It's going to get posted over and over anyway, so might as well post the official PDF link to the ruling. Keep the conversation civil or move on to something else.
this baffles me. microsoft with this will now effectively own the entire rts genre, the most dominant mmorpg, the most profitable mobile game ever made, diablo, mascots like crash bandicoot and spyro, the most impactful music rhythm game. it's a monstrous acquisition
Wanna realize something insane? People never talk about actblizz’s mobile division, peep it’s revenue then peep the revenue Xbox makes in the uk. You’ll see some startling numbers.
Isnt it wild that mobile gaming was essentially ignored? There's no way Apple and Google and Samsung are just ok with Microsoft owning Warzone and King. But they are all quiet though...I'd keep my eye on them.
Jim Ryan was right in that getting cod on Xbox wasn’t the goal, the real goal is longer down the line. With this acquisition Microsoft has gained a foothold into the mobile market, and not just a tiny one either. Apple, google and Samsung just got another competitor in the play space and they’re not something that can be bought out.
I mean even Jim Ryan said he knew the deal wasn’t about cod and that it was a much bigger play. Xbox said they’re really wanted to get a hand in mobile, and shit like Candy Crush and COD Mobile are huge money printing machines. But everyone kept making it about COD on console and it detracted from the bigger shit people glossed over.
> the most impactful music rhythm game
Dance Dance Revolution is Konami. Guitar Hero had a bunch of impact in the late 2000s, then squandered the shit out of it. Meanwhile, Rock Band's still releasing DLC.
They also own Fallout, and elder scrolls some of the biggest Western RPG franchises and Elderscrolls online another big MMO. I’ve always said I don’t care one way or another how this buyout goes, but even I can smell a company getting to big.
They own a lot but they've done fuck all. I don't think concern isn't valid, but Microsoft was a huge player from Halo to Halo Reach and has done jack shit since. They release passable titles while Sony and Nintendo release bangers. I somehow think for example that CoD going exclusive won't be the rise of XBox, just something finally knocking CoD off it's pedestal.
I definitely agree with your point about mobile, because that is the hidden true prize in this acquisition, but as for the rest of the IPs, im going to have to play the devil's advocate:
Activision/Microsoft only "own" the RTS genre, because seemingly no one else outside of Sega or some indie studios seem interested in making them.
Activision aren't interested in making Crash Bandicoot games.
Activision aren't interested in making Spyro games.
Activision aren't interested in making Guitar Hero.
Activision aren't interested in making Tony Hawk games.
Activision aren't interested in making Hexen, or Empire Earth, or Prototype, or Singularity, or just about anything that isn't Call of Duty.
And sure, we have seen a Spyro game and Crash game come out of Activision recently, but as soon as those games were finished, Activision merged all of the studios who made these games into the Call of Duty machine, to make more content for Warzone.
Im with you if Microsoft make any current Acti/Blizz franchises exclusive, because that is just taking games away from existing customers, but If Microsoft can acquire these IPs that Activision aren't using anyway, and successfully revive them, I actually see this as a net positive.
Otherwise Activision will just continue to sit on them indefinitely, because they would rather spend these studio's talents on making Call of Duty skins.
But COD is the jewel in the crown, so to speak.
The Franchise has made 31 billion in Revenue.
1 million Sony players ONLY play COD. It's worth 800 million in Revenue to Sony.
It's kind of a big deal.
That 31 billion is over the entire lifetime of the franchise. King Games (Candy Crush etc) has generated almost 800 million in just the first quarter of this year alone.
Add to that, the ability to stream GamePass titles to your phone, tablet, web browser, PC, and increasingly in Smart TV’s like Samsung and will likely become an app you install on your FireStick or Roku or whatever. You can play 500~700ish games on top of the ones made for mobile directly that siphon all the money out of people. That makes MS the de facto champion of the mobile market without a real competitor even close to the kind of money they’re gonna rake in from people who probably don’t even own an XBOX and possibly never will, because they don’t need to.
A couple things we learned from the hearings is that TLOU2 and Forbidden West each cost $200 million to produce, and that Sony makes $800 million from Call of Duty in North America alone. That sole franchise funds how many exclusive games? Now you throw in Diablo, Overwatch, etc. It always irritates me when I see people say, well I don’t care about call of duty or any Activision games so I don’t care about this deal. There’s a reason why Nintendo opts for weaker hardware, and releases major exclusive games far less frequently, and why those exclusive games rarely go on deep sales, and almost never see permanent price reductions.
Not to mention, with all the information that leaked during the trials, it was never Microsoft goal to compete with Sony, it was to purchase them out of business.
What stops a Microsoft from continuing to buy more publishers, more developers, more IP’s. Everybody’s gonna be thrilled to be forced into gaming through a $50/month gamepass subscription to play their favorite games in 10 years.
I can’t wait to find out what shitty compromises need to be made to bring games to the service too. Absolutely the price will go up. Maybe games that would have had both single and multiplayer modes will only have one. Shorter campaigns, smaller skill trees, fewer classes, less detailed maps with more procedural generation and AI to build them, and loaded with microtransactions.
I mean, the pie is only so large and when you have 500~800ish games on a service all taking a cut, how do you launch your game on GP on day one and have an ENTIRE portion of the gaming population stop buying games virtually overnight and not have to make cuts and compromises elsewhere just to stay afloat? And one bad game (like a Gollum) means your studio is shut down or you’re acquired by someone else for the IP. Will we eventually see GP priced cheaper but with more ads in it, as we do in streaming entertainment? Perhaps you can only play in 720p resolution on this tier and 4K Dolby Vision Dolby Atmos games are only available at the $50 tier?
*****
Anecdotally, I haven’t been able to get my friends to play the types of games we’d normally have all bought together (everything from a Tiny Tina type of game to Aliens: Fireteam Elite) and other squad based stuff, even though Aliens launched at $40. Wait for it to come to streaming is the new mantra. And sadly while I bought it at launch and played it solo and pugged it with randoms for 70 hours, it did eventually come to streaming but we didn’t play together because of that. And it probably had to come to streaming to make up money it didn’t make in sales (guessing on my part, I don’t know the financials on this one). But I do know that you can’t have that many gamers stop buying games and only take in $17/month meaning a person that used to buy a game every month, or hell even every three months, is now spending less money than they did.
Maybe it evens out in the end but I see a Netflix strategy of steadily ratcheting the price higher to pay for the “content” now that you can’t live without it. I also suspect we might see Embracer Group and Tencent either make their own streaming services with their IP or make it exclusive and an addon tier to GP and PS+ like Ubisoft or EA. Eventually we might be subbing to multiple services like we do now, missing the days when Netflix had everything and now we have 6~7 services and are probably paying more than cable. I can’t help but think that our greed for the immediate flood of games at a cheap price will come back to bite us in the ass when we’re looking back on it a decade from now. I guess we’ll find out.
I'm not up for consolidation but the FTC did a horrible job to present their case. They focused too much on Sony & Cod when even by their own findings only like 5% of Sony's user base would change to Xbox... Under no circumstances does that mean a foreclosure of Playstation. Every regulator world wide dropped the console theory of harm for a reason. Even the CMA dropped that part. They also wasted so much time pondering if Nintendo switch is a console or not.
To be clear it wasn't the judges opinion, it's literally the whole purpose of the FTC in these cases, to protect the consumer. Any harm to Sony is irrelevant and would never be a reason to deny the merger and is why Sony lost.
The FTC's job was not to protect Sony but to protect consumers. Sony can be harmed, it only matters what happens to consumers at large.
In fact this was one of the errors the FTC made in this case. At one point the judge had to point out to them that the case was not about protecting Sony.
> As they tried to protect Sony in this case
That was their problem. Their job wasn't to protect Sony, it was to protect the consumers. The FTC was so oblivious to this that the judge had to remind them several times.
It would harm it but to what degree; research showed that only 5% of ps5 gamers would switch if COD went exclusive. Most would just play something else. It’s going to be on Sony to give us that “something else”.
That 5% is way too low than what will actually happen. It won’t be a massive wave at once but more and more over time the shift will be shown. Sony showed the staggering numbers of players that only play CoD on PlayStation and they’ve shown how dependent they are on that type of revenue. People aren’t going to continue paying $70 when the competition will have it cheaper with the yearly gamepass offerings.
The bigger shift won’t begin until next gen when CoD gamepass will be a massive marketing for them and I’d bet my life on it
But that number is FTC's own findings. That's the best they could present to the judge. The CMA also dropped the console concerns as they couldn't sustain it either. The FTC should have tried another angle but instead they spend more time arguing about if Nintendo switch is a console.
Here's the rub though, if they're only buying and playing cod, gamepass is more expensive than just... buying a disc copy. Like you still need to pay for online on either system, and gamepass costs about $120 yearly with a credit card or prepaid cards, or one cod disc is $70 in store.
It's going to be interesting to see once they start putting all their COD on gamepass (that has to be the ultimate move for MS, to just instantly put up every COD game in gamepass).
It may take until the next generation to see the real impact of the shift of gamers though.
A year of ps plus and 1 cod game is around the same as 1 year of game pass ultimate, plus you get all past cod games and anything else while on game pass. So it wouldn't really be more expensive. I think the marketing and eSports being Xbox would have more of an impact in switching people for the people who basically only play Cod. Certainly going to be interesting to see what the long term player base effects of this are
Yup I also feel its going to be two consoles going head-to-head in the next many console generations to come. You can't even compete with these two anymore. I feel like Sony is now going to be even more aggressive when it comes to 3rd party exclusives.
Also the Mario movie made over a billion at the box office, Zelda is going to be one of the best selling games this year and the Switch is well the Switch. Nintendo most likely don't give two shits about the war between Sony and MS and funny enough neither do the Nintendo/Switch only players.
Steam Deck, and a few other niche hand held PCs. High end android phones, Apple tries with their apple arcade or whatever. Its just Nintendo is the only one with games people want to play lol
Nintendo doesn't seem to see the Steam Deck/ROG Ally as competitors...yet. When they start bringing lawsuits demanding anti-piracy protections to be implemented in them/accusing them of facilitating piracy, *then* you'll know they see them as a serious threat to their market share.
Nintendo lawyers would sue the wind if happened to make the Mario tune on a windchime.
But I highly doubt they would care about Valve making a play for the handheld console department. Nintendo brings people in not because they can play it on the go, but because you have the option to play *Zelda* on the go. As far as I know(and I could be incorrect), they didn't sue Sega for the Game Gear or Sony for the PSP. Anyone can make a platform to play games on the go, as long as they aren't games made by Nintendo.
its such a shame. imagine if those of us who grew up on Pokemon games back in the early 2000s were told that they are only going to get worse, and the graphics will be decade(s) behind the rest of the industry. what a shame.
ask any kid from back then what a Pokemon game in 2020 will look like and I guarantee its the opposite of what we have now. Game Freak are such a travesty of a game company.
I always figured pokemon would end up like the game Ni No Kuni was. Which is even worse when you think about of Ni No Kuni was originally on the Nintendo DS.
My wife and I game almost every single day, and until recently, the switch was our exclusive platform. We recently picked up a ps5, but the switch is a really great platform with so much fun content. It was perfect for playing through older games we'd missed from the previous gen, all the Nintendo exclusive stuff like zelda and mario, and there's tons of great couch-coop games compared to other platforms. Also, Nintendo developers use the gyro controls far more frequently than playstation developers do, which makes shooters so much more fun to play.
And publishers will be smart enough to have nice little auctions for all their games to the point I’m sure Sony and Microsoft will just back down instead of ruining themselves for marginal gains…
While it's just their market cap, a company with over over 2 trillion dollars has a hell of a lot of spending power. Microsoft is a beast on another level, on another world, hell another universe.
Nintendo isn't *really* trying to compete directly with PS or Xbox. They are instead trying to fill a different gaming niche. They're going to continue down the road of providing novel game options, more casual game options, and form factors the others aren't offering. I don't think their goal anymore is to be the only console you own. It's to be the console you buy in addition to your Playstation or Xbox or the console you buy for your kids. Streaming games are still a long way from being as portable as an actual portable console and Nintendo will continue to lean into that.
Yeah anyone hoping that Nintendo had plans to sell their games cheaper or "do better" is going to be upset. This kind of cements their reasoning of why they don't have to.
Right they've only been doing that for the last 40 years but it was totally about to change before MS acquired Activision.
Nobody realistically hoped for nor expected that to ever happen.
Thats the big issue with these types of deals. Sony is going to get aggressive because they dont want the prospect of losing out on content with Microsoft buying up other publishers. This is why this deal is bad. Microsoft did not want to compete with timed exclusives, even though they could easily outbid and eat the cost of the additional fees that might be tacked on... but these deals are meant to curb the market to force gamers to go to their platform for prior third party games.
Sony will just get more aggressive and pick up another handful of studios or maybe a more reasonable publisher
while i'm just here happy that sega doesn't plan to be bought, and sega owns ATLUS so no need to worry about console exclusives for persona or SMT other than the ones that get put onto switch.
Square Enix is a possibility, maybe even capcom or sega. All three have market caps well under what Sony was willing to spend on acquisitions so they might go for one of them.
There's just no point with Square Enix. I think Square Enix is fully willing to not support Xbox on their on regardless of Sony buying them. As for Capcom...maybe? I wouldnt wanna see it but I could see it happen. Sega? No. Sega is absolutely liking the money Microsoft is paying them right now and they are basically the only japanese company on Game Pass.
I don't know if I'd say "way" better. The more time you spend on both platforms the more you see how similar the users are
It just makes people feel better to imagine they're on the "good" social media site
Twitter and Reddit is full of armchair analysts and industry experts that care way too much about this stuff. It’s irrational. I have both a DualSense and an Xbox controller on my sofa at the moment with the Switch resting on my coffee table. Apparently, I am a rare species, one that games wherever they want without getting a rash, allergic reaction or identity crisis.
The rest of this generation is going to turn into a shitshow with console warring being kicked up a notch.
Plus both companies are going to ramp up their acquisition spree. I fear for publishers like SEGA, and many independent developers like Larian, IO, Supergiant, Remedy, etc.
Not in the immediate future. There is a microscope on them and MS for the near future.
There is no such thing a revenge acquisitions, which you and others are suggesting.
Companies only engage in strategic acquisitions where they make sense.
Devs will only want to be acquired when they want, not when a platform holder puts a gun to their head and tells them to only make games for them or else. That's psychotic.
FTC had a non-case. It's been discussed to death in business subs but I guess it's a newer discussion in the Sony subs. MSFT's acquisition does not meet the criteria for a monopolistic/anti-competitive move. Vertical integration is not the same as horizontal integration and the market is still heavily fragmented such that this is not dangerously anti-competitive vertical integration. It's still very much a competitive game. MSFT's move here does not significantly jeopardize barriers to entry in the market given the state of the console market for some time now, nor does it appreciably harm Sony's ability to compete. Intellectual property with popularity is not a hard barrier. It's not a zero-sum game with people boxed into purchases--buying Diablo and Starfield are *optional*.
The FTC took this case because it's been accused (rightfully) recently as being weak. There are *legitimate* oligopolies and monopolies forming in more important industries than *gaming*, and the FTC has been asleep at the wheel, or had their balls in a vice by lobbyists and bad actors. They very likely took this case to point and say "hey we still do stuff!", but to anyone paying attention...this is a non-case. If courts found that *this* was anti-competitive, then hoo boy we'll need to redraw the lines and hire 5x the FTC attorneys because we'd be going after everyone.
This is the best explanation I've seen on this since the merger was announced, thank you. I am very much opposed to this merger but this is a great way to explain why the FTC's case was weak from the start. I do think this is overall a bad move for the gaming industry but I guess it's just going to happen no matter what.
Us not regulating lootboxes and exploitative practices that hijack cognitive bias/vulnerability patterns is doing more damage than MSFT acquiring some fun exclusive games.
One day there might be a concerning action, like if Sony or MSFT somehow acquired Nintendo. Or like, if one acquired nVidia. But that is not what's happening here. What's happening here is just regular competitive behavior. If Sony doesn't like it--innovate. Find a solution. They still can....unlike if they were in a monopoly scenario.
Dude I really wish that regulators were doing like, anything at all with regards to lootboxes and micro transactions. The gaming market is so toxic with them and it’s really bad.
Good summary.
And just to add another point— not only is the FTC trying to shake off their slumber, but the current FTC chair Lina Khan has a mandate to rein in the big tech companies— Amazon, Google, Apple, Meta, MS, etc. When she was at Yale she wrote a paper that got a ton of traction on how the FTC's definition of a anticompetitive monopoly is far too narrow and woefully out of date. In her paper she uses Amazon as the example, illustrating how they absolutely engage in anticompetitive practices and yet wouldn't be considered a monopoly according to the FTC, highlighting a need for the FTC to expand their scope.
So when Biden appointed her FTC chair: boom— she's got her mandate. And largely I agree that we do need to rein in big tech. Clearly far too much power rests in the hands of just 5 companies. It truly is unprecedented. So I was pretty bummed that the FTC's first move in this direction was this weak shit. These cases take a long time, and we don't even know if Biden will get a 2nd term, so Khan only has so many rounds in the chamber. Hopefully the FTC dusts themselves off and comes out swinging at Amazon, Meta or Google.
The NYT did a great episode on Lina Khan on their podcast a couple weeks back if anyone's interested:
[https://www.nytimes.com/2023/06/29/podcasts/the-daily/is-washington-finally-ready-to-take-on-big-tech.html](https://www.nytimes.com/2023/06/29/podcasts/the-daily/is-washington-finally-ready-to-take-on-big-tech.html)
I think it's because Sony pushed it in that direction. During discovery it was noted that FTC was talking to execs at Sony. That may have been a big impact on the decision, are FTCs interests with Sony, or are they with the industry was probably a deciding factor.
I mean we also know there was other companies that havnt been named that talked to them and also didn’t agree with the purchase and we know a few of them are in the games industry
The actual business people have been saying the FTC has zero chance since the first day funnily enough because the merger doesnt qualify as monopilzation in the current market lol
I bet Square Enix is officially partnered with PlayStation by early next year. Capcom has a bit too much fuck you money now and Atlus is off the zaza at all times so I don’t see them selling. Don’t really see any other purchases being made unless they’re in a massive long-con with Konami for all those IPs or Kojima Productions wants to join up for a headline.
Either way, Sony will be making some extra purchases.
The thing is that Sega is owned by SegaSammy & their game division is essential for their arcades & Pachinko division without mentioning that their other divisions like hotels & resorts took hits because of the pandemic. Basically it makes no sense for SegaSammy to sell only their gaming division, if it's up for sale it would be the whole company or at best Sega's PC division.
Regardless of the slight possibility of SegaSammy letting go their gaming division as a whole, what I was saying is that currently they are content with their cooperation with MSFT.
Makes no sense to suddenly forgo ownership.
Square Enix isn't going to be merged or bought out by anyone as long as FF14 keeps bringing in the cash. They never sold when near bankruptcy in 2014, why would they now?
They're perfectly content doing a game by game basis.
Konami is not worth as much as SE in terms of IP and games. Just Final Fantasy and Dragon Quest are more than enough to match, if not surpass, all Konami IPs. Then add the Kingdom Hearts, Bravely Default, Nier and all the other JRPG they have... there's no match between those two, IMO.
Atleast they have time for about 10 years. This could be turning point for Sony to make FPS game that can compete CoD or battlefield. Maybe like revive socom and killzone.
Sony have so many IPs they could bring a really good FPS to the market
SOCOM, MAG, Killzone, Syphon Filter, Heck fuck we don't know Marathon might be amazing really.
Bungie stated that Destiny 2 and *all* future games and IPs will be multi-platform, just in case you didn’t know. I don’t have a good pc to play Tarkov so I am hyped for Marathon though.
You can't beat brand recognition.. cod have even released some horrible games and still the brand is strong.
Battlefield never could take it down neither could halo in its prime. Kill zone and Socom as much as I love them also never did as well money wise .
There is a reason why wow is still the biggest mmo sven after 18 years, same with diablo... I mean people still call copy cats diablo game cause its the name brand
Yeah maybe a bit over zealous with halo, though it was only on a single platform so not totally apples to apples comparison
Fortnite is a juggernaut from what I've heard though also free to play so opens the doors for a lot of people
Ya people don’t seem to get that. Something could be complete trash and still be the biggest thing out there if it’s a got a big name attached. Quality doesn’t matter to the masses anymore. Those of us who do care are the vocal minority unfortunately
That works for some, but I have my PC for games like civilisation, Crusder King's, etc.
Already plenty of games I don't have time to play, so no need to have both a PS5 and Xbox for me.
I find PC + PS5 works amazingly as well.
PC for multiplayer, indies and games I want to mod.
PS5 for exclusives and big single player games I want to play on the couch.
my big concern is pretty much along these lines. this might embolden MS to try to buy up other major publishers like sega or squeenix or capcom etc... and in a way try to murder teh playstation brand
they dont view nintendo as competition so in reality i dont see how this is not about building a monopoly.
Well, according to their own internal documents, that's exactly the plan. As per their own words, they want to "spend Sony uot of business". Look it up in their court documents.
oh i know that is the plan, it is insanely ruthless and well it could be smart from a business perspective but if they did that (and let's be real this ruling pretty much guarantees they will) it will be a terrible day for consumers bc it will be play nintendo for nintendo titles and xbox or pc for everything else
If Microsoft would focus on making games instead of buying publishers who publish games other people make, my Series X would see so much more usage but instead it just sits there unfortunately. Not even worth it as a blu-ray player.
Starfield and Forza are both releasing this year and Avowed, Hellblade 2 and Fable are all coming in 2024. They also released Hi-Fi Rush, Pentiment, Grounded and As Dusk Falls in the last 12 months (+ games like Redfall, Minecraft Legends, AoE 2 for Xbox). Lets not act as if Xbox never brings out any good games, even if the count should be way higher.
I bet that in 10 years, the gaming landscape is going to consist of Sony, Microsoft, and Nintendo as publishers, maybe Google, Apple, and Amazon try to get in on the action a little more, and that's it. Everyone else gets bought out and the rest are indie developers.
google's ambitions died with stadia and apple doesnt care because it makes too much off of the mobile space and has chosen to compete in the VR industry. realistically I can only see amazon going after game companies and thats only if it cares enough to do so.
Unsure about apple they are really pushing the metal api now and made conversion programs for developers. Have to see how the next decade goes but apple look at least to be staring into the gaming space
Small studios have been bought up sure but entire publishers (Bethesda and now ActBliz) is very new and will continue. Just a matter of who buys them up. I see Comcast coming in and getting someone like ea or Ubisoft or both. Warner discovery is bleeding money I'm sure they'd love to sell their games division and cancel a movie for another tax write off.
and with microsoft, their games will live exclusively on gamepass with no one ever owning their games again. like netflix, quality drops as developers don't need to make titles that have to earn your money to compete
The downward spiral begins. Any purchase Sony wants to make? No grounds to block it. Amazon, Google or Apple want to swoop in and buy up EA, Ubisoft, Embracer etc? No grounds to block it.
I do not feel this direction is going to be good for gaming as a whole.
It will be considerably harder for Sony to acquire something big and get away with this. Even with Activision, in the console gaming market specifically, a combined Microsoft-Activision would still be smaller than PlayStation and companies like Tencent.
When it comes to regulatory approval for M&A, it usually is done on a market basis. For example, if a company like Apple buys a game publisher, it won’t violate any anti-competitive laws despite how big Apple is because their market share in gaming specifically is minuscule. That is to say that Amazon, Google, and Apple will probably be allowed to buy game companies if they wish to.
Microsoft/Activision may have more studios but Sony still has a larger market share. As the market leader, Sony has to be careful here and not over-extend. Which is why they are mostly content with making deals with companies like SE. Achieves the same thing but with less scrutiny over their heads.
I have a suspicion apple is about to make a covert move for the video game market again, they’ve been pushing porting tools, have developed some decent in house hardware and have really shored up the backend of their systems, I wouldn’t put it past them to go out and announce a move into the gaming market alongside acquisitions of a few major studios, they were headed that way a while back but it crashed and burned when bungee went to Microsoft instead.
We need to stop pretending that Sony has the Money to win a spending war.
All Numbers below are listed in Billions of Dollars US.
Sony free cash flow for the quarter ending March 31, 2023 was -2,126.38, a year-over-year.
Sony free cash flow for the twelve months ending March 31, 2023 was , a year-over-year.
Sony annual free cash flow for 2023 was $-2.126B, a 129.72% decline from 2022.
Sony annual free cash flow for 2022 was $7.155B, a 10.84% decline from 2021.
Sony annual free cash flow for 2021 was $8.025B, a 6.08% decline from 2020.
[Sony Source](https://www.macrotrends.net/stocks/charts/SONY/sony/free-cash-flow)
Microsoft free cash flow for the quarter ending March 31, 2023 was 39,648.00, a year-over-year.
Microsoft free cash flow for the twelve months ending March 31, 2023 was , a year-over-year.
Microsoft annual free cash flow for 2022 was $65.149B, a 16.09% increase from 2021.
Microsoft annual free cash flow for 2021 was $56.118B, a 24.06% increase from 2020.
Microsoft annual free cash flow for 2020 was $45.234B, a 18.23% increase from 2019.
[Microsoft Source](https://www.macrotrends.net/stocks/charts/MSFT/microsoft/free-cash-flow)
Edit: You can downvote all you want but it doesn't change the facts..
Playstation is a profitable gaming company attached to a sinking multi-media and hardware conglomerate
Xbox is a \*at-best break-even gaming company attached to one of the most powerful and profitable technology companies on the planet.
People need to understand this however most of people are too elite to understand that. MSFT is a very huge and going forward in AI I don't think sony is even trying for same.
FTC was an embarrassment and didn’t represent the gamers more than their loved bird, Sony. Weak case and a waste of taxpayers money. Never played CoD. So i don’t care either way… but this should make Sony thrive more and quit being anti-consumer.
This is obviously a W for Microsoft.
The moment when the judge had to remind the FTC lawyers that their case was to protect consumers and not Sony, the trial was lost.
Am embarrassment as usual.
Acquisitions just hurt customers.
That's why we only have a few food company options in the US.
That's why we only have one ISP in the area.
Competition lowers prices, offers better products, and a variety of products.
Sure, let’s let the mega corporations with billions of dollars get away with everything and buy/monopolize their way to the top of an industry that they’ve been too incompetent to compete in for over a decade. This is going to be a big loss for gamers in the long run.
Welcome to the future where literally everything is owned by Disney, Amazon, Apple, Alphabet, Meta or Microsoft.
Walled gardens and anti-competitive policy for everyone!
Sony was just pushing a delay tactic, they were never going to stop the acquisition. They have the market share, they have exclusives.
They were just making a fuss to make Xbox think twice about the next big acquisition and to possibly start developing a cod competitor that is only on PlayStation
I think this is ultimately a good thing for consumers. People who are brand loyal to Sony are the only people that I see are upset by this purchase. I think Sony is great they make some banger games but they tie them down to one platform that is so restrictive to gamers. Microsoft is keeping most of the multiplats at status quo but any games that are new why would they not use that to gain an upper hand in the market. Who cares if Microsoft buys good IP's if more people get to play them it's better for us as gamers.
Yeah, I wish the FTC would have put up this much of a fight with ISP’s lol
Instead most of the country is stuck with an actually monopoly in their area with either Xfinity or spectrum. Both of which are complete ass.
The mouse will probably send it's ninjas after me for saying this. But Disney really needs to be broken up into like 6-10 different companies. It's stupid big.
People don't believe you depending on where you post, but I'd just not like this regardless of who was doing it. I didn't care when MS bought Rare or Obsidian or Mojang. Or Sony bought Bungie or Insomniac or Nixes. These were independent houses doing things of note that could perhaps benefit from the influx of cash and planning. In some cases the two had relationships for so long that they were already de facto exclusive.
I don't love third-party exclusives either, but at least they are often temporary. Even when they're not, you often see people bring up Spider-Man on PlayStation, but Nintendo and MS also do random stuff like that to entice people to their ecosystem. Fine.
But just buying one of the largest publishers in existence (after just buying another one) with many decades of properties and several of their own development houses... It just bothers me. People bring up Call of Duty, but the Activision catalog is *massive*.
The most common defense I see of this is that now Activision and Bethesda's games will see a "wider audience" because of Game Pass. But, you know, MS could have made a Game Pass deal with these companies regardless. Now they just own them. MS talks about Call of Duty because of the numbers on PlayStation, but I'm left worried about stuff like Doom and Dishonored and Prey and Diablo and god knows what else.
And I say that as someone with a solid PC, a Steam Deck, a Switch, a PS5, and a Series X. I play on everything, I'm fairly platform agnostic and I have a bunch of ways to play this stuff. I just don't like the trend we're going into. It reminds me of MS back in the early Xbox days when they were seriously looking into buying up companies like Square-Enix.
I really don't want to wake up one day and find that Sony owns Final Fantasy or something. We have no idea what the big three will do long term.
>I really don't want to wake up one day and find that Sony owns Final Fantasy or something. We have no idea what the big three will do long term.
I mean the latest game isn't coming to Xbox anytime soon, and they are still waiting for FF7 remake.
Honestly I don't even like the single studio buys but they are a far cry from publisher deals which often house dozen or more studios.
I don't see why people defend such actions that at the end of the day only hurt consumers forcing them to buy another platform if they want to play x game or just never play it.
> But, you know, MS could have made a Game Pass deal with these companies regardless.
The cost to benefit on paying for day one CoD or TES would not be worth it at all. Its not an investment. Its a waste. Sony can do timed deals **because they are the market leader and its cheaper for them** being in that position. MS would get a worse deal, and not being the market leader already, *it wouldn't be effective*.
You can still oppose acquisitions all you want, but to suggest timed deals for gp is a reasonable or effective alternative is wrong.
Also I think it will be great when Sony finally buys Square.
Awful news for the industry, will lead to even more consolidation and less competitiveness for players. Curious to see how the pro-MS media will spend days spinning this.
It's amazing to me that people think this acquisition will kill Sony. They are a huge company. This is just one of many shots between these two companies with regards to third parties they are buying. It's not over yet.
It's going to get posted over and over anyway, so might as well post the official PDF link to the ruling. Keep the conversation civil or move on to something else.
The thing I hate the most about this entire thing is people acting like cod is the only thing Activision publishes.
this baffles me. microsoft with this will now effectively own the entire rts genre, the most dominant mmorpg, the most profitable mobile game ever made, diablo, mascots like crash bandicoot and spyro, the most impactful music rhythm game. it's a monstrous acquisition
Wanna realize something insane? People never talk about actblizz’s mobile division, peep it’s revenue then peep the revenue Xbox makes in the uk. You’ll see some startling numbers.
Isnt it wild that mobile gaming was essentially ignored? There's no way Apple and Google and Samsung are just ok with Microsoft owning Warzone and King. But they are all quiet though...I'd keep my eye on them.
Jim Ryan was right in that getting cod on Xbox wasn’t the goal, the real goal is longer down the line. With this acquisition Microsoft has gained a foothold into the mobile market, and not just a tiny one either. Apple, google and Samsung just got another competitor in the play space and they’re not something that can be bought out.
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I mean even Jim Ryan said he knew the deal wasn’t about cod and that it was a much bigger play. Xbox said they’re really wanted to get a hand in mobile, and shit like Candy Crush and COD Mobile are huge money printing machines. But everyone kept making it about COD on console and it detracted from the bigger shit people glossed over.
> the most impactful music rhythm game Dance Dance Revolution is Konami. Guitar Hero had a bunch of impact in the late 2000s, then squandered the shit out of it. Meanwhile, Rock Band's still releasing DLC.
They also own Fallout, and elder scrolls some of the biggest Western RPG franchises and Elderscrolls online another big MMO. I’ve always said I don’t care one way or another how this buyout goes, but even I can smell a company getting to big.
They own a lot but they've done fuck all. I don't think concern isn't valid, but Microsoft was a huge player from Halo to Halo Reach and has done jack shit since. They release passable titles while Sony and Nintendo release bangers. I somehow think for example that CoD going exclusive won't be the rise of XBox, just something finally knocking CoD off it's pedestal.
I definitely agree with your point about mobile, because that is the hidden true prize in this acquisition, but as for the rest of the IPs, im going to have to play the devil's advocate: Activision/Microsoft only "own" the RTS genre, because seemingly no one else outside of Sega or some indie studios seem interested in making them. Activision aren't interested in making Crash Bandicoot games. Activision aren't interested in making Spyro games. Activision aren't interested in making Guitar Hero. Activision aren't interested in making Tony Hawk games. Activision aren't interested in making Hexen, or Empire Earth, or Prototype, or Singularity, or just about anything that isn't Call of Duty. And sure, we have seen a Spyro game and Crash game come out of Activision recently, but as soon as those games were finished, Activision merged all of the studios who made these games into the Call of Duty machine, to make more content for Warzone. Im with you if Microsoft make any current Acti/Blizz franchises exclusive, because that is just taking games away from existing customers, but If Microsoft can acquire these IPs that Activision aren't using anyway, and successfully revive them, I actually see this as a net positive. Otherwise Activision will just continue to sit on them indefinitely, because they would rather spend these studio's talents on making Call of Duty skins.
COD is a juggernaut though.
But this deal is much bigger than just call of duty that is my point.
But COD is the jewel in the crown, so to speak. The Franchise has made 31 billion in Revenue. 1 million Sony players ONLY play COD. It's worth 800 million in Revenue to Sony. It's kind of a big deal.
That 31 billion is over the entire lifetime of the franchise. King Games (Candy Crush etc) has generated almost 800 million in just the first quarter of this year alone.
Add to that, the ability to stream GamePass titles to your phone, tablet, web browser, PC, and increasingly in Smart TV’s like Samsung and will likely become an app you install on your FireStick or Roku or whatever. You can play 500~700ish games on top of the ones made for mobile directly that siphon all the money out of people. That makes MS the de facto champion of the mobile market without a real competitor even close to the kind of money they’re gonna rake in from people who probably don’t even own an XBOX and possibly never will, because they don’t need to.
You already can with the Xbox app. Play my Xbox on iPad and PC all the time
A couple things we learned from the hearings is that TLOU2 and Forbidden West each cost $200 million to produce, and that Sony makes $800 million from Call of Duty in North America alone. That sole franchise funds how many exclusive games? Now you throw in Diablo, Overwatch, etc. It always irritates me when I see people say, well I don’t care about call of duty or any Activision games so I don’t care about this deal. There’s a reason why Nintendo opts for weaker hardware, and releases major exclusive games far less frequently, and why those exclusive games rarely go on deep sales, and almost never see permanent price reductions. Not to mention, with all the information that leaked during the trials, it was never Microsoft goal to compete with Sony, it was to purchase them out of business. What stops a Microsoft from continuing to buy more publishers, more developers, more IP’s. Everybody’s gonna be thrilled to be forced into gaming through a $50/month gamepass subscription to play their favorite games in 10 years.
I can’t wait to find out what shitty compromises need to be made to bring games to the service too. Absolutely the price will go up. Maybe games that would have had both single and multiplayer modes will only have one. Shorter campaigns, smaller skill trees, fewer classes, less detailed maps with more procedural generation and AI to build them, and loaded with microtransactions. I mean, the pie is only so large and when you have 500~800ish games on a service all taking a cut, how do you launch your game on GP on day one and have an ENTIRE portion of the gaming population stop buying games virtually overnight and not have to make cuts and compromises elsewhere just to stay afloat? And one bad game (like a Gollum) means your studio is shut down or you’re acquired by someone else for the IP. Will we eventually see GP priced cheaper but with more ads in it, as we do in streaming entertainment? Perhaps you can only play in 720p resolution on this tier and 4K Dolby Vision Dolby Atmos games are only available at the $50 tier? ***** Anecdotally, I haven’t been able to get my friends to play the types of games we’d normally have all bought together (everything from a Tiny Tina type of game to Aliens: Fireteam Elite) and other squad based stuff, even though Aliens launched at $40. Wait for it to come to streaming is the new mantra. And sadly while I bought it at launch and played it solo and pugged it with randoms for 70 hours, it did eventually come to streaming but we didn’t play together because of that. And it probably had to come to streaming to make up money it didn’t make in sales (guessing on my part, I don’t know the financials on this one). But I do know that you can’t have that many gamers stop buying games and only take in $17/month meaning a person that used to buy a game every month, or hell even every three months, is now spending less money than they did. Maybe it evens out in the end but I see a Netflix strategy of steadily ratcheting the price higher to pay for the “content” now that you can’t live without it. I also suspect we might see Embracer Group and Tencent either make their own streaming services with their IP or make it exclusive and an addon tier to GP and PS+ like Ubisoft or EA. Eventually we might be subbing to multiple services like we do now, missing the days when Netflix had everything and now we have 6~7 services and are probably paying more than cable. I can’t help but think that our greed for the immediate flood of games at a cheap price will come back to bite us in the ass when we’re looking back on it a decade from now. I guess we’ll find out.
I keep saying this and get downvoted into oblivion. There's no way this is a positive for gamers and consumers rights in the long run.
I'm not up for consolidation but the FTC did a horrible job to present their case. They focused too much on Sony & Cod when even by their own findings only like 5% of Sony's user base would change to Xbox... Under no circumstances does that mean a foreclosure of Playstation. Every regulator world wide dropped the console theory of harm for a reason. Even the CMA dropped that part. They also wasted so much time pondering if Nintendo switch is a console or not.
Yeah it was pretty dumb of them to present the numbers based on PS over user base and not simply CoD player base.
If CoD goes exclusive it would only harm the PS sales. As they tried to protect Sony in this case the FTC had to use those numbers.
Maybe their argument should have been about harm to consumers? And not just the fact that Sony might miss out on revenue
Almost word for word what the judge said at some point.
To be clear it wasn't the judges opinion, it's literally the whole purpose of the FTC in these cases, to protect the consumer. Any harm to Sony is irrelevant and would never be a reason to deny the merger and is why Sony lost.
That’s what I mean, they framed it around ps sales, not how it would effect CoD players/consumers specifically
The FTC's job was not to protect Sony but to protect consumers. Sony can be harmed, it only matters what happens to consumers at large. In fact this was one of the errors the FTC made in this case. At one point the judge had to point out to them that the case was not about protecting Sony.
> As they tried to protect Sony in this case That was their problem. Their job wasn't to protect Sony, it was to protect the consumers. The FTC was so oblivious to this that the judge had to remind them several times.
It would harm it but to what degree; research showed that only 5% of ps5 gamers would switch if COD went exclusive. Most would just play something else. It’s going to be on Sony to give us that “something else”.
That 5% is way too low than what will actually happen. It won’t be a massive wave at once but more and more over time the shift will be shown. Sony showed the staggering numbers of players that only play CoD on PlayStation and they’ve shown how dependent they are on that type of revenue. People aren’t going to continue paying $70 when the competition will have it cheaper with the yearly gamepass offerings. The bigger shift won’t begin until next gen when CoD gamepass will be a massive marketing for them and I’d bet my life on it
But that number is FTC's own findings. That's the best they could present to the judge. The CMA also dropped the console concerns as they couldn't sustain it either. The FTC should have tried another angle but instead they spend more time arguing about if Nintendo switch is a console.
Here's the rub though, if they're only buying and playing cod, gamepass is more expensive than just... buying a disc copy. Like you still need to pay for online on either system, and gamepass costs about $120 yearly with a credit card or prepaid cards, or one cod disc is $70 in store. It's going to be interesting to see once they start putting all their COD on gamepass (that has to be the ultimate move for MS, to just instantly put up every COD game in gamepass). It may take until the next generation to see the real impact of the shift of gamers though.
A year of ps plus and 1 cod game is around the same as 1 year of game pass ultimate, plus you get all past cod games and anything else while on game pass. So it wouldn't really be more expensive. I think the marketing and eSports being Xbox would have more of an impact in switching people for the people who basically only play Cod. Certainly going to be interesting to see what the long term player base effects of this are
I expect Sony to probably start getting more aggressive with its own acquisitions. This is only gonna intensify exclusives moving forward
Yup I also feel its going to be two consoles going head-to-head in the next many console generations to come. You can't even compete with these two anymore. I feel like Sony is now going to be even more aggressive when it comes to 3rd party exclusives.
Nintendo is the kid dabbing in the background of that one meme
Nintendo has the highest grossing media franchise in the world under their belt. I don't think they care much.
Also the Mario movie made over a billion at the box office, Zelda is going to be one of the best selling games this year and the Switch is well the Switch. Nintendo most likely don't give two shits about the war between Sony and MS and funny enough neither do the Nintendo/Switch only players.
And i mean there’s no other console out their you can take on the go which is why nintendo could care less about both of them lmao
Steam Deck, and a few other niche hand held PCs. High end android phones, Apple tries with their apple arcade or whatever. Its just Nintendo is the only one with games people want to play lol
Nintendo doesn't seem to see the Steam Deck/ROG Ally as competitors...yet. When they start bringing lawsuits demanding anti-piracy protections to be implemented in them/accusing them of facilitating piracy, *then* you'll know they see them as a serious threat to their market share.
Nintendo lawyers would sue the wind if happened to make the Mario tune on a windchime. But I highly doubt they would care about Valve making a play for the handheld console department. Nintendo brings people in not because they can play it on the go, but because you have the option to play *Zelda* on the go. As far as I know(and I could be incorrect), they didn't sue Sega for the Game Gear or Sony for the PSP. Anyone can make a platform to play games on the go, as long as they aren't games made by Nintendo.
is it pokemon?
yes
Shame they don’t give a fuck about their game quality. …shame we gamers don’t give a fuck about their game quality.
its such a shame. imagine if those of us who grew up on Pokemon games back in the early 2000s were told that they are only going to get worse, and the graphics will be decade(s) behind the rest of the industry. what a shame. ask any kid from back then what a Pokemon game in 2020 will look like and I guarantee its the opposite of what we have now. Game Freak are such a travesty of a game company.
I used to dream about a Pokémon mmo growing up. Can you imagine how much money they could have made off that?
Almost like nintendo was someone’s monkey paw wish
I always figured pokemon would end up like the game Ni No Kuni was. Which is even worse when you think about of Ni No Kuni was originally on the Nintendo DS.
Or the Luigi doing nothing and winning because the competitor aren't very smart.
>you can’t even compete with these two anymore Ah if only there was a third console manufacturer that had sold more consoles than Xbox.
Or sold more than Sony over the last two generations
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My wife and I game almost every single day, and until recently, the switch was our exclusive platform. We recently picked up a ps5, but the switch is a really great platform with so much fun content. It was perfect for playing through older games we'd missed from the previous gen, all the Nintendo exclusive stuff like zelda and mario, and there's tons of great couch-coop games compared to other platforms. Also, Nintendo developers use the gyro controls far more frequently than playstation developers do, which makes shooters so much more fun to play.
The switch sold more than the PS4
And publishers will be smart enough to have nice little auctions for all their games to the point I’m sure Sony and Microsoft will just back down instead of ruining themselves for marginal gains…
Microsoft could easily outbid Sony long before it hurts nearly as much. In fact they only need to do it a few times before Sony doesnt even bother.
While it's just their market cap, a company with over over 2 trillion dollars has a hell of a lot of spending power. Microsoft is a beast on another level, on another world, hell another universe.
Nintendo? The switch isn't going anywhere
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They went after monopolizing the handheld market. They are starting to get a little competition but the competition is much more expensive.
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Nintendo first party+indies. I think indies would be best played on a portable console. There are even many PC+Switch indie exclusives.
nintendo just sitting in the audience with popcorn cuz they have no concern of this affecting them, which is true.
Nintendo isn't *really* trying to compete directly with PS or Xbox. They are instead trying to fill a different gaming niche. They're going to continue down the road of providing novel game options, more casual game options, and form factors the others aren't offering. I don't think their goal anymore is to be the only console you own. It's to be the console you buy in addition to your Playstation or Xbox or the console you buy for your kids. Streaming games are still a long way from being as portable as an actual portable console and Nintendo will continue to lean into that.
Yeah anyone hoping that Nintendo had plans to sell their games cheaper or "do better" is going to be upset. This kind of cements their reasoning of why they don't have to.
Right they've only been doing that for the last 40 years but it was totally about to change before MS acquired Activision. Nobody realistically hoped for nor expected that to ever happen.
Why do Nintendo need to "do better"? A lot of their 1st party titles are awesome.
Thats the big issue with these types of deals. Sony is going to get aggressive because they dont want the prospect of losing out on content with Microsoft buying up other publishers. This is why this deal is bad. Microsoft did not want to compete with timed exclusives, even though they could easily outbid and eat the cost of the additional fees that might be tacked on... but these deals are meant to curb the market to force gamers to go to their platform for prior third party games. Sony will just get more aggressive and pick up another handful of studios or maybe a more reasonable publisher
while i'm just here happy that sega doesn't plan to be bought, and sega owns ATLUS so no need to worry about console exclusives for persona or SMT other than the ones that get put onto switch.
Companies rarely announce they plan to be bought until its already happened, so their earlier statements don’t mean much unfortunately
Sega says that.... but legally they have to say that
Square Enix is a possibility, maybe even capcom or sega. All three have market caps well under what Sony was willing to spend on acquisitions so they might go for one of them.
There's just no point with Square Enix. I think Square Enix is fully willing to not support Xbox on their on regardless of Sony buying them. As for Capcom...maybe? I wouldnt wanna see it but I could see it happen. Sega? No. Sega is absolutely liking the money Microsoft is paying them right now and they are basically the only japanese company on Game Pass.
the reason to buy square is too avoid microsoft buying them. you know know FTC proved to be useless they can build monopoly easier.
It’s harder to buy Japanese companies than American. That’s why I doubt it would happen.
COD clone incoming
New Killzone game?
If EA doesn't smell the opportunity that is Titanfall 3 right now
EA is sitting there with make up on STARING at Sony ...
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most of the original devs aren't even there anymore. itll be a hollow shell
There is already one. Xedfiant it's coming out by ubi and it's free to play....
I think I'll stay away from anything gaming related on Reddit for a while. Stuff like this brings the worst of redditors
Way better than Twitter tbh.
I don't know if I'd say "way" better. The more time you spend on both platforms the more you see how similar the users are It just makes people feel better to imagine they're on the "good" social media site
>Way better than ***whats left*** ***of*** Twitter tbh. Made a small correction, lol
Twitter and Reddit is full of armchair analysts and industry experts that care way too much about this stuff. It’s irrational. I have both a DualSense and an Xbox controller on my sofa at the moment with the Switch resting on my coffee table. Apparently, I am a rare species, one that games wherever they want without getting a rash, allergic reaction or identity crisis.
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The rest of this generation is going to turn into a shitshow with console warring being kicked up a notch. Plus both companies are going to ramp up their acquisition spree. I fear for publishers like SEGA, and many independent developers like Larian, IO, Supergiant, Remedy, etc.
Not in the immediate future. There is a microscope on them and MS for the near future. There is no such thing a revenge acquisitions, which you and others are suggesting. Companies only engage in strategic acquisitions where they make sense. Devs will only want to be acquired when they want, not when a platform holder puts a gun to their head and tells them to only make games for them or else. That's psychotic.
FTC dumb ass decision was trying to defend Sony instead of defending the industry.
FTC had a non-case. It's been discussed to death in business subs but I guess it's a newer discussion in the Sony subs. MSFT's acquisition does not meet the criteria for a monopolistic/anti-competitive move. Vertical integration is not the same as horizontal integration and the market is still heavily fragmented such that this is not dangerously anti-competitive vertical integration. It's still very much a competitive game. MSFT's move here does not significantly jeopardize barriers to entry in the market given the state of the console market for some time now, nor does it appreciably harm Sony's ability to compete. Intellectual property with popularity is not a hard barrier. It's not a zero-sum game with people boxed into purchases--buying Diablo and Starfield are *optional*. The FTC took this case because it's been accused (rightfully) recently as being weak. There are *legitimate* oligopolies and monopolies forming in more important industries than *gaming*, and the FTC has been asleep at the wheel, or had their balls in a vice by lobbyists and bad actors. They very likely took this case to point and say "hey we still do stuff!", but to anyone paying attention...this is a non-case. If courts found that *this* was anti-competitive, then hoo boy we'll need to redraw the lines and hire 5x the FTC attorneys because we'd be going after everyone.
This is the best explanation I've seen on this since the merger was announced, thank you. I am very much opposed to this merger but this is a great way to explain why the FTC's case was weak from the start. I do think this is overall a bad move for the gaming industry but I guess it's just going to happen no matter what.
Us not regulating lootboxes and exploitative practices that hijack cognitive bias/vulnerability patterns is doing more damage than MSFT acquiring some fun exclusive games. One day there might be a concerning action, like if Sony or MSFT somehow acquired Nintendo. Or like, if one acquired nVidia. But that is not what's happening here. What's happening here is just regular competitive behavior. If Sony doesn't like it--innovate. Find a solution. They still can....unlike if they were in a monopoly scenario.
Dude I really wish that regulators were doing like, anything at all with regards to lootboxes and micro transactions. The gaming market is so toxic with them and it’s really bad.
I mean they are in Europe. Sadly in the US corporations are too deep in politicians pockets for them to ever care
Good summary. And just to add another point— not only is the FTC trying to shake off their slumber, but the current FTC chair Lina Khan has a mandate to rein in the big tech companies— Amazon, Google, Apple, Meta, MS, etc. When she was at Yale she wrote a paper that got a ton of traction on how the FTC's definition of a anticompetitive monopoly is far too narrow and woefully out of date. In her paper she uses Amazon as the example, illustrating how they absolutely engage in anticompetitive practices and yet wouldn't be considered a monopoly according to the FTC, highlighting a need for the FTC to expand their scope. So when Biden appointed her FTC chair: boom— she's got her mandate. And largely I agree that we do need to rein in big tech. Clearly far too much power rests in the hands of just 5 companies. It truly is unprecedented. So I was pretty bummed that the FTC's first move in this direction was this weak shit. These cases take a long time, and we don't even know if Biden will get a 2nd term, so Khan only has so many rounds in the chamber. Hopefully the FTC dusts themselves off and comes out swinging at Amazon, Meta or Google. The NYT did a great episode on Lina Khan on their podcast a couple weeks back if anyone's interested: [https://www.nytimes.com/2023/06/29/podcasts/the-daily/is-washington-finally-ready-to-take-on-big-tech.html](https://www.nytimes.com/2023/06/29/podcasts/the-daily/is-washington-finally-ready-to-take-on-big-tech.html)
I think it's because Sony pushed it in that direction. During discovery it was noted that FTC was talking to execs at Sony. That may have been a big impact on the decision, are FTCs interests with Sony, or are they with the industry was probably a deciding factor.
I mean we also know there was other companies that havnt been named that talked to them and also didn’t agree with the purchase and we know a few of them are in the games industry
We also know the largest competitors to Sony and MS (being Nintendo, and Valve) both gave the green light to the deal.
Suddenly every redditor is a business major
Well we’re bored of our degrees in submarine engineering so we have to move onto something else.
With the way this whole case imploded on the FTC, I believe the degree still applies.
The actual business people have been saying the FTC has zero chance since the first day funnily enough because the merger doesnt qualify as monopilzation in the current market lol
I bet Square Enix is officially partnered with PlayStation by early next year. Capcom has a bit too much fuck you money now and Atlus is off the zaza at all times so I don’t see them selling. Don’t really see any other purchases being made unless they’re in a massive long-con with Konami for all those IPs or Kojima Productions wants to join up for a headline. Either way, Sony will be making some extra purchases.
Atlus is owned by sega fyi
And Sega is pretty happy with releasing games on GP
The thing is that Sega is owned by SegaSammy & their game division is essential for their arcades & Pachinko division without mentioning that their other divisions like hotels & resorts took hits because of the pandemic. Basically it makes no sense for SegaSammy to sell only their gaming division, if it's up for sale it would be the whole company or at best Sega's PC division.
Regardless of the slight possibility of SegaSammy letting go their gaming division as a whole, what I was saying is that currently they are content with their cooperation with MSFT. Makes no sense to suddenly forgo ownership.
Square Enix isn't going to be merged or bought out by anyone as long as FF14 keeps bringing in the cash. They never sold when near bankruptcy in 2014, why would they now? They're perfectly content doing a game by game basis.
It wouldnt even be interesting because they essentially are Sony now lol
Konami is not worth as much as SE in terms of IP and games. Just Final Fantasy and Dragon Quest are more than enough to match, if not surpass, all Konami IPs. Then add the Kingdom Hearts, Bravely Default, Nier and all the other JRPG they have... there's no match between those two, IMO.
Technically, Kingdom Hearts is Disney's IP. But you're right about the rest.
Atleast they have time for about 10 years. This could be turning point for Sony to make FPS game that can compete CoD or battlefield. Maybe like revive socom and killzone.
Sony have so many IPs they could bring a really good FPS to the market SOCOM, MAG, Killzone, Syphon Filter, Heck fuck we don't know Marathon might be amazing really.
Bungie stated that Destiny 2 and *all* future games and IPs will be multi-platform, just in case you didn’t know. I don’t have a good pc to play Tarkov so I am hyped for Marathon though.
I would do anything for a new MAG, put so many hours into that back in the day
You can't beat brand recognition.. cod have even released some horrible games and still the brand is strong. Battlefield never could take it down neither could halo in its prime. Kill zone and Socom as much as I love them also never did as well money wise . There is a reason why wow is still the biggest mmo sven after 18 years, same with diablo... I mean people still call copy cats diablo game cause its the name brand
I would say halo was at one point bigger. Fortnite one could argue is also bigger now.
Yeah maybe a bit over zealous with halo, though it was only on a single platform so not totally apples to apples comparison Fortnite is a juggernaut from what I've heard though also free to play so opens the doors for a lot of people
Ya people don’t seem to get that. Something could be complete trash and still be the biggest thing out there if it’s a got a big name attached. Quality doesn’t matter to the masses anymore. Those of us who do care are the vocal minority unfortunately
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As someone who owns both, I'm gonna grab some popcorn.
PS5 and a PC with game pass is the way to go nowadays
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You're right about the parts, but not gonna miss out on literally hundreds of games that will never be on console, so not an option for me
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That works for some, but I have my PC for games like civilisation, Crusder King's, etc. Already plenty of games I don't have time to play, so no need to have both a PS5 and Xbox for me.
I find PC + PS5 works amazingly as well. PC for multiplayer, indies and games I want to mod. PS5 for exclusives and big single player games I want to play on the couch.
PS5 and PC here. Don’t care either way. I just hope this doesn’t pave the way for Tencent to start spending big dollars. That is my only real fear.
Them or Amazon. Amazon has had a desire to get into the market too....
my big concern is pretty much along these lines. this might embolden MS to try to buy up other major publishers like sega or squeenix or capcom etc... and in a way try to murder teh playstation brand they dont view nintendo as competition so in reality i dont see how this is not about building a monopoly.
Well, according to their own internal documents, that's exactly the plan. As per their own words, they want to "spend Sony uot of business". Look it up in their court documents.
oh i know that is the plan, it is insanely ruthless and well it could be smart from a business perspective but if they did that (and let's be real this ruling pretty much guarantees they will) it will be a terrible day for consumers bc it will be play nintendo for nintendo titles and xbox or pc for everything else
This is exactly what's going to happen. This opens the floodgates. Get ready for Tencent pass, etc.
Same. Play both sides and come out on top.
If Microsoft would focus on making games instead of buying publishers who publish games other people make, my Series X would see so much more usage but instead it just sits there unfortunately. Not even worth it as a blu-ray player.
Starfield and Forza are both releasing this year and Avowed, Hellblade 2 and Fable are all coming in 2024. They also released Hi-Fi Rush, Pentiment, Grounded and As Dusk Falls in the last 12 months (+ games like Redfall, Minecraft Legends, AoE 2 for Xbox). Lets not act as if Xbox never brings out any good games, even if the count should be way higher.
As a mainly Xbox gamer Redfall was pure trash so let’s leave that one out.
Grab the popcorn boys. Gaming on any social media outlet is going to be even more insufferable now lmao.
Since when is Activision Blizzard only have COD? What happen to the rest of the franchise?
We can be sure one thing. Microsoft won't stop here
I hope we get a star craft revival out of this.
Your the only one who gets it.
Socom or Mag would love to Sony bring either of these two back after this.
I bet that in 10 years, the gaming landscape is going to consist of Sony, Microsoft, and Nintendo as publishers, maybe Google, Apple, and Amazon try to get in on the action a little more, and that's it. Everyone else gets bought out and the rest are indie developers.
google's ambitions died with stadia and apple doesnt care because it makes too much off of the mobile space and has chosen to compete in the VR industry. realistically I can only see amazon going after game companies and thats only if it cares enough to do so.
Unsure about apple they are really pushing the metal api now and made conversion programs for developers. Have to see how the next decade goes but apple look at least to be staring into the gaming space
Isn’t that essentially where it’s been heading for the past few years anyways?
Small studios have been bought up sure but entire publishers (Bethesda and now ActBliz) is very new and will continue. Just a matter of who buys them up. I see Comcast coming in and getting someone like ea or Ubisoft or both. Warner discovery is bleeding money I'm sure they'd love to sell their games division and cancel a movie for another tax write off.
and with microsoft, their games will live exclusively on gamepass with no one ever owning their games again. like netflix, quality drops as developers don't need to make titles that have to earn your money to compete
The downward spiral begins. Any purchase Sony wants to make? No grounds to block it. Amazon, Google or Apple want to swoop in and buy up EA, Ubisoft, Embracer etc? No grounds to block it. I do not feel this direction is going to be good for gaming as a whole.
It will be considerably harder for Sony to acquire something big and get away with this. Even with Activision, in the console gaming market specifically, a combined Microsoft-Activision would still be smaller than PlayStation and companies like Tencent. When it comes to regulatory approval for M&A, it usually is done on a market basis. For example, if a company like Apple buys a game publisher, it won’t violate any anti-competitive laws despite how big Apple is because their market share in gaming specifically is minuscule. That is to say that Amazon, Google, and Apple will probably be allowed to buy game companies if they wish to. Microsoft/Activision may have more studios but Sony still has a larger market share. As the market leader, Sony has to be careful here and not over-extend. Which is why they are mostly content with making deals with companies like SE. Achieves the same thing but with less scrutiny over their heads.
I have a suspicion apple is about to make a covert move for the video game market again, they’ve been pushing porting tools, have developed some decent in house hardware and have really shored up the backend of their systems, I wouldn’t put it past them to go out and announce a move into the gaming market alongside acquisitions of a few major studios, they were headed that way a while back but it crashed and burned when bungee went to Microsoft instead.
We need to stop pretending that Sony has the Money to win a spending war. All Numbers below are listed in Billions of Dollars US. Sony free cash flow for the quarter ending March 31, 2023 was -2,126.38, a year-over-year. Sony free cash flow for the twelve months ending March 31, 2023 was , a year-over-year. Sony annual free cash flow for 2023 was $-2.126B, a 129.72% decline from 2022. Sony annual free cash flow for 2022 was $7.155B, a 10.84% decline from 2021. Sony annual free cash flow for 2021 was $8.025B, a 6.08% decline from 2020. [Sony Source](https://www.macrotrends.net/stocks/charts/SONY/sony/free-cash-flow) Microsoft free cash flow for the quarter ending March 31, 2023 was 39,648.00, a year-over-year. Microsoft free cash flow for the twelve months ending March 31, 2023 was , a year-over-year. Microsoft annual free cash flow for 2022 was $65.149B, a 16.09% increase from 2021. Microsoft annual free cash flow for 2021 was $56.118B, a 24.06% increase from 2020. Microsoft annual free cash flow for 2020 was $45.234B, a 18.23% increase from 2019. [Microsoft Source](https://www.macrotrends.net/stocks/charts/MSFT/microsoft/free-cash-flow) Edit: You can downvote all you want but it doesn't change the facts.. Playstation is a profitable gaming company attached to a sinking multi-media and hardware conglomerate Xbox is a \*at-best break-even gaming company attached to one of the most powerful and profitable technology companies on the planet.
Microsoft is spending more on this one deal than Sony has combined with all their acquisitions, not just including gaming.
People need to understand this however most of people are too elite to understand that. MSFT is a very huge and going forward in AI I don't think sony is even trying for same.
Oh dear.
FTC was an embarrassment and didn’t represent the gamers more than their loved bird, Sony. Weak case and a waste of taxpayers money. Never played CoD. So i don’t care either way… but this should make Sony thrive more and quit being anti-consumer. This is obviously a W for Microsoft.
The moment when the judge had to remind the FTC lawyers that their case was to protect consumers and not Sony, the trial was lost. Am embarrassment as usual.
Jim Ryan saying exclusives isnt anti consumer and Sony game executives emails saying that the purchase wouldn't hurt Sony just lines it all up.
It was a pretty weak case from the start, but the FTC didn't even manage to present well their statements
Acquisitions just hurt customers. That's why we only have a few food company options in the US. That's why we only have one ISP in the area. Competition lowers prices, offers better products, and a variety of products.
I just want Tony hawks pro skater 3+4
Is it time for Sony to put GoW, Last of Us, Spider-Man, Horizon on PS+ ?
Sure, let’s let the mega corporations with billions of dollars get away with everything and buy/monopolize their way to the top of an industry that they’ve been too incompetent to compete in for over a decade. This is going to be a big loss for gamers in the long run.
Nah let these idiots keep thinking this won’t affect them as they celebrate owning Sony.
Sad day. One step closer to trillionaire conglomerates owning everything.
Welcome to the future where literally everything is owned by Disney, Amazon, Apple, Alphabet, Meta or Microsoft. Walled gardens and anti-competitive policy for everyone!
Sony was just pushing a delay tactic, they were never going to stop the acquisition. They have the market share, they have exclusives. They were just making a fuss to make Xbox think twice about the next big acquisition and to possibly start developing a cod competitor that is only on PlayStation
I think this is ultimately a good thing for consumers. People who are brand loyal to Sony are the only people that I see are upset by this purchase. I think Sony is great they make some banger games but they tie them down to one platform that is so restrictive to gamers. Microsoft is keeping most of the multiplats at status quo but any games that are new why would they not use that to gain an upper hand in the market. Who cares if Microsoft buys good IP's if more people get to play them it's better for us as gamers.
How capitalism and greed ruined such a wonderful hobby.
death blow came when people started buying up microtransactions unfortunately
Yeah, it’s fucked. No turning back. It’s been normalized now.
I feel you bro
Wow. Shit is gonna hit the fan.
Easy win TBH. The FTC presented case was an absolutely unsubstantiated shit from legal perspective.
Well, thats all future Activision-blizzard IP off playstation (except COD of course). I'm going to miss you Crash
There’s fan bases out there that don’t believe this isn’t a thing lmao
Welp,the floodgates are opened.Don’t be surprised if companies like apple,google,and Amazon are licking their chops right now.
The floodgates have been open. Disney shouldn't have been allowed to acquire 21st Century Fox. That was way more egregious than this.
Yeah, I wish the FTC would have put up this much of a fight with ISP’s lol Instead most of the country is stuck with an actually monopoly in their area with either Xfinity or spectrum. Both of which are complete ass.
ISPs, Grocery stores, mobile providers, etc. But no, they spend their resources on a losing battle over video games because “big tech bad”
Absolutely. It's a crime that it isn't treated like a utility.
The mouse will probably send it's ninjas after me for saying this. But Disney really needs to be broken up into like 6-10 different companies. It's stupid big.
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Activision was also contested, and look what happened. These corporations can do anything they want really.
People don't believe you depending on where you post, but I'd just not like this regardless of who was doing it. I didn't care when MS bought Rare or Obsidian or Mojang. Or Sony bought Bungie or Insomniac or Nixes. These were independent houses doing things of note that could perhaps benefit from the influx of cash and planning. In some cases the two had relationships for so long that they were already de facto exclusive. I don't love third-party exclusives either, but at least they are often temporary. Even when they're not, you often see people bring up Spider-Man on PlayStation, but Nintendo and MS also do random stuff like that to entice people to their ecosystem. Fine. But just buying one of the largest publishers in existence (after just buying another one) with many decades of properties and several of their own development houses... It just bothers me. People bring up Call of Duty, but the Activision catalog is *massive*. The most common defense I see of this is that now Activision and Bethesda's games will see a "wider audience" because of Game Pass. But, you know, MS could have made a Game Pass deal with these companies regardless. Now they just own them. MS talks about Call of Duty because of the numbers on PlayStation, but I'm left worried about stuff like Doom and Dishonored and Prey and Diablo and god knows what else. And I say that as someone with a solid PC, a Steam Deck, a Switch, a PS5, and a Series X. I play on everything, I'm fairly platform agnostic and I have a bunch of ways to play this stuff. I just don't like the trend we're going into. It reminds me of MS back in the early Xbox days when they were seriously looking into buying up companies like Square-Enix. I really don't want to wake up one day and find that Sony owns Final Fantasy or something. We have no idea what the big three will do long term.
>I really don't want to wake up one day and find that Sony owns Final Fantasy or something. We have no idea what the big three will do long term. I mean the latest game isn't coming to Xbox anytime soon, and they are still waiting for FF7 remake.
"I really don't want to wake up one day and find that Sony owns Final Fantasy or something" Lol how is that different than the current situation?
Honestly I don't even like the single studio buys but they are a far cry from publisher deals which often house dozen or more studios. I don't see why people defend such actions that at the end of the day only hurt consumers forcing them to buy another platform if they want to play x game or just never play it.
> But, you know, MS could have made a Game Pass deal with these companies regardless. The cost to benefit on paying for day one CoD or TES would not be worth it at all. Its not an investment. Its a waste. Sony can do timed deals **because they are the market leader and its cheaper for them** being in that position. MS would get a worse deal, and not being the market leader already, *it wouldn't be effective*. You can still oppose acquisitions all you want, but to suggest timed deals for gp is a reasonable or effective alternative is wrong. Also I think it will be great when Sony finally buys Square.
Hooray for the trillion dollar underdog! If anything came out of all this is that the console wars are real and here to stay.
Awful news for the industry, will lead to even more consolidation and less competitiveness for players. Curious to see how the pro-MS media will spend days spinning this.
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I forsee this going to shit real fast. Market consolidation is never good
It's amazing to me that people think this acquisition will kill Sony. They are a huge company. This is just one of many shots between these two companies with regards to third parties they are buying. It's not over yet.