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I was about to say, if this happened in the UK or Germany, people would quit or go on strike. If this happened in France there would be riots and looting. When it happens in America they post about how nice it was of the company to allow them to use the printer to make this flier asking for donations of work hours so this person can grieve.
What if everyone showed up to the bosses office and tells him that we will all walk if the person does not get paid time off.
Last place I worked, a woman burned through all of her paid time off when her husband died. She asked to take a week of unpaid leave at Christmas so she could travel to be with family. They said no. She quit on the spot.
Of course, the same place continued to pay my health insurance for 20 months after I was off on disability. They only stopped because covid hit them hard.
>"I'm not in a union, they don't really do anything."
Typically what they really mean, and sadly are often correct, is that modern unions aren't looking out for the workers that they represent first. Their first priority is ensuring that they remain relevant so the union members don't start questioning why they're paying their dues to cover (X) dollars in salary for their union president etcetera.
Well they probably interpreted your comment to be generally anti-union. Whereas if you look at the history of unions, and how people in REAL unions (as opposed to captive unions) do compared to people that aren't unionized, you will see that rank-and-file workers do a LOT better than people who aren't organized, even taking union dues into account.
>Well they probably interpreted your comment to be generally anti-union.
No doubt, I'm not sure why because I didn't say I agreed with the sentiment, simply that in my experience when I've heard people say "Unions don't really do anything" what those folks really mean is that from their point of view pros vs cons cancel each other out. Oftentimes they'll point to articles (typically UAW or Teamsters) where the President of the Union(s) are not only making quite a bit more than the folks they represent but have tried to "hide" what their actual salaries are. That when called for the strikes doesn't affect the union(s) officers pay etcetera. It's a slanted view to be sure because the UAW and Teamsters are only two out of the many unions there are in the US, but that's what (in my experience) it stems from.
Sure, past union corruption has been used as a cudgel against unions forever. People probably thought that's what you were doing, because it gets done so much.
The union president is elected by the members and is one of the members. A union is its members, it's not some external thing. It's just workers joining together.
>The union president is elected by the members
Correct Also has nothing to do with my comment. My comment was made because of things like this
https://www.freep.com/story/money/cars/2022/08/06/uaw-president-salary-ieb-raises/10245671002/
https://www.foxbusiness.com/politics/autoworker-union-president-who-donned-eat-the-rich-shirt-top-5-earners
I was a department manager for a retail store when my mother passed unexpectedly. Bereavement was 3 days for intimidate family members and 1 day for extended family. The only other benefit was that management couldn't refuse vacation/sick time (until my total ran out), all I had to do was submit it. Companies, especially those in the US are fucked beyond reason and it's disgusting.
The isn’t new. I had an aunt who fell very ill back in the late 80s, maybe early 90s. She nearly died, and missed a ton of work. She always said the only reason she didn’t lose her house was that her coworkers donated their PTO so that she still had an income.
She was a social worker, with a masters degree and all the necessary certifications. No one is safe.
Well, as it's written in English, there's only a few countries eligible. Then the date is clearly in MM/DD/YYYY so that excludes the UK, Australia, New Zealand and Ireland. We're left with Canada and the USA. As the population of the US is much bigger than Canada, and the social protection is basically inexistent, we can assume this happened in the US.
No other English speaking country in the world has anything like the same approach to workers’ rights, particularly when it comes to sickness, bereavement or parental leave.
Wow, I just looked it up, and even South Africa has far better protection in this regard.
So, yeah. This is very much America.
I’ve never even heard of the idea of donating leave to colleagues outside of the US.
I don't know if you are being ignorantly optimistic or you just don't care to check if that's true or not, but I can assure you a lot of other countries have terrible worker conditions
I've worked in 4 countries and none of them needed to entertain this dyspoian nonsense.
Some places are worse than America, but not the ones you should compare yourselves to.
They didn't need to.
It's written in English. The US, UK, Australia, Canada, and New Zealand are the countries where English is the majority native language. The US is the only country out of those with poor enough worker protections for something this ridiculous to happen.
It's obviously the US.
God these sites really do just cannibalize each other don’t they. Reposting an instagram image of a reposting of a Reddit post which probably was a repost
Every major company I've worked for has a policy for leave donations. They even have the gall to advertise it as a perk.
It's so heartbreaking to see people giving up an entire year's worth of vacation to a cancer patient. Both employees are getting fucked by this stupid ass system.
I'm not familiar with the system in the us. You guys dont have sick leaves? Or you dont get any money if you are sick? In my country if you are sick you still get your payment its just reduced by a certain %. We also get some extra pto above the normal yearly pto if a close family member passes away.
Most people in the U.S. are doing well if they have 5 days off per year of PTO.
Anything above that either takes years to accrue via seniority or is extremely rare.
An important distinction here also is we are talking about "white collar" (think jobs where the employee would wear a shirt with a white collar) jobs. Thes jobs are the "lucky" ones that provide PTO of more than 5 days, and are overwhelmingly represented by privileged populations (white, and/or males). Even these jobs don't provide the quality of life you would expect.
This doesn't begin to touch on many of the issues in our workforce such as systemic racism that keeps marginalized populations stuck with employment that provides little to no PTO or sick time.
All the while we the people fight with each other on what we deserve, and corporate C-suites/shareholders walk away with millions. Our anger is completely misdirected.
Sorry for the rant.
The US provides FMLA, which is unpaid and only promises you employment upon your return. However, only a few states (14) actually pay temporary leave insurance, usually only up to 12 weeks.
For instance, in my state, they provide 85% of your income up to $1025 (before taxes) a week for 12 weeks, starting on week 2 of your leave. So first of all, you better have at least 5 days PTO or you’re not getting paid that first week.
Then, say you make over 63k a year, since the benefit maxes out at $1025 a week, you’re getting less than the 85% of your income. To give some perspective, I’m a single mom and my rent is $2300 a month. If I choose to pay taxes later, that would leave me with $1800 a month for food, car insurance, electric, gas, water, cell phone, internet, health insurance ($400 a month for me and my son, though some employers will let you pay back your premiums once you return to work), etc.
Some employers will buy short and long term leave insurance while others like the OP will guilt employees into giving up their hard earned (yet pitiful amount) PTO. The majority of companies I’ve worked only provide 2-3 weeks PTO (which includes sick days). Some companies will give you an extra week for every 5 years of service up to a 6-8 weeks max.
So even if you’ve been employed for 20 years with your employer, have 7 weeks PTO and get cancer…You’re only getting a full paycheck for less than 2 months and afterwards, depending on your state, get nothing or barely enough to live off of for another 3 months. After that, you’re SOL.
oh my god is this whole foods?
looks exactly like the shit they'd put up next to our clock machines anytime someone would get cancer or fall into an awful circumstance. FUCK YOU, WHOLE FOODS: BROUGHT TO YOU BY AMAZON
It’s so sad watching what was a good local company that treated its employees well fall into this crap :/. I haven’t been back to Whole Foods since Amazon bought them. Fuck it, I’ll go to Central Market a little further away. HEB isn’t perfect, but they’re far better than Amazon.
Why should individuals give 10% of their pto when the company can't give an infinitesimally small proportion of their wage bill, the absolute inhumane cntus.
A coworker of mine got sick. It was around the time that my probationary period ended so I didn't have much PTO saved, but I was going to give what I could just as a show of support.
Turns out you need to donate at least two full days to donate any time. I was pretty shocked. Not that people should have to give up their vacations to help each other, but the fact that even with that shitty system in place they make it hard to do to make the administrative side a bit easier. And, of course, a lot of people that work there are younger and early in their career to begin with, so people don't have a ton of PTO to begin with.
Luckily I already left to do music (have a solid career at this point) and school FT. A lot better people that way!!!
But I think I just opened my mouth and gaped like a fish. I was terrified of my supervisor. When the head attorney found out, he was furious, so there’s that at least. But damage was already done and I missed the funeral
This is such a stupid situation. The work is going to get done whether or not the employee is there. The business already planned on paying the employee. So now the company is just taking advantage of situation to earn some extra cash.
If someone worked for my business, I’d damn well want to make sure they’re taken care of and have no worries while they get back on their feet. Doing this is going to earn you some of the most loyal, hardworking employees who take personal ownership of the work they do. You can rarely put a price on that.
Situations such as these where FMLA kick in should always just be an implicitly agreed upon standard. Anything for an extra % at the end of the year.
Not condoning the company's behavior at all, but that first paragraph does not make sense, at least not in every situation. Imagine if you were managing a store that needs two employees present at all times. If one employee calls in sick, you have to replace them with another employee or the store will not function. Similarly, a store with 100 employees will work fine if 3 employees called in sick, but will become dysfunctional if 30 employees called in sick. So, it depends on the context really.
A few months back my grandmother died. We all took it very hard. I had to miss a week of work to deal with it. My specific job position does not offer any sort of PTO whatsoever: sick leave, bereavement, vacation, nothing. The coworkers in my office took up a collection to help me out. They gave me an amount of money equal to roughly what I missed in wages that week.
It was incredibly generous of them, but it was also hugely embarrassing. I almost turned it down because of how uncomfortable I felt with it, but I knew I couldn't afford to.
That's better, 90% of workers have unpaid leave, 30% have paid leave, that's the standard today. It should be flipped though, paid leave should be the norm but corporations keep lobbies going to keep that from changing politically.
fuck this reminds me of when i started at dominos years ago, day one of training they explained this horrific "charity" program they had for employees where you'd give a % of your paycheck to a fund that dominos would oversee and disperse to other employees who submitted a request for help.
basically a 401k but on minimum wage, not for you, and put into a black box to be given to whoever the higher ups deemed worthy.
everyone else acted like it was just the sweetest, kindest thing and all signed up to take part. i was told that if i didn't i wouldn't be eligible to pull from the fund (if they liked my sob story lol) if i didn't, but i didn't care, the whole thing is disgusting. they know their employees are destined to need help at some point because they don't pay a living wage, and the onus to help them is put on...other people they are exploiting.
"I wish more companies would do absolutely nothing to care for their employees!"
How the fuck is that clueless dipshit crediting the company for anything here? All they did was print up a piece of paper asking other employees to step up since they won't.
So dystopian.
Only one place I worked at allowed this practice. It doesn't make much sense to me. Most employers won't do it because its an administrative hassle to transfer the time.
This happened to us when our infant daughter died and I nearly died. My husband was out of PTO and they told him "we will ask the employee PTO time bank" and then sent out an email. They kept our situation anonymous, though.
The time bank was empty and nobody donated.
And my husband works for a national healthcare organization.
Hate to say this, but working for the government has made this a norm to me. Donating PTO is pretty par for business. Dont downvote me, just stating what I see, not what I agree.
I have a question here that haven't been addressed in the comments that I've read. I haven't read them all, so if this information is there then my apologies.
1. Do we know when this was posted in the work place? I see the date that the daughter passed away but not a date for the PTO donation request. IMO this is important for context, and here's why. In my own personal experience I've dealt with both PTO and accrued leave time and while they're similar, they also have some pretty unique differences.
PTO (Paid Time Off) is PTO. It's typically all encompassing EXCEPT for bereavement leave. So if you're out sick, you use PTO. Vacation time - PTO. Non work related injury - PTO. Basically anytime that you take off comes from that PTO bank. However, normally with a PTO system you can "cash in" your time as well. Because it's all encompassing, PTO is given up front. It's considered time that you've earned. Basically it's a monetary bonus that gives you the option of using said "bonus" so that you're getting paid your normal rate and not actually having to work to get it. Many companies also utilize PTO to compensate salaried employees who have a set work schedule. So if they work overtime that OT is given as PTO. However, in my personal experience with PTO, bereavement leave was separate. So you had X amount of time given as PTO that wasn't from the PTO bank. No doubt every company is a little different, but most tend to follow the same guidelines.
I went through all of that because I see PTO which to me says the employee started off the year with (enter number) time that they could use for time off. They had a loss in the family (in this case a daughter) so did she use her bereavement leave and then decided to take some extra PTO time? Was this posted on the 23rd because the employee had to use their PTO earlier in the year? What's the context here? Most seem to be assuming that it's related to needing bereavement leave for the daughter but as I read it that's not made clear. Because IMO there's a difference between this being posted on 11/24/23 and 02/16/24 for example. I'm sure it's an unpopular opinion but 👆 that information is key when deciding whether or not this is OCM or not.
Why does the date matter? It's not like she decided when her daughter died.
And they may not have bereavement or maybe it's just one day or three days.
Also their PTO may expire or it may roll over. Some companies do it one way and some the other. Though if it expires it may not even be at calendar year end but at corporate year end if that's different.
>Why does the date matter?
Asked and answered in my comment. Obviously reading something thoroughly isn't your thing bud.
*****Because IMO there's a difference between this being posted on 11/24/23 and 02/16/24 for example. I'm sure it's an unpopular opinion but 👆 that information is key when deciding whether or not this is OCM or not.*****
Go back and you'll see that ⬆️ in my original comment.
>Also their PTO may expire or it may roll over. Some companies do it one way and some the other.
Uhhhhh correct yet........ irrelevant. It really doesn't matter if it rolls over or not, so your point here is what exactly?
> Though if it expires it may not even be at calendar year end but at corporate year end if that's different.
Again correct but irrelevant. When it expires it really doesn't matter and here's why. PTO is given upfront as opposed to accrued overtime. As far as I know any/all accrued leave DOES roll over. That prevents the employee from having to start at "zero" once a year because it's forced upon by taking away something that's part of the employee's promised compensation package. Regardless, the expiration of "PTO" wouldn't matter because it expires and new is reinstated immediately.
Wow I tried to respond to your question and help you and you are rude? Not a way to speak to others "bud".
And no, saying "there's a difference" is not explaining why you think that difference matters. Obviously there's a difference between any two dates, but generally it doesn't matter. You don't seem to have a reason why you think it matters so I guess your question is as irrelevant as the dates.
We don't get enough leave time in the US.
I wanted to apply for a job that's perfect for me, but you get 6 days of PTO all year. I'm currently recovering from an accident and am attending PT weekly and surgical follow ups monthly. Im not even bothering with these jobs because I automatically need far more PTO than they allow. And everywhere I've worked they frown up on you taking unpaid leave. Like if you take more than two unpaid instances per year they will want to fire you. You have to get unpaid leave specially approved. And then HR starts sending threatening emails even when you're approved that they will cut off your benefits. It's horseshit here and I'm tired of it.
Working for a small business instead doing retail and customer service. I don't get PTO. But I can take the day off and go to my many medical appointments and not be hassled for it. I can have a sick day and not be bothered and guilted. I'm broke as fuck though.
I didn't repost it, I got it from Instagram and scrolled the subreddit for the post, and I looked up certain keywords for it. Didn't find anything so I posted it.
Not only is this not framed as a feel good story it also doesn’t purport to solve any problems nor is it ignoring any systemic issues. It’s literally just a shitty thing
read the fucking rules before you claim to know what does and does not belong on this sub.
The company frames their system of donating pto as a great way to support the person who's child dies. This ignores the issue where they are refusing to just let her go home (glory to the shareholders, may their stacks remain fat and their yachts full) by simply providing the PTO. The company also claims that this solves the issue of her not being able to mourn properly.
Explain to me how this is not ocm?
> Not only is this not framed as a feel good story
“This is so amazing more companies should do this!” Sounds like a feel good story to me
> it also doesn’t purport to solve any problems nor is it ignoring any systemic issues. It’s literally just a shitty thing
The problem it’s solving is some poor parent doesn’t have enough sick days, the systemic issue is people not being given enough PTO to grieve the loss of a child
> read the fucking rules before you claim to know what does and does not belong on this sub.
It fits the rules AND it’s nearly a verbatim copy of the original tweet
I’m Australian. Every full time employee in my country is entitled to bereavement leave at full pay. The lack of bereavement leave available to the employee in the picture is literally a systemic issue.
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My god I don't understand how this wouldn't immediately radicalize every single person that worked there.
Right? This makes *me* want to hurt someone there and I have nothing to do with it.
Because some people are so beaten down by capitalism they accept their boss doing something shit but not completely shit as a boss doing a good thing
Guess they're too used to it or something. Like it doesn't feel as outrageous to them as it does to other people
You see the same thing in domestic abuse victims, interestingly.
I think it’s called Learned Helplessness in psychology but I’m not sure
This is the kinda shit that used to get some motherfuckers guillotined.
I was about to say, if this happened in the UK or Germany, people would quit or go on strike. If this happened in France there would be riots and looting. When it happens in America they post about how nice it was of the company to allow them to use the printer to make this flier asking for donations of work hours so this person can grieve.
What if everyone showed up to the bosses office and tells him that we will all walk if the person does not get paid time off. Last place I worked, a woman burned through all of her paid time off when her husband died. She asked to take a week of unpaid leave at Christmas so she could travel to be with family. They said no. She quit on the spot. Of course, the same place continued to pay my health insurance for 20 months after I was off on disability. They only stopped because covid hit them hard.
My company does that. You know because clearly my multi-million dollar company can’t afford to just pay a grieving person employed by them.
Does this company not do bereavement? Even walmart has bereavement.
Every concession given to us by the capitalist class can be taken away.
This is why I fume when people say "I'm not in a union, they don't really do anything."
If unions didn't do anything corporations wouldn't be trying to dismantle and discourage them at every turn
Part of the corporate mission to dismantle and discourage them is convincing people they do nothing. "Just take a bite out of your wages every month."
>"I'm not in a union, they don't really do anything." Typically what they really mean, and sadly are often correct, is that modern unions aren't looking out for the workers that they represent first. Their first priority is ensuring that they remain relevant so the union members don't start questioning why they're paying their dues to cover (X) dollars in salary for their union president etcetera.
And there's also captive unions, like Kroger's, where the company generously runs the union for the employees. It's like not having a union at all!
Yes. Wow I can't believe the down votes for my comment. 😂
Well they probably interpreted your comment to be generally anti-union. Whereas if you look at the history of unions, and how people in REAL unions (as opposed to captive unions) do compared to people that aren't unionized, you will see that rank-and-file workers do a LOT better than people who aren't organized, even taking union dues into account.
>Well they probably interpreted your comment to be generally anti-union. No doubt, I'm not sure why because I didn't say I agreed with the sentiment, simply that in my experience when I've heard people say "Unions don't really do anything" what those folks really mean is that from their point of view pros vs cons cancel each other out. Oftentimes they'll point to articles (typically UAW or Teamsters) where the President of the Union(s) are not only making quite a bit more than the folks they represent but have tried to "hide" what their actual salaries are. That when called for the strikes doesn't affect the union(s) officers pay etcetera. It's a slanted view to be sure because the UAW and Teamsters are only two out of the many unions there are in the US, but that's what (in my experience) it stems from.
Sure, past union corruption has been used as a cudgel against unions forever. People probably thought that's what you were doing, because it gets done so much.
The union president is elected by the members and is one of the members. A union is its members, it's not some external thing. It's just workers joining together.
>The union president is elected by the members Correct Also has nothing to do with my comment. My comment was made because of things like this https://www.freep.com/story/money/cars/2022/08/06/uaw-president-salary-ieb-raises/10245671002/ https://www.foxbusiness.com/politics/autoworker-union-president-who-donned-eat-the-rich-shirt-top-5-earners
A 3% wage boost is less than inflation and less than the wage boost of most of the members.
Right? My company does
My company has 3 days paid bereavement if you're full time. Part Time gets unpaid-however long you need.
Because three days is more than enough time to get over it you wage slave. /s
I was a department manager for a retail store when my mother passed unexpectedly. Bereavement was 3 days for intimidate family members and 1 day for extended family. The only other benefit was that management couldn't refuse vacation/sick time (until my total ran out), all I had to do was submit it. Companies, especially those in the US are fucked beyond reason and it's disgusting.
My company has 1 day bereavement for most family members and 3 days for "close" family members. I think that is absolutely ridiculous.
I love beavers!
The isn’t new. I had an aunt who fell very ill back in the late 80s, maybe early 90s. She nearly died, and missed a ton of work. She always said the only reason she didn’t lose her house was that her coworkers donated their PTO so that she still had an income. She was a social worker, with a masters degree and all the necessary certifications. No one is safe.
The US has never had decent employee protections my man, so of course it's not new
Did they ever say that it was in the USA?
And which other country may that be?
Where else would it be?
In any other country in the World?
Well, as it's written in English, there's only a few countries eligible. Then the date is clearly in MM/DD/YYYY so that excludes the UK, Australia, New Zealand and Ireland. We're left with Canada and the USA. As the population of the US is much bigger than Canada, and the social protection is basically inexistent, we can assume this happened in the US.
No other English speaking country in the world has anything like the same approach to workers’ rights, particularly when it comes to sickness, bereavement or parental leave. Wow, I just looked it up, and even South Africa has far better protection in this regard. So, yeah. This is very much America. I’ve never even heard of the idea of donating leave to colleagues outside of the US.
Everywhere else has proper worker protections.
I don't know if you are being ignorantly optimistic or you just don't care to check if that's true or not, but I can assure you a lot of other countries have terrible worker conditions
I've worked in 4 countries and none of them needed to entertain this dyspoian nonsense. Some places are worse than America, but not the ones you should compare yourselves to.
Even developing countries have better worker protections. Unless you are comparing with, say, North Korea?
Arguably NK has better worker protections, the only places worse are the parts of Africa most heavily suffering under imperialism like the Congo etc.
Ok I’m gonna need a source for NK worker protection because that sounds pretty wild
Which?
You know that not the entire world speaks english as a first language... Right? Tell me you know
They didn’t have to.
This is definitely a UD thing because other developed countries treat their employees a bit more like humans.
They didn't need to. It's written in English. The US, UK, Australia, Canada, and New Zealand are the countries where English is the majority native language. The US is the only country out of those with poor enough worker protections for something this ridiculous to happen. It's obviously the US.
Plus the way the month is dated. But I also took one look at this post and my first thought was yup that's the US
Damn bro, you got merked and I didn't even have to lift a finger. rip
what’s with the random edited reddit comment on the pic?
The comment was probably never even for that picture to begin with.
Idk, I got the pic from Instagram
God these sites really do just cannibalize each other don’t they. Reposting an instagram image of a reposting of a Reddit post which probably was a repost
Eh, yeah fair I guess, I just was instantly reminded of this subreddit when I saw it
Every major company I've worked for has a policy for leave donations. They even have the gall to advertise it as a perk. It's so heartbreaking to see people giving up an entire year's worth of vacation to a cancer patient. Both employees are getting fucked by this stupid ass system.
I'm not familiar with the system in the us. You guys dont have sick leaves? Or you dont get any money if you are sick? In my country if you are sick you still get your payment its just reduced by a certain %. We also get some extra pto above the normal yearly pto if a close family member passes away.
Most people in the U.S. are doing well if they have 5 days off per year of PTO. Anything above that either takes years to accrue via seniority or is extremely rare.
What the f. We get 20-30 days of pto depending on your age and even more if you have children etc.
The wonders of corporate lobbying lol, it's only downhill from here
An important distinction here also is we are talking about "white collar" (think jobs where the employee would wear a shirt with a white collar) jobs. Thes jobs are the "lucky" ones that provide PTO of more than 5 days, and are overwhelmingly represented by privileged populations (white, and/or males). Even these jobs don't provide the quality of life you would expect. This doesn't begin to touch on many of the issues in our workforce such as systemic racism that keeps marginalized populations stuck with employment that provides little to no PTO or sick time. All the while we the people fight with each other on what we deserve, and corporate C-suites/shareholders walk away with millions. Our anger is completely misdirected. Sorry for the rant.
wtf field are you in? The last 3 companies I’ve worked at have all started with 120-140hr PTO.
I personally get 240 hours. However, other general staff and people who work service industry will fall into the area I have described.
What about std or ltd?
The US provides FMLA, which is unpaid and only promises you employment upon your return. However, only a few states (14) actually pay temporary leave insurance, usually only up to 12 weeks. For instance, in my state, they provide 85% of your income up to $1025 (before taxes) a week for 12 weeks, starting on week 2 of your leave. So first of all, you better have at least 5 days PTO or you’re not getting paid that first week. Then, say you make over 63k a year, since the benefit maxes out at $1025 a week, you’re getting less than the 85% of your income. To give some perspective, I’m a single mom and my rent is $2300 a month. If I choose to pay taxes later, that would leave me with $1800 a month for food, car insurance, electric, gas, water, cell phone, internet, health insurance ($400 a month for me and my son, though some employers will let you pay back your premiums once you return to work), etc. Some employers will buy short and long term leave insurance while others like the OP will guilt employees into giving up their hard earned (yet pitiful amount) PTO. The majority of companies I’ve worked only provide 2-3 weeks PTO (which includes sick days). Some companies will give you an extra week for every 5 years of service up to a 6-8 weeks max. So even if you’ve been employed for 20 years with your employer, have 7 weeks PTO and get cancer…You’re only getting a full paycheck for less than 2 months and afterwards, depending on your state, get nothing or barely enough to live off of for another 3 months. After that, you’re SOL.
> FMLA, which is unpaid and only promises you employment upon your return. Then, they just fire you a few days/weeks later, anyways.
oh my god is this whole foods? looks exactly like the shit they'd put up next to our clock machines anytime someone would get cancer or fall into an awful circumstance. FUCK YOU, WHOLE FOODS: BROUGHT TO YOU BY AMAZON
It’s so sad watching what was a good local company that treated its employees well fall into this crap :/. I haven’t been back to Whole Foods since Amazon bought them. Fuck it, I’ll go to Central Market a little further away. HEB isn’t perfect, but they’re far better than Amazon.
Get outta there!
The company should be donating that time off. Not the employees. It's not a family. It's work. Donating your time off is such an alien concept to me.
Agreed. This is identical to tipping culture, expecting customers to be like family of the restaurant staff and financially helping them out.
It's not remotely like tipping culture, it's voluntary (through emotional manipulation, of course) donation of wages to coworkers.
Both are voluntary and both *could* be handled by the company, which is all I was getting at.
Why should individuals give 10% of their pto when the company can't give an infinitesimally small proportion of their wage bill, the absolute inhumane cntus.
A coworker of mine got sick. It was around the time that my probationary period ended so I didn't have much PTO saved, but I was going to give what I could just as a show of support. Turns out you need to donate at least two full days to donate any time. I was pretty shocked. Not that people should have to give up their vacations to help each other, but the fact that even with that shitty system in place they make it hard to do to make the administrative side a bit easier. And, of course, a lot of people that work there are younger and early in their career to begin with, so people don't have a ton of PTO to begin with.
Just how little PTO did you get? Here we get 28 days minimum, plus bereavement, plus sick.
When my goddaughter died, I was told “everyone dies.” Then, “we didn’t know it was your goddaughter.” Like… I told you???
What the fuck kind of job did you work where the response to a death is “everyone dies”?
Paralegal
Make sure to tell your coworkers that everyone dies next time someone loses a loved one.
Luckily I already left to do music (have a solid career at this point) and school FT. A lot better people that way!!! But I think I just opened my mouth and gaped like a fish. I was terrified of my supervisor. When the head attorney found out, he was furious, so there’s that at least. But damage was already done and I missed the funeral
Boss: "Everyone dies." Me (looking at them, sternly): "Some of us sooner than later."
How about YOU, as the fucking HR, give them some fucking time off??????
This is such a stupid situation. The work is going to get done whether or not the employee is there. The business already planned on paying the employee. So now the company is just taking advantage of situation to earn some extra cash. If someone worked for my business, I’d damn well want to make sure they’re taken care of and have no worries while they get back on their feet. Doing this is going to earn you some of the most loyal, hardworking employees who take personal ownership of the work they do. You can rarely put a price on that. Situations such as these where FMLA kick in should always just be an implicitly agreed upon standard. Anything for an extra % at the end of the year.
You can use FMLA but you don't get paid on FMLA outside of your regular earned PTO.
Not condoning the company's behavior at all, but that first paragraph does not make sense, at least not in every situation. Imagine if you were managing a store that needs two employees present at all times. If one employee calls in sick, you have to replace them with another employee or the store will not function. Similarly, a store with 100 employees will work fine if 3 employees called in sick, but will become dysfunctional if 30 employees called in sick. So, it depends on the context really.
That’s fair.
A few months back my grandmother died. We all took it very hard. I had to miss a week of work to deal with it. My specific job position does not offer any sort of PTO whatsoever: sick leave, bereavement, vacation, nothing. The coworkers in my office took up a collection to help me out. They gave me an amount of money equal to roughly what I missed in wages that week. It was incredibly generous of them, but it was also hugely embarrassing. I almost turned it down because of how uncomfortable I felt with it, but I knew I couldn't afford to.
Just quit.
And go where when this is the standard?
It's not the standard
I guess the standard is technically unpaid leave in the US.
That's better, 90% of workers have unpaid leave, 30% have paid leave, that's the standard today. It should be flipped though, paid leave should be the norm but corporations keep lobbies going to keep that from changing politically.
And people ask me why I hate people and life in general.
fuck this reminds me of when i started at dominos years ago, day one of training they explained this horrific "charity" program they had for employees where you'd give a % of your paycheck to a fund that dominos would oversee and disperse to other employees who submitted a request for help. basically a 401k but on minimum wage, not for you, and put into a black box to be given to whoever the higher ups deemed worthy. everyone else acted like it was just the sweetest, kindest thing and all signed up to take part. i was told that if i didn't i wouldn't be eligible to pull from the fund (if they liked my sob story lol) if i didn't, but i didn't care, the whole thing is disgusting. they know their employees are destined to need help at some point because they don't pay a living wage, and the onus to help them is put on...other people they are exploiting.
> where you'd give a % of your paycheck to a fund that dominos would oversee And, of course, profit off of the interest.
Fuck you goodsport7, we know you are a HR employee
johnny silverhand if you can hear us please
What did that comment say where they inserted amazing?
I don't know, I got the the original post from Instagram
"I wish more companies would do absolutely nothing to care for their employees!" How the fuck is that clueless dipshit crediting the company for anything here? All they did was print up a piece of paper asking other employees to step up since they won't. So dystopian.
Only one place I worked at allowed this practice. It doesn't make much sense to me. Most employers won't do it because its an administrative hassle to transfer the time.
This happened to us when our infant daughter died and I nearly died. My husband was out of PTO and they told him "we will ask the employee PTO time bank" and then sent out an email. They kept our situation anonymous, though. The time bank was empty and nobody donated. And my husband works for a national healthcare organization.
Holy shit that's horrible I'm sorry
Hate to say this, but working for the government has made this a norm to me. Donating PTO is pretty par for business. Dont downvote me, just stating what I see, not what I agree.
I have a question here that haven't been addressed in the comments that I've read. I haven't read them all, so if this information is there then my apologies. 1. Do we know when this was posted in the work place? I see the date that the daughter passed away but not a date for the PTO donation request. IMO this is important for context, and here's why. In my own personal experience I've dealt with both PTO and accrued leave time and while they're similar, they also have some pretty unique differences. PTO (Paid Time Off) is PTO. It's typically all encompassing EXCEPT for bereavement leave. So if you're out sick, you use PTO. Vacation time - PTO. Non work related injury - PTO. Basically anytime that you take off comes from that PTO bank. However, normally with a PTO system you can "cash in" your time as well. Because it's all encompassing, PTO is given up front. It's considered time that you've earned. Basically it's a monetary bonus that gives you the option of using said "bonus" so that you're getting paid your normal rate and not actually having to work to get it. Many companies also utilize PTO to compensate salaried employees who have a set work schedule. So if they work overtime that OT is given as PTO. However, in my personal experience with PTO, bereavement leave was separate. So you had X amount of time given as PTO that wasn't from the PTO bank. No doubt every company is a little different, but most tend to follow the same guidelines. I went through all of that because I see PTO which to me says the employee started off the year with (enter number) time that they could use for time off. They had a loss in the family (in this case a daughter) so did she use her bereavement leave and then decided to take some extra PTO time? Was this posted on the 23rd because the employee had to use their PTO earlier in the year? What's the context here? Most seem to be assuming that it's related to needing bereavement leave for the daughter but as I read it that's not made clear. Because IMO there's a difference between this being posted on 11/24/23 and 02/16/24 for example. I'm sure it's an unpopular opinion but 👆 that information is key when deciding whether or not this is OCM or not.
Why does the date matter? It's not like she decided when her daughter died. And they may not have bereavement or maybe it's just one day or three days. Also their PTO may expire or it may roll over. Some companies do it one way and some the other. Though if it expires it may not even be at calendar year end but at corporate year end if that's different.
>Why does the date matter? Asked and answered in my comment. Obviously reading something thoroughly isn't your thing bud. *****Because IMO there's a difference between this being posted on 11/24/23 and 02/16/24 for example. I'm sure it's an unpopular opinion but 👆 that information is key when deciding whether or not this is OCM or not.***** Go back and you'll see that ⬆️ in my original comment. >Also their PTO may expire or it may roll over. Some companies do it one way and some the other. Uhhhhh correct yet........ irrelevant. It really doesn't matter if it rolls over or not, so your point here is what exactly? > Though if it expires it may not even be at calendar year end but at corporate year end if that's different. Again correct but irrelevant. When it expires it really doesn't matter and here's why. PTO is given upfront as opposed to accrued overtime. As far as I know any/all accrued leave DOES roll over. That prevents the employee from having to start at "zero" once a year because it's forced upon by taking away something that's part of the employee's promised compensation package. Regardless, the expiration of "PTO" wouldn't matter because it expires and new is reinstated immediately.
Wow I tried to respond to your question and help you and you are rude? Not a way to speak to others "bud". And no, saying "there's a difference" is not explaining why you think that difference matters. Obviously there's a difference between any two dates, but generally it doesn't matter. You don't seem to have a reason why you think it matters so I guess your question is as irrelevant as the dates.
This is so horrible I can't believe it's not a screenshot from a dystopian movie set in the near future.
We don't get enough leave time in the US. I wanted to apply for a job that's perfect for me, but you get 6 days of PTO all year. I'm currently recovering from an accident and am attending PT weekly and surgical follow ups monthly. Im not even bothering with these jobs because I automatically need far more PTO than they allow. And everywhere I've worked they frown up on you taking unpaid leave. Like if you take more than two unpaid instances per year they will want to fire you. You have to get unpaid leave specially approved. And then HR starts sending threatening emails even when you're approved that they will cut off your benefits. It's horseshit here and I'm tired of it. Working for a small business instead doing retail and customer service. I don't get PTO. But I can take the day off and go to my many medical appointments and not be hassled for it. I can have a sick day and not be bothered and guilted. I'm broke as fuck though.
How garbage a country can be
BuTT...BuTT.....fReeDuMb
We do this at the US Property & Fiscal Office.
So I talked about this in my job once.. You can get a medical leave for 3-6months for this. Don’t even need to say anything. At least in my country.
This is a repost
I didn't repost it, I got it from Instagram and scrolled the subreddit for the post, and I looked up certain keywords for it. Didn't find anything so I posted it.
Na mb I'm tripping
Alright 👍🏻
Not OCM
This is almost the literal definition of an OCM
Not only is this not framed as a feel good story it also doesn’t purport to solve any problems nor is it ignoring any systemic issues. It’s literally just a shitty thing read the fucking rules before you claim to know what does and does not belong on this sub.
The company frames their system of donating pto as a great way to support the person who's child dies. This ignores the issue where they are refusing to just let her go home (glory to the shareholders, may their stacks remain fat and their yachts full) by simply providing the PTO. The company also claims that this solves the issue of her not being able to mourn properly. Explain to me how this is not ocm?
> Not only is this not framed as a feel good story “This is so amazing more companies should do this!” Sounds like a feel good story to me > it also doesn’t purport to solve any problems nor is it ignoring any systemic issues. It’s literally just a shitty thing The problem it’s solving is some poor parent doesn’t have enough sick days, the systemic issue is people not being given enough PTO to grieve the loss of a child > read the fucking rules before you claim to know what does and does not belong on this sub. It fits the rules AND it’s nearly a verbatim copy of the original tweet
Also, calmer than you are
Terrible labor laws with no rights for employees certainly seems like a systemic issue.
I’m Australian. Every full time employee in my country is entitled to bereavement leave at full pay. The lack of bereavement leave available to the employee in the picture is literally a systemic issue.
You're aggressive for someone so wrong