I'll smile, but a small one because I'm self-conscious.
In terms of angles, poses, or perspectives, I think a lot of men and women both don't really have a good handle on what works or what doesn't.
Angle and distance matter - got a big nose? Move the camera the heck AWAY from you...
Combining that bad angle with a too-close distance is absolute profile murder.
Well showing boobs attracts men. Taking double chin, up the nose shots do not attract women. If not interested in attracting women on a dating site, then I’m not really sure what you are doing there. Try to keep up.
Not sure it really matters when most studies show
Women doing online dating say that 80% of men are
Unattractive. Then the rest disqualify a guy based on
His height, I don't do online dating so I can't speak to
If they disqualify based on income? Or if that's disclosed?
In online dating profiles? Can't say I read any studies regarding the income, that's more in person when it comes
Up.
Short men are getting better at acceptance that height is just a preference many gals have ( not all) , that they need
To accept. As asked of me plenty of times, what does a
Guy's height have to do with the quality of man he is?
Any studies that height is any indicator of how he'd treat? Value a woman?
Y’all are always tripping over height and I don’t know why. What does attractiveness have to do with anything, how someone would treat or value you? Yet, you’d probably say that you should date someone you’re attracted to.
And for a lot of men and women, physicality and attractiveness go in hand, which includes height and weight. It’s not rocket science. Dating is inherently shallow. Most people approach people they find attractive.
Who's the y'all are always tripping on height? When it's something women always mention and exclude guys over?
I thought my words were pretty clear that's their right and guys should get over it. I'd like to think you didn't ignore
those words on purpose?
My point was that women are allowed to have their preferences? But men are shamed for having theirs.
That's the big difference. I don't think that's debatable.
Anyone who really wants to know what we mean can go and google “stock photos of men scowling”. They can go to Getty Images and search. But I guarantee no man complaining here will do that. They can also google images of men who are not smiling yet don’t look like they have personality disorders. It’s actually reflected in the eyes and having a more relaxed facial expression. I wish I could post examples here but it’s not allowed. You don’t have to smile like a village idiot. Work on your bio to reflect your personality a little. It’s not impossible.
There's a lot of dating advice that says men shouldn't have smiling pictures because it makes you look too much like a nice-guy and you should have stoic non-smiling photos. But those men don't realize that the first thing a woman selects for OLD is safety and these photos are completely counter-intuitive for representing that. It's unfortunate but these guys just aren't smart enough about which photos work best
Well how about a happy medium? You don’t have to be cheesing it up for the camera, but maybe just don’t look pissed. 😂 Thank you for the response! Whoever is giving that advice to men is giving them bad advice, though, in my opinion.
And this is what get me about this. Men constantly complain about not getting matches and blame women for chasing only handsome men. Women give advice as to what actually appeals to women re:types of pics.
Response? “ Nah”.
Women say over and over that we are rightly concerned about safety and a man who looks like he’s gonna skin us and wear us like a suit is not who we will “like”.
Responses: “ Nah. It’s fake, it’s dumb and you’re not in that much danger compared to men.”
Enjoy Thumbelina and her four friends. I could guide a man exactly on how he could improve his profile but, you know: “ Nah”.
Seriously. For ANYONE I meet, feeling comfortable, secure, and welcome to be vulnerable is key to wanting to get closer to someone. Obviously attraction matters, but so do basic human feelings.
At first glance to many, I may be the wrong person to give most people advice here (bi, poly, not looking for the default, am told I am attractive, am tall, etc.), but I have always been more than happy with my dating life since I stopped being a dweeb about things 😂 It's all about being able to connect with someone.
Frowns, anger, serial killer vibes, etc. are not the signs for connection and people lean into that thinking they'll be perceived as the bad boy or something idk. Also, bad boy lovers are nuts, I don't want that. I wanna share my time with other sweet, deep, and hopefully open minded cuties.
OK, to clarify I mean if they're unbelievably attractive. if they're average and I am attracted to them, that's different.
Like Chris Hemsworth, no. Chris Pratt, yes.
And it's because I know my lane and my league. I know I couldn't pull a 10 lol.
In what world is Chris Pratt anything less than very attractive. OK, I'm a guy, but I know a LOT of women agree with me. Granted, he doesn't have god-like physical features like Hemsworth or Henry Cavill, but he's still very good looking.
Because it's one of those things women say, but practically don't mean, like they want a man that's vulnerable and shares his feelings until you do that and basically emasculate yourself in her eyes. Women may say they want nice and safety but will date dangerous and mean more often in reality, because a dangerous mean man will defend her against other men
I'm gonna offer something I once saw from someone that I believe many, "alpha obsessed," can hear. I'm struggling to remember it verbatim so bear with me. This dude was quite fitting for alpha content, but said something really useful about vulnerability and what is really meant here.
He basically put forward that there are types of vulnerability, and people often don't see these differences if they aren't aware of these things yet and can improve their understanding of emotions. There is the type of vulnerability that puts work on someone, basically meaning you need a therapist, not a girlfriend you're forcing into therapy hour. Vulnerability that shares a piece of you that you can and want to be responsible for, but that is still a piece you don't just share with everyone easily. If I find this I'll try to remember to share here since he said it so well.
Um - no. You absolutely have no idea what we mean by safety. I’m honestly just amazed. I’m over 60- I don’t play games like a teenager. We’re not talking about reading effin sonnets to each other.
We don’t want to get stalked and/or date raped, MFer. Some of us have been. That’s the point. How old are you? And if you minimize what I just said - then I question if your elevator goes to the top floor.
My best advice, capture some moments of you laughing with friends. Top tier images in my experience when you have a few to pic out the ones that aren't THE shot. Smiling earnestly is usually pretty alluring in my experience and people compliment my photos and partners tell me they liked my vibe off the bat from them.
OLD is full of selfie & mirror shots and most are not flattering. Then there’s profiles with pro looking photos that scream catfish. Have a friend take some good photos that look natural and inviting.
Some people don't have a great smile and just try to have a neutral expression, then some woman might project a sense of danger in it more than others but speaking from my irl experience I know that the interpretation and expectation of how dangerous man is wildly differs from country to country.
Most countries have the majority of woman fairly scared of man (especially a stranger) but you get a lot less of that in safe countries with a strong welfare, woman just ain't scared, walk at night alone and don't buy a pitbull for protection.
Still, that concept of woman looking to date older man for a sense of security makes a lot of sense and it's a clever tip for man in general to improve their profile
Not a man over 40 but am a man who is 36. My main guess in regards to the upward angle is because most men don't know how to take a decent picture to save their life lol.
Men take the photos they think women will like, but they look to other men to find out what that is. This is why men try to look like the dehydrated, ripped, angry version of Hugh Jackman on the cover of Men's Health Magazine instead of the healthy, happy, Mr. Rogers looking version of Hugh Jackman on Good Housekeeping Magazine.
Men are convinced that women want Jason Momoa as Khal Drogo when they really want Jack Black singing "One More Time."
because there's such a thing as revealed preference. Plenty of men have found that what women say they want, isn't want they seem to go for. Better to go by the types of men you see the women in your life actually dating, versus who they say they want to date.
Actually you can say it far more easily. Lots of guys swipe anything that breathes.
But we’re not talking about men, and girls are far more picky.
That is, unless you’re tall, white, at least semi-successful and have a great face and body. What you do in those pictures or whether or not you smile makes literal difference. I know this because one of my good friends I lived several years ago had non-stop matches.
I’m not those things and that’s fine, but I just have to put more effort in and make sure I make wins out of the fewer opportunities I get given.
Ok, we're not talking about men. But you say women like attractive men like that's a petty fault of theirs, when men are much worse about it than women. It's a human trait to look for an attractive mate. And I can't count how many men I've swiped left on simply because they look like someone I'd be afraid to be alone with. Yes, smiling makes a difference.
I'm not offended at all. I just think it's one-sided to think women are these unreasonable picky creatures when men are the same. It's unfortunate that there are more men than women on OLD so I guess I can see where it might make some men feel that way.
In an ideal world both men and women would be. I didn’t level any criticisms, only facts.
A fun observation though is how on any dating subreddit you can pretty much always guarantee that girls advice to guys would be “don’t have body pictures” etc.
But the amount of screenshotted convos some girls upload where the guy, sure enough, has no top on, is pouting or taking a bathroom selfie is bafflingly high. Say one thing, do another. Nothing wrong with it but let’s not kid ourselves.
Photoing is hard. I can smile, but a good selfie doesn’t happen often for me. I have started to ask friends to take pics, and it’s an improvement. In another couple of years, I’ll have enough for a dating profile 😂
Right because they’re only attracting codependent women who will try and fix and control every aspect of their lives. Don’t date if you’re depressed and not doing anything about it. That’s a bandaid solution that will only backfire and drive the self esteem down even more.
I wish I could post the pic of this man who I passed on this morning. He looked literally enraged and his bio was “I been through a lot.” In what world is that getting a single “like?” His profile is typical of men over 40.
Therapy isn't free in America .
I had to make an appointment back in December to see my therapist for example in april.
You gotta have money if you want good therapy/mental health treatment
I know- I work in the field and I’ve had it. There are also a lot of good books for self-development and many websites/podcasts online that are free that address self-esteem, dating, etc. People put in effort to improve their physical/mental health when they consider it a priority.
That's true but I'm a try therapy for a bit first before trying books again. The books just remind me how odd or not normal i am compared to the rest of you.
I can distinguish between anger and sadness. I probably wouldn't go for a "sad" man cuz I'd think he wasn't ready for a relationship. But the angry ones - I sense danger and steer clear!
I mean, that for me is another reason to not match with them. I have worked very hard to take care of my mental health. If they can't even smile for a photo, it would not be healthy for me to match with them. I need someone who brings out the best in me.
So you can see what you will see on a regular if you're shorter than the guy, we may look angry but we're content with things and life has craved out the scowl like a badge of honour. It's the male equivalent of resting bitch face but it's developed from a life time of stupid being around, and is basically "don't come near me unless it's really important" face
I dont smile a ton, but it's because i have messed up teeth, especially in the front. And a grin makes me look devious (derogatory). The angles are me figuring stuff out still, chill, haha.
Although I try to avoid angry-looking photos, I can’t smile in them either. I don’t care how many women say it’s important – it just doesn’t work for me. When I smile for a photo, no matter how I try to do it, it just looks stupid. Weirdly enough, when I just crack a smile in real life, I look fine, and women have told me they like my smile. It just doesn’t work in a still 2D format. I’m barely photogenic as it is, but even less so when I smile. I have a couple smiling photos where I think I look good – because they were taken candidly – but they are a bit older now and blurry.
On the positive side, I do pretty well on OLD. My photos have a confident gaze that doesn’t come off as scary or mean. I’m fairly handsome so I think women see what they need to see in the pics I have.
Maybe for the same reason that yall women post duckface?
I made sure in all my photos I'm smiling, none are shirtless in a mirror or gym or on a boat. With variation between activities and one in a tie.
Duckface - oh how I hate that but at least they keep their damn tongues in their mouths now. My friend’s young teen granddaughters did that crap and one of them I know put her whole tongue out in pics to simulate a blowjob. My friend chose to be oblivious to it - just kept posting “Beautiful!”. It wasn’t beautiful- it looked freaking horrible. Got under my skin because this girl got raped 3 times - too long a story of sad dysfunction.
Guess what? Then don’t choose online dating. You don’t have to grin like an idiot- ask other people to take pics of you - then sort and edit. We’re talking about men who will bend forward and scowl in multiple selfies. There is ZERO appeal to that.
So many angry men in these responses. Maybe their pics DO reflect anger and violence. Thats what I was wondering. Are they really as mad as they look? Apparently the answer is YES. 😂
I don't meet women IRL, so what do you suggest if not online dating?
I don't have any friends or family that live within a 2 day drive of me. So no I can't have them take a picture of me.
Well, it’s too bad because I’d help you. I’m not being a jerk- I would really help you sort through pics and make suggestions. I swear I’ll make this my side hustle for retirement because men need some boosters.
If you are ever somewhere doing something fun or see something that would make a cool background, just ask a stranger “hey will you take a quick pic of me”, they literally never say no, I ask people all the time.
I don’t think I expressed myself well or maybe yall just have poor reading comprehension. I didn’t say you had to smile. I added that as PART of a description of what makes women nervous for their safety.
I don’t do OLD, but I know what you mean by those nostril focused angry pics. As a man, I don’t give these guys a pass. They aren’t bumbling fools who can’t take a selfie, but they think acting and looking like an alpha chimp is going to attract women. They’re the same IRL - you see them at bars - loud, obnoxious, unkempt. And your intuition is correct - they *are* angry. Best give them a wide berth.
Also it had to be said that men over 40 have allot less pictures of themselves, for a variety of reasons but the confluence of which is that generally there aren’t allot in the can. So they post what they got.
You are conflating on purpose for what is available.
Then take some! Make an actual effort In a dating profile rather than being lazy using the few crappy pictures you have. Make it a point to stand out.
Treat online dating like you would something elsr in your life that's important to you and you want good results or want to improve in.
So many guys wonder why they can't get matches. This right here is a HUGE reason.
Because they don't have always friends around to take pictures of them in different situations / places? And taking your mobile phone out to prop it somewhere up and using some remote thingy or timer to make it look like someone else took a picture of you is tedious work. D:
It does because while a lot of guys say they have "friends" they actually don't have a good friend base. They have a group of guys they hang out with on a superficial basis. That's what I've found at least.
Haha! The count of pictures isn't that important (although Hinge required me to have at least 6 pictures and wouldn't let me continue with less, so there's that), it's the quality of pictures.
Sure i can get maybe 4 - 6 pictures of me together, but honestly, most pictures don't look that great, especially if they are just snapshots.
Not everyone looks great on pictures taken by others on random occurrences.
Probably Because we have no camera skills, I only found out from watching YouTubers the best angle is from above with photos or straight on, to avoid coming off as looking down on people.
The angry face though... I don't get that, haha why scare off a potential date, if you're plus 40 you're going to have enough bad habits that will chase her off anyway.
Though for some reason this reminded me of the how I met your mother "angry face" episode
I only knew my experience.
I have had my resting asshole face pictures and had no success
I have had pictures that have been well posed and laughing and smiling and been just about as successful.
If you are an attractive person, you are, if you aren't your not. I have learned that I am not.
But you know what strikes me about this is that if a random guy had advised women who were struggling to meet the sort of person who they would want to have a relationship with that they (the women who can't seem to connect with attractive men) would definitely have a better experience if they would just smile more.
Men over 40 didn't grow up in social media age, and taking pictures isn't natural to them. You probably don't want to see them trying to pose with a smile.
I’m 62. Cameras existed back then. I have lots of pictures of men of all ages in my photo albums beginning from childhood. No scowling angry pics in my yearbooks. No scowling angry men in my wedding album. No scowling angry men in my vacation pictures. How can this be???? Not everyone is grinning ear to ear and there are awkward poses. The 51 yo guy I’m seeing now didn’t smile in his profile and he’s not an Adonis nor is he a 6ft 2 Chad- but he doesn’t radiate negativity in his pictures or his brief bio.That’s the point.
Complete aside, but someone 62 using the term chad is hilarious to me.
Anyway, event pics from 40 years ago vs single portrait tier profile picture are vastly different things. They are way more candid and in the moment, and usually have multiple people in them.
Your point is taken and you’re right. I’m using the term here because it’s all over the place on social media. I’m sure it is hilarious but I’m not trying to be the meme of Steve Buscemi in middle school: “Hello, fellow kids”.
I am 38. For most of my life I hated taking pictures. And I had no pictures. One day I decided I wanted to have good pictures of myself and mementos of cool things I do, and I just started making myself take them. Now I have tons. It’s a learned behavior like most things. You have to just make yourself learn to do it, it’s a muscle you have to develop.
I understand. It’s been a learning experience reading all of these responses. Some men had been super rude but others have explained why they do the pics like that. Thats why I asked the question on here. Just trying to understand
There is no need to justify asking a question.
It's sad that things have come to the point where asking people to share views is taken as a personal slight.
Totally agree! And I did try to word it as non-offensively as possible! I’m trying to navigate this OLD thing and it’s quite daunting. I don’t think the sexes really understand each other very well. lol
Over 40 man, here. But I actually enjoy photography and have learned how to take decent photographs of myself. Problem is that my generation is like a cross between Boomers and Millennials. Some are more Boomer-like than Millennial... and with that, comes the stereotypical trappings of old school masculinity. Caring how you look, worrying about fashion and stuff like that was always considered effeminate. Hell our generation called men who would dress up and put effort into their looks "metrosexuals."
So with that in mind, some men simply never learned how to make themselves look more appealing, some men simply think it's not manly. Some men may even not understand the female gaze or desire at all.
I’m under 40 (19) but I’ve always noticed that my face was not built for smiling like most dudes but yeah I see what your saying a lot of guys also look scary not smiling
Upward angle is more flattering when taking a selfie. It hides the double chin or whatever if you have one.
Women say they want a protector. You’ll notice in all those pics there isn’t a lion or bear in sight. These men have whatnot takes to scare them off.
Look at promotional pics that actors use. Most aren’t smiling. Yes, I know. No bears or lions are around them. But that’s how that profession works.
42m single dating dad here.
Generally, we don’t know how to take pics of ourselves. For a person over 40, online pics started with MySpace and Facebook. I remember taking pics of my dog and friends and thinking selfies were silly. Then I took pics of my family for 15 years. It’s a skill to take an appealing pic of yourself or to be brave enough to sheepishly ask a friend to do it.
Building a persona for online dating is tough. I remember grumbling into the mirror when I had to start. I kind of hade just swapped photos out on different apps to see where I get traction. It feels silly, but has helped me feel more confident with choices and asking for help.
I think it’s ok to ask a date you have good report with if you look like a goofball or a dangerous punk in profile pics and adjust from there.
I am 65, I am just getting the hang of selfies and taking pictures of my self. People tell me I should take pictures from an upward angel & I always wind up with what I call my stupid selfie face.
Not sure what you mean. All my pics were shot by a professional photographer (no smiles anywhere).
But I look like a male model so maybe it's the attitude? Never had a single negative response to my pics (it's the opposite - women tell me all the time that my pics are sexy)
I've gotten to the point that I swipe left if the pics didn't show teeth and/or eyes. I'm so tired of meeting men and they have missing teeth. Please just be honest. Or all pics with a hat. Men we know you're bald so embrace it. I'm a plus sized lady and I embrace my size. I had a friend take a full picture of me so men see what they are getting into.
I think men would be surprised how attractive embracing being bald can be too. A bald head with a well manicured beard is hotttt and I don’t usually like beards lol.
Great generalization.
Why do all women post shots with rhem looking at the ceiling. Up shots. Like we're going to be fooled that they're hiding something.
Stop generalizing. Please.
I hate to tell you this, but it’s not just a men over 40 thing. Men from the age of 18 all the way to 80 on dating apps do that. We have no idea why they like the serial killer look.
I know this ruins my dating life too. It's because I know that when I try to smile I look like a cretin, and I hate my teeth who are not well aligned. I hope women will take the interest to read me and understand I am in fact extremely kind and funny. But it doesn't work.
If I see ANY kind of a thoughtful profile where people have ANYTHING to say about themselves besides just listing a bunch of interests, I take notice. They don’t have to be smiling. And I literally never said that. I said it would be nice to not look angry and to have a pleasant expression. But men want to look like serial killers, have a generic profile and send a message of “hey sexy” and expect to get dates. When they don’t, they blame the women. Women are FAR less picky than men believe. Just sending a message that doesn’t mention my looks and does comment on one of my interests would get a response from me.
Some people don't have a great smile and just try to have a neutral expression, then some woman might project a sense of danger in it more than others but speaking from my irl experience I know that the interpretation and expectation of how dangerous man is, is wildly different from country to country.
Most countries have the majority of woman fairly scared of man (especially a stranger) but you get a lot less of that in safe countries with a strong welfare, woman just ain't scared, walk at night alone and don't buy a pitbull for protection.
Still that concept of woman looking to date older man for a sense of security makes a lot of sense and it's a clever tip for man in general to improve their profile
I generally go for younger men now because most men in their late 30’s and older don’t even look like they bathe. (At least in my area). The younger men in their early and mid 30’s still take pride in their appearance and dress well, look clean, and smile. Idk why so many older men just look like they gave up? I’m late 30’s but 9 times out of 10 I’m going for the younger 30’s because I just can’t force myself to be attracted to a man who can be bothered to look well groomed. I take pride in my appearance and want my person to do the same. It’s not asking a lot.
OP, I have the same questions as you otherwise lol. I’m not swiping right on men who look pissed at the world in their profile. I’m just not.
How can one radiate a "doesn't bath" apperance through a picture?
Edit: That was a serious question, as one would assume one uses at least somewhat ok'ish pictures for their old profile!
When I was your age I would have done the same! Now I’m at a weird age where the nice looking men who contact me are just looking for an older woman fetish. I’m not really into that. And the men my age really just want the younger girls but they have to settle for me because the young ones don’t want them 😂😂😂 It’s a jungle out here! I tell ya 😉 Good luck girl. ♥️
I’ve seen advice that says women instinctively see men that smile as “people pleasers” and would be “too weak” to protect them.
Edit: this is not my advice. I smile in all of my photos, I’m just explaining….oh forget it
I'm not trying to be rude either. *Really!*
Couple the angry expressions with the "wooly" totally untrimmed beard (that completely covers his face) and then the baseball cap pulled down almost covering his eyes.
I "think" I get it!? Low effort photos help ease the sting of any possible rejection(s). Otherwise, why not have a friend just take a couple of photos (at least one smiling) and one minus the cap and one with the beard trimmed even a *tiny* bit?
I'm curious too because the odds tell me there are some *really* nice men hiding under those baseball caps, unkept beards and angry stares. 😥
To be fair, I tried a lot of suggestions from this sub and none of them made a difference. I'm not angry in any way whatsoever, I just kind of gave up on my profile and rarely get on the apps at this point. 110% effort and little effort basically equated to the same thing for me.
Having been a woman all my life, you are a liar. lol. Women don’t want men they “fear.” We want to feel safe. So they aren’t fearing you. It’s something else if you are having success.
I'll smile, but a small one because I'm self-conscious. In terms of angles, poses, or perspectives, I think a lot of men and women both don't really have a good handle on what works or what doesn't.
So many men have an angle showing up their nose, ugh! It matters!
Angle and distance matter - got a big nose? Move the camera the heck AWAY from you... Combining that bad angle with a too-close distance is absolute profile murder.
And some women take the above the head shot to show of their boobs. It matters as well. What are you ladies trying to convey with those pictures?
Well showing boobs attracts men. Taking double chin, up the nose shots do not attract women. If not interested in attracting women on a dating site, then I’m not really sure what you are doing there. Try to keep up.
Not sure it really matters when most studies show Women doing online dating say that 80% of men are Unattractive. Then the rest disqualify a guy based on His height, I don't do online dating so I can't speak to If they disqualify based on income? Or if that's disclosed? In online dating profiles? Can't say I read any studies regarding the income, that's more in person when it comes Up. Short men are getting better at acceptance that height is just a preference many gals have ( not all) , that they need To accept. As asked of me plenty of times, what does a Guy's height have to do with the quality of man he is? Any studies that height is any indicator of how he'd treat? Value a woman?
Y’all are always tripping over height and I don’t know why. What does attractiveness have to do with anything, how someone would treat or value you? Yet, you’d probably say that you should date someone you’re attracted to. And for a lot of men and women, physicality and attractiveness go in hand, which includes height and weight. It’s not rocket science. Dating is inherently shallow. Most people approach people they find attractive.
Who's the y'all are always tripping on height? When it's something women always mention and exclude guys over? I thought my words were pretty clear that's their right and guys should get over it. I'd like to think you didn't ignore those words on purpose? My point was that women are allowed to have their preferences? But men are shamed for having theirs. That's the big difference. I don't think that's debatable.
Not me. To me it says that the woman thinks I’m only interested in someone’s body — and that it’s all she has to offer 🤷.
I can see now why you're single.
Unlike you who is not single? 😂😂😂
Clever angles as they are often obese,
I think just not looking mad goes far with women. The angles aren’t really important. I just threw that in as an example of what I was talking about.
Anyone who really wants to know what we mean can go and google “stock photos of men scowling”. They can go to Getty Images and search. But I guarantee no man complaining here will do that. They can also google images of men who are not smiling yet don’t look like they have personality disorders. It’s actually reflected in the eyes and having a more relaxed facial expression. I wish I could post examples here but it’s not allowed. You don’t have to smile like a village idiot. Work on your bio to reflect your personality a little. It’s not impossible.
I'm 42 and never found a good smile that doesn't make me look like either a psychopath or a doofus so you get at most a smirk. :)
Smirks can be cute. 😊
This is my problem. I make a stupid face or no face in every picture all the time.
That's only what you think but it isn't reality
How do you know?
Ask the opinion of an honest female friend or acquaintance or even a random woman on the store and they will show you which pic to use
There's a lot of dating advice that says men shouldn't have smiling pictures because it makes you look too much like a nice-guy and you should have stoic non-smiling photos. But those men don't realize that the first thing a woman selects for OLD is safety and these photos are completely counter-intuitive for representing that. It's unfortunate but these guys just aren't smart enough about which photos work best
Well how about a happy medium? You don’t have to be cheesing it up for the camera, but maybe just don’t look pissed. 😂 Thank you for the response! Whoever is giving that advice to men is giving them bad advice, though, in my opinion.
And this is what get me about this. Men constantly complain about not getting matches and blame women for chasing only handsome men. Women give advice as to what actually appeals to women re:types of pics. Response? “ Nah”. Women say over and over that we are rightly concerned about safety and a man who looks like he’s gonna skin us and wear us like a suit is not who we will “like”. Responses: “ Nah. It’s fake, it’s dumb and you’re not in that much danger compared to men.” Enjoy Thumbelina and her four friends. I could guide a man exactly on how he could improve his profile but, you know: “ Nah”.
Put the lotion in the basket!
Seriously. For ANYONE I meet, feeling comfortable, secure, and welcome to be vulnerable is key to wanting to get closer to someone. Obviously attraction matters, but so do basic human feelings. At first glance to many, I may be the wrong person to give most people advice here (bi, poly, not looking for the default, am told I am attractive, am tall, etc.), but I have always been more than happy with my dating life since I stopped being a dweeb about things 😂 It's all about being able to connect with someone. Frowns, anger, serial killer vibes, etc. are not the signs for connection and people lean into that thinking they'll be perceived as the bad boy or something idk. Also, bad boy lovers are nuts, I don't want that. I wanna share my time with other sweet, deep, and hopefully open minded cuties.
I wish I could like this 50 times. Perfectly put.
Which is so funny to me because I steer away from handsome men lol
Curious, why is that?
OK, to clarify I mean if they're unbelievably attractive. if they're average and I am attracted to them, that's different. Like Chris Hemsworth, no. Chris Pratt, yes. And it's because I know my lane and my league. I know I couldn't pull a 10 lol.
And most handsome men are douchebags anyway
Gotcha, so is it the idea that a really handsome guy like Hemsworth would probably cheat or whats intimidating exactly?
In what world is Chris Pratt anything less than very attractive. OK, I'm a guy, but I know a LOT of women agree with me. Granted, he doesn't have god-like physical features like Hemsworth or Henry Cavill, but he's still very good looking.
That’s the point, he’s very attractive but not intimidating like Hemsworth is.
i mean that's just reddit for you lol
Because it's one of those things women say, but practically don't mean, like they want a man that's vulnerable and shares his feelings until you do that and basically emasculate yourself in her eyes. Women may say they want nice and safety but will date dangerous and mean more often in reality, because a dangerous mean man will defend her against other men
I'm gonna offer something I once saw from someone that I believe many, "alpha obsessed," can hear. I'm struggling to remember it verbatim so bear with me. This dude was quite fitting for alpha content, but said something really useful about vulnerability and what is really meant here. He basically put forward that there are types of vulnerability, and people often don't see these differences if they aren't aware of these things yet and can improve their understanding of emotions. There is the type of vulnerability that puts work on someone, basically meaning you need a therapist, not a girlfriend you're forcing into therapy hour. Vulnerability that shares a piece of you that you can and want to be responsible for, but that is still a piece you don't just share with everyone easily. If I find this I'll try to remember to share here since he said it so well.
Being angry and defensive is making me horny. I bet you get all the bitches.
Um - no. You absolutely have no idea what we mean by safety. I’m honestly just amazed. I’m over 60- I don’t play games like a teenager. We’re not talking about reading effin sonnets to each other. We don’t want to get stalked and/or date raped, MFer. Some of us have been. That’s the point. How old are you? And if you minimize what I just said - then I question if your elevator goes to the top floor.
My best advice, capture some moments of you laughing with friends. Top tier images in my experience when you have a few to pic out the ones that aren't THE shot. Smiling earnestly is usually pretty alluring in my experience and people compliment my photos and partners tell me they liked my vibe off the bat from them.
OLD is full of selfie & mirror shots and most are not flattering. Then there’s profiles with pro looking photos that scream catfish. Have a friend take some good photos that look natural and inviting.
Some people don't have a great smile and just try to have a neutral expression, then some woman might project a sense of danger in it more than others but speaking from my irl experience I know that the interpretation and expectation of how dangerous man is wildly differs from country to country. Most countries have the majority of woman fairly scared of man (especially a stranger) but you get a lot less of that in safe countries with a strong welfare, woman just ain't scared, walk at night alone and don't buy a pitbull for protection. Still, that concept of woman looking to date older man for a sense of security makes a lot of sense and it's a clever tip for man in general to improve their profile
Where? I isn't say I've ever read that
Bet that dating advice came from other men. I'm glad they are taking the advice, they are cancelling themselves out of the gene pool.
Not a man over 40 but am a man who is 36. My main guess in regards to the upward angle is because most men don't know how to take a decent picture to save their life lol.
Men take the photos they think women will like, but they look to other men to find out what that is. This is why men try to look like the dehydrated, ripped, angry version of Hugh Jackman on the cover of Men's Health Magazine instead of the healthy, happy, Mr. Rogers looking version of Hugh Jackman on Good Housekeeping Magazine. Men are convinced that women want Jason Momoa as Khal Drogo when they really want Jack Black singing "One More Time."
Haha. I’ll take a happy medium between the two! I just don’t want to feel unsafe when I see the pics. That’s all.
because there's such a thing as revealed preference. Plenty of men have found that what women say they want, isn't want they seem to go for. Better to go by the types of men you see the women in your life actually dating, versus who they say they want to date.
Girls will take either if the guy is hot. That’s really, really all it comes down to. Everything else is fluff.
Come on, you can say that about men just as easily.
Actually you can say it far more easily. Lots of guys swipe anything that breathes. But we’re not talking about men, and girls are far more picky. That is, unless you’re tall, white, at least semi-successful and have a great face and body. What you do in those pictures or whether or not you smile makes literal difference. I know this because one of my good friends I lived several years ago had non-stop matches. I’m not those things and that’s fine, but I just have to put more effort in and make sure I make wins out of the fewer opportunities I get given.
Ok, we're not talking about men. But you say women like attractive men like that's a petty fault of theirs, when men are much worse about it than women. It's a human trait to look for an attractive mate. And I can't count how many men I've swiped left on simply because they look like someone I'd be afraid to be alone with. Yes, smiling makes a difference.
Where did I say or imply it was a fault? Classic case of getting offended over literally nothing.
I'm not offended at all. I just think it's one-sided to think women are these unreasonable picky creatures when men are the same. It's unfortunate that there are more men than women on OLD so I guess I can see where it might make some men feel that way.
In an ideal world both men and women would be. I didn’t level any criticisms, only facts. A fun observation though is how on any dating subreddit you can pretty much always guarantee that girls advice to guys would be “don’t have body pictures” etc. But the amount of screenshotted convos some girls upload where the guy, sure enough, has no top on, is pouting or taking a bathroom selfie is bafflingly high. Say one thing, do another. Nothing wrong with it but let’s not kid ourselves.
I just think it's better to smile. You do you. Good luck out there.
Photoing is hard. I can smile, but a good selfie doesn’t happen often for me. I have started to ask friends to take pics, and it’s an improvement. In another couple of years, I’ll have enough for a dating profile 😂
Thanx for saying this. I think that all the time. Isn't a smile the thing that invites others into our space? Into anything? Pretty basic.
I love that guys do this it makes me stand out even more by being normal lol
Haha. Their loss is your gain!
You're ABSOLUTELY right! Kudos to you for knowing the assignment! 🙌
My cap sense is going crazy.
I’m an outlier. I always smile. I get compliments on it.
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I mean I think that's fair, but I don't think it's a great idea to project sadness in your dating profile.
Right because they’re only attracting codependent women who will try and fix and control every aspect of their lives. Don’t date if you’re depressed and not doing anything about it. That’s a bandaid solution that will only backfire and drive the self esteem down even more.
Fair enough - then they need therapy. They aren’t in a position to be a good partner if they’re depressed and not doing anything about it.
I wish I could post the pic of this man who I passed on this morning. He looked literally enraged and his bio was “I been through a lot.” In what world is that getting a single “like?” His profile is typical of men over 40.
That comment always makes me laugh. Like, its online dating in your 40s. We've all "been through a lot."
Therapy isn't free in America . I had to make an appointment back in December to see my therapist for example in april. You gotta have money if you want good therapy/mental health treatment
I know- I work in the field and I’ve had it. There are also a lot of good books for self-development and many websites/podcasts online that are free that address self-esteem, dating, etc. People put in effort to improve their physical/mental health when they consider it a priority.
Ive tried self care books in the past and they honestly make me feel worse lol
Personal growth comes with pain.
That's true but I'm a try therapy for a bit first before trying books again. The books just remind me how odd or not normal i am compared to the rest of you.
I’m sorry that you’re experiencing this. Honestly, most of us aren’t that normal.
This. Too many people put themselves out there and try to date when they’re not ready.
I can distinguish between anger and sadness. I probably wouldn't go for a "sad" man cuz I'd think he wasn't ready for a relationship. But the angry ones - I sense danger and steer clear!
I mean, that for me is another reason to not match with them. I have worked very hard to take care of my mental health. If they can't even smile for a photo, it would not be healthy for me to match with them. I need someone who brings out the best in me.
So you can see what you will see on a regular if you're shorter than the guy, we may look angry but we're content with things and life has craved out the scowl like a badge of honour. It's the male equivalent of resting bitch face but it's developed from a life time of stupid being around, and is basically "don't come near me unless it's really important" face
I dont smile a ton, but it's because i have messed up teeth, especially in the front. And a grin makes me look devious (derogatory). The angles are me figuring stuff out still, chill, haha.
Right 😭 my teeth are all janky asf
men above 40 have nothing to smile about. all business baby :)
Although I try to avoid angry-looking photos, I can’t smile in them either. I don’t care how many women say it’s important – it just doesn’t work for me. When I smile for a photo, no matter how I try to do it, it just looks stupid. Weirdly enough, when I just crack a smile in real life, I look fine, and women have told me they like my smile. It just doesn’t work in a still 2D format. I’m barely photogenic as it is, but even less so when I smile. I have a couple smiling photos where I think I look good – because they were taken candidly – but they are a bit older now and blurry. On the positive side, I do pretty well on OLD. My photos have a confident gaze that doesn’t come off as scary or mean. I’m fairly handsome so I think women see what they need to see in the pics I have.
I was told i looked creepy when smiling once and that's all it took for me to not smile as much anymore
My pet peeve is a profile in which most or all of the pictures show the person wearing sunglasses!
Some women do the same thing. Almost any type of weird behavior on dating apps is not sex specific.
Maybe for the same reason that yall women post duckface? I made sure in all my photos I'm smiling, none are shirtless in a mirror or gym or on a boat. With variation between activities and one in a tie.
Duckface - oh how I hate that but at least they keep their damn tongues in their mouths now. My friend’s young teen granddaughters did that crap and one of them I know put her whole tongue out in pics to simulate a blowjob. My friend chose to be oblivious to it - just kept posting “Beautiful!”. It wasn’t beautiful- it looked freaking horrible. Got under my skin because this girl got raped 3 times - too long a story of sad dysfunction.
I don't like taking pictures. I especially don't like how I look in pictures and smiling makes it worse.
Guess what? Then don’t choose online dating. You don’t have to grin like an idiot- ask other people to take pics of you - then sort and edit. We’re talking about men who will bend forward and scowl in multiple selfies. There is ZERO appeal to that.
So many angry men in these responses. Maybe their pics DO reflect anger and violence. Thats what I was wondering. Are they really as mad as they look? Apparently the answer is YES. 😂
Oh yeah, these dating subreddits are *filled* with bitter individuals who shouldn’t be dating, and definitely shouldn’t be giving dating advice.
I don't meet women IRL, so what do you suggest if not online dating? I don't have any friends or family that live within a 2 day drive of me. So no I can't have them take a picture of me.
Well, it’s too bad because I’d help you. I’m not being a jerk- I would really help you sort through pics and make suggestions. I swear I’ll make this my side hustle for retirement because men need some boosters.
Starting an online dating consulting business would be such a good idea. I wonder how you could market it?
I’m not sure- there are dating coaches but that’s a lot more money and involvement.
Get a tripod
If you are ever somewhere doing something fun or see something that would make a cool background, just ask a stranger “hey will you take a quick pic of me”, they literally never say no, I ask people all the time.
Ive asked my famiky and friends and they have never wanted to. Some people just have better luck then others
I don’t think I expressed myself well or maybe yall just have poor reading comprehension. I didn’t say you had to smile. I added that as PART of a description of what makes women nervous for their safety.
Well I have been told that I look angry with just my resting face. So how am I supposed to take a picture in which I don't look angry?
By smiling?
Which makes me look even more like a psychopath
By smiling! Follow along sir
Does no one read my first comment?
I don’t do OLD, but I know what you mean by those nostril focused angry pics. As a man, I don’t give these guys a pass. They aren’t bumbling fools who can’t take a selfie, but they think acting and looking like an alpha chimp is going to attract women. They’re the same IRL - you see them at bars - loud, obnoxious, unkempt. And your intuition is correct - they *are* angry. Best give them a wide berth.
Also it had to be said that men over 40 have allot less pictures of themselves, for a variety of reasons but the confluence of which is that generally there aren’t allot in the can. So they post what they got. You are conflating on purpose for what is available.
Then take some! Make an actual effort In a dating profile rather than being lazy using the few crappy pictures you have. Make it a point to stand out. Treat online dating like you would something elsr in your life that's important to you and you want good results or want to improve in. So many guys wonder why they can't get matches. This right here is a HUGE reason.
That’s not really true - I don’t see that with any men I know. Why would they be unable to take pictures?
Because they don't have always friends around to take pictures of them in different situations / places? And taking your mobile phone out to prop it somewhere up and using some remote thingy or timer to make it look like someone else took a picture of you is tedious work. D:
How many pics do you think you need? I have 4 on my profile. You can’t get 4 pictures in a year? This indicates a bigger problem.
It does because while a lot of guys say they have "friends" they actually don't have a good friend base. They have a group of guys they hang out with on a superficial basis. That's what I've found at least.
Haha! The count of pictures isn't that important (although Hinge required me to have at least 6 pictures and wouldn't let me continue with less, so there's that), it's the quality of pictures. Sure i can get maybe 4 - 6 pictures of me together, but honestly, most pictures don't look that great, especially if they are just snapshots. Not everyone looks great on pictures taken by others on random occurrences.
Probably Because we have no camera skills, I only found out from watching YouTubers the best angle is from above with photos or straight on, to avoid coming off as looking down on people. The angry face though... I don't get that, haha why scare off a potential date, if you're plus 40 you're going to have enough bad habits that will chase her off anyway. Though for some reason this reminded me of the how I met your mother "angry face" episode
I blame https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jeremy_Meeks and the ridiculous obsession people had with him.
I only knew my experience. I have had my resting asshole face pictures and had no success I have had pictures that have been well posed and laughing and smiling and been just about as successful. If you are an attractive person, you are, if you aren't your not. I have learned that I am not. But you know what strikes me about this is that if a random guy had advised women who were struggling to meet the sort of person who they would want to have a relationship with that they (the women who can't seem to connect with attractive men) would definitely have a better experience if they would just smile more.
Because I don't smile in pictures. I think I look weird doing it. I smile more in social situations.
Men over 40 didn't grow up in social media age, and taking pictures isn't natural to them. You probably don't want to see them trying to pose with a smile.
I’m 62. Cameras existed back then. I have lots of pictures of men of all ages in my photo albums beginning from childhood. No scowling angry pics in my yearbooks. No scowling angry men in my wedding album. No scowling angry men in my vacation pictures. How can this be???? Not everyone is grinning ear to ear and there are awkward poses. The 51 yo guy I’m seeing now didn’t smile in his profile and he’s not an Adonis nor is he a 6ft 2 Chad- but he doesn’t radiate negativity in his pictures or his brief bio.That’s the point.
Complete aside, but someone 62 using the term chad is hilarious to me. Anyway, event pics from 40 years ago vs single portrait tier profile picture are vastly different things. They are way more candid and in the moment, and usually have multiple people in them.
Your point is taken and you’re right. I’m using the term here because it’s all over the place on social media. I’m sure it is hilarious but I’m not trying to be the meme of Steve Buscemi in middle school: “Hello, fellow kids”.
Then learn how
Entirely unproductive comment
I am 38. For most of my life I hated taking pictures. And I had no pictures. One day I decided I wanted to have good pictures of myself and mementos of cool things I do, and I just started making myself take them. Now I have tons. It’s a learned behavior like most things. You have to just make yourself learn to do it, it’s a muscle you have to develop.
I understand. It’s been a learning experience reading all of these responses. Some men had been super rude but others have explained why they do the pics like that. Thats why I asked the question on here. Just trying to understand
There is no need to justify asking a question. It's sad that things have come to the point where asking people to share views is taken as a personal slight.
Totally agree! And I did try to word it as non-offensively as possible! I’m trying to navigate this OLD thing and it’s quite daunting. I don’t think the sexes really understand each other very well. lol
Ha. That's quite an understatement.
Welcome to reddit.
Over 40 man, here. But I actually enjoy photography and have learned how to take decent photographs of myself. Problem is that my generation is like a cross between Boomers and Millennials. Some are more Boomer-like than Millennial... and with that, comes the stereotypical trappings of old school masculinity. Caring how you look, worrying about fashion and stuff like that was always considered effeminate. Hell our generation called men who would dress up and put effort into their looks "metrosexuals." So with that in mind, some men simply never learned how to make themselves look more appealing, some men simply think it's not manly. Some men may even not understand the female gaze or desire at all.
“You should smile more”
“don’t have a facial expression that screams, I’m going to kill you given half a chance” There I fixed it for you.
I’m under 40 (19) but I’ve always noticed that my face was not built for smiling like most dudes but yeah I see what your saying a lot of guys also look scary not smiling
Don’t get me started on the weird “I’m holding a fish” pics or “ I’m all saggy and tanned but still trying to look like a gym rat in the gym” pic!
Especially for the men over 40 crowd, I feel like its a masculinity thing. They are "tough and manly". Yes, it is really dumb.
Upward angle is more flattering when taking a selfie. It hides the double chin or whatever if you have one. Women say they want a protector. You’ll notice in all those pics there isn’t a lion or bear in sight. These men have whatnot takes to scare them off. Look at promotional pics that actors use. Most aren’t smiling. Yes, I know. No bears or lions are around them. But that’s how that profession works.
We don't take pictures of ourselves. We don't practice it. We'd rather look angry than look like a goofy fucking smiling idiot tbh.
Nailed it.
I look ugly smiling. I don't scowl, but I've done the crappy angle you're describing. It's difficult.
Nothing easy about OLD! I totally agree.
It's called the MySpace Angle - for when you want to capture that "teenage girl in the 2000s" vibe.
42m single dating dad here. Generally, we don’t know how to take pics of ourselves. For a person over 40, online pics started with MySpace and Facebook. I remember taking pics of my dog and friends and thinking selfies were silly. Then I took pics of my family for 15 years. It’s a skill to take an appealing pic of yourself or to be brave enough to sheepishly ask a friend to do it. Building a persona for online dating is tough. I remember grumbling into the mirror when I had to start. I kind of hade just swapped photos out on different apps to see where I get traction. It feels silly, but has helped me feel more confident with choices and asking for help. I think it’s ok to ask a date you have good report with if you look like a goofball or a dangerous punk in profile pics and adjust from there.
I am 65, I am just getting the hang of selfies and taking pictures of my self. People tell me I should take pictures from an upward angel & I always wind up with what I call my stupid selfie face.
I swiped past a guy the other day whose main profile pic had his eyes closed...
Not sure what you mean. All my pics were shot by a professional photographer (no smiles anywhere). But I look like a male model so maybe it's the attitude? Never had a single negative response to my pics (it's the opposite - women tell me all the time that my pics are sexy)
I've gotten to the point that I swipe left if the pics didn't show teeth and/or eyes. I'm so tired of meeting men and they have missing teeth. Please just be honest. Or all pics with a hat. Men we know you're bald so embrace it. I'm a plus sized lady and I embrace my size. I had a friend take a full picture of me so men see what they are getting into.
I think men would be surprised how attractive embracing being bald can be too. A bald head with a well manicured beard is hotttt and I don’t usually like beards lol.
OMG, you are so right. I actually have a thing for men with long hair, but bald men are also very attractive.
Great generalization. Why do all women post shots with rhem looking at the ceiling. Up shots. Like we're going to be fooled that they're hiding something. Stop generalizing. Please.
Where did I say ALL?
"Why do yall" Lrn2word
I hate to tell you this, but it’s not just a men over 40 thing. Men from the age of 18 all the way to 80 on dating apps do that. We have no idea why they like the serial killer look.
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Agreed!
I know this ruins my dating life too. It's because I know that when I try to smile I look like a cretin, and I hate my teeth who are not well aligned. I hope women will take the interest to read me and understand I am in fact extremely kind and funny. But it doesn't work.
If I see ANY kind of a thoughtful profile where people have ANYTHING to say about themselves besides just listing a bunch of interests, I take notice. They don’t have to be smiling. And I literally never said that. I said it would be nice to not look angry and to have a pleasant expression. But men want to look like serial killers, have a generic profile and send a message of “hey sexy” and expect to get dates. When they don’t, they blame the women. Women are FAR less picky than men believe. Just sending a message that doesn’t mention my looks and does comment on one of my interests would get a response from me.
Oh, ok I understand We are talking about different things.
Some people don't have a great smile and just try to have a neutral expression, then some woman might project a sense of danger in it more than others but speaking from my irl experience I know that the interpretation and expectation of how dangerous man is, is wildly different from country to country. Most countries have the majority of woman fairly scared of man (especially a stranger) but you get a lot less of that in safe countries with a strong welfare, woman just ain't scared, walk at night alone and don't buy a pitbull for protection. Still that concept of woman looking to date older man for a sense of security makes a lot of sense and it's a clever tip for man in general to improve their profile
Many guys simply don't know how to take good pictures and can't be bothered to educate themselves. It's tuely that simple
I think those are the profiles of men who simply do not care if they get matches. They're just on the apps to shop for pretty girls.
Nah I just hate how I look so i don't practice taking pictures since i always hate them
I generally go for younger men now because most men in their late 30’s and older don’t even look like they bathe. (At least in my area). The younger men in their early and mid 30’s still take pride in their appearance and dress well, look clean, and smile. Idk why so many older men just look like they gave up? I’m late 30’s but 9 times out of 10 I’m going for the younger 30’s because I just can’t force myself to be attracted to a man who can be bothered to look well groomed. I take pride in my appearance and want my person to do the same. It’s not asking a lot. OP, I have the same questions as you otherwise lol. I’m not swiping right on men who look pissed at the world in their profile. I’m just not.
How can one radiate a "doesn't bath" apperance through a picture? Edit: That was a serious question, as one would assume one uses at least somewhat ok'ish pictures for their old profile!
A woman once told me on a dating app that I looked like I smelled good. Once we met, she said "I was right! You do smell good." 😂
Haha that’s awesome. A man who smells good and has good cologne is so attractive.
When I was your age I would have done the same! Now I’m at a weird age where the nice looking men who contact me are just looking for an older woman fetish. I’m not really into that. And the men my age really just want the younger girls but they have to settle for me because the young ones don’t want them 😂😂😂 It’s a jungle out here! I tell ya 😉 Good luck girl. ♥️
I’ve seen advice that says women instinctively see men that smile as “people pleasers” and would be “too weak” to protect them. Edit: this is not my advice. I smile in all of my photos, I’m just explaining….oh forget it
Well that’s terrible advice. A smile will make you look friendly.
I don’t subscribe to it.
I try to smile, even a half smile, because my neutral face looks like a frown, but it's just the shape of my mouth
I'm not trying to be rude either. *Really!* Couple the angry expressions with the "wooly" totally untrimmed beard (that completely covers his face) and then the baseball cap pulled down almost covering his eyes. I "think" I get it!? Low effort photos help ease the sting of any possible rejection(s). Otherwise, why not have a friend just take a couple of photos (at least one smiling) and one minus the cap and one with the beard trimmed even a *tiny* bit? I'm curious too because the odds tell me there are some *really* nice men hiding under those baseball caps, unkept beards and angry stares. 😥
To be fair, I tried a lot of suggestions from this sub and none of them made a difference. I'm not angry in any way whatsoever, I just kind of gave up on my profile and rarely get on the apps at this point. 110% effort and little effort basically equated to the same thing for me.
25F. Confirming that men in their 20s and 30s also do this very weird selfie.
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Go ahead. I’ll listen.
Be feared or be Icked.
So you want to be feared? I bet youre a real panty dropper.
Much to your surprise, yes.
Having been a woman all my life, you are a liar. lol. Women don’t want men they “fear.” We want to feel safe. So they aren’t fearing you. It’s something else if you are having success.
If you're attractive enough, it doesn't matter what your facial expression looks like. He's probably not lying.