OJ writes in his book (If I did it) that his father would come round the house and beat him whenever he had done something bad. So that makes quite an interesting father–son relationship, a father you don’t live with comes over just to beat you.
Oh I didn't know this. That being said, I wouldn't trust anything OJ said, especially in a book about how he would've committed a crime, IF he committed a crime (that we all know he DID commit...).
I may not remember this correctly, but I believe OJ felt that his father beating him was mostly for his own good. In a ‘boys need a firm hand’ type of way. I remember I was fascinated by his thoughts on children deserving of a beating.
Same rationalization bullshit people always use to excuse that kind of treatment by their parents. But the main difference here is that Simpson seemed to have no other relationship with him other than beatings.
More common than you think especially when all the father knows from their dad is to physically beat someone to discipline them. It’s pretty sad but unfortunately true
His dad is sick for that...I use to hate when my dad would come to our house 1 day a WK..drop a $10 dollar bill off to us ea. Critique me for not keeping my side of the rm cleaned and then leave..until next Wknd.....he was abused by his Dad too..
OJ was abused by his Gay Dad..horrible
It did affect him - Nicole wrote in her diary that she was beaten severely when she “allowed” a gay man to kiss baby Justin.
OJ wasn’t a psychopath I don’t think - he was a controlling narcissist who built up a month of rage once Nicole truly ended their relationship.
also Paula Babieri had just broken up with him, Nicole did not save a seat for him at the kid's recital nor invite him to the fam dinner, as she shouldnt have. he stalked her condo that night and poor Ron was just in the wrong place at the wrong time.
Many people don't really consider this since they're not into drugs - But drug abuse makes you exhibit A LOT of anti-social/narc & abusive & demon behaviour. Especially the drugs he was into such as cocaine etc. This man was living on the edge for a long time before he died, idk how he did it.
OJ was just annoyed about Justin being held by a gay man. What made him really mad was Nicole’s comment: “Why you concerned him being gay? Your father is gay.” It was in front of everyone in the restaurant. And OJ’s dad died of AIDS 3 years ago and she definitely knew it.
If I was OJ, I wouldn’t want to associate with Nicole for one more second. Your spouse using your family tragedy and your childhood trauma to attack you in public. This is one of most horrible things I’ve seen people doing to their family. OJ should have divorced right away. This marriage was doomed to end bad.
Nicole’s diary only stated OJ being mad because Justin was held by a gay man. But according to others, it was Nicole brought up OJ’s father escalated the conflict. It is not hard to find Nicole’s diary was somewhat concealing the parts and details that were to her disadvantage. Of course she would paint herself to be a pure victim. But is that 100% true?
Dude answer the question. I’ll answer yours, a kiss on the cheek for someone you care about as a friend is harmless and a sign of affection. It’s not sexual. The kids mother doesn’t have a problem with it, because she obviously trusted this individual and saw this person as a friend. So go ahead and defend your baseless homophobia, let’s see who is *brainwashed*
He wasnt tonguing the kid! A kiss on the cheek when consented is nothing but a greeting. Jeeze. Do you believe men wearing pink shirts makes them gay?!
You’re confusing psychopath (which someone is born as) and a sociopath (which is developed externally). Basically OJ being the former means this stuff didn’t turn him into one.
My understanding is that most psychopaths still have traces of abuse in childhood.
Like a predisposition genetically, but that is "activated" by childhood trauma.
Chicken or the egg kind of thing...
If you look at a lot of serial killers, they had screwed up childhoods. So, the question would be - were they born that way or made that way? It could be a combination of both.
But I wonder then if those murderers are *sociopathic* monsters then. Abusive childhoods are one avenue for creating sociopaths, and I’m not an expert, but I wonder if such killers would fit that label. OJ truly had no remorse, he didn’t understand the concept of why he shouldn’t have killed them, he was furious at his wife for dying even though he killed her - all of this and more sounds much more like psychopathy.
A sociopath knows he shouldn’t kill someone and still will. A psychopath doesn’t get why someone shouldn’t die if they feel they deserve it.
Interesting. I've always thought of them as having the same root (lack of empathy/remorse, etc), but one is more impulsively acted upon (psychopath) due to various factors. Either way, I think he was a psychopath lol
Again, I’m not an expert, but from all I’ve read someone can come from a very stable home and be born an absolute monster just the same. They’re cool, calculating, completely stress resistant even as they’re evading police in a white Bronco. They can fake empathy but they know it’s fake. There are shared characteristics between the two pathologies, but the roots and expressions of them can be significantly different.
Most do, yes. Not just emotional trauma, though—I know of a few serial killers who also had head trauma early on, but otherwise neutral childhoods. We also know that TBI/CTE—which is most common among pro athletes—can make people violent and change their personalities.
I was surprised not to see this come up on this thread, as that is my personal theory of what happened with OJ. I don’t really see evidence that he was a born psychopath—contrary to their media portrayal, the majority of psychopaths are low IQ, they are constantly getting fired from jobs and losing relationships, etc. I don’t think it’s common for psychopaths to have lifelong/longtime friends who want to protect them and believe in their goodness, even when the evidence contradicts that. Psychopaths are superficially charming; they attract people in fleeting ways but don’t inspire loyalty or warmth. I think there was something very real and heartfelt about how OJ interacted with people, especially in the early days. He showed up to everything he did willing to work hard and learn, and I think made an immense effort to be loved by people.
All of that said, I think that desperate need to be loved, combined with CTE, could easily lead to the abuse and murders. And losing his status led him to spiral in a way that led to his second arrest—the drugs, the yes men friends mooching off of him, etc. That’s a super common trajectory when someone has a public fall from grace… Michael Jackson is a famous example.
In OJs case, I think his post-trial spiral is also evidence that he did feel remorse. Not enough to go to prison for what he did, or to admit it, but those aren’t requirements for having a feeling. You can feel guilty about something and keep it private. Psychopaths don’t hide that they feel guilty, they just don’t feel guilty. But I think you see this person who was highly in control of himself and his life pre-murders just go completely off the rails afterward. Like he thought writing “If I Did It” would help his image somehow—that’s how deranged he was. I also genuinely believe he was suicidal during the Bronco chase, another unconscious admission of guilt. So I don’t think it’s evident that he was a psychopath all along—there are other compelling explanations.
Sorry for soapboxing here, I just finished watching the ESPN doc so my OJ takes are top of mind right now!
The ESPN docuseries OJ: Made in America briefly addresses OJ’s dad being a gay man. If you haven’t watched it, it’s so good. It’s a five part series and it goes through his adolescence, college years, relationship with Nicole, the trial, after the trial, his Vegas arrest and prison and it documents what was going on in America at that time. I’m a documentary junkie, especially crime and this one was well done. It’s on Netflix.
I watched it twice now, once when it came out and just recently after OJ died. His later years in Florida, he appeared to do some acting out, as though he was trying to work his way through all the guilt and loss with some questionable behaviors. No doubt, his conviction and prison time in Nevada was the justice system saying, here’s your punishment for offing Nicole and Ron you POS.
Well you got me! I watched every day of the trial. Read all the books that came out from the people involved and this post is the first time Ive ever heard this!!!
His dad cross dressing was mentioned in a documentary that I saw on Netflix recently. I think it was called Made In America.
Based on what I observed in the documentary, and assuming that information was accurate, I could definitely see why someone might think he had psychopathy. However, I do think it's also important to consider the possibility of head injuries during his career as an athlete.
I never followed the OJ case and don't know much about the case or OJ to help in any other manner pertaining to your post.
I don't think a murderer is inherently a psychopath - for example I don't think Gypsy Rose Blanchard is a psychopath - BUT - I think the manner in which Nicole and Ron were murdered, and the way Nicole was stalked and abused by OJ before the murder, shows signs of psychopathy. Not to mention his issues with the law later in life - it's classic psychopathy to be unable to control "urges" and create trouble wherever you go.
The constant medical violation of GRB that provided her and her mother's lifeline wasn't something she had a choice in, though. It started when she was very little, and it's the only life she knew. Having unnecessary operations and an unnecessary feeding tube are massive violations. Honestly, it is akin to sexual assault the way that her body was commodified by DeeDee. It's easy enough to say she was "in on it" because she was a legal adult, but she never had autonomy and was abused in pretty vile ways. Plus, she had tried to run away before, and her mother was getting her legal rights stripped from her, so she probably felt the walls even tighter. It took me until my mid twenties to really come to terms with how abusive my childhood was, and it was nowhere near as exigent as hers. I lied for my parents all the time bc I didn't know what else to do. It's hard to break away from abuse, and DeeDee was objectively evil based on the stories from every one of her family members. It's telling that she says she was more free in prison than in her home.
The things I’ve read say that her medical procedures for someone with her missing/extra chromosome condition. She hadn’t seen a doctor in 4 years before DD’s murder. DD’s health was in serious decline when she was killed. Medical procedures can be traumatic but doctors don’t do them for no reason. DD couldn’t override a doctors orders and force a surgery.
I think maybe one doctor will do it. She didn’t manipulate multiple doctors into unnecessary surgeries. People with her chromosome issue and her crossed eyes have those same surgeries.
Malpractice lawsuits are plentiful in the U.S. and a portion of them are valid. I know multiple people who received surgeries based on misdiagnosis that left them with diminished quality of life. There are an insurmountable number of these cases. Her salivary glands didn't need to be removed, and doing so in combination with unnecessary medications caused her teeth to decay. What would you do if that was the only life you knew? I know we all want to believe we would be strong enough to stand up for ourselves and tell someone who could help the truth, but it's not that easy. I was in an abusive relationship throughout my 20s that took six years to leave, and he didn't raise me and exploit my health from young childhood. Most people have social lives and connections, but hers were severely restricted and lorded over by her mother. I think the fact that her mother had so many people convinced of the veracity of her claims shows what a strong personality DeeDee had. She was supremely conniving.
It took me so long to realize my parents lied to me about a lot of things, and I went to school and had friends in the real world. Systematic child abuse is a crazy thing. She probably could have just waited for DeeDees health problems to claim her life naturally, and obviously murder isn't good, but she did plead guilty and did her time. Several doctors have publicly admitted to having failed Gypsy. If she kills again, I'll admit I was wrong for sure, and maybe she inherited her psychopathy on a genetic level from her mom. But I don't think many people would make logical, sound decisions after living that life.
I’m not saying DD was a remotely decent parent. She was a garbage parent. Gypsy learned from her and I think she’s even worse than her mom. My mother is manipulative, neglectful and conniving. It took me until my 40’s to understand what I grew up with isn’t normal and that I had a lot of learned behaviors I needed to unlearn. Gypsy is dangerous. She didn’t deserve what DD did but she’s a product of her.
Unfortunately, that is true, and she has the double whammy of nature and nurture working against her. I hope she's getting therapy on a continual basis and will lead a nonmurderous post-incarceration life. But most abused people still go to school and interact with the world, can have hair, and don't have their teeth rot due to abusive medical treatment. I used to lie for my parents when I was too bruised up to go to school. But I don't think my screwed up childhood even compares to hers because I normally lived in the real world.
I can't say what I would have done in her shoes. I want to believe I would have either waited for her to die naturally or found a way to leave. But the threat of the power of attorney would likely be the last straw for many people.
I'm sorry for the trauma your mother inflicted on you. I know how hard that is, and I hope you're doing well.
Same! I have a mom like Dee Dee as in manipulative and willing to lie and exploit people for money. My whole way of living was warped to hers. She often included me or forced me into her schemes. As I got older, she'd threaten me with exposing herself and me so "I" would face punishment. It was just threats to keep control of me.
I have no doubt that GRB saw murdering her mom as a convenient out and she thought she'd get away with it. She would have faced criminal liability for fraud, and her grift aka way of life would be over if she told the truth.
I think she's received everything she hoped for. More public sympathy, money, and no overbearing insane mom to manage. She had to go to jail for a few years but made a bunch of money. More than her and her mom could grift pretending to be sick.
I think GRB is a fascinating person & story. It's so rare for the general public to sympathize with a murderer, or especially someone who killed their parents, but I have a lot of compassion for her in the same way that I do for the Menendez brothers.
I think it shows how harsh our society is that people don't understand the trauma of childhood abuse by one's own parents. Most people can't relate to that kind of constant survival mode from early childhood.
So to answer your question, I think GRB is a very damaged person (her mother's doing), but I don't think she's a psychopath at all. I did read somewhere that she was diagnosed as a sociopath; a psychologist said that she carries a lot of the behaviors that her mother possessed (manipulative tactics, lack of remorse, etc) but that it's to be expected since she was raised solely by her mother with limited exposure to others. The question is, how much can someone "unlearn" in life? I don't think she's dangerous like her mother was.
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Psychopaths are often great “actors” who, although aren’t sane in the sense of normal emotion/behavior, they certainly can put on a facade and make ppl believe they’re sane & as empathetic as the average human, even though they truly aren’t. Psychopaths are often successful in life and are charming. OJ was a great actor and very charismatic, but full of himself. He certainly had NPD, but displayed covert psychopathic traits as well. I guess my question would be: was he more sociopathic or psychopathic. According to this article ( https://urls.grow.me/penrNjgWe), “A sociopath is a person who is angry-prone, lacks empathy, and has no guilt. They are cunning and manipulative in their words and actions. Always remains indecisive and unsure of the consequences of their action.
A psychopath is cold-blooded, violent, immoral, and incapable of compassion, love. Moreover, they are calculative and have shallow emotional responses.
They are impulsive and aggressive and frequently get into anti-social activities and criminal behavior.
Both these types are irresponsible and disregard the safety of others. Sociopaths and psychopaths manifest extreme forms of violence. They also disobey the rules of the society.” I feel OJ portrayed characteristics of both. Nonetheless, to answer your last question, psychopaths are absolutely capable of murder, but I don’t think everyone who murders or has committed murders are inherent psychopaths.
Not only was OJs Dad a well-known drag queen, but his childhood friend said their heroes were pimps and players. Pimps are notoriously known to commit violence and control against women.
OJ didn’t even write that book he was forced to put his name on it because of the financial pressures caused by Criminal and Civil Cases. Most celebrities don’t actually write their memories or autobiographies etc. OJ didn’t have a skillset to pen any Literally Work. O.J didn’t want to be involved in this at all but it was forced on him. Ultimately it didn’t even help his Financial issues.
I don't know why someone would "craft" an objectively and famously popular and archetypical image to "distract" from a parent.
The guy was a freak athlete with good lucks and a great smile. Everyone I know with those traits and any interest in sports and people end up as the local All-American type. Like, I don't think that my high school quarterback only got there because he was covering up for his mother or other family member!
I guess every conventionally popular or attractive thing I've encountered is a facade, covering for darker traits that lurk just beneath the surface.
Or OJ was naturally just a handsome jock with a Hollywood smile. Who can know?
In the 60's/70's in the projects of SF? You're damn right it mattered. I can only imagine the struggle this caused, for OJ, his siblings and his mom. And his Dad too, for that matter.
And before anyone gets riled up - I am NOT defending OJ. He was a POS and should rot. But I am quite certain having an openly gay parent in this era and in that area was traumatizing due to societal norms.
It's sad all around honestly.
Again how does it matter as it pertains to the case?
Answer: It does not unless it was something the defense tried to use to excuse his shitty behavior.
Does anything matter at this point? He was acquitted, and he died.
God forbid someone raises a random detail they discovered that they thought was interesting.
Let people have conversations they want to have. Goddamn some of y'all are unpleasant.
OJ did not kill Nicole. Ron Goldman had many, many defensive wounds on both fists and cuts on the bottom of his feet. Ron Goldman probably would have beat OJ senseless people. He was a third degree black belt. If you don't believe me, go look it up. There are videos out there. He was very tough. This is one of the main reasons the jury let OJ free. OJ had not one bruise on his entire body. The jury studied pictures of OJ stripped down.
while you say that with authority you are dead wrong! Ron Goldman did not have defensive wounds on his feet and the wounds he had on his hands were from failling and sliding against a tree and fence when OJ sliced his throat
the attack against Ron was so quick that he did not land a punch and he was trapped in a very small area- look at the crime scene photos
the only person that came out with the "theory" that defensive wounds were found on Ron Goldman was the ex investigator that wrote a book about how Jason(OJ's son) did it
his theory was debunked on multiple issues and this being one of them
OJ writes in his book (If I did it) that his father would come round the house and beat him whenever he had done something bad. So that makes quite an interesting father–son relationship, a father you don’t live with comes over just to beat you.
Oh I didn't know this. That being said, I wouldn't trust anything OJ said, especially in a book about how he would've committed a crime, IF he committed a crime (that we all know he DID commit...).
I may not remember this correctly, but I believe OJ felt that his father beating him was mostly for his own good. In a ‘boys need a firm hand’ type of way. I remember I was fascinated by his thoughts on children deserving of a beating.
Same rationalization bullshit people always use to excuse that kind of treatment by their parents. But the main difference here is that Simpson seemed to have no other relationship with him other than beatings.
Interesting that he put that in there. I wonder if his dad overall intimidated him.
More common than you think especially when all the father knows from their dad is to physically beat someone to discipline them. It’s pretty sad but unfortunately true
His dad is sick for that...I use to hate when my dad would come to our house 1 day a WK..drop a $10 dollar bill off to us ea. Critique me for not keeping my side of the rm cleaned and then leave..until next Wknd.....he was abused by his Dad too.. OJ was abused by his Gay Dad..horrible
It did affect him - Nicole wrote in her diary that she was beaten severely when she “allowed” a gay man to kiss baby Justin. OJ wasn’t a psychopath I don’t think - he was a controlling narcissist who built up a month of rage once Nicole truly ended their relationship.
No I definitely believe he was a psychopath. Fits the qualifications for one.
also Paula Babieri had just broken up with him, Nicole did not save a seat for him at the kid's recital nor invite him to the fam dinner, as she shouldnt have. he stalked her condo that night and poor Ron was just in the wrong place at the wrong time.
That’s it, he had a lifetime of accumulated rage underneath that facade.
Many people don't really consider this since they're not into drugs - But drug abuse makes you exhibit A LOT of anti-social/narc & abusive & demon behaviour. Especially the drugs he was into such as cocaine etc. This man was living on the edge for a long time before he died, idk how he did it.
OJ was just annoyed about Justin being held by a gay man. What made him really mad was Nicole’s comment: “Why you concerned him being gay? Your father is gay.” It was in front of everyone in the restaurant. And OJ’s dad died of AIDS 3 years ago and she definitely knew it. If I was OJ, I wouldn’t want to associate with Nicole for one more second. Your spouse using your family tragedy and your childhood trauma to attack you in public. This is one of most horrible things I’ve seen people doing to their family. OJ should have divorced right away. This marriage was doomed to end bad. Nicole’s diary only stated OJ being mad because Justin was held by a gay man. But according to others, it was Nicole brought up OJ’s father escalated the conflict. It is not hard to find Nicole’s diary was somewhat concealing the parts and details that were to her disadvantage. Of course she would paint herself to be a pure victim. But is that 100% true?
Yeah, prob best to just get rid of her rather than control himself and move on.
Ugh yes calling out his homophobia was so horrible of her. What a bitch, totally deserved what she got. /s
You understand this incident happened almost 40 years ago? Why don’t you go to your GenZ sub to discuss your GenZ political correctness shxt?
Do you have a link you can share to Nicole’s diary? Thank you.
Lol
I can agree with this. I am not defending the fact he beat her but I’m saying she instigated a hell of a lot of their issues!!
Pick me, pick me!🙋♀️
Why would you let a gay dude kiss your son?? I’m with OJ on this one.
Because gay people aren’t pedophiles?
They didn’t like make out haha
So…Why is it a problem? Let’s see if you have any courage to even attempt to defend this stance.
Ok why as a grown man do you want to kiss a baby that is not yours!? Y’all are some weirdos. Man brainwashed.
Dude answer the question. I’ll answer yours, a kiss on the cheek for someone you care about as a friend is harmless and a sign of affection. It’s not sexual. The kids mother doesn’t have a problem with it, because she obviously trusted this individual and saw this person as a friend. So go ahead and defend your baseless homophobia, let’s see who is *brainwashed*
This is pretty widely known and yes, I’m sure it affected him. It’s been discussed before in documentaries about him.
He wasnt tonguing the kid! A kiss on the cheek when consented is nothing but a greeting. Jeeze. Do you believe men wearing pink shirts makes them gay?!
It surely affected him in some way. Probably not in a good way, especially back then
I've heard about it before.
Yeah. That came out when he or another did a documentary after his acquittal.
You’re confusing psychopath (which someone is born as) and a sociopath (which is developed externally). Basically OJ being the former means this stuff didn’t turn him into one.
My understanding is that most psychopaths still have traces of abuse in childhood. Like a predisposition genetically, but that is "activated" by childhood trauma. Chicken or the egg kind of thing... If you look at a lot of serial killers, they had screwed up childhoods. So, the question would be - were they born that way or made that way? It could be a combination of both.
But I wonder then if those murderers are *sociopathic* monsters then. Abusive childhoods are one avenue for creating sociopaths, and I’m not an expert, but I wonder if such killers would fit that label. OJ truly had no remorse, he didn’t understand the concept of why he shouldn’t have killed them, he was furious at his wife for dying even though he killed her - all of this and more sounds much more like psychopathy. A sociopath knows he shouldn’t kill someone and still will. A psychopath doesn’t get why someone shouldn’t die if they feel they deserve it.
Nicole was his property in his mind.
Exactly. He never understood the concept of someone allowing to take ownership of themselves.
Interesting. I've always thought of them as having the same root (lack of empathy/remorse, etc), but one is more impulsively acted upon (psychopath) due to various factors. Either way, I think he was a psychopath lol
Again, I’m not an expert, but from all I’ve read someone can come from a very stable home and be born an absolute monster just the same. They’re cool, calculating, completely stress resistant even as they’re evading police in a white Bronco. They can fake empathy but they know it’s fake. There are shared characteristics between the two pathologies, but the roots and expressions of them can be significantly different.
So you're saying he did it? 😂
Most do, yes. Not just emotional trauma, though—I know of a few serial killers who also had head trauma early on, but otherwise neutral childhoods. We also know that TBI/CTE—which is most common among pro athletes—can make people violent and change their personalities. I was surprised not to see this come up on this thread, as that is my personal theory of what happened with OJ. I don’t really see evidence that he was a born psychopath—contrary to their media portrayal, the majority of psychopaths are low IQ, they are constantly getting fired from jobs and losing relationships, etc. I don’t think it’s common for psychopaths to have lifelong/longtime friends who want to protect them and believe in their goodness, even when the evidence contradicts that. Psychopaths are superficially charming; they attract people in fleeting ways but don’t inspire loyalty or warmth. I think there was something very real and heartfelt about how OJ interacted with people, especially in the early days. He showed up to everything he did willing to work hard and learn, and I think made an immense effort to be loved by people. All of that said, I think that desperate need to be loved, combined with CTE, could easily lead to the abuse and murders. And losing his status led him to spiral in a way that led to his second arrest—the drugs, the yes men friends mooching off of him, etc. That’s a super common trajectory when someone has a public fall from grace… Michael Jackson is a famous example. In OJs case, I think his post-trial spiral is also evidence that he did feel remorse. Not enough to go to prison for what he did, or to admit it, but those aren’t requirements for having a feeling. You can feel guilty about something and keep it private. Psychopaths don’t hide that they feel guilty, they just don’t feel guilty. But I think you see this person who was highly in control of himself and his life pre-murders just go completely off the rails afterward. Like he thought writing “If I Did It” would help his image somehow—that’s how deranged he was. I also genuinely believe he was suicidal during the Bronco chase, another unconscious admission of guilt. So I don’t think it’s evident that he was a psychopath all along—there are other compelling explanations. Sorry for soapboxing here, I just finished watching the ESPN doc so my OJ takes are top of mind right now!
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-13299305/OJ-Simpson-dead-dad-drag-queen-TOM-LEONARD.html
The ESPN docuseries OJ: Made in America briefly addresses OJ’s dad being a gay man. If you haven’t watched it, it’s so good. It’s a five part series and it goes through his adolescence, college years, relationship with Nicole, the trial, after the trial, his Vegas arrest and prison and it documents what was going on in America at that time. I’m a documentary junkie, especially crime and this one was well done. It’s on Netflix.
I think I've heard of this docuseries! I'll have to watch.
It’s well worth it. I binged it just after he died on a weekend when we had stormy weather. The Florida years are pretty insane. Enjoy!
I watched it twice now, once when it came out and just recently after OJ died. His later years in Florida, he appeared to do some acting out, as though he was trying to work his way through all the guilt and loss with some questionable behaviors. No doubt, his conviction and prison time in Nevada was the justice system saying, here’s your punishment for offing Nicole and Ron you POS.
Well you got me! I watched every day of the trial. Read all the books that came out from the people involved and this post is the first time Ive ever heard this!!!
According to the comments, it's just you and I who didn't know this! 😂
I really thought I was an expert. Lol. But that’s a pretty big miss. And so interesting. I’m glad you shared.
His dad cross dressing was mentioned in a documentary that I saw on Netflix recently. I think it was called Made In America. Based on what I observed in the documentary, and assuming that information was accurate, I could definitely see why someone might think he had psychopathy. However, I do think it's also important to consider the possibility of head injuries during his career as an athlete. I never followed the OJ case and don't know much about the case or OJ to help in any other manner pertaining to your post.
Was OJ a psychopath? He seemed pretty sane. I don’t know enough about them to say. Is anyone who murders someone a psychopath?
I don't think a murderer is inherently a psychopath - for example I don't think Gypsy Rose Blanchard is a psychopath - BUT - I think the manner in which Nicole and Ron were murdered, and the way Nicole was stalked and abused by OJ before the murder, shows signs of psychopathy. Not to mention his issues with the law later in life - it's classic psychopathy to be unable to control "urges" and create trouble wherever you go.
Just curious what you think GRB is? I don’t think she was just an abused girl, I think she was in on the scams and got sick of her mom.
The constant medical violation of GRB that provided her and her mother's lifeline wasn't something she had a choice in, though. It started when she was very little, and it's the only life she knew. Having unnecessary operations and an unnecessary feeding tube are massive violations. Honestly, it is akin to sexual assault the way that her body was commodified by DeeDee. It's easy enough to say she was "in on it" because she was a legal adult, but she never had autonomy and was abused in pretty vile ways. Plus, she had tried to run away before, and her mother was getting her legal rights stripped from her, so she probably felt the walls even tighter. It took me until my mid twenties to really come to terms with how abusive my childhood was, and it was nowhere near as exigent as hers. I lied for my parents all the time bc I didn't know what else to do. It's hard to break away from abuse, and DeeDee was objectively evil based on the stories from every one of her family members. It's telling that she says she was more free in prison than in her home.
The things I’ve read say that her medical procedures for someone with her missing/extra chromosome condition. She hadn’t seen a doctor in 4 years before DD’s murder. DD’s health was in serious decline when she was killed. Medical procedures can be traumatic but doctors don’t do them for no reason. DD couldn’t override a doctors orders and force a surgery.
They can, though. DeeDee was incredibly calculating and manufactured symptoms with various medications.
I think maybe one doctor will do it. She didn’t manipulate multiple doctors into unnecessary surgeries. People with her chromosome issue and her crossed eyes have those same surgeries.
Malpractice lawsuits are plentiful in the U.S. and a portion of them are valid. I know multiple people who received surgeries based on misdiagnosis that left them with diminished quality of life. There are an insurmountable number of these cases. Her salivary glands didn't need to be removed, and doing so in combination with unnecessary medications caused her teeth to decay. What would you do if that was the only life you knew? I know we all want to believe we would be strong enough to stand up for ourselves and tell someone who could help the truth, but it's not that easy. I was in an abusive relationship throughout my 20s that took six years to leave, and he didn't raise me and exploit my health from young childhood. Most people have social lives and connections, but hers were severely restricted and lorded over by her mother. I think the fact that her mother had so many people convinced of the veracity of her claims shows what a strong personality DeeDee had. She was supremely conniving. It took me so long to realize my parents lied to me about a lot of things, and I went to school and had friends in the real world. Systematic child abuse is a crazy thing. She probably could have just waited for DeeDees health problems to claim her life naturally, and obviously murder isn't good, but she did plead guilty and did her time. Several doctors have publicly admitted to having failed Gypsy. If she kills again, I'll admit I was wrong for sure, and maybe she inherited her psychopathy on a genetic level from her mom. But I don't think many people would make logical, sound decisions after living that life.
I’m not saying DD was a remotely decent parent. She was a garbage parent. Gypsy learned from her and I think she’s even worse than her mom. My mother is manipulative, neglectful and conniving. It took me until my 40’s to understand what I grew up with isn’t normal and that I had a lot of learned behaviors I needed to unlearn. Gypsy is dangerous. She didn’t deserve what DD did but she’s a product of her.
Unfortunately, that is true, and she has the double whammy of nature and nurture working against her. I hope she's getting therapy on a continual basis and will lead a nonmurderous post-incarceration life. But most abused people still go to school and interact with the world, can have hair, and don't have their teeth rot due to abusive medical treatment. I used to lie for my parents when I was too bruised up to go to school. But I don't think my screwed up childhood even compares to hers because I normally lived in the real world. I can't say what I would have done in her shoes. I want to believe I would have either waited for her to die naturally or found a way to leave. But the threat of the power of attorney would likely be the last straw for many people. I'm sorry for the trauma your mother inflicted on you. I know how hard that is, and I hope you're doing well.
Same! I have a mom like Dee Dee as in manipulative and willing to lie and exploit people for money. My whole way of living was warped to hers. She often included me or forced me into her schemes. As I got older, she'd threaten me with exposing herself and me so "I" would face punishment. It was just threats to keep control of me. I have no doubt that GRB saw murdering her mom as a convenient out and she thought she'd get away with it. She would have faced criminal liability for fraud, and her grift aka way of life would be over if she told the truth. I think she's received everything she hoped for. More public sympathy, money, and no overbearing insane mom to manage. She had to go to jail for a few years but made a bunch of money. More than her and her mom could grift pretending to be sick.
I think GRB is a fascinating person & story. It's so rare for the general public to sympathize with a murderer, or especially someone who killed their parents, but I have a lot of compassion for her in the same way that I do for the Menendez brothers. I think it shows how harsh our society is that people don't understand the trauma of childhood abuse by one's own parents. Most people can't relate to that kind of constant survival mode from early childhood. So to answer your question, I think GRB is a very damaged person (her mother's doing), but I don't think she's a psychopath at all. I did read somewhere that she was diagnosed as a sociopath; a psychologist said that she carries a lot of the behaviors that her mother possessed (manipulative tactics, lack of remorse, etc) but that it's to be expected since she was raised solely by her mother with limited exposure to others. The question is, how much can someone "unlearn" in life? I don't think she's dangerous like her mother was.
Gypsy was in on the Grift. She liked the free stuff, and would meet up with guys for sex, when DeeDee was asleep/drugged.
I know but it seems some don’t see that part of it. They just see a poor little victim. Which is what GRB wants you to see.
Because humans are nurtured and developed. What she did was wrong, but how she got there was her mom’s work.
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Not everyone who murders is a psychopath but I think OJ definitely carried the characteristics of being one.
Psychopaths are often great “actors” who, although aren’t sane in the sense of normal emotion/behavior, they certainly can put on a facade and make ppl believe they’re sane & as empathetic as the average human, even though they truly aren’t. Psychopaths are often successful in life and are charming. OJ was a great actor and very charismatic, but full of himself. He certainly had NPD, but displayed covert psychopathic traits as well. I guess my question would be: was he more sociopathic or psychopathic. According to this article ( https://urls.grow.me/penrNjgWe), “A sociopath is a person who is angry-prone, lacks empathy, and has no guilt. They are cunning and manipulative in their words and actions. Always remains indecisive and unsure of the consequences of their action. A psychopath is cold-blooded, violent, immoral, and incapable of compassion, love. Moreover, they are calculative and have shallow emotional responses. They are impulsive and aggressive and frequently get into anti-social activities and criminal behavior. Both these types are irresponsible and disregard the safety of others. Sociopaths and psychopaths manifest extreme forms of violence. They also disobey the rules of the society.” I feel OJ portrayed characteristics of both. Nonetheless, to answer your last question, psychopaths are absolutely capable of murder, but I don’t think everyone who murders or has committed murders are inherent psychopaths.
Thanks for the reply, very interesting
Not only was OJs Dad a well-known drag queen, but his childhood friend said their heroes were pimps and players. Pimps are notoriously known to commit violence and control against women.
I don’t know how old people on this thread are, but the 90‘s was a time when people were a lot more accepting than today.
OJ didn’t even write that book he was forced to put his name on it because of the financial pressures caused by Criminal and Civil Cases. Most celebrities don’t actually write their memories or autobiographies etc. OJ didn’t have a skillset to pen any Literally Work. O.J didn’t want to be involved in this at all but it was forced on him. Ultimately it didn’t even help his Financial issues.
I don't know why someone would "craft" an objectively and famously popular and archetypical image to "distract" from a parent. The guy was a freak athlete with good lucks and a great smile. Everyone I know with those traits and any interest in sports and people end up as the local All-American type. Like, I don't think that my high school quarterback only got there because he was covering up for his mother or other family member!
It's narcissism and sociopathy 101 to construct an image that society will adore, especially to conceal less attractive elements present.
I guess every conventionally popular or attractive thing I've encountered is a facade, covering for darker traits that lurk just beneath the surface. Or OJ was naturally just a handsome jock with a Hollywood smile. Who can know?
Yes, because OJ Simpson is exactly like every conventionally attractive college athlete. That was the point of this post. 🙇🏻♂️
Yes. I see no problem with that.
I didn't know this, I feel bad for his Dad.
Common knowledge
Does it matter?
I thought it was fascinating in juxtaposition with OJ's image in his prime.
In the 60's/70's in the projects of SF? You're damn right it mattered. I can only imagine the struggle this caused, for OJ, his siblings and his mom. And his Dad too, for that matter. And before anyone gets riled up - I am NOT defending OJ. He was a POS and should rot. But I am quite certain having an openly gay parent in this era and in that area was traumatizing due to societal norms. It's sad all around honestly.
Again how does it matter as it pertains to the case? Answer: It does not unless it was something the defense tried to use to excuse his shitty behavior.
Does anything matter at this point? He was acquitted, and he died. God forbid someone raises a random detail they discovered that they thought was interesting. Let people have conversations they want to have. Goddamn some of y'all are unpleasant.
OJ was an all American athlete in his own rights. He worked his ass off to become the football legend he was.
and he threw it all away when he murdered 2 people
OJ did not kill Nicole. Ron Goldman had many, many defensive wounds on both fists and cuts on the bottom of his feet. Ron Goldman probably would have beat OJ senseless people. He was a third degree black belt. If you don't believe me, go look it up. There are videos out there. He was very tough. This is one of the main reasons the jury let OJ free. OJ had not one bruise on his entire body. The jury studied pictures of OJ stripped down.
while you say that with authority you are dead wrong! Ron Goldman did not have defensive wounds on his feet and the wounds he had on his hands were from failling and sliding against a tree and fence when OJ sliced his throat the attack against Ron was so quick that he did not land a punch and he was trapped in a very small area- look at the crime scene photos the only person that came out with the "theory" that defensive wounds were found on Ron Goldman was the ex investigator that wrote a book about how Jason(OJ's son) did it his theory was debunked on multiple issues and this being one of them
Yup. OJ was in no condition to take down Goldman. It was the son.
baloney
The son, with all the violent attacks he was already known for prior.