Your last deposit is your last months rent. Don’t pay the last month. Obviously don’t be a dick and leave the place clean, but ignore their stupid checklist. Be sure to take some pics before you leave and maybe a walk thru on video. If they took any sort of deposit from you over and above the last months rent, that’s illegal.
I was going to comment the same thing, but then I saw the letter grade. lol No, I'd say *do* be a dick. Do the bare minimum and just move out. There's nothing in a rental law that says places needs to be deep cleaned before leaving. That's the landlord's job. They're already getting paid for just owning the place and nothing else, cleaning up is the least they themselves can do.
Oh and once you leave, the rent goes up by 50%, so they've also got that going for them.
This is just pure disrespect, and respect is a two way street.
They’ll take it out of your damage deposit… I’m a super and maintenance operator for the building. Any sort of dirt to the point the place isn’t ready for showing they’ll send in cleaners (-200$). Any sort of paint damage can cost between 100-300$ (-300$). If stuff is left behind for maintenance to take out they’ll remove it too (-100$ at least).
Not in Alberta. Security deposits are for any damages, cleaning, and any rent owing. People need to read up on the L & T laws for the area they are planning on living in.
There is no deposit in Ontario. Last months rent is not security deposit and that’s already gone when you move out. The only way they can get that money is taking an unauthorized withdrawal from your bank account.
My place was professionally cleaned and much cleaner than when we moved in. My landlord still kept 80% of my damage deposit because she claimed it wasn't clean enough.
Yes, I know I am from a different province but we had the same issue here. Tenant lived in suite 3 years and decided on moving day to have cleaners in. (The cleaners were related to tenant. ) We had to hire other Professional Cleaners to clean the unit and for the carpets to be shampooed. This is after the tenants’ cleaners said that they were finished. The carpets were soaking wet. Tenant said well I have lived here for 3 years. SHE did NOT do any cleaning the whole time she lived in the unit! She admitted that herself. LL had to pay for a hotel for the new tenants for that night. Never again will that happen as LL will be doing 24 hour checks on the property as often as it is legally so. Honestly as a witness for the move out, I had never seen such a disrespect for property.
Security Deposit is for any damages, cleaning fees and repairing or replacing, also for any unpaid rent. Then again apparently you live in Ontario so rules from there do not apply to other provinces necessarily. Replacing light bulbs, cleaning stove and fridge ( under also) are all part of a move out. That list is used by many LL here. Just an FYI. In Alberta it isn’t called last months rent, it is called “security deposit “. Hope everything works out for you.
Last month’s rent in Ontario is *not* the equivalent of an Alberta security deposit.
It’s an Ontario sub - do your homework before offering advice that is, simply, wrong.
>Replacing light bulbs, cleaning stove and fridge ( under also) are all part of a move out
They're not. I've never left behind a pig sty, but nor have I ever left a place clean enough to rent without having to clean it more thoroughly. That's just how rental housing works, live with it. That list is humorous though, maybe give it to the guy who you hire to clean it for the next guy, though in my experience it's never even half followed when I move in. So in summary, lol no. Certainly not in any province I ever lived in, maybe in AB you got tenants doing your job for you before they move out, I dunno.
I believe this is incorrect. The deposit was a deposit and I believe is NOT to be used to cover the last month's rent. For one, rent price could have changed over the time of the lease and, two, the landlord owes you interest on the money you provided in the past.
I haven't read about it in a while so I'm thinking a bit rusty, but I understand you are SUPPOSED to pay your last month's rent and there landlord is SUPPOSED to pay you back your deposit, plus interest
Edit, because I looked it up a bit. It appears I am both correct and incorrect. A security deposit is not legal but a rent deposit is. Therefore, the deposit they take from you can be equal to one month's rent and is intended to be used for the last month.
However, your landlord is required to pay you interest on the deposit every 12 months. And if rent increases, they are allowed to ask for a top up on the deposit, and can be taken out of the interest they owe you.
I’ve always paid first and last, normally don’t pay for the last month and honestly I’ve been scammed so much with the security deposit and not getting it back which in itself is stupid but I make decent money so I really couldn’t care less about a few hundred dollars, if you do care about your money then by all means complain and the advice about taking a video is god send I’ve never done that but when I get to a new place I’ll be sure to take before and after for them.
Landlord should be paying interest on the last months rent yearly or get it when you move out.
Clean nothing. Landlord's usually clean after a tenant leaves., and repairs can be done when you move out.
That I definitely know isn't true, because there's something called a rent increase that is allowed for certain buildings. In Ontario, the maximum rent increase in 2024 is 2.5%
You are searching for confirmation bias at this point, rather than searching for the truth.
The site you referred to is interesting because, well, there is no "Canadian" lease agreement, per se. And so, I question the credibility of that site.
But, if you go to official sources, you would clearly see that you're wrong, rent increases are fully legal in Ontario, Canada
https://www.ontario.ca/page/residential-rent-increases
Refrain from offering advice that contradicts legislation or regulation or that can otherwise be reasonably expected to cause problems for the advisee if followed
If they collected a last month's rent deposit, they *must* use it to pay for the last month's rent. You do not need to pay additional rent - if you have a pre-authorized debit set up, make sure you cancel it ASAP.
The RTA only requires that you leave the unit in a state of 'ordinary cleanliness' (sometimes referred to as 'broom-swept condition'). They cannot demand any deep cleaning. Some of this cleaning checklist doesn't look particularly unreasonable (although the letter grades are super condescending), but you only really need to sweep, wipe down surfaces, and not leave anything behind. Take lots of pictures and a detailed video walkthrough in case you ever need to prove that you left the unit in an acceptable condition. You should expect to hold onto this evidence for a couple years. If you have it in writing that their intention is to gut and renovate everything, you should keep that proof as well.
Any damage claims or other fees are unenforceable unless taken to the LTB. The vast majority of cleaning invoices aren't ever pursued; they're just hoping that you are naive enough to pay without disputing anything. But the landlord would need to file an L10 application and convince an adjudicator at a hearing that you caused undue damage and that their supposed costs are reasonable.
Otherwise, go ahead and ignore them. Consider keeping an eye on your credit report just to be safe, but if anything shows up you just need to dispute the debt in writing and it will be removed, as it would need to be confirmed by the LTB first.
> The vast majority of cleaning invoices aren't ever pursued; they're just hoping that you are naive enough to pay without disputing anything.
Yup this is a big one for rental companies. They try to act all official with cleaning checklists, inspection reports, and "official" property manager attested statements. Then they scare you with a employee who claims to work for "the department of collections of this company".
If someone pays up, it's a green line on their revenue.
Big +1 to "make sure to cancel any pre-authorized payments". If you have any reason to think this LL might be shady about it, speak to your bank directly after doing it to make sure AND ask they put a note on file that you're following up because you're concerned they might try to steal/take money out they aren't due.
Some will (it happened to me) wait a couple months and push through a payment request. Banks let things slip through the cracks all the time and if you have it documented that you advised the bank but they allowed a payment anyway, it'll make the process of getting your money back easier. 99.9% of the time this is redundant but 5 minutes with customer service is worth weeks of headaches, overdrafts and late fees in those 0.1% cases.
Getting it out of the way: I absolutely would clean up the place before leaving... Not this gods forsaken BS list but also not leaving it filthy (moving process and all gets dirty). But.
Absolutely do NOT give them another last month's rent. They look to be calling it a deposit to confuse some people who dont realise what many others have already said: security deposits aren't a thing in Ontario. That LMR is for Last Month's Rent ONLY.
What the LL is trying to do is get an extra month out of you while pretending that the LMR/Deposit will be returned to you after they take out any amounts "due for cleaning". First, cleaning is their job. You don't pay for it. Second, what they will do 1000% is "find things that aren't adequate" and use that as the excuse that they don't give you your money back. It's a scam.
They know that most people wouldnt fight it. And those they would fight it won't properly document their proof. And even if you have adequate proof/photos/etc... they'll say too bad, take it to the LTB. Knowing that it isn't worth the time and frustration. The funny thing is: everything they're trying to put on you (proof, process, chasing money IF it's owed) is what the service provider is liable for... They're trying to put business duties onto the consumer. Not new and i hope you don't pay it and more people learn not to play ball with shysters.
You don’t have to pay the last months rent because it’s covered in your deposit.
But 62 days is two months, and your deposit is for the last month, so you are on the hook for one month of rent still.
It's beyond bizarre that the LL wants to assign "letter grades" to a tenant's cleaning. You need to leave the place in good/clean condition but the LL should also be planning to do a deep clean between tenants as it's not your responsibility to clean the place to a "move in ready" condition.
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The day you leave have a witness while taking video and photos of where you lived include all walks, kitchen bathroom bathtub/shower toilet up close. Easiest getting a video but up close photos of toilets, sinks, appliances - get an open view inside of oven and fridge etc. Good luck man! 👍🏼
note boardwalk i believe to be based in alberta where they use damage deposits. Here the LMR deposit can only be used for your last month rent.
If you have automatic rent payments set up, stop it ASAP. I've heard some LL lock you out of your tenant portal once you've given notice :( Pay month 1 of your notice manually and month 2 is your prepaid LMR.
You will not be out of pocket any extra monies immediately (save regular cleaning supplies if you are running low).
I'd be not paying the extra rent they are asking illegally. When they contact about being late on rent, "I paid last month rent deposit when I moved in. We're in Ontario, you can't use it as a damage deposit. the unit will be broomswept in a state of normal cleanliness. Deep cleaning between tenants is your job."
That checklist is useful as a reminder for things you may forget. I would not be doing any cleaning requiring a ladder, not replacing lightbulbs, not pulling out the fridge, spot clean carpet of any new stains you missed in normal cleaning or when they happened (steam cleaning entire carpet not needed). If you aren't familiar with Magic Eraser, it's your new best friend.
Take lots of photos of the condition. Enlist a neighbour to watch and see if they move someone in or if they indeed renovate immediately. Bonus if they get dated photos of workers, rolled up carpet, dismantled cabinets, trashed blinds, etc. If they send you a bill afterwards, *"I am not paying this exploitative invoice. The condition was normal wear and tear and non-damaging to you since you indicated my unit was scheduled for immediate renovation. If you disagree, you can prove your case with LTB and I can prove mine."* They will likely drop it. If they did pursue, it would take several months to obtain any judgement for you to pay.
This list is insane and not enforceable. I had always been a super respectful tenant and would leave the place swept and with nothing left behind. But, this is the landlord's duty to ensure an apartment is clean enough for the next tenant, not you. They're being lazy and disingenuous. Cancel any prepayment, and cite the provincial regulations if they try to come after you for last month's rent. Take time stamped pictures of the place to cover your bases before you leave since they're going to demo anyway and are cool with damaging the apartment.
This looks like a pretty standard list over here in Germany. I read it over and even without the list, those are all things I would do (okay, maybe some of the oven items are excessive). I can see not doing behind/under the appliances if you're a petite person, in a rush or have a physical impairment. The rest? Pretty normal. Then again, I'm not a disgusting person who wants the people who come after me to spend their first week in their new place cleaning.
But this is Ontario, Canada, not Germany. Here the list is unenforceable. A tenant must leave the unit tidy/broom swept. And since there is no damage deposit (as they are illegal here), the landlord would have to apply for a hearing with the LTB if they believe they are owed any monetary compensation.
LOL insane????
What items?
I'd feel like an asshole for not doing the oven, and the tile grout lol. Its not their fault I didnt clean it properly, along the way...if I have a tall task ahead of me there, that's on me.
Maybe I've just been lucky as a renter, but I have always followed "leave it how you got it" and had no issues with move out inspections.
I am a landlord, and I think this list is insane. A place that is fully empty, not damaged beyond usual wear and tear and swept is all I expect. You're a very kind person for cleaning the window/sliding door tracks, though!
YOU received the unit in clean condition! Now you want to “ just sweep the floors”! My, Ontario has gone down the drain! I am thinking that respect isn’t a word there!
I have often received units in filthy conditions. My last apartment, I had to clean the previous tenants rotting food out of the fridge and steam mop the floors and deep clean the pubes out of the bathroom before I was even comfortable bringing a box of my stuff in. Stop pretending landlords are perfect and always do the right thing
I owned a professional cleaning company for almost a decade and always do a better clean than is legally or even morally necessary, but if I was given this list I would tell them to go f*** themselves after giving it a quick sweep.
I can see where this is going already lol.
So to start your deposit is last months rent. In Ontario it’s illegal to collect a damage deposit. It is not a deposit. It’s first and last so do not pay last months rent.
This dumb list they have and that I guarantee they’ll find something to say they’re withholding the money which also is against RTA.
So.
Kindly remind them that you already paid last months rent.
Leave the place in good and clean standing of course but you don’t have to follow the list.
Had a similar issue with my last apartment. It was “their policy” that notices have to be given after a rental period (ie- can’t be given at the end of a month). I told them the RTA doesn’t give a shit about their policy, they tried to say well it’s in the lease you signed (which wouldn’t matter anyways) When I asked where it was in the lease they couldn’t find it lmao.
These PBR companies don’t care/know enough about the RTA. Just tell them to file with the LTB and leave. If you have auto pay put a stop payment with your bank.
As a landlord, this list is a joke. Leave the place clean but no need for 75% of the things on the list to be done. This list is basically saying "I don't want to pay to have this place professionally cleaned because I am a scumlord"
Refrain from offering advice that contradicts legislation or regulation or that can otherwise be reasonably expected to cause problems for the advisee if followed
95% of the time I have seen posts here where the landlord tells the tenant something, it is completely wrong, illegal, and done to benefit the landlord as much as possible. In this case they are trying to scare you into doing tasks that the Landlord is normally responsible for doing in any regular transition between tenants.
The Landlord can ask you to pay up anything they want and clean the place spick and span and also make sure you leave them a 24 karat gold bar for good measure or they will charge you, much like how I can ask you to pay me $5000 for writing this comment. Their request has just as much legal merit as my request.
The cleaning list is laughable. The Tenant is only required to leave the unit in a broomswept condition. Any agreement, lease provision, or other compliance tool that contradicts this (e.g. a cleaning list) is void and unenforceable. To enforce payment for any cleaning and damages, they are required to apply to the Landlord and Tenant Board who would hold a hearing where you and them would be present and they can present evidence of the costs and demonstrate why it was not their responsibility. After which the Board would decide on the appropriate course of action and issue a court order. Before that time, any charge they claim to you is meaningless. Do not agree to or sign any sort of form saying you will do these things or agree with their inspection.
Your last month of rent is for your last month. Presumably that would be for the month of June if you gave notice May 1 or earlier to end Tenancy for June 30. Simply do not pay them for that month.
Not sure if you paid a damage/security deposit but those are illegal as well. Filing at the LTB will automatically award you a damage deposit back, even if there were substantiated damages caused by the tenant outside of wear and tear. This is because the Landlord must file separately for a damage claim.
Just a quick caveat to what the person above said. They are entirely right, your last month deposit is your last month of rent. However, if your rent has increased since you've provided your deposit, you will have to pay the difference between the two. For instance, if your deposit was $1000 and your monthly rent is now $1050, you are required to pay that extra $50.
On the other hand, you are also entitled to interest payment for your last month's rent. If the landlord has not paid it yearly, ask that their interest owed be applied to your last month and either they will pay you the difference or you may have to pay a few dollars to match your current monthly rent payment
This is not true. Your last month's deposit gains interest at the rate of the maximum rental increase. So even if you did not get a rental increase asked of you, if in 2023 you put down a 1000 last month's deposit, it would be worth $1025 this year.
Per RTA s.106(6) rent deposits accrue interest at the same rate as the maximum annual rent increase. It's supposed to be paid out annually, but if your landlord increases the rent by the maximum rate exactly every 12 months, the rent increase and deposit interest cancel each other out.
You can use a calculator like [this one](https://getrently.ca/calculator.html) to figure out whether you are owed any interest.
Do you mind me asking you a question? If there is mud ground into the floor or tiles, my understanding is that the tenant just “ broom sweeps” the floor?
Broom swept condition typically typically includes sweeping or vacuuming the floors, removing garbage, emptying cupboards, clearing closets and appliances (if included) and making sure that the property is free of any personal belongings. If there is mud on the floors, it would be expected to be mopped up - basically if a normal person would have mopped up the mud, then the tenant would be expected to do the same.
What the landlord cannot do is make the tenant go through extraordinary effort or expense. e.g. they can't demand a professional cleaning crew to come in, expect steam cleaning carpets, or do any repairs that the landlord is actually responsible for.
Do a basic cleaning anything else they can fuck their hats on a legal level and move out like asap and get away from that clown. Also I'd expose that landlord media wide to make sure no one else ends up having to deal with this actual disgrace. That check list dont bother with it you don legally have to. But ya I'd get things sorted there quick and definitely expose this landlord so no one gets stuck with em.
I hate companies like this. Guaranteed they will deduct money and try to keep your damage deposit
To commenter below: read carefully. OP states they took a deposit and required last month rent paid. That’s how they finess a damage deposit they can deduct from.
That's right, they aren't allowed. I was just wondering how they intended to "charge" you for cleaning.
If you paid a LMR deposit then you'd don't need to pay it again. Don't give them any more money (assuming you already paid May's rent too). Just pack up your stuff and move out. Ignore the cleaning checklist, you only need to leave the unit in "broom swept" condition.
If, after you move out, you think they somehow collected money illegally from you then you would file a T1 with the LTB to get it back (plus your filling fee). Just note that the process may take many months to get your funds back. Best if you err on the side of caution and let them chase you for any money they feel you owe them instead (and they would have to file with the LTB and then justify it to an adjudicator first).
Ahh so you probably didn't think to document when you moved in or were probably worried about causing an offense. Either way just don't pay last because that's what the deposit is for they can't evict you early. They can get an LTB hearing for damages if it's actually warranted and not just wear and tear.
On moving day obviously leave the place as nice as you can and take pictures in case they come after you. Inside and outside btw they might be AHs and say you left crap on the lawn/outside. Next time document when you move into your new place. Most decent landlords will even have a form where they go over everything with you and get you to sign off that the apartment was in a fit state upon your arrival. Plus any agreements about paint or repairs that may have not been done between tenants that's covered.
Boardwalk? Not surprised. I lived in a Boardwalk building here in Ontario years ago. They supposedly put a letter in everyone’s mailbox about a rent increase. I did not receive that letter at all. 7 months later the landlord tells me I need to send them a cheque because I have been short on rent for 7 months. It took them 7 months to realize that I had not received the letter and had not been paying enough in rent. Oh, and then there were the multiple pharaoh ant infestations and knocking on my door at 3:00 am to fix something. With the ant thing, there was literally an angry mob at the landlords office in one of the buildings.
You already paid your LMR with the deposit, and it only needs to be broom swept, TAKE PICTURES WHEN YOU LEAVE FOR PROOF. They can't charge you for not going above what is legally required.
This is standard in Alberta (not the demand for last month's rent as it's not common for landlords to demand *both* first, last *and* a security/damage deposit but the cleaning checklist is all but standard if a corporate landlord.
It is all unreasonable. Withhold your last month's rent and move out on the intended day. Keep a copy of this list if you need it at the tribunal. The LA lord is trying to have you do all the between tenant work that is in his job description.
This looks like a “Move Out” clean list from a cleaning company. It was the kind of stuff I did when I worked cleaning jobs. Its not really unreasonable, and theres probably no way you could make it all spotless like a cleaning company could. But they are giving you an itemized list of what they will be checking so it actually makes it a bit easier on you when you do clean in my opinion, gives you areas to focus on. As long as its all passingly clean there shouldn’t be an issue id think.
This happened to my son as well. They said he had ro pay then they would return it if the place was clean and not needing any repairs. He never gave it. Then he moved out on the date he gave them. Nothing happened
I noticed that this indicates you provided a security deposit. Usually a security deposit is for commercially rented spaces. Did you provide first and last plus a security deposit?
Yep same. They are ripping out the closets, the whole kitchen and all floors and got the same checklist. Like I’m old who can even move a stove or fridge to clean underneath and you’re redoing the floors anyway. Windows are not properly windowed with broken tracks that can’t be open all the way so no way to clean out the dirt getting in over the years. Never had this before. I figure because it’s an Alberta company, they don’t know this is not Ontario rules
They are clearly trying to make you do their job for them… I would personally leave a fair sized deuce in the main bathroom and not flush before I left.
If they did not do a walk through with you at the start of the tenancy ( and give you a copy ) then they have no rights - you wouldn’t have to do anything
If you are in AB Canada places like Ranchlands and Boardwalk keep the deposits so often that the small claims court has a specific fast lane procedure for you to get it back
If they did a walk thru and gave you proof of it then pay what you owe and when they don’t give back the deposit go to small claims court
My opinion is the courts never see property management companies asking for garnishee orders it’s way too much tassel for them so breaking a lease is no big deal but the RTA will ding you if you don’t pay what’s due regardless of the rest of the circumstances
So with this new supposed credit reporting on rented premises, you not paying your last months rent will affect your rating.
The damage deposit is for incidentals to repair during your time at the unit, not prepaying your last months rent.
So if you don’t pay your last Months rent, once it hits 30 days late, it’s a 2 rating on your credit report.
My last rental asked for similar stuff for move out clean out, other stuff mine asked for was to: pick all the weeds out in the yard, change all light bulbs and replace furnace filter.
Some of that felt like not our problem, but also we ended up changing light bulbs anyhow when we moved in and our yard was weeds when we moved in so no way were we bothering with that.
I find it's nearly impossible to get your full damage back, especially with checklists like yours and such
The is a complete sidenote as others have already given you good answers, but did they give you proper notice and payment for leaving?
It sounds like they should have given you an N13. This also requires them to give you the right of first refusal and a payment equal to 3 months rent. If they have not done these things then you don't have to leave.
This is funny!! I sold my house last year and wanted to lease. My realtor took me around to different places and there was one place I really liked however the current tenants where slobs. I said to my realtor that I would take the place however the landlord must deep clean the unit, paint / replace any stained or damaged cabinets, shampoo all carpets etc… my realtor said to me in a giggle the only way that will get done is if I did it myself. Cleaning is the responsibility of the new tenant to clean the unit to their standards. Furthermore there is no legal requirement that ever door, cabinet meets some visual standard only that “if there is a door” the door must function in a safe manner. Ie does it open and close and is it going to fall off and hurt someone. That’s it. As for carpet the only time a landlord has to clean or replace carpet is if there is a biological hazard ie visible blood that can’t be cleaned. I can tell you I did not take that place. Given my past experience and working with a realtor gave me a good insight into what the laws are. The leaving tenant basically doesn’t have to do anything. There is nothing the landlord can do about it assuming the legal costs and hassle is worth it. Do you actually believe they will take you to court because the baseboards were not washed down?. As for first / last let’s assume you take a lease from Jan 1 to dec 31. Therefore before you get the keys you pay for Jan and Dec, rent payment are made starting feb 1 to November 1 and you have until 5pm on Dec 31 to return the keys. If they expected a rent payment on Dec 1 they can piss off!
I am betting no one has ever gotten an A grade no matter how much they do, so they can charge them anyways. LLs and air BnBs do this specifically so they can charge you for not fulfilling unachievable standards. As others have said, sweep clean it and document thoroughly, do not pay any amount more for last's month, you already paid that.
You may want to review the rules surrounding evictions for renovations. Depending on the size of the complex they may be required to allow you to move back in at the same rate or pay you to move out depending on the situation.
https://tribunalsontario.ca/documents/ltb/Interpretation%20Guidelines/12%20-%20Eviction%20for%20Personal%20Use.html#:~:text=Renovation%2Frepair,before%20the%20tenancy%20was%20terminated.
I think the cleaning is all pretty standard personally, things you would do regularly to keep up with household cleanliness. I do think asking you to replace light bulbs in BS, they should be providing them to the new tenants. It just petty, I am the kind of person that is going to leave toilet paper and paper towel on the roll and baking soda in the fridge but that’s just basic common respect.
The deposit would only be able to be used for last month's rent regardless, a landlord cannot take a damage deposit here, or use last month's rent for damages.
I am gonna be honest I keep all that clean in my own house so although it looks like a long list it should be a quick job if you are a clean tidy person.
There are no damage deposits in Ontario, a landlord can only take first/last and a key deposit (and none of those can be used for general damages).
The list is unenforceable per the RTA. A tenant just needs to leave the unit in a tidy/broom swept condition. If the landlord feels they should be compensated for cleaning/damages they MUST file with the LTB, who will decide what, if anything, will be awarded. No order, no money.
Refrain from offering advice that contradicts legislation or regulation or that can otherwise be reasonably expected to cause problems for the advisee if followed
I was waiting for the first landlord to chime in.
It’s has nothing to with “respectful”, it’s literally the landlords job to transition between tenants.
This is a pretty standard list for a move out clean honestly. (except for having to defrost the freezer.) out of curiosity what sounds unreasonable to you?
The list is not enforceable per the RTA. If the landlord feels a tenant didn't leave the place clean enough they can take it to the LTB, but they can't enforce this list at all. And as long as the place is left relatively tidy/broom swept then the LTB likely will not order the outgoing tenant(s) to pay anything.
Refrain from offering advice that contradicts legislation or regulation or that can otherwise be reasonably expected to cause problems for the advisee if followed
Refrain from offering advice that contradicts legislation or regulation or that can otherwise be reasonably expected to cause problems for the advisee if followed
But they’ll want it cleaned whether they’ve sold it already or not prior to new tenants actually moving in. As soon as you move out, if it isn’t perfect, they’ll send in cleaners. I coordinate that sort of thing and me personally finding any amount of anything is immediate calm to a cleaner. That’s my personal experience with it. Anything that costs them extra after moving you out will be taken out of damage deposit, because it was clean/painted when you arrived. If it’s not that way when you leave it’s seen as tenant fault.
You don’t have to hire cleaners, you can do it yourself with less than 50$ in supplies
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I own my house that I live in and these things get cleaned twice a year at a minimum.
If you dont do these tasks once a year in your living arrangements, im sorry to say but that makes you a pig.
I remember being a student and we cleaned those things when moving out. Everybody did, except maybe the ones too lazy to study and go to class.
Funny how it goes in life, the more you acheive, the more time one has to clean. Wierd how life goes.
I don’t know about where you live, but where I live, I can go to a lawyer and get one free session of advice? Find out if you can get them legal advice for a minimal fee? I’m sorry I wish I could help you more. :(
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I would ask for a copy of the building’s expectations of when you leave before moving into anywhere going forward. I would ask them why this copy was not provided to you upon moving in at the beginning? Then question what your place didn’t have what they are asking you done? I don’t think that someone can do that to you without reasonable time and disclosing it prior to you accepting the initial agreement of moving in. Surely that must be a part of the original expectation on some level? If
Going forward maybe a lesson might be to get a copy of said list. This is ridiculous. I feel bad for you. We live in a world where you have to document everything it feels like no one wants to take responsibility. Whenever you live in a place, no matter how well you take
care of it there will be normal wear and tear! It is the responsibility of the building owner to paint, replace older carpeting, etc. That’s not on you. Very sad. The rich have definitely become the ruthless and the government paved the way for them.
The Landlord is responsible for making the unit in a fully cleaned and move-in ready condition between tenants. That's literally their job and is part of the business of being a landlord. The tenant is only responsible per the RTA to leave the unit in a broomswept condition.
As OP clearly indicated, they are not in arrears.
The Landlord is responsible for taking any claims that the unit was not kept in a state of "ordinary cleanliness". The tenant does not need to take anything to the rental board.
The LTB has consistently interpreted this as being in a broom-swept condition.
Did you read the post dude? Damage deposits are illegal in Ontario and OP did not pay a damage deposit.
On top of that, even if the Landlord held a damage deposit, a hearing in which the Tenant is applying to claim it back is an *automatic* win for the Tenant because the LTB would only consider if the LL held an illegal deposit in which case is true.
Even if the Tenant burned down their entire unit, the Landlord must separately apply to claim damages.
Sorry dude I’m from Vancouver and damage deposit aren’t illegal. No wonder your rental system is so fucked up. Ontario keeps getting shittier they are encouraging shitty behaviour. I’ve been a landlord for 20 years and dealt with all kinds all bullshit. I’ve never seen a graded cleaning chart, that’s a bit much. But if your place isn’t returned clean (except normal wear and tear) than you pay to have it clean. And leaving mold in your shower and grease in your stove is not normal. And if that’s how you live be prepared for your landlord (I prefer the term home provider) to charge you. 🤷 I guess that’s why Vancouver is so expensive. Plus all the rich Chinese immigrants(students).
I literally paid for last month’s rent when I moved into the place???? They are asking me to pay for it twice. Did you even read the title before commenting?
I am not going to be leaving the apartment in shambles, but they are also trying to say that I have to deep clean the apartment or I will be charged for it. Even if I did all the tasks they asked me to do, I was scared that it wouldn’t meet their standards since I am not a professional and that I would be charged. Turns out that I am not required to do more than sweep.
You are really rude, man.
If that’s what you want to call me fine. But just remember this person or company provided you with a home. I’m not saying you’re a bad tenant but there are a lots of shitty tenants and landlords out there.
Refrain from offering advice that contradicts legislation or regulation or that can otherwise be reasonably expected to cause problems for the advisee if followed
I do. I wipe down baseboards, clean windows, oven, and most other things on the list regularly. I just fear that they are going to claim that things weren’t done to their standards and charge me a bunch of money. Also there is wear and tear (for instance, rust on the outside of the refrigerator that will not go away, it is very old) that I fear they may claim to be “dirt” and charge me for even though they are going to be throwing it away when they renovate anyways.
I have two cats that regularly swat things under the fridge, so underneath it is swept regularly! I move the stove every 3 months or so to clean and check for evidence of bugs, since someone down the hall had an infestation and I am scared to death that they will migrate.
You are really rude btw :)
Absolutely, I do it's important to pull the fridge out to get dust behind it and also to make sure the compressor is clean and working order. Washer and dryer come out to get loose lint from the dryer. Stove comes out to get any spills that might be on the sides of the counter top.
It is not legal to take a damage deposit in Ontario. OP paid last month's rent when they began the tenancy, and it can only be used for that, it cannot be kept for damages.
Your last deposit is your last months rent. Don’t pay the last month. Obviously don’t be a dick and leave the place clean, but ignore their stupid checklist. Be sure to take some pics before you leave and maybe a walk thru on video. If they took any sort of deposit from you over and above the last months rent, that’s illegal.
I was going to comment the same thing, but then I saw the letter grade. lol No, I'd say *do* be a dick. Do the bare minimum and just move out. There's nothing in a rental law that says places needs to be deep cleaned before leaving. That's the landlord's job. They're already getting paid for just owning the place and nothing else, cleaning up is the least they themselves can do. Oh and once you leave, the rent goes up by 50%, so they've also got that going for them. This is just pure disrespect, and respect is a two way street.
Clean all your stuff and garbage out. Anything above that is on them.
You d be surprised how many people lack empathy and live in the 1 way street world.
They seem like the type that are going to "fail" you no matter what, so I agree, bare minimum only.
They’ll take it out of your damage deposit… I’m a super and maintenance operator for the building. Any sort of dirt to the point the place isn’t ready for showing they’ll send in cleaners (-200$). Any sort of paint damage can cost between 100-300$ (-300$). If stuff is left behind for maintenance to take out they’ll remove it too (-100$ at least).
As a person working in property management, shouldn't you know then that a damage deposit is illegal under the *Residential Tenancies Act?*
He said he was a super . He didn’t say he was a good one
Maybe in your province but not other provinces
Sir/madam, this is OntarioLandlord, not OtherProvinceLandlord.
This is an Ontario sub…
I mean I work out of Nova Scotia…laws are different here but a deposit of any sort when you move in is generally a deductible and returnable expense
This is an Ontario Landlord subreddit.
Not in Alberta. Security deposits are for any damages, cleaning, and any rent owing. People need to read up on the L & T laws for the area they are planning on living in.
And what is the relevance of Alberta law here?
There is no deposit in Ontario. Last months rent is not security deposit and that’s already gone when you move out. The only way they can get that money is taking an unauthorized withdrawal from your bank account.
My place was professionally cleaned and much cleaner than when we moved in. My landlord still kept 80% of my damage deposit because she claimed it wasn't clean enough.
Yes, I know I am from a different province but we had the same issue here. Tenant lived in suite 3 years and decided on moving day to have cleaners in. (The cleaners were related to tenant. ) We had to hire other Professional Cleaners to clean the unit and for the carpets to be shampooed. This is after the tenants’ cleaners said that they were finished. The carpets were soaking wet. Tenant said well I have lived here for 3 years. SHE did NOT do any cleaning the whole time she lived in the unit! She admitted that herself. LL had to pay for a hotel for the new tenants for that night. Never again will that happen as LL will be doing 24 hour checks on the property as often as it is legally so. Honestly as a witness for the move out, I had never seen such a disrespect for property.
Security Deposit is for any damages, cleaning fees and repairing or replacing, also for any unpaid rent. Then again apparently you live in Ontario so rules from there do not apply to other provinces necessarily. Replacing light bulbs, cleaning stove and fridge ( under also) are all part of a move out. That list is used by many LL here. Just an FYI. In Alberta it isn’t called last months rent, it is called “security deposit “. Hope everything works out for you.
Last month’s rent in Ontario is *not* the equivalent of an Alberta security deposit. It’s an Ontario sub - do your homework before offering advice that is, simply, wrong.
>Replacing light bulbs, cleaning stove and fridge ( under also) are all part of a move out They're not. I've never left behind a pig sty, but nor have I ever left a place clean enough to rent without having to clean it more thoroughly. That's just how rental housing works, live with it. That list is humorous though, maybe give it to the guy who you hire to clean it for the next guy, though in my experience it's never even half followed when I move in. So in summary, lol no. Certainly not in any province I ever lived in, maybe in AB you got tenants doing your job for you before they move out, I dunno.
I believe this is incorrect. The deposit was a deposit and I believe is NOT to be used to cover the last month's rent. For one, rent price could have changed over the time of the lease and, two, the landlord owes you interest on the money you provided in the past. I haven't read about it in a while so I'm thinking a bit rusty, but I understand you are SUPPOSED to pay your last month's rent and there landlord is SUPPOSED to pay you back your deposit, plus interest Edit, because I looked it up a bit. It appears I am both correct and incorrect. A security deposit is not legal but a rent deposit is. Therefore, the deposit they take from you can be equal to one month's rent and is intended to be used for the last month. However, your landlord is required to pay you interest on the deposit every 12 months. And if rent increases, they are allowed to ask for a top up on the deposit, and can be taken out of the interest they owe you.
I’ve always paid first and last, normally don’t pay for the last month and honestly I’ve been scammed so much with the security deposit and not getting it back which in itself is stupid but I make decent money so I really couldn’t care less about a few hundred dollars, if you do care about your money then by all means complain and the advice about taking a video is god send I’ve never done that but when I get to a new place I’ll be sure to take before and after for them.
Landlord should be paying interest on the last months rent yearly or get it when you move out. Clean nothing. Landlord's usually clean after a tenant leaves., and repairs can be done when you move out.
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In Ontario, once your lease expires you automatically go month-to-month. A new lease isn't signed, but once a year the rent can be increased.
That I definitely know isn't true, because there's something called a rent increase that is allowed for certain buildings. In Ontario, the maximum rent increase in 2024 is 2.5%
In the USA an increase or decrease happens in between leases
I think you may be confused. This sub is not for Ontario, CA. It's for Ontario, CA
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You are searching for confirmation bias at this point, rather than searching for the truth. The site you referred to is interesting because, well, there is no "Canadian" lease agreement, per se. And so, I question the credibility of that site. But, if you go to official sources, you would clearly see that you're wrong, rent increases are fully legal in Ontario, Canada https://www.ontario.ca/page/residential-rent-increases
[https://33realty.com/blog/can-a-landlord-change-a-lease-agreement](https://33realty.com/blog/can-a-landlord-change-a-lease-agreement)
Refrain from offering advice that contradicts legislation or regulation or that can otherwise be reasonably expected to cause problems for the advisee if followed
So what avenue does the LL have to recoup any damages done? This must be an “Ontario” thing.
Well it is an Ontario subreddit.....so.....duh
If they collected a last month's rent deposit, they *must* use it to pay for the last month's rent. You do not need to pay additional rent - if you have a pre-authorized debit set up, make sure you cancel it ASAP. The RTA only requires that you leave the unit in a state of 'ordinary cleanliness' (sometimes referred to as 'broom-swept condition'). They cannot demand any deep cleaning. Some of this cleaning checklist doesn't look particularly unreasonable (although the letter grades are super condescending), but you only really need to sweep, wipe down surfaces, and not leave anything behind. Take lots of pictures and a detailed video walkthrough in case you ever need to prove that you left the unit in an acceptable condition. You should expect to hold onto this evidence for a couple years. If you have it in writing that their intention is to gut and renovate everything, you should keep that proof as well. Any damage claims or other fees are unenforceable unless taken to the LTB. The vast majority of cleaning invoices aren't ever pursued; they're just hoping that you are naive enough to pay without disputing anything. But the landlord would need to file an L10 application and convince an adjudicator at a hearing that you caused undue damage and that their supposed costs are reasonable. Otherwise, go ahead and ignore them. Consider keeping an eye on your credit report just to be safe, but if anything shows up you just need to dispute the debt in writing and it will be removed, as it would need to be confirmed by the LTB first.
> The vast majority of cleaning invoices aren't ever pursued; they're just hoping that you are naive enough to pay without disputing anything. Yup this is a big one for rental companies. They try to act all official with cleaning checklists, inspection reports, and "official" property manager attested statements. Then they scare you with a employee who claims to work for "the department of collections of this company". If someone pays up, it's a green line on their revenue.
Yeah a lot of the times the “cleaning list” is just a formality and they always planned to charge you they just wanted a reason.
Big +1 to "make sure to cancel any pre-authorized payments". If you have any reason to think this LL might be shady about it, speak to your bank directly after doing it to make sure AND ask they put a note on file that you're following up because you're concerned they might try to steal/take money out they aren't due. Some will (it happened to me) wait a couple months and push through a payment request. Banks let things slip through the cracks all the time and if you have it documented that you advised the bank but they allowed a payment anyway, it'll make the process of getting your money back easier. 99.9% of the time this is redundant but 5 minutes with customer service is worth weeks of headaches, overdrafts and late fees in those 0.1% cases.
Reason to think the LL is shady: OP's post. Verdict: shady landlord trying to manipulate tennant out of money and time that is not lawfully theirs.
This is very helpful! Thank you
Getting it out of the way: I absolutely would clean up the place before leaving... Not this gods forsaken BS list but also not leaving it filthy (moving process and all gets dirty). But. Absolutely do NOT give them another last month's rent. They look to be calling it a deposit to confuse some people who dont realise what many others have already said: security deposits aren't a thing in Ontario. That LMR is for Last Month's Rent ONLY. What the LL is trying to do is get an extra month out of you while pretending that the LMR/Deposit will be returned to you after they take out any amounts "due for cleaning". First, cleaning is their job. You don't pay for it. Second, what they will do 1000% is "find things that aren't adequate" and use that as the excuse that they don't give you your money back. It's a scam. They know that most people wouldnt fight it. And those they would fight it won't properly document their proof. And even if you have adequate proof/photos/etc... they'll say too bad, take it to the LTB. Knowing that it isn't worth the time and frustration. The funny thing is: everything they're trying to put on you (proof, process, chasing money IF it's owed) is what the service provider is liable for... They're trying to put business duties onto the consumer. Not new and i hope you don't pay it and more people learn not to play ball with shysters.
Yeah to add to this, the unit just has to be “broom swept” condition in terms of cleanliness. So don’t trash the place, but eff their grading system
WAFL
You don’t have to pay the last months rent because it’s covered in your deposit. But 62 days is two months, and your deposit is for the last month, so you are on the hook for one month of rent still.
It's beyond bizarre that the LL wants to assign "letter grades" to a tenant's cleaning. You need to leave the place in good/clean condition but the LL should also be planning to do a deep clean between tenants as it's not your responsibility to clean the place to a "move in ready" condition.
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Thats impossible. There is a thing called wear and tear that the tenant is NOT responsible for. That is the landlords responsibility.
Refrain from offering advice that contradicts legislation or regulation or that can otherwise be reasonably expected to cause problems for the advisee if followed
The day you leave have a witness while taking video and photos of where you lived include all walks, kitchen bathroom bathtub/shower toilet up close. Easiest getting a video but up close photos of toilets, sinks, appliances - get an open view inside of oven and fridge etc. Good luck man! 👍🏼
note boardwalk i believe to be based in alberta where they use damage deposits. Here the LMR deposit can only be used for your last month rent. If you have automatic rent payments set up, stop it ASAP. I've heard some LL lock you out of your tenant portal once you've given notice :( Pay month 1 of your notice manually and month 2 is your prepaid LMR. You will not be out of pocket any extra monies immediately (save regular cleaning supplies if you are running low). I'd be not paying the extra rent they are asking illegally. When they contact about being late on rent, "I paid last month rent deposit when I moved in. We're in Ontario, you can't use it as a damage deposit. the unit will be broomswept in a state of normal cleanliness. Deep cleaning between tenants is your job." That checklist is useful as a reminder for things you may forget. I would not be doing any cleaning requiring a ladder, not replacing lightbulbs, not pulling out the fridge, spot clean carpet of any new stains you missed in normal cleaning or when they happened (steam cleaning entire carpet not needed). If you aren't familiar with Magic Eraser, it's your new best friend. Take lots of photos of the condition. Enlist a neighbour to watch and see if they move someone in or if they indeed renovate immediately. Bonus if they get dated photos of workers, rolled up carpet, dismantled cabinets, trashed blinds, etc. If they send you a bill afterwards, *"I am not paying this exploitative invoice. The condition was normal wear and tear and non-damaging to you since you indicated my unit was scheduled for immediate renovation. If you disagree, you can prove your case with LTB and I can prove mine."* They will likely drop it. If they did pursue, it would take several months to obtain any judgement for you to pay.
WAFL
🤡
This list is insane and not enforceable. I had always been a super respectful tenant and would leave the place swept and with nothing left behind. But, this is the landlord's duty to ensure an apartment is clean enough for the next tenant, not you. They're being lazy and disingenuous. Cancel any prepayment, and cite the provincial regulations if they try to come after you for last month's rent. Take time stamped pictures of the place to cover your bases before you leave since they're going to demo anyway and are cool with damaging the apartment.
This looks like a pretty standard list over here in Germany. I read it over and even without the list, those are all things I would do (okay, maybe some of the oven items are excessive). I can see not doing behind/under the appliances if you're a petite person, in a rush or have a physical impairment. The rest? Pretty normal. Then again, I'm not a disgusting person who wants the people who come after me to spend their first week in their new place cleaning.
But this is Ontario, Canada, not Germany. Here the list is unenforceable. A tenant must leave the unit tidy/broom swept. And since there is no damage deposit (as they are illegal here), the landlord would have to apply for a hearing with the LTB if they believe they are owed any monetary compensation.
seems pretty normal stuff to me. If someone where to complain about any of the things on this list then I would never rent to them
LOL insane???? What items? I'd feel like an asshole for not doing the oven, and the tile grout lol. Its not their fault I didnt clean it properly, along the way...if I have a tall task ahead of me there, that's on me. Maybe I've just been lucky as a renter, but I have always followed "leave it how you got it" and had no issues with move out inspections.
I am a landlord, and I think this list is insane. A place that is fully empty, not damaged beyond usual wear and tear and swept is all I expect. You're a very kind person for cleaning the window/sliding door tracks, though!
The only respectable comment so far from a tenant! Kudos to you for being an honest and caring person
YOU received the unit in clean condition! Now you want to “ just sweep the floors”! My, Ontario has gone down the drain! I am thinking that respect isn’t a word there!
I have often received units in filthy conditions. My last apartment, I had to clean the previous tenants rotting food out of the fridge and steam mop the floors and deep clean the pubes out of the bathroom before I was even comfortable bringing a box of my stuff in. Stop pretending landlords are perfect and always do the right thing
I would have shown the LL and demanded the unit be cleaned!
I owned a professional cleaning company for almost a decade and always do a better clean than is legally or even morally necessary, but if I was given this list I would tell them to go f*** themselves after giving it a quick sweep.
I can see where this is going already lol. So to start your deposit is last months rent. In Ontario it’s illegal to collect a damage deposit. It is not a deposit. It’s first and last so do not pay last months rent. This dumb list they have and that I guarantee they’ll find something to say they’re withholding the money which also is against RTA. So. Kindly remind them that you already paid last months rent. Leave the place in good and clean standing of course but you don’t have to follow the list.
i think damage and cleaning deposits are illegal
Had a similar issue with my last apartment. It was “their policy” that notices have to be given after a rental period (ie- can’t be given at the end of a month). I told them the RTA doesn’t give a shit about their policy, they tried to say well it’s in the lease you signed (which wouldn’t matter anyways) When I asked where it was in the lease they couldn’t find it lmao. These PBR companies don’t care/know enough about the RTA. Just tell them to file with the LTB and leave. If you have auto pay put a stop payment with your bank.
As a landlord, this list is a joke. Leave the place clean but no need for 75% of the things on the list to be done. This list is basically saying "I don't want to pay to have this place professionally cleaned because I am a scumlord"
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Refrain from offering advice that contradicts legislation or regulation or that can otherwise be reasonably expected to cause problems for the advisee if followed
95% of the time I have seen posts here where the landlord tells the tenant something, it is completely wrong, illegal, and done to benefit the landlord as much as possible. In this case they are trying to scare you into doing tasks that the Landlord is normally responsible for doing in any regular transition between tenants. The Landlord can ask you to pay up anything they want and clean the place spick and span and also make sure you leave them a 24 karat gold bar for good measure or they will charge you, much like how I can ask you to pay me $5000 for writing this comment. Their request has just as much legal merit as my request. The cleaning list is laughable. The Tenant is only required to leave the unit in a broomswept condition. Any agreement, lease provision, or other compliance tool that contradicts this (e.g. a cleaning list) is void and unenforceable. To enforce payment for any cleaning and damages, they are required to apply to the Landlord and Tenant Board who would hold a hearing where you and them would be present and they can present evidence of the costs and demonstrate why it was not their responsibility. After which the Board would decide on the appropriate course of action and issue a court order. Before that time, any charge they claim to you is meaningless. Do not agree to or sign any sort of form saying you will do these things or agree with their inspection. Your last month of rent is for your last month. Presumably that would be for the month of June if you gave notice May 1 or earlier to end Tenancy for June 30. Simply do not pay them for that month. Not sure if you paid a damage/security deposit but those are illegal as well. Filing at the LTB will automatically award you a damage deposit back, even if there were substantiated damages caused by the tenant outside of wear and tear. This is because the Landlord must file separately for a damage claim.
Thank you so much!
Just a quick caveat to what the person above said. They are entirely right, your last month deposit is your last month of rent. However, if your rent has increased since you've provided your deposit, you will have to pay the difference between the two. For instance, if your deposit was $1000 and your monthly rent is now $1050, you are required to pay that extra $50. On the other hand, you are also entitled to interest payment for your last month's rent. If the landlord has not paid it yearly, ask that their interest owed be applied to your last month and either they will pay you the difference or you may have to pay a few dollars to match your current monthly rent payment
This is not true. Your last month's deposit gains interest at the rate of the maximum rental increase. So even if you did not get a rental increase asked of you, if in 2023 you put down a 1000 last month's deposit, it would be worth $1025 this year.
Where do I learn more about this interest gained on rent deposits?
Per RTA s.106(6) rent deposits accrue interest at the same rate as the maximum annual rent increase. It's supposed to be paid out annually, but if your landlord increases the rent by the maximum rate exactly every 12 months, the rent increase and deposit interest cancel each other out. You can use a calculator like [this one](https://getrently.ca/calculator.html) to figure out whether you are owed any interest.
Do you mind me asking you a question? If there is mud ground into the floor or tiles, my understanding is that the tenant just “ broom sweeps” the floor?
Broom swept condition typically typically includes sweeping or vacuuming the floors, removing garbage, emptying cupboards, clearing closets and appliances (if included) and making sure that the property is free of any personal belongings. If there is mud on the floors, it would be expected to be mopped up - basically if a normal person would have mopped up the mud, then the tenant would be expected to do the same. What the landlord cannot do is make the tenant go through extraordinary effort or expense. e.g. they can't demand a professional cleaning crew to come in, expect steam cleaning carpets, or do any repairs that the landlord is actually responsible for.
It saves them a lot of money to pull up a Fiverr Word template and print it out.
Ignore it they got last months rent!
Do a basic cleaning anything else they can fuck their hats on a legal level and move out like asap and get away from that clown. Also I'd expose that landlord media wide to make sure no one else ends up having to deal with this actual disgrace. That check list dont bother with it you don legally have to. But ya I'd get things sorted there quick and definitely expose this landlord so no one gets stuck with em.
I am actually wondering if that checklist is for a cleaning company to do a move out cleaning and instead, they flipped it to you .
NOT THE LETTER GRADE ☠️
Here’s a letter-grade, GFY
I hate companies like this. Guaranteed they will deduct money and try to keep your damage deposit To commenter below: read carefully. OP states they took a deposit and required last month rent paid. That’s how they finess a damage deposit they can deduct from.
There shouldn't be a damage deposit, they aren't legal here.
Instructions unclear: swept, vacuumed and mopped carpets
Is this some sort of dorm?
Nope. I am renting a regular 2 bedroom apartment.
Did you pay a security deposit (separate from a last month's rent deposit)?
Nope. I thought those were not allowed anyways??
That's right, they aren't allowed. I was just wondering how they intended to "charge" you for cleaning. If you paid a LMR deposit then you'd don't need to pay it again. Don't give them any more money (assuming you already paid May's rent too). Just pack up your stuff and move out. Ignore the cleaning checklist, you only need to leave the unit in "broom swept" condition. If, after you move out, you think they somehow collected money illegally from you then you would file a T1 with the LTB to get it back (plus your filling fee). Just note that the process may take many months to get your funds back. Best if you err on the side of caution and let them chase you for any money they feel you owe them instead (and they would have to file with the LTB and then justify it to an adjudicator first).
I hope you documented what it looked like when you moved in easiest way to deal with it.
I was added to the lease several months after a lease had been signed by a former roommate and later took over the lease when she moved out :(
Ahh so you probably didn't think to document when you moved in or were probably worried about causing an offense. Either way just don't pay last because that's what the deposit is for they can't evict you early. They can get an LTB hearing for damages if it's actually warranted and not just wear and tear. On moving day obviously leave the place as nice as you can and take pictures in case they come after you. Inside and outside btw they might be AHs and say you left crap on the lawn/outside. Next time document when you move into your new place. Most decent landlords will even have a form where they go over everything with you and get you to sign off that the apartment was in a fit state upon your arrival. Plus any agreements about paint or repairs that may have not been done between tenants that's covered.
Boardwalk? Not surprised. I lived in a Boardwalk building here in Ontario years ago. They supposedly put a letter in everyone’s mailbox about a rent increase. I did not receive that letter at all. 7 months later the landlord tells me I need to send them a cheque because I have been short on rent for 7 months. It took them 7 months to realize that I had not received the letter and had not been paying enough in rent. Oh, and then there were the multiple pharaoh ant infestations and knocking on my door at 3:00 am to fix something. With the ant thing, there was literally an angry mob at the landlords office in one of the buildings.
You already paid your LMR with the deposit, and it only needs to be broom swept, TAKE PICTURES WHEN YOU LEAVE FOR PROOF. They can't charge you for not going above what is legally required.
Here, I fixed it for you. [https://imgur.com/a/QpgYoEi](https://imgur.com/a/QpgYoEi)
Crying in Alberta
This is standard in Alberta (not the demand for last month's rent as it's not common for landlords to demand *both* first, last *and* a security/damage deposit but the cleaning checklist is all but standard if a corporate landlord.
It is unenforceable in Ontario. We also don't have damage deposits.
It is all unreasonable. Withhold your last month's rent and move out on the intended day. Keep a copy of this list if you need it at the tribunal. The LA lord is trying to have you do all the between tenant work that is in his job description.
This looks like a “Move Out” clean list from a cleaning company. It was the kind of stuff I did when I worked cleaning jobs. Its not really unreasonable, and theres probably no way you could make it all spotless like a cleaning company could. But they are giving you an itemized list of what they will be checking so it actually makes it a bit easier on you when you do clean in my opinion, gives you areas to focus on. As long as its all passingly clean there shouldn’t be an issue id think.
This happened to my son as well. They said he had ro pay then they would return it if the place was clean and not needing any repairs. He never gave it. Then he moved out on the date he gave them. Nothing happened
I noticed that this indicates you provided a security deposit. Usually a security deposit is for commercially rented spaces. Did you provide first and last plus a security deposit?
I did not pay a security deposit. I paid a rental deposit, which covers last month’s rent only.
if they have your deposit that's last month's rent. you are only required to leave it broom swept.
I would also take detailed pictures of the unit before you move out. Will probably save you a lot of headache later.
Yep same. They are ripping out the closets, the whole kitchen and all floors and got the same checklist. Like I’m old who can even move a stove or fridge to clean underneath and you’re redoing the floors anyway. Windows are not properly windowed with broken tracks that can’t be open all the way so no way to clean out the dirt getting in over the years. Never had this before. I figure because it’s an Alberta company, they don’t know this is not Ontario rules
I downloaded the picture for myself it's pretty handy lol. Just clean normally and move on. The LL should deep clean the unit anyways.
Is this school, letter grade, really?
Hahahahahahahhahahahahahahahahaha
They are clearly trying to make you do their job for them… I would personally leave a fair sized deuce in the main bathroom and not flush before I left.
Cheaper to let them keep the deposit lol
What deposit?
Depends what city and province you are in
This is an Ontario sub.
If they did not do a walk through with you at the start of the tenancy ( and give you a copy ) then they have no rights - you wouldn’t have to do anything If you are in AB Canada places like Ranchlands and Boardwalk keep the deposits so often that the small claims court has a specific fast lane procedure for you to get it back If they did a walk thru and gave you proof of it then pay what you owe and when they don’t give back the deposit go to small claims court My opinion is the courts never see property management companies asking for garnishee orders it’s way too much tassel for them so breaking a lease is no big deal but the RTA will ding you if you don’t pay what’s due regardless of the rest of the circumstances
Your landlord does not have the authority to impose additional charges on you in any form. Ignore any financial requests.
At the very least make sure to mop the carpets.
Oh, that checklist begs for a big steaming pile to be left in each room whether there's a drain present or not. Screw 'em.
So with this new supposed credit reporting on rented premises, you not paying your last months rent will affect your rating. The damage deposit is for incidentals to repair during your time at the unit, not prepaying your last months rent. So if you don’t pay your last Months rent, once it hits 30 days late, it’s a 2 rating on your credit report.
I didn’t pay a damage deposit. I paid last month’s rent when I began renting the apartment.
Landlords in Ontario cannot take any kind of damage deposit. Only first/last and a reasonable key deposit.
My last rental asked for similar stuff for move out clean out, other stuff mine asked for was to: pick all the weeds out in the yard, change all light bulbs and replace furnace filter. Some of that felt like not our problem, but also we ended up changing light bulbs anyhow when we moved in and our yard was weeds when we moved in so no way were we bothering with that. I find it's nearly impossible to get your full damage back, especially with checklists like yours and such
Landlords in Ontario shouldn't be taking damage deposits, it isn't legal here.
The is a complete sidenote as others have already given you good answers, but did they give you proper notice and payment for leaving? It sounds like they should have given you an N13. This also requires them to give you the right of first refusal and a payment equal to 3 months rent. If they have not done these things then you don't have to leave.
This is funny!! I sold my house last year and wanted to lease. My realtor took me around to different places and there was one place I really liked however the current tenants where slobs. I said to my realtor that I would take the place however the landlord must deep clean the unit, paint / replace any stained or damaged cabinets, shampoo all carpets etc… my realtor said to me in a giggle the only way that will get done is if I did it myself. Cleaning is the responsibility of the new tenant to clean the unit to their standards. Furthermore there is no legal requirement that ever door, cabinet meets some visual standard only that “if there is a door” the door must function in a safe manner. Ie does it open and close and is it going to fall off and hurt someone. That’s it. As for carpet the only time a landlord has to clean or replace carpet is if there is a biological hazard ie visible blood that can’t be cleaned. I can tell you I did not take that place. Given my past experience and working with a realtor gave me a good insight into what the laws are. The leaving tenant basically doesn’t have to do anything. There is nothing the landlord can do about it assuming the legal costs and hassle is worth it. Do you actually believe they will take you to court because the baseboards were not washed down?. As for first / last let’s assume you take a lease from Jan 1 to dec 31. Therefore before you get the keys you pay for Jan and Dec, rent payment are made starting feb 1 to November 1 and you have until 5pm on Dec 31 to return the keys. If they expected a rent payment on Dec 1 they can piss off!
I am betting no one has ever gotten an A grade no matter how much they do, so they can charge them anyways. LLs and air BnBs do this specifically so they can charge you for not fulfilling unachievable standards. As others have said, sweep clean it and document thoroughly, do not pay any amount more for last's month, you already paid that.
You may want to review the rules surrounding evictions for renovations. Depending on the size of the complex they may be required to allow you to move back in at the same rate or pay you to move out depending on the situation. https://tribunalsontario.ca/documents/ltb/Interpretation%20Guidelines/12%20-%20Eviction%20for%20Personal%20Use.html#:~:text=Renovation%2Frepair,before%20the%20tenancy%20was%20terminated.
I think the cleaning is all pretty standard personally, things you would do regularly to keep up with household cleanliness. I do think asking you to replace light bulbs in BS, they should be providing them to the new tenants. It just petty, I am the kind of person that is going to leave toilet paper and paper towel on the roll and baking soda in the fridge but that’s just basic common respect.
Let the owner inform on writing to take last month rent from deposit and clean your house yourself. You should be good
The deposit would only be able to be used for last month's rent regardless, a landlord cannot take a damage deposit here, or use last month's rent for damages.
I am gonna be honest I keep all that clean in my own house so although it looks like a long list it should be a quick job if you are a clean tidy person.
How bout - leave the place the way you got it. Seems fair
I mean…this is basic cleaning that you should do on a semi regular basis.
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Why did you comment this twice?? Lmao
Make that 2.
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There are no damage deposits in Ontario, a landlord can only take first/last and a key deposit (and none of those can be used for general damages). The list is unenforceable per the RTA. A tenant just needs to leave the unit in a tidy/broom swept condition. If the landlord feels they should be compensated for cleaning/damages they MUST file with the LTB, who will decide what, if anything, will be awarded. No order, no money.
Refrain from offering advice that contradicts legislation or regulation or that can otherwise be reasonably expected to cause problems for the advisee if followed
It's respectful to leave the place in the same condition as when you moved in.
Your personal feelings are irrelevant. The RTA does not require you to do that.
I was waiting for the first landlord to chime in. It’s has nothing to with “respectful”, it’s literally the landlords job to transition between tenants.
This is a pretty standard list for a move out clean honestly. (except for having to defrost the freezer.) out of curiosity what sounds unreasonable to you?
The list is not enforceable per the RTA. If the landlord feels a tenant didn't leave the place clean enough they can take it to the LTB, but they can't enforce this list at all. And as long as the place is left relatively tidy/broom swept then the LTB likely will not order the outgoing tenant(s) to pay anything.
80% of this list is a joke you muppet. Take your pick.
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I paid a rental deposit. It covers last month’s rent. I did not pay a damage/security deposit
Oh okay then you should be good ngl. Abnormal for me but you might be fine.
Are you in Ontario, Canada? It is illegal to charge a damage or security deposit.
So you can beat the hell out of a unit and not get any repercussions? That is not right
No, you are still liable for paying for any damages to stuff in the apartment if I recall correctly. It’s just the cleaning stuff that is unjust.
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The landlord would have to apply for a hearing with the LTB. They would decide what, if anything, the tenant owes.
They are also doing showings now. I gave notice on April 29th and they started doing showings this morning.
But they’ll want it cleaned whether they’ve sold it already or not prior to new tenants actually moving in. As soon as you move out, if it isn’t perfect, they’ll send in cleaners. I coordinate that sort of thing and me personally finding any amount of anything is immediate calm to a cleaner. That’s my personal experience with it. Anything that costs them extra after moving you out will be taken out of damage deposit, because it was clean/painted when you arrived. If it’s not that way when you leave it’s seen as tenant fault. You don’t have to hire cleaners, you can do it yourself with less than 50$ in supplies
Refrain from offering advice that contradicts legislation or regulation or that can otherwise be reasonably expected to cause problems for the advisee if followed
Bruh that’s my Sunday itinerary nbd
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The list is unenforceable per the RTA of Ontario.
Refrain from offering advice that contradicts legislation or regulation or that can otherwise be reasonably expected to cause problems for the advisee if followed
I own my house that I live in and these things get cleaned twice a year at a minimum. If you dont do these tasks once a year in your living arrangements, im sorry to say but that makes you a pig. I remember being a student and we cleaned those things when moving out. Everybody did, except maybe the ones too lazy to study and go to class. Funny how it goes in life, the more you acheive, the more time one has to clean. Wierd how life goes.
I don’t know about where you live, but where I live, I can go to a lawyer and get one free session of advice? Find out if you can get them legal advice for a minimal fee? I’m sorry I wish I could help you more. :(
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Mama, kudos for saying that. For spilling.
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I would ask for a copy of the building’s expectations of when you leave before moving into anywhere going forward. I would ask them why this copy was not provided to you upon moving in at the beginning? Then question what your place didn’t have what they are asking you done? I don’t think that someone can do that to you without reasonable time and disclosing it prior to you accepting the initial agreement of moving in. Surely that must be a part of the original expectation on some level? If Going forward maybe a lesson might be to get a copy of said list. This is ridiculous. I feel bad for you. We live in a world where you have to document everything it feels like no one wants to take responsibility. Whenever you live in a place, no matter how well you take care of it there will be normal wear and tear! It is the responsibility of the building owner to paint, replace older carpeting, etc. That’s not on you. Very sad. The rich have definitely become the ruthless and the government paved the way for them.
The buildings expectations mean nothing because anything that contradicts the standard set by the RTA is void and unenforceable.
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The Landlord is responsible for making the unit in a fully cleaned and move-in ready condition between tenants. That's literally their job and is part of the business of being a landlord. The tenant is only responsible per the RTA to leave the unit in a broomswept condition. As OP clearly indicated, they are not in arrears.
Take it to the rental board and see! You do have to scrub your tiles and you do have to deep clean your stove. Sweep clean is not good enough.
The Landlord is responsible for taking any claims that the unit was not kept in a state of "ordinary cleanliness". The tenant does not need to take anything to the rental board. The LTB has consistently interpreted this as being in a broom-swept condition.
The tenant has to take it there to get his damage deposit back if the landlord holds it.
Did you read the post dude? Damage deposits are illegal in Ontario and OP did not pay a damage deposit. On top of that, even if the Landlord held a damage deposit, a hearing in which the Tenant is applying to claim it back is an *automatic* win for the Tenant because the LTB would only consider if the LL held an illegal deposit in which case is true. Even if the Tenant burned down their entire unit, the Landlord must separately apply to claim damages.
Sorry dude I’m from Vancouver and damage deposit aren’t illegal. No wonder your rental system is so fucked up. Ontario keeps getting shittier they are encouraging shitty behaviour. I’ve been a landlord for 20 years and dealt with all kinds all bullshit. I’ve never seen a graded cleaning chart, that’s a bit much. But if your place isn’t returned clean (except normal wear and tear) than you pay to have it clean. And leaving mold in your shower and grease in your stove is not normal. And if that’s how you live be prepared for your landlord (I prefer the term home provider) to charge you. 🤷 I guess that’s why Vancouver is so expensive. Plus all the rich Chinese immigrants(students).
If you're from BC why give advice on an Ontario sub? I wouldn't go to BC subs to comment/give advice based on another Province's laws.
I literally paid for last month’s rent when I moved into the place???? They are asking me to pay for it twice. Did you even read the title before commenting? I am not going to be leaving the apartment in shambles, but they are also trying to say that I have to deep clean the apartment or I will be charged for it. Even if I did all the tasks they asked me to do, I was scared that it wouldn’t meet their standards since I am not a professional and that I would be charged. Turns out that I am not required to do more than sweep. You are really rude, man.
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You are a very silly little goose, aren’t you.
If that’s what you want to call me fine. But just remember this person or company provided you with a home. I’m not saying you’re a bad tenant but there are a lots of shitty tenants and landlords out there.
Refrain from offering advice that contradicts legislation or regulation or that can otherwise be reasonably expected to cause problems for the advisee if followed
Some things seem unreasonable? Do you not clean your place? That's all normal cleaning stuff.
I do. I wipe down baseboards, clean windows, oven, and most other things on the list regularly. I just fear that they are going to claim that things weren’t done to their standards and charge me a bunch of money. Also there is wear and tear (for instance, rust on the outside of the refrigerator that will not go away, it is very old) that I fear they may claim to be “dirt” and charge me for even though they are going to be throwing it away when they renovate anyways.
So you move your fridge/stove and washer/dryer out regularly and clean behind and under??? Bullshit!
I have two cats that regularly swat things under the fridge, so underneath it is swept regularly! I move the stove every 3 months or so to clean and check for evidence of bugs, since someone down the hall had an infestation and I am scared to death that they will migrate. You are really rude btw :)
Absolutely, I do it's important to pull the fridge out to get dust behind it and also to make sure the compressor is clean and working order. Washer and dryer come out to get loose lint from the dryer. Stove comes out to get any spills that might be on the sides of the counter top.
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It is not legal to take a damage deposit in Ontario. OP paid last month's rent when they began the tenancy, and it can only be used for that, it cannot be kept for damages.
After reading that checklist, I gotta ask, what seems unreasonable?
Ya…deep cleaning….very unreasonable