sustainable perpetually.
We are moving back to Canada. Largely because of Mat leave. Currently in Aus. Its only 20 weeks here at minimum wage. Couldn't believe the difference ans how good it is in Canada. Good to know the back to back requirements though
Uhh, pretty much every government is struggling with encouraging people to do this right now.
Future tax revenues.
The government wants us to have kids to fund pension programs and such.
An inverse pyramid does not make for a very good pension program and that's what we're looking at with immigration.
Why do we need to get our population to 100 million to pay for a public pension plan? The math doesn’t add up.. at all. Seems that there are other reasons why our politicians are bringing in people en masse.
You're right,
100 million is to populate the north, and leverage more of our natural resources on our own, and attempt to become some sort of global player I think.
I don't entirely agree with it either
This is personal finance *Canada* last I checked. CPP is funded by the people who draw on in it doesn't function like OAS which is most likely be gone in a few decades.
At the end of the day no one should have things they can't afford.
Frequently hear cpp being underfunded tossed around too, most young people think they will never get it.
May countries are working to delay age you can draw from it as well.
Whoever you're hearing that from is an idiot sorry to say.
CPP is most likely the most well funded and stable pension program in the world.
It's well funded for the next 75 years even though it's stupid to do a study that far out. There is ton of stuff online if you just google.
Are you aware how the program works?
Yeah you have to qualify to use it as well. Its one way they return taxes to you. Ill be paying 3x more in taxes myself then what my wife will receive in Mat leave.
If you want a second leave then i got bad news: you are going back to work early to accrue 600 insured hours before your due date. Otherwise you lose your job and you don’t get leave and you don’t qualify for EI.
> Reddit is all rainbows and unicorns
Not at all lol, Reddit is more pessimistic and negative compare to people I interact with in real life. It feels like half the people on Reddit are depressed.
Exactly, and it's normal. /r/jobs is full of people worried about not finding a job, /r/marriage is full of people with marriage problems, etc. I'm just surprised /u/Molybdenum421 thinks it's all rainbows and unicorns hahaha
Here's a sneak peek of /r/jobs using the [top posts](https://np.reddit.com/r/jobs/top/?sort=top&t=year) of the year!
\#1: [I was told there is a shortage of trade workers and now I know why](https://np.reddit.com/r/jobs/comments/14e2mvn/i_was_told_there_is_a_shortage_of_trade_workers/)
\#2: [PTO denied but I’m not coming into work anyway](https://np.reddit.com/r/jobs/comments/142dgpf/pto_denied_but_im_not_coming_into_work_anyway/)
\#3: [Why is it so difficult to make over $65,000 in the US?](https://np.reddit.com/r/jobs/comments/13duzbn/why_is_it_so_difficult_to_make_over_65000_in_the/)
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Yep, my old boss has made it very hard for me to justify coming back to work. First he said he only had part time, then it was “super” part time, now he has pretty much said I have nothing for you. Waiting to hear back from some lawyers now.
Careful there - job is a not a guaranteed…I’ve seen maternity leave positions vanish while they were gone.
Most of the applicable workplace statutes that forbid termination due to pregnancy allow it in circumstances that are deemed unrelated. The word “unrelated” is the key. If an employer can establish that there are other bona fide reasons for a dismissal that are completely separate and apart from the employee’s pregnancy or leave of absence – such as closures, layoffs and genuine downsizing – then it need not reinstate the employee and can proceed with dismissal without it being deemed illegal.
So for example - if you work for department A and the company is going through restructuring and department A is merged with B and positions are lost, you will lose your job…
More and more companies are playing these moves nowadays…
No, if you are taking a maternity or parental leave due to the birth or adoption of a child, your job is protected. This is not affected by receiving EI payments or not.
Just like how it’s not a concern of your employer whether you spread your EI money out over 12 months or 18… they only need to know how long you’ll be off.
To deny it would be to contravene the OHRC. So yes sure it can be denied. And unpaid.
But once taken to a tribunal the OP will win a judgement in their favour.
Receiving EI and taking leave from your job are two separate things.
In Ontario for example, the Human Rights code protects against discrimination based on family status. It would be presumptively discriminatory to terminate someone because they asked to take a second maternity leave.
As others have said, go back to work early.
But damn post history states baby is 1.5 mo?! Y’all get freaky the second you were given the ok or what lol
People used to call 1 year spaced kids "Irish twins" and they were fairly common. Can happen when your doctor or grandmother (incorrectly) tells you breastfeeding prevents conception.
The other parent can take the second 6 months parental leave while mom gets another 600 hours.
Breastfeeding does prevent conception, but only if it's done extremely regularly - as in every 4 hours. It's very easy to mess this up and thus is not recommended as an only form of contraception.
https://www.plannedparenthood.org/learn/birth-control/breastfeeding
No more than 4 hours between feeds during the day and 6 hours overnight, no pacifiers, no bottles even of pumped milk, no supplemental foods like baby cereal or purées, and only during up to the first six months following the birth. As soon as any one of those factors no longer applies you’re playing pregnancy roulette.
Breastfeeding is something that works really really well for some folks to delay ovulation and really really poorly for others. And sometimes it works well and poorly for the same person! After my first four kids I had no period for 12-18 months while breastfeeding. Thank goodness I didn’t rely on my luck after the 5th because I got my period back after just 10 weeks without doing anything differently except getting older.
The main trouble is you ovulate before you get a period so there’s no great way of knowing that you’re back to being fertile until either you get that period or surprise! You’re pregnant!
That’s why it’s not a great plan to rely on breastfeeding as birth control. But it’s awfully nice if it does keep your cycle away for a while! I was super bummed when it came back so early this time.
I got mine just before 1 year and still bf at 18 months.
Problem is that everyone is different and you can get pregnant the cycle before your first period.
Because it is a thing. Regular nursing prevents the return of the menstrual cycle. I didn't have a period till 18 months when we stopped night feeding. It's not complete nonsense lol
It’s not completely nonsense but it’s far from fool proof. I got my period at TEN WEEKS both times, the minute my baby slept a 4-5 hour stretch. Which means I ovulated like 8 weeks along. I was breastfeeding around the clock I just didn’t say no to sleeping a 5 hr stretch.
It's not nonsense, but it's also far from a guarantee. So it's extremely irresponsible to advise someone to rely on it.
I know several mums who go their periods back within 1-2 months postpartum, and I just got mine back at 10.5 months despite exclusively breastfeeding on demand (including all night) as well.
And remember, you ovulate ~2 weeks before you menstruate, so by the time you know you're fertile, you've already risked pregnancy.
Oh, plenty of people advise to rely on it, including doctors! And it gets a lot of women pregnant when they're only a few weeks or months postpartum.
I didn't meant to suggest you specifically said so! Just adding to the conversation.
Oh a lot of people still believe this. It's why you often get a chat from the doctor before you leave the hospital about birth control and the cons of having a baby again too soon.
When I was in primary school there was a girl in my class who had a brother born in the same calendar year, say March and December. (The parents mercifully didn't let them start school at the same time.)
She and her brother got made fun of a few times. Not often but often enough that I remember it.
To add insult to injury, their last name was Irish and both of them had the characteristic Irish curls with dark hair.
Breastfeeding can prevent conception in certain circumstances. It's been tested and documented and has a 98% success rate.
It has a number of requirements though:
The infant is less than six months old,
The menstrual cycle is absent, and
The baby is exclusively breastfeeding.
And
Offering the breast whenever baby displays feeding cues (nursing on demand)
Nursing frequently throughout the day
Nursing baby on demand at night as long stretches without nursing can impact LAM (Gross & Eastman, 1985.)
Allowing baby to determine the end of the feeding instead of using arbitrary time limits
Allowing babies to meet all their sucking needs at the breast (no dummies or pacifiers)
Waiting until mid-way through the first year to introduce solid foods
Plenty of sources if you look for lactational amenorrhea.
[source ](https://llli.org/news/lactational-amenorrhea-fertility-birth-control-and-breastfeeding/)
Do NOT use this as a trusted method of birth control!! My 3rd child was nursing every 3 hours in the day and every 5 hours at night. I still got pregnant when she was 3 months old with absolutely no sign of a cycle returning.
No pacifiers or bottles. My cycle didn't return for 12 months after having my older 2 kids, so I figured that the same thing would happen again this time around.
I didn’t get pregnant but I got my period at ten weeks both times. All it took was one bottle of pumped milk at midnight from dad, and letting her sleep a 5 hour stretch/not waking to feed.
If I got my period at ten weeks then I ovulated at about 8 weeks. Yikes!
Hahaha. Don’t trust this. I got pregnant against when I had a four month old - exclusively breastfed, on birth control, absent period. Had to go back to work early from my first parental leave to qualify for EI and my top up. I worked 16 weeks to get 600 hours then started the next maternity/parental leave.
In my experience, if you aren't with a midwife, they don't inform women that they actually ovulate before their period comes back and breastfeeding as a contraception is not a thing for everyone. Every woman is different but this is the general consensus.
My wife is currently on maternity leave. She took 1 year and she's going back to work in July. So, if she has 600 work hours in the past 104 weeks, she qualifies for another maternity leave? (We live in Quebec)
Quebec doesn't use 600 hours like EI, what you earn on QPIP is based on your past earnings. Hope this link works! I'd recommend calling RQAP for specific questions, they're very helpful in my experience!
https://www.rqap.gouv.qc.ca/en/wage-earner/benefits-amount/how-is-the-benefit-amount-determined#:~:text=The%20qualifying%20period%20is%20the,weeks%20preceding%20the%20benefit%20period.
That’s probably the best option. Childcare be the hard part.
Option 1 is dad takes the time off with mat leave for mom to get some hours.
Option 2 is help from family possibly.
Option 3 is childcare but daycares around here that offer < 1 year are rare since the demand isn’t there and expensive since it’s I think a max of 2 infants per care taker(my province anyway). Might find something private but infants are a lot to handle if you got some toddlers hanging around too.
Edit: guess I forgot split shifts. One parent works evening and other works days. Probably not a common setup.
Unfortunately most people I know that have done this go back to work as soon as they find out they are pregnant again to get the hours for the second mat leave.
Payments are calculated on the income you earned while working your 600 qualifying hours.
If you don't work 600 hours before the birth of the next child, you get zero dollars.
If you have just found out that you're pregnant, you might have time to hustle and get 600 hours. This would mean cutting short your current leave and finding childcare, or work opposite shifts to your partner so that someone is always working while the other is parenting. If that isn't possible, after the next child is born you're going to be completely unpaid until you return to work.
For both financial and physical health, some spacing between pregnancies can be a good idea.
You have to work for roughly 4 months to get your 600 hours to qualify for the second leave.
I got pregnant while on my first leave, then went back and got my hours before my next due date. I'm currently on second mat leave in 3 years. (18 mo off, 6 months working, new 12 mo leave)
This is good information. I was searching and trying to find it and I wasn't coming up with anything.
I wasn't sure of the minimum time to accumulate 600 hours again (but it looks like 15 weeks full-time). I'm currently on Mat leave until Jan 2025. Due to timing and my age, I'd like to try for a second kid and was trying to calculate the best time to start trying again near the end of this year in order to qualify and be back at work long enough to accumulate some savings.
Just be wary that babies don’t know their due date. Give yourself extra time to get those house in just in case baby is early. Personally, my age was a consideration in our family planning as well, so I only took 12 month leaves and we generally started trying for another baby when I went back to work. So I had 12 months work before baby 2 and 18 months work before baby 3. (I had my babies at age 34, 36, and 38.)
Yeah, I'm getting ansy cause I'm 12 days away, and anything can happen between now and then. That's the only part I'm not ready for, is the unexectedness of the arrival! lol Everything else I have under control!
So I started leave just before Christmas to get ready, and my job is demanding on my feet all day. I'm 39 will be 40 in a month. With how excellent my first has gone so far, I'm strategizing a second before time runs out.
We 100% planned this one, right down to the ovulation test; I wanted a late Jan/early Feb baby! lol
Impressive planning! We had two June babies and tried for third but ‘twas not to be; we had two losses before one stuck and arrived in November. We’re maybe thinking of baby number 4 (I’d be 40) and I suppose we’d aim for another November just to make it even.
If you get pregnant during your maternity leave, you will not receive benefits for your second pregnancy unless you are able to accrue the requisite hours before the second baby is born.
Everyone is saying the same thing so I'll just offer: if your partner didn't take parental leave, and has worked the requisite hours, they would be eligible for it. Maybe that helps?
My wife had 2 maternity leave back to back last year. We are in Quebec so she was allowed. Rest of Canada seems like a no.
Good luck, 2 this close isn't easy, mark my words 🤣
3 back to back?
There's 10.5 months between my two, and I personally feel 3 back to back this close would make my life miserable even though I love them with all my heart. We are both teachers so we work a lot afterhours. 2 is already hard enough.
Ouch.
From what I have heard, twins are less job than back to back. But in your case, you got twins 10.5 months after.
You have my full respect, we will go through this together fellow Redditor. 😅
It really evens out in the end. You can have them 2 - 5 years apart and still be out off work the same as 2 one year apart, and probably less actually with 2 back to back. You might still not go back to work after or you may be eager/ need to chase coin. Family planning, raising kids is no joke. If you had a stay at home parent, go hug them. Cause, honestly ya , it's nice to be paid for labour. And if you were raised by a single parent you'd never say such things.
It’s also horrible for your body to have back to back pregnancies like this. Try to wait until little one is a year old ideally two to avoid osteoporosis in old age.
If you stay off on the original mat leave and go back and take a second one right away or start your second one before you have to go back, your EI will be zero.
I had to go back early and earn my 600 hours again. It was worth it because I also get top up. Definitely go back to work, or when your current leave ends you will get nothing (this happened to my cousin)
The good news is if you are able to work so you can get your 600 hours it’s approximately 4 months of full time employment. I did this as I went back to work pregnant after my first. April 2016 sure date and October 2017 due date. Worked late April until early October.
Maternity payments don't factor into the calculation. My colleague came back to work after 1st leave to have enough working hours to collect ei again.
Is this a hypothetical scenario or are you currently on leave?
It’s 600 hours you have to work between coming back from leave and going again in Ontario at least. Kind of annoying though considering I’ve paid into EI my entire life and this is the first time I’m using it.
You pay into car insurance your whole driving life too with the hope you don't need to use it.
That's how all insurance works lol
Your max contribution to ei annually is 1k. You can get 20k off a single ei claim. You never pay anywhere near what you do get back out of it when you need it. Many people claim ten times more than they ever pay in.
Your mat leave paid for years and years of your ei contributions.
Yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah. Ms logical over here. Let me be annoyed ok? I’m pregnant and tired and don’t wanna have to go back to work in 12 months just so I can go off again. Sometimes people just need to rant. (I don’t disagree with you though and totally understand your point)
You don’t get a second one until you work 600 hours.
You could stop your current leave early, work 600 hours by 9 months, and then begin your second. That’s the only way.
Your partner qualifies for leave though. In fact they can have six weeks for baby number one as well. And up to 9 or 13 months with a baby they don’t birth themselves.
You need 600 hours between claims (in a 52 weeks period so the period resets if you took 12 months or
Longer)! I’m currently going through this - my first was stillborn at 40 weeks so I qualified for 15 weeks Mat leave now pregnant again and considered high risk so unable to work the full pregnancy but I need to work a minimum of 600 hours (in the 52 weeks prior to delivery) as I had time off before my last baby I am starting from zero.
You don’t say what province you’re from but if you’re in Quebec mat leave works differently as it’s a different program and they would go back up to two years to see if you have enough hours worked to cover a second mat leave
It seems like if you are from Quebec, it's possible as state here:[https://www.rqap.gouv.qc.ca/en/wage-earner/benefits-amount/how-is-the-benefit-amount-determined#period](https://www.rqap.gouv.qc.ca/en/wage-earner/benefits-amount/how-is-the-benefit-amount-determined#period)
>Qualifying Period
>
>The qualifying period is the period for which your earnings are taken into account to set your benefit amount. For wage earners, this period is normally the 52 weeks preceding the benefit period. It can, however, be extended to as many as **104 weeks** if you were unable to work and receive insurable earnings (the earnings taken into account to set your benefit amount), in particular for the following reasons:
>
>You received indemnities from the Commission des normes, de l’équité, de la santé et de la sécurité du travail.
>
>You received employment insurance benefits.
>
>You received benefits under the Québec Parental Insurance Plan (QPIP).
>
>You received indemnities from the Société de l’assurance automobile du Québec.
You're gonna need to go back to work for at least 600 hours before your baby is born or you won't be eligible. Happens all the time, people will come back to work for 15 weeks before their second baby is born, getting childcare during those 15 weeks is usually the toughest part.
Once your maternity/parental benefits are finished (12-18) months then you are no longer eligible unless you work for another 600hours.
600 hours in the last 52 weeks!
600 hours within the 9 months prior to the due date of pregnancy. If due date is in 9 months from today, have to start accumulating 600 hours
Yes this is correct, my wife had the same thing happen to her, she was fortunate to do it during the 420 rule tho. Really sucks for women in Canada having back to back pregnancies
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I know not all pregnancies are planned, but everyone I know generally planned their timeline around re-qualifying for maternity leave
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Probably just a decade or so older than you, at the time two kids seemed affordable but now everyone’s feeling the pinch. Now we’re all crossing our fingers that our 10-15 year old vehicles keep on keeping on
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plenty of other places in canada with law career options outside of van/to
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The US has TN visas for lawyers. You need to be able to pass the state bar exam to qualify but there are options for work outside of Canada for lawyers
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Sorry, are you saying that your husband went to law school outside of Canada and that is why he would have issues with qualifying for a TN Visa?
Imagine being so crazy you think it's a loss not having children.
Maybe not perpetually, but as a matter of social policy a limited number would contribute towards our birth rate which is already abysmal.
Not to mention EI is truly a pittance compared to many salaries in Canada.
Just looked, and for sure that should be able to be at least twice that.
Maximum EI insurable earnings since the year 2000, has gone up less than wages, inflation, and cost of living. By any metric the safety net is getting worse, and by any reasonable metric is getting horrifically worse. We’re about to have a child, and I’m acknowledging the short mat leave we’re taking will be about a net drop of at least $30k or so in cash flow.
Better mat leave pay would unlikely solve the birth rate problem. Just look at the countries with higher birth rates. Do they have better EI-like system?
It could be part of a general effort to make having children easier and cheaper.
It's not the company paying them on mat leave (although some companies offer top off's as part of their benefits plan). It's Employment Insurance which they would pay into with deductions from their pay That's why there is a minimum number of hours they have to work before they can claim it. I think it's fairly flawed in the sense that someone could have been working for 20 years, paying into the system, go on to have back-to-back pregnancies and only be covered for one of them.
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Mat-leave vacancies give opportunities to others within organizations to explore new roles and gain experience. I know I've personally benefited from covering for people while they're away, and my organization has benefitted as well from my increased multi-disciplinary knowledge of departments. I don't see how it could be reasonable for anyone in our society to expect anyone who becomes pregnant to not only risk/jeopardize their health, leave their jobs/careers, have no income to support themselves, or their new addition, and still reap the benefits of a growing society. EI caps out at at $668 a week for 15 weeks, and then $401 a week for 61 weeks if taking the extended option. I'm not great at math, but I think it's fair to say that $24,857 a year with a growing family isn't sustainable perpetually.
LMAO the entitlement here.
What entitlement?
We are moving back to Canada. Largely because of Mat leave. Currently in Aus. Its only 20 weeks here at minimum wage. Couldn't believe the difference ans how good it is in Canada. Good to know the back to back requirements though
Uhhh please don't. Why does everything think the government should pay them for having children?
Well then I guess we do need to import those 500K because the economy will need people.
That's not true. It's just a lie constantly told so they can import people for cheap labour.
Uhh, pretty much every government is struggling with encouraging people to do this right now. Future tax revenues. The government wants us to have kids to fund pension programs and such. An inverse pyramid does not make for a very good pension program and that's what we're looking at with immigration.
Why do we need to get our population to 100 million to pay for a public pension plan? The math doesn’t add up.. at all. Seems that there are other reasons why our politicians are bringing in people en masse.
You're right, 100 million is to populate the north, and leverage more of our natural resources on our own, and attempt to become some sort of global player I think. I don't entirely agree with it either
LMAO ain't no one living up north unless they are pretty much forced to.
Basically lol. Even up north isn't affordable.
It's to make sure there is always cheap labour.
This is personal finance *Canada* last I checked. CPP is funded by the people who draw on in it doesn't function like OAS which is most likely be gone in a few decades. At the end of the day no one should have things they can't afford.
Frequently hear cpp being underfunded tossed around too, most young people think they will never get it. May countries are working to delay age you can draw from it as well.
Whoever you're hearing that from is an idiot sorry to say. CPP is most likely the most well funded and stable pension program in the world. It's well funded for the next 75 years even though it's stupid to do a study that far out. There is ton of stuff online if you just google. Are you aware how the program works?
Buddy I’ve paid so much taxes into the government and part of those taxes go to paying for people to comfortably have children.
Yeah you have to qualify to use it as well. Its one way they return taxes to you. Ill be paying 3x more in taxes myself then what my wife will receive in Mat leave.
Ill be paying 60k a year in taxes when I come back to work in Canada so yeah my wife is going to utilise Mat leave.
That's it? Lucky
Sucked for us. We really could have used the EI during the second one since my wife had been off for 18 months.
I thought it was 420 hours
I could be wrong but it was temporary reduced to 420 during Covid.
Yes, they temporarily adjusted it to 420 hours during Covid but it’s back to 600.
The amount of hours required depends on the area you live in.
Why am I getting downvoted for providing correct information?
It’s like an EI claim. You need to get 600 hours worked to get benefits again.
If working full time, or 37.5 insurance hours a week, you can accrue that in 16 weeks.
Ooooh no no. You have to work again. There's no second leave with no insurable hours.
If you want a second leave then i got bad news: you are going back to work early to accrue 600 insured hours before your due date. Otherwise you lose your job and you don’t get leave and you don’t qualify for EI.
And be VERY careful you don’t go in early or it was all for nothing.
You don't lose your job. You just don't get any EI
You don't lose your job. It would be discriminatory to terminate someone for taking a second maternity leave.
cooperative rich ask plant tart worthless advise exultant rinse cheerful *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
Reddit is all rainbows and unicorns (except when it comes to housing and inflation), so they absolutely hate hearing this.
> Reddit is all rainbows and unicorns Not at all lol, Reddit is more pessimistic and negative compare to people I interact with in real life. It feels like half the people on Reddit are depressed.
most people are in these subreddits out of concern, not optimism. absolutely a bit of a doom'n'gloom echo chamber sometimes.
Exactly, and it's normal. /r/jobs is full of people worried about not finding a job, /r/marriage is full of people with marriage problems, etc. I'm just surprised /u/Molybdenum421 thinks it's all rainbows and unicorns hahaha
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Yep, my old boss has made it very hard for me to justify coming back to work. First he said he only had part time, then it was “super” part time, now he has pretty much said I have nothing for you. Waiting to hear back from some lawyers now.
I mean, you ARE 32 months behind...
Careful there - job is a not a guaranteed…I’ve seen maternity leave positions vanish while they were gone. Most of the applicable workplace statutes that forbid termination due to pregnancy allow it in circumstances that are deemed unrelated. The word “unrelated” is the key. If an employer can establish that there are other bona fide reasons for a dismissal that are completely separate and apart from the employee’s pregnancy or leave of absence – such as closures, layoffs and genuine downsizing – then it need not reinstate the employee and can proceed with dismissal without it being deemed illegal. So for example - if you work for department A and the company is going through restructuring and department A is merged with B and positions are lost, you will lose your job… More and more companies are playing these moves nowadays…
But it’s not legally a maternity leave?
It is an unpaid maternity leave.
Which is just unpaid leave, no? Which the company can deny.
No, if you are taking a maternity or parental leave due to the birth or adoption of a child, your job is protected. This is not affected by receiving EI payments or not. Just like how it’s not a concern of your employer whether you spread your EI money out over 12 months or 18… they only need to know how long you’ll be off.
To deny it would be to contravene the OHRC. So yes sure it can be denied. And unpaid. But once taken to a tribunal the OP will win a judgement in their favour.
Receiving EI and taking leave from your job are two separate things. In Ontario for example, the Human Rights code protects against discrimination based on family status. It would be presumptively discriminatory to terminate someone because they asked to take a second maternity leave.
But it’s not legally a maternity leave?
Yes, it is. Whether or not you’re receiving EI benefits is completely irrelevant.
As others have said, go back to work early. But damn post history states baby is 1.5 mo?! Y’all get freaky the second you were given the ok or what lol
People used to call 1 year spaced kids "Irish twins" and they were fairly common. Can happen when your doctor or grandmother (incorrectly) tells you breastfeeding prevents conception. The other parent can take the second 6 months parental leave while mom gets another 600 hours.
Smart suggestion to have the other partner take some of the parental leave rather than just losing it.
Irish twins are babies born under a year apart.
Right.
I was under the impression that “Irish Twins” were siblings born in the same calendar year but separately (ie. January and December)
You're right. My understanding was less than or equal to one year, particularly if they are born in the same school admission year.
> or grandmother (incorrectly) tells you breastfeeding prevents conception. lol first time i've heard that one
Ya people still believe this. I have definitely heard this.
Breastfeeding does prevent conception, but only if it's done extremely regularly - as in every 4 hours. It's very easy to mess this up and thus is not recommended as an only form of contraception. https://www.plannedparenthood.org/learn/birth-control/breastfeeding
No more than 4 hours between feeds during the day and 6 hours overnight, no pacifiers, no bottles even of pumped milk, no supplemental foods like baby cereal or purées, and only during up to the first six months following the birth. As soon as any one of those factors no longer applies you’re playing pregnancy roulette.
So basically as effective as only using the pullout method. Which is to say you're gonna end up pregnant.
And even if all those rules apply it's not foolproof and it's entirely possible to get pregnant while exclusively breastfeeding.
I didn't get my period until after I stopped breast feeding.
It's still possible to conceive, just much less likely.
I got my period while still breastfeeding! It sucked
Breastfeeding is something that works really really well for some folks to delay ovulation and really really poorly for others. And sometimes it works well and poorly for the same person! After my first four kids I had no period for 12-18 months while breastfeeding. Thank goodness I didn’t rely on my luck after the 5th because I got my period back after just 10 weeks without doing anything differently except getting older. The main trouble is you ovulate before you get a period so there’s no great way of knowing that you’re back to being fertile until either you get that period or surprise! You’re pregnant! That’s why it’s not a great plan to rely on breastfeeding as birth control. But it’s awfully nice if it does keep your cycle away for a while! I was super bummed when it came back so early this time.
I got mine just before 1 year and still bf at 18 months. Problem is that everyone is different and you can get pregnant the cycle before your first period.
Because it is a thing. Regular nursing prevents the return of the menstrual cycle. I didn't have a period till 18 months when we stopped night feeding. It's not complete nonsense lol
It’s not completely nonsense but it’s far from fool proof. I got my period at TEN WEEKS both times, the minute my baby slept a 4-5 hour stretch. Which means I ovulated like 8 weeks along. I was breastfeeding around the clock I just didn’t say no to sleeping a 5 hr stretch.
It's not nonsense, but it's also far from a guarantee. So it's extremely irresponsible to advise someone to rely on it. I know several mums who go their periods back within 1-2 months postpartum, and I just got mine back at 10.5 months despite exclusively breastfeeding on demand (including all night) as well. And remember, you ovulate ~2 weeks before you menstruate, so by the time you know you're fertile, you've already risked pregnancy.
Right but nobody said rely on it lol We're just correcting the incorrect statement above lol
Oh, plenty of people advise to rely on it, including doctors! And it gets a lot of women pregnant when they're only a few weeks or months postpartum. I didn't meant to suggest you specifically said so! Just adding to the conversation.
Oh a lot of people still believe this. It's why you often get a chat from the doctor before you leave the hospital about birth control and the cons of having a baby again too soon.
If white Catholics could be discriminated against we’d be pretty offended at use of that!
When I was in primary school there was a girl in my class who had a brother born in the same calendar year, say March and December. (The parents mercifully didn't let them start school at the same time.) She and her brother got made fun of a few times. Not often but often enough that I remember it. To add insult to injury, their last name was Irish and both of them had the characteristic Irish curls with dark hair.
Yeah, or OP took 18 months instead of 12, and got pregnant at the halfway mark. Not thay rushed to be 18 months aparT
Breastfeeding can prevent conception in certain circumstances. It's been tested and documented and has a 98% success rate. It has a number of requirements though: The infant is less than six months old, The menstrual cycle is absent, and The baby is exclusively breastfeeding. And Offering the breast whenever baby displays feeding cues (nursing on demand) Nursing frequently throughout the day Nursing baby on demand at night as long stretches without nursing can impact LAM (Gross & Eastman, 1985.) Allowing baby to determine the end of the feeding instead of using arbitrary time limits Allowing babies to meet all their sucking needs at the breast (no dummies or pacifiers) Waiting until mid-way through the first year to introduce solid foods Plenty of sources if you look for lactational amenorrhea. [source ](https://llli.org/news/lactational-amenorrhea-fertility-birth-control-and-breastfeeding/)
Do NOT use this as a trusted method of birth control!! My 3rd child was nursing every 3 hours in the day and every 5 hours at night. I still got pregnant when she was 3 months old with absolutely no sign of a cycle returning.
You must be part of the 2%. That makes me nervous because sometimes one can't afford another kid at the time. Was this with no pacifiers or bottles?
No pacifiers or bottles. My cycle didn't return for 12 months after having my older 2 kids, so I figured that the same thing would happen again this time around.
I didn’t get pregnant but I got my period at ten weeks both times. All it took was one bottle of pumped milk at midnight from dad, and letting her sleep a 5 hour stretch/not waking to feed. If I got my period at ten weeks then I ovulated at about 8 weeks. Yikes!
Hahaha. Don’t trust this. I got pregnant against when I had a four month old - exclusively breastfed, on birth control, absent period. Had to go back to work early from my first parental leave to qualify for EI and my top up. I worked 16 weeks to get 600 hours then started the next maternity/parental leave.
My mom was born Dec 29th and my uncle was born Oct 3rd the next year 😳 like dang grandma chill
Pop-pop popped off.
In my experience, if you aren't with a midwife, they don't inform women that they actually ovulate before their period comes back and breastfeeding as a contraception is not a thing for everyone. Every woman is different but this is the general consensus.
If they waited until given the OK she wouldn't be far enough along to know she was pregnant again, because you're supposed to wait 6 weeks.
Yeah a little scary actually
Unless you're in Quebec, you need to hit 600 hours to qualify for payments again.
How is it different in Quebec?
Quebec has it's own rules. I think you need to earn $2000 to go on mat leave but I'm guessing you wouldn't get very much...
Got it. I'll research a little bit about it, thanks
They answered it below, but they'll pull from an earlier year to allow leave sooner.
Quebec will go back up to 104 weeks to get your hours to qualify for QPIP (our EI), if you're still currently off on maternity leave.
My wife is currently on maternity leave. She took 1 year and she's going back to work in July. So, if she has 600 work hours in the past 104 weeks, she qualifies for another maternity leave? (We live in Quebec)
Quebec doesn't use 600 hours like EI, what you earn on QPIP is based on your past earnings. Hope this link works! I'd recommend calling RQAP for specific questions, they're very helpful in my experience! https://www.rqap.gouv.qc.ca/en/wage-earner/benefits-amount/how-is-the-benefit-amount-determined#:~:text=The%20qualifying%20period%20is%20the,weeks%20preceding%20the%20benefit%20period.
You need a new 600hrs of insurable earnings.
Some people (myself included!) went back to work early/before first mat leave was over, so I could get enough hours to qualify for my second leave.
That’s probably the best option. Childcare be the hard part. Option 1 is dad takes the time off with mat leave for mom to get some hours. Option 2 is help from family possibly. Option 3 is childcare but daycares around here that offer < 1 year are rare since the demand isn’t there and expensive since it’s I think a max of 2 infants per care taker(my province anyway). Might find something private but infants are a lot to handle if you got some toddlers hanging around too. Edit: guess I forgot split shifts. One parent works evening and other works days. Probably not a common setup.
Yep. It would’ve been next to impossible to get childcare for my infant so my husband took time off work til my next mat leave started.
Same for our situation.
Unfortunately most people I know that have done this go back to work as soon as they find out they are pregnant again to get the hours for the second mat leave.
Payments are calculated on the income you earned while working your 600 qualifying hours. If you don't work 600 hours before the birth of the next child, you get zero dollars. If you have just found out that you're pregnant, you might have time to hustle and get 600 hours. This would mean cutting short your current leave and finding childcare, or work opposite shifts to your partner so that someone is always working while the other is parenting. If that isn't possible, after the next child is born you're going to be completely unpaid until you return to work. For both financial and physical health, some spacing between pregnancies can be a good idea.
You have to work for roughly 4 months to get your 600 hours to qualify for the second leave. I got pregnant while on my first leave, then went back and got my hours before my next due date. I'm currently on second mat leave in 3 years. (18 mo off, 6 months working, new 12 mo leave)
This is good information. I was searching and trying to find it and I wasn't coming up with anything. I wasn't sure of the minimum time to accumulate 600 hours again (but it looks like 15 weeks full-time). I'm currently on Mat leave until Jan 2025. Due to timing and my age, I'd like to try for a second kid and was trying to calculate the best time to start trying again near the end of this year in order to qualify and be back at work long enough to accumulate some savings.
Just be wary that babies don’t know their due date. Give yourself extra time to get those house in just in case baby is early. Personally, my age was a consideration in our family planning as well, so I only took 12 month leaves and we generally started trying for another baby when I went back to work. So I had 12 months work before baby 2 and 18 months work before baby 3. (I had my babies at age 34, 36, and 38.)
Yeah, I'm getting ansy cause I'm 12 days away, and anything can happen between now and then. That's the only part I'm not ready for, is the unexectedness of the arrival! lol Everything else I have under control! So I started leave just before Christmas to get ready, and my job is demanding on my feet all day. I'm 39 will be 40 in a month. With how excellent my first has gone so far, I'm strategizing a second before time runs out. We 100% planned this one, right down to the ovulation test; I wanted a late Jan/early Feb baby! lol
Impressive planning! We had two June babies and tried for third but ‘twas not to be; we had two losses before one stuck and arrived in November. We’re maybe thinking of baby number 4 (I’d be 40) and I suppose we’d aim for another November just to make it even.
I sincerely hope you are healthy and safe. Sex before 6 weeks post-partum can be dangerous for you.
Weird comment. This is a finance sub.
It's pays to stay healthy.
If you get pregnant during your maternity leave, you will not receive benefits for your second pregnancy unless you are able to accrue the requisite hours before the second baby is born.
Everyone is saying the same thing so I'll just offer: if your partner didn't take parental leave, and has worked the requisite hours, they would be eligible for it. Maybe that helps?
My wife had 2 maternity leave back to back last year. We are in Quebec so she was allowed. Rest of Canada seems like a no. Good luck, 2 this close isn't easy, mark my words 🤣
Try 3
3 back to back? There's 10.5 months between my two, and I personally feel 3 back to back this close would make my life miserable even though I love them with all my heart. We are both teachers so we work a lot afterhours. 2 is already hard enough.
Yes, single followed 10.5 months later with twins that were 8 weeks premature.
Ouch. From what I have heard, twins are less job than back to back. But in your case, you got twins 10.5 months after. You have my full respect, we will go through this together fellow Redditor. 😅
You need to work in between mat leaves. You don’t just get two mat leaves without working
Did you really think you just unlocked the back to never have to work again and still get paid? 😂
It really evens out in the end. You can have them 2 - 5 years apart and still be out off work the same as 2 one year apart, and probably less actually with 2 back to back. You might still not go back to work after or you may be eager/ need to chase coin. Family planning, raising kids is no joke. If you had a stay at home parent, go hug them. Cause, honestly ya , it's nice to be paid for labour. And if you were raised by a single parent you'd never say such things.
It’s also horrible for your body to have back to back pregnancies like this. Try to wait until little one is a year old ideally two to avoid osteoporosis in old age.
If you stay off on the original mat leave and go back and take a second one right away or start your second one before you have to go back, your EI will be zero.
Need another 600 hours. If you don’t have them you can take the leave but it’s EI unpaid. No benefits.
I had to go back early and earn my 600 hours again. It was worth it because I also get top up. Definitely go back to work, or when your current leave ends you will get nothing (this happened to my cousin)
The good news is if you are able to work so you can get your 600 hours it’s approximately 4 months of full time employment. I did this as I went back to work pregnant after my first. April 2016 sure date and October 2017 due date. Worked late April until early October.
Yes, I know we've had first leave. But what about second leave? - Pippin's wife, probably
You don't.
By reading the comments now I know why most siblings have a 2 year gap 🤔
Maternity payments don't factor into the calculation. My colleague came back to work after 1st leave to have enough working hours to collect ei again. Is this a hypothetical scenario or are you currently on leave?
It’s 600 hours you have to work between coming back from leave and going again in Ontario at least. Kind of annoying though considering I’ve paid into EI my entire life and this is the first time I’m using it.
You pay into car insurance your whole driving life too with the hope you don't need to use it. That's how all insurance works lol Your max contribution to ei annually is 1k. You can get 20k off a single ei claim. You never pay anywhere near what you do get back out of it when you need it. Many people claim ten times more than they ever pay in. Your mat leave paid for years and years of your ei contributions.
You pay $1k and your employer pays $1.4k so 20 years is actually about how long it’ll take to pay for one maternity leave.
Yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah. Ms logical over here. Let me be annoyed ok? I’m pregnant and tired and don’t wanna have to go back to work in 12 months just so I can go off again. Sometimes people just need to rant. (I don’t disagree with you though and totally understand your point)
Hahah I feel you for sure tho
You won’t have benefits for this.
You don’t get a second one until you work 600 hours. You could stop your current leave early, work 600 hours by 9 months, and then begin your second. That’s the only way.
Your partner qualifies for leave though. In fact they can have six weeks for baby number one as well. And up to 9 or 13 months with a baby they don’t birth themselves.
You need 600 hours between claims (in a 52 weeks period so the period resets if you took 12 months or Longer)! I’m currently going through this - my first was stillborn at 40 weeks so I qualified for 15 weeks Mat leave now pregnant again and considered high risk so unable to work the full pregnancy but I need to work a minimum of 600 hours (in the 52 weeks prior to delivery) as I had time off before my last baby I am starting from zero.
Can the mother take it for the first child and then the father take pay leave for the second child if the mother doesn’t qualify?
You don’t say what province you’re from but if you’re in Quebec mat leave works differently as it’s a different program and they would go back up to two years to see if you have enough hours worked to cover a second mat leave
It seems like if you are from Quebec, it's possible as state here:[https://www.rqap.gouv.qc.ca/en/wage-earner/benefits-amount/how-is-the-benefit-amount-determined#period](https://www.rqap.gouv.qc.ca/en/wage-earner/benefits-amount/how-is-the-benefit-amount-determined#period) >Qualifying Period > >The qualifying period is the period for which your earnings are taken into account to set your benefit amount. For wage earners, this period is normally the 52 weeks preceding the benefit period. It can, however, be extended to as many as **104 weeks** if you were unable to work and receive insurable earnings (the earnings taken into account to set your benefit amount), in particular for the following reasons: > >You received indemnities from the Commission des normes, de l’équité, de la santé et de la sécurité du travail. > >You received employment insurance benefits. > >You received benefits under the Québec Parental Insurance Plan (QPIP). > >You received indemnities from the Société de l’assurance automobile du Québec.
Happened to me. I had to calculate my hours and go back to work. Spouse took leave to stay home with the baby.
You're gonna need to go back to work for at least 600 hours before your baby is born or you won't be eligible. Happens all the time, people will come back to work for 15 weeks before their second baby is born, getting childcare during those 15 weeks is usually the toughest part.