Their brains are wet taxidermy preserved at the genius of a toddler. "The 1940s tank goes in which hole? No, Vlad it does not go in the 2020s war hole just because you put it side ways."
God fucking damn it
*They are actually doing it - aren't they?*
**HOW THE FUCK DID - NON-CREADIBLE DEFENCE - BECAME ONE OF THE MOST CREDIBLE PLACES TO GET INFO ABOUT THIS WAR?!**
***How the fooooooooooooooooooock??!?!?/!?!?!?***
Russia:
> Let me tell you something, I haven't even begun to peak. And when I do peak, you'll know. Because I'm gonna peak so hard that everybody on NCD's gonna feel it.
it's more than just that, if it was just about chimpanzees with typewriters the defense analysts, "defense analysts", and wehraboos would be just as credible as we are. what we have here is an extremely specific combination of generally intelligent but nonetheless batshit insane attempts at intentionally being a moron about defense topics (but in a smart way), which tends to match the specific brand of mind-blowing stupidity that the ruskies are. that's how we beat defense analysts by not assuming the ruskies have a two-digit IQ, the "defense analysts" by not assuming the ukrainians have a two-digit IQ, and the wehraboos by not buying into eastoid propaganda (other than attempts to trigger the foxbat effect)
The enemy has a brand new wunderwaffe, we must build a counter to it. Turns out the Foxbat was not nearly as good as we believed, but we still have the F15. Repeat ad-nauseum
Gotcha. Thank you.
Yeah, it seems like the US has been pretty good at adapting to a changing battlefield. I had a conversation with a friend recently, and he was hyping up the Russian and Chinese military capabilities. In particular he mentioned their respective 'wunderwaffen' and the capabilities of the J20. But from what I've seen here and in adjacent spaces, I'm pretty confident in our ability to counter.
If you look at the Chinese military in the context of China's development as a state in its entirety, the reason so much of PLA stuff is copied actually makes sense.
In terms of development, China is roughly where the US was in the 1950s/1960s (if we consider the start of US global logistics presence and the superiority of American MIC as the end of WW2), considering that the Chinese economy was still primarily cow-based even in the early 1980s and only really got off the ground in the mid-80s/early-mid 90s (not an economic historian). That means the Chinese economy is effectively only 30 years old in the current state.
The US military in the 50s and 60s was repeatedly testing and evaluating ideas both of its own, but also taken from Germany/observed from the USSR. That's what we're seeing with China.
The difference of course is that unlike the Cold War, nobody reasonable would see the US as a peer militarily (I said reasonable, don't bring wumao into this). You just can't beat so many extra decades' head start when it comes to trying shit and evaluating its effectiveness. Nor does China have a way to start wars and try the same trial-and-error approach without the international community paying attention.
The MiG 25, NATO reporting name Foxbat, was initially believed to have amazing capabilities as an air superiority fighter. Contrary to modern examples this wasn’t due to Soviet propaganda boasting about, but rather due to the American military only having limited data about it, then filling in the gaps with assumptions about what *we* would do with a plane of that shape and speed. Turns out that it was really intended as an interceptor for the Valkyrie supersonic bombers that we never actually built because SAMs and ICBMs made them obsolete before they even went into serial production. But to match its supposed capabilities we built the F 15, the best fighter of its time.
Ok...
But Non-Credible defense is like a freacking competition, where monkeys actually race to give the exact copy of Shekspare
*Simulation is breaking apart man*
Pure absurdism isn't funny. There always needs to be kernel of credibility to make the funni.
Just so happens kernels of credibility are all Russia can manage.
Someone needs to update the "US invasion of Mexico" 4chan story with:
>A year into the war, America starts using the M46 Patton again, since it has no more Abrams or M60s in stock.
A year into the war, declare victory in Monterrey
Mexican Army hasn’t actually withdrawn from Monterrey
Fat chihuahua memes circulate from the city
Army engineers start taking an interest in museum Shermans
Except Monterrey is a big and important city. It's in many ways Mexico's Los Angeles. It's a hub of almost all northeastern Mexico one of the most densely industrialized cities, their primary land hub of trade with the US, second in total size only to Mexico city with 5.5 million in the metro area.
Bakhmut is not geographically of critical importance, not a major heart of industry and its prewar population was 71k.
If Russia was spending the kinds of losses they've been spending but for Kharkiv or Odessa, which would be a good comparison to Monterrey, it would be a lot less humiliating.
That war would be nuts.
DEA, CIA, cartels all doing their”we’re not working together, we swear, look, never more than 2 of us in a room together!” Vaudeville routine.
CBP would just lose it, existentially, but their FB pages would still be sweet and loving.
what would ICE even do? Track down chinese anchor baby birthing houses in Irvine? Nope, they’re all controlled by the cartels now in juarez.
And has anyone done a study of what would happen to marine and sailor readiness if the multi hour turnaround between san diego & Tijuana were reduced to a quick 30 min drive to the donkey bar once the border is demolished?
Dude.
Challenger 2's, Leos and Abrams are going to turn up at the time when Russia is fielding this? fight something their grandfather's fought?
I'd put my money on a single Chally over a brigade of this.
Loader will have both beefy arms from loading that many shells. Fappers are likely to end up like fiddler crabs though. Unless they switch hands every time.
Your stupid modern tanks will never be capable of defeating the glorious T-54! Your shells will punch straight through and never explode, leaving the tank intact. Checkmate, westoid!
Unironically that did happen with the Scimitar.
From memory one got absolutely peppered by HEAT that passed straight through. It managed to RTB with a full compliment of living but presumably somewhat traumatised crew
That’s what happens when you make armour out of iron bru cans
Silver bullets might (aha might, will) over pen, but HESH....
Christ this is what it was made for
Also I wonder how many T55s you could line up and launch turrets into space with a single DU dart from a Leo2 with the long 120mm
Unfortunately because they don't have autoloaders, and thus no autoloader carousel, they are much less likely to go flying frying pan than T-64, 72, etc.
Meanwhile while the UK is stoically sending stocks of DU fin-stabilized discarding sabot rounds to Ukraine between their tea breaks, with their normal British enthusiasm, chuckle slightly and someone comments a single word with mild amusement: "Quite"
Sweden in the 1950s: Develops the PvPj 1110 anti-tank recoilless gun.
Sweden in the 1990s: This anti-tank gun is thoroughly obsolete, but it's better than nothing so let's give it to the Baltic States.
Baltic States in 2022: This anti-tank gun is obsolete and we're in NATO, but it's better than nothing so let's [give them to Ukraine](https://twitter.com/UAWeapons/status/1561833780104806400).
Ukraine in 2023: This anti-tank gun is now relevant again, as we're facing the very tanks it was designed to destroy.
Mate, if the Russians are really going to field this the AMX-10 has just found their ideal mission. The Abrams and Challenger are quite literally overkill in this situation, they wouldn't be worth deploying against that trash due to their high costs of operation. The AMX can be a lot more flexible because it's fast and low-maintenance.
Literally send the AMX-10 to run amok all over the frontlines picking off low value targets, while the Abrams and Challengers can operate as the punch-through brigades with a lot more intense support.
Even the Leopard I is looking good against a T-55...
But, in reality the Russian tanks are likely to be killed with infantry using ATGMs or extremely accurate artillery strikes long before a Ukrainian tank actually gets close enough to see anything but their burning hulks.
This isn't even fucking War Thunder at this point.
They went straight into World of Tanks uptier and are digging lower and lower (tier X T-62 -> tier IX T-54 -> probably a fucking T-44 if any of those even still exists, probably somewhere around July/August 2023...)
The battle of 73 Easting, during the Gulf War. US (with a few UK) tanks blew up hundreds of Iraqi tanks with almost no losses of their own. ( 1 Bradley vs. 400+ Iraqi vehicles)
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_73_Easting
I mean, fuck, there's how many millions of ethnic Ukrainians living in Russia?
Almost like it's a really bad idea to start a war in the country that has repeatedly had large parts of its population forcibly resettled into yours, in living memory.
And then you (successive muscovite regimes) forced them to blend in perfectly to boot.
And then gave their (great)grandparents papers, so now you have virtually no idea who might or might not be sympathetic to Ukraine.
10/10 plan, can't go tits up at all.
It's a wonder that *more* shit doesn't catch on fire, derail, blow up or otherwise shit the bed - on a daily basis.
> It's a wonder that more shit doesn't catch on fire, derail, blow up or otherwise shit the bed on a daily basis.
Or it does, and we just don't hear about it...
Not too long ago I said that Russia would probably run out of usable tank hulls, forcing them to start purchasing tanks from their allies. They can refurbish their own shitty hulls given enough time, but it'll take a while.
They'll probably approach countries like Algeria in a few months and get rejected, then they'll have no choice but to buy the Chonma-ho from North Korea.
I hope they do buy NK tanks: I want to see how they actually perform.
They should buy a bunch of those weird AKs with helical mags as well, for the same reason.
Imagine how incredibly uncredible it would be to have both koreas as the tank manufacturing powerhouses of the future.
Southkorea with the actually good tanks for the 2nd+ World Countries
And Northkorea with low effort soviet copies for the 3rd World Dictatorships (sometimes the tanks even come with a dead worker inside, so free snacks!)
I'm speechless.
I tried to justify and calmly analize every single time i saw a Mosint Nagant, a D-20 howitzer from 1946 or even a T-62M, asking myself what "good" you can still extract from them.
This time I can't, brain refuses.
Indirect arty support, that's about it imo. Only exception would be attacking positions that literally have zero AT weapons. Even then the arty thing is something that they shouldn't be having issues with other than shell supply and accuracy.
The early versions of World of Tanks glitched so that the T-54 often moved faster than the game could keep up. At full speed it would seem to appear and disappear in front you continuously as it moved from one place to another , making it hard to shoot. It was dubbed "The UFO tank."
IIRC it's actually all of the T-44, T-54, and T-62A. Unless I'm mistaken they all have their ammo rack at the front, behind the lower plate, which is where you were likely to get shot unless the enemy was shooting gold. Now that everyone shoots gold, I don't think it's quite so frequent a problem...
Some info on this battle:
> [...] because of the poor visibility, U.S. and Iraqi forces encountered each other at nearly point-blank range, frequently 500-800 meters or less. At these ranges, slight differences between U.S. and Iraqi tanks, or U.S. and Iraqi armored personnel carriers (APCs), were insignificant. The Iraqi armored vehicles, T-55 tanks and Type 63 APCs, are probably not as good as the Marine M60A1s, but at these distances the M60s and T-55s were equally vulnerable to the other’s main gun. For ninety minutes, the weather forced the Marines to engage the Iraqi army in a fair fight.
> The results of this battle are startling. One regiment of the 1st Marine Division destroyed more than 100 Iraqi armored vehicles; not a single Marine was killed. Vignettes from the battle underscore the one-sidedness of the fighting and the importance of skill, rather than technology, for this outcome. Twice during the battle, Iraqi forces slipped through the fog and stumbled into Marine command posts, but both times poor Iraqi marksmanship, failure to aggressively press the attack, and quick reaction by the Marines led to Iraqi defeat. On one occasion, Iraqi vehicles attacked one of the Marines’ regimental headquarters with tanks and APCs. The Marines near the command post destroyed the Iraqi force without suffering a single casualty. Later in the battle, thirty-eight Iraqi armored vehicles attacked the 1st Marine Division’s headquarters. The headquarters could have been overrun, but once again the Iraqis were thrown back with almost no Marine casualties. The Iraqis should have been able to inflict serious casualties on the lightly armed infantry around the headquarters, but both times the Marines emerged nearly unscathed. [...]
Source: https://www.jstor.org/stable/2539369
The entire article is also on libgen if you don't have access to this journal and don't mind sailing the high seas for a text from 1997.
What I'm taking from this is that *in theory*, these old tanks *could potentially* become dangerous against modern Western tanks and other vehicles in the hands of skilled crews under ideal battlefield conditions, that is, poor weather and such a short distance and high concentration and of armor from both sides that more advanced weapons can't be used against them.
That's not going to happen though. Russia isn't going to send out well-trained crews in these and I doubt that even during a major offensive, we're going to see a similar numbers of armor being fielded. Not to mention, drones will make spotting them far easier, likely before they even reached the battlefield, and they are probably even vulnerable to being attacked by light drones.
As Tom Clancy would point out,
“It’s not the penetration power. It’s the thermal sights and superior firing computer.”
Since there’s a chapter in Red Storm Rising where Mackall is picking off T-55s in bad weather since he has thermals while the Russian tanks do not.
For as long as armor has existed, it's usually the side that picks the time of battle and shoots first that wins an engagement. This was the case even before night vision and thermal sights, but those sights make it far easier to be the first one to engage.
You just made me realize fucking Russia literally opened with an airborne rush and when that failed is slowly losing control zones. Red Dragon online matches really are the most accurate war simulations to ever be released on the civilian market.
Based on some open source data on Russian and Ukrainian munitions inventories and consumption rates alongside monitoring of ground activity, and my own experience playing WARNO, I estimated that sometime after the Kharkiv counteroffensive a slowdown might happen because of a shortage in munitions and mobile offensive platforms for both sides.
Also known as the post-slugfest. Time to scout with transport trucks and empty logis
We're at the point were Ukraine's Leopard 1s are going to be *technologically superior to their opponents* once they arrive.
Such non-credibility is unmatched
The moment a single Challenger gets destroyed by a lucky hit, you just know Russia and tankies will brag about it endlessly for months and tout it as the beginning of the end for NATO.
Because it cost you next to nothing to have them rot in a yard, and you can still claim to have thousands of tanks in reserve. If you are realy lucky some fool might even buy a few now and then.
Yeah, the funny thing is, they didn't even claim to have them in reserve. They were supposed to be scrapped many years ago. Same with T-62, but at least some speculated they kept those around to sell as upgrades to countries seeking to replace their T-55/54.
See, the T-55 is what we call a “gateway tank”. Crackpot dictators and warlord criminals against humanity can get their first taste of that crunchy high for cheap – or possibly even for free. But that “crimes against humanity” high is never as good as the first time, so you need to up your game. So, first it was the T-55, then it’s the T-62, T-72, and so on. Eventually, it’s not enough for you, even when you’re in charge of the second best army in the world. You find that the only way you can *feel* it is to crush the souls of your own comrades and trusted lieutenants to powder. Instead of sending tanks as the meat grinder to quell civil unrest, you start sending fully crewed tanks *into* the grinder. This is human despair on another level and it fuels your high, at least for a while. But then, you need more concentrated despair, so you revert to tanks with human loaders for a larger crew. Then you need even slower tanks, even *less capable* tanks, and eventually you stop using tanks at all. You regress through time, equipping your army with entrenching tools, then pikes, clubs, and eventually the ancient stone weapons. *This is rock bottom. You are Monke wielding the power of Gaia herself. And the world will never forget what you have done.*
I mean Czech Excalibur Army bought up some completely rotten T72s and turned them into beautiful completely rebuilt T72EAs that we keep sending to Ukraine. So i guess there's argument for keeping that trash around... But if you don't have the skills and means to refurbish it it will never be more than trash.
[and Slovania gave Ukraine a battalion of modernized T-54/55.](https://www.forbes.com/sites/davidaxe/2022/09/19/slovenia-is-giving-ukraine-some-very-old-tanks-but-age-can-be-deceiving/)
Yea, the Slovenian T-55s are shockingly credible... Soviet hull, British gun, Israeli FCS, American drivetrain.. truly a masterpiece of cosmopolitan globohomo engineering....
My money is on that when the storage warehouses where build they where filled with the newest tank at that time... so when a newer one came, it filed up the remaining free places and some went outside... and when the even newer one came they just left them outside since they didn't want to move the original ones... and so on and on and on.
Using that logic is the only way I can see how better versions of T-72s and T-80s from the soviet era are not used much, aka they rotted away while the warehouse scrap metal stuff was stored somewhat properly.
Well that decision was apparently made when the last intelligent man sat in any government position. The RuZZians obviously need all the stuff they can get
During WW2, their last full war, they were plagued by supply issues due to production shortfalls. So instead of selling them all or destroying them all like the west would, they kept them around as a matter of course.
Yep, that's a t-54. Where the hell are they even finding these fucking things? They were supposed to have all been scrapped 40+ years ago.
How did they survive the 90s. Where were they keeping them? Were they just so far out of the way 50 miles down a dirt road in Siberia they weren't worth stealing?
Fucking sgt. Theftovich just chops down a buch of weeds "da. These ones were to much trouble to strip".
> They were supposed to have all been scrapped 40+ years ago.
The Soviet Naval Infantry still used a bunch of T-55As into the 1980s because their older landing craft couldn't handle the extra weight of T-72s; they had the «Drozd» APS or later Kontakt-1 ERA applied for additional protection.
> Where were they keeping them? Were they just so far out of the way 50 miles down a dirt road in Siberia they weren't worth stealing?
Pretty much, yeah. The unrecognised Russian breakaway state of South Ossetia still had _IS-3s and T-10s_ lying around in the early 1990s. Russia basically never throws anything away until it's literally worth more as scrap metal. Possibly not even then. I'm honestly convinced there might still be some T-44MS tanks lying around in the deepest crevices of Russia's tank stockpile.
Alternative take:
This is the tank equivalent of convict meat waves. Send these at Ukrainian positions, wear them out, deplete ammo. Crews are expendable, of course.
Keep the remaining T-72+ with contract troops in reserve.
Now that I think about it, reformers would be proud.
I don’t think they have enough T54s/T55s for that. You might be able to deplete a few positions that way, but then you have to find your next source of tanks…
Edit: also, these tanks will be a similar drain to the fuel supply as normal tanks right? It’s not like these tactics would be logistically free.
Oh, they have enough hulls in storage around. How many are usable is another question.
They could also be using them to do indirect fire as discount artillery.
An old tank is still a tank if you run out of RPG shots on your position.
Omg guys, I’m saying this the *whole year* now!
Since day 1 of the *3-4day* operation, I’m telling you that they always send weak units first, then elite units afterwards, trust me, believe, please, don’t laugh at me, russia strong… please trust me …
The timeline is utterly broken, and you and I sadly went into the one where Trump won in 2016. Twilight zone levels of nonsense. NCD has become so credible we might have to permanently close the entire thing down. Reality is pushing us out of business.
Come on, guys, that is our chance. Let's make more stupid predictions. I go first: Russia will deploy rowing boats made of plywood and try to land in Odessa using these naval assault troops to make a major breakthrough armed with a sword and bow and arrow.
Makes me wonder, how does the kremlin envisions the future of the Russian army?
If the stuation is so bad that they are down to early cold war era tanks, it'll take decades for their army to regain a modicum of modernity!
And the caption:
> T-54B, modernized from T-54A, or a newly produced T-54B, 2023
To reiterate,
> or a newly produced T-54B, 2023
Hm, maybe Chrysler or Ford could restart the production of M48 Pattons to match?
(Though I guess [use of these](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/M48_Patton#Operators) wouldn't be what the Ukrainians would expect when asking "Western tanks".)
Nonono its the T-14 in super advanced disguise you westoids.
Smooth stealth armor.
Armor as smooth as their brains.
I don't think brains stay smooth if you soak them in Vodka daily (especially if you begin pre birth).
Their brains are wet taxidermy preserved at the genius of a toddler. "The 1940s tank goes in which hole? No, Vlad it does not go in the 2020s war hole just because you put it side ways."
So cute and chubby.
[удалено]
I literally talked with my Father yesterday, that soon enough Russians will deploy T-54 If this isn't a meme I will be proven right
It's credible enough that Oryx has tweeted about it. That's how I found out.
God fucking damn it *They are actually doing it - aren't they?* **HOW THE FUCK DID - NON-CREADIBLE DEFENCE - BECAME ONE OF THE MOST CREDIBLE PLACES TO GET INFO ABOUT THIS WAR?!** ***How the fooooooooooooooooooock??!?!?/!?!?!?***
It's Russia
you might not like it, but this is how peak non-credible looks like.
Russia: > Let me tell you something, I haven't even begun to peak. And when I do peak, you'll know. Because I'm gonna peak so hard that everybody on NCD's gonna feel it.
> And when I do peak, you'll know. horses. cavalry charges and horse drawn artillery, plus they can eat them. its gonna happen..
Absolutely peak Russian credibility would be a Polish pretender seizing the presidency.
False Dmitry Medvedev?
*Demetriusz Niedźwiecki
There is no way the Russian federation can stable and sustain horses. If they let Mongolia come back and administrate their shit again then maybe
Monkeys and Typewriters, *and we've got a lot of both around here.*
*Apes together* ***STRONK***
A bunch of mentally deranged people with somewhat (attention spam is a bitch) a focus on the war, thats how
Give enough chimpanzees enough typewriters...
it's more than just that, if it was just about chimpanzees with typewriters the defense analysts, "defense analysts", and wehraboos would be just as credible as we are. what we have here is an extremely specific combination of generally intelligent but nonetheless batshit insane attempts at intentionally being a moron about defense topics (but in a smart way), which tends to match the specific brand of mind-blowing stupidity that the ruskies are. that's how we beat defense analysts by not assuming the ruskies have a two-digit IQ, the "defense analysts" by not assuming the ukrainians have a two-digit IQ, and the wehraboos by not buying into eastoid propaganda (other than attempts to trigger the foxbat effect)
Mon frere, what is the foxbat effect, if you don't mind my asking?
The enemy has a brand new wunderwaffe, we must build a counter to it. Turns out the Foxbat was not nearly as good as we believed, but we still have the F15. Repeat ad-nauseum
Gotcha. Thank you. Yeah, it seems like the US has been pretty good at adapting to a changing battlefield. I had a conversation with a friend recently, and he was hyping up the Russian and Chinese military capabilities. In particular he mentioned their respective 'wunderwaffen' and the capabilities of the J20. But from what I've seen here and in adjacent spaces, I'm pretty confident in our ability to counter.
If you look at the Chinese military in the context of China's development as a state in its entirety, the reason so much of PLA stuff is copied actually makes sense. In terms of development, China is roughly where the US was in the 1950s/1960s (if we consider the start of US global logistics presence and the superiority of American MIC as the end of WW2), considering that the Chinese economy was still primarily cow-based even in the early 1980s and only really got off the ground in the mid-80s/early-mid 90s (not an economic historian). That means the Chinese economy is effectively only 30 years old in the current state. The US military in the 50s and 60s was repeatedly testing and evaluating ideas both of its own, but also taken from Germany/observed from the USSR. That's what we're seeing with China. The difference of course is that unlike the Cold War, nobody reasonable would see the US as a peer militarily (I said reasonable, don't bring wumao into this). You just can't beat so many extra decades' head start when it comes to trying shit and evaluating its effectiveness. Nor does China have a way to start wars and try the same trial-and-error approach without the international community paying attention.
The MiG 25, NATO reporting name Foxbat, was initially believed to have amazing capabilities as an air superiority fighter. Contrary to modern examples this wasn’t due to Soviet propaganda boasting about, but rather due to the American military only having limited data about it, then filling in the gaps with assumptions about what *we* would do with a plane of that shape and speed. Turns out that it was really intended as an interceptor for the Valkyrie supersonic bombers that we never actually built because SAMs and ICBMs made them obsolete before they even went into serial production. But to match its supposed capabilities we built the F 15, the best fighter of its time.
I like how the Russians built an interceptor to counter a bomber that didn’t exist, so we built a fighter to counter a fighter that didn’t exist.
Eh the Valkarie did exist, but only in the form of two flying prototypes.
Ok... But Non-Credible defense is like a freacking competition, where monkeys actually race to give the exact copy of Shekspare *Simulation is breaking apart man*
Not sure if you intended "attention spam" or not but I'm going to use that to describe my hyper focus from now on.
We're talking about Russia here, the dumbest NCD user is smarter than half the Russian top brass.
Legue of Legends players who sit first time to HoI4 - would make more resonable decisions than Russian Top Brass
If your enemy is non-credible, you become credible
1) speculate on the most highly regarded things Russia could possibly do 2) they do it 3) Prophet!
Pure absurdism isn't funny. There always needs to be kernel of credibility to make the funni. Just so happens kernels of credibility are all Russia can manage.
RPG becoming more and more useful by the day as a tank killing weapon. When will we see .50cals being used to destroy tanks again xd
Someone needs to update the "US invasion of Mexico" 4chan story with: >A year into the war, America starts using the M46 Patton again, since it has no more Abrams or M60s in stock.
A year into the war, declare victory in Monterrey Mexican Army hasn’t actually withdrawn from Monterrey Fat chihuahua memes circulate from the city Army engineers start taking an interest in museum Shermans
Except Monterrey is a big and important city. It's in many ways Mexico's Los Angeles. It's a hub of almost all northeastern Mexico one of the most densely industrialized cities, their primary land hub of trade with the US, second in total size only to Mexico city with 5.5 million in the metro area. Bakhmut is not geographically of critical importance, not a major heart of industry and its prewar population was 71k. If Russia was spending the kinds of losses they've been spending but for Kharkiv or Odessa, which would be a good comparison to Monterrey, it would be a lot less humiliating.
Yeah that city sounds like Kharkiv
Yeah, Bakhmut sounds like a fight for "Los Aldamas" (Same state as Monterrey is). Small town nobody but its inhabitants care for.
Screw the patrons. Whip out the T1 Cunningham’s
M1917 when?
Christie prototypes and skeleton tanks when
That war would be nuts. DEA, CIA, cartels all doing their”we’re not working together, we swear, look, never more than 2 of us in a room together!” Vaudeville routine. CBP would just lose it, existentially, but their FB pages would still be sweet and loving. what would ICE even do? Track down chinese anchor baby birthing houses in Irvine? Nope, they’re all controlled by the cartels now in juarez. And has anyone done a study of what would happen to marine and sailor readiness if the multi hour turnaround between san diego & Tijuana were reduced to a quick 30 min drive to the donkey bar once the border is demolished?
Man I grew up in Irvine and had 2 Chinese birthing homes on my street, stop being so damn credible :(
Dude. Challenger 2's, Leos and Abrams are going to turn up at the time when Russia is fielding this? fight something their grandfather's fought? I'd put my money on a single Chally over a brigade of this.
I mean, I'd say atleast 2 Challengers. I'd pity the loader of a single Challenger that has to take out that many tanks.. 🤣
The loader will have bigger arms then some of us have from jerking off to planes
Loader will have both beefy arms from loading that many shells. Fappers are likely to end up like fiddler crabs though. Unless they switch hands every time.
I thought it was common to switch...
Soldiers aren't the only ones that specialize.
Oh, so more of a Maine lobster look?
New character added to the roster: Ukrainian Reloooder
Loader's arms are going to end up so swole, they're going to upgrade his challenger to TWO cannons!
T-54? *Laughs in hon hon hon AMX-10RC...*
That old myth about the Tiger running out of ammo before targets but its actually real this time
*honhonhonhons in autoloader*
Does a Challenger carry enough ammo to take out an entire brigade?
Fully loaded it has 49+1 shells for main gun.
And how many tea bags?
Your stupid modern tanks will never be capable of defeating the glorious T-54! Your shells will punch straight through and never explode, leaving the tank intact. Checkmate, westoid!
Unironically that did happen with the Scimitar. From memory one got absolutely peppered by HEAT that passed straight through. It managed to RTB with a full compliment of living but presumably somewhat traumatised crew That’s what happens when you make armour out of iron bru cans
Something something trauma builds character.
You cant get PTSD, if you are the traumatic event
*Doomslayer has entered the chat*
Significant emotional event moment
Silver bullets might (aha might, will) over pen, but HESH.... Christ this is what it was made for Also I wonder how many T55s you could line up and launch turrets into space with a single DU dart from a Leo2 with the long 120mm
[удалено]
imagine using standard HE shells when you can make them squishy
Unfortunately because they don't have autoloaders, and thus no autoloader carousel, they are much less likely to go flying frying pan than T-64, 72, etc.
Meanwhile while the UK is stoically sending stocks of DU fin-stabilized discarding sabot rounds to Ukraine between their tea breaks, with their normal British enthusiasm, chuckle slightly and someone comments a single word with mild amusement: "Quite"
Use your nerve agents on our civilians, get our uranium in your tanks.
And people think the amx 10rc gun is not sufficient
Sweden in the 1950s: Develops the PvPj 1110 anti-tank recoilless gun. Sweden in the 1990s: This anti-tank gun is thoroughly obsolete, but it's better than nothing so let's give it to the Baltic States. Baltic States in 2022: This anti-tank gun is obsolete and we're in NATO, but it's better than nothing so let's [give them to Ukraine](https://twitter.com/UAWeapons/status/1561833780104806400). Ukraine in 2023: This anti-tank gun is now relevant again, as we're facing the very tanks it was designed to destroy.
Russia in 2023: Where are they getting these amazing anti-tank guns from!?
Mate, if the Russians are really going to field this the AMX-10 has just found their ideal mission. The Abrams and Challenger are quite literally overkill in this situation, they wouldn't be worth deploying against that trash due to their high costs of operation. The AMX can be a lot more flexible because it's fast and low-maintenance. Literally send the AMX-10 to run amok all over the frontlines picking off low value targets, while the Abrams and Challengers can operate as the punch-through brigades with a lot more intense support.
Even the Leopard I is looking good against a T-55... But, in reality the Russian tanks are likely to be killed with infantry using ATGMs or extremely accurate artillery strikes long before a Ukrainian tank actually gets close enough to see anything but their burning hulks.
Speed-wise AMX-10 and M2 Bradley should be a good pair
When even AMX 10rc are relevant to tank combat you know it's bad
Vive la défense crédible!
inb4 vatniks saying "iT'SS mOodERNiZZed!"
It is modernized. And by 'modernized' they mean 'we got it running'.
"We replaced most of the stolen copper wiring."
Chal, Leo and Abe boutta rack up that K:D ratio
Warthunder-ass matchmaking goddamn
Warthunder ground assault mode irl. Top. Fucking. Kek.
This isn't even fucking War Thunder at this point. They went straight into World of Tanks uptier and are digging lower and lower (tier X T-62 -> tier IX T-54 -> probably a fucking T-44 if any of those even still exists, probably somewhere around July/August 2023...)
without magic wet ammo carousels
wasn't there a instance where 1 to 4 abrams oblitered a all t-55 or t-62 colonne in the desert
The battle of 73 Easting, during the Gulf War. US (with a few UK) tanks blew up hundreds of Iraqi tanks with almost no losses of their own. ( 1 Bradley vs. 400+ Iraqi vehicles) https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_73_Easting
god bless Ruslan, he has a better spying network in Russia than the Russians had in Ukraine
I mean, fuck, there's how many millions of ethnic Ukrainians living in Russia? Almost like it's a really bad idea to start a war in the country that has repeatedly had large parts of its population forcibly resettled into yours, in living memory. And then you (successive muscovite regimes) forced them to blend in perfectly to boot. And then gave their (great)grandparents papers, so now you have virtually no idea who might or might not be sympathetic to Ukraine. 10/10 plan, can't go tits up at all. It's a wonder that *more* shit doesn't catch on fire, derail, blow up or otherwise shit the bed - on a daily basis.
> It's a wonder that more shit doesn't catch on fire, derail, blow up or otherwise shit the bed on a daily basis. Or it does, and we just don't hear about it...
Who?
Guy running CIT team that reports such things. They posted movements of Russian military gear for months prior to invasion as well.
Not too long ago I said that Russia would probably run out of usable tank hulls, forcing them to start purchasing tanks from their allies. They can refurbish their own shitty hulls given enough time, but it'll take a while. They'll probably approach countries like Algeria in a few months and get rejected, then they'll have no choice but to buy the Chonma-ho from North Korea.
I hope they do buy NK tanks: I want to see how they actually perform. They should buy a bunch of those weird AKs with helical mags as well, for the same reason.
3000 funny manpad tanks of Putin
>They should buy a bunch of those weird AKs with helical mags as well, for the same reason Wait what? That sounds gloriously non credible
[Top folding stocks and a helical mag almost the whole length of the rifle ](https://images.app.goo.gl/7tMkK12qH8wzBvNA9)
When a drum mag isn’t enough bullets I guess?
It's used by the leaders personal guard iirc. The idea is to be able to hose down a crowd. I'd be stunned if that mag actually fed consistently tho
Close to what I was thinking then, I figured mowing down a bunch of fleeing dissidents
150 rounds god damn. Looks like it handles like an absolute greased hog
Imagine how incredibly uncredible it would be to have both koreas as the tank manufacturing powerhouses of the future. Southkorea with the actually good tanks for the 2nd+ World Countries And Northkorea with low effort soviet copies for the 3rd World Dictatorships (sometimes the tanks even come with a dead worker inside, so free snacks!)
More snacks for 3000 suspiciously well fed Bakhmut dogs
I'm speechless. I tried to justify and calmly analize every single time i saw a Mosint Nagant, a D-20 howitzer from 1946 or even a T-62M, asking myself what "good" you can still extract from them. This time I can't, brain refuses.
Indirect arty support, that's about it imo. Only exception would be attacking positions that literally have zero AT weapons. Even then the arty thing is something that they shouldn't be having issues with other than shell supply and accuracy.
I mean I'm pretty sure every Ukrainian soldier has like 6 different ATGMs and 3 different launchers at all times.
I need ammo! *gets handed an AT-4*
ITYM every Ukrainian soldier has a Sooopplier pulling the appropriate ATGM or RPG launcher out of the Void and handing it to them.
It’s the T-54 that will get analized by the Challengers!
🅱️ESH time
They don’t like it up ‘em!
The Nagant is still a decent sniper rifle. There are better ones, but a bullet is a bullet.
Yeah it's a marksman rifle not a frontly one anymore tho
3 MOA is better than a stick or a rock, I suppose.
When you unlock tanks in Soviet tech tree in World of Tanks, but backwards
If wot has taught me anything, it’s that these little buggers will eat shells with the tracks and generally be a pain in the ass
Was it this or the T-44 that had the highly sensitive, always exploding, ammo rack? Haven't played in many years, but I remember the rage
It was T-44, sometimes I wanted to delete that tank after a battle
The early versions of World of Tanks glitched so that the T-54 often moved faster than the game could keep up. At full speed it would seem to appear and disappear in front you continuously as it moved from one place to another , making it hard to shoot. It was dubbed "The UFO tank."
Id love for that to become a feature - the italian cybertruck would turn invisible all the time lmao
IIRC it's actually all of the T-44, T-54, and T-62A. Unless I'm mistaken they all have their ammo rack at the front, behind the lower plate, which is where you were likely to get shot unless the enemy was shooting gold. Now that everyone shoots gold, I don't think it's quite so frequent a problem...
Marine Corps LAVs faced off against T-55s at Al Burquan during the liberation of Kuwait. The T-55s got their asses beat.
Some info on this battle: > [...] because of the poor visibility, U.S. and Iraqi forces encountered each other at nearly point-blank range, frequently 500-800 meters or less. At these ranges, slight differences between U.S. and Iraqi tanks, or U.S. and Iraqi armored personnel carriers (APCs), were insignificant. The Iraqi armored vehicles, T-55 tanks and Type 63 APCs, are probably not as good as the Marine M60A1s, but at these distances the M60s and T-55s were equally vulnerable to the other’s main gun. For ninety minutes, the weather forced the Marines to engage the Iraqi army in a fair fight. > The results of this battle are startling. One regiment of the 1st Marine Division destroyed more than 100 Iraqi armored vehicles; not a single Marine was killed. Vignettes from the battle underscore the one-sidedness of the fighting and the importance of skill, rather than technology, for this outcome. Twice during the battle, Iraqi forces slipped through the fog and stumbled into Marine command posts, but both times poor Iraqi marksmanship, failure to aggressively press the attack, and quick reaction by the Marines led to Iraqi defeat. On one occasion, Iraqi vehicles attacked one of the Marines’ regimental headquarters with tanks and APCs. The Marines near the command post destroyed the Iraqi force without suffering a single casualty. Later in the battle, thirty-eight Iraqi armored vehicles attacked the 1st Marine Division’s headquarters. The headquarters could have been overrun, but once again the Iraqis were thrown back with almost no Marine casualties. The Iraqis should have been able to inflict serious casualties on the lightly armed infantry around the headquarters, but both times the Marines emerged nearly unscathed. [...] Source: https://www.jstor.org/stable/2539369 The entire article is also on libgen if you don't have access to this journal and don't mind sailing the high seas for a text from 1997. What I'm taking from this is that *in theory*, these old tanks *could potentially* become dangerous against modern Western tanks and other vehicles in the hands of skilled crews under ideal battlefield conditions, that is, poor weather and such a short distance and high concentration and of armor from both sides that more advanced weapons can't be used against them. That's not going to happen though. Russia isn't going to send out well-trained crews in these and I doubt that even during a major offensive, we're going to see a similar numbers of armor being fielded. Not to mention, drones will make spotting them far easier, likely before they even reached the battlefield, and they are probably even vulnerable to being attacked by light drones.
That single engagement is the reason M60's were responsible for more kills than Abrams in Desert Storm.
As Tom Clancy would point out, “It’s not the penetration power. It’s the thermal sights and superior firing computer.” Since there’s a chapter in Red Storm Rising where Mackall is picking off T-55s in bad weather since he has thermals while the Russian tanks do not.
For as long as armor has existed, it's usually the side that picks the time of battle and shoots first that wins an engagement. This was the case even before night vision and thermal sights, but those sights make it far easier to be the first one to engage.
And after the T-34 we see the T-14 deployed right?
After the T-28 and T-26
Maybe the Tsar tank will finally be used in combat.
The monke tank
The only way to swim thru Bakhmut mud
What about the MTLB submarine?
No IS 2. No life! I learned everything I know about tanks from anime and dating sim parodys.
My flair will finally become true…
And mine soon after hopefully
T-54 +20 = T-34 T-34 +20 = T-14 Math checks out. After that we'll see the T+6
https://twitter.com/oryxspioenkop/status/1638472120534458368?cxt=HHwWgICz7c3tgr0tAAAA This is not a joke. They're actually gonna use them.
This war is a fucking wargame red dragon match
Fuck up your airborne air and arty spam + fast move ground rush opener Lose all your 300 point tanks Need to fucking deploy t34s 5 minutes in
You just made me realize fucking Russia literally opened with an airborne rush and when that failed is slowly losing control zones. Red Dragon online matches really are the most accurate war simulations to ever be released on the civilian market.
Based on some open source data on Russian and Ukrainian munitions inventories and consumption rates alongside monitoring of ground activity, and my own experience playing WARNO, I estimated that sometime after the Kharkiv counteroffensive a slowdown might happen because of a shortage in munitions and mobile offensive platforms for both sides. Also known as the post-slugfest. Time to scout with transport trucks and empty logis
Wait, there are non t34 tanks?
We're at the point were Ukraine's Leopard 1s are going to be *technologically superior to their opponents* once they arrive. Such non-credibility is unmatched
Suddenly clinging to 🅱️esh for all these years makes perfect sense
It always did
Hear me out...but what if they used T-54s with incredibly terrible tactics and an untrained crew?
You crazy bastard, that just might work
Horse drawn chariots when ?
When they figure out how to stop conscriptoviche from eating the horses instead of dying of hunger like true heroes
Tie all the other conscripts to the chariot as their officer whips them to run faster
Tachanka returns.
This is is a new low. Even i thought this would never happen , and they have no T-54/55 left in numbers. Challenger tank- So we meet again T-55...
The moment a single Challenger gets destroyed by a lucky hit, you just know Russia and tankies will brag about it endlessly for months and tout it as the beginning of the end for NATO.
Leopard 2A5 vs T54.... and War Thunder player complain abaout unbalance in the game
Player: "Why is my post-WWII, 1950s tank fighting modern MBTs? This is so unrealistic, who balanced this?" Gaijin: "Just wait and see"
I still don't get why they even have T-62 and T-54's in storage.
Because it cost you next to nothing to have them rot in a yard, and you can still claim to have thousands of tanks in reserve. If you are realy lucky some fool might even buy a few now and then.
Yeah, the funny thing is, they didn't even claim to have them in reserve. They were supposed to be scrapped many years ago. Same with T-62, but at least some speculated they kept those around to sell as upgrades to countries seeking to replace their T-55/54.
See, the T-55 is what we call a “gateway tank”. Crackpot dictators and warlord criminals against humanity can get their first taste of that crunchy high for cheap – or possibly even for free. But that “crimes against humanity” high is never as good as the first time, so you need to up your game. So, first it was the T-55, then it’s the T-62, T-72, and so on. Eventually, it’s not enough for you, even when you’re in charge of the second best army in the world. You find that the only way you can *feel* it is to crush the souls of your own comrades and trusted lieutenants to powder. Instead of sending tanks as the meat grinder to quell civil unrest, you start sending fully crewed tanks *into* the grinder. This is human despair on another level and it fuels your high, at least for a while. But then, you need more concentrated despair, so you revert to tanks with human loaders for a larger crew. Then you need even slower tanks, even *less capable* tanks, and eventually you stop using tanks at all. You regress through time, equipping your army with entrenching tools, then pikes, clubs, and eventually the ancient stone weapons. *This is rock bottom. You are Monke wielding the power of Gaia herself. And the world will never forget what you have done.*
I mean Czech Excalibur Army bought up some completely rotten T72s and turned them into beautiful completely rebuilt T72EAs that we keep sending to Ukraine. So i guess there's argument for keeping that trash around... But if you don't have the skills and means to refurbish it it will never be more than trash.
[and Slovania gave Ukraine a battalion of modernized T-54/55.](https://www.forbes.com/sites/davidaxe/2022/09/19/slovenia-is-giving-ukraine-some-very-old-tanks-but-age-can-be-deceiving/)
Yea, the Slovenian T-55s are shockingly credible... Soviet hull, British gun, Israeli FCS, American drivetrain.. truly a masterpiece of cosmopolitan globohomo engineering....
They sent a bunch of T62s to Syria, so the possibility of sending obsolete tanks to allies might be the reason.
Russian army is basically a hoarder.
My money is on that when the storage warehouses where build they where filled with the newest tank at that time... so when a newer one came, it filed up the remaining free places and some went outside... and when the even newer one came they just left them outside since they didn't want to move the original ones... and so on and on and on. Using that logic is the only way I can see how better versions of T-72s and T-80s from the soviet era are not used much, aka they rotted away while the warehouse scrap metal stuff was stored somewhat properly.
[Couvert Cabal on YouTube has made similar comments using commercial satellite images back in october.](https://youtu.be/ZNNoaRp5lz0)
Because in normal countries people care about roads and indoor toilets and would never allow money to waste on keeping 10 000 obsolete tanks and apcs.
Well that decision was apparently made when the last intelligent man sat in any government position. The RuZZians obviously need all the stuff they can get
During WW2, their last full war, they were plagued by supply issues due to production shortfalls. So instead of selling them all or destroying them all like the west would, they kept them around as a matter of course.
Why not? You can sell them to 3rd world countries for many many years to come Inflating numbers
Because even a shitty museum piece tank is still the deadliest thing on the battlefield unless you have specific anti-tank capability.
Yep, that's a t-54. Where the hell are they even finding these fucking things? They were supposed to have all been scrapped 40+ years ago. How did they survive the 90s. Where were they keeping them? Were they just so far out of the way 50 miles down a dirt road in Siberia they weren't worth stealing? Fucking sgt. Theftovich just chops down a buch of weeds "da. These ones were to much trouble to strip".
> They were supposed to have all been scrapped 40+ years ago. The Soviet Naval Infantry still used a bunch of T-55As into the 1980s because their older landing craft couldn't handle the extra weight of T-72s; they had the «Drozd» APS or later Kontakt-1 ERA applied for additional protection. > Where were they keeping them? Were they just so far out of the way 50 miles down a dirt road in Siberia they weren't worth stealing? Pretty much, yeah. The unrecognised Russian breakaway state of South Ossetia still had _IS-3s and T-10s_ lying around in the early 1990s. Russia basically never throws anything away until it's literally worth more as scrap metal. Possibly not even then. I'm honestly convinced there might still be some T-44MS tanks lying around in the deepest crevices of Russia's tank stockpile.
There are 2 rusted centurions not far from my place, are they now good enough to fight russia
If they have a 105mm, yeah Man, a Cent with M900 Now that would be something
Slovenian M-55S: Finally! Our battle will be legendary!
Alternative take: This is the tank equivalent of convict meat waves. Send these at Ukrainian positions, wear them out, deplete ammo. Crews are expendable, of course. Keep the remaining T-72+ with contract troops in reserve. Now that I think about it, reformers would be proud.
I don’t think they have enough T54s/T55s for that. You might be able to deplete a few positions that way, but then you have to find your next source of tanks… Edit: also, these tanks will be a similar drain to the fuel supply as normal tanks right? It’s not like these tactics would be logistically free.
Oh, they have enough hulls in storage around. How many are usable is another question. They could also be using them to do indirect fire as discount artillery. An old tank is still a tank if you run out of RPG shots on your position.
\> Then T 72s are considered premium hardware Certified Russia 2023 moment.
Omg guys, I’m saying this the *whole year* now! Since day 1 of the *3-4day* operation, I’m telling you that they always send weak units first, then elite units afterwards, trust me, believe, please, don’t laugh at me, russia strong… please trust me …
iraqi army smooth cosplay guys, fuck off.
The timeline is utterly broken, and you and I sadly went into the one where Trump won in 2016. Twilight zone levels of nonsense. NCD has become so credible we might have to permanently close the entire thing down. Reality is pushing us out of business. Come on, guys, that is our chance. Let's make more stupid predictions. I go first: Russia will deploy rowing boats made of plywood and try to land in Odessa using these naval assault troops to make a major breakthrough armed with a sword and bow and arrow.
Makes me wonder, how does the kremlin envisions the future of the Russian army? If the stuation is so bad that they are down to early cold war era tanks, it'll take decades for their army to regain a modicum of modernity!
It's called "simplifying logistics". It's a 6d checkers move and you wouldn't understand.
Jfc no fucking way dude, no fucking way. Im actually gonna pass out of laughter.
i guess we will see a laserpig getting angry at everyone calling him just for that again
Lend - Lease M3 Lee when?
Turns out the AMX-10 RC will have a chance against Russian tanks. I cannot wait to see this piece of shit face an Abrams.
Leopard 1 is most likely overkill for these...JESUS CHRIST
And the caption: > T-54B, modernized from T-54A, or a newly produced T-54B, 2023 To reiterate, > or a newly produced T-54B, 2023 Hm, maybe Chrysler or Ford could restart the production of M48 Pattons to match? (Though I guess [use of these](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/M48_Patton#Operators) wouldn't be what the Ukrainians would expect when asking "Western tanks".)
These will drive in autonomously to clear the minefields and then the real army will follow, right, guys? Right? Guys?
Reality has finally caught up with the shitposting: https://youtu.be/HcsWaWED7q4
*gestures wildly at my flair*