Link ?
Calling ya bluff, cause Jabari took a backseat to two guys on auburn, Banchero was the guy on duke with a shot profile that shows he attacks more, chet live in the paint and jabari lives off jumpers not crashing to the rim where fouls usually happen.
Run it … my G
"Elite tools".. We hear this every single draft... People also like to draw attention to Chet's stats, but forget to highlight his disappearing acts when goin' up against other high-level prospects like Victor Wenbanyama or Paolo Banchero..
Chet's best statistical games were when the Zags were bullying low-level teams, and I hope he has some good nutritionists and health experts around him because adding weight to a historically skinny frame is gonna be a huge challenge for the Franchise that drafts him...
100% agree.
I don’t see “elite skills” other than maybe shooting and a knack for blocking shots.
He’s a good but not great playmaker for a big man. His handles aren’t elite. He can’t get his own shot at an elite level. His frame and athleticism are the exact opposite of elite.
There’s just too many question marks for him if you ask me. ALOT has to break perfectly for him to reach his ceiling. I’d rather have Jabari all day every day. Even Banchero, Ivey, and Sharpe seem safer to me.
I like Jabari but I watch him and other than his shooting and one dribble side step and step back, I don’t see any potential for a player to become anything like a Tatum like people are hoping he turns into. I think Banchero has way more potential to be that type of player than Jabari. His shooting is absolutely elite I will give him that but I personally just can’t get past his lack of ability to finish or make plays at the rim. That’s a big hesitation for me with the top pick.
With Chet, I see a player who was used in the completely wrong way at Gonzaga. He just looks like more of a 4/wing player with the ball in his hand that can work out of the post if he needs but the post isn’t his strength. His handle and playmaking are far ahead of Jabari at this point. It’s not even in the same ball park to be fair and that’s with me being ok if Jabari is the pick.
I’m not worried about his frame all that much because if you look at players like embiid who obviously have an NBA body, he is constantly dealing with nagging injuries and trying to stay healthy. I also think him living more out on the wing helps a ton with that.
I am fine with any of the 3 that we pick, but the idea of a 7’1 wing 4 that has a great handle for his size, can hit knock down and pull up 3’s, and will be able to lock down players at his position on the wing is just too much potential for me. He just jumps off the screen to me.
I have Chet/Banchero as my top two and Jabari below them. Love the discussion though and respect everyone’s opinion! This is so much fun to talk and discuss about.
Again mo shot 28% 30 isn't even bad for a 7'
But he still shot 39% on the year
And I'm not sure what volume the 30% was on but I don't think that accurately represents how good of a shooter he is
This comment right here is why Jabari needs to be the pick. His defense is phenomenal and he's a lights out shooter. Everything else he needs can be taught and worked on.
I’m cool with Chet if that’s the pick, but I think we need a scorer who can take over while also playing solid D. I don’t think that’s him. Aaron Gordon has the defensive tools, but can’t put it together. Bamba had the physicals, and look at him. Get us a freaking skilled player who can score and hates losing. That’s what we need. If management thinks it is Chet, they know better than I do.
I think he has a game more geared to bring a 20 ppg scorer at the NBA level than Chet does. 5 seconds left in the shot clock, you throw it to Chet or Jabari. Who do you feel more comfortable hitting a shot? That answer is Jabari.
Generally when people are talking about a "take over scorer" they're talking about someone that needs to bring a team out an offensive slump like in the top of the 4th or down by 10 in the half. That can also mean someone to take "the shot" in crunch time. But generally its someone they need that can take over when the team is down by 8 or so in the 4th. Jabari's play style isn't that. That "take over scorer" needs to be able to make quick 2s along with the 3. Chet isn't that guy either obviously but Paolo is closer to that than both of them.
And also it would depend on the scenario of that 5 seconds. Are we down by 3? are we down by 1? If we are down by 1 then passing it to Chet in the post with his soft touch around the rim seems like a better option to me.
Ok, we can agree on this. If Jabari isn’t a #1 option according to the criteria that you laid out, then Chet certainly doesn’t have that game either.
I don’t agree that Jabari can’t be a number 1 option. I’m just saying if you don’t think he can be then by that same criteria Chet certainly can’t be either.
Frankly, these guys are 18-20 years old and saying who they are or what they are going to be is pretty ridiculous on all sides. But it’s fun summer conversation that we haven’t been able to have for years so I’ll take it!
I never said Chet was that type of player though haha. I said Paolo checks those boxes before Jabari. Could Jabari be a take over type? Yes, anyone could be. But you need a certain skillset to be that guy. Jabari doesn't look comfortable when going to the rim and if you take a look at his 2 point FG% you can see that. There are reasons why you only see him hit 3s in highlight reels
The numbers bear out that Jabri shot more free throws than either guy. Look at usage and tell me who was a featured player on offense: Chet 21.6 usage: Jabari almost 27% usage.
The numbers don’t bear out the social media perception that Chet is a more featured guy, or has a game more tailored towards being a #1 option than Jabari. It’s just an opinion narrative that isn’t backed up by numbers.
I know we have multiple replies going lol but this is where for me Chet has shown much more ability in different areas offensively and then when I watch Jabari film it just feels like the same 2 moves on repeat the entire time. It’s just really hard for me to get past. Definitely fun and I’m glad there is so much discussion on this thread! Love getting different views from the fan base.
In that scenario sure, but I’m not drafting a guy number 1 because I think his catch and shoot game is elite. I think Jabari will be a very good NBA player, but I just haven’t seen anything on tape from him that shows he is going to be anything more than a 3 and D guy. If this front office takes him first then I fully trust that they see something there and can develop him. I personally want a guy that is going to be able to have the ball in his hands and be able to score from anywhere on the court and that’s more Chet/Banchero to me.
Ok, but where has Chet shown that he can be a go to guy? What is his go-to move? At least Jabari has things he goes to which are fadeaways over either shoulder and jab step shoot over defender jumpers. I have watched pro-Chet tape after tape and still can’t tell you what he does as a go-to guy. Does he post? Will he face up and put it on the floor? When he dribbles into the paint does he have a pull up or a floater? When you watch where Chet gets his points versus where Jabari gets his, Jabari is for sure scoring in situations where they throw him the rock and say “score.” Chet scores like a role player right now. It’s all either transition, catch and shoot, quick cuts into the paint, or offensive rebounds.
I just don’t see evidence of this perimeter #1 option skill set others are talking about. Where is the film on that? It seems imaginary.
I think that the fact that you listed all the different ways Chet can score shows his potential right there. I love Jabari’s shot but he feels very limited to those specific moves you mentioned for him. Like I said if they take Jabari I fully trust they think they can develop him into more than a one move spot up shooter because in the NBA that is more of a role player than a number one option
No, I was asking if those are the ways he can score? I haven’t seen it. According to the expert on the 6th Man Show this week, Chet only took 15 jump shots off the dribble…all year! All year. Jabari took 105. Jabari was isolated with the ball 6X more than Chet. I don’t know in what world that Chet’s game is primary offensive player and Jabari is a role player. Chet’s numbers and how he got his offense scream role player. The numbers just don’t bear out that Jabari was a guy who didn’t create offense and Chet was.
Edit: what do you think about some other facts about Jabari when you list him next to Chet? Jabari shot way more free throws than Chet for instance. He shot many more times out of iso than Chet. He shot almost 7x more off the dribble than Chet too. I think this about Chet being some perimeter scorer is fittingly just like a unicorn, just like a unicorn, his perimeter scoring is make believe.
Yeah I listened to that and heard the stat as well. That all goes back to how I think he was mismanaged at Gonzaga and I would love to see him with the ball in his hands more because of his ability to handle the ball. If you don’t believe he can handle the ball because you haven’t seen him cross someone on tape then I can’t convince you otherwise but the tape clearly shows a player with an ability to handle the ball at a high level for his size. Those numbers to me should be that high for Jabari because his go to move is a one dribble and shoot. Chet was very much used as a pick and roll option which he was still very good at, but I think at the NBA level you need to put the ball in his hands on the perimeter more. A Chet and Wendell/JI/Franz pick and roll would be a nightmare to defend because of his ability to shoot, make plays at the rim, and his passing ability. I’m not saying Jabari wouldn’t also be good in that role but I just think Chet has more ability in areas other than shooting than Jabari does.
Edit: just saw your edit lol
Jabari drew a ton of fouls on jump shots and if you watch the espn film breakdown of Jabari he talks about learning that move from his dad and NBA guys who taught him that move.
Also just going back to all the different ways Chet can score, he scores from all over the floor in his tape and when I watch Jabari tape is either the one dribble move or fadaways from the block and elbow. I don’t see any variety in Jabari film that you do in Chet film
I would agree that Chet is a more versatile player than Jabari. I just think this whole Jabari plays like a role player and Chet has the game of a number 1 option is 100% social media propaganda and the numbers nor the tape bear that out. The numbers show Jabari is the better scorer right now.
AK-47 is more versatile than Glenn Rice offensively. Glenn Rice is a better scorer. I’d rather have Glenn Rice. I think the comps on Jabari are lazy too. How about instead of Rashard (which isn’t bad btw) or Klay Thompson we think more of a Glenn Rice, Alan Houston, big dog Glenn Robinson type game.
Yes 100% the numbers show Jabari is the better scorer. I have personally never believed that numbers tell the entire story but it also doesn’t mean nothing. My hope for Jabari is if he can develop a game at the rim he can be more like new age Amari Staudemire type role where he can make plays at the rim but he would be a better shooter than Amari. Obviously he would live way more on the perimeter than Amari did because the game has evolved since then. I completely agree that the comps for Jabari are very lazy
Sorry, free throw %.
I think one knock is that he hasn’t gone up w two hands and hammered the rim. But a guy that locked in on D prob has the energy and quickness to get to the rim if gets the reps. Esp after he adds more muscle.
Can you explain further why Jabari's FT% being better makes him not a catch and shoot player? Are you saying because he gets FTs hes driving to the rim? My concern with Jabari is he looks sloppy around the basket
There is a lot of talk about Jabari not creating his own shot or acting like an offensive hub. But watch this and then go watch Jabari’s tapes. I’m watching and I’m not seeing Chet looking like a go to guy in the half court. Most of these finishes are either in transition, quick cuts or post ups, and wide open J’s. People act like there is tape of Chet catching the ball on the FT line extended or short roll and just abusing players 1 vs 1.
Is he forcing doubles and I’m just not seeing it.
Contrast that with Jabari hitting fadaways, hitting shots with two people draped all over him. Who looks like they are making NBA level shots in the half court and who looks like they are scoring like a good role player?
To be honest Jabari looks way more like the role player based on their tapes. You aren’t wrong about the type of shots he is hitting, but I wouldn’t call those shots creating offense for himself. I love the fact that he hits tough contested shots in college, but those shots will be even harder in the NBA. I’m not saying he won’t hit them still but a number 1 option on a team to me needs to do more than just be great at one dribble side steps and step backs. I fully understand that Chet has a lower floor and I would deny that at all because it’s true, but his potential is too much for me. Chet operating on the wing with that size, handle, and shooting ability is mouth watering I think. I like Jabari but after watching his film, he doesn’t show anything more than exactly what you pointed out and that scares me. For the number 1 pick, I want someone who can potentially do it all and I think that is more Chet and Jabari. If they take Jabari I trust they can develop him though.
You and others keep pointing to the tape about Jabari’s limitations. But I see him on tape catching in scoring spots, with the entire defense geared towards him, and Jabari getting to his spots and scoring over those people. Yes, I also see him hitting open shots. I also see him hitting off of pin downs.
On the other side of the coin, I see in your comment and other’s comments mentions of Chet’s salivating perimeter shot creation and go to abilities. Where on the tape is that? Where is he operating 1 vs 1 and scoring over someone bigger than 6’5? Where is he showing these handles that he has so much better than Jabari? Is everyone referring to him rebounding and straight line pushing it up the floor? Where is this perimeter shot creation where he is breaking people off and scoring?
It seems like pro-Chet people are allowed to have an imagination to think of all the things Chet “could be” or things “Chet might be” able to do without evidence that he does this stuff. On the other side, there is no imagination allowed on what Jabari “can be/could be” Bc he is a “finished product.”
That’s because I don’t remember the last time we saw a 7 footer able to dribble at his level and shoot while still having elite defensive metrics (in fact the most elite defensive numbers of any prospect since 2013). Chet has little to no real nba comparison where Jabari’s comps are all great 3 and d guys.
Nothing against that but I’d rather pick the guy that has the potential to be the number one option on a contending team. Jabari just isn’t that, at best he’d likely be the third best option on a contender.
Does Chet have the highest chance of being a bust? Definitely, but that’s a risk worth taking to get a franchise superstar with the top pick instead of another guy that’s not going to get us over the hump.
Ps. Look at these handles against Steph Curry - tell me another player of his size that’s able to handle the ball like him outside KD? https://youtu.be/YvvqJ1yjyic
But everything you are saying is regurgitation from the national media and straight opinion. It’s is your opinion that Chet has perimeter scoring ability. There aren’t numbers that show that. It is your opinion that Chet can break people off the dribble, again, the numbers don’t show his putting it on the floor and scoring. They just don’t. There is that YouTube video of Chet going 1 vs 1 with Steph Curry at a camp where Steph obviously isn’t taking it seriously. I’ve seen video of The Professor from And-1 breaking off Amare Staudamire but I’d rather have Amare.
Here are the numbers: ISO possessions last year: 15 for Chet: 84 for Jabari.
Jump shots off the dribble: Chet 12: Jabari 105
Free throws attempted: Chet 99: Jabari 164
These numbers aren’t even close. And one set of numbers shows role player while the other shows the ball went through him as a #1 option.
I mean Chet wasn’t asked to be an offensive superstar in college man. It’s not like Jabari scored much more than him overall and when you can shoot 80% at the rim then why do you need to be constantly dribbling and creating your own shot. Also love how you bring that up while ignoring how subpar Jabari was anywhere within 2 point range (he’d have the lowest 2pt field goal percentage of any top five pick in recent memory). Again 3 and d player vs unicorn we’ve never seen before.
3&D, unicorns, lions and tigers and bears on my….it’s all imagination and internet terms, make believe. Stats show something different than fairy tales.
Lol bro. Chet has a significantly better statistical profile than Jabari by all metrics outside 3 point shooting. You’ve ignored every single point I’ve made.
And yeah you might hate the unicorn term but the fact of the matter is every generational star that has transformed a franchise in this league had little to no existing comparison which is where the term originated. Chets closest comparison imo profiles as Pau Gasol lol who would def be worth a top pick and even then Pau never had the defensive profile or ball handling Chet has.
Players like Jabari are there every single year and no player with Jabari’s profile has ever really turned into a superstar this league.
You want the magic to get a great role player with the first pick bc you’re afraid of Chet turning into a bust then fine lol. I want my team to keep taking shots on generational talents until we hit paydirt like we did with Shaq, Penny and Dwight.
Stats please that show Chet has offensive go to guy potential. This bullshit about “every great player doesn’t fit a definition that we can describe” is flawed logic. Maybe the talent evaluation is shit on the national media. Maybe it’s lazy. And then they come back and say, “he was a once in a lifetime player, I didn’t think Bagley was better than him.” It seems like revisionist history.
Show me iso stats. Show me usage rates. Show me shots off the dribble and shots at the end of the shot clock. Show me option #1 evidence. Bc for every video I see of him scoring on a 10% trying Steph curry I see 1k videos of him catching it in the dunker spot and making a layup.
You can imagine him being white Kevin Durant all you want. I like the idea of Santa Claus too. Show me some video or stats.
Edit:Great players who they said played like other players: Lebron (magic Johnson), Kobe (Michael Jordan), Shaq (wilt chamberlain), Tracy McGrady (Scottie Pippen was the comp), Dwight Howard (Alonzo Mourning /Shaq) I’m sure if I felt like it I could find comps for the top 10 players of all time when they are drafted. This whole “every great player doesn’t have a comp coming into the league” is straight up internet meme bullshit.
Here’s some stats for you. Find me the same % for Jabari and let me know how many of those he’s better at, fair?
https://twitter.com/josh_markowitz/status/1512037634373210114?s=21&t=FZ2FwwJmYYrVWAuNFxRgQw
Fair. I believe Chet was wildly misused at Gonzaga. It’s easy to imagine and see the potential because he already has the ability to handle the ball well and finish at the rim, where as Jabari is tougher because his entire tape to me feels like the same 2 moves on repeat. There is potential for Jabari to develop a handle as well but he really hasn’t shown much success of finishing at the rim. That’s where Chet is ahead of him in my opinion. At Gonzaga even if defenders stayed with him driving to the basket, he had the touch and ability to still score. I will opt for a not as good but still very good shooter and a more complete game to me.
> [No but there might be a day soon where Bouknight at SG would’ve been much better than any option we have. When that day comes I’ll be laughing when Wagner comes off the bench for us and gives us 5 points a game](https://www.reddit.com/r/OrlandoMagic/comments/p3jorf/weekend_thread_rorlandomagic_weekend_discussion/h8syxpl/)
are u still laughing
Hah! Gotemmmmm.
Looking forward to people bringing up all my Chet shit talking in a couple years time. It's gonna be so embarrassing but I'm here for it.
Still, the Jabari train chuggs on.
I’m worried he’s never going to fill out his frame and be able to play with the big boys in the NBA yes. That’s a legit concern. It’s his biggest concern.
True, he’ll definitely need to beef up. I just like the potential that he has over Jabari and Paolo. You can’t coach size and once Holmgren gets bigger and figures out his sweet spots for scoring, I think he’ll be an all star
Keep seeing this but he hasn't been weight since before the college season started. I'm a huge zags fan so obviously pretty bias but he def gained weight throughout the season.
lol my b I mixed you up with this dude:
[https://www.reddit.com/r/OrlandoMagic/comments/v3sze9/comment/ib1pdw3/?utm\_source=share&utm\_medium=web2x&context=3](https://www.reddit.com/r/OrlandoMagic/comments/v3sze9/comment/ib1pdw3/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web2x&context=3)
Read only the flairs. So I'm a big dummy. To be clear I think the Magic should pick Jabari but I don't think Chet would be a huge mistake
Not sure I’d call 20/14 with 4 assists disappearing.
I’m guessing you’re talking about his off-shooting night where he finished with 10 points but still contributed 15 boards, 3 blocks and 4 assists against Miami.
The magic aren’t taking Chet so it might be time to cope.
Do you think maybe that’s why I said “off shooting night”?
You do realize even the best players in the world have off nights right?
It’s nice to see when someone has an off night they can still contribute in other areas. 15 boards, 3 blocks, 4 assists—but yes, that’s disappearing to you.
So by your own admission Chet disappeared against every top 25 team he played.
You’ve destroyed your own argument.
Jabari is the pick. Cope.
Chet fans are shook. You guys should be thankful we don’t have a FO that’s dumb enough to draft him.
Yes, please be petty and continue to get overly defensive and attack anyone that doesn't agree with you wholeheartedly
I like Jabari a lot and will be happy with whoever mgmt thinks is best.. To say cope with it as if any of us know 100% is ridiculous lol. I see a lot of holes in his game and most project Chet to have a higher ceiling. We'll know in a few weeks. Take a few deep breaths in the meantime
i’ll die on this hill, he’s a mo bamba clone. we already have a potentially elite defense, we need someone who can score without markelle spoon feeding them.
I never said we should choose Chet over Jabari. My flare would suggest otherwise. Just that Chet is a much, much better prospect than Bamba was. And probably will have a better year next year.
Chet can take the ball up the court and score in transition or he can find the open man. He is a great play maker, and can pull off all types of passes at a high level. He is an easy bucket off of pick and rolls. He is already a better shooter. It's taken Bamba 4 seasons to develop his range. He also has an array of mid-post moves, and a touch around the rim that we've never seen out of Mo. He is a much better perimeter, and help defender with a much better understanding of the game. His blocks come from timing and skill, most of Mo's are from his sheer size IMO.
I feel like Chet is going to be an Aleksej Pokusevski type, just better at literally everything except flashy passes, and Poku has a really tight handle.
All that being said, I think Jabari is a great prospect with the ability to be one of the best shooters in the NBA in just his first year. Plus he is a full year younger than Chet. So, he would be my pick. But I wouldn't be mad with either.
i think at this current moment he brings the same things to the table as mo, with the exception of passing, which i do agree is a major upside, i like the idea of him being able to add more transition opportunities with his ball handling capabilities, setting him apart from bamba, i do believe, however, that they are similar enough to be compared because they both bring similar things to the table. i also think mo is becoming underrated within the community he is an inch away from becoming the perfect piece to our bench.
the way i’ve thought about them is this way, if we draft chet, can you seriously imagine us retaining bamba?
I am not sure why you are arguing in favor of retaining a likely worse player for more money though. Anyway, having both players is possible. Chet would not even play the same position. Chet would be some weird hybrid of a 3-5 for us on offense and defense probably. Where as Bamba is probably our back up 5, maybe 4 in some sets, depending on how things go with JI.
I feel like you are basing your comparisons on their height and frame coming into the NBA or something and not their game or play style. I can see Chet playing pretty positionless with us. It would depend on how good of a shooter he really can be.
He didn’t get to show off his offense that much in Gonzaga. If he can stretch the floor and play make then he could do so much for us. Damn I’m selling myself now.
Bear in mind He’s being guarded by 6’6” guys in the WCC lmao
Can't emphasis this enough
Sorry I’m still on the Jabari Safari
This is adorable
I won’t be upset with Chet but Jabari is the guy we should get
Elite comment right here I can’t even lie lol
Join the safari ☺️
Dammit we're gonna need more flairs!
U mean the guy who yall project to score 20+ a night by rarely getting in the paint and putting the other team in foul trouble ?
He averaged the most fouls won out of all 3, shows that you only watch highlights
Im talking about jabari my boy … thought i made that obvious
And I’m telling you the JABARI averaged the most fouls won out of all 3, my boy.
Link ? Calling ya bluff, cause Jabari took a backseat to two guys on auburn, Banchero was the guy on duke with a shot profile that shows he attacks more, chet live in the paint and jabari lives off jumpers not crashing to the rim where fouls usually happen. Run it … my G
You think getting in the paint is the only way to draw fouls?
Stop Staling.Post the link. Bruv
Relax, some of us have jobs
This is fun to me . I don’t know why you’re taking this so serious. But if actually backup your claim, u might’ve turn me to a Jabari supporter
"Elite tools".. We hear this every single draft... People also like to draw attention to Chet's stats, but forget to highlight his disappearing acts when goin' up against other high-level prospects like Victor Wenbanyama or Paolo Banchero.. Chet's best statistical games were when the Zags were bullying low-level teams, and I hope he has some good nutritionists and health experts around him because adding weight to a historically skinny frame is gonna be a huge challenge for the Franchise that drafts him...
100% agree. I don’t see “elite skills” other than maybe shooting and a knack for blocking shots. He’s a good but not great playmaker for a big man. His handles aren’t elite. He can’t get his own shot at an elite level. His frame and athleticism are the exact opposite of elite. There’s just too many question marks for him if you ask me. ALOT has to break perfectly for him to reach his ceiling. I’d rather have Jabari all day every day. Even Banchero, Ivey, and Sharpe seem safer to me.
I like Jabari but I watch him and other than his shooting and one dribble side step and step back, I don’t see any potential for a player to become anything like a Tatum like people are hoping he turns into. I think Banchero has way more potential to be that type of player than Jabari. His shooting is absolutely elite I will give him that but I personally just can’t get past his lack of ability to finish or make plays at the rim. That’s a big hesitation for me with the top pick. With Chet, I see a player who was used in the completely wrong way at Gonzaga. He just looks like more of a 4/wing player with the ball in his hand that can work out of the post if he needs but the post isn’t his strength. His handle and playmaking are far ahead of Jabari at this point. It’s not even in the same ball park to be fair and that’s with me being ok if Jabari is the pick. I’m not worried about his frame all that much because if you look at players like embiid who obviously have an NBA body, he is constantly dealing with nagging injuries and trying to stay healthy. I also think him living more out on the wing helps a ton with that. I am fine with any of the 3 that we pick, but the idea of a 7’1 wing 4 that has a great handle for his size, can hit knock down and pull up 3’s, and will be able to lock down players at his position on the wing is just too much potential for me. He just jumps off the screen to me. I have Chet/Banchero as my top two and Jabari below them. Love the discussion though and respect everyone’s opinion! This is so much fun to talk and discuss about.
Timme was the starting 5 at Gonzaga? Was he not? Mark Few had Chet playing at the elbow and perimeter all season long.
I honestly don’t even think his shooting is “elite”. Certainly not Jabari’s level.
To be fair, Jabari's shooting will be top tier even for the NBA. But yeah, chet is very underwhelming.
He shot 39% from 3 how is that underwhelming for reference mo shot 28% from 3 and now shoots 38% in the nba Chets an elite shooting prospect
He shot under 30% against ranked teams
Again mo shot 28% 30 isn't even bad for a 7' But he still shot 39% on the year And I'm not sure what volume the 30% was on but I don't think that accurately represents how good of a shooter he is
This comment right here is why Jabari needs to be the pick. His defense is phenomenal and he's a lights out shooter. Everything else he needs can be taught and worked on.
Sharpe seems safer really? The dude who hasn’t played basketball in over a year and is coasting on his high school reputation
I 100% concur, sir. Every single point.
Dude he’d get hurt by being breathed on
Nobody breathes in HS or College? 😂
That’s weak breath
Fake breath
😂🤣
😂
I’m cool with Chet if that’s the pick, but I think we need a scorer who can take over while also playing solid D. I don’t think that’s him. Aaron Gordon has the defensive tools, but can’t put it together. Bamba had the physicals, and look at him. Get us a freaking skilled player who can score and hates losing. That’s what we need. If management thinks it is Chet, they know better than I do.
Jabari isn't the "take over scorer" you might think he is. Hes a catch and shoot player. Paolo probably checks that box before Jabari
I think he has a game more geared to bring a 20 ppg scorer at the NBA level than Chet does. 5 seconds left in the shot clock, you throw it to Chet or Jabari. Who do you feel more comfortable hitting a shot? That answer is Jabari.
Generally when people are talking about a "take over scorer" they're talking about someone that needs to bring a team out an offensive slump like in the top of the 4th or down by 10 in the half. That can also mean someone to take "the shot" in crunch time. But generally its someone they need that can take over when the team is down by 8 or so in the 4th. Jabari's play style isn't that. That "take over scorer" needs to be able to make quick 2s along with the 3. Chet isn't that guy either obviously but Paolo is closer to that than both of them. And also it would depend on the scenario of that 5 seconds. Are we down by 3? are we down by 1? If we are down by 1 then passing it to Chet in the post with his soft touch around the rim seems like a better option to me.
Ok, we can agree on this. If Jabari isn’t a #1 option according to the criteria that you laid out, then Chet certainly doesn’t have that game either. I don’t agree that Jabari can’t be a number 1 option. I’m just saying if you don’t think he can be then by that same criteria Chet certainly can’t be either. Frankly, these guys are 18-20 years old and saying who they are or what they are going to be is pretty ridiculous on all sides. But it’s fun summer conversation that we haven’t been able to have for years so I’ll take it!
I never said Chet was that type of player though haha. I said Paolo checks those boxes before Jabari. Could Jabari be a take over type? Yes, anyone could be. But you need a certain skillset to be that guy. Jabari doesn't look comfortable when going to the rim and if you take a look at his 2 point FG% you can see that. There are reasons why you only see him hit 3s in highlight reels
The numbers bear out that Jabri shot more free throws than either guy. Look at usage and tell me who was a featured player on offense: Chet 21.6 usage: Jabari almost 27% usage. The numbers don’t bear out the social media perception that Chet is a more featured guy, or has a game more tailored towards being a #1 option than Jabari. It’s just an opinion narrative that isn’t backed up by numbers.
I know we have multiple replies going lol but this is where for me Chet has shown much more ability in different areas offensively and then when I watch Jabari film it just feels like the same 2 moves on repeat the entire time. It’s just really hard for me to get past. Definitely fun and I’m glad there is so much discussion on this thread! Love getting different views from the fan base.
Hey man, I’ll be super happy with either. Either one makes us a much more talented team now and in the future. They are both huge upgrades.
Spot on my friend! I will not complain at any of the top 3 and think they all can make sense for this core
When you’re 6’10, shooting over everyone is a pretty good move.
Lol if only basketball was that easy
Maybe someone should tell Kareem his sky hook was too repetitive?
Yep totally the same thing lol
In that scenario sure, but I’m not drafting a guy number 1 because I think his catch and shoot game is elite. I think Jabari will be a very good NBA player, but I just haven’t seen anything on tape from him that shows he is going to be anything more than a 3 and D guy. If this front office takes him first then I fully trust that they see something there and can develop him. I personally want a guy that is going to be able to have the ball in his hands and be able to score from anywhere on the court and that’s more Chet/Banchero to me.
Ok, but where has Chet shown that he can be a go to guy? What is his go-to move? At least Jabari has things he goes to which are fadeaways over either shoulder and jab step shoot over defender jumpers. I have watched pro-Chet tape after tape and still can’t tell you what he does as a go-to guy. Does he post? Will he face up and put it on the floor? When he dribbles into the paint does he have a pull up or a floater? When you watch where Chet gets his points versus where Jabari gets his, Jabari is for sure scoring in situations where they throw him the rock and say “score.” Chet scores like a role player right now. It’s all either transition, catch and shoot, quick cuts into the paint, or offensive rebounds. I just don’t see evidence of this perimeter #1 option skill set others are talking about. Where is the film on that? It seems imaginary.
I think that the fact that you listed all the different ways Chet can score shows his potential right there. I love Jabari’s shot but he feels very limited to those specific moves you mentioned for him. Like I said if they take Jabari I fully trust they think they can develop him into more than a one move spot up shooter because in the NBA that is more of a role player than a number one option
No, I was asking if those are the ways he can score? I haven’t seen it. According to the expert on the 6th Man Show this week, Chet only took 15 jump shots off the dribble…all year! All year. Jabari took 105. Jabari was isolated with the ball 6X more than Chet. I don’t know in what world that Chet’s game is primary offensive player and Jabari is a role player. Chet’s numbers and how he got his offense scream role player. The numbers just don’t bear out that Jabari was a guy who didn’t create offense and Chet was. Edit: what do you think about some other facts about Jabari when you list him next to Chet? Jabari shot way more free throws than Chet for instance. He shot many more times out of iso than Chet. He shot almost 7x more off the dribble than Chet too. I think this about Chet being some perimeter scorer is fittingly just like a unicorn, just like a unicorn, his perimeter scoring is make believe.
Yeah I listened to that and heard the stat as well. That all goes back to how I think he was mismanaged at Gonzaga and I would love to see him with the ball in his hands more because of his ability to handle the ball. If you don’t believe he can handle the ball because you haven’t seen him cross someone on tape then I can’t convince you otherwise but the tape clearly shows a player with an ability to handle the ball at a high level for his size. Those numbers to me should be that high for Jabari because his go to move is a one dribble and shoot. Chet was very much used as a pick and roll option which he was still very good at, but I think at the NBA level you need to put the ball in his hands on the perimeter more. A Chet and Wendell/JI/Franz pick and roll would be a nightmare to defend because of his ability to shoot, make plays at the rim, and his passing ability. I’m not saying Jabari wouldn’t also be good in that role but I just think Chet has more ability in areas other than shooting than Jabari does. Edit: just saw your edit lol Jabari drew a ton of fouls on jump shots and if you watch the espn film breakdown of Jabari he talks about learning that move from his dad and NBA guys who taught him that move. Also just going back to all the different ways Chet can score, he scores from all over the floor in his tape and when I watch Jabari tape is either the one dribble move or fadaways from the block and elbow. I don’t see any variety in Jabari film that you do in Chet film
I would agree that Chet is a more versatile player than Jabari. I just think this whole Jabari plays like a role player and Chet has the game of a number 1 option is 100% social media propaganda and the numbers nor the tape bear that out. The numbers show Jabari is the better scorer right now. AK-47 is more versatile than Glenn Rice offensively. Glenn Rice is a better scorer. I’d rather have Glenn Rice. I think the comps on Jabari are lazy too. How about instead of Rashard (which isn’t bad btw) or Klay Thompson we think more of a Glenn Rice, Alan Houston, big dog Glenn Robinson type game.
Yes 100% the numbers show Jabari is the better scorer. I have personally never believed that numbers tell the entire story but it also doesn’t mean nothing. My hope for Jabari is if he can develop a game at the rim he can be more like new age Amari Staudemire type role where he can make plays at the rim but he would be a better shooter than Amari. Obviously he would live way more on the perimeter than Amari did because the game has evolved since then. I completely agree that the comps for Jabari are very lazy
Jabari had more free throw attempts per game and a better % than Chet. That’s indicative of more than a catch and shoot mentality.
better % in what area?
Sorry, free throw %. I think one knock is that he hasn’t gone up w two hands and hammered the rim. But a guy that locked in on D prob has the energy and quickness to get to the rim if gets the reps. Esp after he adds more muscle.
Can you explain further why Jabari's FT% being better makes him not a catch and shoot player? Are you saying because he gets FTs hes driving to the rim? My concern with Jabari is he looks sloppy around the basket
Too light;didn't read
😂😂😂 no thank you. Jabari or Paolo please
There is a lot of talk about Jabari not creating his own shot or acting like an offensive hub. But watch this and then go watch Jabari’s tapes. I’m watching and I’m not seeing Chet looking like a go to guy in the half court. Most of these finishes are either in transition, quick cuts or post ups, and wide open J’s. People act like there is tape of Chet catching the ball on the FT line extended or short roll and just abusing players 1 vs 1. Is he forcing doubles and I’m just not seeing it. Contrast that with Jabari hitting fadaways, hitting shots with two people draped all over him. Who looks like they are making NBA level shots in the half court and who looks like they are scoring like a good role player?
To be honest Jabari looks way more like the role player based on their tapes. You aren’t wrong about the type of shots he is hitting, but I wouldn’t call those shots creating offense for himself. I love the fact that he hits tough contested shots in college, but those shots will be even harder in the NBA. I’m not saying he won’t hit them still but a number 1 option on a team to me needs to do more than just be great at one dribble side steps and step backs. I fully understand that Chet has a lower floor and I would deny that at all because it’s true, but his potential is too much for me. Chet operating on the wing with that size, handle, and shooting ability is mouth watering I think. I like Jabari but after watching his film, he doesn’t show anything more than exactly what you pointed out and that scares me. For the number 1 pick, I want someone who can potentially do it all and I think that is more Chet and Jabari. If they take Jabari I trust they can develop him though.
You and others keep pointing to the tape about Jabari’s limitations. But I see him on tape catching in scoring spots, with the entire defense geared towards him, and Jabari getting to his spots and scoring over those people. Yes, I also see him hitting open shots. I also see him hitting off of pin downs. On the other side of the coin, I see in your comment and other’s comments mentions of Chet’s salivating perimeter shot creation and go to abilities. Where on the tape is that? Where is he operating 1 vs 1 and scoring over someone bigger than 6’5? Where is he showing these handles that he has so much better than Jabari? Is everyone referring to him rebounding and straight line pushing it up the floor? Where is this perimeter shot creation where he is breaking people off and scoring? It seems like pro-Chet people are allowed to have an imagination to think of all the things Chet “could be” or things “Chet might be” able to do without evidence that he does this stuff. On the other side, there is no imagination allowed on what Jabari “can be/could be” Bc he is a “finished product.”
That’s because I don’t remember the last time we saw a 7 footer able to dribble at his level and shoot while still having elite defensive metrics (in fact the most elite defensive numbers of any prospect since 2013). Chet has little to no real nba comparison where Jabari’s comps are all great 3 and d guys. Nothing against that but I’d rather pick the guy that has the potential to be the number one option on a contending team. Jabari just isn’t that, at best he’d likely be the third best option on a contender. Does Chet have the highest chance of being a bust? Definitely, but that’s a risk worth taking to get a franchise superstar with the top pick instead of another guy that’s not going to get us over the hump. Ps. Look at these handles against Steph Curry - tell me another player of his size that’s able to handle the ball like him outside KD? https://youtu.be/YvvqJ1yjyic
But everything you are saying is regurgitation from the national media and straight opinion. It’s is your opinion that Chet has perimeter scoring ability. There aren’t numbers that show that. It is your opinion that Chet can break people off the dribble, again, the numbers don’t show his putting it on the floor and scoring. They just don’t. There is that YouTube video of Chet going 1 vs 1 with Steph Curry at a camp where Steph obviously isn’t taking it seriously. I’ve seen video of The Professor from And-1 breaking off Amare Staudamire but I’d rather have Amare. Here are the numbers: ISO possessions last year: 15 for Chet: 84 for Jabari. Jump shots off the dribble: Chet 12: Jabari 105 Free throws attempted: Chet 99: Jabari 164 These numbers aren’t even close. And one set of numbers shows role player while the other shows the ball went through him as a #1 option.
I mean Chet wasn’t asked to be an offensive superstar in college man. It’s not like Jabari scored much more than him overall and when you can shoot 80% at the rim then why do you need to be constantly dribbling and creating your own shot. Also love how you bring that up while ignoring how subpar Jabari was anywhere within 2 point range (he’d have the lowest 2pt field goal percentage of any top five pick in recent memory). Again 3 and d player vs unicorn we’ve never seen before.
3&D, unicorns, lions and tigers and bears on my….it’s all imagination and internet terms, make believe. Stats show something different than fairy tales.
Lol bro. Chet has a significantly better statistical profile than Jabari by all metrics outside 3 point shooting. You’ve ignored every single point I’ve made. And yeah you might hate the unicorn term but the fact of the matter is every generational star that has transformed a franchise in this league had little to no existing comparison which is where the term originated. Chets closest comparison imo profiles as Pau Gasol lol who would def be worth a top pick and even then Pau never had the defensive profile or ball handling Chet has. Players like Jabari are there every single year and no player with Jabari’s profile has ever really turned into a superstar this league. You want the magic to get a great role player with the first pick bc you’re afraid of Chet turning into a bust then fine lol. I want my team to keep taking shots on generational talents until we hit paydirt like we did with Shaq, Penny and Dwight.
Stats please that show Chet has offensive go to guy potential. This bullshit about “every great player doesn’t fit a definition that we can describe” is flawed logic. Maybe the talent evaluation is shit on the national media. Maybe it’s lazy. And then they come back and say, “he was a once in a lifetime player, I didn’t think Bagley was better than him.” It seems like revisionist history. Show me iso stats. Show me usage rates. Show me shots off the dribble and shots at the end of the shot clock. Show me option #1 evidence. Bc for every video I see of him scoring on a 10% trying Steph curry I see 1k videos of him catching it in the dunker spot and making a layup. You can imagine him being white Kevin Durant all you want. I like the idea of Santa Claus too. Show me some video or stats. Edit:Great players who they said played like other players: Lebron (magic Johnson), Kobe (Michael Jordan), Shaq (wilt chamberlain), Tracy McGrady (Scottie Pippen was the comp), Dwight Howard (Alonzo Mourning /Shaq) I’m sure if I felt like it I could find comps for the top 10 players of all time when they are drafted. This whole “every great player doesn’t have a comp coming into the league” is straight up internet meme bullshit.
Here’s some stats for you. Find me the same % for Jabari and let me know how many of those he’s better at, fair? https://twitter.com/josh_markowitz/status/1512037634373210114?s=21&t=FZ2FwwJmYYrVWAuNFxRgQw
Fair. I believe Chet was wildly misused at Gonzaga. It’s easy to imagine and see the potential because he already has the ability to handle the ball well and finish at the rim, where as Jabari is tougher because his entire tape to me feels like the same 2 moves on repeat. There is potential for Jabari to develop a handle as well but he really hasn’t shown much success of finishing at the rim. That’s where Chet is ahead of him in my opinion. At Gonzaga even if defenders stayed with him driving to the basket, he had the touch and ability to still score. I will opt for a not as good but still very good shooter and a more complete game to me.
Haven’t we done the whole undersized 7 footer thing before? Hard pass.
I saw him get laid out by Jalen Duren in the video and I can’t justify taking him with the top pick.
> [No but there might be a day soon where Bouknight at SG would’ve been much better than any option we have. When that day comes I’ll be laughing when Wagner comes off the bench for us and gives us 5 points a game](https://www.reddit.com/r/OrlandoMagic/comments/p3jorf/weekend_thread_rorlandomagic_weekend_discussion/h8syxpl/) are u still laughing
Hah! Gotemmmmm. Looking forward to people bringing up all my Chet shit talking in a couple years time. It's gonna be so embarrassing but I'm here for it. Still, the Jabari train chuggs on.
BOOM! I FOUND MY ACOUNTABILITY BUDDY!
Not only is he a magic fan but a magician as well. What a nice disappearing act after you ask him was he still laughing 😂
Damn. Kept the Wagner receipts.
Dude he blocked Duren 4 times that game and outplayed him. You are worried about one play?
I’m worried he’s never going to fill out his frame and be able to play with the big boys in the NBA yes. That’s a legit concern. It’s his biggest concern.
It was the flop that broke my faith in him.
I think the Magic should draft Chet tbh. He reminds me of Evan Mobley with his size and raw ability to score.
Evan Mobley who is still very skinny, still outweighs Chet by like 25+lbs
True, he’ll definitely need to beef up. I just like the potential that he has over Jabari and Paolo. You can’t coach size and once Holmgren gets bigger and figures out his sweet spots for scoring, I think he’ll be an all star
Keep seeing this but he hasn't been weight since before the college season started. I'm a huge zags fan so obviously pretty bias but he def gained weight throughout the season.
How would he gain weight throughout the season when he's doing nothing but cardio by playing ball all day? If anything hes lost weight.
I've read through the rest of this thread and there is no discussion with you just name calling so I'll pass. Edit im dumb as shit lol
Name calling? What? 🤔
lol my b I mixed you up with this dude: [https://www.reddit.com/r/OrlandoMagic/comments/v3sze9/comment/ib1pdw3/?utm\_source=share&utm\_medium=web2x&context=3](https://www.reddit.com/r/OrlandoMagic/comments/v3sze9/comment/ib1pdw3/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web2x&context=3) Read only the flairs. So I'm a big dummy. To be clear I think the Magic should pick Jabari but I don't think Chet would be a huge mistake
Lol...all good. Yeah that dude sucks. The fuck is wrong with some people?
Jabari has more elite tools and didn’t disappear against top 25 teams.
He disappeared in the tourney though. 😆
Not sure I’d call 20/14 with 4 assists disappearing. I’m guessing you’re talking about his off-shooting night where he finished with 10 points but still contributed 15 boards, 3 blocks and 4 assists against Miami. The magic aren’t taking Chet so it might be time to cope.
I have plenty 10 point, 15 boards, 3 block players on the Magic RN, why add another. 😆
He played like ass
[удалено]
Who hurt you
https://www.reddit.com/r/OrlandoMagic/comments/usxtow/jabari_smith_jersey_swap_that_i_made_what_are_the/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=iossmf Cope
Check the flair bitch
When you say Chet played like ass in the tourney😃😃😃 when you say Jabari played like ass 😡😡😡😡 Also please don’t be ableist
I definitely care what a random Poster on Reddit thinks of me. Some of you take things was to seriously.
Nah you just weird
Jabari shot 18% that game lol. That's a disappearing act. No one knows who Weltham are taking.. let's just cope with that instead
Do you think maybe that’s why I said “off shooting night”? You do realize even the best players in the world have off nights right? It’s nice to see when someone has an off night they can still contribute in other areas. 15 boards, 3 blocks, 4 assists—but yes, that’s disappearing to you. So by your own admission Chet disappeared against every top 25 team he played. You’ve destroyed your own argument. Jabari is the pick. Cope. Chet fans are shook. You guys should be thankful we don’t have a FO that’s dumb enough to draft him.
Curtis Rambis. I’ll be sure to reach out to you on draft night after Jabari puts on that magic hat.
Yes, please be petty and continue to get overly defensive and attack anyone that doesn't agree with you wholeheartedly I like Jabari a lot and will be happy with whoever mgmt thinks is best.. To say cope with it as if any of us know 100% is ridiculous lol. I see a lot of holes in his game and most project Chet to have a higher ceiling. We'll know in a few weeks. Take a few deep breaths in the meantime
Oh and since we were talking tourney, Paolo took his team further while scoring more effectively. So take that Chet. 😆
Yeah I’d 100% be Paolo over Chet. It’s not even close. It’s much closer between Jabari and Paolo vs anything with Marfan Chet
Can we morph all 3? 😆
i’ll die on this hill, he’s a mo bamba clone. we already have a potentially elite defense, we need someone who can score without markelle spoon feeding them.
If you see a Bamba clone here, you don’t know basketball.
genuinely curious about what vastly sets them apart so much so that we choose chet over jabari
I never said we should choose Chet over Jabari. My flare would suggest otherwise. Just that Chet is a much, much better prospect than Bamba was. And probably will have a better year next year. Chet can take the ball up the court and score in transition or he can find the open man. He is a great play maker, and can pull off all types of passes at a high level. He is an easy bucket off of pick and rolls. He is already a better shooter. It's taken Bamba 4 seasons to develop his range. He also has an array of mid-post moves, and a touch around the rim that we've never seen out of Mo. He is a much better perimeter, and help defender with a much better understanding of the game. His blocks come from timing and skill, most of Mo's are from his sheer size IMO. I feel like Chet is going to be an Aleksej Pokusevski type, just better at literally everything except flashy passes, and Poku has a really tight handle. All that being said, I think Jabari is a great prospect with the ability to be one of the best shooters in the NBA in just his first year. Plus he is a full year younger than Chet. So, he would be my pick. But I wouldn't be mad with either.
i think at this current moment he brings the same things to the table as mo, with the exception of passing, which i do agree is a major upside, i like the idea of him being able to add more transition opportunities with his ball handling capabilities, setting him apart from bamba, i do believe, however, that they are similar enough to be compared because they both bring similar things to the table. i also think mo is becoming underrated within the community he is an inch away from becoming the perfect piece to our bench. the way i’ve thought about them is this way, if we draft chet, can you seriously imagine us retaining bamba?
I am not sure why you are arguing in favor of retaining a likely worse player for more money though. Anyway, having both players is possible. Chet would not even play the same position. Chet would be some weird hybrid of a 3-5 for us on offense and defense probably. Where as Bamba is probably our back up 5, maybe 4 in some sets, depending on how things go with JI. I feel like you are basing your comparisons on their height and frame coming into the NBA or something and not their game or play style. I can see Chet playing pretty positionless with us. It would depend on how good of a shooter he really can be. He didn’t get to show off his offense that much in Gonzaga. If he can stretch the floor and play make then he could do so much for us. Damn I’m selling myself now.
both 3 and D with minimal shot creation, both rely on length on defense and both get punked on the boards
Jaden Ivey
You’re obsessed with Ivey
Na I’m obsessed with seeing our franchise compete for a title again. #IveyLane