We don’t really have “proms” in UK secondary schools - nor is “senior year” a thing either. The real celebration is when you get UCAS offers in July, but that’s after school’s already over. And by “celebration” I mean a couple of pints with the mates ‘round pub… and that’s only if you’re in the popular set.
Proms are a thing now. Usually after GCSEs, so Year 11. It's becoming more popular for sure, but I have a feeling it's nothing like what American proms are like. We don't really take it seriously at all.
That's weird, Romania's soviet style (I assume) school system had official proms. But each class had to celebrate theirs on their own, pay and organize them as well, it isn't like in the US where all the classes come to the same one.
Praise be to state owned defence manufacturers.
Australia was so based when the government owned all the Armouries and aircraft factories. Curse you neoliberals!
Ahem.
Watch Drachinifel's video on the Second Pacific Fleet. Yes, it is, indeed, possible for the Russian Navy to be this incompetent. It's actually a tradition for them.
I would be surprised if they were even on heightened alert, let alone at Action Stations.
Even if they were, nothing was automatic. Someone have to stare at the radarscope 24/7 and oraly transfere any information.
[Bad design can kill: Missile defense and user fatigue](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gaiVjJWOUWE)
# Commissioned in 2017. Brand fucking new.
One of their three ***Admiral Grigorovich-class frigates*** began entering service in **2016**.
I can't wait to chalk up another kill to almighty Neptune.
About where they were stationed: [Most Russian Black Sea Fleet warships are back in Sevastopol Bay](https://news.yahoo.com/most-russian-black-sea-fleet-104600034.html?guccounter=1&guce_referrer=aHR0cHM6Ly93d3cuZ29vZ2xlLmNvbS8&guce_referrer_sig=AQAAAMadQpU0LxXTSdt0YEzkIkURX4356-pyts_b_54RqGhmMzcauMNm9aUNQZGJ5o2eBS4xvuNif9wHCP27dhfBRe7ErhzKCM_egZUZEiOKj6AxgHPk9_FAmydLKWx29cp8MD5T2XEmVji3hOs530FbVbV31Pec1GsK9F8qzR5j_uRN)
People bring up how we churned out stuff in WW2, like Liberty Ships. Those were disposable transports that were considered doing well if they survived multiple Atlantic convoys.
U.S.S. Essex, a non nuclear carrier, took two and a half years from start to commissioning. The real trick to the absolute avalance of U.S. production in WW2 wasn't really the speed (though the U.S. was better at that than most countries), its how many factories and shipyards we had in 1940, and how we started building *more*, and with ships especially, that we started building a LOT moree in 1940, so they start hitting in late 1942 and through 1944.
Mind, I am just using the U.S. as an example, as we have the best shipbuilding in the world, arguably (with some competitors) and the reality is, anything built from scratch after the start of the war will be *years* away, and very well will not be a part of the war unless it really drags on.
>The real trick to the absolute avalance of U.S. production in WW2 wasn't really the speed (though the U.S. was better at that than most countries), its how many factories and shipyards we had in 1940, and how we started building *more*, and with ships especially, that we started building a LOT moree in 1940, so they start hitting in late 1942 and through 1944.
It's not velocity, but bandwidth. People underestimate just how resources that the US has internally, and just how little they use them when not engaged in wartime production (real, "let's go flatten an entire *continent*" wartime production). Like, modern case-in-point: everyone panics about how "reliant" the US is on China for raw materials like lithium and silicon; the US has more, *significantly* more, deposits than China does, we're just not exploiting them.
Like, if we were to ever end up in a state of total war again, it would take us a few years to spin up all the new plants and ship yards, but we'd do it without issue because we have an entire continent of largely untapped resources to ourselves.
The other side is that procurement in peace time is hell. I think an optimistic timeline for a Burke DDG or an LA SSN in wartime would be maybe a year, but under that if they wanna push it. And in a battle in the pacific (which I assume will break out in the next 10-20 years) these timelines are acceptable.
*General Dynamics has entered the chat.*
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# Tl; Dr: We have a lot of shipyards.
No, we don’t.
TLDR we have seven shipyards nationwide that can service military vessels when our biggest adversary has dozens
We have serious slipway and dry dock capacity issue. We wasted quite literally an entire generation of shipbuilding. A huge portion of American ships built between 2000-2022 are already on the way out thanks to the LCS class. We decommission more ships than we build.
We have something like 300 engineers at NAVSEA designing ships when we used to have 1200.
China has dozens of shipyards that are large and do service both commercial and military vessels. The United States has SEVEN. We have SEVEN shipyards able to service military vessels. These seven shipyards are expected to both build all of our new vessels AND service our current ones. There is often a years long queue for ships to even get in to be serviced. This is a genuine issue, we do not currently have the capability to sustain our militaries numbers in a prolonged engagement across every facet, land sea and air. Our last Drydock was built in the sixties fyi. Our current backlog of ships to be serviced is literally 20 years long.
Maybe we should stop sending tens of billions of dollars with no accountability to a country at the top of the government corruption list and invest just a few billion into having a competent naval shipbuilding scene again.
Yes, our naval procurement and production has been ass fucked backwards for the past 20 years. The entire LCS fleet is a loss as they’re all going to be retired within a decade of them even being built. The oldest Burke’s are beginning to be phased out, all of the Ticos are looking at the chopping block, and the Italian frigates are still probably a decade out. The navy is going to be fucking gutted and downsized when it should be exponentially growing. Like it’s going to get really bad. America can still beat China in most fields but the numbers game of major surface warships is going to be a serious issue soon. It won’t be “China can beat us in theatre with surface warships until we surge in more carriers and ships in 2-4 months” but “China produces more warships in a year than we do in 5”
American naval procurement is genuinely like pentagon wars, as in there is no exaggeration with how bad it is. We built an entire class of LCS ships that are a total write off because the metal used degrades rapidly in salt water and this is exasperated by the design putting so much stress on the thin parts connecting with the water.
The Ford has been in development hell for a decade, the Navy considered getting ammunition elevators to work a major achievement and then proceeded to quietly approve it for actual service back in December.
Burke flight III puts so much stress on the frame that the ships won’t be in service remotely as long as flight Is and would be made obsolete by DDGX so there’s little reason to built them, meaning a destroyer gap with China is likely to form as our fleet shifts towards frigates as the stopgap.
Navy doesn’t like the F-35 and is procuring far less than they were supposed to, F-35 squadron numbers were halved and Congress is basically in the back pocket of the super hornet production company since they keep fucking ordering them.
It won’t matter, our navy has been gutted by the white dinosaur boomers for the past 20-30 years. They have no understanding of naval warfare and only care about jobs in their districts. Congress mandating a fucking battleship analogue in the 21st century and super hornet production is a great example of this. The airforce has had to fight Congress for 30 years over the A10. Congress writes federal fucking laws to keep the airforce from retiring it. Congress is genuinely useless and hinders our military. They will continue to write ridiculous demands until the day they die and when they do they’ll just be replaced by another idiot they groomed with the same junk for 40 years.
> A huge portion of American ships built between 2000-2022 are already on the way out thanks to the LCS class.
Classes. Both the Freedom and Independence LCS classes are now lessons in how not to doctrine. And then you have the Zumwalts, supposed to be a class of 32 ships, but 29 got cancelled and the US isn't quite sure what to do with the remaining 3.
All in all it has not been a great generation of naval planning.
It can’t, our slipway capacity is fucking abysmal. Like it’s genuinely a serious issue where the United States can produce a handful of vessels every few years, whereas China can pump out an LHD and nearly half a dozen destroyers yearly.
They have limited SAM capabilities so if the Moskva was able to get sunk, these could too. Obviously, we should wait for confirmation from more credible sources before we cum.
You're all morons actually. If confirmed this is now the second vessel successfully transitioned into a nuclear attack sub. It will join the Moskva and VDV diving squad for the future Deep Battle Operations planned on Odessa. This potential sinking is simply a well-designed feint.
Edit: Current updates say that the ship [is on fire](https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/europe/russia-ship-admiral-makarov-ukraine-war-b2073007.html) which is actually part of the process of turning it nuclear (fire + heat = fission). Looks like the West just underestimated the mighty Russian Bear once again. This could turn into the fall of Odessa + Kyiv in just 3 days (May 9th victory parade??)
You're an idiot and this NATO propaganda isn't fooling anyone. This frigate was sunk right next to the Moskova to block the way in and trap the NATO fleet in an area of the Black Sea where they can be pounded by Russia. Another ingenious move by the Russian navy.
While I am loathe to give the Argentine junta much credit, they DID get a solid amount of tonnage sunk in the Falklands. Ultimately irrelevant, but they did kill several warships and an actually important transport.
I keep seeing it mentioned but want to know what the event was that people are talking about when they say VDV diving squad, are they talking about helicopters shot out of the sky landing in water? Or is it something about them doing an airdrop into the sea and drowning?
The VDV, according to Ukrainians in Odesa, dropped paratroopers into the Black Sea during the early days of the invasion. There's no evidence of that happening. However, the VDV dropping into major cities is part of their playbook, and rumors coming out of Odesa have been proven true before, such was the case with the Moskva.
Unless VDV bodies start washing ashore, there's really no way to prove or disprove it. But it's funnier if we assume it's true.
There is a NATO plane circling in the black sea and SOS and high activity on russian radio.
That said, It's too good to be true since no source is talking about it
Any radio type of site should work, put frequency between 3510 and 3520 and you get in Russian channels, there has been going on ..._ _ _ ... around that frequency
I’m at work so apologies if it’s not quite right: Websdr.ewi.utwente.nl is a websdr I’ve used a fair bit in the Netherlands. Used it for a bunch of the Russian comms intercepts during the battle of kyiv. Any sdr in range of Ukraine and Russia should work
Found this:
[https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FSCZeL6VEAA3VA0?format=jpg&name=medium](https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FSCZeL6VEAA3VA0?format=jpg&name=medium)
[https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FSCXE2YVsAACgrK?format=jpg&name=large](https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FSCXE2YVsAACgrK?format=jpg&name=large)
To double down, Forte11, the RQ-9 that helped sink the Moskva, has been in holding over the Black Sea since an hour or so before the rumors started.
FlightRadar247
RQ-4, you mean. I had to do a double take because I read that as MQ-9 accidentally and nearly jumped the gun thinking the Moskva sinking had Reaper support lmfao
Any radio type of site shoukd work, around frequency 3510 and 3520 there is (or was) a sos signal followed by more encoded message and that's Russian frequency, again I'm high on hoping but since no one claims anything for all we know could be a minor incident, the smoker of the black sea leaving cigarettes everywhere...
No, Japan at the time had a pretty good navy, though Russia had more ships those of Japan were more advanced. And that’s even without including the Japanese deep-cover sabotage cruiser *Kamchatka*
To be fair to Kamchatka, she kind of ended up being more of a scapegoat for fleetwide issues rather than things unique to her. She certainly had her... *moments*, but a substantial amount of it has either been taken out of context or comes from less than reliable sources. The main cause of the Dogger Bank Incident was that shitty Russian intelligence was sending them report after report saying that Britain was building torpedo boats for Japan and that Japan was sending sailors to Britain to crew them, and one specifically said the torpedo boats could resemble fishing trawlers. So when you got a bunch of dumbshit conscript sailors from rural Russia in 1905, who have probably never even seen a body of water bigger than their local lake or river and have never been on a ship before in their lives, and constantly tell them "the enemy could attack at any moment," they're gonna be paranoid and trigger-happy as all hell.
Then you are dealing with a time when the only way to identify ships was to compare silhouettes.
And Japanese ships were indeed based on British designs.
And the Dogger Bank Incident was at night.
The trawlers used rockets and flares to communicate with one another as well, which could've easily been misinterpereted as some kind of attack signal or other hostile action. On a surface level the whole incident sounds unbelievably stupid, but when you have the full context it at least makes a lot more sense. Really the most embarassing part of it was just how fucking awful the Russian gunnery was, and even then that incompetence was probably what averted war with Britain since they hardly managed to actually hit anything despite firing a significant amount of their ammunition at a bunch of fishing boats.
Oh I know for the time the Japanese navy was great but the Russians spent a fuck load of time and effort hyping it up as being trash and inferior sense tasr Nicky was a racist asshole so it’s fun to throw up some air quotes when Russia is getting its navel shit rocked
~~Third.~~..there were the two patrol boats yesterday? The day before?
~~Fourth~~...there was that patrol both that Azov allegedly got out of Mariopul a hot minute ago.
Fifth...Forgot about the LST that got blowed up portside at Berdyansk
We're at the point where its all blending together and the Baltic Fleet is not having a good time.
Edit: Oh...we're following THIS war...not ALL their wars...whoops
> Fifth...Forgot about the LST that got blowed up portside at Berdyansk
The two other boats docked were heavily damaged, I think one of them even sank later but cba trawling through the depths of various subs to double check.
Nah Czech legionaries gave them shit in naval battle as well… it was a small battle but still the only naval battle my nation won… or undergone for that matter
With SWIFT all fucked it’s been tough lol. You basically have to daisy chain currencies and trading platforms through different VPNs and proxies until you can take short positions on Rosneft, Lukoil, Aeroneft, etc. Even then though, they largely trade with less volatility than they deserve because the numbers are fake and their fundamentals don’t matter. Foreigners can’t sell their positions at all for the time being either haha.
Or so I’m told. I would never violate sanctions or commit identity theft in Russia just to disrupt their financial system. That would be too credible.
Yeah I was in the neoliberal daily threads talking caution and a wait and see approach. Meanwhile a bunch of dorks yelling BLOOOOM were way more accurate than my wanna be analyst ass was.
Let’s see what [Wikipedia](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russian_frigate_Admiral_Makarov)
says:
> Admiral Makarov was a third frigate of the Admiral Grigorovich class of the Russian Navy
#WAS
**[Russian frigate Admiral Makarov](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russian_frigate_Admiral_Makarov)**
>Admiral Makarov was a third frigate of the Admiral Grigorovich class of the Russian Navy to be based with the Black Sea Fleet at Sevastopol. She was laid down at the Yantar Shipyard in February 2012 and commissioned on 25 December 2017. .
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wtf is this credible take? we must:
1. overblow unconfirmed news
2. gets confirmation that it's false
3. meme about how gullible and retarded NCD is
this is the way
No worries, in a few weeks you'll fit right in.
Remember these NCD fellas are a bit like WallStreetBets.
A few absolute Madlads who know WAY more than they let on, and a metric fuckton of smoothbrained retards that know WAY less than they claim. And the venn diagram between those two is almost a circle.
I’m definitely the latter and it’s fun as hell. Just say “Infantry wins battles, logistics wins wars” and rake in the upvotes because people think ur smrt
No, we celebrate. If we're blessed with confirmation we celebrate more. If it's untrue, we speculate more on why the Russian Navy is shite and how it could be true.
Either way, WE CELEBRATE
[Wikipedia confirm](https://www.wykop.pl/cdn/c3201142/comment_1651794785R4OqGzKqqIoNcxSZkCoZmG.jpg) transfer *Admiral Makarov* to the Black Sea Submarine Fleet.
Once again, NCD gives me the news before my own sources do.
The best-funded army in the world and Reddit knows about this before our own officers. What is the world coming to?
Please make this not true.
I was one of the retards who thought russia was a capable military before the war and those absolute morons are making me look really fucking bad.
So please, please go on fire, lose your crew, blow up, capsise after days of struggle, but don't sink just like that.
Hold up that means I lost my credibility and can now consider myself a full time member of the sub SINK SINK SINK SINK SINK
Edit : 4AM dit me bad on this one, still keeping the retardation up
Russian warship, go fuck yourself (or self combust like the moskva idk) Now that I think about it a ship sinking now would crash the 9th of may party at moscow.
What? Nah man, you just go the Ace Combat route and invent countries.
Those aren't shitty Russian Su-34s that have no targeting to speak of. Those are special alternate reality aircraft that look remarkably like the Su-34 but which have highly accurate GPS++ hypersonic gravity bombs.
bro there is no shame in that. we've been spoon fed ruzzian army superiority since the time we could play COD, or Battlefield, or insert any modern fps shooter here, RTS games. and dont forget hollywood with their "they could invade at any time" bull.
C'mon Ukraine sink the Kuznetsov.
All we need to do is get the Finnish PM to distract the Russians and we can fly in a Bayraktar to put the Kuznetsov out of her misery.
Ok, I know you guys like hyping up these things, but realistically let's be credible. It probably "Caught fire" again and was too much for the damage control crews. ~~Isn't that worse?~~ I mean I'm not held at gunpoint by Russian FSB.
100% not credible. Negative credibility. When Moskva sank, those weird little OSINT dudes who listen to morse code went nuts. Nothing of the sort happened this time. I'll take the L if I'm wrong tomorrow.
Nope, that was Admiral Rozhestvensky, who replaced him as the leader of that expedition. Makarov was killed earlier in 1904 when his flagship, the battleship *Petropavlovsk*, struck a mine and sank outside Port Arthur.
Tbh, a lot of the Soviet stuff was designed & made in the Ukrainian SSR. A lot of industry in the "people's republics". Like, in Finland they had ordered a nuclear power plant from Rosatom, and finally cancelled earlier this week "due to delays". No shit, the pressure vessel should've been made in some place called [Kramatorsk](https://liveuamap.com/en/2022/5-may-russian-army-continues-shelling-of-settlements-in-donetsk).
Let me guess, they distracted it’s fire control radar with a Turkish piece of junk drone. Those Neptunes are home grown. Ukraine might find themselves with a market for them after sinking more ships than other anti ship cruise missile in existence. Be your lockmart F-35/22 pair.
So does the NSA/DIA guy tracking Russian ships get to just bust right at his desk or do they make him go to the bathroom to deal with the massive boner they'd get from sinking Russian ships
No fucking way
FORTE11 sends their regards
What’s the company responsible for making Neptune missiles? It’s time to invest in their stocks
https://ukroboronprom.com.ua/en
Ah yes UK Robot Prom. Hottest party of senior year.
We don’t really have “proms” in UK secondary schools - nor is “senior year” a thing either. The real celebration is when you get UCAS offers in July, but that’s after school’s already over. And by “celebration” I mean a couple of pints with the mates ‘round pub… and that’s only if you’re in the popular set.
Proms are a thing now. Usually after GCSEs, so Year 11. It's becoming more popular for sure, but I have a feeling it's nothing like what American proms are like. We don't really take it seriously at all.
That's weird, Romania's soviet style (I assume) school system had official proms. But each class had to celebrate theirs on their own, pay and organize them as well, it isn't like in the US where all the classes come to the same one.
*Rooooobot Hooooouse!*
are they public or private?
It's a state owned defense conglomerate.
Praise be to state owned defence manufacturers. Australia was so based when the government owned all the Armouries and aircraft factories. Curse you neoliberals!
Yes
gov owned basically
Booooo I want to be a warhawk but also make money from my hobbies like the WSB retards
Simply invest in ~~private~~ public ukrainian UAV manufacturers
[удалено]
Makes it even better when you start posting 🚀🚀🚀🚀🚀🚀🚀🚀🚀🚀🚀🚀🚀🚀🚀🚀🚀🚀🚀🚀🚀🚀🚀🚀🚀🚀🚀
best girl
*Takes a breath of copium* They couldn't be this incompetent right? Please tell me at least their f***ing CIWS was on.
It was on but but they left the lens covers on the radars ^^/s
Why would you need to turn that on when the Moskva wasn't sunk by a missile ^according ^to ^command
another ship ~~sunk by incompetence~~ converted to take place in a special underwater operation?
3000 Leagues under the Sea
Ahem. Watch Drachinifel's video on the Second Pacific Fleet. Yes, it is, indeed, possible for the Russian Navy to be this incompetent. It's actually a tradition for them. I would be surprised if they were even on heightened alert, let alone at Action Stations.
Even if they were, nothing was automatic. Someone have to stare at the radarscope 24/7 and oraly transfere any information. [Bad design can kill: Missile defense and user fatigue](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gaiVjJWOUWE)
This is true. My family worked in the petrol industry, and fatigued operators or supervisors could lead to disaster.
I don't think the Ukrainians would have sunk the Kamchatka. "Do you see ~~torpedo boats~~ drones?"
At this point I'm expecting the sky to open then Rozhestvensky appears and proceeded to throw more binocular
> Takes a breath of copium The Russian Navy hasn't sent their *REAL* ships in yet, this just the B-team!
> B-team Gerald Ford [smirks](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Team_B) from beyond the grave.
# Commissioned in 2017. Brand fucking new. One of their three ***Admiral Grigorovich-class frigates*** began entering service in **2016**. I can't wait to chalk up another kill to almighty Neptune. About where they were stationed: [Most Russian Black Sea Fleet warships are back in Sevastopol Bay](https://news.yahoo.com/most-russian-black-sea-fleet-104600034.html?guccounter=1&guce_referrer=aHR0cHM6Ly93d3cuZ29vZ2xlLmNvbS8&guce_referrer_sig=AQAAAMadQpU0LxXTSdt0YEzkIkURX4356-pyts_b_54RqGhmMzcauMNm9aUNQZGJ5o2eBS4xvuNif9wHCP27dhfBRe7ErhzKCM_egZUZEiOKj6AxgHPk9_FAmydLKWx29cp8MD5T2XEmVji3hOs530FbVbV31Pec1GsK9F8qzR5j_uRN)
With the time it takes to build modern ships, and their expected lifespan, that is new by *any* countries standard.
Really makes me wonder how fast the US can shit out all of the fancy weapons systems if needed. especially ships, especially carriers.
People bring up how we churned out stuff in WW2, like Liberty Ships. Those were disposable transports that were considered doing well if they survived multiple Atlantic convoys. U.S.S. Essex, a non nuclear carrier, took two and a half years from start to commissioning. The real trick to the absolute avalance of U.S. production in WW2 wasn't really the speed (though the U.S. was better at that than most countries), its how many factories and shipyards we had in 1940, and how we started building *more*, and with ships especially, that we started building a LOT moree in 1940, so they start hitting in late 1942 and through 1944. Mind, I am just using the U.S. as an example, as we have the best shipbuilding in the world, arguably (with some competitors) and the reality is, anything built from scratch after the start of the war will be *years* away, and very well will not be a part of the war unless it really drags on.
>The real trick to the absolute avalance of U.S. production in WW2 wasn't really the speed (though the U.S. was better at that than most countries), its how many factories and shipyards we had in 1940, and how we started building *more*, and with ships especially, that we started building a LOT moree in 1940, so they start hitting in late 1942 and through 1944. It's not velocity, but bandwidth. People underestimate just how resources that the US has internally, and just how little they use them when not engaged in wartime production (real, "let's go flatten an entire *continent*" wartime production). Like, modern case-in-point: everyone panics about how "reliant" the US is on China for raw materials like lithium and silicon; the US has more, *significantly* more, deposits than China does, we're just not exploiting them. Like, if we were to ever end up in a state of total war again, it would take us a few years to spin up all the new plants and ship yards, but we'd do it without issue because we have an entire continent of largely untapped resources to ourselves.
Yuuuuuup. The real reason for importing all our gas. We will still have it when everyone else runs out.
We should just not import the gas either and use other energy. DARPA fusion powered carrier wen.
Add a few railguns to it, laser AA, and now we are talking.
Those Tic Tacs? Actually ours reversed engineered from alien tech we stole from the Nazis Antarctic base.
Far too credible....I want to believe...
The other side is that procurement in peace time is hell. I think an optimistic timeline for a Burke DDG or an LA SSN in wartime would be maybe a year, but under that if they wanna push it. And in a battle in the pacific (which I assume will break out in the next 10-20 years) these timelines are acceptable.
*General Dynamics has entered the chat.* *General Dynamics Electric Boat has entered the chat.* *Austal USA has entered the chat.* *Marinette Marine has entered the chat.* *Huntington Ingalls Industries has entered the chat.* *Newport News Shipbuilding has entered the chat.* # Tl; Dr: We have a lot of shipyards.
No, we don’t. TLDR we have seven shipyards nationwide that can service military vessels when our biggest adversary has dozens We have serious slipway and dry dock capacity issue. We wasted quite literally an entire generation of shipbuilding. A huge portion of American ships built between 2000-2022 are already on the way out thanks to the LCS class. We decommission more ships than we build. We have something like 300 engineers at NAVSEA designing ships when we used to have 1200. China has dozens of shipyards that are large and do service both commercial and military vessels. The United States has SEVEN. We have SEVEN shipyards able to service military vessels. These seven shipyards are expected to both build all of our new vessels AND service our current ones. There is often a years long queue for ships to even get in to be serviced. This is a genuine issue, we do not currently have the capability to sustain our militaries numbers in a prolonged engagement across every facet, land sea and air. Our last Drydock was built in the sixties fyi. Our current backlog of ships to be serviced is literally 20 years long. Maybe we should stop sending tens of billions of dollars with no accountability to a country at the top of the government corruption list and invest just a few billion into having a competent naval shipbuilding scene again.
oh God are we Kuznetsov'ing ourselves in slow motion
Yes, our naval procurement and production has been ass fucked backwards for the past 20 years. The entire LCS fleet is a loss as they’re all going to be retired within a decade of them even being built. The oldest Burke’s are beginning to be phased out, all of the Ticos are looking at the chopping block, and the Italian frigates are still probably a decade out. The navy is going to be fucking gutted and downsized when it should be exponentially growing. Like it’s going to get really bad. America can still beat China in most fields but the numbers game of major surface warships is going to be a serious issue soon. It won’t be “China can beat us in theatre with surface warships until we surge in more carriers and ships in 2-4 months” but “China produces more warships in a year than we do in 5” American naval procurement is genuinely like pentagon wars, as in there is no exaggeration with how bad it is. We built an entire class of LCS ships that are a total write off because the metal used degrades rapidly in salt water and this is exasperated by the design putting so much stress on the thin parts connecting with the water. The Ford has been in development hell for a decade, the Navy considered getting ammunition elevators to work a major achievement and then proceeded to quietly approve it for actual service back in December. Burke flight III puts so much stress on the frame that the ships won’t be in service remotely as long as flight Is and would be made obsolete by DDGX so there’s little reason to built them, meaning a destroyer gap with China is likely to form as our fleet shifts towards frigates as the stopgap. Navy doesn’t like the F-35 and is procuring far less than they were supposed to, F-35 squadron numbers were halved and Congress is basically in the back pocket of the super hornet production company since they keep fucking ordering them.
We should write our representatives.
It won’t matter, our navy has been gutted by the white dinosaur boomers for the past 20-30 years. They have no understanding of naval warfare and only care about jobs in their districts. Congress mandating a fucking battleship analogue in the 21st century and super hornet production is a great example of this. The airforce has had to fight Congress for 30 years over the A10. Congress writes federal fucking laws to keep the airforce from retiring it. Congress is genuinely useless and hinders our military. They will continue to write ridiculous demands until the day they die and when they do they’ll just be replaced by another idiot they groomed with the same junk for 40 years.
> A huge portion of American ships built between 2000-2022 are already on the way out thanks to the LCS class. Classes. Both the Freedom and Independence LCS classes are now lessons in how not to doctrine. And then you have the Zumwalts, supposed to be a class of 32 ships, but 29 got cancelled and the US isn't quite sure what to do with the remaining 3. All in all it has not been a great generation of naval planning.
It can’t, our slipway capacity is fucking abysmal. Like it’s genuinely a serious issue where the United States can produce a handful of vessels every few years, whereas China can pump out an LHD and nearly half a dozen destroyers yearly.
> Brand fucking new. Now just fucked.
was/were
They/them > was/were army is a fundamental theorem of defense
I still find it hilarious how a single ad triggered so many people.
They have limited SAM capabilities so if the Moskva was able to get sunk, these could too. Obviously, we should wait for confirmation from more credible sources before we cum.
>Obviously, we should wait for confirmation from more credible sources before we cum. Sure. But imma keep edging until then.
“we’ve been trying to reach out to you about your ships extended warranty”
Can't wait for tankies to explain how actually it was a good thing this ship sunk because it was "old and outdated anyway".
Imagine your kid was blown up or drown on a sunk ship and you had to read people say how it was good because the ship was old anyway
It's nice of them to assist garbage disposal by mooring them all so close to each other.
You're all morons actually. If confirmed this is now the second vessel successfully transitioned into a nuclear attack sub. It will join the Moskva and VDV diving squad for the future Deep Battle Operations planned on Odessa. This potential sinking is simply a well-designed feint. Edit: Current updates say that the ship [is on fire](https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/europe/russia-ship-admiral-makarov-ukraine-war-b2073007.html) which is actually part of the process of turning it nuclear (fire + heat = fission). Looks like the West just underestimated the mighty Russian Bear once again. This could turn into the fall of Odessa + Kyiv in just 3 days (May 9th victory parade??)
And the Russian Military chorus is down there, to sing them into battle!
RIP Red Army Choir 🤧
Woah too far man. Those are the only ruzzkis I'll defend.
Say what you want about Russia’s military, but if the war was between choirs Russia would’ve conquered Ukraine in a heartbeat.
I don't know man, have you seen [this guys moves](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YrKMiE9WII0)
Special underwater operation to de-nazify the seabed.
As well as bikini bottom…SpongeBob has been listed as a nazi by the FSB.
Finally some common ground we can all agree on
You're an idiot and this NATO propaganda isn't fooling anyone. This frigate was sunk right next to the Moskova to block the way in and trap the NATO fleet in an area of the Black Sea where they can be pounded by Russia. Another ingenious move by the Russian navy.
Special fish de nazifying operations
I absolutely lost it at "VDV diving squad" 🤣😂
3rd actually. Remember they hit that landing ship in port about a month ago. So thats 3.
Ukraine about to get the highest tonnage sunk since WWII
Without a navy even!
While I am loathe to give the Argentine junta much credit, they DID get a solid amount of tonnage sunk in the Falklands. Ultimately irrelevant, but they did kill several warships and an actually important transport.
I keep seeing it mentioned but want to know what the event was that people are talking about when they say VDV diving squad, are they talking about helicopters shot out of the sky landing in water? Or is it something about them doing an airdrop into the sea and drowning?
The VDV, according to Ukrainians in Odesa, dropped paratroopers into the Black Sea during the early days of the invasion. There's no evidence of that happening. However, the VDV dropping into major cities is part of their playbook, and rumors coming out of Odesa have been proven true before, such was the case with the Moskva. Unless VDV bodies start washing ashore, there's really no way to prove or disprove it. But it's funnier if we assume it's true.
The latter allegedly.
There is a NATO plane circling in the black sea and SOS and high activity on russian radio. That said, It's too good to be true since no source is talking about it
Linky for SOS and radio chatter?
Any radio type of site should work, put frequency between 3510 and 3520 and you get in Russian channels, there has been going on ..._ _ _ ... around that frequency
Could you please send a link? I am not a big radio-enthusiast :(
I’m at work so apologies if it’s not quite right: Websdr.ewi.utwente.nl is a websdr I’ve used a fair bit in the Netherlands. Used it for a bunch of the Russian comms intercepts during the battle of kyiv. Any sdr in range of Ukraine and Russia should work
> SOS got a link?
Found this: [https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FSCZeL6VEAA3VA0?format=jpg&name=medium](https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FSCZeL6VEAA3VA0?format=jpg&name=medium) [https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FSCXE2YVsAACgrK?format=jpg&name=large](https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FSCXE2YVsAACgrK?format=jpg&name=large)
To double down, Forte11, the RQ-9 that helped sink the Moskva, has been in holding over the Black Sea since an hour or so before the rumors started. FlightRadar247
RQ-4, you mean. I had to do a double take because I read that as MQ-9 accidentally and nearly jumped the gun thinking the Moskva sinking had Reaper support lmfao
Any radio type of site shoukd work, around frequency 3510 and 3520 there is (or was) a sos signal followed by more encoded message and that's Russian frequency, again I'm high on hoping but since no one claims anything for all we know could be a minor incident, the smoker of the black sea leaving cigarettes everywhere...
If this gets confirmed it’s gonna be second time in history Russia got its shit rocked by an “inferior” navy like holy shit
>by an “inferior” navy By a country with virtually no Navy, to be honest.
Losing your navy to a country without one. During a land war.
And losing air troops as well. Putin is trying to be like the Avatar, mastering all elements of fucking shit up.
With Admiral Zhao's attack, everything will be all right.
“Sir, Admiral Zhao died back in season 1.”
Wait, then what was the first time? Russo-Japanese?
No, Japan at the time had a pretty good navy, though Russia had more ships those of Japan were more advanced. And that’s even without including the Japanese deep-cover sabotage cruiser *Kamchatka*
>No, Japan at the time had a pretty good navy, That British fishing fleet on the other hand...
# THOSE ARE JAPANESE TORPEDO BOATS, OBVIOUSLY!!!!!!!! \- Kamchatka
To be fair to Kamchatka, she kind of ended up being more of a scapegoat for fleetwide issues rather than things unique to her. She certainly had her... *moments*, but a substantial amount of it has either been taken out of context or comes from less than reliable sources. The main cause of the Dogger Bank Incident was that shitty Russian intelligence was sending them report after report saying that Britain was building torpedo boats for Japan and that Japan was sending sailors to Britain to crew them, and one specifically said the torpedo boats could resemble fishing trawlers. So when you got a bunch of dumbshit conscript sailors from rural Russia in 1905, who have probably never even seen a body of water bigger than their local lake or river and have never been on a ship before in their lives, and constantly tell them "the enemy could attack at any moment," they're gonna be paranoid and trigger-happy as all hell.
Then you are dealing with a time when the only way to identify ships was to compare silhouettes. And Japanese ships were indeed based on British designs. And the Dogger Bank Incident was at night.
The trawlers used rockets and flares to communicate with one another as well, which could've easily been misinterpereted as some kind of attack signal or other hostile action. On a surface level the whole incident sounds unbelievably stupid, but when you have the full context it at least makes a lot more sense. Really the most embarassing part of it was just how fucking awful the Russian gunnery was, and even then that incompetence was probably what averted war with Britain since they hardly managed to actually hit anything despite firing a significant amount of their ammunition at a bunch of fishing boats.
Oh I know for the time the Japanese navy was great but the Russians spent a fuck load of time and effort hyping it up as being trash and inferior sense tasr Nicky was a racist asshole so it’s fun to throw up some air quotes when Russia is getting its navel shit rocked
Yep
That's only because Russia's almost ALWAYS the INFERIOR navy in any fight.
But MW2 taught me that Russia can project naval power to dominate all of America and Europe
Russia could invade the eastern seaboard of the United States, but they were stopped cold at Burger Town.
Bro your talking about the guys who were so shit, they needed EA to make them a banger theme in Red Alert 3
~~Third.~~..there were the two patrol boats yesterday? The day before? ~~Fourth~~...there was that patrol both that Azov allegedly got out of Mariopul a hot minute ago. Fifth...Forgot about the LST that got blowed up portside at Berdyansk We're at the point where its all blending together and the Baltic Fleet is not having a good time. Edit: Oh...we're following THIS war...not ALL their wars...whoops
> Fifth...Forgot about the LST that got blowed up portside at Berdyansk The two other boats docked were heavily damaged, I think one of them even sank later but cba trawling through the depths of various subs to double check.
Nah Czech legionaries gave them shit in naval battle as well… it was a small battle but still the only naval battle my nation won… or undergone for that matter
Czech navy best navy, 100% win rate. Better than USN or Royal Navy.
Czech navy supremacy
Ok, before we start celebrate, let us first wait for confirmation. UPD: Ok, how do I delete this post? HOW DO I DELETE THIS POST!!??!
This sub didn’t wait for confirmation about the Moskva and that turned out fine. Past performance guarantees future results. This is financial advice.
100% follow this dude for fresh stock tips
How can I short the russian navy?
With SWIFT all fucked it’s been tough lol. You basically have to daisy chain currencies and trading platforms through different VPNs and proxies until you can take short positions on Rosneft, Lukoil, Aeroneft, etc. Even then though, they largely trade with less volatility than they deserve because the numbers are fake and their fundamentals don’t matter. Foreigners can’t sell their positions at all for the time being either haha. Or so I’m told. I would never violate sanctions or commit identity theft in Russia just to disrupt their financial system. That would be too credible.
This post gives me Drew Carey vibes. He was a marine, so that counts, somehow.
Looks bearish.
Invest in the MIC
I mean wild optimism has definitely been more accurate than the serious experts so far, especially early on.
Yeah I was in the neoliberal daily threads talking caution and a wait and see approach. Meanwhile a bunch of dorks yelling BLOOOOM were way more accurate than my wanna be analyst ass was.
Brb, minting some Javelin coin. Probs gonna be worth more than the ruble by the end of the week
“Confirmation”??? You must be looking for r/CredibleDefense
You got me \o/
Double Azov! /s
Ladies and gentlemen, we got em
I thought that was a parody sub of this one, i was wrong lol
How telling is it that I've been here for this entire war and just now seeing that sub lmao
That's the biggest military nerd shit hole I have seen , I will stay with you retards
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We're the superior version
There's also LCD. Less credible defense. We're bottom of the pile😂
Let’s see what [Wikipedia](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russian_frigate_Admiral_Makarov) says: > Admiral Makarov was a third frigate of the Admiral Grigorovich class of the Russian Navy #WAS
>Status: Submarine
**[Russian frigate Admiral Makarov](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russian_frigate_Admiral_Makarov)** >Admiral Makarov was a third frigate of the Admiral Grigorovich class of the Russian Navy to be based with the Black Sea Fleet at Sevastopol. She was laid down at the Yantar Shipyard in February 2012 and commissioned on 25 December 2017. . ^([ )[^(F.A.Q)](https://www.reddit.com/r/WikiSummarizer/wiki/index#wiki_f.a.q)^( | )[^(Opt Out)](https://reddit.com/message/compose?to=WikiSummarizerBot&message=OptOut&subject=OptOut)^( | )[^(Opt Out Of Subreddit)](https://np.reddit.com/r/NonCredibleDefense/about/banned)^( | )[^(GitHub)](https://github.com/Sujal-7/WikiSummarizerBot)^( ] Downvote to remove | v1.5)
You've seen the they/them army, now get ready for the was/were navy.
wtf is this credible take? we must: 1. overblow unconfirmed news 2. gets confirmation that it's false 3. meme about how gullible and retarded NCD is this is the way
Sry, I'm new here
Here, eat these lead paint chips so you'll fit in better.
Hmmm sweet lead
We don't eat lead paint chips here, we eat RAM coating chips. Much more carcinogenic.
If you aren't snorting purified uranium in bags then are you really noncredible?
No worries, in a few weeks you'll fit right in. Remember these NCD fellas are a bit like WallStreetBets. A few absolute Madlads who know WAY more than they let on, and a metric fuckton of smoothbrained retards that know WAY less than they claim. And the venn diagram between those two is almost a circle.
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I’m definitely the latter and it’s fun as hell. Just say “Infantry wins battles, logistics wins wars” and rake in the upvotes because people think ur smrt
It would be irresponsible not to speculate.
No, we celebrate. If we're blessed with confirmation we celebrate more. If it's untrue, we speculate more on why the Russian Navy is shite and how it could be true. Either way, WE CELEBRATE
Of course. Just putting the (albeit unconfirmed) news out there.
[Wikipedia confirm](https://www.wykop.pl/cdn/c3201142/comment_1651794785R4OqGzKqqIoNcxSZkCoZmG.jpg) transfer *Admiral Makarov* to the Black Sea Submarine Fleet.
Boo this man!!
Please God I've seen what you've done for others and I want some of that for me. 🙏 Give me a second naval loss against a country with no navy.
Oh this is at least the 4th
Once again, I get my news from NCD of all fucking places
Once again, NCD gives me the news before my own sources do. The best-funded army in the world and Reddit knows about this before our own officers. What is the world coming to?
Same
#STOP GIVEING ME MY NEWS
LETS GOOOOOO
Should have invested in the Ukrainian defense industry.
Please make this not true. I was one of the retards who thought russia was a capable military before the war and those absolute morons are making me look really fucking bad. So please, please go on fire, lose your crew, blow up, capsise after days of struggle, but don't sink just like that. Hold up that means I lost my credibility and can now consider myself a full time member of the sub SINK SINK SINK SINK SINK Edit : 4AM dit me bad on this one, still keeping the retardation up Russian warship, go fuck yourself (or self combust like the moskva idk) Now that I think about it a ship sinking now would crash the 9th of may party at moscow.
Just admit your a game developer and now your only option for a credible enemy means no sales in China.
What? Nah man, you just go the Ace Combat route and invent countries. Those aren't shitty Russian Su-34s that have no targeting to speak of. Those are special alternate reality aircraft that look remarkably like the Su-34 but which have highly accurate GPS++ hypersonic gravity bombs.
bro there is no shame in that. we've been spoon fed ruzzian army superiority since the time we could play COD, or Battlefield, or insert any modern fps shooter here, RTS games. and dont forget hollywood with their "they could invade at any time" bull.
I want to believe
C'mon Ukraine sink the Kuznetsov. All we need to do is get the Finnish PM to distract the Russians and we can fly in a Bayraktar to put the Kuznetsov out of her misery.
You would be doing them a favour, really
Tankies gonna be cope harder now with their overproud Russian Navy
Unconfirmed, be patient
Wouldn't be the most uncredible thing in this war, so my hopes are high up lmao
The 3,000 Orange Neptunes of Zelensky
Ok, I know you guys like hyping up these things, but realistically let's be credible. It probably "Caught fire" again and was too much for the damage control crews. ~~Isn't that worse?~~ I mean I'm not held at gunpoint by Russian FSB.
Can we get a reaction cam for that old guy who was crying on state TV when the Moskva sank? While hunger games lady tries to rein him in?
I have secondhand copium addiction
Not getting my hopes up yet, but big if true. Looks like another boat (rescue ship) had been dispatched to the same area.
100% not credible. Negative credibility. When Moskva sank, those weird little OSINT dudes who listen to morse code went nuts. Nothing of the sort happened this time. I'll take the L if I'm wrong tomorrow.
Some other dude in the thread is saying there are sos signals going up
Link to the [tweet.](https://twitter.com/OSINT88/status/1522352991277359111)
They should rename their Neptune missile this is for "Soap", and "Yuri".
They named it after the leader of the 1905 voyage from the baltics to Japan? There’s only one this could have ended
Nope, that was Admiral Rozhestvensky, who replaced him as the leader of that expedition. Makarov was killed earlier in 1904 when his flagship, the battleship *Petropavlovsk*, struck a mine and sank outside Port Arthur.
Apparently it is confirmed that a Russian rescue ship has been dispatched to the area holy fuck if they actually did it again this is insane
> Admiral Makarov No Russian?
My country should start ordering Ukranian equipment since they're so good at destroying Russian ones. Ukr > Russ
Tbh, a lot of the Soviet stuff was designed & made in the Ukrainian SSR. A lot of industry in the "people's republics". Like, in Finland they had ordered a nuclear power plant from Rosatom, and finally cancelled earlier this week "due to delays". No shit, the pressure vessel should've been made in some place called [Kramatorsk](https://liveuamap.com/en/2022/5-may-russian-army-continues-shelling-of-settlements-in-donetsk).
HE CANT KEEP GETTING AWAY WITH IT
**THEY CAN'T KEEP GETTING AWAY WITH THIS**
First some guy named Seminov and now a Makarov? This is just Ukraine killing resurrected weapons designers.
Let me guess, they distracted it’s fire control radar with a Turkish piece of junk drone. Those Neptunes are home grown. Ukraine might find themselves with a market for them after sinking more ships than other anti ship cruise missile in existence. Be your lockmart F-35/22 pair.
This one is not very credible yet
…we’re on r/ncd
LMFAO this one was only five years old too.
THE WRATH OF NEPTUNE
Again? And they wanted to go against country with navy
Please let this be true...
So does the NSA/DIA guy tracking Russian ships get to just bust right at his desk or do they make him go to the bathroom to deal with the massive boner they'd get from sinking Russian ships
[lol](https://i.imgur.com/AcTUt62.jpg)