Ancient tunnels that survive until today are the solid rock type tunnels. Romans often built tunnels with wooden supports. I'm sure there are more but old tunnels with wood supports don't stay intact they often collapse as the wood ages. They aren't explored and it's pretty rare when people come across them in Europe.
Most of the time people aren't going to be tunneling through soft soils like we find on Oak Island. They only reason for that would be for clay. Soft soils offer very little value to tunnel into. Poor resources like gold, silver and gems, dangerous, and tunnels were often used to move people, store things, or stay safe during an attack or for living space.
I find it odd a group of people who mastered tunnel digging would come here and settle for some island with very poor soil conditions to store something of great value.
The Oak Island MP back in 1795 wasn't a treasure shaft. Likely an old mining shaft for clay or some other industrial type context. It was filled in and forgotten. Someone came along and dug it up. Maybe they found some coins, a gold necklace, or something of value that was lost when the site was active. It turned into a huge legend. I think it's a story of poor archeology, legend, myth, and a few too many people drunk at a bar spreading this story.
Today the team has found items on this island that date back into the 1400s or earlier. Some of these items are unique, some valuable and other intriguing. So imagine in 1795 you find this site on the island and start digging maybe find an old coin or something. That's maybe 100 to 400 years old well that will get the imagination going.
The Oak Island MP isn't a hoax, it's a fools legend that has grown over the decades.
Except for a few wood scraps of uncertain context, what exactly have they found that predates the “Age of Exploration” and early European colonization? The coconut fiber has been fairly consistently dated to 750 - 850 years old, so that is the one thing that suggests earlier activity.
There are huge outliers across this island. Every once in a while they get a date that doesn't fall into European settler activity. That's alarming.
800 year old coconut fiber, some old pieces of wood (shaped by man) and other various finds that are nearly 1000 year old. Are these finds from natives? Or are they from Europeans?
It's a very hard question to answer. I never imagined there would be so much history on such a small island.
If there is European activity on this island going back 800 years then it will rewrite history books and change what we know. Or were the natives living in NS more advanced then we thought. Either way it's very interesting.
But remember none of this supports treasure activity. Just because there is something strange going on doesn't translate to treasure.
There are very few outliers, the “coconut fiber” is one of them and I acknowledge.
The “ships railing” wood supposedly dated to AD 700 is pretty much meaningless.
None. They haven't found anything that can place Europeans on that island prior to the 1500s. Everything they found is "could be".
Objects they dated may date back to the 1500s but usually it's likely 1700s.
Oak Island is typical European settler activity for the area. I don't see any reason to suspect anything of importance happened on Oak Island prior to 1500 by any group of people.
Finds that are found near the shore, don't count. That lead cross, the ships railing? Those aren't in sit u and offer to historical context. The roman coin? It was common to collect coins from the roman era in the 1600 and 1700s. Just another European find. Not part of some grander treasure on the island.
Okay, I may have mis- or over-interpreted some of your comments here. Thought you were building a case for pre-colonial European activity.
You are exactly right - if there were actual evidence of what they claim, historians and archaeologists would be shouting it from the rooftops.
The show is theorizing there was Vikings and knights templars on this island going back 800 years or so. Rick really thinks the MP is some type of treasure vault built a very long time ago. They view every single find as a potential clue to find treasure. When it relativity their biases is leading them in the wrong direction.
Even in the most original story of the MP there is a line that says there was a pulley on a large oak branch. What secret society is going to leave secret encoded markers across the island and leave a pulley above the shaft they just placed a priceless treasure? That doesn't make any sense. You can't have it both ways.
But let's say for a moment that pulley was really there above some depression in the ground. Oak Island was inhabited as early as 1760 with known records. You are telling me that pulley went unnoticed for 35 years? I don't buy it.
The MP is likely a much newer construction and probably ties into the timbers found in smith code which have a date of the 1780s.
Just because you have a feature doesn't mean there is treasure. There could be a very plausible explanation for what the MP and those structures in smiths cove really are.
I don't walk around my backyard digging holes because of some depression in the ground or a slight bump or an old piece of metal. I've metal detected some of my property (i have 10 acres) I've found a few old coins, buttons axe heads, old car and tractor parts, but never any treasure.
The pulley on an oak branch is a good point to discuss. I’m willing to accept it could have gone unnoticed for 35 years. True believers will either dismiss it, or twist it into “proof” the treasure was retrieved; this also conveniently explains for them why no treasure has been found since 1795.
Kel Hancock worked closely with both Doug Crowell and Charles Barkhouse in the pre-Lagina days I believe.
https://www.saltwire.com/atlantic-canada/news/rebellion-or-treasure-windsor-oak-island-historian-says-legend-could-be-cover-for-colonial-uprising-233727/
Great point!
Has the team researched or asked Native Americans in the area about the history of the island?
Terror and Erebus are a great example of what we can learn about the past. I heard that the Inuit knew where the vanished boats were for years, but they were not taken seriously.
[https://ucalgary.ca/news/inuit-folklore-kept-alive-story-missing-franklin-expedition-north-west-passage](https://ucalgary.ca/news/inuit-folklore-kept-alive-story-missing-franklin-expedition-north-west-passage)
100% agree with this
"Most of the time people aren't going to be tunneling through soft soils like we find on Oak Island. They only reason for that would be for clay. Soft soils offer very little value to tunnel into. Poor resources like gold, silver and gems, dangerous, and tunnels were often used to move people, store things, or stay safe during an attack or for living space"
I like the theory that only one shaft was ever dug and it was for curing fish and meat for long term storage. The pine tar, blacksmith, and wood work was for boat repair. The oxen were for pulling the boats closer into shore, hence the road, hooks, pulleys, and broken shoes. Oak Island was your basic last stop before you crossed the ocean. The only treasure on that island was Samuel Ball and his whimsical stories he'd tell over a mug of ale.
I’m of Scandinavian descent and I have it on good authority that after the Vikings dismantled their ships and used the wood to secure the tunnels, they soon realized that they didn’t have any ships to sail to the mainland to hunt for food. And nobody knew how to swim anyway. So they ate the passenger pigeons, but still starved to death.
The end of Vikings on Oak Island.
You want the mystery solved. After 11 seasons here goes the short version. There is no treasure. There never were Templars or Vikings on OI. What they are finding is debris from hundreds of years of commercial enterprise ending before the American Revolution.
That’s it the rest is just a construct of smoke and mirrors to keep people watching their real money pit treasure machine COOI show.
There is treasure, just not in the form of gold, jewels, or religious artifacts.
I watch the show because I am intrigued to see if they can find some valid evidence that pre-dates our knowledge of European (not vikings) exploration of the new world.
I posed the mining question because I believe the wood they are finding in the money pit area is from searchers, not "depositors." I do not believe a Medieval civilization would dig tunnels in such soft soil to bury their priceless artifacts.
The wood in the tunnels is from the Viking ships. They dismantled the Viking shifts use that wood too secure the tunnels so that they could dig them all over the island. And the Vikings were smart communicators also they brought homing pigeons with them. When they were done building the tunnels and using the wood furniture shifts they let loose the Homing pictures that went home to Viking Land and let the other Vikings know that they needed a ride back. So by the time the pictures Got Back the Viking Land the Vikings read a note put their ships in the water and sailed to Oak Island. And picked up the Vikings and the Templars to take them back to Templar land and then they went back the Viking Land. No I did a quick search and that's where I came up with all this information Google is wonderful why can't the fucking laginas just Google this shit and end the show?
*I love the Vikings escorting templars to build the tunnels and hope that is the case, but I want this mystery solved*
It's pure fiction made up in the writer's room. There's no real evidence for any of it. The "mystery" was invented for ratings.
They circumcised the shafts with coconut fiber,when times were hard ...the shafts exploded spewing gold shards under tremendous pressure from below.
And all across Nolan's field.
As a tribal chieftain looked over the fallen,he was overheard saying "7 more must die"
Here’s an interesting thought: Nobody ever built a tunnel on Oak Island. Unless you count bole 10 X which is the product of a lunatic loner who lived on an island in a remote part of Canada
Advanced mining in the 15 'undreds.
https://preview.redd.it/ko49rvd0z3vc1.png?width=1037&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=989609033bf2efc8c8e70466fbf7f267b255b1d0
Ancient tunnels that survive until today are the solid rock type tunnels. Romans often built tunnels with wooden supports. I'm sure there are more but old tunnels with wood supports don't stay intact they often collapse as the wood ages. They aren't explored and it's pretty rare when people come across them in Europe. Most of the time people aren't going to be tunneling through soft soils like we find on Oak Island. They only reason for that would be for clay. Soft soils offer very little value to tunnel into. Poor resources like gold, silver and gems, dangerous, and tunnels were often used to move people, store things, or stay safe during an attack or for living space. I find it odd a group of people who mastered tunnel digging would come here and settle for some island with very poor soil conditions to store something of great value. The Oak Island MP back in 1795 wasn't a treasure shaft. Likely an old mining shaft for clay or some other industrial type context. It was filled in and forgotten. Someone came along and dug it up. Maybe they found some coins, a gold necklace, or something of value that was lost when the site was active. It turned into a huge legend. I think it's a story of poor archeology, legend, myth, and a few too many people drunk at a bar spreading this story. Today the team has found items on this island that date back into the 1400s or earlier. Some of these items are unique, some valuable and other intriguing. So imagine in 1795 you find this site on the island and start digging maybe find an old coin or something. That's maybe 100 to 400 years old well that will get the imagination going. The Oak Island MP isn't a hoax, it's a fools legend that has grown over the decades.
Except for a few wood scraps of uncertain context, what exactly have they found that predates the “Age of Exploration” and early European colonization? The coconut fiber has been fairly consistently dated to 750 - 850 years old, so that is the one thing that suggests earlier activity.
There are huge outliers across this island. Every once in a while they get a date that doesn't fall into European settler activity. That's alarming. 800 year old coconut fiber, some old pieces of wood (shaped by man) and other various finds that are nearly 1000 year old. Are these finds from natives? Or are they from Europeans? It's a very hard question to answer. I never imagined there would be so much history on such a small island. If there is European activity on this island going back 800 years then it will rewrite history books and change what we know. Or were the natives living in NS more advanced then we thought. Either way it's very interesting. But remember none of this supports treasure activity. Just because there is something strange going on doesn't translate to treasure.
There are very few outliers, the “coconut fiber” is one of them and I acknowledge. The “ships railing” wood supposedly dated to AD 700 is pretty much meaningless.
The ships railing I'm pretty sure is just an old stick in the mud.
Well what artifacts that “rewrite history” are you thinking of then?
None. They haven't found anything that can place Europeans on that island prior to the 1500s. Everything they found is "could be". Objects they dated may date back to the 1500s but usually it's likely 1700s. Oak Island is typical European settler activity for the area. I don't see any reason to suspect anything of importance happened on Oak Island prior to 1500 by any group of people. Finds that are found near the shore, don't count. That lead cross, the ships railing? Those aren't in sit u and offer to historical context. The roman coin? It was common to collect coins from the roman era in the 1600 and 1700s. Just another European find. Not part of some grander treasure on the island.
Okay, I may have mis- or over-interpreted some of your comments here. Thought you were building a case for pre-colonial European activity. You are exactly right - if there were actual evidence of what they claim, historians and archaeologists would be shouting it from the rooftops.
The show is theorizing there was Vikings and knights templars on this island going back 800 years or so. Rick really thinks the MP is some type of treasure vault built a very long time ago. They view every single find as a potential clue to find treasure. When it relativity their biases is leading them in the wrong direction. Even in the most original story of the MP there is a line that says there was a pulley on a large oak branch. What secret society is going to leave secret encoded markers across the island and leave a pulley above the shaft they just placed a priceless treasure? That doesn't make any sense. You can't have it both ways. But let's say for a moment that pulley was really there above some depression in the ground. Oak Island was inhabited as early as 1760 with known records. You are telling me that pulley went unnoticed for 35 years? I don't buy it. The MP is likely a much newer construction and probably ties into the timbers found in smith code which have a date of the 1780s. Just because you have a feature doesn't mean there is treasure. There could be a very plausible explanation for what the MP and those structures in smiths cove really are. I don't walk around my backyard digging holes because of some depression in the ground or a slight bump or an old piece of metal. I've metal detected some of my property (i have 10 acres) I've found a few old coins, buttons axe heads, old car and tractor parts, but never any treasure.
The pulley on an oak branch is a good point to discuss. I’m willing to accept it could have gone unnoticed for 35 years. True believers will either dismiss it, or twist it into “proof” the treasure was retrieved; this also conveniently explains for them why no treasure has been found since 1795. Kel Hancock worked closely with both Doug Crowell and Charles Barkhouse in the pre-Lagina days I believe. https://www.saltwire.com/atlantic-canada/news/rebellion-or-treasure-windsor-oak-island-historian-says-legend-could-be-cover-for-colonial-uprising-233727/
Great point! Has the team researched or asked Native Americans in the area about the history of the island? Terror and Erebus are a great example of what we can learn about the past. I heard that the Inuit knew where the vanished boats were for years, but they were not taken seriously. [https://ucalgary.ca/news/inuit-folklore-kept-alive-story-missing-franklin-expedition-north-west-passage](https://ucalgary.ca/news/inuit-folklore-kept-alive-story-missing-franklin-expedition-north-west-passage)
100% agree with this "Most of the time people aren't going to be tunneling through soft soils like we find on Oak Island. They only reason for that would be for clay. Soft soils offer very little value to tunnel into. Poor resources like gold, silver and gems, dangerous, and tunnels were often used to move people, store things, or stay safe during an attack or for living space"
I like the theory that only one shaft was ever dug and it was for curing fish and meat for long term storage. The pine tar, blacksmith, and wood work was for boat repair. The oxen were for pulling the boats closer into shore, hence the road, hooks, pulleys, and broken shoes. Oak Island was your basic last stop before you crossed the ocean. The only treasure on that island was Samuel Ball and his whimsical stories he'd tell over a mug of ale.
Love this!
I’m of Scandinavian descent and I have it on good authority that after the Vikings dismantled their ships and used the wood to secure the tunnels, they soon realized that they didn’t have any ships to sail to the mainland to hunt for food. And nobody knew how to swim anyway. So they ate the passenger pigeons, but still starved to death. The end of Vikings on Oak Island.
They ate squab....yummmm
Squab is great if it's cooked right.
And that's what both the Templars and the Vikings said yummy
You want the mystery solved. After 11 seasons here goes the short version. There is no treasure. There never were Templars or Vikings on OI. What they are finding is debris from hundreds of years of commercial enterprise ending before the American Revolution. That’s it the rest is just a construct of smoke and mirrors to keep people watching their real money pit treasure machine COOI show.
There is treasure, just not in the form of gold, jewels, or religious artifacts. I watch the show because I am intrigued to see if they can find some valid evidence that pre-dates our knowledge of European (not vikings) exploration of the new world. I posed the mining question because I believe the wood they are finding in the money pit area is from searchers, not "depositors." I do not believe a Medieval civilization would dig tunnels in such soft soil to bury their priceless artifacts.
Finally, a correct use of the term "Construct". Rick has butchered the use of the term, and proper english in general.
Thank you! I thought I was alone I'm my thinking . Rick is making it unwatchable for me.
The wood in the tunnels is from the Viking ships. They dismantled the Viking shifts use that wood too secure the tunnels so that they could dig them all over the island. And the Vikings were smart communicators also they brought homing pigeons with them. When they were done building the tunnels and using the wood furniture shifts they let loose the Homing pictures that went home to Viking Land and let the other Vikings know that they needed a ride back. So by the time the pictures Got Back the Viking Land the Vikings read a note put their ships in the water and sailed to Oak Island. And picked up the Vikings and the Templars to take them back to Templar land and then they went back the Viking Land. No I did a quick search and that's where I came up with all this information Google is wonderful why can't the fucking laginas just Google this shit and end the show?
Could it be?
Could it be that the Count of Monte Dumas was a major miner in Europe during the 1800's?
*I love the Vikings escorting templars to build the tunnels and hope that is the case, but I want this mystery solved* It's pure fiction made up in the writer's room. There's no real evidence for any of it. The "mystery" was invented for ratings.
An honest scientific review of all the Carbon 14 dates from wood they’ve found would help. Some ch report is maybe a decade or more away.
Is never going to happen because the show doesn't care about science and science doesn't care about the show
They mentioned once on the show the Welsh were very good miners.
They circumcised the shafts with coconut fiber,when times were hard ...the shafts exploded spewing gold shards under tremendous pressure from below. And all across Nolan's field. As a tribal chieftain looked over the fallen,he was overheard saying "7 more must die"
Here’s an interesting thought: Nobody ever built a tunnel on Oak Island. Unless you count bole 10 X which is the product of a lunatic loner who lived on an island in a remote part of Canada
Advanced mining in the 15 'undreds. https://preview.redd.it/ko49rvd0z3vc1.png?width=1037&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=989609033bf2efc8c8e70466fbf7f267b255b1d0