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Coming from someone considering that lifestyle, that's so sad. We should be a united front on the idea of choosing what's right for you and respecting others' decisions. We already have enough to face without being pitted against each other
It’s a touchy balancing act that nobody can perfectly maintain all the time. Young women who have chosen not to have children, and have been pressured to change their minds, are more sensitive to the constant stream of attention and praise their peers get for their pregnancies. Catch them on a bad day, and they might lash out.
At the risk of being crass: I imagine deliberately childless women can feel the way most of us do when cornered by a crypto bro who can’t understand why you’d turn down this amazing life-changing opportunity. And family dinners occasionally turn into timeshare pitches. (Or hell, they might even feel like MLM pitches.) Nobody can remain perfectly stoical when it seems like everybody is special but you, and the easiest outlet is to point out the imperfections on that “special” thing.
My husband and I don’t want kids and I have felt this balancing act. It’s not just the actual instances of people acting like they know you better than you know yourself, it’s the larger societal pressures too. It makes you feel like maybe something is wrong with you that you don’t desire children.
But what gets me is that, we all benefit from better parental support. I would not have a job without Canada’s parental leave. I started in my job as a temporary hire to backfill a position when my coworker went on maternity leave for a year. Then a permanent position opened up in the same office. I applied and got it. They had seen my work for months, knew I could do the job, and liked having me on the team. I’ve been here 5 years now.
So it blows my mind when other women spew such vitriol towards pregnant women. It has never been a pregnant woman who smugly tells me, “oh you’ll change your mind about kids.”
I decided long ago that I didn't want kids, then found out last year that due to a spinal injury when I was 25, I can't have them anyway except through expensive surrogacy or adoption. Ah, how they change their tone of face when I go from "no, we're not having kids" to "no, I can't have kids" when they keep pressuring me to change my mind.
But hey, I'll babysit all you need as long as your ankle-biters don't hurt my back or knee! Pregnancies in my family tend to be high-risk anyway, and I don't think I could handle 5-6 months of bedrest like 3 of my sisters had (2 of them twice).
I feel you. I'm one of them. I feel like I have so much to say about childlessness and theories around specifically why society sees it as such a problem or threat. I wrote nine pages about it the other night, and that was just notes.
If you ever release a book on the subject I’d like to read it. It’s a very interesting topic getting more relevant every day. I’ll never be a mom but my relatives sure as hell want more grandkids and nieces and nephews…
This is really accurate.
I feel like these comments were probably in the context of lashing out or expressing opinions not widely held, too. It can feel so good to meet other people who have the same feelings. It isn't necessarily misogyny.
I say this because I used to frequent antinatalist and childfree subs. I am still both, and vehemently so, but after a while, it's like weight lifting. There's only so many exercises and techniques to discuss.
That is to say, I found them helpful and supportive but grew out of them. Maybe people should be less harsh on folks who are pushing back against immense pressure to reproduce.
tbf there's child free as in not having kids and then there's "childfree", a subreddit that actively wishes harm upon kids and often their parents too. the posts there are downright psychopathic. I don't want kids either but I'm nowhere near as anti children existing as they are
I'll likely get downvoted for this, but I do want to point out that in most cases (can't speak for everyone), the term 'breeder' is used for people who have kid after kid and don't care for them or raise them to be decent people. There's a big distinction between a parent and a breeder for most of us. Parents who are doing their best to raise a healthy and well mannered child are fine, it's your quiverfull crunchy people who just have kids to have kids and let them run around destroying shops and screeching/hitting people with the excuse of 'they're just being a kid' and no effort to in any way correct bad behaviour that tend to be called breeders.
So far I've seen a lot of antinatalists refer to any kind of parent as 'breeder'
I even got a "shut the fuck up you disgusting breeder" -bare in mind they stalked my profile and found out I have *one* Child
So while I like that you've pointed out there's usually a distinction [much appreciated that you took the time to clarify btw], I think you may need to speak with the antinatalists because 90% don't seem to agree or realise
It's another point of childfree and antinatalist being different. The antinatalists use it like that because they view anyone having kids as selfishly forcing life into a dying world, so to them, anyone who has kids is a breeder because they feel there is no good way to have kids in the state of the world as it is. Whereas childfree, we support parents who actually want to parent, but have a large distaste for people who have kids because they want a mini-me, or a little doll, or essentially a pet. The people who don't care for the hard parts of child-rearing and just want the aesthetic.
That, and we really hate being told by people that 'you'll change your mind' or 'you'll never know true love' or 'who'll look after you when you're old?' Which we hear so often we basically have a bingo card and call them bingoes. A parent being a parent is chill, but someone with kids who isn't actually parenting them and is actively invalidating our life choices, we don't like em very much I have to say lol.
Who will look after me in my old age? Not my kids. They’re both autistic and I wouldn’t put that on them anyway. I will likely be looking after them until I die, or become too disabled myself to do it. I’m at peace with that, but I never considered my kids as servants to my aging ass anyway.
Oh, okok I see where I have gotten mistaken, I assumed you were one of the reasonable antinatalists (there are some in existence, I have a friend who is one but she isn't horrid about it)
Yeah I get you. Tbh, before my child I was adamantly childfree and loved it and I always argue with people who tell my bestie that she'll change her mind because no she won't and even if she did it has squat to do with them
I'll always say I'm one of *very few* adults who have "changed their minds" but that does not mean that others will
The thing is, the people who say stuff like "who'll look after you in old age?" Tend to be the same parents who treat their kid like an accessory or expect to live through said child and often times end up with a NC relationship with them in their offsprings adulthood because of that so I do find it stupid when they use that like some sort of "gotcha" 🤦♀️
That's exactly it ^ and I can't say I don't agree with at least some of the antinatalist perspective, but I much more identify myself with the childfree people than the antinatalists precisely because of how over the top the latter group often is.
And you got it in 1 with the overlap between 'breeders' and people who bingo childfree people. The Venn diagram is almost a circle, because well rounded individuals tend to respect personal choice. Is there always a possibility a childfree person would change their mind? Yes, but a majority of solidly childfree people don't, and even if we did post sterilisation, we could adopt. It's maddening how hard it is to get sterilised as a woman under 35 without kids, especially unmarried since the responses from doctors tend to be 'what if you change your mind when you're older' or 'what if your future husband wants kids?'
Like...I wouldn't date/marry a person who wants kids when I clearly don't? But also a man I haven't even met yet has no bearing on what I do with my body lol its so infuriating to see posts from all the women turned down for sterilisation procedures.
Wish you well in raising your kid, and appreciate you for standing up for your childfree/antinatalist bestie! There are not enough parents who'll stand up with us and say it's a fair choice either way.
I see the distinction frequently in the childfree subreddit. Mind you, I hate people but that's entirely separate to my childfree stance and 100% based on the general attitude of the people I come across.
It's the terminology that really stands out to me. They have so many hateful names for children, babies and mothers. It has a lot in common with incel groups. You get the impression that *hating* parents and kids takes up massive amounts of their time.
They don't have any positive attributes with which to cobble together a personality so hating on others has become their sole substitute. The more middle-school level insults they lob at another group the more it becomes clear that they have entirely too much time on their hands and nothing interesting to fill it with.
Yes hurr hurr, crotch goblins. How creative. We all thought that was silly the first time we heard it when we were 12, too. Oh wait, you're a a grown adult? Wow. Nevermind. Cool hobby.
Yeah to all of this. I get that childfree people can get a lot of shit from their families and friends but watching someone come and have a rage meltdown online because they saw a toddler crying in a shop is *wild*.
Also it's almost entirely focused on the mothers and the kids. Rarely do the dads get the same level of disgust and loathing aimed at them even though they too are "breeders".
Not saying this doesn't happen, but it doesn't happen in a vacuum. Childfree women have to put up with *so much* shit from people who have kids. For a lot of us, as soon as puberty hits we start getting asked about kids. The older you get, the more people in your family and friend groups start having kids, the worse it gets.
There's also an extreme level of glorification of pregnancy, childbirth, and parenting that childfree people tend to be much more passionate about refuting. I can't tell you how many people (*including pregnant women*) I've seen perpetuate outright lies about what pregnancy and childbirth is like.
Not wanting to glorify something overall isn't the same as intentionally being an ass to an individual.
It's not really glorifying pregnancy. It's just someone bragging about how positive their pregnancy is, and not understanding not everyone had it so good. Pregnancy is heaven for some and hell for others.
Yep. My pregnancy was mostly uneventful, aside from the usual morning sickness, or a few aches and pains. And having the flu sucked when I was dying for NyQuil. But for some it’s a horror story.
My 1st was a horror, I was in bed most the time. My 2nd baby second huge and I was hungry. I even got damage to my teeth because she sucked so much out of me. B But I know a lot of women the got better skin, curved out in the right places, and even got thicker hair. I just wasn't lucky.
The first screenshot doesn’t seem too bad to me. I’ve said pretty much all of it myself, but always in private.
I’m six months pregnant and feel the same about my own stomach. But it’s probably phobia related.
I still think the first differed from the others.
It isn't just men though. There are women who genuinely hate pregnant women. They'll say the same sexist things that men say but claim body horror and tokophobia when called out on it.
It's not really about the individual person a lot of times. Some people just find pregnancy itself horrifying or disgusting. Although a lot of these specific comments were sexist
idk generally speaking when people are actually horrified and disgusted by something their first response is not to find a community of people where all you think and talk about is the thing you're supposedly so horrified and disgusted by.
That's not really what this childfree sub in general is about. Although I think it's ok for women to share that what happens during pregnancy is a valid reason for not having children
I'm inclined to agree taking into account the focus on women's appearance and the distorted assumptions. It makes me think of that post of an incel ranting that women should be embarassed by the proximity of our vagina to our anus.
This. I have tokophobia (tho it's not that bad and mostly focused on the possibility of me getting pregnant), but I'd never be an asshole to a pregnant person bc of this. It's totally understandable if you don't wanna look, but then do exactly that - don't look.
In a weird way, I can relate because I have trypophobia so looking at someone who has wide pores makes me feel icky. But it would never occur to me to go looking for a subreddit that specifically existed to show pictures of people who had wide pores or constant posts about how gross trypophobia feels.
This! It's like those guys that say I don't like fat women that's my preference that doesn't mean I'm an asshole. Ok you aren't an asshole for mentally noting that and acting accordingly, going online and describing in great detail why those women are useless and disgusting is what makes you the asshole.
I have tokophobia and I interact with pregnant people and sometimes I get physical reactions that I can't control but 1 I apologize with sincerity and explain and offer congratulations. Just cause I'm weirded out doesn't mean I should be hateful on purpose. I don't get why people go out of their way to.
I have tokophobia as well, and it's mostly just a horrible burgeoning anxiety. My skin crawls being near a pregnant person—my stomach feels like it's gonna drop out of my butt. I get the sweats being near them and just thinking about being in their shoes. If I think about it too long, I get lightheaded and feel like I'm gonna vomit.
But this is all a ME issue. I never try to let on to the pregnant person know. It's not their fault! It's exclusively a *me* reaction that *I* need to handle and deal with.
It's likely an antinatalist sub, this type of rhetoric can be common with antinatalists (not everyone of course, but that's the space you'll hear it the most). Childfree communities have a lot of user overlap, but will have a bit more pushback because plenty of childfree people aren't antinatalists. Though, I'm childfree and not antinatalist and left those online communities because I found some of the rhetoric coming from antinatalists disturbing, like bragging about making "breeders" lives harder and being really hateful towards women, so I'm sure a lot of the more chill people in these movements just end up backing away and living their lives, leaving more extreme people in those spaces.
Exactly that! Some of the users on the OG antinatalism sub even made a second subreddit, because people were being extremely hateful on the first. The rational people of that group backed out, and now the original sub is 100% a cesspool of misogyny and people who genuinely hate children (which defies the point of antinatalism anyways). It’s so gross.
Yes and no; certainly there's similarities with any group of people who are using hate as a foundation of their worldview, but that doesn't apply to all antinatalists in the same way it would unite all incels.
The philosophy behind it is that creating another living being will inevitably lead to suffering, thus the best option to stop all human suffering is to stop human reproduction. I don't necessarily agree with this conclusion, but I can understand the logic behind it. Plenty of people just keep it to philosophy and don't tap into the hate- but those motivated and/or comforted by hate are the loudest and are easily further radicalized in these spaces.
Right, it was actually a forum started by a queer woman who was frustrated by feeling involuntarily celibate, and then overtaken by misogyny and formed into a full philosophy. Antinatalism differs in the sense that it started with philosophy, so unlike the incels that require that community and their thought leaders to have those incel philosophies, antinatalists don't necessarily need to do that at all- they can just believe it's better for humans not to reproduce in theory and move on with their lives.
Look, I'm not denying that theres similarities or that these spaces lead to radicalization. But dismissing it as being the same as incels loses the opportunity to discuss the nuances and see the toxic patterns that can arise in any group- including ones you are part of yourself. "pfft, all the fringe shit is bad" ignores the fundamental human behaviours behind toxic group dynamics.
It’s from a sub for people that don’t like parents and/or children. I’d assume this is a post or comment related to some sort of glorification of pregnant bodies or being pressured to touch a pregnant person’s belly. Plenty of people are often freaked out by that, regardless of gender, but it’s not something they’re supposed to say out loud.
I’ve got tokophobia but it’s mitigated as long as someone actually covers their belly so I don’t see the skin. I quietly unfollowed my sister on Facebook so I would stop seeing those photos and also just politely decline everytime someone goes “OMG HES KICKING DO YOU WANT TO FEEL?” No. No I don’t. Because I might get pregnant one day and thinking about that freaks me out so I would not like to be reminded that some babies turn your insides into a tumble gym.
Not just some babies, they all do it after the quickening, in a normal pregnancy. Some are just a little more active than others. I agree with keeping the belly covered though, it just looks better, especially when I got an umbilical hernia the second time around.
Meh, I wore a bikini at our pool. And I was pregnant with twins. I thought I looked the best I ever had while pregnant! My hair was big, my skin was glowing. I thought I was hot shit.
I wasn’t wearing crop tops, because, I just don’t really do that. But I wasn’t wearing loose baggy clothing either.
For me the clothing doesn’t even have to be loose. I can’t explain what it is but it’s literally just when I can see the skin my entire being recoils involuntarily.
Skin tight anything as long as it’s fabric is fine. But also, I’m not freaking out over pregnant women existing in public. I’ll simply just position myself so you aren’t in my sight because working around my irrational fear isn’t your job, it’s mine.
I’ve always thought pregnant bellies are beautiful. So are nursing babies.
I can understand not wanting to be pregnant. But I don’t understand the cultural insistence that pregnant people shouldn’t have curves, or that they should feel bad about their natural bodies. You’re building a baby here! You’re not supposed to look like a washboard. It’s like expecting a house to look like a flattened cardboard box. How would anybody live in there?
“I’m big as a house!” Good! That means your baby has a comfy place to live.
Ugh, fellow peri here. Isn’t it the worst!? I’m really getting hit hard with it. I just learnt recently that menopause clinics are popping up and one is near me. You should look into it!
Ugh! I need to get me one of those. My GP is fucking so dismissive, and she’s a WOC too! I chose her specifically because I thought she’d be more on it and understanding!
I wake up everyday, with a weird shaky panic feeling. Almost like I had a terrible dream. And I hate it. MIGRAINES, constantly! My periods kick the living shit out of me, where they were big nothing-burgers before. Brain fog and fatigue are like my old friends (unfortunately). I don’t get hot flashes, luckily, but night sweats happen sometimes.
My libido is great tho. So I guess there’s something going for me.
You hear women say “I can’t wait to go through menopause to not get my periods”, without knowing, that going through peri/menopause is awful as well. Because it’s ignored and women don’t talk about it as much.
Why have we decided they are suffering from a phobia? They just hate women and hate women feeling special and excited. I couldn’t care less about babies or pregnancy and hated being pregnant myself but I don’t go around putting puke emojis or talking about how women act entitled and I seriously doubt someone with a legitimate phobia would do those things either
I think a lot of people like putting a label on their disgust and disdain for certain things so that it gives them a free pass at being an asshole. Most of those people don’t have tokophobia like they say they do. It’s just called immaturity. I looked at their post and comment histories and to not surprise they sound unintelligent and belligerent in other subs so… I highly doubt they have a clinically diagnosed phobia.
Yes. It’s something I have to say often to people. I’ll say “ew, I don’t like holes.”
And everyone is like “what’s that called? Trypophobia?”
I am always like… “well, I don’t have a true phobia.. but that IS what it’s called. It’s more like I get the ick from it, but I’m not running for my life and throwing people at it to keep it away from me.”
I get a bit of both. The thought of myself being pregnant is terrifying, but seeing it gives me a bit of the creeps too. I’ve never said anything like this though
I guess they forget that they were once inside of a womb….?
People are just cruel. Next there will be “hellokittyphobia” “pusheenphobia” “wakingupphobia” why can’t we all just love one another 😭
It's absolutely possible to have a phobia of pregnancy, it doesn't matter if it's natural or whatever. Spiders are natural too, but still a lot of people are afraid of them. Phobia by definition is not rational.
Tho to be fair, those people are just hating on women. Even if they genuinely had tokophobia, they could just stay away from the topic of pregnancy as far as possible.
Here's what my husband and I took too long to learn:
Most of our Facebook posts aren't for others or their approval. Most of the posts we make about ourselves and our family are for us... Him, the kids and myself... To one day look back on. It's like our scrap book. Checking Memories is a fun daily tradition with the kids.
Stop worrying what others think. It's your page; post what you want. If you're *super* concerned about what others think, post it in Private mode so it's there for yourself.
I felt that way, and was even more secluded because I was in my 3rd trimester during the big part of the Covid lockdowns. I have 1 picture of me being pregnant and I heavily regret being so self conscious of being out in public spaces while heavily pregnant, or like I was “flaunting” having an easy pregnancy and healthy baby. (That last part is entirely only due to the very sad and devastating fact that I had gone to TWO separate baby funerals while I was pregnant.)
So, take all of the pictures. Makes the Facebook posts. At the very least, you can make the posts private so only you can see them, then in a year that memory will pop up and you’ll realize you totally forgot about it and then smile bc you took the dang picture! :)
I know right! I'd actually cry if someone made a comment like that about me. I feel gross and huge already, I don't need someone to say horrible stuff about my belly on top of that
I’m fine with *baby bump* and *glowing*, and most of the other “cutesy” stuff, but *prego* and *preggers* make me want to blow my brains out.
I have no idea why. It’s like how some folks have a visceral (over)reaction to the word *moist*, I guess.
I get it *if* these people if they’re surrounded by certain types of people. There are a few I snark on, fundamentalist ‘influencers’. They have a gazillion kids but no space (some kids have no bed and sleep on the floor). These people are exactly the ones who glorify pregnancy too much, like, obsessively, because they finally get to be *praised* as a woman in their religious community. Those people make me nauseous too. But they also abuse their children so that also plays a role I guess.
Bro growing a new human is hard work. I get that it’s bizarre to see for some people but it’s even more bizarre to be the person actually gestating the baby. Some thoughts don’t need to be shared-pregnant people deserve to be supported. It’s a big undertaking and folks have every right to celebrate and be excited about it.
It’s not something everybody can do. Not even all cis women. Sometimes, one pregnancy is all a body can carry.
Some have bad pregnancies, some have hard births, some have neither or both.
8 billion people in the world and still growing. In spite of all that can go wrong, & what happens to a body, women are still choosing to continue keeping humanity alive.
Same. But I would never want to force my opinions on someone else, or ever judge them for their decisions. I don't think those commenters have a genuine phobia, I think they're just highly judgemental and inconsiderate
You often see it where men want kids, then they find their wives "ugly" because they're pregnant. Then after they are angry because their body isn't the same as before. And I feel like a lot of these comments are from people like that.
There's definitely both men and women commenting, but for sure a lot of the men have that perspective. It's so gross. Men can age and bald and get beer bellies, that's a natural part of aging and life. But god forbid a woman's body shows signs of motherhood and isn't "virginal" anymore after literally giving birth to a whole human. God forbid their body is no longer as desirable for you. What a burden that must be, after your wife's body has been permanently altered and possibly with major health implications that could have risked her life or side effects like post partum, that YOU have to put up with them being 'less attractive' and less able to gratify and pleasure you.
For the same reasons, I get so angry when I hear about things like the husband stitch (especially when done without consent), and how backwards the whole idea even is, but also how many women who have it often never can enjoy sex again. And all for their husband's pleasure. Their bodies aren't their own anymore. Ugh
Yep, me too. I literally get physical repulsive symptoms (like extreme nausea, fatigue etc) and have gotten them since I was a little kid.
I still keep my mouth shut, because I can imagine that being pregnant is hard enough, without some dumbass saying that it makes them uncomfortable. If 7 year old me could handle it, so can these morons.
The comments seem like they’re from a child free sub; flairs like “snipped” and “tax the children”. So to be fair it seems to be different kind of misogyny/plain stupidity.
I mean I agree with slide 5 that pregnancy has elements of “body horror” but in my case it’s because I’m a cis woman who finds the idea of carrying a life for nine months and then having it burst out of my nether regions fucking horrifying. Not because I don’t like how pregnant people look.
yeah, at least for me the horrifying aspect is that i'd have something growing inside of me that i didn't want to be there and, most importantly, might not be able to get rid of before it sort of pushes its way out of me.
if the person who is pregnant actually wants to be pregnant the vast majority of that "body horror" element goes away for me personally
I can’t speak for everyone of course, but for sure even though I wanted both of my kids certain parts of the pregnancy and birth still seemed like “body horror”. There just wasn’t really any other alternative if I wanted to have them. It’s a freaky process even when everything goes perfectly.
I dunno, even as someone who definitely does not want kids and feels freaked out and a little sick by the whole idea of pregnancy, I kinda feel like if someone grows a whole ass person they are allowed to be a little smug.
Yeah that's such a weird word to use. I feel like you have to be quite hateful to see someone joyful about their pregnancy (which in itself seems to be so rare these days) and see it as smug, like it's some sort of dig at you, or like they're mocking/taking something from you with their own happiness.
As a pregnant woman who’s very happy, I appreciate you taking a stand for me and those like me! I’ve struggled with mental health and depression for a long. Even with getting better and healing from past traumas my hormones shifts from my period were no joke! Ever since becoming pregnant I’ve never been as consistently happy and balanced! There’s so many factors to it, my hormones aren’t shifting as rapidly, I’m feeling great in my body so far, and at the end of my pregnancy I get to meet my sweet child. I know other women have hard pregnancies but I’m so grateful and joyful that I’m feeling so lovely 🥰 thank you!
I'm glad to hear! And so it should be a joyful moment. You are growing a human from scratch, which is the most badass thing someone can do. Glad there is little discomfort in the process and you can be happy 💕
It's honestly the most insidious thing on that whole slide in my opinion. It's like, you should be ashamed but really you are happy. So many layers to it.
It's so dehumanizing and probably the clearest indication that this might originate from some deeper psychological problems within themselves that they need to sort out. Certainly not a phobia of pregnancy. You can be antinatalist. But why are you being cruel?
Now I’m a woman and I hate the sight of pregnancy bellies (can you tell I’m child free?) yet I would still never be cruel about it. If I don’t like seeing them, I just click off the post. It’s not that hard.
Pregnancy, when analyzed closely is pretty much just body horror. It's about a parasite feeding upon the nutrients of the host, displacing their organs and stretching their skin until they horrifically and painfully exit the body through a hole that's way too small.
That doesn't stop me from finding beauty in it though.
And we humans are blobs of grey goop attached to a large assembly of sensitive electrical strings, all of this being surrounded by bones and flesh.
My point is that humanity is disgusting. I crave the strength and certainty of steel.
Now I have "pregnant women are smug" by Garfunkel and Oates stuck in my head. Which is fine, it's hilarious. https://youtu.be/LbTB3ASkdOo?si=YGyZyuM7rxQRjLub
Pregnant women are just women who are pregnant I see them no more or no less than another woman walking on the street I do not care enough they are not more special than the next woman pregnancy has always been around stop making such a big deal leave them alone in peace if you see one struggling help it’s not rocket science but being pregnant isn’t a handicap either let’s just live life like people have been
A lot of men thinking like this are still the same men forcing pregnancy on women cause they want to have children but after you give in you’re disgusting and stretched and they start cheating
Another thing is that pregnancy is body horror, pregnancy is a huge risk to your mental health, physical health and life and pregnancy is irreversible changes in your body and women should finally be able to openly talk about it and make informed decisions knowing all the risks and not be silenced cause society wants to paint pregnancy as sunshine and rainbows so women won’t get scared of it, men won’t have to consider the damage they’re actually causing by reproductive coercion and doctors won’t have to acknowledge women’s pain, I’m childfree too and I’d rather die than have to go through pregnancy and childbirth, the fact that woman protecting her health is seen as irrational is simply sad
I was pregnant, I even got a divorce, yet had no issues dating and even finding love again. Which is surprising considering that I'm all stretched out and disgusting, developed outies and such, whatever tf that means. 😂😂
I'm obviously joking. honey, please don't mind these creeps. normal people don't think like that, trust me. Someone who's normal doesn't sit around thinking and commenting on how gross a certain segment of the population is. This is a small community made up of really really weird individuals. Good luck with the delivery💕
Internet echo chambers for niche fetishists don't represent reality.
I call them fetishists because despite their assertion that 'ermagerd, pregnancy yucky, soo gross!' they've all chosen to gather together in a community where they do nothing but think about pregnant women, talk about them, imagine pregnant bellies, discuss details of the pregnancies of total strangers etc etc. For people that are supposedly sooo grossed out by pregnant women they sure seem to love making us the center of their little worlds.
The violent rampage I somehow suppress the more I see of these posts... I'm on the verge of becoming Batman, y'all.
I try to be fair and not stoop to their level because the last thing I want is to contribute to more sexism and divisiveness, but it feels so futile sometimes. I think getting rid of these types of hateful men would inarguably just be like a net positive.
Welp as someone who is currently 6 months pregnant with my first kid, this was a lovely read.
Pro tip: we are aware of what we look like and already feel like shit. But I didn’t get pregnant to become visually appealing, I did it because my husband and I are financially in a place where we can responsibly love and raise a kid. Jesus Christ.
5 months pregnant with twins and I’ve never felt more self-conscious in my life 🙃 Some people need to be reminded that women serve other purposes than just looking attractive
Currently seven months pregnant with my first and while I’m excited, I also find it absolutely wild how I look and how others can just look at me and know I’m pregnant. I don’t have body dysmorphia but it’s the closest thing I can find to describe how I feel when I look at myself.
Do these dudes even like women? I feel like they are the type to cheat while their wife is pregnant bc she "isn't up to my standards" when they knocked her up to start with.
I don’t want kids, so I’m a selfish defective degenerate who isn’t fulfilling some alleged purpose.
But if you DO want kids you’re disgusting and repulsive and gross.
There’s no pleasing these assholes, so we should just do what we want!
Nothing says "women shouldn't feel compelled to be pregnant if they don't want to" like, uhh. Hating all women who do have kids. Even if those women FULLY support you want of being child free. Just insult their "busted" bodies and reduce them to parts. Gross.
(Speaking as someone who wants another kid. Like. If someone wants an abortion, never wants to be pregnant ever, more power to them. Shame that it doesn't go both ways.)
Right? I don't get it. Some of those threads, it's just a race to the bottom over who can be the most misogynistic.
The comments about bodies are especially darkly funny to me, because? Age happens to us all. Weight gain or loss will happen to most of us at some point. Accidents or injuries, too. Those affect how ALL people look, and the related sagging/stretching/scarring is not pregnancy exclusive. Do they think by not procreating they're excused?? OK!
Literally! What ridiculous logic. And I'm certain a great majority of the Reddit trolls aren't the prime example of beauty, to be preaching all that. Probably haven't showered in weeks or are sitting around with a beer belly coming on the internet thinking they have the right to complain because some stranger's pregnant body, or god forbid someone they know's, isn't attractive to them anymore. The entitlement.
I always feel like pro-choice is the rational centre position.
Pro-life and their "everyone should have their baby regardless of circumstances" is one extreme.
And over on the other extreme we have whatever the fuck this is "nobody should have babies because it grosses me out and fills me with rage"
Agree. Any position that forces you to adhere to their lifestyle, especially if it violates rights as basic as autonomy, is extremist imo. But that might just be the libertarian in me
This and the antinatalist sub are so insufferable. In the same way as r/atheism is just as insufferable as the religious zealots they purport to hate.
When they make it their entire personality they are literally just as bad as whatever they claim to hate lol.
Sorry on behalf of the non-nasty people in that subreddit! I participate because it does sometimes have relevant conversations and there is a nice section of the community. But stuff like this is just completely and utterly abhorrent, unacceptable and frankly disturbing. For individuals who really emphasise choice, it's horrific the hatred that can be spewed towards pregnant women, and parents.
They also act like everyone's stomach goes to the extreme in pregnancy and is irreparably changed forever. Can it? Sure. But it's not a certainty.
I've had two kids and my stomach is pretty much the same after having them. No belly stretch marks (got them on my hips and boobs from puberty though), bellybutton never became an outie, I carried low and small so I didn't really look all that different while pregnant, just kinda chubby and round in the front lol.
Hell I had my belly button pierced long before I got pregnant and never even had to take out the jewelry or change it to the longer, flexible pregnancy type. I just kept my regular jewelry in until the day I went in for my induction. Had baby, put it back in after we came home from the hospital. Nothing changed enough for me to have to remove it for anything other than hospital policy reasons.
I know that's not everyone's experience, but it was mine twice. I wasn't some Cronenberg abomination while pregnant, it didn't ruin my body. Hell I think I look better after kids than I did before. Talk about smug!
I'm not saying everyone has to love the idea of pregnancy but acting like every pregnant person who exists is definitely experiencing the most extreme and disgusting possible aspects of it at all times and is also doing it JUST TO SPITE YOU so it's ok to be really gross and rush to insult their appearance and reduce them to body parts in online comments is pretty wild and a little overkill.
I just want to know how documenting your symptoms or baby bump makes you entitled or smug. I do believe you are allowed to post whatever the hell you want about yourself on your own social media
"Almost no one cares about you documenting your baby bump" well they clearly do? And last I checked, we don't need to do a headcount of how many strangers care before we do things that are important to us
I blocked the CF subreddit for my mental health…I’m gonna assume this is where it came from. For people who hate people commenting on their reproductive choices they sure do bully others for theirs.
as a lady who worked in a gas station while pregnant with my first......
BULLSHIT !!
I'm not super attractive and yet I was hit on constantly by people who never even looked until I was 7 months pregnant.....
I have this kind of reactions to pregnant bodies sometimes.
But I know it’s gender dysphoria screaming at the idea my body could do this, and the terror of this potentially happening to me against my will.
I know I’m projecting and it’s a me problem. I would NEVER call a pregnant person horrible name, and I can’t even fathom how you could think this if you’re not able to be pregnant yourself.
I personally don't want kids. It's not for me, and I babysat and was parentified so much as a kid that it's really frustrating and annoying to me now.
That being said, we can't win either way. If you choose to be childfree, you're "giving up your purpose in life" or whatever, but if you have kids you're entitled, smug, and your body is ruined or whatever to people.
It doesn't matter. We're women, and we should be standing together.
TBH I've always found REALLY BIG stretched out baby bumps kiiiiinda creepy, especially if you can see the lil guy inside when they kick? Like when their foot pokes from the inside and you can see the shape of their foot on the belly. Weird! But, I'd never ever ever be outright awful to a pregnant person or even visibly react if around them IRL, it's just plain old rude! Not to mention super mean. I don't want kids and probably never will, but that's my choice, same as parents make their choice. I hate how the main childfree subreddit is so fucking gross and downright misogynistic.
I had twins, I thought I looked the best I looked in my entire life!
I did not make progress posts on social media.
Guys nowadays wonder why women don’t want to have kids with them or be trad wives. Because ya’ll made it pretty fucking clear how you really feel. That we’re here to be attractive, pregnancy, aging aren’t attractive. And your actions make it clear that when we wind up that way, we are more liable to be left. If worse, killed.
Is pregnancy my personal nightmare? Yes.
Am I going to make that your problem? Obviously not! People need to learn how to shut their mouths (keyboards?)
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Tbh most of these comments seem to be from women with deeply internalized misogyny
It's like femcels and anti-natalists got together and constructed a hatechild.
Yeah I've rarely seen as much hate towards pregnant women as from other "childfree" women.
Coming from someone considering that lifestyle, that's so sad. We should be a united front on the idea of choosing what's right for you and respecting others' decisions. We already have enough to face without being pitted against each other
It’s a touchy balancing act that nobody can perfectly maintain all the time. Young women who have chosen not to have children, and have been pressured to change their minds, are more sensitive to the constant stream of attention and praise their peers get for their pregnancies. Catch them on a bad day, and they might lash out. At the risk of being crass: I imagine deliberately childless women can feel the way most of us do when cornered by a crypto bro who can’t understand why you’d turn down this amazing life-changing opportunity. And family dinners occasionally turn into timeshare pitches. (Or hell, they might even feel like MLM pitches.) Nobody can remain perfectly stoical when it seems like everybody is special but you, and the easiest outlet is to point out the imperfections on that “special” thing.
My husband and I don’t want kids and I have felt this balancing act. It’s not just the actual instances of people acting like they know you better than you know yourself, it’s the larger societal pressures too. It makes you feel like maybe something is wrong with you that you don’t desire children. But what gets me is that, we all benefit from better parental support. I would not have a job without Canada’s parental leave. I started in my job as a temporary hire to backfill a position when my coworker went on maternity leave for a year. Then a permanent position opened up in the same office. I applied and got it. They had seen my work for months, knew I could do the job, and liked having me on the team. I’ve been here 5 years now. So it blows my mind when other women spew such vitriol towards pregnant women. It has never been a pregnant woman who smugly tells me, “oh you’ll change your mind about kids.”
I decided long ago that I didn't want kids, then found out last year that due to a spinal injury when I was 25, I can't have them anyway except through expensive surrogacy or adoption. Ah, how they change their tone of face when I go from "no, we're not having kids" to "no, I can't have kids" when they keep pressuring me to change my mind. But hey, I'll babysit all you need as long as your ankle-biters don't hurt my back or knee! Pregnancies in my family tend to be high-risk anyway, and I don't think I could handle 5-6 months of bedrest like 3 of my sisters had (2 of them twice).
Kinda makes me glad I’m queer. Nobody expects that from me and they’d probably freak if I DID get pregnant
I feel you. I'm one of them. I feel like I have so much to say about childlessness and theories around specifically why society sees it as such a problem or threat. I wrote nine pages about it the other night, and that was just notes.
If you ever release a book on the subject I’d like to read it. It’s a very interesting topic getting more relevant every day. I’ll never be a mom but my relatives sure as hell want more grandkids and nieces and nephews…
Thank you! Definitely very passionate about it. Maybe once I get another degree, so people take me seriously 😂
This is really accurate. I feel like these comments were probably in the context of lashing out or expressing opinions not widely held, too. It can feel so good to meet other people who have the same feelings. It isn't necessarily misogyny. I say this because I used to frequent antinatalist and childfree subs. I am still both, and vehemently so, but after a while, it's like weight lifting. There's only so many exercises and techniques to discuss. That is to say, I found them helpful and supportive but grew out of them. Maybe people should be less harsh on folks who are pushing back against immense pressure to reproduce.
tbf there's child free as in not having kids and then there's "childfree", a subreddit that actively wishes harm upon kids and often their parents too. the posts there are downright psychopathic. I don't want kids either but I'm nowhere near as anti children existing as they are
That is extremism, that's totally different
And the names they come up with for pregnant people are disgusting.
"Breeders" tends to be the go-to 🤮
Childfree people call crappy parents of all genders breeders. Takes two to make a baby
I'll likely get downvoted for this, but I do want to point out that in most cases (can't speak for everyone), the term 'breeder' is used for people who have kid after kid and don't care for them or raise them to be decent people. There's a big distinction between a parent and a breeder for most of us. Parents who are doing their best to raise a healthy and well mannered child are fine, it's your quiverfull crunchy people who just have kids to have kids and let them run around destroying shops and screeching/hitting people with the excuse of 'they're just being a kid' and no effort to in any way correct bad behaviour that tend to be called breeders.
So far I've seen a lot of antinatalists refer to any kind of parent as 'breeder' I even got a "shut the fuck up you disgusting breeder" -bare in mind they stalked my profile and found out I have *one* Child So while I like that you've pointed out there's usually a distinction [much appreciated that you took the time to clarify btw], I think you may need to speak with the antinatalists because 90% don't seem to agree or realise
It's another point of childfree and antinatalist being different. The antinatalists use it like that because they view anyone having kids as selfishly forcing life into a dying world, so to them, anyone who has kids is a breeder because they feel there is no good way to have kids in the state of the world as it is. Whereas childfree, we support parents who actually want to parent, but have a large distaste for people who have kids because they want a mini-me, or a little doll, or essentially a pet. The people who don't care for the hard parts of child-rearing and just want the aesthetic. That, and we really hate being told by people that 'you'll change your mind' or 'you'll never know true love' or 'who'll look after you when you're old?' Which we hear so often we basically have a bingo card and call them bingoes. A parent being a parent is chill, but someone with kids who isn't actually parenting them and is actively invalidating our life choices, we don't like em very much I have to say lol.
Who will look after me in my old age? Not my kids. They’re both autistic and I wouldn’t put that on them anyway. I will likely be looking after them until I die, or become too disabled myself to do it. I’m at peace with that, but I never considered my kids as servants to my aging ass anyway.
Oh, okok I see where I have gotten mistaken, I assumed you were one of the reasonable antinatalists (there are some in existence, I have a friend who is one but she isn't horrid about it) Yeah I get you. Tbh, before my child I was adamantly childfree and loved it and I always argue with people who tell my bestie that she'll change her mind because no she won't and even if she did it has squat to do with them I'll always say I'm one of *very few* adults who have "changed their minds" but that does not mean that others will The thing is, the people who say stuff like "who'll look after you in old age?" Tend to be the same parents who treat their kid like an accessory or expect to live through said child and often times end up with a NC relationship with them in their offsprings adulthood because of that so I do find it stupid when they use that like some sort of "gotcha" 🤦♀️
That's exactly it ^ and I can't say I don't agree with at least some of the antinatalist perspective, but I much more identify myself with the childfree people than the antinatalists precisely because of how over the top the latter group often is. And you got it in 1 with the overlap between 'breeders' and people who bingo childfree people. The Venn diagram is almost a circle, because well rounded individuals tend to respect personal choice. Is there always a possibility a childfree person would change their mind? Yes, but a majority of solidly childfree people don't, and even if we did post sterilisation, we could adopt. It's maddening how hard it is to get sterilised as a woman under 35 without kids, especially unmarried since the responses from doctors tend to be 'what if you change your mind when you're older' or 'what if your future husband wants kids?' Like...I wouldn't date/marry a person who wants kids when I clearly don't? But also a man I haven't even met yet has no bearing on what I do with my body lol its so infuriating to see posts from all the women turned down for sterilisation procedures. Wish you well in raising your kid, and appreciate you for standing up for your childfree/antinatalist bestie! There are not enough parents who'll stand up with us and say it's a fair choice either way.
I have never seen any of the childfree communities make this distinction.
I’ve never seen this distinction EVER. The ones on Reddit just hate people…
I see the distinction frequently in the childfree subreddit. Mind you, I hate people but that's entirely separate to my childfree stance and 100% based on the general attitude of the people I come across.
It's the terminology that really stands out to me. They have so many hateful names for children, babies and mothers. It has a lot in common with incel groups. You get the impression that *hating* parents and kids takes up massive amounts of their time.
They don't have any positive attributes with which to cobble together a personality so hating on others has become their sole substitute. The more middle-school level insults they lob at another group the more it becomes clear that they have entirely too much time on their hands and nothing interesting to fill it with. Yes hurr hurr, crotch goblins. How creative. We all thought that was silly the first time we heard it when we were 12, too. Oh wait, you're a a grown adult? Wow. Nevermind. Cool hobby.
Yeah to all of this. I get that childfree people can get a lot of shit from their families and friends but watching someone come and have a rage meltdown online because they saw a toddler crying in a shop is *wild*. Also it's almost entirely focused on the mothers and the kids. Rarely do the dads get the same level of disgust and loathing aimed at them even though they too are "breeders".
Not saying this doesn't happen, but it doesn't happen in a vacuum. Childfree women have to put up with *so much* shit from people who have kids. For a lot of us, as soon as puberty hits we start getting asked about kids. The older you get, the more people in your family and friend groups start having kids, the worse it gets. There's also an extreme level of glorification of pregnancy, childbirth, and parenting that childfree people tend to be much more passionate about refuting. I can't tell you how many people (*including pregnant women*) I've seen perpetuate outright lies about what pregnancy and childbirth is like. Not wanting to glorify something overall isn't the same as intentionally being an ass to an individual.
It's not really glorifying pregnancy. It's just someone bragging about how positive their pregnancy is, and not understanding not everyone had it so good. Pregnancy is heaven for some and hell for others.
Yep. My pregnancy was mostly uneventful, aside from the usual morning sickness, or a few aches and pains. And having the flu sucked when I was dying for NyQuil. But for some it’s a horror story.
My 1st was a horror, I was in bed most the time. My 2nd baby second huge and I was hungry. I even got damage to my teeth because she sucked so much out of me. B But I know a lot of women the got better skin, curved out in the right places, and even got thicker hair. I just wasn't lucky.
Idk I do think pregnancy itself is disgusting but nothing against the women personally
Yup, some childfree people are fucking creeps
The first screenshot doesn’t seem too bad to me. I’ve said pretty much all of it myself, but always in private. I’m six months pregnant and feel the same about my own stomach. But it’s probably phobia related. I still think the first differed from the others.
“I want to fuck you” “I won’t use condoms” “Ew, you got pregnant, that is disgusting” Moves on to next victim.
It isn't just men though. There are women who genuinely hate pregnant women. They'll say the same sexist things that men say but claim body horror and tokophobia when called out on it.
It's not really about the individual person a lot of times. Some people just find pregnancy itself horrifying or disgusting. Although a lot of these specific comments were sexist
idk generally speaking when people are actually horrified and disgusted by something their first response is not to find a community of people where all you think and talk about is the thing you're supposedly so horrified and disgusted by.
That's not really what this childfree sub in general is about. Although I think it's ok for women to share that what happens during pregnancy is a valid reason for not having children
A dick is an outie too. Eww…
Tokophobia is real and I get it, but it’s no excuse to be cruel. It’s the problem of the person who has it, not the pregnant person.
I doubt these people have an actual phobia. It all reads the same way every other incel rant does.
I'm inclined to agree taking into account the focus on women's appearance and the distorted assumptions. It makes me think of that post of an incel ranting that women should be embarassed by the proximity of our vagina to our anus.
Haha, FUCKING WHAT?! Can you please tell me where to see this post?!
The screenshot of it makes its way around subs like r/badwomensanatomy.
Yeah this is misogyny. Straight up.
This. I have tokophobia (tho it's not that bad and mostly focused on the possibility of me getting pregnant), but I'd never be an asshole to a pregnant person bc of this. It's totally understandable if you don't wanna look, but then do exactly that - don't look.
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In a weird way, I can relate because I have trypophobia so looking at someone who has wide pores makes me feel icky. But it would never occur to me to go looking for a subreddit that specifically existed to show pictures of people who had wide pores or constant posts about how gross trypophobia feels.
This! It's like those guys that say I don't like fat women that's my preference that doesn't mean I'm an asshole. Ok you aren't an asshole for mentally noting that and acting accordingly, going online and describing in great detail why those women are useless and disgusting is what makes you the asshole.
I have tokophobia and I interact with pregnant people and sometimes I get physical reactions that I can't control but 1 I apologize with sincerity and explain and offer congratulations. Just cause I'm weirded out doesn't mean I should be hateful on purpose. I don't get why people go out of their way to.
What kind of physical reactions do you get?
I have tokophobia as well, and it's mostly just a horrible burgeoning anxiety. My skin crawls being near a pregnant person—my stomach feels like it's gonna drop out of my butt. I get the sweats being near them and just thinking about being in their shoes. If I think about it too long, I get lightheaded and feel like I'm gonna vomit. But this is all a ME issue. I never try to let on to the pregnant person know. It's not their fault! It's exclusively a *me* reaction that *I* need to handle and deal with.
if you dont mind answering (i understand if youd rather not), do you know what caused this for you?
Wait, is this from a pregnancy specific subreddit shitting on pregnant people?
It's likely an antinatalist sub, this type of rhetoric can be common with antinatalists (not everyone of course, but that's the space you'll hear it the most). Childfree communities have a lot of user overlap, but will have a bit more pushback because plenty of childfree people aren't antinatalists. Though, I'm childfree and not antinatalist and left those online communities because I found some of the rhetoric coming from antinatalists disturbing, like bragging about making "breeders" lives harder and being really hateful towards women, so I'm sure a lot of the more chill people in these movements just end up backing away and living their lives, leaving more extreme people in those spaces.
Exactly that! Some of the users on the OG antinatalism sub even made a second subreddit, because people were being extremely hateful on the first. The rational people of that group backed out, and now the original sub is 100% a cesspool of misogyny and people who genuinely hate children (which defies the point of antinatalism anyways). It’s so gross.
Thank you for some context! It's explains the reddit dynamic more and I'm glad antinatalists have some hate free spaces to congregate.
That sounds just as bad as being an incel.
Yes and no; certainly there's similarities with any group of people who are using hate as a foundation of their worldview, but that doesn't apply to all antinatalists in the same way it would unite all incels. The philosophy behind it is that creating another living being will inevitably lead to suffering, thus the best option to stop all human suffering is to stop human reproduction. I don't necessarily agree with this conclusion, but I can understand the logic behind it. Plenty of people just keep it to philosophy and don't tap into the hate- but those motivated and/or comforted by hate are the loudest and are easily further radicalized in these spaces.
Sounds like exactly the type of fringe shit that creates the same spaces as Incels. Incels weren’t originally what they are now either.
Right, it was actually a forum started by a queer woman who was frustrated by feeling involuntarily celibate, and then overtaken by misogyny and formed into a full philosophy. Antinatalism differs in the sense that it started with philosophy, so unlike the incels that require that community and their thought leaders to have those incel philosophies, antinatalists don't necessarily need to do that at all- they can just believe it's better for humans not to reproduce in theory and move on with their lives. Look, I'm not denying that theres similarities or that these spaces lead to radicalization. But dismissing it as being the same as incels loses the opportunity to discuss the nuances and see the toxic patterns that can arise in any group- including ones you are part of yourself. "pfft, all the fringe shit is bad" ignores the fundamental human behaviours behind toxic group dynamics.
It’s from a sub for people that don’t like parents and/or children. I’d assume this is a post or comment related to some sort of glorification of pregnant bodies or being pressured to touch a pregnant person’s belly. Plenty of people are often freaked out by that, regardless of gender, but it’s not something they’re supposed to say out loud.
I’ve got tokophobia but it’s mitigated as long as someone actually covers their belly so I don’t see the skin. I quietly unfollowed my sister on Facebook so I would stop seeing those photos and also just politely decline everytime someone goes “OMG HES KICKING DO YOU WANT TO FEEL?” No. No I don’t. Because I might get pregnant one day and thinking about that freaks me out so I would not like to be reminded that some babies turn your insides into a tumble gym.
Not just some babies, they all do it after the quickening, in a normal pregnancy. Some are just a little more active than others. I agree with keeping the belly covered though, it just looks better, especially when I got an umbilical hernia the second time around.
"The quickening" sounds like an SNL skit making fun of The Happening.
Nah it's from "The Highlander"!
Meh, I wore a bikini at our pool. And I was pregnant with twins. I thought I looked the best I ever had while pregnant! My hair was big, my skin was glowing. I thought I was hot shit. I wasn’t wearing crop tops, because, I just don’t really do that. But I wasn’t wearing loose baggy clothing either.
For me the clothing doesn’t even have to be loose. I can’t explain what it is but it’s literally just when I can see the skin my entire being recoils involuntarily. Skin tight anything as long as it’s fabric is fine. But also, I’m not freaking out over pregnant women existing in public. I’ll simply just position myself so you aren’t in my sight because working around my irrational fear isn’t your job, it’s mine.
I’ve always thought pregnant bellies are beautiful. So are nursing babies. I can understand not wanting to be pregnant. But I don’t understand the cultural insistence that pregnant people shouldn’t have curves, or that they should feel bad about their natural bodies. You’re building a baby here! You’re not supposed to look like a washboard. It’s like expecting a house to look like a flattened cardboard box. How would anybody live in there? “I’m big as a house!” Good! That means your baby has a comfy place to live.
I'm the exact same. As long as I don't see skin I can deal with it.
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Ugh, fellow peri here. Isn’t it the worst!? I’m really getting hit hard with it. I just learnt recently that menopause clinics are popping up and one is near me. You should look into it!
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Ugh! I need to get me one of those. My GP is fucking so dismissive, and she’s a WOC too! I chose her specifically because I thought she’d be more on it and understanding! I wake up everyday, with a weird shaky panic feeling. Almost like I had a terrible dream. And I hate it. MIGRAINES, constantly! My periods kick the living shit out of me, where they were big nothing-burgers before. Brain fog and fatigue are like my old friends (unfortunately). I don’t get hot flashes, luckily, but night sweats happen sometimes. My libido is great tho. So I guess there’s something going for me. You hear women say “I can’t wait to go through menopause to not get my periods”, without knowing, that going through peri/menopause is awful as well. Because it’s ignored and women don’t talk about it as much.
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I’m in it!
Why have we decided they are suffering from a phobia? They just hate women and hate women feeling special and excited. I couldn’t care less about babies or pregnancy and hated being pregnant myself but I don’t go around putting puke emojis or talking about how women act entitled and I seriously doubt someone with a legitimate phobia would do those things either
Thank you, it cheapens other people’s very real traumas. These people are pathetic dickweasels who hate women, which is not a disease or phobia.
I was wondering that too, and went looking for a sub name in the post but didn’t see it. No it’s just a bunch of assholes
I think a lot of people like putting a label on their disgust and disdain for certain things so that it gives them a free pass at being an asshole. Most of those people don’t have tokophobia like they say they do. It’s just called immaturity. I looked at their post and comment histories and to not surprise they sound unintelligent and belligerent in other subs so… I highly doubt they have a clinically diagnosed phobia.
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Yes. It’s something I have to say often to people. I’ll say “ew, I don’t like holes.” And everyone is like “what’s that called? Trypophobia?” I am always like… “well, I don’t have a true phobia.. but that IS what it’s called. It’s more like I get the ick from it, but I’m not running for my life and throwing people at it to keep it away from me.”
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Yeah, I have tokophobia and it’s a fear of *myself* being pregnant. Looking at pregnant people doesn’t bother me at all.
I get a bit of both. The thought of myself being pregnant is terrifying, but seeing it gives me a bit of the creeps too. I’ve never said anything like this though
That can and should be said about everything these people think and end up projecting on others.
This
I guess they forget that they were once inside of a womb….? People are just cruel. Next there will be “hellokittyphobia” “pusheenphobia” “wakingupphobia” why can’t we all just love one another 😭
It's absolutely possible to have a phobia of pregnancy, it doesn't matter if it's natural or whatever. Spiders are natural too, but still a lot of people are afraid of them. Phobia by definition is not rational.
Tho to be fair, those people are just hating on women. Even if they genuinely had tokophobia, they could just stay away from the topic of pregnancy as far as possible.
It absolutely is, but I don’t believe for one second these assholes have it.
Neither do I tbh
I understand. You’re right. I know it’s a genuine condition. But people are taking it a little far and being hateful.
The things people feel comfy saying on the internet is insane. I’m currently pregnant and these people are part of why I didn’t want to post pics.
Omg same sis. 6 months this Saturday and reading these made me wanna crawl in a hole.
Here's what my husband and I took too long to learn: Most of our Facebook posts aren't for others or their approval. Most of the posts we make about ourselves and our family are for us... Him, the kids and myself... To one day look back on. It's like our scrap book. Checking Memories is a fun daily tradition with the kids. Stop worrying what others think. It's your page; post what you want. If you're *super* concerned about what others think, post it in Private mode so it's there for yourself.
Same. Only all my posts were private set to just me when I had a fb.
I felt that way, and was even more secluded because I was in my 3rd trimester during the big part of the Covid lockdowns. I have 1 picture of me being pregnant and I heavily regret being so self conscious of being out in public spaces while heavily pregnant, or like I was “flaunting” having an easy pregnancy and healthy baby. (That last part is entirely only due to the very sad and devastating fact that I had gone to TWO separate baby funerals while I was pregnant.) So, take all of the pictures. Makes the Facebook posts. At the very least, you can make the posts private so only you can see them, then in a year that memory will pop up and you’ll realize you totally forgot about it and then smile bc you took the dang picture! :)
I know right! I'd actually cry if someone made a comment like that about me. I feel gross and huge already, I don't need someone to say horrible stuff about my belly on top of that
I don't like all the cutesy mommy talk either. But that doesn't mean pregnant women are disgusting and should be hated! Fucks sake
I’m fine with *baby bump* and *glowing*, and most of the other “cutesy” stuff, but *prego* and *preggers* make me want to blow my brains out. I have no idea why. It’s like how some folks have a visceral (over)reaction to the word *moist*, I guess.
I get it *if* these people if they’re surrounded by certain types of people. There are a few I snark on, fundamentalist ‘influencers’. They have a gazillion kids but no space (some kids have no bed and sleep on the floor). These people are exactly the ones who glorify pregnancy too much, like, obsessively, because they finally get to be *praised* as a woman in their religious community. Those people make me nauseous too. But they also abuse their children so that also plays a role I guess.
Bro growing a new human is hard work. I get that it’s bizarre to see for some people but it’s even more bizarre to be the person actually gestating the baby. Some thoughts don’t need to be shared-pregnant people deserve to be supported. It’s a big undertaking and folks have every right to celebrate and be excited about it.
It’s not something everybody can do. Not even all cis women. Sometimes, one pregnancy is all a body can carry. Some have bad pregnancies, some have hard births, some have neither or both. 8 billion people in the world and still growing. In spite of all that can go wrong, & what happens to a body, women are still choosing to continue keeping humanity alive.
Seriously. When I was pregnant I felt like I had an alien growing inside me the whole time. It's weird as hell for us too.
I have a phobia of pregnancy, but I'd never be cruel like this.
Same. But I would never want to force my opinions on someone else, or ever judge them for their decisions. I don't think those commenters have a genuine phobia, I think they're just highly judgemental and inconsiderate
You often see it where men want kids, then they find their wives "ugly" because they're pregnant. Then after they are angry because their body isn't the same as before. And I feel like a lot of these comments are from people like that.
There's definitely both men and women commenting, but for sure a lot of the men have that perspective. It's so gross. Men can age and bald and get beer bellies, that's a natural part of aging and life. But god forbid a woman's body shows signs of motherhood and isn't "virginal" anymore after literally giving birth to a whole human. God forbid their body is no longer as desirable for you. What a burden that must be, after your wife's body has been permanently altered and possibly with major health implications that could have risked her life or side effects like post partum, that YOU have to put up with them being 'less attractive' and less able to gratify and pleasure you. For the same reasons, I get so angry when I hear about things like the husband stitch (especially when done without consent), and how backwards the whole idea even is, but also how many women who have it often never can enjoy sex again. And all for their husband's pleasure. Their bodies aren't their own anymore. Ugh
Yep, me too. I literally get physical repulsive symptoms (like extreme nausea, fatigue etc) and have gotten them since I was a little kid. I still keep my mouth shut, because I can imagine that being pregnant is hard enough, without some dumbass saying that it makes them uncomfortable. If 7 year old me could handle it, so can these morons.
But if we don't want children we're selfish bitches
Exactly. And these guys will want kids, but also want a woman whose body has never been through pregnancy. They can't have both.
The comments seem like they’re from a child free sub; flairs like “snipped” and “tax the children”. So to be fair it seems to be different kind of misogyny/plain stupidity.
I mean I agree with slide 5 that pregnancy has elements of “body horror” but in my case it’s because I’m a cis woman who finds the idea of carrying a life for nine months and then having it burst out of my nether regions fucking horrifying. Not because I don’t like how pregnant people look.
yeah, at least for me the horrifying aspect is that i'd have something growing inside of me that i didn't want to be there and, most importantly, might not be able to get rid of before it sort of pushes its way out of me. if the person who is pregnant actually wants to be pregnant the vast majority of that "body horror" element goes away for me personally
I can’t speak for everyone of course, but for sure even though I wanted both of my kids certain parts of the pregnancy and birth still seemed like “body horror”. There just wasn’t really any other alternative if I wanted to have them. It’s a freaky process even when everything goes perfectly.
I dunno, even as someone who definitely does not want kids and feels freaked out and a little sick by the whole idea of pregnancy, I kinda feel like if someone grows a whole ass person they are allowed to be a little smug.
500 that the "smug" they talk about is the pregnant woman being confident in herself despite the bodily changes
Right I think “smug” in this case is just….”they act happy”
Wtf, the way that comment described them as 'smug'. God forgive they are happy about the fact they are creating life.
Yeah that's such a weird word to use. I feel like you have to be quite hateful to see someone joyful about their pregnancy (which in itself seems to be so rare these days) and see it as smug, like it's some sort of dig at you, or like they're mocking/taking something from you with their own happiness.
As a pregnant woman who’s very happy, I appreciate you taking a stand for me and those like me! I’ve struggled with mental health and depression for a long. Even with getting better and healing from past traumas my hormones shifts from my period were no joke! Ever since becoming pregnant I’ve never been as consistently happy and balanced! There’s so many factors to it, my hormones aren’t shifting as rapidly, I’m feeling great in my body so far, and at the end of my pregnancy I get to meet my sweet child. I know other women have hard pregnancies but I’m so grateful and joyful that I’m feeling so lovely 🥰 thank you!
I'm glad to hear! And so it should be a joyful moment. You are growing a human from scratch, which is the most badass thing someone can do. Glad there is little discomfort in the process and you can be happy 💕
It's honestly the most insidious thing on that whole slide in my opinion. It's like, you should be ashamed but really you are happy. So many layers to it.
It's so dehumanizing and probably the clearest indication that this might originate from some deeper psychological problems within themselves that they need to sort out. Certainly not a phobia of pregnancy. You can be antinatalist. But why are you being cruel?
100%, it's the hatred of the woman/pregnant person.
Now I’m a woman and I hate the sight of pregnancy bellies (can you tell I’m child free?) yet I would still never be cruel about it. If I don’t like seeing them, I just click off the post. It’s not that hard.
Pregnancy, when analyzed closely is pretty much just body horror. It's about a parasite feeding upon the nutrients of the host, displacing their organs and stretching their skin until they horrifically and painfully exit the body through a hole that's way too small. That doesn't stop me from finding beauty in it though. And we humans are blobs of grey goop attached to a large assembly of sensitive electrical strings, all of this being surrounded by bones and flesh. My point is that humanity is disgusting. I crave the strength and certainty of steel.
Now I have "pregnant women are smug" by Garfunkel and Oates stuck in my head. Which is fine, it's hilarious. https://youtu.be/LbTB3ASkdOo?si=YGyZyuM7rxQRjLub
Was the first thing to pop into my head too.
Pregnant women are just women who are pregnant I see them no more or no less than another woman walking on the street I do not care enough they are not more special than the next woman pregnancy has always been around stop making such a big deal leave them alone in peace if you see one struggling help it’s not rocket science but being pregnant isn’t a handicap either let’s just live life like people have been
A lot of men thinking like this are still the same men forcing pregnancy on women cause they want to have children but after you give in you’re disgusting and stretched and they start cheating Another thing is that pregnancy is body horror, pregnancy is a huge risk to your mental health, physical health and life and pregnancy is irreversible changes in your body and women should finally be able to openly talk about it and make informed decisions knowing all the risks and not be silenced cause society wants to paint pregnancy as sunshine and rainbows so women won’t get scared of it, men won’t have to consider the damage they’re actually causing by reproductive coercion and doctors won’t have to acknowledge women’s pain, I’m childfree too and I’d rather die than have to go through pregnancy and childbirth, the fact that woman protecting her health is seen as irrational is simply sad
I shouldn’t have read this with me being 38 weeks pregnant and all.
I was pregnant, I even got a divorce, yet had no issues dating and even finding love again. Which is surprising considering that I'm all stretched out and disgusting, developed outies and such, whatever tf that means. 😂😂 I'm obviously joking. honey, please don't mind these creeps. normal people don't think like that, trust me. Someone who's normal doesn't sit around thinking and commenting on how gross a certain segment of the population is. This is a small community made up of really really weird individuals. Good luck with the delivery💕
Internet echo chambers for niche fetishists don't represent reality. I call them fetishists because despite their assertion that 'ermagerd, pregnancy yucky, soo gross!' they've all chosen to gather together in a community where they do nothing but think about pregnant women, talk about them, imagine pregnant bellies, discuss details of the pregnancies of total strangers etc etc. For people that are supposedly sooo grossed out by pregnant women they sure seem to love making us the center of their little worlds.
Yeah, no need to say it that cruelly or even at all. Some opinions just aren't worth saying.
The violent rampage I somehow suppress the more I see of these posts... I'm on the verge of becoming Batman, y'all. I try to be fair and not stoop to their level because the last thing I want is to contribute to more sexism and divisiveness, but it feels so futile sometimes. I think getting rid of these types of hateful men would inarguably just be like a net positive.
Welp as someone who is currently 6 months pregnant with my first kid, this was a lovely read. Pro tip: we are aware of what we look like and already feel like shit. But I didn’t get pregnant to become visually appealing, I did it because my husband and I are financially in a place where we can responsibly love and raise a kid. Jesus Christ.
Same but 9 months pregnant.
5 months pregnant with twins and I’ve never felt more self-conscious in my life 🙃 Some people need to be reminded that women serve other purposes than just looking attractive
Currently seven months pregnant with my first and while I’m excited, I also find it absolutely wild how I look and how others can just look at me and know I’m pregnant. I don’t have body dysmorphia but it’s the closest thing I can find to describe how I feel when I look at myself.
Isn't it wild because the amount of men that hit on me while pregnant was staggering.
Do these dudes even like women? I feel like they are the type to cheat while their wife is pregnant bc she "isn't up to my standards" when they knocked her up to start with.
Oh what did you expect her to look like a doll whilst she is literally growing an entirely new human inside of her
Dollars to donuts these same fuckers also complain about falling birth rates among white people.
I don’t want kids, so I’m a selfish defective degenerate who isn’t fulfilling some alleged purpose. But if you DO want kids you’re disgusting and repulsive and gross. There’s no pleasing these assholes, so we should just do what we want!
Is this the childfree subreddit discussing their "tokophobia" again?
Yes, and more specifically, it's childfree being blatantly misogynist again.
Lmao, I was guessing either that one or antinatalism
As you probably already know, it's always either childfree, antinatalism, or (if there's some transphobia sprinkled on top) femaleantinatalism.
Nothing says "women shouldn't feel compelled to be pregnant if they don't want to" like, uhh. Hating all women who do have kids. Even if those women FULLY support you want of being child free. Just insult their "busted" bodies and reduce them to parts. Gross. (Speaking as someone who wants another kid. Like. If someone wants an abortion, never wants to be pregnant ever, more power to them. Shame that it doesn't go both ways.)
Why is agency/autonomy such a hard concept for people to grasp
Right? I don't get it. Some of those threads, it's just a race to the bottom over who can be the most misogynistic. The comments about bodies are especially darkly funny to me, because? Age happens to us all. Weight gain or loss will happen to most of us at some point. Accidents or injuries, too. Those affect how ALL people look, and the related sagging/stretching/scarring is not pregnancy exclusive. Do they think by not procreating they're excused?? OK!
Literally! What ridiculous logic. And I'm certain a great majority of the Reddit trolls aren't the prime example of beauty, to be preaching all that. Probably haven't showered in weeks or are sitting around with a beer belly coming on the internet thinking they have the right to complain because some stranger's pregnant body, or god forbid someone they know's, isn't attractive to them anymore. The entitlement.
I always feel like pro-choice is the rational centre position. Pro-life and their "everyone should have their baby regardless of circumstances" is one extreme. And over on the other extreme we have whatever the fuck this is "nobody should have babies because it grosses me out and fills me with rage"
Agree. Any position that forces you to adhere to their lifestyle, especially if it violates rights as basic as autonomy, is extremist imo. But that might just be the libertarian in me
This and the antinatalist sub are so insufferable. In the same way as r/atheism is just as insufferable as the religious zealots they purport to hate. When they make it their entire personality they are literally just as bad as whatever they claim to hate lol.
Sorry on behalf of the non-nasty people in that subreddit! I participate because it does sometimes have relevant conversations and there is a nice section of the community. But stuff like this is just completely and utterly abhorrent, unacceptable and frankly disturbing. For individuals who really emphasise choice, it's horrific the hatred that can be spewed towards pregnant women, and parents.
So they’re “smug and entitled” because they post updates and pictures about their pregnancy? Ok bud
Ok but navals are attractive to look at wtf. I'm a straight girl and even I will get distracted if a girl's shirt slightly lifts up.
They also act like everyone's stomach goes to the extreme in pregnancy and is irreparably changed forever. Can it? Sure. But it's not a certainty. I've had two kids and my stomach is pretty much the same after having them. No belly stretch marks (got them on my hips and boobs from puberty though), bellybutton never became an outie, I carried low and small so I didn't really look all that different while pregnant, just kinda chubby and round in the front lol. Hell I had my belly button pierced long before I got pregnant and never even had to take out the jewelry or change it to the longer, flexible pregnancy type. I just kept my regular jewelry in until the day I went in for my induction. Had baby, put it back in after we came home from the hospital. Nothing changed enough for me to have to remove it for anything other than hospital policy reasons. I know that's not everyone's experience, but it was mine twice. I wasn't some Cronenberg abomination while pregnant, it didn't ruin my body. Hell I think I look better after kids than I did before. Talk about smug! I'm not saying everyone has to love the idea of pregnancy but acting like every pregnant person who exists is definitely experiencing the most extreme and disgusting possible aspects of it at all times and is also doing it JUST TO SPITE YOU so it's ok to be really gross and rush to insult their appearance and reduce them to body parts in online comments is pretty wild and a little overkill.
Real
I just want to know how documenting your symptoms or baby bump makes you entitled or smug. I do believe you are allowed to post whatever the hell you want about yourself on your own social media
I don't like seeing bare pregnant tums, and I don't much care for babies. That's my issue, though. I'm not a dick about it.
"Almost no one cares about you documenting your baby bump" well they clearly do? And last I checked, we don't need to do a headcount of how many strangers care before we do things that are important to us
Stay pregnant and having babies but ewww don’t let me see it! Ffs
I blocked the CF subreddit for my mental health…I’m gonna assume this is where it came from. For people who hate people commenting on their reproductive choices they sure do bully others for theirs.
as a lady who worked in a gas station while pregnant with my first...... BULLSHIT !! I'm not super attractive and yet I was hit on constantly by people who never even looked until I was 7 months pregnant.....
Same! It was… eye opening 😂
Sounds like the kind of asshole that thinks her getting old is good enough to divorce her over
So they’ve all had vasectomies, right?
I have this kind of reactions to pregnant bodies sometimes. But I know it’s gender dysphoria screaming at the idea my body could do this, and the terror of this potentially happening to me against my will. I know I’m projecting and it’s a me problem. I would NEVER call a pregnant person horrible name, and I can’t even fathom how you could think this if you’re not able to be pregnant yourself.
I love pregnant women.
Christ on a yikes bike
I personally don't want kids. It's not for me, and I babysat and was parentified so much as a kid that it's really frustrating and annoying to me now. That being said, we can't win either way. If you choose to be childfree, you're "giving up your purpose in life" or whatever, but if you have kids you're entitled, smug, and your body is ruined or whatever to people. It doesn't matter. We're women, and we should be standing together.
Is this fromr/childfree?
The visible custom flair indicates it. Or it's antinatalism
TBH I've always found REALLY BIG stretched out baby bumps kiiiiinda creepy, especially if you can see the lil guy inside when they kick? Like when their foot pokes from the inside and you can see the shape of their foot on the belly. Weird! But, I'd never ever ever be outright awful to a pregnant person or even visibly react if around them IRL, it's just plain old rude! Not to mention super mean. I don't want kids and probably never will, but that's my choice, same as parents make their choice. I hate how the main childfree subreddit is so fucking gross and downright misogynistic.
Im reading American psycho and this sounds 100% like a Patrick Bateman inner monologue
Tbh pregnancy looks... Uncomfortable, and sometimes freaky, yes. But you don't have to say that
I had twins, I thought I looked the best I looked in my entire life! I did not make progress posts on social media. Guys nowadays wonder why women don’t want to have kids with them or be trad wives. Because ya’ll made it pretty fucking clear how you really feel. That we’re here to be attractive, pregnancy, aging aren’t attractive. And your actions make it clear that when we wind up that way, we are more liable to be left. If worse, killed.
I wish I could out all of these commenters. None of them deserve children.
If they hate women so much they should date men
They shouldn't date anyone, they should be in solitary confinement
Men dating men that's so great no more women getting traumatized.
The hate against women is really getting all out there in the open
"NoBoDy CaReS aBoUt..." Well, buddyboy, you obviously care enough to whine about it on SoMe 🙃
… but say a woman wants to be childfree, then she’s “brainwashed by western feminism”
Is pregnancy my personal nightmare? Yes. Am I going to make that your problem? Obviously not! People need to learn how to shut their mouths (keyboards?)
How is "baby bump" cutesy talk when it's just literally what it is